PCMARK05 testing

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12-04-2009, 01:35 AM
Leeghoofd

Nice work and tips there, never even thought of that :p
12-04-2009, 04:22 AM
George_o/c

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngpro

i disagree with that, tweaks and optimization is what makes the difference.. i think if your willing to put in the time and effort to understand a benchmark you shouldnt be penalized for that....

i mean if clocks was all we were after, we could use cpuz and gpuz validations, but that wouldnt be much fun at all :)

100% agree with you. :up: Same goes for your IGP 2k6 methodology, I loved it. :yepp:
12-04-2009, 08:42 PM
Computurd

'tweaks and optimizations'?? changing the very program itself does not classify as a tweak or optimization. you tweak or optimize the COMPUTER, not the benchmark. if you are writing your own benchmark, basically, then why do you bother posting it under PCMARK05. why not call it YOUNGPRO05? you cannot use this to compare to others, you are using different programs. i have a feeling these scores would not pass muster in the hwbot if they knew the methods used to obtain the scores.
12-04-2009, 10:27 PM
TheKarmakazi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Computurd

'tweaks and optimizations'?? changing the very program itself does not classify as a tweak or optimization. you tweak or optimize the COMPUTER, not the benchmark. if you are writing your own benchmark, basically, then why do you bother posting it under PCMARK05. why not call it YOUNGPRO05? you cannot use this to compare to others, you are using different programs. i have a feeling these scores would not pass muster in the hwbot if they knew the methods used to obtain the scores.

I couldnt disagree with you more:shrug:

Tweaking is where its at. And who do you think the person posting in here named Massman is? He is a hwbot admin...
12-04-2009, 10:52 PM
Computurd

massman himself has expressed some hesitation about these changes as well, if you read his post above

Quote:

@massman
Changing browser/decoder => tuning application used
Changing file to decode => tuning, ehr, file.

The first seems to be no problem, but I don't know about the second.
12-04-2009, 11:02 PM
youngpro

i can appreciate massmans opinion for sure but firstly im not submitting this to hwbot at this stage and secondly i dont think, with all respect to pj that he is the global oc authority
12-05-2009, 01:46 AM
crustytheclown

Great work James amazing result mate!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngpro

i dont think, with all respect to pj that he is the global oc authority

TRUE story
12-05-2009, 07:06 AM
Computurd

i understand youngpro that pj isnt the global authority. however the spirit of overclocking used to be getting the fastest performance out of various pieces of your hardware in conjunction with each other. lately it seems that everyone is using different 'tweaks' to the benchmarks themselves that radically alter the scores. i think when you go so far as to use a hex editor the alter the benchmark itself you have gone too far. what is going to stop the next guy out there from modifying it to a point that he gets 60k? oh well i digress. just my two cents.:rolleyes:
12-05-2009, 07:33 AM
massman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Computurd

massman himself has expressed some hesitation about these changes as well, if you read his post above

To be honest, the words you quote are not hesitation to allow this kind of tweaking, but wondering whether it's possible to also tune at the level of the file.

For the record: no official hwbot policy or opinion has been expressed in this topic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngpro

secondly i dont think that he is the global oc authority

Couldn't agree more.
12-05-2009, 08:59 AM
BenchZowner

I don't like where this is going...
12-05-2009, 11:14 AM
TheKarmakazi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Computurd

i understand youngpro that pj isnt the global authority. however the spirit of overclocking used to be getting the fastest performance out of various pieces of your hardware in conjunction with each other. lately it seems that everyone is using different 'tweaks' to the benchmarks themselves that radically alter the scores. i think when you go so far as to use a hex editor the alter the benchmark itself you have gone too far. what is going to stop the next guy out there from modifying it to a point that he gets 60k? oh well i digress. just my two cents.:rolleyes:

Oh really? You think people JUST started using tweaks? LMFAO :rolleyes:

Do I need to dig up a thread about hardcore tweaking 3dmark 2001 from 7 years ago ? If you read what he said, he could only look at the files with a hex editor, not alter them. There is nothing wrong with understanding how the benchmark runs and what it is composed of.
12-05-2009, 11:14 AM
[XC] gomeler

Me either. Might be time to dump PCM05 and move to PCMVantage.
12-05-2009, 11:16 AM
TheKarmakazi

Quote:

Originally Posted by [XC] gomeler

Me either. Might be time to dump PCM05 and move to PCMVantage.

pcmvantage sucks.... its way too long. half hour to get a result? What happens if you lock up when bench is almost done, or if that happens a few times. You spent 2-3 hours to get one bench in? lame.

Not to mention you can only run it once unless you pony up some cash
12-05-2009, 11:20 AM
Computurd

you are calling it tweaking karmakazi. i call it cheating. i am sure they were doing it seven years ago. people were also murdering people seven years ago, but does that make murder okay? hell no it doesnt.
when you are actually modifying the very benchmark itself you are cheating. you are no longer running the benchmark. you are using diifferent browsers, encoders yada yada yada/.
that is my opinion, and one that many others share.
there are many others who share your opinion.
so lets keep it that way.

agree to disagree i say.

pcmark vantage is a total system benchmark. just because you actually have to have a stable system to run it does not mean it sucks. does not take 2-3 hours either.
12-05-2009, 11:23 AM
TheKarmakazi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Computurd

you are calling it tweaking karmakazi. i call it cheating. i am sure they were doing it seven years ago. people were also murdering people seven years ago, but does that make murder okay? hell no it doesnt.
when you are actually modifying the very benchmark itself you are cheating. you are no longer running the benchmark. you are using diifferent browsers, encoders yada yada yada/.
that is my opinion, and one that many others share.
there are many others who share your opinion.
so lets keep it that way.

agree to disagree i say.

pcmark vantage is a total system benchmark. just because you actually have to have a stable system to run it does not mean it sucks. does not take 2-3 hours either.

Your a troll and I wont bother feeding you anymore :p:
12-05-2009, 11:25 AM
Computurd

i will not post on this subject any more, either. but calling me a troll and moving away from the debate proves nothing on your behalf. i take it as a gracious exit however.
12-05-2009, 11:27 AM
TheKarmakazi

Sorry to any thread hijacking pro. This is an AWESOME fully tweaked and perfectly run legit result. Big ups to ya! :up:
12-05-2009, 11:31 AM
Leeghoofd

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheKarmakazi

Oh really? You think people JUST started using tweaks? LMFAO :rolleyes:

Well if you change the way a program does it tests by effectively altering some integrated benchmarks of it, it's going a bit too far to my liking. There's a difference to change a run order in a 3dmark then there's to change an internet browser. This goes just that bit to deep. I love that people are always innovating and improving things, but try keep the test on a fair level. You can't do all this in a live event, as it will not be allowed.
12-05-2009, 11:46 AM
TheKarmakazi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leeghoofd

Well if you change the way a program does it tests by effectively altering some integrated benchmarks of it, it's going a bit too far to my liking. There's a difference to change a run order in a 3dmark then there's to change an internet browser. This goes just that bit to deep. I love that people are always innovating and improving things, but try keep the test on a fair level. You can't do all this in a live event, as it will not be allowed.

What does a live event have to do with this topic? You dont have to change the internet browser from IE to tweak it either. I can get quite a nice boost by tweaking IE options
12-05-2009, 11:55 AM
Leeghoofd

As there it is where you show your tweaking and use the given tools... not add your own. You are looking it from your perspective only, I'm looking at it more globally. (This from what I've learned the last years and what I know people do, to get a better score or win an event legally or illegally.)

James has shown a few tips lately :p and I must say I'm impressed by his devotion to stay up front, but some stuff is far out of my league ( too stupid or too lazy for it ) or offends some of my own principles.

You adapt or change what you like, that's your own perogative.
12-05-2009, 02:25 PM
youngpro

Quote:

Originally Posted by Computurd

i think when you go so far as to use a hex editor the alter the benchmark itself you have gone too far.

i just want to make it really clear the only benchmark that has been physically modified is the 3dmark01 team au edition and that is clearly modified for a fun and not competitive benching purpose, i certainly havnt and wouldnt touch anything with a hex editor that i would show benchmarks with, without specifically saying so

RE: BenchZowner,

Well i think there is these kind of tweaks in all benchmarks, i think LOD is a prime example of a tweak that is way more important than anything im doing and easily available, we all know it and use it.. i guess what i wonder is, does it matter how much a tweak alters a benchmark score, if it is a tweak, and not something specifically banned by the rules (such as altering the perception of a benchmark or mipping for example) then is it not just advancing benching? this was going to happen sooner or later with the advancing state of this sport we are playing... i remember reading what happened when ln2 cooling first came in, all the guys on air and ss didnt like it and were not interested, but look at us now? we all have dewars at home and spend our pay cheques on a scientific liquid to cool our pcs...

oh and just on the tweaking, to me i have alot more fun sifting through the registry or analyzing the way a benchmark works and trying to find ways to tweak its performance than i do benching with ln2.. thats just me though, everyone has to do what is enjoyable to them..

i know since i posted this ive found some more things to advance the score of pcmark further so i would say 45k would be totally possible with a fully setup rig...
12-05-2009, 02:28 PM
Gautam

In the old days, LN2 benching was "cheating". Then LOD was "cheating". And so on and so forth...
12-05-2009, 05:07 PM
dinos22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gautam

In the old days, LN2 benching was "cheating". Then LOD was "cheating". And so on and so forth...

:rofl: true true
12-05-2009, 06:57 PM
Marco André

I think we'll should be thankful to youngpro for sharing his tweaking method and trick as we all are here to learn, right? :up:

Waiting for the 45k now.. :D
12-06-2009, 07:06 AM
George_o/c

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marco André

I think we'll should be thankful to youngpro for sharing his tweaking method and trick as we all are here to learn, right? :up:

Couldn't agree more :up:

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