A :toast: for the effort and time...
It's great to have guys willing to sacrifice their resources for others... :clap:
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A :toast: for the effort and time...
It's great to have guys willing to sacrifice their resources for others... :clap:
keep up the good work skinnee!!!!
Patiently awaiting results as well - kudos to you skinnee for all the work you are pouring into this!
One quick question, in addition to all the performance metrics you are going to collect, could you also expose each block to a woman (preferably married) to get their acceptance reaction/scowl factor? (This may help influence my purchase decision...) :p:
Rose colored water with rose smell. We have discussed it before here.Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperchargedZ06
"Honey, I got .375C lower load temps, I just need to buy xxx for a whole 1.0C."
"Thats nice dear it smells pretty and looks like the rose garden you promised me 3 years ago, go ahead, buy more stuff."
$37 a pint, interested?
Wow this will be great. I'm really looking forward to the results. Thank for doing this research. The type of data on this forum, I feel, is way more reliable than one-off reviews floating on the web.
This thread is the reason I got the backplates so here it is on :)
http://rs760l33.rapidshare.com/files...ate_x2_800.jpg
looks like its bent.
It's not, just not fully screwed in the middle and not at all on both edges as the attached screws were too short.Quote:
Originally Posted by -TYPHOON-
Good screws are on the way though.
This is a debate I had in dreams between a nameless Hard core XS member and Skinnee:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
XS (Authoritative): Ideally Skinnee, you'd want to epoxy 28 type T thermo-couples to the side of each one of the mosfets :p:
Skinnee (mildly amused): $%^%^:mad:&you :nuts: or what? grmbl grmbl
XS (accomodating): ok, I understand, .. how about 14 then ? You could run spreadsheets with temp variations between each of the mosfet with the different blocks, with nice standard deviation curvs.. that would look great!
Skinnee (loosing patience): *(&:cussing: (:slapass::slapass:^&*
XS (giving up): fine, let's settle for 7 then ? really that's the least you could do for a mildly accurate performance analysis.
Skinnee: (%^&%:shakes: :smoke: :explode: ^%&*(&
These results can't come soon enough! :p:
Does the EK backplate do anything functional, besides looking awesome?
Whats wrong gabe ?
Your afraid that skinnee could discover anything wrong about the Swiftech block ?
Im 100% satisfied with my komodo ... i dont see why the GTX one would fail ...
I might be wrong but I don't think so - at least not until you put the thermal pads in a few places where there are chips on the PCB.Quote:
Originally Posted by -Fluffy-
Perhaps also prevents the card to bend but to be honest I did not notice PCB to bend with EK block.
HA you found a creative way to use those holes on the PCB :up:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
Well on the photo above, it's already bent ?Quote:
Originally Posted by luke997
See my post above - it's not bent it's just not fully mounted due to incorrect size screws attached.Quote:
Originally Posted by gmat
When mounted with random screws I've had just to try out all fits well.
results please.......ahhhhhhhhh
Patience :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancelot
He's only got the BP 100% done (Koolance should be done soon I'd think).
IIRC, he saw over 100C on his VRM probes on the run that tripped his PSU's OCP. Guess the VRMs weren't getting cooled well enough and saw runaway drops in efficiency (leading to runaway increases in power consumed at the wall and power dissipated at the VRMs). So yeah, definitely has some viable data off the VRM temp setup he has going right now :cool:
And even at stock, there were major differences in GPU temp and VRM temp between the Koolance and the BP, so it looks like the test setup is done and now it's just to data collection :up:
Anyone want to buy my Bitspower GTX 480 waterblock? :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
I'm not sure how many of the blocks could handle those test settings, if any :lol:
Fortunately his finalized test settings for the review are lower...reviewers of blocks need three main things from their GPU/CPU/board/whatever: heat, repeatability, and stability. He's got all covered right now :up:
Yup, BP block thermals are complete and Koolance block is 2/3rds complete but should be done tonight. Danger Den block is next since it was the second block to arrive. I should have the BP install video done tonight as well, I want the Koolance video rendering tonight but that might be high expectations of myself.
The voltage testing on the card was insane, VRM temps were well beyond 100C and watt consumption of the card just kept climbing. I can't wait to see the non-reference designs come out, as the power delivery has a lot of room for improvement. But what came out of all that white knuckle experiementation was as much heat as I could generate, remain stable and my own comfort level that the card would survive the torture of testing 8+ blocks.
But yes, we've now reached the 'grind' portion... Mount Video, Test, Test, unmount/remount, Test, Test, unmount/remount, Test, Test, Mount Video, rinse/repeat. I'm going to get a few more blocks done this weekend and might just provide a sneak peak at some performance data.
:toast:
nice lookin review skinee.
cant wait to see the results. The Swiftech/EVGA block looks very interesting with the hybrid VRM cooling.
Exxxxxcellent :clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
Thanks for your hard work on bringing us these numbers :D
Is it only the Aqua block that has a backplate?
My money is on the EK (I have always used them and already purchased one for my new GTX470)......... I also have my doubts about the XSPC VRM cooling.
Can't wait to see the finished charts :)
If i remember well, only the aqua have a backplate as standard with the block but Ek have one in option. Best choice for me would be the ek backplate and aqua gtx 470 block with the stainless black painted and the copper nickel plated. That would be very nice.
Skinnee fast! fast! I need juice here. JK ... can do the EK block first ... the rest later.
Yeah, you are correct. EK is out-of-stock for 470 and none of the UK stores have them. EK say that "Backplate serves as aesthetics add on", so I guess it is not really needed unless you have a Window case......Quote:
Originally Posted by snoro
What's the point of a single test result other then to prove the EK does cool the card sufficiently when you don't have results from other brands to compare it against?Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeChuo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
If you compare these 2 pictures:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/d..._prodshot2.jpg
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/d...-vrmprobes.jpg
You will see that the screw shown by the orange dot lines up with the corresponding orange dot temperature probe exactly.
From the below picture you can see the screw is not flush against the copper surface:
http://skinneelabs.com/assets/images..._prodshot3.jpg
The machining of these copper blocks are very precise, often overhanging components on the PCB by few hundred micrometers, and I believe the screw placement at that location is so that it misses the chokes when mounted. From your pictures Skinnee the temp sensor seems to be flush with the chokes, so is it possible that because of this conflict the screw+temp probe causing a bad mount and therefore bad VRM contact? Seeing that the Bitspower block have no mechanical fixture point between the block and the PCB on the VRM end side like the Koolance/Aqua-Computers blocks have, it may have caused the PCB to bend away from the block when you tighten down the screws shown by the green and blue dots.
Bad design on Bitspower's end, hopefully you haven't damaged your 480 by a bad/no contact for the VRMs...
Good point here Mr. fantasy !
Bet certain OTHER forums will not detail a design flaw in a BP product if there were one. only flame vendors other than BP when you have their banner ad
Good sleuthing! Yeah, that screw concerned me but it turned out to be a non-issue.
There were not any contact problems on the Bitspower block, the TIM and Thermal Pad contact looks fine.
http://skinneelabs.com/assets/images...80_contact.jpg
Bitspower Black Freezer Installation - Part 1
Bitspower Black Freezer Installation - Part 2
720p will be available once the videos are done processing by YouTube. Now working on the Koolance and Danger Den install videos.
So, BP numbers?
I have them, yes. :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthBeavis
Phew, we thought you lost them there for a second. I herd they like to hide in dark corners.
Koolance VID-NX480 Installation Video
Had some audio problems with this one, getting that corrected for the Danger Den installation video.
go skinnee! nice one mate. eagerly await ek testing and final results
Sounds like you hit puberty at 6:30 :)Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
:rofl::rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by cx-ray
:rofl:
Yeah, audio issues.
:rofl:
is that what they call the merwang hitting the impeller now adays?Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
I have no idea what that means to begin with. :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthBeavis
NOT ENOUGH :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl: facesQuote:
Originally Posted by cx-ray
Skinnee you sure james earl jones wasnt around at 6:30?
I've watched the KL video many times now... probably going to pull it and completely re-do it. Picture is far to yellow, sound it all jacked up and so on.
Danger Den video is rendering now...
Danger Den Installation Video
trying some different tricks and what not...
interesting.. wonder why dd is the only company that insists on TIM instead of thermal pads for the memory chips, guess all will be revealed at the end!
also skinnee are you weighing each block as you go along? the weight of the blocks are quite important to me. each video is getting better and better btw
Aqua-Computers also use TIM for memory.Quote:
Originally Posted by ell
well shave my balls and call me susie, that's a melon scratcher. surely thermal pads makes up any micro millimetre difference in machining of the block? whereas TIM i'd imagine you'd have to screw excessively tight to make proper contact, possibly causing pcb bending? then again, i've only ever used EK
other way round unless somehow solids have the same properties as liquids nowQuote:
Originally Posted by ell
Nice ninja swap with the MX-2 tubes :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
Started with a black near-empty tube and ended with a fresh white tube :p:
Correct, Danger Den and Aqua Computer both specify TIM on the memory. Not sure why some chose TIM vs. Thermal PadsQuote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ell
Quote:
Originally Posted by eternal_fantasy
No, if they're specifying TIM they've already accounted for the variance. And thermal pads compress quite well to... so there really isn't much difference, 1/10's of millimeters or less I would presume.Quote:
Originally Posted by ell
I have not been, but thats not a bad idea... I'll have to haul these into work and use the scales we have there, scales I have at home do not go down to grams.Quote:
Originally Posted by ell
Near-empty, ha! I got 3 mem chips and that was all... I didn't think anyone was going to catch that either, good eye. :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
EK block installed, video captured and things progressing! :up:
Nice thread. I can't wait to see the test results. I bought my 480's the first week they were out and there was really only one option for waterblocks so I went with the Koolance. So far I have been really pleased. They look great and seem to be doing a good job cooling these beastly cards down. Right now I only have them on a triple Rad and they are running in parallel. I am getting 33C idle temps and 50C after looping Vantage for an hour. Some of these new blocks look dead sexy though :) Quick pic of mine lit up.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...euss/temp2.jpg
lets see that vapQuote:
Originally Posted by Section8
thanks for the videos, its extremely important to be able to see the ease of use of mounting the blocks, cant believe Koolance give sooo much thermal pads, hi5 to them... my only question which they dont make clear in their updated instructions is why there are two types of thermal pads included?
Also I vote that this thread be made sticky, once the results are announced it will pretty much be *THE* thread to check for 480 WBs.
Coldon: GTX480 will not be TOP gpus even after year (well, in my opinion compared to 5870 or 5970 they are not top ones even now, but that's offtopic). Then what - for each new gen gpus of nvidia/ati new sticky thread? If it had not been done for other gpus, no need for these ones.
yeh but in addition to the fact that the blocks are only for the 480, the installation videos themselves have a wealth of additional info for novice water coolers. How to apply thermal tape, how to apply TIM, whats important when mounting the block, whats important performance wise, etc...
As for the sticky thing, it is a bit of laziness on my part ;) But its also valuable info for the moment, sticky it for a few months till the info isnt all the important than unsticky it. The GTX480 will be a popular WC card for at least another 6~12months.
I'm seriously impressed with the koolance block install, just curious about the performance. I cant believe I nearly pulled the trigger on a BP block. OMFG.
Love your video skinnee ... Awesome!
:up:
Took some time off yesterday, needed some relaxing on the long weekend. Aqua Computer block goes on later today, EK video should be rendering this afternoon.
We need more honest people like you ^^^^ Its good to see people actually put their OWN time into testing products and giving out reviews etc. GJ Skinnee
EK Block Installation video is up. YT is still processing the video, 720p will be available soon.
My bad if it has been mentioned before but I didnt notice it was or not, is the MCW-80 being tested as well?
Thanks,
Eddie
Skinee, good job, nice vid.Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
It looks like you did not put the thicker 1.5mm pad on those tiny 6 chips at the end of the card.
If I'm correct only first few blocks were missing thicker pads and had old instructions.
Mine had wrong instructions but the pads were included separately in the parcel and I got e-mail with correct instructions.
you mean the ones right after the VRM's? If so, the pad I had in the retail package covers them about 75%.
I was not aware of any changes to that area, only change I know of is the washer around the GPU core for the bracket.
:shrug:
Yes, the six small after the VRM's.Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
The pads in the package now are (numbers are for the marked areas on the instructions
(1) thin, 3x precut strips for RAM
(2) thin, 2 strips to be cut for the 6 large chips + 4 small above the capacitors + 18 small to the right of the 6 large chips
(3) thick pad to be cut into 6 small pieces for those small chips which are lower than others
If you plan do to the backplate too, there is also few small chips on the back of the pcb, if you put the pads there it can make the backplate somewhat useful :)
I have no idea though how hot those small chips get on either sides without any cooling but they were meant to be cooled in stock (there were thick pads on them when I've opened my cards) and in the waterblock - as it extends to them.
Once again - grand job with all the testing!
yes there should be a 1" by 1" square 1.5mm thick thermal pad taht you need to cut into very small squares to cover the 6 very small VRM chips.Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
take a look at the stock cooler and you will see a thick "grayish" thermal compound on 6 points beside the white thermal pad that touches the VRM chips...
Thanks for the info luke!
At this point, the only thing I can do is note the further revision in the review of the EK block. I have a few emoticons I could use for what I want to say right now about the several revisions after release by EK, but no point in going down that road. I will say from testing the block with the thermal pads I installed, stability was not an issue.
cant wait to see the results :up:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
sounds like a good matchup
Great videos Skinnee m8... :toast:
Seriously i think that block manufacturers should buy these installation videos...
Poll: Should Skinnee introduce a hot looking "assistant" to help during the videos? lol
Good work m8, not sure I'm going the 480 route yet but I'd love to see the results!
A nurse dressed in vinyl should be nice... :lol2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Major
Great work skinnee and much appreciated. I just ordered a 480 with the EK acetal + nickel block.
Few questions though, after watching the video those stand offs you have to insert yourself with thermal compound on, how the hell do they hold the block on? Are they rubber? Do the screws press them tight to the outer walls of those holes and that's how it's held in place? (Like a wall plug)
Seems an over complicated and risky way of holding the block in place.
Here is a cutout of the instructions updated April 16, 2010. It says to use the 1.5mm pads on the circled mosfets.
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2...elot737/EK.jpg
the screw goes through the middle of the standoff.Quote:
Originally Posted by phenomenon67
Danger Den did a videos for both the 480 and 470 versions...saw them on youtube.Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeBar
I have an assistant for himQuote:
Originally Posted by JoeBar
http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/736...vl49827531.jpg
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/7...0312ul8.th.jpg
Is she available and willing to travel to Australia? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by DarthBeavis
Can she make a sammich?
Skinnee,
Where did you get the rubber covers for the sensitive connection areas that you use while working on the card?
sure . . .my blow up ewe got worn out :rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
They came stock on the card MSI sent us.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancelot
@DB if she makes a good sammich, send her over... cleaned first plz. ;)
No, seeing quality WC pron installs and zooming back to get :banana::banana::banana::banana: chickies would totaly cause the universe to fold. All of us uber smart guys would crack at seeing crack vs pron and trying to calculate pron vs :banana::banana::banana::banana: would upset the Hawking balance. Smart guys know who Hawkins is.............. And read his book, I did, buried under my old GPU waterbock.Quote:
Originally Posted by Major
http://www.amazon.com/Brief-History-...owViewpoints=1
There is enuff Google in the world. Smart people know when to close one link and move to another reality.
Kids these days. And besides, Skinnee wears a ring.
Doesn't mean I'm dead. :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by Conumdrum
Don't let the wife see that or you will be. :p:;):rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
What's her email?
LOL, yea, so true. I guess I'm to used to tabbing I guess. Pron/:banana::banana::banana::banana:, one click.
no nurses!!! i`m tired from them at my job. maybe maid? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeBar
hope she doesnt have an account here or you might be.:rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
Haha! Everyone with his fantasies... :lol2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vetalar
Jesus christ guys lets not get too overwhelmed by a plastic doll. Lets stick to the program. already we have a useless page of cringe worthy embarrasing statements from a wealth of greased spotty teenagers around the globe, great! cheers db! :up: if my other half saw me in possesion of something like that my sanity would definetley come into question, other than the obvious, "what in the hell would a grown man need/want that for?" could be a cultural difference.. not certain, u yanks ey! :ROTF:
well, on other forums I have been spotted with blown up sheep . . .so this is rather tame. Granted I have the body of Ron Jeremy in said pix . . .Quote:
Originally Posted by ell
i think we need a review on this from DarthBeavis : http://www.muttonbone.com/inflatable-sheep-specs/
Maybe a blow up sheep round up, where you can give us the "skinnee" on max pressure, easse of use and so on :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Every time I arrive upon XtremeSystems, I immediately check my User CP. It's more than likely that I'm doing so in order to check, with high hopes, that the threads I'm subscribed to might show their titles in a beautiful bold font, exclaiming to me, "Hear ye, hear ye, behold, I bear new fruits!" In this case, however, after clicking this newly thickened link, I feel rather blue-balled instead of excited to finally read Skinnee's 480 block results. You all have killed the little boy inside of me, who was once ecstatic to hear that he's going to Disney Land, only to be devastated moments later when his parents tell him that he cannot go. Through all of your recent off-topic, sammich, and Ron Jeremy boner banter, you've left me empty inside without bearing of said new fruits as the bold link I clicked on so fiendly implied. Unfortunately, because I'm a junkie for this topic, it's like a symptom of withdrawal and I have no choice but to continue to check back every hour as I have been for days now... :)
the mods can clean it up. job security for them. does not mean we cannot post stuff. And, for the record, I did not mean that part of Ron Jeremy. I meant his belly. Get your mind out of the gutter :shocked:Quote:
Originally Posted by ForceFed_B16A
I think a review of that nature might be more up [XC] riptide's alley. :rofl::ROTF:Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldon
:para:
*runs away and hides*
:sofa:
Ah, skinnee did say it was going to take a while to get the testing done so we're just keeping the mood lighthearted til his next post.Quote:
Originally Posted by ForceFed_B16A
I don't mind the banter at all... in fact I still need a sammich. :p:
AC block is through 1 mount, mounts 2 & 3 will hopefully happen tonight (work and a few other things have prevented progress). Need to reshoot the mounting part of the installation video... camera got all glitchy again for that part. In related news, HeatKiller block should've shipped from Germany today according to the last email conversation I had with Watercool.
Once all of the blocks have completed the 6 tests (2 tests per mount), I am going through a tweak and improvement round to try out the ideas I have as testing has been going on. Retail package and tweaked data will be released at the same time. My goal is to have all the testing completed including the tweak round by the 18th... as I have a rather exciting trip planned.
Carry on...
Thanks for putting so much time into the testing. Cant wait for the results, my purchase hinges on your review.
As am I; twas my only intention. I didn't mean to appear serious. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Waterlogged
And Moses parted the seas of distilled water with a little PT Nuke added...
And Jebus turned 32 oz of Fluid XP into enough to cool everyone's rig
tho, I walk through the valley of the shadow of FTW, I shall fear no BSODs...for MovieMan is our sheppard, he banneth the heathens to the netheregions of the intrawebz
There, a poast for our Biblically-oriented brethren.
Fluid XP... really?
:rofl:
So, Skinnee...results around Christmas? Allllllrighty-then.
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/g...AceVentura.gif
I was thinking closer to New Year. ;)