Japan quakes

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Originally Posted by miahallen

Thanks Mark :)

Thanks again everyone for your prayers, I went and got my wife today, so we're all back together, safe and sound :up:

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Good to hear Mia :)

A vulcano has become active in Japan as well... Just hit the news. So sickening what these people have to endure. My prayers are with them.

Source: http://theextinctionprotocol.wordpre...ent-explosion/

1. earthquake
2. tsunami
3. nuclear accident
4. volcanic outburst ???

what´s next - gozilla??? :D

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Originally Posted by josh1980

I'll try to fill you guys in on some info since I work at a nuclear plant...

In the event of an emergency the containment building is meant to keep all the bad radiation inside. So far it looks like the building is still intact, which is great news. backup diesel generators onsite are supposed to power giant pumps that can pump water into the reactor from various sources. These sources are a bunch of tanks, the ocean, and the reactor itself. Once enough water has been pumped into the reactor then the system is realigned to provide a cooling path. Water is pumped out of the reactor, cooled, then pumped back in. If the reactor vessel were to crack, or something else happened that prevents the reactor from holding water inside it, then the plant is designed such that water is pumped into the reactor and comes out wherever the hole is. Then the containment building will start to fill with water. Once the containment building is filled completely then water is pumped from inside the containment building back into the reactor.

The key to preventing reactor damage is keeping water inside the core. As long as you can keep water in the core there will be no damage. This is a key characteristic of all nuclear power plants.

Currently, it sounds like there is no pure water available, so seawater is being pumped into the reactor. It isn't clear whether water is leaking out somewhere or just being vented. But the fact that water is being pumped into the reactor is the best news you could hear. It means that the amount of core damage is now under control. In the end, it looks like the worst is already over and all that is left is going to be keeping the pumps running until the reactor is completely cool(could be weeks or months) and then cleaning up the mess.

There's alot of sensationalism going on in the news. It's incredibly difficult to get any kinds of facts or solid numbers to figure out how bad it is. Honestly, if I lived close to the plant I wouldn't want to be there right now(mostly because there's so little data as to what is actually going on), but I'm convinced that in a few weeks it won't be as dire as the media says it is.

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thanks!
the water was all gone since it avaporated, as it couldnt be cooled, and then was vented into the air or escaped when the pressure tank blew, which is what tore the roof off, right?
so now they use sea water to cool the reactor which is good, but what happens to the sea water? how do they cool it? or is it just evaporating and escaping just as the original cooling water did? :confused:
sure you dont know, but im curious what your thoughts are...

and yeah i think this is way overhyped by the media...

what do you think about the monitoring stations around the plant picking up massive radiation and detecting radioactive caesium and iodine? doesnt that mean the core has at least a minor leak? how else could those have escaped into the environment? through the cooling system??

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Originally Posted by saaya

so now they use sea water to cool the reactor which is good, but what happens to the sea water? how do they cool it? or is it just evaporating and escaping just as the original cooling water did? :confused:
sure you dont know, but im curious what your thoughts are...

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Well, if the loops can't be completed then I guess that the vapor simply goes away...

Just had a Japanese friend check in.

He's ok (lives just NE of Tokyo) but he has family up near the north east coast and no news on them :(

He says it's a warzone up there.

Stay strong all you guys who are affected by this and survived... the days ahead are going to be very hard.

Best wishes from the UK.

Biker.

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Originally Posted by saaya

thanks!
the water was all gone since it avaporated, as it couldnt be cooled, and then was vented into the air or escaped when the pressure tank blew, which is what tore the roof off, right?
so now they use sea water to cool the reactor which is good, but what happens to the sea water? how do they cool it? or is it just evaporating and escaping just as the original cooling water did? :confused:
sure you dont know, but im curious what your thoughts are...

and yeah i think this is way overhyped by the media...

what do you think about the monitoring stations around the plant picking up massive radiation and detecting radioactive caesium and iodine? doesnt that mean the core has at least a minor leak? how else could those have escaped into the environment? through the cooling system??

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the seawater containing bor acid (which is only used when u actually want to stop a meltdown) will evapor into the air. there is no way to fill it into a closed cooling cycle, also there should be no reason to do so, if the cooling cycle is still closed. so we have to expect the core to be open.
i don´t think that media is overhyping this at all. think of tschernobyl 25yrs ago. michail gorbatschow was informed of the meltdown by sweden, not his own people.

Toughts and prayers to everyone in Japan and for those that have families there . Be strong and don't give up .

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by saaya

thanks!
the water was all gone since it avaporated, as it couldnt be cooled, and then was vented into the air or escaped when the pressure tank blew, which is what tore the roof off, right?

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The heat of the nuclear reaction caused the creation of hydrogen und that's what exploded. Knallgas, kennste doch noch aus der Schule :p

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Originally Posted by josh1980

I'll try to fill you guys in on some info since I work at a nuclear plant...

In the event of an emergency the containment building is meant to keep all the bad radiation inside. So far it looks like the building is still intact, which is great news. backup diesel generators onsite are supposed to power giant pumps that can pump water into the reactor from various sources. These sources are a bunch of tanks, the ocean, and the reactor itself. Once enough water has been pumped into the reactor then the system is realigned to provide a cooling path. Water is pumped out of the reactor, cooled, then pumped back in. If the reactor vessel were to crack, or something else happened that prevents the reactor from holding water inside it, then the plant is designed such that water is pumped into the reactor and comes out wherever the hole is. Then the containment building will start to fill with water. Once the containment building is filled completely then water is pumped from inside the containment building back into the reactor.

The key to preventing reactor damage is keeping water inside the core. As long as you can keep water in the core there will be no damage. This is a key characteristic of all nuclear power plants.

Currently, it sounds like there is no pure water available, so seawater is being pumped into the reactor. It isn't clear whether water is leaking out somewhere or just being vented. But the fact that water is being pumped into the reactor is the best news you could hear. It means that the amount of core damage is now under control. In the end, it looks like the worst is already over and all that is left is going to be keeping the pumps running until the reactor is completely cool(could be weeks or months) and then cleaning up the mess.

There's alot of sensationalism going on in the news. It's incredibly difficult to get any kinds of facts or solid numbers to figure out how bad it is. Honestly, if I lived close to the plant I wouldn't want to be there right now(mostly because there's so little data as to what is actually going on), but I'm convinced that in a few weeks it won't be as dire as the media says it is.

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Thanks for the information, josh, really appreciate it! :up:

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Originally Posted by fellix_bg

Japan ground cracking open and moving, water pours out

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Woah, scary stuff :eek:

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Originally Posted by miahallen

Thanks Mark :)

Thanks again everyone for your prayers, I went and got my wife today, so we're all back together, safe and sound :up:

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Glad to hear you're all right! :)

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Originally Posted by josh1980

Edit:

One other thing i'd like to say...

The people at the plants are literally heroes. They're working hard despite possibly not knowing if their families are still alive, their homes are still there, etc. I'm sure some of them are grieving for lost ones and yet still expected to perform their job. Imagine the kind of stress on their shoulders right now. On top of that they're being exposed to large doses of radiation. It is possible that some of them may be exposed to lethal doses of radiation to protect the general public. Pray for the workers that may be sacrificing themselves.

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:up::up::up::up::up:

guys check out the before and after photos here
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2...sunami.html?hp

devastating :(

Here's some other pics too http://www.abc.net.au/news/events/ja...eforeafter.htm

Sick to see whole villages gone. :s

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Originally Posted by RPGWiZaRD

Here's some other pics too http://www.abc.net.au/news/events/ja...eforeafter.htm

Sick to see whole villages gone. :s

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It is... I keep getting myself worked up about the villages and farms levelled and thinking about the people @ the fukushima plant... Do they have families/houses to go back to after battling the disaster? Or their lives have been levelled too?

Is bloody awful really... I try to keep sombre thoughts at bay and have hopeful and positive thoughts instead, but they creep back in... :(

Been keeping tabs on the reactor situation that the Japanese have been handling. Sounds to me like they're doing everything correct to keep the cores in check. Better to release some radioactive steam and save the core than suffer a catastrophic core meltdown. Or two as it seems to be :(

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Originally Posted by saaya

thanks!
the water was all gone since it avaporated, as it couldnt be cooled, and then was vented into the air or escaped when the pressure tank blew, which is what tore the roof off, right?
so now they use sea water to cool the reactor which is good, but what happens to the sea water? how do they cool it? or is it just evaporating and escaping just as the original cooling water did? :confused:
sure you dont know, but im curious what your thoughts are...

and yeah i think this is way overhyped by the media...

what do you think about the monitoring stations around the plant picking up massive radiation and detecting radioactive caesium and iodine? doesnt that mean the core has at least a minor leak? how else could those have escaped into the environment? through the cooling system??

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All cooling systems have failed. The tsunami destroyed the backup diesel generators that would circulate the cooling loops that exchange heat with the water in direct contact with the core. The battery backups were drained I believe early Saturday morning to prevent a meltdown of the cladding that contains the pellets of uranium oxide.

They've been venting steam to reduce pressures within the pressure vessel of the reactor. They began adding dirty sea water when they had vented off enough distilled water that the fuel rods were being exposed. The exposed rods, without any cooling from the surrounding water, would reach temperatures capable of melting the cladding due to residual fission reactions from the radioactive byproducts from uranium fission.

My understanding is at this point they are cooling the few MW of residual heat and cooling the core. The explosion that occurred earlier was due water disassociating into hydrogen and oxygen at high temperatures within the core. Rumor is the operators were venting the core steam into the building in an attempt to let any of the short-lived isotopes to stabilize. The biggest concern is if any fuel rods melted you could end up with cesium and iodine particles in the steam.

I wouldn't go grab a beer near the reactor but this thing won't blow up.

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Originally Posted by MadDias

the seawater containing bor acid (which is only used when u actually want to stop a meltdown) will evapor into the air. there is no way to fill it into a closed cooling cycle, also there should be no reason to do so, if the cooling cycle is still closed. so we have to expect the core to be open.
i don´t think that media is overhyping this at all. think of tschernobyl 25yrs ago. michail gorbatschow was informed of the meltdown by sweden, not his own people.

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Chernobyl was a catastrophic screw up by an inexperienced crew on an unstable reactor design. My understanding is that at Chernobyl the operators were attempting a test to see if the plant could sustain a complete power failure to the cooling systems and survive the gap between power failure and the emergency generators coming online. Long story short they removed all the neutron moderation rods, water flashed to steam as the core temperature spiked, the water, now being steam, was no longer absorbing neutrons which caused the core to spike even further. This massive spike in temperatures caused the water residing in the core to flash to steam and literally blew the lid off the structure. This wouldn't have happened if they hadn't removed all the moderation rods in an attempt to ramp up heat production..

The best comparison I've heard of is the Japanese meltdow is basically a Three Mile Island situation. Partial but contained meltdown with the release of some short lived radioactive gas/steam. The core is shutdown and they are just dealing with residual heat. They aren't dealing with a gigantic core spiking in thermal output.

edit: I should note that all of this is just from my casual research of the current situation and nuclear power design in general. I have zero formal education on nuclear power but I sometimes wish I did :D

When it first happened and the reported number of dead was around 40, i was relieved and thought that that was it.. Now it could be thousands and whole villages have been wiped out. Hopefully the nuclear plant's situation will not worsen because then the devastation will reach a different scale, if thats possible.

As long as the main radioactive elements remain in the enclosure, the situation shouldn't be that bad.

Chernobyl as most of Russias nuclear reactors were actually producing "material" for bombs, the power production was just a by-product.

Thats why the meltdown and radioactive waste were on the level they were. The Japanese reactors are way-way cleaner.

Earthquake --> Tsunami --> Nuclear Disaster --> Volcanic Activity = OMG how unlucky can you get!!! Sympathies to Japan and it's occupants from myself and everyone at NRNL.

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Originally Posted by SabreWulf69

Earthquake --> Tsunami --> Nuclear Disaster --> Volcanic Activity = OMG how unlucky can you get!!! Sympathies to Japan and it's occupants from myself and everyone at NRNL.

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+1 only disaster left is if North Korea's Kim Jong ill invades

New footage of moment tsunami hit

Like a living nightmare!

That's wierd, I was told a completely diff story about Chernobyl.
What I was told when I was young is they were scheduled to shut down the reactor, then got a phone call to keep it running (being greedy), so they lowered the rod back in place and it got stuck mid way and within min's it went critical.

Anyways there was supposedly an eruption at Hawaii's Kilauea a few days ago.
Which isn't out of the ordinary.
I mentioned this a day or 2 ago that I thought it might happen because of the recent earthquake activity.

I haven't looked at the maps in a long time now.
Can't see them now, the only thing I can do is look up on the list, seems the us has been become a bit more active in earthquakes but nothing major.
Hopefully we don't see any more volcano's start up...

Anyways I heard it could take up to a year to get power restored to the rest of japan.

As a side note, alot of people seem to think it's funny what's happening in japan.
:(
It's not not gonna help the usa economy just because a richer country then us is having a hard time people's...

Stay strong and survive. Toughts and prayers to everyone in Japan.

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Originally Posted by NEOAethyr

As a side note, alot of people seem to think it's funny what's happening in japan.
:(

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Humour is a well known mechanism to cope with situations that are just too awful to assimilate.

However that doesn't make it funny.

Hope I'm making sense here.

However, I don't know if this is what you're talking about or you mean that some people find this disaster funny in the sense of "hilarious and entertaining"...

Japans greatest tragedy since WWII. Despite being one of the most advanced countries the world it's still utterly powerless facing natures fury :(

Here's a good article that explains the current status of the reactors and various possibilities of what the future could hold.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...,3403230.story

@Gomeler- Your explanation for chernobyl is pretty accurate. Good enough for those not in the industry looking for the simple explanation. You are also correct that the issues in Japan more closely resemble 3 mile island than Chernobyl.