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to be honest, I never noticed how hot my DDC-2's ran until I disassembled my rig for the first time with them - the "gel stuff" pad under them was melted to the shape of the bottom of the pump, with bubbles forming like it was almost melting
but IDK - neither of the pumps (in series) died within the period that I had them with alphacool tops, but seeing these dying every so often, I might have to run 2x D5's when I setup WC again
Really hmm... so you don't have the pump mounted to the case ?
I just recently re-tubed my loop and put a Laing D-4 in front of my DD-2 w\Petras Top just in case. I couldn't see spending another $100 when this D-4 was just sitting here. If the DDC-2 does quit on me, at least I will find out before things get real hot, I hope.
Sorry to hear about your pump. Glad nothing cooked.
is that alright running 2 different pumps in your loop ?
Not sure. I ask the question here a while back and never got a definitive answer of yes or no. A little discussion, but that was it. So I thought logically, which sometimes works and sometimes doesn't when it comes to water cooling. I figured if I put the pump with the weaker head pressure in front of the stronger one that it wouldn't impede it's performance. But the D-4 has a higher flow rate than the DDC-2. So I really don't know where that figures into the equation.
I use a reservoir that takes up two 5 1/4" drive bays. And I can tell you that the water returning to the reservoir is shooting across towards the front of the reservoir just a little further. I can't fill it up because I have a leaking gasket around one of the plastic plugs. If it helped my temps any at all it is under 1C because the idle & load temps remain unchanged. But I did this mainly to have a back up in case my DDC-2 dies. It doesn't seem to be hurting my loop at all though. So I guess it is alright.
Enough with the hi-jack. Sorry m8s.
The flow rate will be limited by the d4 but in total you will have greater head pressure than either single pump, perhaps ~the sum of the two heads. I'm not sure about the flowrate before and after your change tho :) Too early
A lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by mion
They never fail as far as you are concerned. And if they do iwaki will replace for free.
But it doesn't matter as they don't fail. They are made to run 24/7 punishing saline aquarium water for over 10 years. You don't have to worry about an rd30 failing.
This may be news to some poeple but you get what you pay for.
I have been thinking about an Iwaki, but not because of the DDC-2 giving up the ghost for some. Mainly wanting to increase the cooling performance of the Storm if that is possible to do using an Iwaki over a DDC-2 w\Petras Top.
Plus, I leave my rig running 24\7 so an Iwaki would make sense to use if only because they are designed to run all the time for years on end. Of course, "the DDC pump employs a brushless DC motor with a lifetime in excess of 50,000 hours when operated at 12 volts — three to four times the life expectancy of other pumps in its class." as quoted from Laings web site. If it get all those hours in, that is somewhere between 6 or 7 years anyway.
So I guess it would boil down to performance. Is there a performance increase in cooler temps using an Iwaki with a Storm Rev. 2? I guess the only real way to know would be to buy one and see for myself. Which I believe I will seeing as I have a little $$$ burning a hole in my wallet. Gotta find one now.
Been an XIP since before the XS/XR split the other year... no blue for me *shrug*Quote:
XIP = Blue.
XL = Green
you had the gel-stuff under you pump? all DDC-2s i saw till now had foam or gel-stuff underneath it:stick: .
i think the alphacool-mounting is the best (no vibration at all+good cooling), the foam-mounting has to be redone, i think that it's the heat killing the pump, i mean there is nearly no physical difference between DDC and DDC-2 so there is no reason for all these DDC-2s dying and all 10w version still running without problems:stick:
so poll should be more like:
your DDC-2 died
a) with gel-stuff
b) with foam
c) with alphacool-style mounting
Stop scaring me guys.:( Ive got a DDC-2 with a petras top that im going to using soon. I really do not want it to fail, as I bought it from Petras, so RMAing from the UK would be expensive. Does anyone know why the failure rate is so high then? Is it the overheating? Has anyone reported this to Laing, and has there been an answer from them? I was going to mount mine on gel, but im now considering making a custom bracket and fitting an old P2 heatsink to the bottom.
Mine & many others have been running for many, many months now without issue. We never hear about those. Only the ones that fail. I think there's too much stock going in what is being said.
I have been running mine on the foam. I un-mounted it yesterday while it was running to check out the heat concerns. While it was warm, it was no where near hot. And it has been running 24\7 with the occasional restart for program updates for nearly four months now. I believe the vast majority are fine. So use it and just check it from time to time for your own piece of mind m8. More than likely it will be fine imho.
ahhh the benefits of a reservoir. If no water movement = pump no good.
Lets say that with your OCed processor and two GPUs, you've got a 300-watt heat load. Lets also say that you have poor flow now of 0.5 GPM. That means that the water temperature rises and falls a total of 2.71 C in your loop.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quazi
If you plot the DDC+ P-Q curve against the RD-30, and also guesstimate a friction head curve based on 0.5GPM for the DDC, the projected flow rate of the RD-30 would be about double...or 1 GPM. That means that water temperature would rise and fall a total of 1.31 C in your loop.
You have the *potential* to improve temps by 0.655 C (half of half the difference is how it works out.) In truth the improvement is less because your previous lowest-water-temperature will rise slightly by an unknown amount...determined by the performance abilities of the radiator.
Personally, I think you’d do better by getting one of the latest radiators with the thin flat tube design.
D5 has way much less problems but they still Dies! Like mine did...Quote:
Originally Posted by NickS
how long were u running it before you died? Im surpised DD didnt send you to swiftech. How did DD handle the RMA process? smooth?
Didn't Laing release a new revision of the DDC? Maybe that will help cut down the failure rate.
Would it be possible to mount the DDC-2/Petra's top on its side on the gel stuff, and then use heatsinks on the bottom or wherever?
Also, what's the best thing to use to stick the heatsinks to the pump? I have an old GPU heatsink that would fit perfectly.
I think that you guys may be blowing the whole DDC-2 failure thing a little out of proportion... as I've only been seeing about a 5% failure rate thus far and I've heard that Jab-Tech has had about 3% of theirs come back.Quote:
Originally Posted by SparkyJJO
...aside from that, Swiftech claims that they never fail, Danger Den is "looking into it", and the guys at Laing seem very, very lost. :rolleyes:
I must agree with you here. I don't think that 5% failure rate is going to keep me from getting a DDC-2 with your top when I finally can afford to watercool. I'll just make sure to have it set up that if the DDC's RPMs drop too low the system will automatically shut off, just as a precaution. I'd want to do that with any pump to be honest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petra
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graystar
Thanks for the explanation Graystar, very much. I am really trying to wrap my brain around everything you have taken the time to share with me, and I believe I am making progress. So I am not going to ask for any further explanation, I appreciate the time you've spent thus far.
But what I will ask you about is your suggestion about trying a "thin flat tube design" radiator. My logic says the bigger radiator the more time the water is spent inside cooling down. It seems as though logic works for some areas of water cooling, and in others it matters not. Personally, I have been wanting to install a rad that would allow me to keep it all inside my case. But I didn't want to loose any performance.
So you think a different rad may even help the performance of my loop? No questions or need of explanation. I trust your opinion. But could you go as far as recommending a radiator for me to use so I can get rid of the quad monster and be able to install it inside my case, which is a full towered CM Stacker? I have been looking at the Thermochill PA120.3's. Are those thin flat tube designed rads? Are 120.3's too much? Would a 120.2 get it done just as well?
Well, obviously without any performance data on your existing heatercore, I can’t know for sure what affect a rad change will have. So I’m only speculating.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quazi
That said, I think those Thermochill rads are supposed to be considered the best performers at the moment, although I haven’t seen them pitted against the latest from HWLabs (Black Ice GT Extreme rads) I personally would go with the Black Ice because I don’t think there will be a significant difference in performance, if any, between a BI and a Thermo, and because I like the M4 tapped mounting holes for the fans (Thermo uses self tapping screws...ewww.)
You definitely have a high heat load, and you’re looking for superior cooling, not just good enough, so I would recommend fitting in as much rad as possible. At the very least you should be able to slap a triple up front and hang a single off the rear 120, right? Like I said, I’m speculating, but I would bet dollars to donuts that a 3 + 1 setup of best-of-class radiators will out-perform your current quad heatercore.
Marci mentioned some unpublished testing on the [H] a while ago... pitting the PA120.3 against the GTX 480. It showed the PA120.3 outperforming the GTX 480 by a few degrees with undervolted fans (can't recall what type...probably yates or similar) and the GTX 480 taking a very small performance lead with the fans at full speed. I'll dig around later today and see if I can find the post but, either way, vague tidbits of information from unpublished testing likely shouldn't be taken too seriously. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Graystar
A recent discussion on these rads including the test results you speak of can be found here... http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=131111Quote:
Originally Posted by Petra
Interesting thread...I just built my C2D system.... with dual pumps. D5-->10wDDC /w Petra Top. Amazing flow-rate when the DDC runs!!
I used the DDC for years with the stock 1/2" modded top.... with NO start problems. With the new Top I'm having pump start issues... that I've not figured yet.
It may have to do with pump orientation and air bubble in the chamber? The D5 is in front of the resevoir(constant flood) the DDC is mid-case. So when my comp. powers off, I get a backwash of water and the DDC gets air-bubbles flowing thru it. I'm thinking it's either the Top or it's orientation/air-bubble. could people with start problems let me know if you're using a... modded top/resevoir and pump orientation.
I couldn't tell if my DDC was running(mostly it wasn't!) by touching it.
(no tach wire on this baby!)
Solved it by... turning D5 to #2 b4 boot-up... and watch bubbles go.... with the DDC enabled.... it vaporizes air-bubbles to mist.
My method of reticient pump starting ... is wacking it with a wrench!