yup sorry my misstake :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by zakelwe
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yup sorry my misstake :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by zakelwe
Nothing to it!Quote:
Originally Posted by mongoled
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackX
Yes, It holds the 05 record now, But when Conroe hits, there is a good chance conroe will take it. but then again, It should, and it better, with all this hype.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arisythila
Did you miss that reply?Quote:
Originally Posted by zakelwe
They've been doing it all the time. Protected mode = total haX0rs. MMX for Pentiums = Many Many haXs. P2 with 512KB cache was like total unfair and total cheating.. And dont even get started about SSE - aka, Super Secret Ellusion. And my computer was totally bombed by crackers and spyware because of P4 Hyper Trickery. Its like super concentrated, wont play fair and wait for the competition cheating.Quote:
Originally Posted by Durzel
I LOVE this quote:
" Yes Xtreme Systems is about Extremes but Extremely Stupid is not one the Extremes."
Well not THAT much. Afterall, Prescotts 2MB barely helped over P4E's 1MB. I think a lot more PentiumM/Conre performance advantage is the low latency of their L2 cache designs. Also remember that Athlons use an a different, "exclusive" system which has its tradeoffs.Quote:
Originally Posted by arisythila
PS: why is 64 bit more e-penis.. cant it be more e-vagina? Isn't this 21st century, the politically correct century?
Conroe is only a processor. Your gonna be able to run your computer a little bit faster. Ya!? Everyone is so personal here, and everyone is fighting about a processor. Free the people! Please don't hate me. :-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mongoled
Last time I checked the Conroe is based on the Dothan (So is the Yonah). Dothan is based on a PIII. With the exception of the new Cache technology which is also used on the Yonah (Correct me if I am wrong), and a few other things. The Conroe is refined old tech....
Alex
Oh, that's where you're so wrong. We bow to the powa!Quote:
Originally Posted by andyisc00l
:worship::worship: ...CONROE...
:worship::worship::worship:
Be careful. :flame:
That is kind of an over simplification. The new CORE microarchitechture involved a redisign of over 80% of the surface of the die. They used many ideas similar to what existed in P3/Dothan, but there are tons of new ideas as well. I'll list some below:Quote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
Here I will try to present some of the differences between CORE and previous architectures (in particular, the Core Duo, Intel's most current architecture you can buy today).
Conroe features a large 4MB cache, which is a first in consumer x86 products. This cache also has ultra-fine-grained power control, and an intelligent sharing mechanism between the two cores (in fact on some motherboards you will see that you can turn off one of the cores and dedicate the entire 4MB to one core, for more stablity in ultra high overclocks for single threaded apps. I can't provide proof for this statement yet, but you'll just have to wait and see if I'm right). That power control and sharing mechanism is not a walk in the park to design, and while many of the principles are present in Core Duo, this was a complete redesign with more aggressive power saving algorithms and more sensors and much more fine grained control, meaning smaller sections of the cache can be turned off more frequently.
Conroe also features memory disambiguation which allows most Loads to be speculatively executed before Stores. This is a HUGE benefit for some workloads. This is also not present in Core Duo.
Conroe has a 4-issue core, which means that 4 (or in some cases 5, see below) instructions are simultaneously pulled from the instruction cache and fed through the pipeline. Core Duo (and every other x86 product on the market) is 3-issue.
Conroe has macro and micro-ops fusion which allows certain combinations of x86 ops to be combined into one as they are pulled from the instruction cache. Macro-fusion allows the chip to save energy and have higher bandwidth, particularly during popular CMP-JMP operation pairs (if/then or switch statements in most programming languages decode into these instructions). It saves energy because it can literally do the same work with less physical transistor switching as the fused instruction moves through the pipeline. Core Duo only has micro-fusion.
Conroe has a completely redesigned 128-bit wide SSE engine that completes all SSE ops in 1 cycle. Core Duo has nothing close to this, in fact nothing on the market has anything close to this.
Conroe is 64-bit, Core Duo is 32-bit.
The SSE units also weren't the only thing expanded. The FPUs were also widened to 128-bit from 64-bit in Yonah, but since the FPUs share some of their resources with the SSE units the two are interrelated. The ALUs have also been widened to 64-bit from 32-bit which should provide a performance boost in integer operations as well.
Other improvements include increases in L1-L2 transfer bandwidth and the near tripling of bandwidth between the L1 cache and the rest of the core. A lot of that has to do with the widening of the internal data paths from 64-bits in Yonah to 128-bits in Core.
Other minor details include SSE4 support, although Intel may be looking to come up with a new marketing name. Related to the 4-wide issue rate is that all the buffers have been widened to handle the increase. The number of ports has also increased from 6 from 5 in Yonah to better organize the additional execution units and the division of capabilities (Vshuffle, etc.) for each execution unit has also changed somewhat to avoid conflicts. The instruction fetch size has also increased from 128-bit to 160-bit (possibly higher) in order to feed the 4 decoders.
Thats just the Cache as I mentioned and a few other things....
Alex
Lol that "few other things" is years of work by a large design team and 1000s of fab technicians.
If you think it is so easy... go ahead and produce a spec doc for memory disambiguation, tune your prefetch logic for a 4MB L2 13 cycle latency cache, create a 128bit wide SSE engine, make sure it plays nice with your new macro=op fusion and Vshuffle instruction buffer. Oh yeah also make sure your entire pipeline has no limitations to allow 64-bit top work properly. Redesign your FPUs to efficient compute 128-bit packed vactor ops, but remember micro-fusion still has to work.
Etc... etc... it is not just a few things....
Dude.... As I stated before its based on old tech that has been refined. Are you a computer/electrical engineer?
Alex
Indeed,Those 'few other things' are important when it comes to performance.
We have seen only high light changes like Macro-ops fusion,SSE engine,SSE4. There might be more small but still unknown changes to the 'core' (C,W,M) compared to yonah.Im still waiting to see it all.
In other perspective all proc's today are refined versions of 8086 (or even 4004)!
Its like a car engine. Its old tech that gets refined every other year or so making them faster and better.....
Alex
Who really cares what some noob at [H]ardforum posted.
So today we have a relatively low revving two cylinder engine (more torquey and not to mention , powerful) instead of very high revving single cylinder which had much chance for a blow up :p:
sorry for the slight offtopic'ness
Dont forget about the fuel consuption is much less now....
Alex
well in one sense you are right. Afterall, a P4 is just based on old tech of 386. You ofcourse totally agree this statement is similar to the one you made.Quote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
But, if trying to argue that Yonah and Conroe are completely different, its best to try to get someone to point out some similarities. If its that both support x86, then so does 386. If its that both support SSE, then so does AthlonXP. Short pipeline.. hmm, PowerPC 970 has similar length pipeline (and its totally different ISA).
well yes, aren't you too?Quote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
(EDIT: Although I did some courses in the field of solid state physics a long while ago, I dont actually work in the field of ASIC design, so my understanding is rudementary at best.. ie dont treat my opinions as definitive facts of an expert)
Yes I am, and I understand the design process for these products, but that is really besides the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
The point I'm trying to make is simply referring to Conroe as "Yonah with a larger cache" is insulting the the hundreds of people who did from-the-ground-up design work and came up with novel ideas that were incorporated into this product.
By your logic, the Athlon is just a refined 386 with a memory controller and more cache. That would be insulting to the AMD design team that came up with that great microarchitecture.
Hehe, yeah amen. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
amenQuote:
Originally Posted by iterations
dont forget all "teH b0Ss" abuse they suffer too.
huh ?
My point is that Intel saw how well Dothan worked with its 2MB cache and they decided to go with that. Its not simply a larger CACHE, its new cache technology as I stated. The core is a more refined Yonah core......Almost all the new tech went to the cache, with few to the actual core.....
Alex
Hay guys I think Conroe is a great core.
[H] has a very nice forum . This guy is way off base no big deal. Amd still has a very good core right . No its not Conroe but its still a good cpu.
Most the guys @ [H] are very reasonable and talk mostly with good common sense. Their not like the guys hear thats for sure but neither am I but I enjoy the reading hear. I very much enjoy O/C but I am not an extreme O/C I like the best possiable stable O/C on water.
I just thought I would add my 2 cents because [H] has a very nice forum and most the guys are really great . AMD and Intel users. Its just not right to label the whole forum because of this guy that can't except the trueth.
Now ATF is very much a forum full of pimple faced fan-boys. Not all but 90% which makes it the most bias forum on the web. Duvie has to be the biggest joke I ever read. He can beat Fugger any day any time according to his post LOL LOL LOL
i dont like fanboys
Almost everything is refined old tech. It's technological evolution.Quote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
It's progress as usual but every now and then there's an evolutionary leap ahead ;)
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Originally Posted by Absolute_0
I just dont like when individuals say ITS "NEW" TECH. Saying that its something never seen before.... Yeah the Cache is totally new, well for the most part, its size is due the smaller proccess allowing it to fit in the chip. Gotta love NANOTECHNOLOGY.....
Alex
Even if they were exactly the same, you can't argue with the end result, and that's Conroe is about 40% faster than Yonah. 80% of it is new LOL!Quote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
40% faster than yonah clock for clock???
$BangForThe$
hehehe! Good to hear from ya'!Quote:
Originally Posted by Turtle 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by crackhead2k
I agree. and till now, there is no AMD CPU could be mentioned in the same breath with Conroe. Conroe is not only much faster at the same frequency but also its highest overclocking is doesn't lose AMD's...... AMD has got a biiiiig trouble
PS:sorry for the grammar mistakes if there is any, i am not a native speaker.:p:
The Cache is new and thats all ???Quote:
Originally Posted by AgonxOC
4 and sometimes 5 issue/ SSE4 / SSE 128 bits excute in one cycle:clap:
I used to be a AMD FAN BOY
BUT NOW IM A INTEL FAN BOY HAHAHAHAHLOL
AMD better get their act togeather by FEB 2007 . Intel will be riding the wave of all the overclocking community
Hey fellas,
when we'll have 45nm conroe/core microprocessors,q2 '07?
and fanboyism is allright,but control your emotions :p: (i was remembering something that happened in some other forum recently ;) )
Please relate . Tell the story . I good laugh is a good laugh.Quote:
Originally Posted by leomax
Quote:
Originally Posted by crackhead2k
My FX60 X2 was be beaten to death by the 3.73EE 65nm chips.
So I switched back to intel. And got the conroe ready board.
I don't care which chip I use.....I just want the fast one for that month:D
Intel & AMD are making great chips......most of them are faster then we will ever need.
sad thing is, the kid obviously believes in what he is writing about, but to ever be taken seriously, he needs to learn how to spell........i would not believe anything he said based solely on his horrible spelling, i don't trust a person who cannot spell simple words like that....Quote:
Originally Posted by crackhead2k
ROFL
**adds to thesaurus the following words**
impressave
experamenting, experementing
molment
afrade
Usouly
nomatter
desine
verious
tollarances
transfure
cus
sertent
reasearch
modal
pritty
arn't
useing
distroy
consittering
hateing
advancment
controlers
'puts the wool'
:rolleyes:
^^The link is in the above post :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Turtle 1