sediment may be building up and at a point where it can drop out of the flow of the loop, once the flow stops, the sediment settles, then when the pump is turned back on, it is stirred up, might be stuff in RAD becuase I don't think rads can be completely cleaned unless you open it up. just a guess
I'm also lost on why this is happening. The only logical explanation i can find is that it is rad dirt.
But radical tested without the rad in the loop and it did the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeBar
Right. I really tried many different parts, all with the same result. I guess I should definitely get some different water, just to see if it makes a difference.
I know quite a few ppl that experienced the same thing and used different water. Mystery remains...
Well... I won't just accept it "as is" :D At least I can see that it doesn't occur that bad if I use some citrus acid and leave the loop running :)
Any results?Quote:
Originally Posted by Radical_53
Nothing satisfying at this point. I'll keep you posted if I find something out.
When cleaning the rad, would it be OK to do step one and two with normal spring water, except for the last time? Like, first flush with spring water, then do step 2 with spring water, then step 3 and 4, then step 2 with spring water, then step 4 then step 2 with distilled water? I don't have distilled water right now and i don't have the time to go to town AND do this thing.
Btw: Really love the PA120.2 :love:
some of us used tap water for the first few flushes...
then its vinegar for rad / ketchup for copper waterblock cleaning...
then rinse with distilled...
generally repeat vinegar soaking and distilled rinsing a few times...
then install loop.
Interestingly, I've been curious about the cloudy tubing issue as well... which is why I've had sections of Masterkleer soaking in distilled water, 10% Pentosin G11, 10% Pentosin G12, and 10% Swiftech Hydrx for about a month now.
Last I checked (which was likely two weeks ago), the tubing in the distilled water had clouded very badly, the tubing in the G11 seemed to be alright, the tubing in the G12 also seemed alright (except that it had been stained bright pink...and had become UV reactive), and the tubing in the Hydrx was getting pretty cloudy and "dirty" looking.
I'll likely redo the test in a more controlled manner (with a larger variety of additives) and post pics once I have the time.
Nice results! Still I'm curious why the tubing would stain and cloud with plain distilled water... technically, that seems really weird to me.
I just bought a bottle of distilled water in drugstore. now i'm waiting for new transparent tubing arrive! and then will see if tubes get cloudy using farmacy water too!
I still think that distilled water for car accumulators and home usage is not 100% h2o, thats why tubes and barbs become calcareous like kettle.
Alex, what container do you use to soak test tubing? covered i hope....
i would like to recommend testing with some diff tubing,tygon, primo & clearflex etc, it would be interesting to know if other tubing will have the same issues...
after running loop (masterkleer tubing) for a few days with distilled water, i had similar experience of cloudy tubing, maybe needs some solution to help maintain clearness...
@skaktuss: That'd be my guess to. Also, I'm not too sure how the plastic canister meant contaminate the water. UV light from the sun, softeners inside the plastic and so on.
I'd prefer to get distilled water from a pharmacy in a dark glass bottle, but I guess I don't want to know what that might cost.
@septim: I'd have to look if I still have some old pictures of my smaller Tygon tubes. They got dirty looking with water + WW too, and got cloudy after a time without WW. I'm still not sure if it's just the tubing itself. If so, there must be something to prevent it (maybe flushing it with fluid X, something to take the stuff out that let's them get cloudy).
I'm not a chemist, so this is kinda trial and error... only thing I know is that there has to be a way to get clear and flexible tubing and make it stay that way.
A few months back I rebuilt my loop. I cleaned all parts very carefully and used distilled water with less than 5% Zerex + a 60 micron filter for about a week, but the tubing still got cloudy. Maybe it's just an illusion but the plexi in my res and DDC tops didn't look as cloudy as the tubing, I wonder why?
The computer did get a lot of sun light so I'm trying to remove this factor this time around. I'm using black R3400 tygon outside the case and no case window.
Well, if you use R3400 you don't have to bother about clouding :D The plex on my rigs got cloudy too btw. It is cleanable, but really hard to rub off. I don't honestly have a clue.
Someone fit in chemistry? Is there any quick test thingy (like the things you give to kids as a toy) to check what kind of substance this dirt consists of?
andersson, sunlight cant make tubes chalky white! it can be caused by saline dilutions like calcium carbonate.
I wonder if buyin' "cheap" distilled water has a bearing. That's what I've been using. I had some alea not long ago. Got rid of it. Flushed the loop pretty good.but didn't really seriously clean it. (Temps are still very nice) Still the tubes seemed to clear up for a time. But now the tygon is cloudy again. (I turn the rig off once inna' while)
To get a good analysis of whats in the tube scum you would probably need something like mass spectrometry.Quote:
Originally Posted by Radical_53
My theory is this:
Since distilled water is devoid of pretty anything but H20...now things like to be in equilibrium. For example hot or cold water will eventually get to room temperature cause again things like to be in equilibrium. Since tubings are kinda slightly porous, the water will draw out whatever free moving chemicals there is in the composition of the tubing to make itself closer to the property of the tubing. Perhaps thru osmosis? Since hte mixture is mechanical between the water and tubing substance, it will settle out of the water if water isn't flowing or flows intermittently. I would say the "purer" the water, the cloudier the tubing will get.
P.S. don't mind me I got a C- in both physics and chem, that's why I'm an accountant.
another theory to add to your list Situman is that the usual container of Distilled water bought in the stores or where ever is plastic which may or may not be 100% free of contaminants or what nots...
I've a lot of questions on the pre-install procedure. I'm just not too keen on cracking open my brand new Storm or Maze4's if I absolutely don't have to.
1. Wouldn't taking apart the waterblocks void the warranty, or is that not important? What if it was defective/leaked before testing?
2. Wouldn't it suffice to simply clean the blocks, like the radiator, without having to take them apart?
3. If we decide to take a waterblock apart, don't you have to replace the o-ring and barbs upon re-assembly?
4. Are the more reputable Swiftech and Danger Den waterblocks Q&A really that bad?
I will answer those questions.
1. No, it doesn't void your warranty. Blocks like the Storm are held together with screws. You can take the block apart and put it back together as many times as you want. There is no way to detect if a block as been opened.
2. No, it will not suffice. You must take the blocks apart and clean each part separately. The entire base (copper) should be placed in a vinegar bath for 8-24 hours to get really clean. You just can't clean it w/o taking it apart.
3. No. You can reuse the O-rings as many times as you want. Like I wrote earlier, the block can be disassembled and reassembled as many times as you please. Keep the O-rings.
4. I don't know. When I got my MCW60, I immediately took it apart and washed it, soaked base in copper, before I ever put it in my loop. Also, after 1 year, it's wise to clean the Storm because it can be clogged easily resulting in worse temps. I ran a loop with DI water and some dye and after 5 months, the cups were heavily clogged and the block just FILTHY. It's part of maintaining your W/C system. Once a year isn't too much to ask for.
Bottom line, open up and clean your blocks. Better temps, no nasty filth in your water and it's always nice to see what your wbs are made of. Anyone can do it. Even 2 yr olds can work a screwdriver.
Thanks for answering thunderstruck.
Maze4 GPU blocks have "warranty void if opened" stickers on them. :confused:
So should I replace the plastic barbs that come with the Storm with the more durable nickel plated barbs, or is it not necessary to take that part of the block apart for yearly maintenance?
Looks like I'm going to have fun taking my loop apart and do a proper pre-install. :slapass: