[Skinnee Labs] The Pump thread...

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08-21-2010, 09:56 AM
affiliate13

Skinnee,
If you get time, and you think it is worth showing, could you test a couple of Jingway 1200s in serial please?
I am just curious to see how they scale.
08-21-2010, 10:13 AM
skinnee

RD-30... check.

Jingway's in serial... I'll see what I can do.

Noise testing... negative. The lab is right next to the mechanical room in the house, noise isolation for testing is not going to happen.

Flow's impact to temps... we have something in mind already. :)

We're going to be splitting up the flow rate charts as more pumps get added, the charts will be just too damn big over time. So we'll have focused ones for each pump type, and then a compiled where we take the top X and bring them together, and stock top tests are in progress.

Are those Eheim/Aquastream pumps still sold here in the US?

edit: Oh yeah, compiled PQ is being added to the OP so Petra's panda cheers up.
08-21-2010, 10:29 AM
Waterlogged

Um, what plate was used on the Supreme? ;)
08-21-2010, 10:40 AM
skinnee

Plate 4, when we were standing in the lab working this all out, we wanted an medium restriction SLI loop and a low restriction CPU loop.

Actually, P4 was still in there from pressure drop testing and it was just looped up without a thought. :D
08-21-2010, 11:00 AM
jumper2high

I'd be quite curious about the DP1200 scaling too. Wondering whether it's better to add another DP1200 or replace the current one with an MCP355 - the cost would be about the same.
08-21-2010, 11:20 AM
Church

HF is already least restrictive from current top blocks even with most restrictive plate #1, i hope it won't result in bunch of foul cries about underperforming pumps compared to your results with just about any other top block (including HF with plate #1). Probably it's worth to at least note in loop description alongside block type, which jet plate is used in it.
08-21-2010, 11:30 AM
skinnee

CPU flow rate chart label updated, now states "P4". SLI label typo fixed. Added PQ from DDC3.2's to the OP.
08-21-2010, 08:02 PM
bobisgod

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinnee

Are those Eheim/Aquastream pumps still sold here in the US?

edit: Oh yeah, compiled PQ is being added to the OP so Petra's panda cheers up.

Yah, ppcs
08-23-2010, 01:18 AM
gmat

What's the difference between:
2x EK V2 (D-Plug)
EK Turbo
EK Dual V2
?

Also, my crappy TN flatscreen here at work wont make any difference between subtle shades of blue. Would help a lot if you used different dots (instead of just diamond shaped ones) on those multiple charts :D
08-23-2010, 01:23 AM
Johnny87au

thanks heaps mate!
08-23-2010, 09:09 AM
skinnee

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmat

What's the difference between:
2x EK V2 (D-Plug)
EK Turbo
EK Dual V2
?

EK Turbo is the first generation dual ddc top from EK, Dual V2 is the 2nd gen or latest one. 2x EK V2 (D-Plug) is two EK V2 single tops connected via a D-Plug.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmat

Also, my crappy TN flatscreen here at work wont make any difference between subtle shades of blue. Would help a lot if you used different dots (instead of just diamond shaped ones) on those multiple charts :D

It is not an easy task dealing with all the dots and trendlines... select 14 different colors that you can differentiate from each other when all crammed into 60 pixels, friggin sucks is what it is. Better flat panel in your future? :shrug:
08-23-2010, 05:20 PM
Hu1kamania

Quote:

Originally Posted by churchy

Hmm, it would be nice to see iwaki among results aswell. Not that i'm interested in ever buying/using it, but to be able to compare it to other pumps (eg. Dual DDCs) and to have some test to point to when someone asks about RDs. +DDC 3.1(5), as also frequently used pump. +noise testing. Also while EK Supreme HF is very fine (especially flow resistance wise) cpu block, imho it would be nice to see some more resistive block (and same for DD's fullcovers in SLI test. They are very unresistive relative to common modern blocks by other vendors). = imho should result in more "common loop setups"/more useful/aplicable to average LC builds data.

Yeah, I am running an Iwaki MD-20RZ and would love to see how it stacks up against the modern competition. At guess at this point you could call it an old favorite.
08-23-2010, 05:39 PM
davidm71

Safe to use MCP655?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martinm210

I can tell you that Tygon is NOT, I repeat NOT capable of handling household 50-80 psi water pressure..:eek:

I tried that once...luckily outside.. Think water balloon followed by my face receiving a good lesson learned.:D

I've also heard at least one story of someone damaging a radiator using household water pressure to flush it, so household pressure is WAY too much.

I believe Tygon 3603 is rated at 74F:
http://www.tygon.com/uploadedFiles/S...Lab-Tubing.pdf

7/16"x5/8" = 20psi Max
1/2"x3/4" = 25psi Max
1/2"x5/8" = 10psi Max..:eek:
3/8"x1/2" = 20psi Max

You obviously at least want thick walled tubing.

In operation, double DDCs likely won't subject the system to more than about 11psi, triples maybe 17psi, RD-30 maybe 14psi.

In practice I think it's been common enough to see dual DDCs that they are relatively tested to a comfort level, but triples are pretty new and not tested a whole bunch.

We don't know about the pressure rating on most parts so it's anybody's guess on that? Perhaps the manufacturers can start posting pressure specs??:shrug:

Regardless, I suspect the weak point is the fitting/barb pull out on the tubing, especially anything that's been removed/put back together, and particularly with some compression fittings that have small barbs. A 1/2" tube at 17psi is receiving about a 3.5 lb normal force trying to pull the tubing off the barb. I'd be a little uncomfortable with that sort of pressure unless I had a standard barb and worm drive clamp.

I was reading the specs of my Swiftec MCP655 Variable Speed pump and its rated at 50 psi max. I'm using Tygon 7/16 with compression fittings and so far so good at max speed setting on the pump. Should I dial that down a notch or am I going to bust a fitting eventually?

Thanks.
08-23-2010, 11:33 PM
jumper2high

Quote:

Originally Posted by davidm71

I was reading the specs of my Swiftec MCP655 Variable Speed pump and its rated at 50 psi max. I'm using Tygon 7/16 with compression fittings and so far so good at max speed setting on the pump. Should I dial that down a notch or am I going to bust a fitting eventually?

Thanks.

They are rated to withstand 50PSI, not generate 50PSI. Those pumps aren't capable of generating more than 15-20PSI pressure.
08-24-2010, 05:05 AM
Martinm210

Yeah, no worries. The max head a D5 is capable of is under 6psi.
http://skinneelabs.com/d5-tops.html

Ive never heard of anyone breaking fitting or busting tubing yet either with normal wc pumps. You'll have tubes pull off of or out of fittings first.
08-24-2010, 07:45 AM
jumper2high

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martinm210

Yeah, no worries. The max head a D5 is capable of is under 6psi.
http://skinneelabs.com/d5-tops.html

Ive never heard of anyone breaking fitting or busting tubing yet either with normal wc pumps. You'll have tubes pull off of or out of fittings first.

Unless you try to take the hydraulic pump off a construction site digger and use it for water cooling :rofl:
08-24-2010, 05:43 PM
skinnee

Adding more pumps/tops has been a little slow... we've hit the D5 portion.

I curse you 5 speed settings! :hitself:
08-25-2010, 05:14 AM
Grinder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Petra

No PQ curves in the thread, available via link only? :eh:

Sad panda is sad.

Don't bother changing it on my account... I'm probably the only one who cares.

OT, I was playing Urban Terror last night, and there was a Sad Panda playing. Was that you, perchance?

:shoot::gamer::CTF:
08-26-2010, 06:52 PM
leo_bsb

great work.
thanks!
09-08-2010, 10:20 PM
Grinchy

@SKINNEE : Can u add Sanso pdh 054 to your pump list? It is an excellent and cheap(for its performance ) pump. i opened a thread on it and there are some interesting data, go to check and see if it is interesting to you too...
09-09-2010, 12:06 AM
damha

Could we possibly get single pump setups in one graph only please :)
09-09-2010, 01:13 AM
vhaarr

I would love to see tests of the EK-DCP 2.2 and EK-DCP 4.0 pumps (Phobya DC12-260/Phobya DC12-400), they are so much cheaper than the Laing ones!
But are they copies of the Jingway DP-600/DP-1200 pumps? Seems like it, but from photos on google they are not identical, at least.
09-09-2010, 01:22 AM
Church

And i would love to see tests of new tops/restops for D5 by DD. Judging by looks, they might apear in many builds in future, when they soon gonna be released.
09-09-2010, 04:07 AM
davidm71

Flow rate best results

Morning All ,

Wondering if you guys know which speed setting on the mcp655 variable produces the best temps on a heat killer with a xpsc rx360 low fpi rad with medium speed fans such as the enermax magmas at 69cfm 1.4 mmh2o static pressure?

Saw some graphs on the skinnee labs site that was confusing. First two showed that highest gpm setting produced lowest temps and the last two I think showed that with medium fans 2-3 gpm medium flow rate worked best?

Thanks.
09-09-2010, 05:00 AM
Church

I doubt you getting more then 2.5-3gpm with your D5/mcp655 pump flow even on 5th/highest speed setting. Most probably flow will be 1.5-2gpm. More flow = more turbulence = a bit better cooling, but with more flow you start getting diminishing returns in temps/actual cooling. 1gpm is good, 1.5gpm a tiny bit better, 2gpm and even more - almost no gain at all (and in some cases with small/inadequate rad area even worse cooling because of increased pump heatload). For enhancing cooling/better temps, bigger rads always > then more flow. No need to concentrate on pump/coolant flow.

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