Superpi score proofs Phenom X4 is a bit faster than Athlon64 X2...

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10-31-2007, 07:39 AM
Zucker2k

Quote:

Originally Posted by SparkyJJO

Oh such a great reason... :rolleyes: Like someone else said (I forget who) if running superpi all day is what you do then fine, go intel. But I know that I'm not the only one doesn't spent all day running superpi. Shoot, I don't really have much of a life and I don't sit here running pi all day. How many others then who actually have a life are going to do it all day? Seriously?:(

Dude, You don't have to run superpi all day to appreciate what I'm saying. Sure there are people who do that. All I'm saying is that it takes a significant amount of time (I estimate about 7 minutes, could be more) for people on AMD systems who run the 32M Pi to finish the benchmark on the average. Since Intel systems overclock better these days, this number is even significantly higher. Need I say that this also translates into "real world" apps like encoding, conversion, etc? For me performance almost always translates into time saved, not only in benchmarks but also in "real world" apps. This is the sole reason why I will switch to AMD if they become the performance king. Cheers!!
10-31-2007, 07:50 AM
Start

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

charles i will tell you what i think feel about AMD.

I see them moving away from needing to prove they are the fastest, we have already seen tri fire on 790 with an aircooled CPU running 3d06 scoring with some god awful high score http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquir...30000-3dmark06
which we all know has been confirmed to be true.

So an aircooled system running 3ghz beats the near 30k run I read about this week with a yorkie running on LN2, I know what i find easier to do even though im benching with 80L of LN2 and a yorkie in 14hrs to see just how far the boards will push this CPU...still for me air cooling is way easier then LN2 anyday ;). Now i know when crossfireX meets q9650 the scores will probably go ballistic but for now that kinda impressed me some what.

Next up, super pi...i asked you before for the source code so that i can have it ported to GPU, I really think once AMD port GPU to CPU we will see some sick fast scores that just make these CPU scores seem real slow. I remember one guy telling me a 2900XT has the power to run 32m pi in under 1minute, you know i would dearly love to see if that is true.

So you asked how i feel about AMD, I feel they are moving to a new arena, the issue is none of us really know what they are upto as none of us are privy to any real info as AMD are the kings of being tight lipped...so we just specualte and most of the time talk rubbish.

This is easily possible since a GPU can pull upwards of 500 GigaFlops, while the fastest Intel chip would be lucky to pull 90 Gigaflops (high estimate). But the problem lies in the GPU architecture, it is heavily parallized and you need to pipeline a lot of stuff in order to fully utilize the GPU. So that means having to redo some algorithms to make it properly work and exploit the full strength of the GPU. So even though you have taken the source code, redoing some of the code will take a bit of work. Then again, I haven't had experience with parallelization and pipelining yet to give a full response, but to the people familiar with the field makes this claim when I asked them :)
10-31-2007, 07:57 AM
da-key

Get a Soda!

Interesting read here. SO let me get this straight.

Intel cpu's have pretty much always been the superpi leader. For ex. the Pentium M s479 and highly clocked p4's. AMD has never dominated there imo.

Most AMD owners in the past including myself have used spi to bench there own system speed compared to other AMD systems. I have never thought of it as a good comparison between platforms. IE Intel vs. AMD. Instead it's more like Intel vs. Intel newest release in that dept.

Overall bandwidth and latency contributed greatly to why AMD CPU's were so successful at the s939 stage when paired with ddr. The throughput for games was superior to Intel's. Also the scaling of that performance was very closely tied to CPU clock and hence with the high OC of most s939 AMD was winner at 3dmark.

My current everday gaming / rig is still an Opteron 185 s939 part that scores 11k in 3d06 with a 320mb 8800gts but only 25s SPi time. Score LINK

I feel that my system is still competitive and the score shows with a e6300 and 8800gtx losing to me even though that system probably gets 18s in SPi 1M.

So what conclusion can you draw from a SPi time? Not much other than its a prerelease bios, cpu, mobo and we don't have many other AMD Phenom X4 systems to compare it to just yet. ;)

Enough of the Intel vs. AMD bickering. IMO AMD would have been better off to skip AM2 & ddr2 altogether. What a waste of R&D.:rolleyes:
10-31-2007, 07:58 AM
n91htmare

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

charles i will tell you what i think feel about AMD.

I see them moving away from needing to prove they are the fastest, we have already seen tri fire on 790 with an aircooled CPU running 3d06 scoring with some god awful high score http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquir...30000-3dmark06
which we all know has been confirmed to be true.

So an aircooled system running 3ghz beats the near 30k run I read about this week with a yorkie running on LN2, I know what i find easier to do even though im benching with 80L of LN2 and a yorkie in 14hrs to see just how far the boards will push this CPU...still for me air cooling is way easier then LN2 anyday ;). Now i know when crossfireX meets q9650 the scores will probably go ballistic but for now that kinda impressed me some what.

Right, because the Tri-fire market is so Huge.

Don't you think it's sad that Intel can still break 30K mark with 2 cards? You phrased it all wrong.
It's 3ghz on air with 3 cards vs. LN2 Yorkie with 2 cards

It's nice to have the option of 3 cards, but Considering how small the SLI/Crossfire market is, the Tri-Fire will be Minuscule.

Quote:

Originally Posted by da-key

Enough of the Intel vs. AMD bickering. IMO AMD would have been better off to skip AM2 & ddr2 altogether. What a waste of R&D.:rolleyes:

Introducing a New socket, a new memory controller on a new Architecture (K10) all at the same time could have been disastrous.
10-31-2007, 08:34 AM
Zucker2k

Quote:

Originally Posted by da-key

My current everday gaming / rig is still an Opteron 185 s939 part that scores 11k in 3d06 with a 320mb 8800gts but only 25s SPi time. Score LINK

I feel that my system is still competitive and the score shows with a e6300 and 8800gtx losing to me even though that system probably gets 18s in SPi 1M.

I'm impressed! But if we have to be thruthful, lets take a brief look at the numbers:

Stock Nvidia 8800 Ultra 612/1080
Stock Nvidia 8800 GTX 575/900
Your OC'ed 8800 GTS 680/1030 (500/800 stock)

No wonder a 6300 with a GTX wouldn't touch you - you're way past Ultra territory!!!

Except maybe if they came to the party with this: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ighlight=e6300 and your oc'ed GTS :D
10-31-2007, 08:41 AM
Entity_Razer

Quote:

Originally Posted by hipro5

No......It's time to be honest and come out and say: "We have this, we sell it that much and that's it"......Don't put me snakes that will unleach their power and bite you.....Don't put me dogs/cats/etc annimals........Put me a picture of the Phenom and say: "That's it guys....if you want it, get it"......:)

you know hipro, your marketing skills suck ;) :rofl:
10-31-2007, 09:06 AM
happychappy

Looks like all us nay-sayers were right all along
10-31-2007, 09:21 AM
hollo

err, isn't that 30k 3d06 score widely considered to be total bs?
eg http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?op...2808&Itemid=35
10-31-2007, 09:57 AM
n91htmare

Quote:

Originally Posted by hollo

err, isn't that 30k 3d06 score widely considered to be total bs?
eg http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?op...2808&Itemid=35

The notion was that it was done on 2 cards.... but it's probably done on 3 cards
10-31-2007, 11:57 AM
hipro5

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

charles i will tell you what i think feel about AMD.

I see them moving away from needing to prove they are the fastest, we have already seen tri fire on 790 with an aircooled CPU running 3d06 scoring with some god awful high score http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquir...30000-3dmark06
which we all know has been confirmed to be true.

Wow, wow, wow......Take it easy M8!..... :D
WHO and WHERE it was confirmed?.....:)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Entity_Razer

you know hipro, your marketing skills suck ;) :rofl:

:D :p:
10-31-2007, 12:25 PM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by hipro5

Wow, wow, wow......Take it easy M8!..... :D
WHO and WHERE it was confirmed?.....:)

:D :p:

My exact words aswell.
10-31-2007, 01:03 PM
savantu

You can't get 30k with a single QC and a 3 GPU setup whatever magic dust is inside K10 ( less than in Kentsfield apparently ) .....
10-31-2007, 01:29 PM
thenrz

Quote:

You can't get 30k with a single QC and a 3 GPU setup whatever magic dust is inside K10 ( less than in Kentsfield apparently ) .....

Ahh, only a Sith talks in absolutes. Honestly, having proof works both ways. Let's see some proof that it is BS!
10-31-2007, 01:51 PM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by savantu

You can't get 30k with a single QC and a 3 GPU setup whatever magic dust is inside K10 ( less than in Kentsfield apparently ) .....

Tony (and Fugger) obviously disagree with you on this one.And Tony said they both knew someone credible confirmed the score with the Phenom 3fire setup.
10-31-2007, 02:01 PM
Kasparz

Quote:

Originally Posted by savantu

You can't get 30k with a single QC and a 3 GPU setup whatever magic dust is inside K10 ( less than in Kentsfield apparently ) .....

It might sound a little impossible about 30k, but Tony knows what he are talking about, and if he says that score is valid, then score IS valid.
10-31-2007, 03:04 PM
hipro5

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasparz

It might sound a little impossible about 30k, but Tony knows what he are talking about, and if he says that score is valid, then score IS valid.

At the DEFAULT resolution of the bench?... :)
10-31-2007, 03:07 PM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by hipro5

At the DEFAULT resolution of the bench?... :)

No,it ran at 640*480 .... /sarcasm
:)
10-31-2007, 03:13 PM
Tony

Quote:

Originally Posted by hipro5;

Wow, wow, wow......Take it easy M8!..... :D
WHO and WHERE it was confirmed?.....:)

:D :p:

You still have access to XIP george, i hear it was confirmed in there ;)

Im perfectly calm m8, just pissed the Q9650 we tested today was cold bugged thats all.
10-31-2007, 03:39 PM
hipro5

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

You still have access to XIP george, i hear it was confirmed in there ;)

Im perfectly calm m8, just pissed the Q9650 we tested today was cold bugged thats all.

Link?.... :confused:

Mobo's cold bug with York.....York uses a bit different way of ouputing data of the temp sensor below zero.... Needed a bios update for that too and NOT only a bios that will "recognise" Yorkfield.... :(
10-31-2007, 03:51 PM
MaxxxRacer

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeardyMan

I would like to see that claim ;)

I'll send u screenie
10-31-2007, 03:52 PM
Tony

i can't link to XIP george, i just heard on the grape vine it was confirmed in there and that ther only public place i can tell you of...plus I am not welcome in XIP anymore.

Regards the yorkie, it was not my cpu, i helped James from Custom PC and Bazx and friends as they wanted to play super pi.

we hit 8.8secs but did not save it...have some 9's saved but sub 5ghz. Overall the boards were a real mess and we gave up in the end.

Still i have 30L LN2 here to play tomorrow ;)
10-31-2007, 07:19 PM
KTE

Ask various IT site owners around. Most of them said "tri-fire" the minute those results were released. I remember NH (Andreas) saying something similar too.
10-31-2007, 11:07 PM
hipro5

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

i can't link to XIP george, i just heard on the grape vine it was confirmed in there and that ther only public place i can tell you of...plus I am not welcome in XIP anymore.

Regards the yorkie, it was not my cpu, i helped James from Custom PC and Bazx and friends as they wanted to play super pi.

we hit 8.8secs but did not save it...have some 9's saved but sub 5ghz. Overall the boards were a real mess and we gave up in the end.

Still i have 30L LN2 here to play tomorrow ;)

About 30k on 2k6 and in VIP's section, sorry but I didn't find anything that proves/confirms it.... :(

Ha, ha, ha......Tony......You're playing with LN2 M8?........:D :welcome:
10-31-2007, 11:27 PM
mongoled

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

i can't link to XIP george, i just heard on the grape vine it was confirmed in there and that ther only public place i can tell you of...plus I am not welcome in XIP anymore.

Regards the yorkie, it was not my cpu, i helped James from Custom PC and Bazx and friends as they wanted to play super pi.

we hit 8.8secs but did not save it...have some 9's saved but sub 5ghz. Overall the boards were a real mess and we gave up in the end.

Still i have 30L LN2 here to play tomorrow ;)

-- OFFTOPIC --

Oh my, so its looking more and more that the roots upon which XS was built are slowly eroding away. Why an earth have you been excluded from the XIP Section? Oh I can definitely guess that one!

I wonder if is possible in this day and age to create a forum such as XS with has created so much traffic and for it to remain IMPARTIAL to 'outside influences' from ANY parties?

This day and age I think this is highly unlikely.

I wonder what would it take to get you re-instated in the XIP section, come on XS users, start shouting from the roof tops.

Tony In, Tony In

heheheheee

Seriously I hope whoever has thrown their DUMMY out the pram will see to reason and allow you back in......

-- END --

Back on topic, how can the title of this thread be correct?

When P4's were still blazing past K8 in superPi were they faster CPU's?

We ALL know the answer to this.

and yet still this thread is 5 pages strong and people are still discussing this

'Superpi score proofs Phenom X4 is a bit faster than Athlon64 X2...'

What gives? The thread should say

'DOES Superpi score prove that Phenom X4 is a bit faster than Athlon64 X2...????

Now we would have a thread, heheheheee

;)
11-01-2007, 12:05 AM
STEvil

Tony's welcome back if he wants I would assume, sometimes we all take ourselves and our fellow man a bit too seriously.. I think the bar's been running dry lately ;)

As to impartiality, thats one of the top creeds of this place otherwise you wouldnt be around, you'd be with the fanboys at [H] or noobs at Tom's ;)

Oh dear, misplaced my asbestos suit!
11-01-2007, 04:02 AM
savantu

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenrz

Ahh, only a Sith talks in absolutes. Honestly, having proof works both ways. Let's see some proof that it is BS!

K10 scores lower than Kentsfield in the 3Dmark 2006 CPU test.

A QX6700 with 2 2900XTs in Crossfire mode ( all stock ) scores ~15k points.

Enlighten me how adding another card ( 33% ) more GPU power will make the score jump 100%.
Even assuming linear scaling that's not possible.The same for a mild OC ( air ).
11-01-2007, 05:23 AM
Zucker2k

Quote:

Originally Posted by savantu

K10 scores lower than Kentsfield in the 3Dmark 2006 CPU test.

A QX6700 with 2 2900XTs in Crossfire mode ( all stock ) scores ~15k points.

Enlighten me how adding another card ( 33% ) more GPU power will make the score jump 200%.
Even assuming linear scaling that's not possible.The same for a mild OC ( air ).

You mean 100%. 200% increase of 15k is 45k. :)
11-01-2007, 08:51 AM
savantu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zucker2k

You mean 100%. 200% increase of 15k is 45k. :)

True. :p:
11-01-2007, 01:42 PM
EvlUndrWareNome

The ignorance about Phenom is just truly amazing. The only thing this thread is is people complaining about Super Pi. Who gives a crap about a lil gadget that calculates Pi?!

If your that mezmorized about it, go buy a 486 and calculate 32mb and amuse yourself for a week or so at a time.

Wheres the rendoering tests, all out gaming benchmars, 1024x768 scores with games, etc...

or even 3dmark? Lets see something run a REAL benchmark and not an indicator of how well your Intel CPU works.

AMD enthusiasts know AMD doesn't take the crown in super pi, why would we care? If it runs games quickly , VM's, servers, rendering, etc...

Please someone help me to understand this worthless benchmark beyond the realm of stability testing is so touted to inflate someones online ego. It seems every single thread on Phenom just ends in kids crying about super pi scores.
11-01-2007, 11:10 PM
hipro5

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvlUndrWareNome

The ignorance about Phenom is just truly amazing. The only thing this thread is is people complaining about Super Pi. Who gives a crap about a lil gadget that calculates Pi?!

If your that mezmorized about it, go buy a 486 and calculate 32mb and amuse yourself for a week or so at a time.

Wheres the rendoering tests, all out gaming benchmars, 1024x768 scores with games, etc...

or even 3dmark? Lets see something run a REAL benchmark and not an indicator of how well your Intel CPU works.

AMD enthusiasts know AMD doesn't take the crown in super pi, why would we care? If it runs games quickly , VM's, servers, rendering, etc...

Please someone help me to understand this worthless benchmark beyond the realm of stability testing is so touted to inflate someones online ego. It seems every single thread on Phenom just ends in kids crying about super pi scores.

Well said...... ;)

Now you guys with the new CPU's (Barchies or Phenoms) give us some 3D action to see how they do...... ;) :D
11-01-2007, 11:14 PM
zakelwe

Quote:

Originally Posted by hipro5

Well said...... ;)

Now you guys with the new CPU's (Barchies or Phenoms) give us some 3D action to see how they do...... ;) :D

We want

Car Hi
Car Hi
Car Hi

:YIPPIE:

Regards

Andy
11-01-2007, 11:36 PM
hipro5

:rofl: :rofl:

.....and Lobby High.......:D
11-02-2007, 09:33 AM
nemrod

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvlUndrWareNome

The ignorance about Phenom is just truly amazing. The only thing this thread is is people complaining about Super Pi. Who gives a crap about a lil gadget that calculates Pi?!

Please someone help me to understand this worthless benchmark beyond the realm of stability testing is so touted to inflate someones online ego. It seems every single thread on Phenom just ends in kids crying about super pi scores.

Nobody cares of superpi on this forum
http://www.xtremesystems.com/superpi/
:D
11-02-2007, 10:09 AM
savantu

Quote:

Originally Posted by hipro5

Well said...... ;)

Now you guys with the new CPU's (Barchies or Phenoms) give us some 3D action to see how they do...... ;) :D

Pretty lame...

http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...3899489_rs.jpg

Look at the UT score , CPU score , aaarghhh...terrible.

http://www.expreview.com/news/hard/2...8206d6758.html
11-02-2007, 10:17 AM
Hornet331

to bad they havent underclocked the A64. :(

would have been nice to see how they compare directly on the same platform.(at least for singelcore performance)
11-02-2007, 12:04 PM
MaSell

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvlUndrWareNome

Wheres the rendoering tests, all out gaming benchmars, 1024x768 scores with games, etc...scores.

You will buy $300 cpu to play in 1024x768? $30 sempron/celly will be enough I guess ;)

Who there will buy pc for something other than spi and 3dmark?

We wanna car hi :D
11-02-2007, 12:26 PM
DoubleZero

Quote:

Originally Posted by savantu

Pretty lame...

http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...3899489_rs.jpg

Look at the UT score , CPU score , aaarghhh...terrible.

http://www.expreview.com/news/hard/2...8206d6758.html

Yeah, pretty lame, GP-7000 is 7% slower then Q6600 while having 20% less clock... terrible, terrible :rofl: :rofl: :clap: :welcome:

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=2717398
11-02-2007, 02:52 PM
EvlUndrWareNome

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaSell

You will buy $300 cpu to play in 1024x768? $30 sempron/celly will be enough I guess ;)

Who there will buy pc for something other than spi and 3dmark?

We wanna car hi :D

at the lower resolutions like that, namesly 1024x768, your CPU is used more than at high resolutions. FPS at equal speeds with another CPU is an indicator of performance.
11-02-2007, 02:54 PM
Tuvok-LuR-

not exactly, cpu is used the same, but gpu is used less, so the difference can be seen better
11-02-2007, 02:55 PM
EvlUndrWareNome

Quote:

Originally Posted by nemrod

Nobody cares of superpi on this forum
http://www.xtremesystems.com/superpi/
:D

Intel has SuperPi,

AMD has the memory bandwidth bench.

Both near useless in real world applications. Well maybe the mem bandwidt could be useful in something.. Maybe tuning RAM?

SPi is useful for stability testing I guess...

That about as useful as either benchmark gets. Thats what I was referring to.
11-02-2007, 02:57 PM
Epsilon84

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoubleZero

Yeah, pretty lame, GP-7000 is 7% slower then Q6600 while having 20% less clock... terrible, terrible :rofl: :rofl: :clap: :welcome:

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=2717398

3DMark scores don't not scale linearly with clockspeed. The GPU has a far bigger influence on the score than the CPU. :rolleyes:

Guess what a Q6600 scores in PCMark05 CPU? 7713
Phenom X4 2GHz? 5830

7713 / 2400 = 3.21 points per MHz for C2Q.

5830 / 2000 = 2.91 points per MHz for Phenom X4.

Spin that. :up:
11-02-2007, 09:19 PM
User9498

Superpi has become an anachronistic piece of software, especially in an age of multi-cored processors. It's more entertainment than science. I currently place almost zero percent real-world stock in the program.
11-03-2007, 12:39 AM
gallag

I hope AMD get there act together soon before all benchmarks become useless.

hopefully if k10 kicks ass, performance will be important again?
11-03-2007, 08:52 AM
Hornet331

Quote:

Originally Posted by gallag

I hope AMD get there act together soon before all benchmarks become useless.

hopefully if k10 kicks ass, performance will be important again?

didnt you know all benches are faaaar away from realworld and only spec suite and sciencemark count? :p:
11-03-2007, 09:21 AM
RedBull78

At this point of time I beg to throw away anything I see that shows a phenom in action. I doubt this with my life because Iam more then 1000000000000000000000% sure that nobody happens to have a working AMD 790mobo and phenom cpu.

Just wait until offical benchmarks and judge the results with a peace of mind , darn it.
11-03-2007, 09:30 AM
Entity_Razer

ye those bandwidth benchmarks are ALL wrong tbh....

Just wait till official benchies on certified hardware before jumping to conclusions guys, you all realise releasing a product which is SLOWER then its predecesor is just corporate suicide and we know AMD is not stupid so... don't go jumping the gun ;)
11-03-2007, 09:34 AM
thenrz

Damn straight, RedBull78. AMD is not breaking the seal on Phenom yet. I guess anyone who wants to see competition on price and performance throughout the next years will hope that Phenom ends up being a bag of chips with some blazing overclocked salsa. :)
11-03-2007, 09:56 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Entity_Razer

ye those bandwidth benchmarks are ALL wrong tbh....

Just wait till official benchies on certified hardware before jumping to conclusions guys, you all realise releasing a product which is SLOWER then its predecesor is just corporate suicide and we know AMD is not stupid so... don't go jumping the gun ;)

Good points(and redbull's too).I can't remember in recent past,the time that AMD "pre-demoed" it's new uarch. and that it performed at the same level as it would when it hit the retail.We remember the early K7 "disastrous" tests with low FPU scores,than it was early K8's that could clock like *** and was later reviewed at Xbitlabs as 2800+ and barely beat K7 at the same clock :) ,then it was early Anand's AM2 preview that showed only decrease of perf. over s939(at the end ,on average with solid DDR2 RAM, AM2 chips were 3-5% faster than s939 with good DDR1,and rarely slower )

So yes,let's wait for the 19th and judge then.
11-03-2007, 10:20 AM
railmeat

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony

All I see nowadays is people linking super pi to how good a cpu is, fact is unless you are seriously sad you won't be playing pi every night for 4 to 6 hrs now will you ;)

AMD are bringing "a platform" not just a cpu that does pi in 8 secs which in reality means very little. if you stand back and see the bigger picture here you will see AMD have changed strategy for a while and really are not that bothered about super pi any more...its just you guys here on XS that are!

Im looking forward to crossfire X on 790 with a Phenom with a chipset that runs really cool and does not even need a heatsink in most cases and hopfully never running superpi on the machine at all :)

"All I see nowadays is people linking super pi to how good a cpu is, fact is unless you are seriously sad you won't be playing pi every night for 4 to 6 hrs now will you ;)"

rofl,
ya theres not that many gamers here,just benchmarkers.and tony i fully agree with what u said.and belive it or not, alot off ppl only run pi 24\7 to get faster to impress others.thats cool and all to optimize something then set it and enjoy it.but for some it never stops til hardware failure sometimes occurs,but hey its xs right.this site has some of thee best info i ever read and the members here use there skill simply to either 24\7 benchmark or game,some both.but still some really good overclockers bottom line from all around the world.i just cant do the pi\3dmark looping crap 24\7.theres to many games that were developed and made to be played...:shrug:

superpi-
i love this quick benchie to tell me how my ram\cpu oc will hold up to prime\occt.stabilty is everything,bottom line.super pi on a tube for a 9second blast to impress others prevails for the masses i guess.i myself love to game thats why i build my pcs to handle the newer games.others build there pcs build to merely impress others it seems with benchmark numbers.others game with friends using voip and having a complete blast regardless of age.i have played with guys who wack 10-11 sec in pi vs my 13 sec rig and that doesnt matter.my pc is still blazing fast and i rip skulls apart in any fps game regardless of cpu speeds 2 sec faster in a pi run... bf2,quake(any3,4),hl2,etqw bring it=)

3dmarks-
this simply tells me how many more fps im getting period by overclocking.a purfect tool for any gamer.as a gamer more fps are the goal to make games more enjoyable period,stable tho.some ppl here call 3dmark06 a game,not the case,its a benchmark.a game is something u play interactivly with others vs pushing a button only to see how it runs by itself displaying fps gains,fun yes, a game no.

i have been holding out a long time with my 4th conroe in my setup hoping amd would prevail in the performance gaming dept.seeing some of the numbers with both amdk10 and quad 775,s both at 3gig getting a 2-5fps +- difference.im not pro amd or intel,whatever runs the newer games best.
i wanted a q6600 to replace my e6600 for some time now because crysis is coded to use quads. but i read the amd should probaly do better using l3 cache to fully load balance all 4 cores in the k10 vs intels shared bus.amd has took the time for better things i think in terms of new cutting edge tech(l3cache,4 seperate cores).now to real world ultilize this tech we shall see.:shrug: i thought amd got more clocks per cycle vs intel,or was that only netburst era?..we shall see as more tests prevail.

1 request tho plz.
3dmark06 (screenies)
sisandra memory and latency test.
11-03-2007, 10:21 AM
StimulatedBoy

Quote:

Originally Posted by gallag

I hope AMD get there act together soon before all benchmarks become useless.

hopefully if k10 kicks ass, performance will be important again?

OWNED
11-03-2007, 11:25 AM
nemrod

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

Good points(and redbull's too).I can't remember in recent past,the time that AMD "pre-demoed" it's new uarch. and that it performed at the same level as it would when it hit the retail.We remember the early K7 "disastrous" tests with low FPU scores,than it was early K8's that could clock like *** and was later reviewed at Xbitlabs as 2800+ and barely beat K7 at the same clock :) ,then it was early Anand's AM2 preview that showed only decrease of perf. over s939(at the end ,on average with solid DDR2 RAM, AM2 chips were 3-5% faster than s939 with good DDR1,and rarely slower )

So yes,let's wait for the 19th and judge then.

In recent past, I've not seen a revolution with barcelona, is it?
11-03-2007, 11:57 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by nemrod

In recent past, I've not seen a revolution with barcelona, is it?

Have you seen one with K7->K8 transition??Was it like 50% faster?No it wasn't.It was typical 15-20%,just as Phenom will be over K8.Although,since the doubled SSE resources,Phenom will be a lot faster than K8 (than those average 20%) in SSE intensive apps.
11-03-2007, 01:17 PM
Zucker2k

Why are all you AMD fanboys pretending superpi is the only benchmark Intel's CPUs are dominating AMDs newest phenoms? Show me a single popular benchmark where phenom or any other AMD cpu dominates an Intel CPU. Fact is all you have now is AMDs past glories to hang on to. Funny thing is, I could be there to but I choose to go Intel now because I SAVE TIME whenever I have to run a benchmark or encode files. As a matter of fact, I am encoding a 27GB HD DVD file to x264 format at 54fps, and still have an overhead to multitask. The best thing is, this is only a mild overclock of 3.5 Ghz on a Q6600. Goodluck trying to duplicate that on your AMD system.
11-03-2007, 01:27 PM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zucker2k

Why are all you AMD fanboys pretending superpi is the only benchmark Intel's CPUs are dominating AMDs newest phenoms? Show me a single popular benchmark where phenom or any other AMD cpu dominates an Intel CPU. Fact is all you have now is AMDs past glories to hang on to. Funny thing is, I could be there to but I choose to go Intel now because I SAVE TIME whenever I have to run a benchmark or encode files. As a matter of fact, I am encoding a 27GB HD DVD file to x264 format at 54fps, and still have an overhead to multitask. The best thing is, this is only a mild overclock of 3.5 Ghz on a Q6600. Goodluck trying to duplicate that on your AMD system.

Funny thing is that there are no benchmarks of Phenom available(apart from one Crysis which is fishy as hell since it's not threaded at all and the system had some low memory subsystem values;yeah one SPi bench was posted too-apart from the fact that SPi has no merit at all)
11-03-2007, 01:39 PM
Tulatin

Problem is, so much as AMD may be a "platform company" What would be the point of buying a phenom + 790 mobo if you could go intel quad + P35 for the same money (the only fallancy here is the CPU), and then OC your way well past graceland? The GPU part of that equation is NOTHING special. You can run CF on anything, you know...

As much as I like Damit, they have to pull their heads out of their asses, and stop this "We're a platform/midrange company. We don't need performance parts" :banana::banana::banana::banana:. If K10 is just ANOTHER K8 iteration just like AM2, then FFS, why don't we call it NetBurst? :(

Edit: and though the K7 -> K8 jump may have been 20% at the gate, K8 had a BIG difference: Headroom. What's the point of putting out a new line of chips if they're the fastest of that breed you'll ever see.
11-03-2007, 01:49 PM
John600rr

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

Funny thing is that there are no benchmarks of Phenom available(apart from one Crysis which is fishy as hell since it's not threaded at all and the system had some low memory subsystem values;yeah one SPi bench was posted too-apart from the fact that SPi has no merit at all)

What do you mean by the Crysis benchmark is not threaded at all?

The Crysis CPU test loaded my E6600 80% on one core and around 75% on the other.
11-03-2007, 02:39 PM
cky2k6

right, but it doesn't load a quad core, cause the dual and quad core intels in the test scored within 2fps of each other. memory scores for these phenoms also seem low, they get less bandwidth than core 2, which is unexpected with an imc...
11-03-2007, 02:45 PM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by cky2k6

right, but it doesn't load a quad core, cause the dual and quad core intels in the test scored within 2fps of each other. memory scores for these phenoms also seem low, they get less bandwidth than core 2, which is unexpected with an imc...

Exactly.BTW,i think that Phenom got even lower mem. scores than K8 in those tests.
11-03-2007, 03:43 PM
John600rr

But it is not as if the Q6600 was running some 'different' version of Crysis which was better multi-threaded.

As many programs today are not completely multi threaded, especially for quad cores, I think it makes the results even MORE realistic.
11-04-2007, 08:01 AM
savantu

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

Have you seen one with K7->K8 transition??Was it like 50% faster?No it wasn't.It was typical 15-20%,just as Phenom will be over K8.Although,since the doubled SSE resources,Phenom will be a lot faster than K8 (than those average 20%) in SSE intensive apps.

Is the difference between K10 and K8 greater than K8 vs. k7 ?
I doubt it.

As a result , K10 vs. K8 will impress less than K8 vs. K7 and your whole argument is in the air.
11-04-2007, 08:28 AM
uwackme

huh?

First, dont even bother me with a test that runs the ram slower than 500Mhz. Using 375 on an AMD, wtf is that :banana::banana::banana::banana:?

My 5600+ gets 24s/22m SuperPi results. You gonna tell me an X4 is that slow... the test is flawed. Learn how to apply the scientific method to your work, then come back and let us know your tests and results. otherwise you are wasting electrons.
11-04-2007, 08:47 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by savantu

Is the difference between K10 and K8 greater than K8 vs. k7 ?
I doubt it.

As a result , K10 vs. K8 will impress less than K8 vs. K7 and your whole argument is in the air.

Hmm,can you read right?

Let me quote myself:

Quote:

Have you seen one with K7->K8 transition??Was it like 50% faster?No it wasn't.It was typical 15-20%,just as Phenom will be over K8.Although,since the doubled SSE resources,Phenom will be a lot faster than K8 (than those average 20%) in SSE intensive apps.

And yes,Phenom over K8 will be the same as K8 over K7.15-20% on average and a lot more in certain (SSE) scenarios.
11-04-2007, 09:01 AM
Epsilon84

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

Funny thing is that there are no benchmarks of Phenom available(apart from one Crysis which is fishy as hell since it's not threaded at all and the system had some low memory subsystem values;yeah one SPi bench was posted too-apart from the fact that SPi has no merit at all)

You must have missed this?
http://www.expreview.com/news/hard/2...8206d6758.html
http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...3899489_rs.jpg
http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...6409212_rs.jpg
http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...6047070_rs.jpg

I think they mislabeled the X4 as a '7000' model when it should in fact be a '9000' model.

Comparing most of those numbers to Q6600 ones (such as PCMark05 or 3DMark 05/06) shows the 2GHz X4 to be slower somewhat, then again it is only clocked at 2GHz, and we don't know the memory timings etc.
11-04-2007, 09:24 AM
GoThr3k

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epsilon84

You must have missed this?
I think they mislabeled the X4 as a '7000' model when it should in fact be a '9000' model.

Comparing most of those numbers to Q6600 ones (such as PCMark05 or 3DMark 05/06) shows the 2GHz X4 to be slower somewhat, then again it is only clocked at 2GHz, and we don't know the memory timings etc.

you think that,but you dont know it for sure

and if you look at the memory bandwidth,you know something isnt right here.....
11-04-2007, 09:32 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epsilon84

You must have missed this?
http://www.expreview.com/news/hard/2...8206d6758.html
http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...3899489_rs.jpg
http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...6409212_rs.jpg
http://www.expreview.com/img/news/07...6047070_rs.jpg

I think they mislabeled the X4 as a '7000' model when it should in fact be a '9000' model.

Comparing most of those numbers to Q6600 ones (such as PCMark05 or 3DMark 05/06) shows the 2GHz X4 to be slower somewhat, then again it is only clocked at 2GHz, and we don't know the memory timings etc.

No i haven't miss that one.Look at the memory subsytem scores for Phenom,aren't they strange?I call BS untill i see official review.
I think we should reserve our judgment 'till the parts officially launch.And i think that since some online stores list the ETA as early as tomorrow,some one will probably get Phenom and test it here at XS long before we hit Nov 19th.
11-04-2007, 09:34 AM
Epsilon84

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoThr3k

you think that,but you dont know it for sure

and if you look at the memory bandwidth,you know something isnt right here.....

Well, if someone is stupid enough to list a tri core as a quad core then I can't do much about that can I? Therefore I can only ASSUME they made a simple MISTAKE in labelling. :rolleyes:

Somehow, I imagine if those results were actually favorable to AMD there wouldn't be all this skepticism? ;)
11-04-2007, 09:35 AM
Epsilon84

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

No i haven't miss that one.Look at the memory subsytem scores for Phenom,aren't they strange?I call BS untill i see official review.
I think we should reserve our judgment 'till the parts officially launch.And i think that since some online stores list the ETA as early as tomorrow,some one will probably get Phenom and test it here at XS long before we hit Nov 19th.

That I agree with. Can't wait, it's been too long already. :yepp:
11-04-2007, 09:44 AM
informal

Yep,i just hope some one grab it before the 19th.Since so many people here at XS shell out the good amount of $ for 790FX mobos,I therefore expect some of them managed to at least grab 9500.For it's price it should be great performer.Also i am looking forward to seeing how ordinary AM2 mobos cope with IMC clocking thing(shouldn't be a problem,but i am careful optimistic :) )
11-04-2007, 11:47 PM
Entity_Razer

quick note:

My school has ... lets say a big "playground" with lots of fun hardware and my teacher today told me we have 3 barcelona's in school up and running with the needed motherboards/ram to support it (under NDA ofc) so all i can say/him confirm is that those benches are WAYYYYY of, and i really do mean WAY OFF
11-04-2007, 11:51 PM
accord99

Quote:

Originally Posted by Entity_Razer

quick note:

My school has ... lets say a big "playground" with lots of fun hardware and my teacher today told me we have 3 barcelona's in school up and running with the needed motherboards/ram to support it (under NDA ofc) so all i can say/him confirm is that those benches are WAYYYYY of, and i really do mean WAY OFF

Barcelona is released so why would there be any NDA?
11-04-2007, 11:53 PM
Entity_Razer

no idea all he said is that he can't openly discuss all the details/benches yet.

it isn't that surprising that they can't TBH, they are working in tight coop with both Intel as AMD and we constantly get the latest hardware to test/play around with (wel he and his specialised department does) so... prob some reason he can't give any long details yet :)
11-05-2007, 12:02 AM
Entity_Razer

btw:

http://anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/sho...spx?i=3092&p=1

Not THAT extensive but i'm surpised i didn't see that link show up more. Barce tests & also a Opteron (barcelona Opterons) test linked in there. Shows barcelona to be 15-20% faster clock/clock then the x2 and the bandwidth to be a LOT better then any other benches i've seen linked here
11-05-2007, 12:08 AM
informal

Entity_Razer,something is definitely going on behind the scenes until the 19th(can't dig out from local AMD guy what's really going on).I guess it's because of the Phenom launch and the fanfare.It's interesting where is AMD pricing the 2.2Ghz model tho.
Not long before 19th is over :).
11-05-2007, 12:12 AM
Entity_Razer

hehe...

well anand or johan de gelas said it in one of the reviews on Anand.... if Barcelona clocks 3Ghz it will pretty much dominate the market for months to come
11-05-2007, 02:07 AM
nemrod

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoThr3k

you think that,but you dont know it for sure

and if you look at the memory bandwidth,you know something isnt right here.....

It's not a tricore. If you go back to the source:
http://www.force.game.tw/
http://myevilprocessor.blogspot.com/...4-x2-6400.html
You will see that there is a name correction.

(Tests could be wrong, but this is about quadcore)

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