AMD DX11 RV8xx Card Exposed

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06-09-2009, 04:45 AM
Final8ty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

And you base that on what? nVidia did quite well financially until the laptop soldering issue.

It cant be marketshare either since nVidia grew and AMD dropped.

I have made my point.

I don't care about discussing laptops or market share which are other issues.
06-09-2009, 04:47 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by Final8ty

I have made my point.

I don't care about discussing laptops or market share which are other issues.

Yet you forgot to tell us how nVidia wasnt prepared.
06-09-2009, 04:54 AM
Final8ty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

Arh...it changes quite abit. Since you can prepare any production and price changes. And ofcourse marketing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

Yet you forgot to tell us how nVidia wasnt prepared.

Having to make a massive price drop of the 200 series after launch.
06-09-2009, 04:58 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by Final8ty

Having to make a massive price drop of the 200 series after launch.

And thats not being prepared? nVidia wanted to milk it. Just like AMD wanted to milk the K8 till the day that Conroe came and cutted the prices 50%. Do you think AMD sat for 6 months after the public demonstration and just wasnt prepared until after Conroe was launched? Or was AMD unprepared with the Phenom II launch that cutted prices just after again?

Pricedrops is the normal in such cases. If nVidia was unprepared they would be caught with high inventory and no marketing counter etc.
06-09-2009, 05:03 AM
Final8ty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

And thats not being prepared? nVidia wanted to milk it. Just like AMD wanted to milk the K8 till the day that Conroe came. Do you think AMD sat for 6 months after the public demonstration and just wasnt prepared? Or was AMD unprepared with the Phenom II launch that cutted prices just after again?

(Massive) pricedrop is the normal in such cases. If nVidia was unprepared they would be caught with high inventory etc.

Those examples are not even close in relationship to the situations of NV dropping as much as it did just one week after the 200 launch.
I truly feel you have nothing better to do than to argue for the sake of it & i have better things to do.
06-09-2009, 05:07 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by Final8ty

Those examples are not even close in relationship to the situations of NV dropping as much as it did just one week after the 200 launch.
I truly feel you have nothing better to do than to argue for the sake of it & i have better things to do.

K8 dropped 50%, 260GTX dropped 25% and 280GTX dropped what...35-40%?

Also it was 1 month after release wasnt it?

You just seem to like to add something that aint there. And look again who started to argue about nothing :p:
06-09-2009, 05:10 AM
Final8ty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

K8 dropped 50%, 260GTX dropped 25% and 280GTX dropped what...35-40%?

Also it was 1 month after release wasnt it?

You just seem to like to add something that aint there. And look again who started to argue about nothing :p:

Which still is not normal to drop a product price that much in that time scale from launch.

K8 did not drop 50% 1 month after launch.
06-09-2009, 05:18 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by Final8ty

Which still is not normal to drop a product price that much in that time scale from launch.

K8 did not drop 50% 1 month after launch.

But Phenom II dropped some 17-18% after 10 days. Its the exact same thing.

And its not about a company being unprepared.
06-09-2009, 05:20 AM
marten_larsson

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

K8 dropped 50%, 260GTX dropped 25% and 280GTX dropped what...35-40%?

Also it was 1 month after release wasnt it?

You just seem to like to add something that aint there. And look again who started to argue about nothing :p:

Sure, maybe they knew what was coming but why did they offer refunds for those that bought the GTX260 and 280 at launch at the much higher price? That wouldn't really make sense if you wanted to milk it... And how much bad PR do you think it cost Nvidia? And how much better do you think the 4800-series was reviewed because of the ridiculous pricing of the GTX200-cards? Nope, I don't think Nvidia made that much money by selling them so expensive the first month.
06-09-2009, 05:23 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by marten_larsson

Sure, maybe they knew what was coming but why did they offer refunds for those that bought the GTX260 and 280 at launch at the much higher price? That wouldn't really make sense if you wanted to milk it... And how much bad PR do you think it cost Nvidia? And how much better do you think the 4800-series was reviewed because of the ridiculous pricing of the GTX200-cards? Nope, I don't think Nvidia made that much money by selling them so expensive the first month.

AMD/nVidia/Intel gives a rats rear end about you. They just want your money.

So why would AMD/nVidia/Intel refund you after pricedrops? Why didnt AMD give money back to K8 buyers? Or 40$ back after Phenom II dropped after 10 days? You can nag over every company. Just remember their only and sole purpose. To make money.
06-09-2009, 05:24 AM
Helmore

Quote:

Originally Posted by marten_larsson

Nope, I don't think Nvidia made that much money by selling them so expensive the first month.

Shouldn't that read "first week"? I'd say NVIDIA was unprepared for ATI's 4XX0 series launch, if they were prepared they would have priced their cards a bit more sensibly.
06-09-2009, 05:24 AM
Final8ty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

But Phenom II dropped some 17-18% after 10 days. Its the exact same thing.

And its not about a company being unprepared.

Its not even close in relation to a competing product launch & more to do with retail price gouging until there was competing retailers around with stock.
06-09-2009, 05:25 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by Final8ty

Its not even close in relation to a competing product launch & more to do with retail price gouging until there was competing retailers around with stock.

Hahaha :rofl:

Oh you are so funny...
06-09-2009, 05:26 AM
aka_ronin

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

And you base that on what? nVidia did quite well financially until the laptop soldering issue.

It cant be marketshare either since nVidia grew and AMD dropped. nVidia ships 2 GPUs when AMD ships 1.

nVidia did not lose markeshare... because people outside of these forums (Xtreme Systems and others) don't even know the diference between a Bit and a Byte... :p: ...and then there are the funboys also :rofl:
06-09-2009, 05:31 AM
Final8ty

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

Hahaha :rofl:

Oh you are so funny...

Small thing please small minds.
06-09-2009, 05:37 AM
marten_larsson

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

AMD/nVidia/Intel gives a rats rear end about you. They just want your money.

So why would AMD/nVidia/Intel refund you after pricedrops? Why didnt AMD give money back to K8 buyers? Or 40$ back after Phenom II dropped after 10 days? You can nag over every company. Just remember their only and sole purpose. To make money.

Yeah, they want my money but somehow that often has a lot to do with PR. It's not good PR selling hardware for 100-200$ more than it should. I'm not nagging over Nvidia's policy, the fact is that they did offer refunds for early adopters. And why would they do that if it wasn't to regain some lost good PR.
06-09-2009, 05:42 AM
ownage

Quote:

Originally Posted by marten_larsson

Yeah, they want my money but somehow that often has a lot to do with PR. It's not good PR selling hardware for 100-200$ more than it should. I'm not nagging over Nvidia's policy, the fact is that they did offer refunds for early adopters. And why would they do that if it wasn't to regain some lost good PR.

nVidia giving refunds was only because people where superpissed because they had paid way to much. If one company sells graphics cards for high prices, its nVidia. They have to, that's what you get when you make a monster chip that's even worse than R600 was.
06-09-2009, 05:47 AM
v_rr

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

And you base that on what? nVidia did quite well financially until the laptop soldering issue.

It cant be marketshare either since nVidia grew and AMD dropped. nVidia ships 2 GPUs when AMD ships 1.

ahah....
1- Nvidia overall 2008 finance was LOSS.
2- Nvidia overall 2009 is going to be LOSS.
3- Nvidia not even with geforce FX made Loss.
4- Nvidia is entering in a spiral of LOSS and ridiculous margins. Last 4 quarters: 17% Q2 2008, 41% Q3 2008, 29% Q4 2008, 28% Q1 2009. Average 12 months = 28-29%
5- Gaining market share dumping and shipping cards to market this way = deep trouble. Also Shipping != Sold.
6- Last time I check back in 2006 when AMD made profit it also won huge amounts of market share dumping CPU's to the market like nvidia is doing right now. What happened next everyone knows = years and years of AMD loss.
7- Comparing year on year Intel gained 6% market share and AMD and Nvidia lost 1.5% and 1.6% market share. Market is demanding IGP. Discrete market these days is reduced in 50%++ to what it was before. Small fluctuations with dumping cards to the market is enought to big % change.
8- Digitimes reported that almost AMD stopped shipping cards on January/February and will increase waffer orders on TSMC to double and triple numbers until June. So don't make to much party around market share number with all this information and in a time of stock adjustments ;) :yepp:

Finally this is a tread about RV8xx. You are trolling and making Spam on the tread as usual with questions completely useless and offtopic posts.
Lets talk about RV8xx????
06-09-2009, 05:54 AM
marten_larsson

Quote:

Originally Posted by ownage

nVidia giving refunds was only because people where superpissed because they had paid way to much. If one company sells graphics cards for high prices, its nVidia. They have to, that's what you get when you make a monster chip that's even worse than R600 was.

Yeah, and they did it because a lot of angry costumers mean bad PR.
06-09-2009, 06:02 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by marten_larsson

Yeah, and they did it because a lot of angry costumers mean bad PR.

Maybe not alot. But loud ;)
06-09-2009, 06:07 AM
v_rr

NEWS ONTOPIC:

Evergreen, Cypress and Juniper: ATI code names explained
http://vr-zone.com/forums/441732/eve...explained.html
06-09-2009, 06:35 AM
jaredpace

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

It took AMD 3 years to even get near Conroe after it was demoed. And it took AMD quite some time to match the original G80 aswell.

Likewise with Intel vs. Athlon & Nvidia vs. R300
06-09-2009, 06:37 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaredpace

Likewise with Intel vs. Athlon & Nvidia vs. R300

Yep! Development just takes along time.
06-09-2009, 11:22 AM
Bo_Fox

Quote:

Originally Posted by v_rr

NEWS ONTOPIC:

Evergreen, Cypress and Juniper: ATI code names explained
http://vr-zone.com/forums/441732/eve...explained.html

VR-Zone just does not make sense. Why would NV be nervous about a HIGH-end 180mm^2 chip?

Anyway, I hate that Evergreen nickname. Just like with WD's slow-and-Green hard drives, the power savings just aint worth it! Hard drives consume only 10W at most, so why would I want to save 2-3 watts and sacrifice maybe 1 hour on slowly transferring 500GB worth of backup data? I think a lot more electricity would have been wasted on the SLOWWWWW transfer of 5800rpm or so (which WD does not want to disclose, trying to claim that it is truly variable "somewhere" between 5400 and 7200rpm), on the hard drive being in load (not idle) state for so long, and having to keep the rig powered on (wasting more electricity) during the "Green" transfers, and having to waste more of your "Green" time not burning much calories sitting in front of a file-transfer window.

Evergreen just sounds awful, period, and I hope the nickname does not have any literal meaning to it.
06-09-2009, 12:50 PM
generics_user

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bo_Fox

VR-Zone just does not make sense. Why would NV be nervous about a HIGH-end 180mm^2 chip?

because nvidia won't offer a next gen high-end chip until very late Q4 or Q1 2010 and a 180mm² chip is going to pwn nvidian 490²mm GT200b so badly that even gtx295 will have a hard time against it for at least 1 quarter and amd may counter gt300 with an expanded rv870 and rv870 X2 ;), additionally nv has to pay for the NVIO chips which itself is almost as large as rv710

nvidia went for the wrong route with their huge monster chips and will pay for it sooner or later :shakes:

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