i dont know if any one mentioned this already but PAT, a canterwood feature, isn't even a technology. It's simply a term for using better silicon. So PAT doesn't really exist.
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i dont know if any one mentioned this already but PAT, a canterwood feature, isn't even a technology. It's simply a term for using better silicon. So PAT doesn't really exist.
erm I think many will question this! PAT seems to be some ram optimizations that probably aren't inherent in certain silicon other than Intel possibly disabling it in the 865PE series.Quote:
Originally posted by oplix
i dont know if any one mentioned this already but PAT, a canterwood feature, isn't even a technology. It's simply a term for using better silicon. So PAT doesn't really exist.
Quote:
Originally posted by JNav89GT
erm I think many will question this! PAT seems to be some ram optimizations that probably aren't inherent in certain silicon other than Intel possibly disabling it in the 865PE series.
I think they would likely select the better silicon for the PAT enabled 875, since this "shortcut" to decrease latency is a little more difficult for the chipset. However, looking at 865's OC capabilities, I dont think there's much difference between them in terms of silicon quality
Yes, they do speed bin chips, and use the best for 875Ps. However, they do alter the chipsets at that point, to shave off clock cycles in the memory controller itself. They are physically different. If what you are saying were true, the two chipsets would give the exact same performance at the same clockspeed, oplix. This is not the case.Quote:
Originally posted by oplix
i dont know if any one mentioned this already but PAT, a canterwood feature, isn't even a technology. It's simply a term for using better silicon. So PAT doesn't really exist.
Dang macci...that is crazy.
I saw you mention, though, that your 875P at 300 FSB whipped your 865PE at 340 in 3DMark?
That seems funky to me...any idea what's going on there?
Macci, I just saw your 320+ FSB, looks like you almost maxed out that board from what anandtechs review shows it only gets up to 333. thats insane.
did you volt mod that board?
from the review it looks like it only gets 1.6 for Core Volts.
Zroc, Yeah the Albatron 865PE @340FSB w/ its slow bios does perform worse than a IC7/P4C800 at 300FSB. But thats only because of there silly slow BIOS.
yes it does seem slow :( compared to 4.1 GHz and much lower FSB....Quote:
Originally posted by macci
Zroc, Yeah the Albatron 865PE @340FSB w/ its slow bios does perform worse than a IC7/P4C800 at 300FSB. But thats only because of there silly slow BIOS.
http://users.pandora.be/JCviggen/p4pi.JPG
Yeah..and the SuperPi w/ albatron is actually quite good..3DMark is even slower (talking about 108Car hi at 4.2GHz etc.) LOL
IC7 at 274FSB gave 34sec btw ;)
I think I've got 36sec aircooled w/ P4C800+2.4C too.
Awesome scores macci, congrats.
What's your memory voltage on the IC7 @ 220Mhz, 2-5-2-2 (looking at your screenshot)?
Hmmm... *thinks about the ASUS* *remembers his and JC's P4T533 accident*
I'm pretty pleased with my IC7-G :)
LOL @ major sluaghter,
Quote:
Originally posted by macci
IC7 at 274FSB gave 34sec
Well see you could stay at 5:4... I had to go to 3:2 at those speeds :(
At 275 5:4 on the IC7 I could max out the mem timings/options and in lobby it gave me the same results as 285 more relaxed timings or 295 3:2 :(
Or just do this.Quote:
Originally posted by Zroc
Well, you could do that...you'd need to multiply the result times 2.
It's just easier to go FSBx1.6 than FSB/1.25x2. Plus, a lot of motherboards list their ratios as 1.6 or 1.3.
Take 5:4 Just multiply your FSB by the number on the right being 4, and then divide that by the number on the left, 5.
So at say a FSB of 250 gives you using 5:4 is
250 X 4=1000
1000 divided by 5=200mhz
Man that is a pain.... I guess no one here is a math genius! To get true Ram speeds do this, very simple:Quote:
Originally posted by TechTones
Or just do this.
Take 5:4 Just multiply your FSB by the number on the right being 4, and then divide that by the number on the left, 5.
So at say a FSB of 250 gives you using 5:4 is
250 X 4=1000
1000 divided by 5=200mhz
5:4 = Just multiply FSB x .8
3:2 = Just multiply FSB x .666
a pain?
imo all the other ways that have been explained are a pain.....its really quite easy to go 260 *4/5 = 208
Ive been doing since using the old 3:4 dividers on the PE chipset....mega mega easy way of doing it :thumbup: :D
I'm using the 326 x 4 / 5 method with my P4P800 :D
http://www.solidhardware.com/macci/p...p_326mem_s.gif
Now lets see a P4C800 do the same :D
Seriously the P4C800 is a bit faster clock to clock but it cant go much above 300 5:4 mem. So at 320FSB P4C (3:2) and P4P (5:4) are equal. Gotta do some more testing thou.
macci would you mind doing a pcmark benchmark for me? im curious to see your scores
Maaci
are you running a Prommy with a P4P800? Any reset switch problems where the board doesn't wait for the evap reach -33 but boots up *right* away.
Opp said there are problems with this 865 board too like mots of them and the Prommy.
macci,
what has been your favorite so far of the of 875/865 boards?
P4C800 and P4P800 are pretty much equal boards. P4P is obviously a bit cheaper and it requires 300+fsb 5:4 mode in order to compete w/ P4C800 at 300fsb 3:2. So if your going to for extreme performance w/ P4P800 make sure you've got some good ram (DDR500+)
what ram do you have? ocz pc3700 gold & whats your vdimm?
Kingston HyperX PC3000
Kingston HyperX PC3000:eek:
WHo'd a though??? What chips are on them??
Hi Ted :)
I have a 2.6c and P4P800 coming tomorrow. What ram are you using for Intel 865's?
no, dont do it! i dont wanna see the P4P faster than a P4C!! :DQuote:
Originally posted by macci
Gotta do some more testing thou.
with air cooling or water cooling which board do you think would be better macci? p4c or p4p??
I need to know too Macci.... also if the vdimm mod is the same for both boards......
TechTones
I've got tons of memory here, Crucial 3200, currently im using Geil platinum ddr. That will do 480 ddr in a albatron 845PE board, But it's in my xp1700@ 230 ddr now. The crucial wont do over 460ddr in the albatron. I have some of the good buffalo windbond chips too CH5. Seems like everyone's doing good with the kingston hyperX??
I ordered a 2.4 and a 2.6, A Asus P4P and a Abit IS7-E only $97 for it. I was in Overclockers forums, guy in there's getting the same killer memory results with the updated Bios 1.3C, Abit pulled it off their server., but i downloaded it and have it saved.
Man i hate waiting. But then i dont have any shortage of computers here. all these F@H rigs!!!!
Got a AMD 1700+ in my vapo PE now that does 2650mhz, I originally had a p4 2.8 in there. So i have the intel Kit still. Gonna be up late about wednesday.
Tell us how you make out tomorrow!!!!
let me know how u guys do with your 2.6C's and P4P800's and IS7's and such. i think ill base my purchase off your guys results if their that good. ;)
im seriously thinking about the P4P800 and a 2.6C
I was thinking of getting the P4C800 but now I think ill be picking up a P4P...... unless the Epox shows up all of the sudden...... The IS7 looks good too but if the vdimm mod is the same as the IC7 then Id like to stay way from that...... I just hope the vdimm mod for the P4P is the same as the P4C cos my rams ( OCZ 3500) sux at 2.8v......
Guys, don't lose sight of the fact that macci is pulling off some EXTREME stuff, here.
As he stated: "P4C800 and P4P800 are pretty much equal boards. P4P is obviously a bit cheaper and it requires 300+fsb 5:4 mode in order to compete w/ P4C800 at 300fsb 3:2. So if your going to for extreme performance w/ P4P800 make sure you've got some good ram (DDR500+)"
Read closely. The P4P need over 300 FSB at 5:4 to beat the P4C 875P at 300 FSB at 3:2. That's actually a lot.
What he's saying, basically, is if you're willing to get extreme (phase cooling, pelting the northbridge, volt mods), the P4P can get to a higher FSB, basically. And by extreme overclocking, he's refering to the max percentage overclock...not necessarily the highest overall performance.
Fact is, you can get to the same place with a higher multiplier chip and a less extreme overclock. For example, he can pass 3DMark 2K1 at 322x12=3864 5:4 with his 2.4 on the P4P and all the work he's done on his setup. He could've gotten as good of performance from a 2.6 at 308...but that's not as extreme of an overclock.
macci's work is exceptional. But don't forget that, for most overclockers, you're better off with an 875P board.
Makes total sence Zroc..... I was at the store to order a P4P and when I put my deposit, I thought of your post and changed my mind agin lol..... ordered me a P4C instead os I dont think I wanna change mobo again in a couple weeks......... I think the $60 more that I spent is worth the money just for the thought that I bought the best mobo around..... yes some may say the IC7 is better but Im sure Ill be doing the vdimm mod and the safety of using grabbers is priceless......
It's a little different: I have (had) both boards. At 200:200 both are at the same level: you get around 3000 MB/sec (-+) unbuffered bandwidth. And if I run game or productivity benchmarks I cannot see any difference between these 2 boards outside of the usual fluctuations. Maybe the P4C800 (depending on the board sample) gives still a few points more, but that's nothing you would feel or see.Quote:
Originally posted by Zroc
Guys, don't lose sight of the fact that macci is pulling off some EXTREME stuff, here.
As he stated: "P4C800 and P4P800 are pretty much equal boards. P4P is obviously a bit cheaper and it requires 300+fsb 5:4 mode in order to compete w/ P4C800 at 300fsb 3:2. So if your going to for extreme performance w/ P4P800 make sure you've got some good ram (DDR500+)"
Read closely. The P4P need over 300 FSB at 5:4 to beat the P4C 875P at 300 FSB at 3:2. That's actually a lot.
Given that the P4P800 DeLuxe has even the better features (ICH5-R) and not less bundled than the P4C800, I think it's the better buy. The biggest bang is the P4P800 standard.
I think Asus sees it in the same way and that's the reason why they have upgraded from P4C800 to P4C800e. But is that version already selling in US?
not sure wether to get this or the ic7 or 4pca3+
That's not what I'm saying, chainbolt. The P4P (and now apparently the IS7) is doing something (and it's NOT PAT) at stock speeds that does NOT carry forward in overclocking.Quote:
Originally posted by chainbolt
It's a little different: I have (had) both boards. At 200:200 both are at the same level: you get around 3000 MB/sec (-+) unbuffered bandwidth. And if I run game or productivity benchmarks I cannot see any difference between these 2 boards outside of the usual fluctuations. Maybe the P4C800 (depending on the board sample) gives still a few points more, but that's nothing you would feel or see.
Given that the P4P800 DeLuxe has even the better features (ICH5-R) and not less bundled than the P4C800, I think it's the better buy. The biggest bang is the P4P800 standard.
I think Asus sees it in the same way and that's the reason why they have upgraded from P4C800 to P4C800e. But is that version already selling in US?
It's advantages at stock just disappear once you overclock (even [H] noted this in their review).
Then there's the possiblity that they'll have to pull those stock-speed tweaks out if Intel lays down the law.
I mean hell, the IC7 costs $130 now, the P4P800 non-deluxe $120...why the heck take those risks for $10?
Zroc, the IS7 bios does not lose its performance gains when overclocked. I cant say for the Asus cos I havnt used it but for the IS7, the performance is definantly still there when overclocking. See results below;
This was with the default bios and the 2nd bios with settings;
275fsb.....2-5-3-2.....
http://users.bigpond.net.au/creat/in...-2=3850MHz.JPG
and this is the same fsb with the same timings with the new bios;
http://users.bigpond.net.au/creat/in...rengthened.JPG
The increase speaks for itself.....I dont have a screenie for it on hand of it as yet, but have been able to get 2975/2974 unbuffered at 280fsb now too :banana:
I love my IS7......except the §§§§ty vdimm :mad: :D
hehehe
Yes, the Sandras are still ok, but it's the application benchmarks that take a dump.
For example, in [H]'s article (which is the only one I've seen where they actually overclocked the P4P):
http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDg0LDM=
The Sandras at 250x12/3GHz 5:4 on the P4P beat the 875P at 200x15/3GHz.
However, none of the benchmarks do. In fact, with the P4P at 250x12/3GHz 5:4, it's slower than 200x15/3GHz on the 875P....AND on the P4P.
This just shouldn't happen. No way should 200x15/3GHz 1:1 beat 250x12/3GHz at 5:4.
I'll go grab an IS7, IC7, and P4P, and test 'em all out myself.
I'll report back with results.
the beauty of this forum. This is hillarious. Insane hardware consumption enter here >>>>>>>>>Quote:
Originally posted by Zroc
I'll go grab an IS7, IC7, and P4P, and test 'em all out myself.
I'll report back with results.
Loading XP on the IS7-e now. Asus p4p didnt come in yet. Just flashed the bios to the 1.3 beta. . I'll give the details in a little while.
But please dont expect anything as good as ZROCS Pulitzer prize reviews!!!:D
Temp seems a little hot on a stock heatsink?? Gonna go to an alpha after testing stock. Then in my Vapo PE.
The geil memory i have here has made it to 470 ddr with 2.8 volts in a older epox 4bGA mb, with a 3:4 Multiplier so im guessing that's what i have to work with. Got some good corsair here makes it to 460 ddr, and just got some buffalo 5ns chips also.
Let me go clear some space on my Hosting site.
Ok here's some stock numbers on memory
Stock 200 fsbCas 222 settings geil platinum 3500 no volts 2.4ghz
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/tedind...y%20200fsb.JPG
Same cas 222 settings Changed memory to ultra 200 fsb 2.4ghz
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/tedind...0memory222.JPG
That's almost a 15% boost. Probably wont hold up as it scales higher, As creatives above didnt @ 275mhz, but lets see.
looking good so far, scale that mofo ;)
Creative and the others. Just checking my DDR volts. Doesnt matter where i set it. It still shows 2.62 volts?? weather i set it @ 2.5 or 2.8?? Does yours change when you actually change it??
This geil does need volts. let me know.
Corrupted my testing HD, gotta reload XP, Knew i shoulda made a Ghost image!!!!
Gonna start a new IS7 Thread, so as not to make this too huge or take away from Macci's P4P for now.
Creative, could you please move your numbers and pics overif you could
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...threadid=14247
Heh, what's hilarious is, I've got four 2.8's and six 3.0's sitting here in front of me...and I don't have time to do any overclocking (cherry-picking, as they say) :(Quote:
Originally posted by JNav89GT
the beauty of this forum. This is hillarious. Insane hardware consumption enter here >>>>>>>>>
As for the boards...well, nothing better than finding out for yourself, eh?
ROFLMAO!!Quote:
Originally posted by Tedinde
But please dont expect anything as good as ZROCS Pulitzer prize reviews!!!:D
Of all people, you KNOW better ;)Quote:
Originally posted by Tedinde
Corrupted my testing HD, gotta reload XP, Knew i shoulda made a Ghost image!!!!
Hey, do you actually have an 875P board there to compare to?
Go to my link zroc, it wasnt the HD or corruption.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...&postid=160809
Yep taken pics and links and words to the other thread :):)
Ill take the pics out of this thread as to free up some of the site bandwidth :)
Zroc, very interested to find your results.....sorry if we made you go and buy new toys :D:D
hehehehehe
It's very easy to fix corruption... check out this article. Takes about 10minutes the first time, then later it goes alot faster if you make some .txt files with the commands in em.Quote:
Originally posted by Tedinde
Corrupted my testing HD, gotta reload XP, Knew i shoulda made a Ghost image!!!!
http://support.microsoft.com/default...b;en-us;307545
I found a guide that is 10x easier than that one, and it actually works. The Microsoft guide didn't work when I tried it.
CLICK
Well I've got a pretty decent 2.4C (I think). And I have ram that will do 250+ so I think imma go for a P4P800 ;)Quote:
Originally posted by macci
P4C800 and P4P800 are pretty much equal boards. P4P is obviously a bit cheaper and it requires 300+fsb 5:4 mode in order to compete w/ P4C800 at 300fsb 3:2. So if your going to for extreme performance w/ P4P800 make sure you've got some good ram (DDR500+)
Really? It's worked every time I've done it.Quote:
Originally posted by Nohto
I found a guide that is 10x easier than that one, and it actually works. The Microsoft guide didn't work when I tried it.
CLICK
I usually just make a ghost of the drive if I am having problems with HD corruption, but the method I posted worked for me with no problems.
sup everyone,
my first post in these forums, usually over at ocaddiction.com forums
i saw some peeps posting mem scores,this is what i got my sys running at right now(280FSB, 5:4):
http://www.angelfire.com/jazz/realll...e_2_sandra.jpg
http://www.angelfire.com/jazz/realll...big/memory.bmp
havent benched sandra on 300FSB, 5:4, but im guessing i will be breaking atleast 7k on air.
http://www.angelfire.com/jazz/reallllllllllbig/6.bmp
[QUOTE]Originally posted by bigballaga
[B]sup everyone,
my first post in these forums, usually over at ocaddiction.com forums
i saw some peeps posting mem scores,this is what i got my sys running at right now(280FSB, 5:4):
havent benched sandra on 300FSB, 5:4, but im guessing i will be breaking atleast 7k on air.
[QUOTE]
WOW!!! THAT IS ONE HELL OF A CHIP!!! 300 FSB ON AIR WOW!!!!
is it stable at 300 fsb? I would realy love to see benchies of that.
Looks like another nice ic7 oc. maybe I am leaning towards the ic7 now and away from the p4p800 after seeing that screenshot!
AAAHHH!!! CAN'T DECIDE!!!:D
hahaha, im looking to get water but cant decide on which system i want. as soon as i get that figured out, i should be hitting 320+
looking for 23k+ in 3d 01
Found a little more in my IS7 with some kingston hyperX
Cas 2225
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/tedind...0hyperx222.JPG
What voltage was that at telinde? Im still contemplating if I should go with the hyperX 3500 or OCZ gold.......
are you going to do regular watercooling, or with pelts, or do you include phase change cooling like prometia and vapo chill? How much money do you want to spend?Quote:
Originally posted by bigballaga
hahaha, im looking to get water but cant decide on which system i want. as soon as i get that figured out, i should be hitting 320+
looking for 23k+ in 3d 01
Nice score ted. If only that kingston was a bit cheaper. I think I would go with ocz gold for that price.