2009 AMD analysts day [official thread]

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11-12-2009, 05:51 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smartidiot89

:D Just wrote this out from the Q&A for my hardware site:

Journalist: Rick you mentioned that you will be sampling Bulldozer and Bobcat in 32nm, Fusion products in the first half of 2010. That would suggest that you either have taped out or is close to taping out all those products. Can you give us some sense off where you are in terms of the development on those cores?

Rick Bergman: We don't really give out inner milestones, but we, obviously you know how the semiconductor industry works. You know, June of 2010 is 7 months from now, it takes a few months to build these things so I don't think your comments are off-target at all we are, we're loading up the gun getting ready with our next wave of these fantastic products

Journalist: You mentioned, I think the roadmap for Global Foundries showed that you had, that they were doing 32nm in the second half of 2010. So how do you actually get those built in the first half?

Dirk Meyer: That was a production question.

Emilio Ghiraldi: That's manufacturing ramp, which is consistent with the...

Journalist: So they are doing the tape-outs now?

Rick Bergman: Oh yeah, absolutely and we have running material, we have material.

I think many of the AMD guys on stage were thinking "Will you just shut the :banana::banana::banana::banana: up already?" :D

Yeah I know,inq picked up the story too :) :
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/...d-sample-chips

Quote:

AMD will sample chips early next year
Bulldozer, Bobcat and Fusion previewed
By Nick Farrell
Thursday, 12 November 2009, 12:32

AMD SAID yesterday that will release samples of processor chips built with its Bulldozer and Bobcat CPU cores to computer makers early in 2010.

Senior vice president Rick Bergman said the company wants to give its customers enough time to prepare for product releases at the end of the year.

The plan is that hardware manufacturers can see what is coming so they can gear up to produce products as soon as the processors become available in volume.

The Bobcat core has a sub-1W capable core with four integer and two floating-point instruction pipelines.

The Bulldozer core is a Bobcat with another 4-pipeline integer unit added. Instead of having one combined integer and floating-point scheduler, Bulldozer has two integer schedulers that share a single floating-point scheduler.

Processors incorporating multiple Bulldozer and Bobcat cores will be built on a 32nm silicon on insulator (SOI) process using high-K metal gates.

AMD has also been talking up its Fusion products, which will be a combination of processor and graphics chips, suggesting that it will be making something that Intel can't.

The company claims that Fusion will do its thing by putting the memory controller in charge. Initial fusion cores are going to have both x86 and GPU components, connected via a shared memory controller in the form of a crossbar switch.

Since GPUs need massive memory bandwidth the memory controller is important, particularly if you have multiple CPU cores to work with. AMD needed to come up with a way of feeding several CPU cores with a few hundred GPU cores attached, and apparently it thinks it has.

Pulling this off will be a technological feat in itself and making it work will show that AMD is back in the running. AMD has been falling behind Intel in the chip technology race lately and this has been hurting its bottom line. µ

I expect for terrace to come in and tell us all this is impossible and that Bergam and all the rest actually meant 2012 and it was a slip of the tongue.With that date in mind we should then expect the actual hardware on the shelf by the early 2013 :p:. /sarcasm mode off
11-12-2009, 07:47 AM
annihilat0r

That might be because they are competitors and anything one of them releases is highly relevant to the other company?
11-12-2009, 07:31 PM
RiverRicer

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

I expect for terrace to come in and tell us all this is impossible and that Bergam and all the rest actually meant 2012 and it was a slip of the tongue.With that date in mind we should then expect the actual hardware on the shelf by the early 2013 :p:. /sarcasm mode off

But.........isn't that after the end of the world? :rofl:
11-12-2009, 10:00 PM
SocketMan

1 Attachment(s)

Who wants one?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ym7X-...9B4CDA&index=0
11-12-2009, 11:34 PM
Lightman

Quote:

Originally Posted by SocketMan

Who wants one?

Movieman??? :D

and me of course! (if it's in my budget)
11-13-2009, 12:00 AM
Vit^pr0n

Is it true that Fusion will have 480 stream processors? That's more than the 3870, and close to a 3870x2! Of course that doesn't mean it's close to that performance since the architecture is different, but the amount itself is impressive.
11-13-2009, 07:35 AM
Manicdan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vit^pr0n

Is it true that Fusion will have 480 stream processors? That's more than the 3870, and close to a 3870x2! Of course that doesn't mean it's close to that performance since the architecture is different, but the amount itself is impressive.

a 4770 is 640 SPs, at 750Mhz, so if they can get this to run at 1ghz, it would be right with a 4770, which is strong enough to play any game for consoles at 1680x1050 and good eyecandy
11-13-2009, 08:55 AM
informal

This Llano Fusion chip is a perfect match for next gen Xbox console :).
11-13-2009, 10:21 AM
Manicdan

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

This Llano Fusion chip is a perfect match for next gen Xbox console :).

yeah i was thinking the same thing. these fusion chips really could create some killer consoles, the ps3 slim v2 could be the size of a ps2 slim with one of these (and i wonder if it will be possible in the future to sli/xfire your consoles...)
11-13-2009, 10:31 AM
Vit^pr0n

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manicdan

a 4770 is 640 SPs, at 750Mhz, so if they can get this to run at 1ghz, it would be right with a 4770, which is strong enough to play any game for consoles at 1680x1050 and good eyecandy

That is very very impressive. Having that kind of performance added with a 5800 would be amazing.

I also think that this is the kind of chip we'll be seeing in the new xbox since ATi is working on that. With the RROD and heat issues of the 360, something tells me MS wants a chip like this. Though I really hope the next-gen consoles will have the capabilities of ATi/Nvidia's latest GPU's at the time ( R1200? GT700? :rofl: ). That would be the time when games make the next giant leap in graphics.
11-13-2009, 11:45 AM
informal

The contender for the most ridiculous article of the year(or even the decade :p:):
Fuad Abazovic's latest and "greatest":
http://www.fudzilla.com/content/view/16425/1/

Quote:

Bulldozer has two quad cores stitched <---[what the hell... :hitself:]

Written by Fuad Abazovic
Friday, 13 November 2009 11:01

Image

Some parts shared

According to Chuck Moore, Corporate Fellow and CTO Technology Development of AMD, the new Bulldozer X86 architecture has “two tightly linked cores.” [After this it all goes downhill and he gets lost in the dark woods of stupidity :shakes: ]

Image

If you look at the picture above, posted in Chuck's presentation, Bulldozer has two quad cores with an integer scheduler and the two cores share two FPU 128bit FMAC schedulers. <--[:rofl:]

Each int scheduler quad <--[Oh my God :shakes:] has its own L1 cache that talks with L2 shared cache used by both cores and FPU units and finally, the last layer has Shared L3 cache as well as Nortbridge support. (You lost me at 'each'. sub.ed.)

This CPU will be designed to easily interconnect with graphics, but such a product probably won't launch before 2012. AMD claims Bulldozer and Bobcat are two new x86 cores targeting different usage models.

"Bulldozer will be a completely new, high performance architecture for the mainstream server, desktop and notebook PC markets that employs a new approach to multithreaded compute performance for achieving advanced efficiency and throughput. Bulldozer is designed to give AMD an exceptional CPU option for linking with GPUs in highly scalable, single-chip Accelerated Processing Unit (APU) configurations. Bobcat will target the low power, ultrathin PC markets with an extremely small, highly flexible, core that also is designed to be easily scaled up and combined with other IP in APU configurations,” claims AMD.

AMD didn’t save its breath to attack Intel for stitching two cores together, and in two years from now, it plans to stitch two cores that will share some parts. As far as we know 8-core Nehalem EX can get to 8 native cores even at 45nm and we are quite sure that for late 2010 Intel plans to launch an 8-core 32nm Westmere based CPUs. <--- [totally clueless and lost :shakes: ]

AMD plans Bulldozer for desktop and server market in 2011.

He has outdone himself with this "piece of news". Newsflash Fudo,you have no idea what you are talking about!:shakes:
There is a Bobcat related article too,not much less ridiculous than this one of course.Enjoy!
11-13-2009, 01:07 PM
Behemot

The choice for APU's (LIano, Ontario) was SOI GPU or bulk CPU. According to Fuad, AMD has chosen the second possibility. Both should be made in 40 nm bulk with some RV8x0 GPU. Interesting for me.
11-13-2009, 01:20 PM
Hornet331

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

He has outdone himself with this "piece of news". Newsflash Fudo,you have no idea what you are talking about!:shakes:

Thats not news... its already in the history books. :rofl:
11-13-2009, 01:23 PM
hurleybird

Oh my goodness... I cannot even begin to grasp how Fuad could have failed this much. Was he in a right state of mind when he wrote that, or is he actually that clueless?
11-13-2009, 01:54 PM
Chumbucket843

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manicdan

a 4770 is 640 SPs, at 750Mhz, so if they can get this to run at 1ghz, it would be right with a 4770, which is strong enough to play any game for consoles at 1680x1050 and good eyecandy

they wont be able to make it clock that much higher just because its on 32nm. remember this is low power. it will also need a wider bus or faster memory to perform as well as a dedicated graphics card like the 4770.
11-13-2009, 02:24 PM
rcofell

Quote:

Originally Posted by Behemot

The choice for APU's (LIano, Ontario) was SOI GPU or bulk CPU. According to Fuad, AMD has chosen the second possibility. Both should be made in 40 nm bulk with some RV8x0 GPU. Interesting for me.

Huh? Unless I'm mistaken, I seem to remember Bergman alluding to the fact they're SOI with the comment that the GPU portion is not a risk item on SOI.

While AMD's future Fusion offering would certainly have cost/size advantages when used in a game console... it's still a year out and I think the next xbox360 revision should prove to be interesting at a sooner date. Also, like chumbucket mentioned, just because it has a decent amount of SPs doesn't mean the performance is the same as it would be for a discrete implementation... there are still issues of TDP and more importantly the memory interface (I really wish they would've leaked some details on the Fusion memory controller :().

Now what I'm waiting for is the point when the GPU portion will be more native and not necessarily require going through a software driver, which AMD seems to acknowledge.
11-13-2009, 02:37 PM
Solus Corvus

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcofell

Now what I'm waiting for is the point when the GPU portion will be more native and not necessarily require going through a software driver, which AMD seems to acknowledge.

I am interested in this as well. It seems to be a possible conclusion to this GPU + CPU combining trend.

But it would require a new instruction set to be able to access those GPU functions, hopefully standardized. Otherwise the only way to access the gpu will continue to be through drivers + API.
11-13-2009, 02:42 PM
Manicdan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chumbucket843

they wont be able to make it clock that much higher just because its on 32nm. remember this is low power. it will also need a wider bus or faster memory to perform as well as a dedicated graphics card like the 4770.

your right that how good the memory interface is will have a huge impact, but just for the core SP power, it can sure offload alot of power.

for power consumption, im not sure what to guess. when going low power, generally its for cheap PCs. the gpu part of the core i feel should have no problem reaching 800-900mhz while staying under 40W, and to offer those features in a single chip, for ultra small PCs that can game, id think they pc could sell for 500-600$ and this chip be ~300$ of that. (youd be paying for convenience, more than performance per dollar)
11-13-2009, 03:00 PM
Glow9

So what is it at AMD as of late thats really got those guys cruising? I mean getting rid of that jackass CEO I'm sure has something to do about it but what else?
11-13-2009, 03:37 PM
LordEC911

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glow9

So what is it at AMD as of late thats really got those guys cruising? I mean getting rid of that jackass CEO I'm sure has something to do about it but what else?

All the big business deals are out of the way, merger and GF spinoff, and the design decisions that happened after the merger seem to be paying off.
Being asset-lite, fabless, seems to have streamlined much of the process.

Probably better management in all departments and I guess it helps that there is that urgency there due to their financial situation.
11-13-2009, 04:37 PM
Calmatory

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manicdan

a 4770 is 640 SPs, at 750Mhz, so if they can get this to run at 1ghz, it would be right with a 4770, which is strong enough to play any game for consoles at 1680x1050 and good eyecandy

Remember that the manufacturer and process have changed. I'd say that the odds are that the GPU part will run sub 600 MHz.

Two reasons: Power consumption and "excess" gpu power(compared to the memory bandwidth).
11-13-2009, 05:11 PM
vietthanhpro

16-core Opteron processor codenamed Interlagos--> 8 modules, 16 core. lol
11-13-2009, 05:25 PM
hurleybird

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calmatory

Remember that the manufacturer and process have changed. I'd say that the odds are that the GPU part will run sub 600 MHz.

Two reasons: Power consumption and "excess" gpu power(compared to the memory bandwidth).

The process is improved over the old one and if the didn't want 'excess' GPU power they would simply put in a smaller GPU instead of wasting die space.
11-13-2009, 08:50 PM
To(V)bo Co(V)bo

Think of bobcat like a quad core atom with a killer igp. It could litterally replace almost 90% of all PC's. I think bobcat has a really bright future imho. Just think of the power a netbook or nettop would have with one of these. You could use these in a nice little HTPC that could actually game pretty decent. It would kick ions butt big time, you wont even need a IGP. Ion will be desroyed, since intel and AMD can do it all in one chip! Whats the point in keeping ion around if it just adds cost and extra power use. Nvidia cant compete in this market without a x86 processor, ion will become extinct.
11-14-2009, 12:23 AM
Lightman

Quote:

Originally Posted by hurleybird

The process is improved over the old one and if the didn't want 'excess' GPU power they would simply put in a smaller GPU instead of wasting die space.

This!:rolleyes:

Besides I think that GPU part will be on separate PLL which means we should get a multiplier option in BIOS to change freq.
For Laptops it will run at low clock, for desktop only TDP will be a limit.
Graphics performance though will be limited by memory subsystem, but there is a chance of mitigating that problem by sideport and giving GPU access to shared L3 cache.
But please not forget that this APU will be targeting a lot of GPGPU tasks where memory bandwidth is not always a problem and 480ALUs will be utilized fully.
I hope we will see 1.2-2GHz APU clocks, if not stock then after some OC for sure :)

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