To me, when a $300 HD 4890 is about 4-7 FPS faster than a $400 GTX 285 at 1920 and above with AA enabled, that is a sound whipping. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by GAR
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To me, when a $300 HD 4890 is about 4-7 FPS faster than a $400 GTX 285 at 1920 and above with AA enabled, that is a sound whipping. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by GAR
Dont get me started about the 4890 review on your site, how you have it beating the GTX 285, thats hilarious :ROTF: does the fact that ATI is in Canada have anything to do with it ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
ATi is currently an American company under the ownership of AMD.Quote:
Originally Posted by GAR
In 1984 Kwok Yuen Ho immigrate to Canada
In 1985 with 2 other HK immigrant found Array Technology Industry
Quote:
Originally Posted by B.E.E.F.
I hate to break it to ya but ATI no longer supports us. They cut us loose a bit before the HD 4890 review. I made that VERY public in the HD 4770 review so I am about the last person on earth to tag an ATI bias on.Quote:
Originally Posted by GAR
As for the scores, that can be chalked up to one thing: HawX is one of my favorite games right now and I play it ALOT. As such, I have determined that the in-game test is HIGHLY inaccurate (which is also mentioned in the review) so actual gameplay time is used.
I hate to defend my own methodologies but in this case I know I am doing it bang on instead of using a short cut and using the 2-minute in-game demo.
The DX10.1 code path means the AA efficiency of ATI's current cores can be magnified by a significant amount in this game. That is why the GTX 285 beats the HD 4890 without AA while the HD 4890 surges ahead when AA is turned on.
Uh...huh. Ok :clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by STEvil
GAR, Sky is a very very unbiased reviewer in a sea of bad eggs so I would show him a lot more respect.
I wont even start to discuss your biases or mine :rolleyes:
and why would ati cut support for you guys? do they not like the truth?Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
I'm sure Nvidia has laid a better groundwork of supporting reviewers and I'm quite sure they have benefited from it.Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
The fact that ATI can no longer support every review site is only indicative of the recession and the fact that one company cannot support all review sites ALL the time and they rotate to other sites to accomodate everyone.
None of the above, however, has anything to do with the choice that reviewers make either to post the most honest benchmark results or to post skewed results, as there is slight evidence of in Tom's results.
If Motley Fool presented evidence that Bear Stearns is a good buy a year go, then it will lose credibility as a result of its actions and the same is true for review sites.
No, we don't hate Tom's, but there are consequences for skewed results, hence this thread.
Perkam
I have tested all of the cards from both camps, im not talking strictly gaming use, i use many of them for my customers, especially ati since Matrox RT X2 HD recommends using an ATI card, and many of my customers do video editing, but i gotta tell you, i run into problems with ati all the time, none with nvidia. I build about 7 high end pc's a week on average. Im not saying ati always gives issues, but if i run into one, it has something to do with ati's drivers. As far as gaming goes, again, nvidia has more support from the game developers, and as far as DX 10.1 goes, im sure the 3 titles that support it dont really matter for most people, HAWX is a good game, but Battle Forge got a 2.0 rating out of 10 didnt it? by gamespot i believe.
See the response below as it hits the nail right on the head.Quote:
Originally Posted by roofsniper
I completely agree with this. It is a sign of the times.Quote:
Originally Posted by perkam
However, to think for even a moment that any site is getting "paid" by ATI or Nvidia for a positive review is completely insane. This doesn't go for you Perkam but to others who have posted here and in other threads claiming just this.
There is alot to say about this subject but I will break it down into two categories. The first of which are sites that manufacturers cannot AFFORD to ignore (Anandtech, Hothardware, Chilehardware, Toms, etc.). The other sites much like ours (I don't hold any illusions about our current place in the industry) always tread on very thin sheet of ice between saying something that makes a manufacturer pull support and always blowing sunshine up our readers' butts to make said manufacturer happy. As such, some sites (us included) have already the lost support of a number of companies for...well...speaking the truth. I am not saying this is what happened to us and ATI but I am opening a bit of the door as to what goes on behind the scenes so to speak. Other companies stick behind sites as long as the reviews are balanced. It is a game of politics. Simpe as that.
I absolutely, completely agree with you. Nvidia's devloper support is second to none and ATI will never catch up. However, it is still possible for ATI to make use of certain applications through driver development and DX10.1 implementation.Quote:
Originally Posted by GAR
As for Battle Forge; don't get me started. With or without DX10.1 it both sucks and blows chunks.
Maybe ATI marketing department is spending all their money on liquid helium. I see liquid helium benches popping up once a week rather than nearly non existing at all. But seriously, I don't this the recession has anything to do with cutbacks, with HWC.
HWC by far and large is the most popular Canadian review site out there. It has even international appeal as the positive feedback about its reviews, even seen here by most members. I have to say those skymtl, quit being so modest.
Perkam, I think its a little naive to think this is all related to the recession. There are only about two dozen websites worth a damn or people visit for reviews(in the entire world), HWC typically on that list. When a company can make crazy ass events where they bench liquid helium, I think they can afford to sent a few review cards out every year, especially the marketing it creates if it gets a good review. AMD still sending cards out to benchers, and honestly only a small and obscure group will see these cards. However the type of marketing ATI might want to get from reviewers might be a glowing review.
I think AMD cut HWC for a different reason.
That is a total abomination.Quote:
Originally Posted by GAR
285 is a faster card.
They favor ATI...
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1336600
The GTX 285 is a faster card yes but not in all cases, particularly when DX10.1 is used by the HD 4890. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Talonman
I wish when I read this...
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum...review-23.html
The information that the 285 was the faster card would have jumped out at me more...
I come away thinking you are an ATI fan.
"Most people look the other way when it comes to overclocking due to voided warranties and potential stability issues."
You neglected to mention ONLY ATI cards warranties are voided, EVGA and Nvidia officially allow this, and keep your warranty in tact. A huge point when buying a high end expensive video card.
Here is the thing: quality has NOTHING to do with sample allocation. That's the reality in this industry. It all depends on whose ear you have and whose you don't.Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111
I'm not going to cry over spilled milk since I will most likely get my samples through other channels ( as I did with the HD 4770 and I won't be under NDA. That means pre-release articles which I am more than happy to do.
Back on topic.
I took the time yesterday to go through the article on Tom's with a fine toothed comb and from what I can tell, they were having some driver issues. Both the Nvidia and ATI cards behaved inconsistently which in my past experiences usually means improperly uninstalled drivers. Trust me, when doing a review with multiple cards over the course of a few days, it becomes very easy to forget to reimage your HDD.
Open up your eyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Talonman
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...f_9.html#sect1
The 4890 regular comes very close to beating the 285 and the 1Ghz 4890 beats the 285 outright:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/video...0/crysiswh.png
Perkam
Actually, not really. EVGA and XFX allow overclocking but now that XFX offers ATI cards, the warranty officially extends to ATI cards as well. On the flip side, from first hand experience, ASUS and Gigabyte will come down on you like a ton of bricks if they suspect failure through overclocking was the reason for an RMA (that goes for BOTH Nvidia and ATI cards). :up:Quote:
Originally Posted by Talonman
Quote:
Originally Posted by perkam
Close... yes.
I cant find their phone number...Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
http://www.xfxvideocards.com/
I want to call them...
I have already been through this with Visiontek...
http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.asp?m=685888&mpage=6&key=
Based on your responce, I just called them.
Toll Free: 866-VTEK-411
I spoke with Alan, he is there now.
He told me that removing the stock cooling would void your Limited Lefetime warranty.
He told me that most wait until the 3 years expire, then opt to change out the stock cooling. That way you don't void your limited Warranty.
Alan at Visiontek thinks I am correct... Call him!
He further told me that he has replaced the stock cooling on his Nvidia card... Snicker!!
Talon, we get it, you like nvidia. thats your personal choice.
I like ATI, thats my personal choice.
dont go around spouting information like your unbiased because its just not credible and its a waste of time for you and everyone else. I have pretty much given up on doing the same for ATI, its pointless because people who like nvidia just like nvidia and vice versa. Your better off letting people read their own reviews and make their own decisions - or do you think you should be making decisions for other people?
lol you fail, thats not even their website :rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by Talonman
http://www.xfxforce.com/en-us/Help/ContactUs.aspx - UK number but a number nonetheless
Forget that then... :down:
I would like to see that in print on their web site...
Everyone has their preference. I just find many people will cry foul after they have bought a card and someone comes out with a review that says a competing solution eats their new $300 purchase for breakfast. It's called denial and its an ugly, ugly thing. ;)