story of my life.....:DQuote:
Originally posted by herefishy
Well, I've got 1# of recovered R-13 from the cascade repair I did last week. But I think that Runmc and I are going to give it a go.
:D
you lucky dog:D
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story of my life.....:DQuote:
Originally posted by herefishy
Well, I've got 1# of recovered R-13 from the cascade repair I did last week. But I think that Runmc and I are going to give it a go.
:D
you lucky dog:D
Hi PC.. Your head pressure looks really low.....
is that good or bad?
idont know nothing bout custom phasechange [the dumbed down generation of promym users]
well everyone know i have been feeling a little under the weather this week,got one of those chest colds that drain you down...
but i cranked up the cascade to see how my adjustments are working with the CO2 i am stuck to use....
well just a small looky for everyone
Now thats what i call COLD!!!!!!!! i bet it'll chill a beer in about two seconds flat. Very good work as always.:toast:
Ok I'll bite.. how are you getting the unit that cold with CO2 and keeping the compressor running? -141F (-123C) Is the trace gas idea from way back working? Details must have details......
omg!! and thats dual evap!! wow thats amazing :toast:
well i will tell a little bit..the -46c you see is the return from the heat exchanger and the co2 is running 225 to 245 psi on the high side....it is tricky as hell to get to work ,and i am not sure how well it will work.
i have been adding tubing to give me capacity.but right now it is a long ways from any type of actual load running.i need i think at least 50ft more tubing to stablize the system in storage.
but i am closer than i have been.i just fealt good enought to get online and post a small pic.
i am getting me another can of soup...later guys.:D
and by the way...yes that is twin evaperators....LOL.
and bakers evap is running better than mine ,(one evap is mine and the other is bakers,,,,lol:D
Damn Bro....you could make a freezer out of 2 sticks and some bubblegum. The McGuyver of Phasechange! :D
i second that one!Quote:
Originally posted by TheDude
Damn Bro....you could make a freezer out of 2 sticks and some bubblegum. The McGuyver of Phasechange! :D
-141F = -96.111CQuote:
Originally posted by Redwolf
Ok I'll bite.. how are you getting the unit that cold with CO2 and keeping the compressor running? -141F (-123C) Is the trace gas idea from way back working? Details must have details......
this C02 is in a heavy vacuum
edit/ .025 bara i estimate, quite low!
My point is the triple point of CO2 is -69.9F (-56.6C).
well not excatly....LOLQuote:
Originally posted by Redwolf
My point is the triple point of CO2 is -69.9F (-56.6C).
it depends alot on the liquid temp of the co2 at time of injection.
the first test i was running,i kept having it start to form dri ice(triple point)this was because i was only at the edge of liquid and gas state.althou i had the heat exchanger running around -40c i didnt have the cap tun from the exchanger insulated.and you could see it frost the cap tube as soon as it came out the exchanger,but the time it reached the evap it was already between a liquid and gas state.and even increasing the pressure to over 325psi made no diff.but i had problems also of not enough co2 in the system to give me a liquid seal on the cap tub all the time,so i had cyclying effect.
i added 50ft of tubing to the low side of the co2 stage.and insulated the entire cap tube and liguid side of the co2.
then got it going.
i still need more storage.i will proberly remove the 50ft and add a 100ft piece of tube,or use a large accumulator from work for the storage i need.
right now i have to start the system and add co2 until it reaches the proper pressure and liquid seal.
co2 is cheap to play on ,but it takes lots more effort to tune.but i can afford to dump the system 2 or 3 times a night to fine tune....you cannt do that with 95 or 1170,unless you are either rich,or have access to large amounts on high pressure freon...
which right now i dont have either.
i am hoping with all my research on this co2 and fine tuning the cascade i will be able to swap in a blend of 95 and something to hit some good temps with.
And how do you estimate the heat load on the I stage ? How big does it look ?
Well this is just in the first stages of testing bud.the heat exchanger isnt really removing alot of heat.Quote:
Originally posted by berkut
And how do you estimate the heat load on the I stage ? How big does it look ?
my design is way off the std design of a cascade i believe.well sorta.
i may show some pics of the unit this weekend,but it is made in such a way as you cannt see the good stuff.
the condensor/evap is a std reverse flow heat exchanger. in a coil.
it is the factory so-low designed unit.(just about the only part i reused from the so-low).but i added a 50ft pre cooler.that runs behind the 2 high side condensor fans.and then it has a fan of its own also.so the temp of the gas entering the heat exchanger is room temp,cool as it possably can be.this allows the heat exchanger to lower my liquid temp to the lowest point.
i still am thinking about adding some more tubing to the high side return to get more use out of the extra return to the compressor.as of right now i frost the suction line to the high side.which i dont want to do.so i may try and use that tubing to help cool my cap tubing going to the low side evap.
but i always go outside of the box when i design something to just see what effect i will have....
i have never been one to go by the book,
Did you think of using old empty tanks (like after R22) as relief tanks ? They should withstand 20 bar easylly... In my system, with a static pressure of 20 bar i can get 0.5l of R23 inside according to Airliquide and a 32:1 low to high side ratio.
*edit*
With CO2 as the refrigerant i could have 0.3l of liquid in the system also according to Airliquide
well you know....i have thought of that...but i am making a compact unit,but......i am brasing a charge port on the low side where i can attach a remote can to.so the anser is yes...i am going to connect a empty can up to the system remotely...that may do what i need.Quote:
Originally posted by berkut
Did you think of using old empty tanks (like after R22) as relief tanks ? They should withstand 20 bar easylly... In my system, with a static pressure of 20 bar i can get 0.5l of R23 inside according to Airliquide and a 32:1 low to high side ratio.
*edit*
With CO2 as the refrigerant i could have 0.3l of liquid in the system also according to Airliquide
but this is just a experiment really.it may not work at all under a load.but you never know unless you build it and try.
Ya ok. Basicly the same way they make Dry Ice. Pump the co2 gas up to a high pressure then throttle it to 0psi and compress the snow. Wonder how this would work in a normal evap. Say eight 1/2" tubes, injecting on one side pulling off the other. With maybe a extra large header on the suction. So what do you think your getting mixture wise 50/50%? God that just to many Btu/lb.
well i am not sure right now how much vapo/liquid i have getting to the evap's but at first without heavy insulation of the cap tubing i couldnt get below -46c.Quote:
Originally posted by Redwolf
Ya ok. Basicly the same way they make Dry Ice. Pump the co2 gas up to a high pressure then throttle it to 0psi and compress the snow. Wonder how this would work in a normal evap. Say eight 1/2" tubes, injecting on one side pulling off the other. With maybe a extra large header on the suction. So what do you think your getting mixture wise 50/50%? God that just to many Btu/lb.
but something is strange.bakers block which is a maze design is handling the co2 better than the open design with finned cooling area.
i tried one time mixing in some freon r22 into the mix to see if it would help move the co2 along,maybe helping it have better surface contact like when you add methonal to dri ice in a dri ice bench rig.but no diff.
more experiments this weekend i hope.
You'd better check an R-22 can if you intend to use it for an expansion tank. To my knowledge, these cans are now equipped with check valves, that prevent refilling/reuse.
Well i thought everone knew but this is the deal...if the can has a black handle it DOES NOT contain a check valve.if it is colored it has a check valve..Quote:
Originally posted by herefishy
You'd better check an R-22 can if you intend to use it for an expansion tank. To my knowledge, these cans are now equipped with check valves, that prevent refilling/reuse.
i am lucky..i have 2 of the old cans left with black handles,but sill i have 3 recover cans that i could use if i had to.
i got my recover cans out the shop,since the law came into effect about the date on the can had to be within a certain period or you get fined big time.so i got the old cans..
so i got plenty,just the trouble of doing it.
ps:i think there is a kit you can get to convert it into a air tank,maybe use of this kit would replace the handle so no check valve.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by bowman1964
[B]to be honest i hate the electrical tape wrap...:( ..it was something i wanted to see if i could smooth the outside of the foam up with.not anything but that.just to see how it would do on putting up a moisture barrier.it will be redone,because it dosent make it to my standards.:rolleyes:
BOWMAN, have you ever tried using liquid electrical tape for that? You can make it as thin or as thick as you want, depending on the layers you put on, and it peels right off easier than regular tape (no sticky residue left over). It also stays on better, and you just paint it on. Its great for those 'hard to cover and insulate' spots.
btw,,,wasnt trying to insult your obvious genius and experience. Just something Ive run across and wanted to share...have you had any experiences using it? any pro's or con's you might be able to pass along in regards to the liquid elec tape? :D
sorry i have been out with the flu,just am getting back.Quote:
Originally posted by GeekGoddess
btw,,,wasnt trying to insult your obvious genius and experience. Just something Ive run across and wanted to share...have you had any experiences using it? any pro's or con's you might be able to pass along in regards to the liquid elec tape? :D
yes the liquid electrical tape,i have used and still have time or 2 to use it.it is very good protecting a cicuirt from moisture.i keep a can on hand all the time to cover a small spot or 2.
Glad your feeling better,,,,well, if you had to have the flue,,,at least you had it early and got it over with....:)