eva: how 'stock' is your system when it's installed? I've seen you posting a thread which explains how to use nlite on the i4memory forums. How much tweaks are already included in your OS when you install it?
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eva: how 'stock' is your system when it's installed? I've seen you posting a thread which explains how to use nlite on the i4memory forums. How much tweaks are already included in your OS when you install it?
@eva2000:
Create a 4GB file ( WinRAR, UltraISO, anything ).
Don't use maxmem.
Open up SuperPi set the calculation, and leave it at the "Now start to calculate..." window ( waiting for you to press ok :D )
Copy the wazza file from D:\ to C:\ and then from C:\ to D:\Temp
As soon as the last copy process finishes click OK to start the calculation.
How about that other one I posted at 8x385?Quote:
Originally Posted by elmor
I would be joining the fun but all I have is a Core Solo 1.2GHz atm so don't despair. :p: (I still have 6 gigs of cherry picked D9 tho...:D)
I might give it a try with 1M & 32M later on, but to be honest I don't expect any changes in 1M ( still looking out for that magic trick that shove those seconds off that magic low clocks WR :p: ), as for 32M...if it shoves off some time, and it works in combination with the "regular" copy wazza as well it might be worthy.
Its really weird waza isnt working for you. Have you tried waiting about 30 sec after the copy before the 32M run? Copying between partitions on root?Quote:
Originally Posted by eva2000
Yeah tried various waiting intervals before hitting okay as well as different partitions on same drive .. super pi is located on main root partition C:\
Exactly, complete bollocks :up:Quote:
Originally Posted by hipro5
I'll give it a try :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
I start the calculation immediately after the copying completes. In fact I have the window ready to go beforehand so all I do is hit OK.Quote:
Originally Posted by eva2000
if they were not faster i wouldn't have pushed them like that :):DQuote:
Originally Posted by massman
OFFTOPIC
What are you doing with blinds cascade?:D
That's exactly what you should do :D :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
Your curve hands doesn't mean that his tweak doesn't work :)
:)
You don't need so large copy-waza. Maxmem +200MB or amount of RAM + 200MB should be enough :)
I am pretty busy right now but I will try this tweak (I hope I will understand every detail of it) myself as Hipro suggested.
LOL
I just copied a few small zipped files from 1 map to another map on the same disk. And the result was also -0.4secs :D
So copying to another partition is not needed?
anyone willing to test that ;)
I'm going to see how far you can push that :D
On AMD (S754 3400+) If I run super pi WHILE moving a large file I drop from 38.063 to 37.859 in 1M and I haven't been able to replicate that every with other tweaks....anyone on conroe want to try this?
OPB seems to have hit the nail very good :D
http://www.ocxtreme.org/opb/cdt4/03.jpg
The higher i get that systemcache the better my score lol :D
and no need at all for copying to another partition or for zipping files :D
another 0.050secs by pushing that systemcache with full litterbin :p
Well, here's my report, just as Hipro wanted here:
System:Quote:
Originally Posted by hipro5
I'm by no means ar Superpi tweaker, so the first score might look like a bit shaky... whatever.Quote:
E6600
Asus P5K-E unmodded
2x1Gb Corsair 6400C3
Asus X850XT (drivers not installed) :D
20 GB IDE HDD
515x7, 1:1, PL7 etc, maxmem=600, no eram, plenty of services disabled, no copy-waza, no cdt.
Result: 13m24.031s
http://mrlobber.svnets.lv/Oc/32M/32M_reference.jpg
Now the same settings plus pagefile 384 Mb, copy-waza 768 GB (in task manager I observed available memory 525Mb vs system cache 540Mb before the run):
Result: 13m14.437s
http://mrlobber.svnets.lv/Oc/32M/32M_copywaza.jpg
And now CDT run... done with pagefile 512Mb exactly as elmor described:
However, I couldn't observe the available memory going closer to system cache more than it was in my 2nd run pictured above. In fact, I observed the 525Mb/540Mb situation already after I did the 1st step of CDT tweak (elmor's 6th, that is, copying that big file from D:\ to C:\), and this proportion didn't change later on, while doing all the other copying.Quote:
Originally Posted by elmor
So, since getting these two (available memory & system cache) as close as possible seem to be the key for this tweak, it's no surprise that my "CDT run" is basically the same as the "copy-waza" run, even a little worse.
Result: 13m18.422s
http://mrlobber.svnets.lv/Oc/32M/32M_cdt.jpg
Gotta only 4hours left to sleep before going to work tomorrow :) so maybe I'll try the CDT after some 20hours once again. Things I might have done differently from elmor's run are 2 (as far as I'm aware of):
1. I calculated the "632Mb file" as 1024x1024x632 whereas elmor did 1000x1024x632
2. I used *.bat files for copying all the stuff around (you can see them on my desktop in the 3rd pic).
Elmor & other people familiar with the tweak, could you give an insight what might I have did / did not for the tweak not working for me as a result? :confused:
Edit:
3. Another subtle thing: before copying all the big files for 3 times each, I always waited a couple of seconds between the copy/replace operations. Should I have done this or should I have started the next copying immediately?
The timing of this is just brilliant!
Thanks mrlobber for the tests...... :)
Anyone's willing to test it as I described?....:)
Tip: You can go into Registry and change the "Windows Priority" from "2" which is default for the Win XP , to 66 (it will show you 102 finaly)....
It's under "Priority"....> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Contro l \PriorityControl
and DON'T use the Patch of Microsoft with multicore suport....It gives you NOTHING even in 3D, makes things worse...
It's under
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Contro l \Session Manager\Memory Management\Throttle......IF you have alredy install it, then put it to "0".....
;)
Hipro5 maybe you can reveal your tweaks :)
And you think that they will work for everyone?
:)
They are NOT MY tweaks......They are Japanise's ppl tweaks that they work like charm all these years - from the oldest till the latest of them -.....and YES they work for everyone...;)Quote:
Originally Posted by spainis
I hope to be able to perform some additional tests this evening. Notice again, the idea behind CDT (at least as I see it, whichever version of it we might want to test) is to approximate available memory and system cache as close as possible. So I think it is obvious that I did something wrong in that respect since, as I already posted, I couldn't get available memory and system cache nowhere as close as others who have displayed the CDT working (and it is also obvious, that it's possible to get these two values very close, as demonstrated by various screenshots around).
Maybe I'll try what hixie posted as well :D
Quote:
Step 1: Set MAXMEM to 600, and made a file 604MB large (600 as in the MAXMEM value and 4 because i'm running 4M Super Pi)
Step 2: Open up Super Pi, and select 4M, but stop that the start button.
Step 3: Open task manager, and keep copying the same 604MB file into THE SAME FOLDER, until System Cache and Available memory figures match each other.
Step 4: Close everything, and run Super Pi.
How much of improvement shall I see....6-7-8-9 sec lower in 3.6GHz than Copy Wazza?....Quote:
Originally Posted by Metallica
i didn't do a deep test so i couldn't say how much of a improvement you will have :)Quote:
Originally Posted by hipro5
i will compare copy-waza and CDT-IV tweak for my-self this weekend and will report :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
but listening to both your tips i used 3.94GB file and copywaza definitely better gain of around 2 seconds versus <1 second more consistentlyQuote:
Originally Posted by BenchZowner
bumped ram to 640mhz 5-5-4-5 but same clock speed
no tweaks
http://fileshosts.com/intel/Asus/Bli...3m12s875ms.png
just copywaza 3.94GB file copied from C: to D: and D: to C:
http://fileshosts.com/intel/Asus/Bli...s_copywaza.png
Going to try hipro's method as well.. didn't know about that prioritycontrol reg tweak though so let's see :)
but i can't see such an entry in PriorityControl ?? only entry is Win32PrioritySeparation ??Quote:
Originally Posted by hipro5
times vary from a gain or loss of a few ms when i do this nothing consistent hehQuote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
eva2000, WHY don't you put in msconfig "maxmem = 640" and test it...?.....
never tried maxmem value of 640M before 600-615 yes but not 640.. will try it now :)
see from ya user title you have a new addiction :cool:
edit: tried maxmem 640 with 3.94GB file copy waza 0.892s faster
http://fileshosts.com/intel/Asus/Bli..._maxmem640.png
Could someone please explain this tweak in proper english?
I just can't get my head around it.
Here's what i understand:
Install Spi on D partion
Make pagefile of min 512 max 512 on D partion
Set maxmem to 600 with msconfig
reboot
Create 3 folders you fill with pics or whatever until they're 632mb each
Open superPi, select size (32M in my case) leave it at "now start to calculate" dialog.
Copy each of the 632mb files into a folder that's in the SuperPi folder on partion D
Make a winrar archive of this file
Let it idle for about 45 seconds watching taskmanager until free memory matches systemcache.(Approx.)
Run SuperPi.
Did it this way but gained 0,00 i must have done something or a couple of things wrong.
All not necessary :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Zeus
Just make a new folder on your desktop
Take a zipped filed with the size around 650mb,
copy that file into that new folder. rename it
copy the same file again, rename it
copy the file again.
the systemcache should be high now.
Run superpi :Dµ
edit*
idleing should improve afterall ^^
HA, HA, HA........George you MUST have the WORST windows instalation EVER..... :D :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by eva2000
Did it for you? If not, it probably means you actually haven't applied the tweak, at least that's what I understand about the essence of CDT.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeus
I personally haven't be able to match these two yet... so, consequently, no gain in Superpi.
This is the max i could push the systemcacheperhaps if i lett it idle more i can get more out of it. Other then that it works lol:D
Yeah could be.. does maybe win2003 better for this ?Quote:
Originally Posted by hipro5
regular XP SP2 works ok, but dont slipstream any updates, at least it works for me
Oh no updates better ? i'm fully updated via Ryam VM packs etc for my WinXP Pro SP2 install http://i4memory.com/showthread.php?t=4736 hehQuote:
Originally Posted by andre X_X
Seems like you got the tweak. What's the difference with Copy-Waza?Quote:
Originally Posted by BeardyMan
I thought it was well known that 2003 was much better for SPI? Maybe I just took for granted that it was much better.
Everyone working with HD's it seems, why not get rid of this and get yourself a proper RAMdisk? Lot less wondering about tweaks because DRAM is so much faster then HD, and atleast everyone would actually understand what is happening instead of this "magic tweak" fairytales :D
For some it is, for some it ain't :).Quote:
Originally Posted by wa77ss
I'd like to see some 03 vs XP results of the tweak
Ehy guys, how come noone who is testing this tweak does it jsut as it says, and has to try thier own way?
I see no max meme 632mb, I see noone takingthe exact same steps as posted in OP. I wish I had more time than to take a quick perusal of the forums...'cause I think if you follow all steps, pagefile, copywaza file size(3x632MB, rar'ed), and thin gs might work different.
I have not seen anyone do...you must rar the 3x632MB files after put into folder. The last rar will use RAM, pagefile, and windows cache, if you set all things as described, and if you use a proper blank file, when it's done, all you got is blank data left in those spaces...you wait a few minutes for windows to "right itself" form the huge file, and then bench.Quote:
so the best way is you only make it once for 632mb for instance, then copy it into the folderright? then re-name the original to othername and copy into that folder...so now your folder has how much? 1264mb? so the one remain out side the folder still 632mb right?
so rename again and "cut it and paste into that folder...
now, if you install winrar already, right click that folder, and make a whatever name of the rar file...there we go, after done...you know what to do...
So, who's the first to rar?
already tried it http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...1&postcount=38Quote:
Originally Posted by cadaveca
Yes, i saw your post EVa, but you have not made all the tweaks in order. you must have maxmem, 525mb-525mb pagefile, 3x files into folder, rar, then use rar'ed file for copywaza, then bench. did you do like this, as I cannot tell which screenshot is from this...also the iwndows registry tweaks MUST be done...I cannot see un-optimized windows doing this "trick" right...
Don't gt me wrong, I do not question your posts EVAR!!!!! The respect I have for you in this regard is very large. But without showing results, I must wonder what is not right...not in what you did, but maybe in the explanation. I think I understand what is trying to be accomplished...but maybe not. lol.
I also think we are missing one part...what size of partitions are being used for C: and D: ? this will affect how well copywaza works, methinks.
Cadaveca, so did I here: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...&postcount=121 (look at the 3rd pic).
yeah made the 3 files rar'd then rar'd to a larger file but OPB stated to use 600 Maxmem and 512M fixed page file or you mean maxmem should of been 512 instead of 600 ??
not sure what you mean without showing results.. my results are in that link or you mean showing no improvements in my results ???
Sorry I went out of my clothes..... Yes I know sometimes I'm an arshole......Keep on, I won't involve into this any more coz I'm not "neutral"......I'll only read your posts and findings...:shakes:
Yeah no improvements. If you cannot get it to work, then I'm less likely to be interested, YKWIM?Quote:
Originally Posted by eva2000
no, i tihnk all three should be 632MB...pagefile, maxmem, and ramdisk. Even the lack of ramdisk would affect scores signifigantly.
LoL. Hipro...you've been pretty damn impartial all these years..why does that change now?:rofl:
XP and 2K3 are virtually equal. RAMDisks etc do not make a significant difference.
This is ONLY when I hear/listen to this: "OPB" nickname and nothing more.....Quote:
Originally Posted by cadaveca
What about the memory management system? Server03 was build for servers, so the memory management should be better than XP's, no?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
True but XP can mimic 2003 memory managment by changing Performance Settings. I still find 2003 to be faster in 32M - even when LSC (Large System Cache) is set on XP.
OPB clearly states pagefile should be 512Mb, maxmem=632.Quote:
Originally Posted by cadaveca
Mimic as in identical or close to the same performance?Quote:
Originally Posted by G H Z
What did opb say? pagefile?:DQuote:
Originally Posted by mrlobber
I haven't applied that yet and already 0.8secs gain :D
Where can i do that :D
right click my computer, select properties, advanced tab, under performance button is pagefile settings.
yes, but do you understand why?Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlobber
No :D I have some ideas but until I don't get the tweak working, I wouldn't like to comment on them.Quote:
Originally Posted by cadaveca
Btw, I should correct myself, OPB said maxmem=600, 632Mb is for the files to be archived :)
ok i will try that tomorow :DQuote:
Originally Posted by cadaveca
I agree with this 100%Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
It will make a difference if your pagefile is on ramdisk, combined with copywaza. If you run superpi from ramdisk, the time it takes to start each iterartion should be less than if the data was sourced from HDD. This effect would be compounded by higher clockspeeds...furhter added to form starting Suerpi, and using copywaza to force the PI data out, and then windows puts it back. This is why you must wait a moment before benching...for windows to "reset" itself.
you can also get some extra time by imaging entire windows install, defragged first, of course, then placing it onto fully formatted drive, and benching from that.
Do some comparisons...I've done everything you mentioned and I'm summing it up into one sentence for you. Take my experience for what its worth.
I will, and I totally accept that you are right. What I don't accept is how this tweak could work. Just trying to look at every angle, I'm not saying you don't know what you're talking about. There's no emotion in this for me at all, just a bit of curiosity. I mean really, that's a real complicated bit of mumbo-jumbo...WTF would someone do that?
Same...I wish I could try it but I can't right now. It seems to me like it has some effect, but its just a variation on copy-waza, one of many variations.
yeah, but if you can get it right, you might end up with nothing but superpi in pagefile, windows vmem cache, and ram. I can understand how this may prove beneficial, and it also could expalin why some iterations are faster than others...it would depend on where windows sourced the data from. There's no waya 32MB run is all gonna come from cpu cache...and it really wouldn't run the same on AMD, for sure.
I do apologize that all these make several friends confused. However, if Elmor can try to pick up my "broken English" and reserch in depth, I don't see why some inteligent overclockers who just try to be picky on my writen English on my own thought whih I did NOT give any permission to anyone posting here and get this huge deabate?
Regardless if this is just a variation or one of many variations of copy waza, you have no RIGHT to critize my work like that. Gautam, you have no idea what did you do. Moreover, by showing that "not so brilliant 3.6g 32m run" , I sincerely suggest you go deep to get some improvement then post later.
Again what massman post here is not even express the whole CDT-IV from my own, that's merely just the quick explanation from the MSN conversation between I and one of my OCX members , Kain, and I thought I could forget that very soon , so I post immediately at coolaler's forum. Also, I have no idea why this post can be post here without having my permission?
Let 's not talking about any tweak or OS, let me invite you for taking this challenge Gautam, would you please match this run? not a competition or so, I am just talking about the raw power of memory subtimings;)
That 's all for now, I appreciate Fugger call me lastnight and being very nice to me. So long everyone.
Thanks for those who always support me.:)
I won't be back here and post until my name is cleared up here in public.:)
http://www.ocxtreme.org/opb/notweak36gspi1m.png
w00t :eek: :eek: :eek:
a) I don't have any hardware on hand.
b) As I've clearly said, I want to see a third party's times, not yours.
OPB, 49500pp at 3600 and with <600MHz DDR2 just isn't possible with Conroe/Kentsfield....heck, it's BARELY possible with DDR3 clocked sky-high.
Not only that, but here's a 48444pp you tried to pass off as the 36GP WR before:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07426/36gpi1mfastest.jpg
That ^^^ is frankly impossible...
This tweak may be worth a few seconds on 32M, which is great...thank you for sharing. However, let's call a spade a spade and acknowledge what scores are impossible at the claimed clocks.
I didn't want to post this but some of the last posts, and the way somebody expressed himself here, I'm gonna get cheeky.
No screenshots and sh1te, wanna clear things up ?
Instructions for a reproducable tweak that shove of those ms for the superpi, not the best product score one, let's take the 8.91s result this time.
5550MHz C2D scoring 8.91s on 1M.
Scores from very good SuperPi benchers at the same frequency are like...hmm
9.11s @ 5548MHz... , 9.09 @ 5552MHz...
Now...a 5914MHz C2D of another well-known bencher ( a very respected one ;) ) scored 8.563s ... a 5728MHz C2D from another well-known bencher scored 8.938s
Give us a tweak that shoves up 200ms on 1M ( by itself ), because all the known tweaks have been used :)
so if you don't have anything on hand, then you better be quiet thenQuote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
as I have clearly said , I want you take the challenge, so I don't care if you have hardware or not, just yes or no you can take that.;)
vapor, there is NONE of your business, so don't even jump up into this , and BTW, don't even show me your lously calculation about that again, I don't think that can be any efficient for upcoming 45nm cpu onto any pi calculation anymore..:)
why your English is so bad I can't even understand what you're talking about then? None of your business either, even fugger gave me respect when he call me, what do you dare to post like that?;)Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchZowner
if you guys keep this attitude, , I am sorry that , I will ask fugger just delete my account, I won't be back to here and say anymore. Sad, this place is still like something discrimination forum huh? very good.hahaha
I don't think that it's too hard to understand what I've posted, looks like "I don't like this question, I'm gonna ignore it" to me ;)
As for the "none of your business part", well if you're going to react like that, why bother posting in here ?
I guess it all comes down to who you'd like to listen & talk to.
As for the last two sentences of your post:
1) Fugger told me that, said so, did so... with all due respect to Charles, this doesn't mean anything.
People respected Bush, does that indicate or even prove that he wasn't/isn't involved into nasty stuff ? Nope.
2) What do I dare to post like that ?
Who am I talking to ? You're not God, are you ?
friendly as always,
BZ
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchZowner
oh I am not god compare with you then, so why bother to listen to you then, I see and read enough for your post just try to stir things worse;)
Penryns already have a known 'good' performance product of roughly 45000. Barcelonas have one at around 70k. K8s have one at like 75k IIRC. Conroe/Kentsfield/DDR2 of just over 50k.Quote:
Originally Posted by Onepagebook
Each processor has a difference performance level, and the performance product is a VERY easy way to describe that.
Anybody cheating is everyone's business. It's unacceptable. The scores you've gotten are just not possible...
No discrimination here...your scores are just not possible. You're not a victim, you're the one who is trying to pass off 'WR' scores that are not possible.
This CDT tweak is good for a few seconds on 32M, it does not 'clear your name' as it still isn't coming close to the performance your scores claim to have.
This is the best I've ever done at 3600MHz Kevin.
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~gautamb/3607_13828.PNG
If you're willing to divulge whatever it is that you're doing leading to such fast times, I, and surely everyone else here are all ears.
edited
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
I think I am done with that. I will let fugger knows that I just could not do as what I and him said which is about what we think the best way to do,
I have been doing my best try to explain and everythiny turns like I am like :banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::b anana: . so ya, I think I am done for that.;)
Okay, as you wish. Is there anything else you'd like to see in this discussion?
did you ask my permission to use that screeny? I mean not post , but you copy the picture and re-upload to your space, is that considered as stealing?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
Kevin thanks for posting.
Everyone else,
Please keep it civil, I want to see this worked out. I have been in orientation for 8 hours today and I cannot think straight atm. I will be home tomorrow to read up as I need to catch up.
Thanks
Certainly Sir, that's what I promise you lastnight, however, not what I would like to say thinkgs beyond my business. I just don't want your great co-admin jump up from nowhere and point the finger to me like that which is lot more different than what we discuss on the phone last night.Quote:
Originally Posted by FUGGER
I highly appreciate that your input here and take care everything.:)
I did not upload/transfer it...member Final1977 has posted exactly that on XS in a thread that's since been removed. He was wondering if it was legit. There was also a ludicrous 32M screenshot in the same post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Onepagebook
Back to my original point....you're not a victim here, for the longest time you've posted screenshots of SuperPi runs that are just not possible. When asked how you did it, or if you can back it up, or ANYTHING like that, you throw a hissy fit (like now).
This CDT tweak is worth a few seconds in 32M, maybe .016s in 1M...it does not 'clear your name' in the slightest since it's frankly not good enough to account for the performance boost required to achieve your 'WR' scores.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
oh then I feel bad for you if you think that;s impossible or whatever. just like why OSU can beat umich...sad, just take the loss;)
sounds like back to 199x year...what did umich said.." there is no possibility that OSU can beat umich, cuz history said so , then don't even think about 3 in a row by same quarterback.." well then what happened? you ARE SO pathetic, buddy;)
Then prove it's possible...that's what we're ALL waiting for. Your scores are so far out of line that it's one of two things: a cheat or a massive tweak. At this point, you have too many scores WAY out of line to be a 'bug.'Quote:
Originally Posted by Onepagebook
FWIW, you have yet to show us a name-clearing massive tweak (CDT is not massive...at all) and it's been a year....that's why everyone is defaulting on you having cheated. Your results, your defense, and your reactions speak volumes about how these scores were achieved.
oh I donn't need to if this is just your own trick to lead me show my tweak, sorry and ya, I forgot to tell you. if people are think they wanna know what and how I have been study in this charming calculation, they will go to OCX and discuss it. because they are sick of the person like you and of course some fanboy-ism here. XS is NOT like ..let say 5 years ago? what's the reason behind this...ROFL:rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
It seems to me that some recent posts in this thread violate forum rules, ie flaming. Can someone please take out the trash? :D
Everyone here should just take a deep breath and stop taking everything so seriously. In OPB's defense, he shared one of his tweaks which benefits him in his SPI runs. They may or may not help everyone, but seemingly it's effective for some. This is a discussion about the validity of this tweak, not a debate regarding OPB's history. If the tweak helps some people here, then great. If it doesn't, then so-be-it. TBH, if it was anybody besides OPB who offered this tweak, people would be applauding the person's attempt rather than criticizing his character.....
BTW, I'm not sure if everyone's aware of this, but OPB owns an RAM EEPROM programmer which allows him to change almost all of the 100+ subtimings which most of us will never see. This could partially explain why some of his runs seem unusually fast for such relaxed primary timings.
Ugh, I'm not trying to trick you Kev. I don't really care what the tweak is, but at this point, it's your last bastion of hope to clear your name....you REALLY should care. At least try to publicly prove your scores are legit...you've managed to talk your way out of backing up your out-of-line scores 100% of the time.
No one at OCX can even come close to replicating your scores either...no one anywhere in the world can. And every time someone challenges your clock-for-clock performance, you do exactly what you're doing now...trying to talk your way out of it with no real effort to truly vindicate yourself.
If you actually do have a tweak that can clear your name, why don't you share it with FUGGER and have him replicate your performance products. Or s7e9h3n (who unfortunately doesn't run Intel :()...or k|ngp|n, or Hipro, or any of Team Japan...or any other legend, one that you feel comfortable with.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
why I don't because you guys see team JP as a Team JP no doubt and whatever they post is priceless, BUT you guys see me as garbage..so that's why I don't want even give a try to post @ here. you see what S7e9h3n try to talk? you just don't get it do you?
no one can achieve? so you think elmor is a cheater as well? what a blind admin here:)
elmor is an extremely skilled bencher who has my highest degree of respect. I do not see how that is relevant.
Team Japan has a couple of virtues on their side...modesty, respectfulness, and a willingness to answer any question that is asked of them as thoroughly as possible.
I got one too....so what?..... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by s7e9h3n
I will not "debate" in this conversation - for the time been - I will only read..... :)
OPB, no one is questioning any plausible results. Team Japan pushes the limits of clockspeed and overall hardware speed and achieves their results with amazing clockspeed and tried-and-true tweaking we've all learned from them.
Yours are beyond implausible, they're impossible. It's nothing about you, it's your scores, your defense, and your reactions.
Speaking of defense and reactions...Gautam has a good point about the way Team Japan conducts themselves. They're extraordinarily helpful and willing to share what they know and have honor in their scores and their hard work. We don't see this from you...plain and simple.
s7e9h3n has a good point...we are off topic, this thread was a thread about a good tweak that you came up with. Though the fact that you came back to XS and in this thread posted "I won't be back here and post until my name is cleared up here in public." and expect CDT-IV to clear your name brought all this up. While it's a good tweak, it's not nearly that good. And only you can clear your name...it doesn't happen on its own.
And no, subtimings will not change SuperPi times nearly enough to compensate for your totally out-of-line scores. Heck, primary timings don't even do THAT much.
elmor has not come close to replicating your 'WR' 1M times/performance products from a year ago, or the 49500 in this thread, or the 48444pp in this thread....no one has. He is a great bencher and deserves our respect, but frankly, he has nothing to do with this. Your scores are really and truly out of line and you're the only one who knows how they happened....
Again, this is an opportunity for you to try to make an effort to prove your scores are legit....
Though I risk getting banned for saying this, but I don't understand one thing. Is it "required" to post how you got a good score to be consider legit? I mean, its his tweak, his score... and common, scores keep falling every other day.
Consider this tweak in question. He came up with it right? No one before that thought of something like this... but he did. Why do we assume he stopped there? And why should he give away his prize tweaks in public when people are flaming him left/right/and center.
I believe, in all entirety, that him posting this tweak proves what he is capable. Forcing him to divulge other tweaks to "clear" his name is just not done. How do you know he doesn't have 10 such tricks which in their own self give around 0.1->0.05s advantage, but when done together by a pro, would give the advantage we see in OPB's score.
OPB, all respect to you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
You're not risking being banned. :cool:
The issue with OPB's scores in particular is that they are statistically inconsistent not only with other scores but also with themselves. By which I mean, it takes others several hundred MHz higher to match him. Such gains are too large too be readily explained by any sort of tweaking. However at the very least we wish to get some sort of confirmation that it is indeed a tweak or a group of tweaks that are responsible...and even that we haven't received yet.
In fact, any request for an explanation is usually met with nothing but flames on OPB's part.
Well benching depends on What you can make your hardware run.
Lets take a theory, I make ALL my hardware run at the same speeds as KINC or Hipro5. My Scores just cant mach theirs.
I suck at benching, But when you acheave the same speeds other people or even Kinc and Hipr05 will help you.
they migth not give you ALL the tweaks, but at somepoint they will get feed up with being faster than you just because of a tweak..
Ergo if you are faster because of a secret tweak it migth as well be cheating.
We all know it is possible to cheat. and alot has been busted cheating.
But it is not cheating, it is just a tweak yes :)?
I dont think so, but I would be borred if I was the fastest in the world, NOT because of my skill with benching and geeting my hardware to run the fastest. But because of a tweak :(
These scores are very out-of-line. That is a fact...Quote:
Originally Posted by KiD0M4N
When a score is so, SO far out of line...on a benchmark that SO many people run and get extremely predictable scores based on hardware settings...it raises a few serious questions. The fact that this is OPB means that the scores weren't immediately dismissed. Almost anybody else, and they would have been immediately dismissed and blackballed from the community. We gave OPB his time.
In fact, it's been a year.
In fact, he never once even made claim that his scores were so great clock-for-clock, perhaps not realizing it. Even now, calling the performance product lousy, it doesn't instill confidence that he understands what the performance product can mathematically show about a score. It shows that his scores are great. So great that no one else has come within a mile of achieving them.
Let's repeat this: his scores are seriously out-of-line with ALL existing scores. No scores that are so far above what others have done can be accepted at face value, that'd be a disservice to the OC community. Regardless of who achieves them.
Not only have we not learned of a tweak (even after a year) that can come close to giving this kind of performance, we haven't even gotten a hint of one. We've gotten nothing but hissy fits, topic changes, and flames from OPB when asked for an explanation.
In all respect, KiD0M4N, but this CDT-IV tweak is nowhere near effective enough to account for but a small fraction of OPB's performance advantage. This tweak is worth maybe 10-15MHz over a well-tweaked system and his performance is hundreds of MHz ahead. This is not something we can just 'accept.'
Hi Gautam,Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
Thats cool to know :D
I agree, some sort of nod or acknowledgment from OPB's side that these are indeed tweaks (hardware software, etc) which gives him the advantage would make everyone a lot more comfortable. I agree, statistically, his "performance level" falls higher (in the opposite sense) than others... but thats how the rule of percentile works right? The top rankers in any IQ test are usually a grade above the rest of the crowd. That kind of a high score doesn't make their score invalid... just that they are better at what they do (in this case Spi benching) that the rest of the people.
Also, consider that FUGGER wants this matter cleared up... he must be convinced there is truth in OPB and therefore he still converses with him and tries to get him back on the forum. I am sure he didn't want to invite him to continue the flaming.
Also sometimes I see a slight bias here... the tone of some people suggests that they simply cannot digest that OPB can get such good scores... they will say anything, go to any extent to discredit him just for the heck of it.
All said and done, :shocked: :eek: at 13.4 from < 3.6GHZ!!!!! Best I have done is a 13.89s with 3-3-2 timings on 975x on a 4MB C2D!
if you can understand this, I don't see why I can't, if I am a cheater with high definition..lol, would not I can't cheat with more skillful or even cheat it closer and cheat it more legit in the range of Vapor's stupid formula? so I can let the score inside of the legit range and I got WR as well;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Gautam
so that's why I said the whole thing is being set up;) wake up people;)
oh I remember about somethinglike when barry Bonds or Jordan...(of course I am NOT comparing I am like them, I am not a smart guy , far more than that) achieve some amazing milestone, they always were doubt if they take any drug..oh ya, now I understand... and is there anyone can even touch them, nope.
Having
means nothing. It can't get memory chips work better than they can.Quote:
RAM EEPROM programmer
I have programmer too, EVERYBODY in this thread and XS in general can assemble it at home, it need only 5-7 cheapo parts :)
http://tin.topmods.net/spdprog.jpg - Mine one, with DDR1 connector, but this is no matter, SPD chips are equal, in DDR1 and DDR2 and DDR3.
ON TOPIC......Has anyone else tested the "tweak" of this thread yet?... :)
After some testing of yours, I will give you a tweak that it'll produse better resaults on your machines.....BUT don't expect to be out of "limits/line".... ;)
I agree, if score were accepted on face value, then people would start getting away with a lot. However, where do we draw the line? Imagine if people started bantering all of kingpin's threads saying that "dude, this score isn't legit! show me how you did this, or else, you suckz!" Why should kingpin take this bum rap, he will cleanly show the door to the fellow.
I am sure I am not even aware of 1% of all that has happened over the year with OPB because I am sure a hell lot must hv gone down in XIP forums before this thread was allowed in public (just a wild guess.)
@Nosfer@tu: Again, we need to draw a line on whats a tweak... and whats a cheat. It is not something you can judge by following a rule book, but rather by conscience. Is it something you can do openly infront of others? Is it something someone can discover given the time and effort? Thats clean by my book.
Ok, I know I am totally n00b in this, how do you categorize the LOD tweak in 3d benchmarks? It makes the GFX look like :banana::banana::banana::banana: right, but gives good scores at the same time. (Please correct me if I am wrong.) Isn't that cheating? Well again I consider it a tweak because everyone can do it and optimize it given time and effort.
Coding a small background to fudge with the system timer to get lower scores etc, well thats BLATANT cheating.
Remember, just like the different shades of gray, the extent of a tweak->cheat is very blurred.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor