Uh didn't ATI already have to change the traces for dongleless Crossfire? But for whatever reason, I can't wait for them to come out. :woot:Quote:
Originally Posted by Revv23
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Uh didn't ATI already have to change the traces for dongleless Crossfire? But for whatever reason, I can't wait for them to come out. :woot:Quote:
Originally Posted by Revv23
Look at the top left edge of any X1800 or X1900. I think the traces may always have been in place
yesQuote:
Originally Posted by Cobalt
Man from the pics of the heatsink it looks like it exhuast out the top of the card. Which just so happens to be where my Lian-Li PC-V1000 PlusII's exhuast fan is.:banana:
512mb versions would come out?
:yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by Anavel0
I would imagine so...If you can buy a 512mb x1650xt (confirmed) why wouldn't someone make a 512mb version of the x1950pro? At the very least, I imagine X1950pro Gemini cards will have 512mb. When HKEPC announced HIS were coming out with dual core x1650xt/x1950pro cards they stated they would have 1GB...but I imagine that will become 512mb. If it is 1gig, even more reason to think a single core 512mb version will be available.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasy
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Originally Posted by Anavel0
Cobalt nailed it, traces are already there. ;)
the traces were already there, it was just a matter of modifying the current PCB with the connectors
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Originally Posted by turtle
We've been seeing "dual-gpu" concept ATi cards for awhile now, but has any of them actually ever released?
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/d...227085430.html
It was suppose to show up after CeBiT for $399...$399 for a dual x1600xt.
The thing to remember is, most of the crazy designs/outgoing things we hear/see about never actually see the light of day. A shining example of this is the PCI-E/AGP hybrid 6800GT MSI made, which was a GREAT idea, but unfortunately never apparently made it past the prototype stage.
Either way, I'm not holding my breath on a dual x1950pro, but a 512mb one would be sweet.
Everything I've heard has been that the X1600 Gemini's were prototypes that were never intended for release. The whole purpose of them was to show what the different AIB's are planning to do with x1650xt/x1950pro. Obviously as you can see from the HKEPC pics the pcb wasn't finalized then as it was too long to even fit in a case. It will surely help that the x1950pro (and perhaps x1650xt) will have a much cleaner/spacious layout than the x1600.
I expect it to see the light of day because all the different prototypes I've seen from different AIB's seem to use the exact same pcb design with the GPUs and bridge chip in the same spot; not a one-off design like the 3d1's. Can't help but wonder if it'll be an official ATi pcb/design rebadged by AIBs rather than created by them. I surely hope if it does make it to market they cut it down to either preferably 64x8, like you said, rather than 64x16 or even 32x16. I hope there are single cards are 64x8 as well.
With all these crazy rumors of G80 having 12 chips (an odd amount of ram...Or what The Inq might call "weird") and 384-bit bus and what-have-you...It'd be nice to see some normalcy remain with a similar layout to the X1K cards before them, and not suddenly start putting ram chips on the back of the pcb...I was never a real big fan of that. Plus, I can't see the extra 512mb being worth the cost to either board.
More RV570 info:
*Available to AIB's on 9/19, "will not launch earlier than October 5th" (rumored launch date is 10/17..but that may be RD600)
*Stock reference clocks are 580/1.4 (apparently down from the 600/1.4 on ATi's slide :( )
*HDCP compliance optional
*Molex "SLI-like" bridge included with every board
*three different configs: Dual-link DVIx2, Dual-link DVI + single-link DVI, Dual-link DVI + VGA.
http://dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=4166
..still a nice specs.. :D what would nvidia do.. :D
without 650MHz for core, and 1500 MHz for memory, that 36-pipe GPU can't win over 550/1400 MHz of GF7950GT!
The 7900gt and x1900gt are fairly matched: nvidia wins some benches, ati some, others they tie. The extra 256mb does little for the 7950, and both these products will just be overclocked versions of their earlier brethren and will probably overclock to the same vicinity as them. Hence I think this will be the same fight redux. If you thought the 7900gt kicked the x1900gt's ass, you'll probably agree this time too. Last time it was a little different...The x1900gt was originally priced much higher or equal to the 7900gt and that's why nvidia was regarded as the favorite. This time around the situation is different.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedjo
I think they will be fairly-evenly matched at the end of the day with perhaps nvidia winning by a slight hair in frames overall. It will also prolly use less power and emit less heat. The x1950 will be cheaper, have HDR+AA, better IQ, and GPGPU features while trouncing the 7900gs (it's actual competitor.)
As always, it will all come down to what you use your card for, what your priorities are in gaming, how much you want to pay and how long you plan to keep it.
It's the 7950GT vs the X1900XT 256mb... The R570 is going to be at the $250 pricepoint or $200 when the price war starts going on. Either way it'll probably be lower than MSRP. So the 7950gt loses.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedjo
http://www.diamondmm.com/p091206.phpQuote:
Originally Posted by DMM
It's been my assumption all along x1950pro would use 1.4ns GDDR3... Remember this and this? That's not to mention FCG saying it would be the deal of a lifetime. ;) Ya'll who told me I was wrong or were hoping for GDDR4 were right.
I guess I shouldn't have doubted Fuad and the others when they said it would use 2200mhz...Because that is exactly what the x1950xtx ended up with. It now makes sense why X1900gt and X1950pro co-exist...and what x1950 means. :)
This card is going to rock. :D
Oh yeah...and AGP is cool too. :)
Think x1650xt may use it as well? If so...
How about this deal? It is the actual competitor to the 7950GT and quite a bit cheaper. Performance is about on par between the two, with the 1900XT etching out on some games and don't forget about the other advantages the 1900XT has over the 7950GT.
How is that true in any way, this is a product developed before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanavit
My whole theorem on that is that the 256mb GDDR3 x1900xt was released because, like many have speculated, GDDR4 may be short supply or was at the point the point of x1950xtx's release, and/or it would be the right filler product to have to accompany the x1900 512mb rather than compete against it, while making the x1950xtx more appealing for being the only GDDR4 product. It may explain why other than getting rid of the craptacular x1600 and phasing out the gddr3 x1900's right away, rv560/rv570 and the x1950xt were delayed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmore
X1950pro's memory may be downclocked so hardcore because if the memory was clocked closer to it's 2200mhz max it would be a closer match in performance to the 256mb x1900xt and would cannibalize it's sales. After it's release in October, I wouldn't be surprised to see the x1900's all completely phased out and x1950pro essentially replacing x1900xt 256mb and the x1950xt 256mb the x1900xt(x) 512mb, and it being a happy little GDDR4 family. That to me would make complete sense, as it would be a strong, thrifty, and complete third product line for x1k at all the main price points.
Wa-wait, does DONGLESS mean "crossfire on SLi" boards?!!
No. It means crossfire on ATI chipsets and afaik Intel chipsets supporting crossfire...but you can buy two of the same cards and connect them via a bridge...which is why X1950PRO SLI sounds better than X1950PRO Dongle-Less xfire.Quote:
Originally Posted by KoHaN69
Perkam
According to stirrings from AIBs, it actually does mean crossfire on all all boards with 2x8/2x16 PEG, which would include SLI boards. Certainly wait for confirmation from a better source than I, but it looks likely.Quote:
Originally Posted by KoHaN69
Like I've said before, it makes sense since ATi will soon be out of the Intel market for chipsets and Intel is more than unlikely to pay for a license from AMD to run their cards on their own future chipsets on their platform. So what does ATi do to get crossfire on future Intel systems if Intel has shunned them from creating new chipsets (or frightened AIB's from using ATi Intel chipsets) and won't license crossfire for their own? Make it an open standard. With the composite engine built into these (rv560/rv570) and every future die and it working over the pci-e bus, nothing is stopping them and I seriously doubt ATi is like Nvidia and will require a chipset check built into the drivers. This would go along with AMD/ATi saying they want an open standard of choice in the future for customers without requiring to have a motherboard, cpu, and graphics cards specifically from them to enjoy the perks of each.
I think that AMD will allow to its new cards, beginning with X1650XT and X1950 Pro, to work SLI capable motherboards!
With that move they will gain much more popularity, and in one point NVIDIA will allow SLI configurations on the AMD (formerly ATI) chipsets!
2 ati cards dongled on a SLi board?Quote:
Originally Posted by perkam
Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedjo
The reason this makes sense is because supposedly NVIDIA will allow SLI to run on future (and perhaps current) Intel chipsets which gives Intel a reason to keep including 2x16 pci-e slots, as obviously they will be abandoning crossfire partnership with ATi (AMD.) Since this will create a large market of Intel boards (high-end Intel/Nvidia) with 2x16 slots even though ATi will no longer have their own Intel chipsets; it's a perfect reason for ATi to open it up.
I agree with you on the overall conclusion that nvidia will then be forced to do the same for SLI. There is definitely nothing wrong with that...as it should have been that way from the beginning. The only reason it wasn't is because nvidia and in-turn ATi wanted to make extra cash on proprietary tech (you need to buy a X company motherboard to run their multi-card solution) and for licensing fees (you need to pay X more money to build a SLI board if you are an AIB than an ultra board even though they are the same chipset...hence the ultra-d being a caniving way to bypass this.)
As for if old crossfire with the 'dongs' and master cards will (eventually) work...That's a very good question. As FCG mentioned in his grand thesis, they for all intents and purposes COULD work...but who knows if they will. It would require a bios flash of old cards...but it's possible although unlikely to be officially supported. It's more-likely that this new style of crossfire could signify a fresh start with the open platform in mind and the bios will not run a check for a crossfire-certified motherboard.. The idea of crossfire (and eventually SLI) going open platform certainly is a happy one, and I hope it starts with these products' launch. If it doesn't, I imagine we'll see it soon regardless. ATi has no other choice if they want to be in future high-end Intel machines.