Is anybody else experiencing this?

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09-02-2010, 12:55 AM
hodgy1971

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ket

@ josh, GPU-Z 4.5 doesn't support BIOS dumping on the card for some reason, I have to do it via nvflash. I'll flash then get a copy through nvflash and compare them.
@ pilsy, I can't do SLI on a 890FX, not without a "patch" at least ;) So for now its a PhysX card.

gpuz 0.4.4 can do the bios dumping
09-02-2010, 03:29 AM
Ket

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyNutz

Have you tried the card in question by it's self, i.e. remove your older card from the equation.

Also what is the make/model of the card, I read somewhere about some makers gtx460 that sports dual bios/flash chips.

And also perhaps the bios structure is different, or its using a different 3d clock domain, and FBE is just not presenting it correctly. I have
nibitor 5.8 (support for 460) if you post your orig bios i'll check it out to see if there is anything strange.

Cool thanks :up: I bought another KFA card to match my existing one. If there is a dual BIOS.. I guess the only option is to find out how to flash the backup chip as well. I've only got the 1 card installed atm as well.

The only thing left I can think of is maybe the 1 domain FBE doesnt touch listed [GPU default] voltage table screws with the card in some way. Anyway, heres a copy of the original BIOS and the modified BIOS.
09-02-2010, 07:08 AM
CrazyNutz

1 Attachment(s)

Ok I edited your stock bios with NiBitor to 800/1600/2000, and removed the voltage cap.

Also when you dl anything from this forum i think you should use firefox, or chrome, anytime I use IE it corrupts my dl's
09-02-2010, 08:13 AM
Ket

I'll give it a shot now :up:
09-02-2010, 08:19 AM
lowfat

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyNutz

Ok I edited your stock bios with NiBitor to 800/1600/2000, and removed the voltage cap.

Also when you dl anything from this forum i think you should use firefox, or chrome, anytime I use IE it corrupts my dl's

I don't suppose you could do the two 768mb bioses posted recently in the 460 bios thread/ :D
09-02-2010, 08:40 AM
Ket

2 Attachment(s)

Just tried flashing again and the BIOS is deffinately taking but clocks still report stock of 700/1800. One thing I did notice when erasing the eeprom was something about the card has no preservation table? Must be something new I've never seen that before on other nvidia cards.. Heres a couple screens.
09-02-2010, 09:45 AM
CrazyNutz

2 Attachment(s)

Hmmm??? Weird! Dude are you shure you dont have a bad floppy? I have nvflash 5.95 for windows it works fine, maybe you can try it?

preservation table, I've read about this, I thinks it can be lost when you erase eeprom. There was a german article about unlocking a 465 to a 470, and it mention somthing about clearing the preservation table.
09-02-2010, 09:54 AM
CrazyNutz

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowfat

I don't suppose you could do the two 768mb bioses posted recently in the 460 bios thread/ :D

Here you go, removed voltage cap:up:
09-02-2010, 10:00 AM
CrazyNutz

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowfat

I don't suppose you could do the two 768mb bioses posted recently in the 460 bios thread/ :D

And almost missed your other one here you go.
09-02-2010, 01:56 PM
Ket

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyNutz

Hmmm??? Weird! Dude are you shure you dont have a bad floppy? I have nvflash 5.95 for windows it works fine, maybe you can try it?

preservation table, I've read about this, I thinks it can be lost when you erase eeprom. There was a german article about unlocking a 465 to a 470, and it mention somthing about clearing the preservation table.

I use a bootable USB stick ;) I've also flashed from DOS and the Windows flasher, neither "appear" to work even though the flash goes fine. Maybe I just have to wait for nibitor and a newer nvflash for my card :shrug:
09-02-2010, 03:14 PM
lowfat

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyNutz

Here you go, removed voltage cap:up:

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyNutz

And almost missed your other one here you go.

Dood. You are awesome. :up:
09-02-2010, 03:58 PM
CrazyNutz

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ket

I use a bootable USB stick ;) I've also flashed from DOS and the Windows flasher, neither "appear" to work even though the flash goes fine. Maybe I just have to wait for nibitor and a newer nvflash for my card :shrug:

Man this is freaky. I can't imagine this being a driver issue either, the Nvidia default clocks are't even 700mhz, and I doubt the drivers have any vendor specific logic...

I wander if Nvidia has given vendors a way to keep us from putting modded bios images on these things? With the potential of the 460's hurting there profits on the high end parts...

Have you tried to put your modded bios from your first 460 on the new one?

Or maybe you just have a botched card???
09-02-2010, 04:01 PM
CrazyNutz

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowfat

Dood. You are awesome. :up:

No Problem, hope you enjoy. BTW If you guy's donate just $5 to Mavke he will send you NiBiTor 5.8
09-02-2010, 05:08 PM
Funky

Its same here with Galaxy GTX 460.
Modified clock and voltages do not stick even though flash goes fine.
And KFA is basically Galaxy. So its brand specific. They have done something to this card that is making this happen.
09-02-2010, 05:21 PM
CrazyNutz

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funky

Its same here with Galaxy GTX 460.
Modified clock and voltages do not stick even though flash goes fine.
And KFA is basically Galaxy. So its brand specific. They have done something to this card that is making this happen.

Uh ohh! bastards! I guess we'll have to wait to see if other vendors follow suit
09-02-2010, 05:58 PM
Funky

One way to check what is actually going on is to try and flash bios from some other manufacturer (stock bios).
If problem is at flashing step, it should still stick to 700/924 clocks which is default for KFA and Galaxy GC Ed. The only thing stopping me from doing that is the fact that this board uses custom PCB. Dont really know what will happen and at the moment I do not have backup card. Will give it a try after few days when I get my HD3450 back from a friend.
09-02-2010, 06:25 PM
Funky

Ok, I tried it. Still nothing.
Whichever bios I flash, speeds remain 700/924 :P

I checked the original bios dump and before and after flash dumps using hex editor.
Bios is definitely getting flashed as new dumps after flashing the card are identical to the bios I flashed.
Still for some reason clocks and voltages are not sticking.
I tried flashing it with stock and modified bios of evga, ASUS, Palit and MSI.

Nothing happens to clocks :@
09-02-2010, 07:08 PM
CrazyNutz

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funky

Ok, I tried it. Still nothing.
Whichever bios I flash, speeds remain 700/924 :P

I checked the original bios dump and before and after flash dumps using hex editor.
Bios is definitely getting flashed as new dumps after flashing the card are identical to the bios I flashed.
Still for some reason clocks and voltages are not sticking.
I tried flashing it with stock and modified bios of evga, ASUS, Palit and MSI.

Nothing happens to clocks :@

The clocks must be hard set i.e. some where on the board there may be a section an array of 0ohm resistors (bridges) that override the bios clocks.

@Ket since you have two of theses cards, can you examine the PCB's on the two and look for differences i.e. added/missing resistors (black very small with a 0 on them)
09-02-2010, 07:36 PM
Funky

I dont think that is the problem.
I can clearly see two bios chips.
There are two PM25LV512 one each on front and back of the card. And they have done something to the chip on the front. There is huge blob of solder on the chip which is on the top near the pin 0. I will try to take better pic of the same.
09-03-2010, 03:02 AM
Funky

Ok as promised, the pics.

Here is the root cause of the problem. The two bios chips. (Sorry for large pics I just wanted to make sure the pics are clear enough )

http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/8589/frontvs.jpg
http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/4392/backap.jpg
09-03-2010, 04:30 AM
cantankerous

Very interesting. I assume this filled in hole is what prevents the bios from sticking? This must be on very late batches of manufacturing after they realized what everyone was doing to previously manufactured cards to get the massive performance increases we are all getting from these little gems.
09-03-2010, 05:13 AM
[XC] Oj101

Or... One is a backup which can't be flashed (and therefore should theoretically never go bad)
in case of emergency? Think Gigabyte's Dual BIOS but with one of the chips write protected.

The PCB is way too complex for you to just superglue a second BIOS chip on somewhere, I
think it was designed like that right from the beginning.
09-03-2010, 06:12 AM
CrazyNutz

ok dual bios as I suspected erlier.

The top chip with the solder blob on it, looking at the datasheet pin 1 is CE (Chip select/enable). I wonder if the solder is by accedent?
Can you flake it off? For that blob of solder to do anything the would have had to drill down to the pin one terminal.
09-03-2010, 06:19 AM
CrazyNutz

1 Attachment(s)

Ket has a two of these, One is ok the other no go on bios mod, if he looks at his two boards we will know exactly how to bypass this lock.

And here is the datasheet for the serial flash chip (bios)
09-03-2010, 06:26 AM
Ket

Ok, so theoretically if we unsolder the BIOS chip on the front of the card it should automatically force the card to use the other BIOS chip, so if you flash it.. VIOLA! As theres no backup chip theres nothing for the card to revert to. Alternatively we need a way to flash the backup chip as well. Ideas anyone?

ED - My other card I haven't flashed either yet. But as its a KFA as well (Galaxy rebrand) then it will have that damn backup BIOS chip as well.

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