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Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
lets just pray.
stupid question:
if ddr2 and ddr3 are pin compatible wont you stil need a new CPu?
or are AMD64 CPUs with a DDR2 mem controller compatible with DDR3?
btw wont DDR3 need a lower voltage compaired to DDR2?
if they are pin compatable, you can use eithier DDR2 or DDR3 but not both at the same time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Starscream
The AMD64 CPUs with a DDR2 controller are compatible with DDR3 because it is a natively DDR3 controller.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzimark
Those seem to be the whispers...They will be. Major +1 for the internal memory controller which it desperately needed.
Perhaps that will be the key improvement of AM3 cpus vs. AM2 cpus. The internal mem controller tweaked to allow them both...Or of course it could just be one of the additions of K8L, if K8L was designed for AM3 all along.
I don't think AM2 will allow for DDR2/3 from the get-go, do you nn_step? I know they are similar (ddr3 is ddr2 based) but I doubt the initial am2 mem controller is set to handle it. Granted, it just may be, or may be through a AM2 chip revision, called AM3, they may be pin compatible to am2 boards. To tell the truth, I don't have a clue. All I know is AMD is going to support DDR3 sooner rather than later, and that things will progress faster than I think most of us thought they were on the AMD side.
Surely more news will break soon to clarify everything...Or maybe someone can just put the whole thing together better than I can.
What makes you think AMD ever designed a DDR2 controller? :rolleyes:
lol :)Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
All this cryptic :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: . This is why nda's make me so mad, not because i want to know, but because they make me want to :p: (assuming your under nda btw.) So m2 is looking to be ddr3 from the start? but i thought am2 WAS m2.........im so confused.
im doubting very much NNSTep is under NDA, and i think NNSTep also said it best. if Intel = faster, buy intel if AMD faster buy AMD , if Mac is faster , Buy Mac.
simple as that.
however i think the focus put on Kentsfield here is incorrect it will be 2 cores sharing the same limited FSB... wont it?
Where this premise fails is ignoring that Intel's manufactoring capacity is huge. Compared to AMD, the market will be awash with conroes. By AMD's roadmap, they wont have a response for six to nine months. A long time; too long; enough to do more than a lot of hurt. Bright side is the chance of a fire sale by AMD in an attempt to hold onto market share. Of course, if Intel prices reasonably low, then even that move will be nullified. Ow, ow, ow. It's AMD's own damn fault. They got greedy and decided to try to milk the market longer instead of moving to 65 nm as they initially planned back in june of 2005. Instead it's rabbit out of a hat time. We'll see.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charloz24
You are truly enjoying keeping everyone puzzled :stick:Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
Why did AMD ever design a DDR2 controller?
Where this premise fails is in ignoring that Intel's manufactoring capacity is huge. Compared to AMD, the market will be awash with conroes. By AMD's roadmap, they wont have a response for six to nine months. A long time; too long; enough to do more than a lot of hurt. Bright side is the chance of a fire sale by AMD in an attempt to hold onto market share. Of course, if Intel prices reasonably, then even that move will be nullified. Ow, ow, ow. It's AMD's own damn fault. They got greedy and decided to try to milk the market longer instead of moving to 65 nm as they initially planned back in june of 2005. Instead it's rabbit out of a hat time. We'll see.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charloz24
revision f have a ddr2 memory controller.
The ddr3 memory standard isn't even finalised yet, so its impossible to have ddr3 memory controolers. Also I believe ddr3 is rather different to ddr2, so a memory controller would have to have redundent components for either format - prehaps even dual memory controllers if a cpu were to be compatible with both formats.
I doubt that to be the case.
More likely am3 or whatever it will be called will be ddr2 when used by a ddr2 cpu and ddr3 when used by a ddr3 cpu. Quite what this means for board layouts remains to be seen - will am3 boards all contain both ddr2 and 3 sockets? This makes little sense - which to mean suggests that you'll need to match a ddr3 cpu (am3) and motherboard (am3) for ddr3, and a ddr2 cpu (am2) and ddr2 motherboard (am2) for ddr2.
Otherwise revision G (am3) may be a tweaked am2 socket - use am2 motherboards for ddr2 and am3 motherboard for ddr3. - Bu again the complexities of a memory controller supporting both formats (and the pinout supporting it) would mean a far more complex memory controller - far better to just jump to ddr3 with a subsequent socket.
What i think nn is hinting at is that the mem controller is not the main innovation in socket m2, what we have seen with am2 is just a redesign of current technology that is becoming quite old, and while conroe beats am2 at the moment that is because its comparing 2 diferent generations of technology, despite when they were produced. "The future's bright, the future's outwitted me"
http://pbskids.org/clifford/shared/i...ouse-wrong.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by onewingedangel
DDR3 can be only one of two specs
AMD's which is plug and play DDR2 but superior
Intel's which is Identical to AMD's Except that two pins switched locations.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR3
different technology base to ddr2.
gddr3 is an evolved form of ddr2, wheras ddr3 is as different from ddr2, as ddr2 is from ddr1.
Thus to have a chip support both ddr2 and 3 would mean a very complicated memory controller that vastly increases the size of the chip unneccesarily - I would prefer that the die space be used on increasing performance. It would be far better to have seperate lines am2 for ddr2 and am3 for ddr3.
physical differentiation between ddr2 and 3 is essential - so that joe public doesn't try to plug in incompatable memory.
This is where the high level of integration by amd starts to fail them. Having the memory controller on die limits flexibility, having a memory controller on motherboard allow more flexibility. After all you can use a 775 cpu with ddr1, 2, or eventually 3, but you must tie your memory into the motherboards physical support. Until theres a unified memory interface such as fb dimm that can span multiple generations of memory, I think its better for amd to be very specific in terms of support - clearly having ddr1/2/3 boards rather than hybrid boards.
:rolleyes: I guess if Wikipedia says it :rolleyes:
You'll see..;)
What I think he's saying fellas, is that they support DDR3 all along, which he's been saying forever. I believe he thinks that DDR3 support will also encompus DDR2 support because they are so similar. IOW, AMD will have DDR2 support at launch, and DDR3 when it comes out.
This remains to be seen.
I think a CPU revision will be needed over AM2 (AM3) to make this possible, although he MAY be right that they do it from the get go.
Who knows about boards, they might be pin compatible (DDR2/3), they might not. Same thing for AM3. It might be a CPU revision, it might be a new socket. Regardless, AM3 will support both DDR2 and DDR3 somehow.
The semantics will remain until official clarification.
Tony (OCZ) and a guy from Mushkin have both said in another thread that DDR2 boards won't be pin compatible with DDR3.. someone can search for the thread if they want, I'm too lazy. Just something to think about
Even if they are compatible, for the sake of idiots they will have to be different to keep the lawyers away.
If they're gonna make AM3 compatible with both DDR2 and DDR3, it means that either the socket will stay the same for a few more years (at least, for the desktops) so AM3 CPUs will fit in both DDR2 and DDR3 motherboards, or AM3 will have different versions for DDR2 and DDR3. Neither would be a logical choice. I doubt AM3 will support DDR2.
i certainly think nn_step knows what he is talking about.
and i certainly think all you people who think amd will just let conroe crush them are fools.
amd has had plenty of time to come up with something big. but keeping it pretty hush hush for the time being.
but like what was said before, the coming months we gonna be seeing some big things happen.
For all your hatred of the Inq, you people monger rumors worse than a sewing circle.
I think nn is right, AMD is not that stupid, They released the K7 when it looked like AMD wasn't going to have anything better and it hurt intels market share alot, then they released the K8 when the K7 was starting to loose from the P4, so I don't think AMD will just sit there and let conroe winQuote:
Originally Posted by iddqd
actually both Socket 754 and Socket 939 were K8..
Socket 754 was just a stop gap. And as history has shown.. was quickly passed over...
Anyone who thinks AMD is just going to sit down and take it like a mexican hooker on a roofers payday is out of their mind.
Seriously now, Conroe will be a beast, and will probably have it's 6 months to shine, but to think that AMD is just going to let them own them is just frivolous.
Dude that was too good to pass up :rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by DilTech
I feel priviliaged, I'm now your official quote for the month.