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DID can be zeroQuote:
Originally Posted by KTE
I found that the max async latency differs ~10ns. That has an impact on benchmarks. Using the same latency leaded to much more linear results. So i keep an eye on that subtiming now. Might be common sense for ocers.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
how can i flash back to 1.1 safely?
With this board the options are either 1 or 2.Quote:
Originally Posted by justapost
I haven't seen that option on this board.Quote:
I found that the max async latency differs ~10ns. That has an impact on benchmarks. Using the same latency leaded to much more linear results. So i keep an eye on that subtiming now. Might be common sense for ocers.
10ns EVEREST RAM latency? Are you sure about this?
There' nothing I've seen giving you that much gain on this board so far (no patch BIOS). I mean the major timings on K10 are ~seven and 5-5-5-15 2T tRC 35 tRFC 195ns wouldn't get 10ns higher latency than 3-3-3-11 1T tRC 24 tRFC 75ns on my board. Usually 4-5ns is max.
This might help you although it concerns K8/DDR, it is still simple enough to apply in many areas.
gareth170: Using the exact same method you used to flash 1.2, just with the correct v1.1 BIOS file. ;)
Ok KTE..
Can I get a short list of the options difference you see with POD compared to 113 when running a black edition of the Phenom? did you take not of this when you where playing with the 2 different bios. Is the POD really a better performer then the 113? more buggy?
just wondering I hope you havn't already stated all of this.
i used msi live update 3 which it made a automatic flashing dos disk with the 1.2 on it which i liked. but ive deleted the 1.1 setup files from msi live update 3 folder. where can i download it from again? and would it downgrade this way?Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
no it will just go back to stock bios check MSI's website for offical bios.
You are talking about your bios options.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
Check MSR C0010070 with CrystalCPU.
Bit 0:5 is CPUFID
Bit 6:8 is CPUDID
CPUDID should be zero if you set it to 1 in the bios.
About MaxAsyncLatency.
As i played with different nb multis the value varied between 48 and 57ns here.
Here are two Screenshots with differen MaxAsyncLatency settings.
http://www.abload.de/thumb/ev8x3s.jpg
http://www.abload.de/thumb/ev8-57nus.jpg
Difference in Everest Latency is ~6ns.
The equation used to calculate this value is in the K10 guide. I'll try to find it.
P0D had the errata patch and nothing more different for me. So I reinstalled 113. I'm running P0E now and it has different options than the last BIOSes.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonspd
On their website: http://global.msi.com.tw/index.php?f...2&type=utilityQuote:
Originally Posted by gareth170
Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
P0E has more options then the last bios 1.2?
noo i mean i have live update 3 already install. and when u download something from it , it saves it in a temp setup folder but i deleted the 1.1 bios setup files which automaticly flashs the bios in dos.. i can't redownload it from live update 3 because its seeing i got 1.2..Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
the flashing dos disk it made take the 1.1 file from msi and replace the 1.2 on the disk if you said it made one with 1.2 on it then restart and type the flashprograms name in when in dos
Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by justapost
I'm aware of the equations mentioned in the guide as I've mentioned before because we went over them in the "Breaking K10 230MH HT limit" thread. The equation I gave is a simplified version of the official one and specific to this boards BIOS programming. You only need BIOS HEX values to give you the speeds and so its easy for anyone to use and doesn't require any decoding.
Ah ok. I didn't use Memset to change timings with K10 so far because it was giving me problems. Tried the latest one now and it works OK, and the option for MaxAsyncLat appears. And yep, it produces big latency gains and even bandwidth gains, well spotted and thanks. ;)Quote:
About MaxAsyncLatency.
As i played with different nb multis the value varied between 48 and 57ns here.
Here are two Screenshots with differen MaxAsyncLatency settings.
http://www.abload.de/thumb/ev8x3s.jpg
http://www.abload.de/thumb/ev8-57nus.jpg
Difference in Everest Latency is ~6ns.
For Phenom, yes. But it has many problems not present in 1.2 aswell.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonspd
I don't use Liveupdate 3 TBH so I'm not sure what it allows and not. My IE 7 is also crashing so I can't try the Liveupdate (I hardly use IE). The way I flash BIOSes is the usually done way, using a floppy or USB drive.Quote:
Originally Posted by gareth170
*You need a DOS floppy disk to boot with (download the files HERE and unzip onto an XP formatted floppy disk).
*Set system to boot from Drive A: with the floppy disk inside.
*And then after its loaded into the DOS environment, you need to insert another floppy disk which contains the BIOS flash utility (EXE file) and the BIOS itself.
*Then you need to type at the command prompt: A:>flashutility biosfilename.ver and press Enter. For example.
--With Flash Utility Afud412.exe and BIOS file A7376AMS.113, you type:
afud412 a7376ams.113
*Press Enter.
*Don't do anything and wait for it to see if everything completes (percentages) and the flash succeeds. Then restart and load BIOS defaults.
*Done. ;)
u can't type anything because it flashs all automatic..Quote:
Originally Posted by jonspd
Sry about that I'm used to awardflash.exe...
I guess kte summed it up tho.
Thanks for the info on the POE also want be trying that one :D
It has too many problems and also the errata patch applied. It also only allows DDR2-1066 3-5-5-15 as the lowest RAM values.Quote:
Originally Posted by jonspd
Must have missed that, so for the record the bios labels 2^CPUDID as CPUDID. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
I mentioned it because the max async latency seems to change in a non linear way with different ref HT's and nb multis and that can causes non linear results in benchmarks.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
DID 1 stands for 0 and DID 2 stands for 1. I'll check on the MaxAsyncLat soon. So far I've tried keeping it at 44 at all multis if HT ref/RAM is kept constant.
Found the place in the K10 dev doc. MaxAsyncLatency is labeld MaxRdLatency in the doc (verified it with wprcedit). Chapter 2.8.7.8.4 describs how to calculate the value used during ddr2 training and a method to optimize the value after dram training. In case you are interested and don't already know. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
The value varies up to 2ns between reboots here that makes ~100 MB/s difference in everst mem read.
44 seems to be the max i can use here. I gain ~300 MB/s in mem read compared to the 50ns the bios detects.
Thank you for the mem-tuning link, gona try that method soon.
I'm not sure what the last 4 characters of the stepping code means. I assume it has something to do with the IMC? :confused:
But the "MPMW" seems to be weak for OC'ing. I've been reading these threads for a few weeks now and was really confused by some of the numbers you guys were getting, when I couldn't even get close regardless of how many V's I gave the chip... (I have a 9600, 0745MPMW)
I kept thinking I was losing my touch, or missing something....
At least I don't feel quite so bad now. ;)
I've had the chip for 2 weeks and this is the best I've been able to achieve while retaining Stability. This is a shot with SMP folding for well over 72Hrs...
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...25LongFold.jpg
If you folks should find a magic bullet for MPWM, I'd sure like to know! :D
If not, this may at least give some of you a rough point for a stable OC...
EDIT: Oh BTW, this is with 9x NB (1962Mhz) and 8x HTT (1744Mhz)... HTT may run at 9x but I haven't tried upping it yet, I was just looking for something solid...
at last with my wc setup im able to run 3dmark at 2.7ghz though, i need 1.44vcore...
card's @ 850 mhz gpu or 800 mhz gpu mems are stock card one 1177mhz and card 2 1126mhz... enjoy :P
gonna run again tomorrow becose flashed clock fix biosses in.
phenom 9500
msi k9a2 plat
ballistix 8500 2x1gb
2x3870 powercolor zerotherms... which are not working even at stock speeds (mem)
3dmark 06 14.4k
http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08026/3dmark06349.jpg
Yeah, it calculates a total aggregate based on latencies and NB clocks so indeed it would definitely make a large difference to the DCT performance. I've tried 40ns vs 50ns at 1066 5-5-5-15 2T, good gains.Quote:
Originally Posted by justapost
As for NB DID, my BIOS gives the following options:
Bits - Divisor
000b Divide-by 1
001b Divide-by 2
010b Divide-by 4
011b Divide-by 8
100b Divide-by 16
Anything chosen >1 doesn't POST (clear CMOS needed).
IDK if what applies to K8 applies to K10h number decoding since they are totally different. One thing does apply, the year/week and the stepping '0747' and 'CAAWB' for instance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daveburt714
But so far one other member says "MPMW is crap" based on 2 results. That's not right to do, it's too early to say this or if the latter letters make any difference at all.
-Firstly you'll need to have a database of similar week different last 4 letters to compare them.
-Secondly you need to have records of 'MPMW' and some other of any one particular week.
-Thirdly you need other week batches.
-Fourthly you need to match and variate steppings.
-Fifthly you need many samples of each chip to get a close to accurate rough idea.
So far we don't have these. 9600 BE could in itself be just a bad clocker. How do we know? Based on retail user results so far, it looks like a bad clocker, worse than locked Phenoms. Especially on HT ref. Jack looks to have a similar week/step to me, so we'll wait to compare chip potential.
I mean, how many users have you seen get more oc out of 9600BE than the standard edition?
How many retail users have you seen 2.55GHz stable on 9600BE?
Many have this with 9500/9600 though. :(
When I see ES/PR junk like this it really ticks me off because they're try to get the feeling across that one one random sample they received reached 2.8GHz stable easy and yet that's totally untrue for retail so far. I'm sorry but not talking to any AMD reps for which step/week to buy and just going out and picking any one sample of the shelf is what we do and what applies as user centric results. I mean even Fudzilla reported on 18th November something far more accurate than most I've seen around: No plus 2.3GHz parts until B3. The >2.4GHz B3 Q1 part is where what I've heard doesn't agree but the rest has been true for a while.
Also, I'm not sure if I've mentioned it but you'll need to know K10 (AM2+, and AM3 actually) are limited to providing a maximum 110A to the cores and 20A to the northbridge. Not very healthy for oc if you start at 2.2GHz at 1.232V 95W TDP.
Generally 9500/9600 are clocking far better than 9600BE so far. My 9500 did 265HT ref but this 9600BE struggles over 210. Though I haven't yet underclocked the NB/HT to test max (BIOS problem), I have enough to show me the basics when 1.504V 1.48VID 220x11 fails bootup and destroys the Windows registry.Quote:
But the "MPMW" seems to be weak for OC'ing. I've been reading these threads for a few weeks now and was really confused by some of the numbers you guys were getting, when I couldn't even get close regardless of how many V's I gave the chip... (I have a 9600, 0745MPMW)
I kept thinking I was losing my touch, or missing something....
At least I don't feel quite so bad now. ;)
If you folks should find a magic bullet for MPWM, I'd sure like to know! :D
If not, this may at least give some of you a rough point for a stable OC...
EDIT: Oh BTW, this is with 9x NB (1962Mhz) and 8x HTT (1744Mhz)... HTT may run at 9x but I haven't tried upping it yet, I was just looking for something solid...
:(
KeZzZu: Its better to either post thumbs when its not something everyone passing-by will need if they miss it, or just to crop only the info you need to show in the pics (the tools/values). :)
9500s are going very good so far... in comparison to the rest.
KTE : fixed now. gonna rerun today with pencil mods. 15k barrier should be easy. also 3dmark06 wasn't up to date. patching it right now.
Thanks. :D
What volts did you need to bench 2.7G 3D on air?
And what was the water and ambient temp?
that run was with watercooling here specs:Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
500l/h pump
black ice stealth 240 with only one fan.
thermalright xwb-01 cpu block
ambient air temp +20 c'
water temp unknown :(
Cpu vid 1.25v
vcore 1.4x (just to be sure it can handle heavy loads.)
cpu idles +24 - +28 c' load with superpi +32 c' and all cores load unknown
havent checked it yet, run was made at 6 am and after that i went to bed... so that's why im gonna take some more ss and info about systems ^^ thats's all info what i remember about from run :)
So you couldn't bench 2.7G 2k6 on air but could do it on water?