Barcelona Launch Clock Speeds Changing?

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08-25-2007, 06:43 AM
BeardyMan

Quote:

Originally Posted by onewingedangel

C2D was able to up the IPC whilst raising the clockspeeds (compared to yonah and previous pentium M's). AMD's problem with k8 was that the design couldn't scale the clockspeeds in the same way that intel could scale theirs (be it SOI or a design issue). k10 goes after a solution by improving IPC again, but looks to do so at the cost of clockspeed compared to k8, let alone c2d. Even if k10 is able to compete with intel in the short term if they run into problems scaling the clocks again it will hurt them long term, the design needs to scale in performance - and raising the clockspeeds is the easiest way to achieve this, extracting ever more IPC gets increasingly costly in regards to die space/idle power consumption.

As I said IPC is only half the story.

I see yes, but compared to netburst, intel had to deliver some mhz as well :)

But youre logic fitts yes ..

Let's pray the 3.0ghz part is true , and that it's a low end model :D
08-26-2007, 02:36 AM
BrowncoatGR

Well ok but both P-M andYonah are mobile cpus. You cant directly compare clockspeed with c2d desktop cpus. A more fair compaison would be yonah with c2d mobile cpus. Merom topped out at 2.33 on release and got a slight bump in may to 2.4ghz. So clocks have been more or less static
08-26-2007, 02:53 AM
accord99

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrowncoatGR

Well ok but both P-M andYonah are mobile cpus. You cant directly compare clockspeed with c2d desktop cpus. A more fair compaison would be yonah with c2d mobile cpus. Merom topped out at 2.33 on release and got a slight bump in may to 2.4ghz. So clocks have been more or less static

There's a just announced mobile X7900 now, running at 2.8GHz. This supersedes the 2.6GHz X7800 launched a little earlier.
08-26-2007, 03:29 AM
BrowncoatGR

Quote:

Originally Posted by accord99

There's a just announced mobile X7900 now, running at 2.8GHz. This supersedes the 2.6GHz X7800 launched a little earlier.

Yes but while the non-extreme parts are 31w and 33w these are 44w so its just Intel willing to release mobile cpus with higher tdp rather than a imrovement in the architecture or process.
08-26-2007, 06:29 AM
mstp2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrowncoatGR

Well ok but both P-M andYonah are mobile cpus. You cant directly compare clockspeed with c2d desktop cpus. A more fair compaison would be yonah with c2d mobile cpus. Merom topped out at 2.33 on release and got a slight bump in may to 2.4ghz. So clocks have been more or less static

Of course you can compare them. The C2D desktop and laptop parts are IDENTICAL. There is absolutely no difference except speed binning (to keep thermals down). Except for slower FSBs, the designs are identical down to the last transistor.
08-26-2007, 06:30 AM
mstp2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrowncoatGR

Yes but while the non-extreme parts are 31w and 33w these are 44w so its just Intel willing to release mobile cpus with higher tdp rather than a imrovement in the architecture or process.

45nm laptop parts are coming in Q1 08.

Can you say 25W 3GHz C2D laptop chips? :D
08-26-2007, 07:50 AM
generics_user

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstp2009

45nm laptop parts are coming in Q1 08.

Can you say 25W 3GHz C2D laptop chips? :D

umm yeah going from 65nm to 45 nm will bring intel 3ghz instead of sub 2ghz 25W parts :rofl:
08-26-2007, 09:21 AM
GoThr3k

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstp2009

45nm laptop parts are coming in Q1 08.

Can you say 25W 3GHz C2D laptop chips? :D

keep on dreaming :rofl:
08-26-2007, 09:32 AM
mstp2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by generics_user

umm yeah going from 65nm to 45 nm will bring intel 3ghz instead of sub 2ghz 25W parts :rofl:

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoThr3k

keep on dreaming :rofl:

Then let me PHRASE it this way.

AMD has ZERO shot in hell of doing this. ;) :up:

Intel has a VERY real shot considering we are seeing 90W 3GHz Penryn quads on the roadmap.

1/2 the chips (dual v. quad) is 45W 3GHz WITHOUT binning.

Binning (i.e. low voltage parts) on a high-K 45nm process puts this EASILY within the realm of possible.
08-26-2007, 09:40 AM
Shintai

The initial 45nm line up is 3.16Ghz dualcore at 40W TDP. Ofcource we dont know how much under 40W. But there is still along way from 40 to 25.
08-26-2007, 09:41 AM
mstp2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

The initial 45nm line up is 3.16Ghz dualcore at 40W TDP. Ofcource we dont know how much under 40W. But there is still along way from 40 to 25.

Again, that is the desktop UNBINNED variety.
08-26-2007, 09:48 AM
GoThr3k

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstp2009

Again, that is the desktop UNBINNED variety.

proof?
08-26-2007, 09:52 AM
mstp2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoThr3k

proof?

I'll answer that when you prove to me God doesn't exist. http://www.xcpus.com/forums/images/smilies/wink2.gif
08-26-2007, 10:05 AM
GoThr3k

so actually you're saying things without even knowing that they are true?

are they binned or not?
08-26-2007, 10:07 AM
mstp2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoThr3k

so actually you're saying things without even knowing that they are true?

are they binned or not?

I know for FACT all Intel laptop CPUs since the P3 have been binned.

Go through their SL codes on processorfinder.intel.com and you will see lower voltages compared to the equivalent speed desktop parts.

So yes, I know for FACT this is true. And anyone that would take the time to look it up would see that as well. :up:
08-26-2007, 10:12 AM
STaRGaZeR

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstp2009

I'll answer that when you prove to me God doesn't exist. http://www.xcpus.com/forums/images/smilies/wink2.gif

God existence must be proved, not viceversa :ROTF:

Haha AMD people claims proofs, when AMD itself is giving us nothing of their upcoming processors until release date :rolleyes:

Well is giving us rumors, thats true :rolleyes:
08-26-2007, 10:15 AM
Face

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoThr3k

keep on dreaming :rofl:

Half way there :

http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/1885/penrynih6.jpg

Quote:

The 25W Penryn has 1066FSB and 3MB of L2 cache with speeds at 2.53, 2.4 and 2.13GHz.

Lineup:
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/1203/penryngm2.gif

2.8 at 35w .. ain't that bad either.
Turion X2 TL-66 is currently 2.3 at 35w.

Ofcourse that this NG vs. current so they should be able to improve things with Griffin\Puma better power saving options.

But it's still not a direct comparison as Intel aims for performance and AMD for longer battery life.

Quote:

Whether Griffin will be competitive with Penryn is somewhat uncertain.
Certainly from a performance standpoint, Griffin will lag behind Intel’s offerings.
However, the situation for power and battery life, which is probably more important, is much less clear. In some areas, AMD’s power management is more sophisticated than what Intel currently offers – particularly the separate voltage planes for each core.
08-26-2007, 10:16 AM
Zytek_Fan

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstp2009

I know for FACT all Intel laptop CPUs since the P3 have been binned.

Go through their SL codes on processorfinder.intel.com and you will see lower voltages compared to the equivalent speed desktop parts.

So yes, I know for FACT this is true. And anyone that would take the time to look it up would see that as well. :up:

Their laptop CPUs are different models. Made to have low voltage, like laptop CPUs should have.
08-26-2007, 10:19 AM
mstp2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zytek_Fan

Their laptop CPUs are different models. Made to have low voltage, like laptop CPUs should have.

They are ALL off the same lithography masks, off the same fabrication lines. That was the beauty of the C2D design - it was originally a laptop design variant of the CD, and got shifted into different segments. The difference is in the binning, and the post-fabrication packaging (PGA vs. LGA). Nothing else, down to the LAST TRANSISTOR is different.
08-26-2007, 10:22 AM
jabway

Why are we talking about penryn in a barcelona thread?
08-26-2007, 10:28 AM
GoThr3k

Quote:

Originally Posted by Face

Half way there :

http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/1885/penrynih6.jpg

Lineup:
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/1203/penryngm2.gif

2.8 at 35w .. ain't that bad either.
Turion X2 TL-66 is currently 2.3 at 35w.

Ofcourse that this NG vs. current so they should be able to improve things with Griffin\Puma better power saving options.

But it's still not a direct comparison as Intel aims for performance and AMD for longer battery life.

i saw them too, but even a 3MB L2 cache with 3 GHz with a TDP of 25W seems impossible for Q1 and Q2

Quote:

Originally Posted by jabway

Why are we talking about penryn in a barcelona thread?

don't know either, every barca thread turns out like a penry thread
08-26-2007, 10:29 AM
biohead

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstp2009

I'll answer that when you prove to me God doesn't exist. http://www.xcpus.com/forums/images/smilies/wink2.gif

Richard Dawkins.

I can do science me.

=)
08-26-2007, 10:30 AM
Movieman

Quote:

Originally Posted by jabway

Why are we talking about penryn in a barcelona thread?

Put's on "the" hat:
Ahh, a statement of reason.
Listen guys, it really is classless to come into an AMD thread and talk Intel.
If the AMD's are better or worse we will know in time.
Now there are people that love one or the other and thats cool, but let the AMD guys have their discussion in peace.
If you guys would like this moved to the AMD section for lets call it a bit more peace just PM me..
Thanks to all for reading..
08-26-2007, 10:35 AM
BeardyMan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Movieman

Put's on "the" hat:
Ahh, a statement of reason.
Listen guys, it really is classless to come into an AMD thread and talk Intel.
If the AMD's are better or worse we will know in time.
Now there are people that love one or the other and thats cool, but let the AMD guys have their discussion in peace.
If you guys would like this moved to the AMD section for lets call it a bit more peace just PM me..
Thanks to all for reading..

OFFTOPIC

dave what's up with your user title :D

Octaless :D
08-26-2007, 10:42 AM
Zytek_Fan

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoThr3k

don't know either, every barca thread turns out like a penry thread

Because some people think it's funny to ruin it.

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