...i guess the LS will be available in the future in black as well?
if not...then it wont match many users black alu cases...
:p
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...i guess the LS will be available in the future in black as well?
if not...then it wont match many users black alu cases...
:p
I did say for us poor Aussie blokes wanting some cool action....Quote:
Originally posted by cpulloverclock
:D
649€ or 829$ for this LS and 480 or 588$ for the ST
Nventiv = 1
Asetek = 0
If I could get my hands on one of those ST's for that price in AUS, I would've done so by now....
We Aussies seem to always get left out:mad: :mad: :mad:
The same cars that are underpowered....No quality Mushkin BH5....Can't remember seein an Aussie with a P4ES (except Kingmax RAM)....2 stores that sell Mach II's for the price of houses...
/ :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:in' mode off:D
where do you get it for 649€? I payed 100€ moer and thought it was a good price :D
Hmm,
As I voted for Asetek I would like to back it up with a few extra words.
1.- I really don't care if it's Asetek or nVentiv, I'd just get the best one. I figure only brand-related fanboys (Intel/AMD/nVidia/ATi) would be as dumb as to do such a thing, which I am not.
2.- It really does offer a lot (or even more) for the price.
3.- Sure the design is a ripoff, but I thought most of us wouldn't care so much about how our PC stuffs look, as long as performance is Xtreme. (I never heard any1 complain about the way i.e. Macci's dry-ice setup looks, yet it ain't pretty :D )
Having said that, I'd still kill for either one of 'em, as they'd both do a lot better then my DIY chiller ;)
Jumping in, I guess. :p:Quote:
Originally posted by Gary Lloyd
Custom builders buy their components from wholesale distributors. Given volume, they could buy direct from the manufacturers. But even without the volume, I think they can beat those prices. Hopefully one of them will show up, and speak for himself.
As far as pricing, the basis of the machines that I build bare bones - compressor, tubing, evaporator, refrigerant, etc, just to acquire and assemble the stuff to make it cold without any fancy controls or designer shrouds, costs me about $300.00 to $350.00 (all new materials, no used or salvaged stuff), and I will put about 12 hours of labor into the construction.
Yes, volume greatly decreases supplies costs. Just a minimum increase in the order quantity of my *herefishy specified* condenser coils cut my cost in half !!! *Team Puss* would testify that my favorite configuration will outperform anything that is now commercially marketed.
I believe that the $1k pricing, of say the MachII, is fair, taking into consideration the controller and aesthetic construction of the machine. HEY! a warranty is a product and service that is paid for too! Product warranty is a *tangible* cost, and that cost is reflected in the salesprice of the product offered.
It has been observed by myself, that in the refrigerated appliance market, that the cheapest equipment available has the least warranty coverage. The lowest priced machine is usually priced as such, because the warranty coverage (*cost*) is reduced (in addition to possibly the actual quality of the workmanship or materials, or features included or available).
I don't think that anything on the market is *overpriced*. No hobbyist can build similar units for less than the retail price of a Vapo or Mach if they consider the cost of NEW components and materials at a *one-time* purchase, and then properly assembling them with the proper tools. I don't think that anyone that is building their own phase-change for their personal use is doing it to save money, but to persue refrigeration as a hobby in support of their activities in the hobby of OC'ing.
One thing about the comment regarding the commercial use of the information on this forumn, as suggested out by a previous post, may have an adverse effect on the free exchange of information on the phase-change subject. Hmmmm, kinda' unfortunate.
I would suggest that anyone browsing these forumns, looking for ideas for use in the marketplace should be *very* careful about simply running to the drawing board without first contacting the source of the information (or idea). There are folks who participate openly here, that actually have patents or provisional patents on some aspects of the things they discuss, or information they post. Actually it would be only good business to investigate any attractive ideas, thoroughly.
Copying an idea that may be legally protected could cause problems for some (company). In the case of Baker (for instance), he could easily demonstrate and document even the date that he *conceived his idea*, as it is documented in this forum, for instance. Who knows... he may have engaged in some protections.
Cheers!
You make good coolers, but not the best:DQuote:
Originally posted by captaincascade
One way or another, I will be in this battle as well.
I honestly believe that i make the best coolers in existance, :D
;)
yeah Tom, i would love to have your unit for a weekend:D
I don't know quite how to interpret that. Care to re-phrase... LOLQuote:
yeah Tom, i would love to have your unit for a weekend
Information is like sex. Everybody wants it, but nobody wants to pay for it. :(Quote:
Copying an idea that may be legally protected could cause problems for some (company). In the case of Baker (for instance), he could easily demonstrate and document even the date that he *conceived his idea*, as it is documented in this forum, for instance. Who knows... he may have engaged in some protections.
They don't need to contact you... you're writing in this forumn, they are just reading.Quote:
Originally posted by captaincascade
I don't know who their chief designer is, but i think he could use a little help.
Quote:
....They are just busy counting thier money.(edit; honestly i think that the promy and the vapochill are very reasonably priced)....
....When i build a system, my primary concern is the system. Not the profit.
What is wrong in going into business and making money? These people (companies are people, you know) are feeding their family, sending their children to school, and purchasing fishing tackle for their leisure time. The U.S. anyway, is a free market. Capitalism is the basis of (the US) market, and *profit* is what provides the quality of life that we have. Profit is not a four-letter word.
nVentiv, etcetera are not posing as charities. The Skipper, Bowman, Baker, and others I would guess - certainly myself - that advertise services and even products (stuff) on the Xtreme sales storefront and even in this forum, certainly became involved in this activity/market, however you want to see it, out of a sense of adventure and the excitement of creating something. But even as the Skipper stated, that he does wish to profit from his activities, by perhaps one of these companies contacting him, so he can help them develop the perfect chiller, such as that he makes.
Anyone involved in the actual construction of these machines and components for trade of any kind, who states that they are only "Doing it for The Good of Mankind"..... well, I find the statement itself, suspect. Everyone has dreams of greatness and success. Heck, I dream of even having a fan club, much like some of the other guys, but I guess I'm the black sheep of the forum, so-to-speak.
Quote:
I'd say the only reason either company is lowwering the prices is in hopes of crippleing the competition so they can raise the prices.
Actually, by lowering prices, you can increase volume. Increased volume results in higher purchasing volumes for materials which can greatly decrease costs, thus increasing profit. You can actually increase profit by lowering your price, when the more attractive pricing results in increased sales.
Quote:
My concern shall remain in the business of computer cooling.
hmmm..... "BUSINESS"..... that is correct.....
Cheers!
you should read threads like "Post your Hexus PiFast scores" sometimes so youd know Tom has the most powerful cascade and runs his FX-51 at 3200mhz or so. :stick:Quote:
Originally posted by Gary Lloyd
I don't know quite how to interpret that. Care to re-phrase... LOL
Wow, it does look interesting. It's a good price too. If I didn't have a sour taste in my mouth, I'd buy one straight away. Im not looking to fan another NVentive / Asetek debate. Im not siding with Nventive so much as I just don't want to do business with a company like Asetek. I dont buy this 'accidental' posting crap, or these 'poor journalism skills' crap. I don't come here for 'unbiased jounralism'. I come here to get real reviews and opinions from real people. Not people payed off by the companies and buy in to all the hype. I could go on and on about this, suffice it to say, I'm disgusted with Asetek and although im in the market and pricerange for one of these devices, and the lightspeed shows promise, I would honestly be unsure about buying one. Especially now that we know all this drama occured right before a new product release. Oh, Im sure none of this was planned, right.
I guess they say even bad publicity is good publicity. Well, not to me it isn't. [/opinion]
Quote:
Originally posted by Player0
I guess they say even bad publicity is good publicity. Well, not to me it isn't. [/opinion]
LOL... right on, Player.
Has anyone ever sued McDonald's because the coffee was *COLD*. The coffee is supposed to be hot.... or even the time that the burger was so fresh and hot off the grill, that the pickles would burn your mouth....
Comeon, Id go for that million dollar pay off as well.
Imagine if the coffee spilled in a GUYS lap though. McD would be bankrupt, and the guy would rise to Bobbit status ;)
i have to sat i dont liek the idea of asetek stealing nventiv's ideas but i think this will defintely get nventiv to lauch a mach3 or wahteever that might be even more powerfull, and i'm unbias but i like nventiv alttle bit better, seems more professional for some reason so in my opinion its going to be good for us- the cosumers to be able to buy a better stock r507 unit w/ warranty and support casue the vapo xe just plain sux
compared to the prommy that is
Sorry couldn't help commenting on this:
The coffee spilling- and lady/dog/microwave- and other similar cases tells more about the sorry state the US legal systems is in. Those cases are ridiulous :)
then didn't Nventiv RIP OFF KryoTech?? If peeps want to go on and ON about this?
C
His joke was referring to your desire to have Tom's "UNIT" for a week, lol (UNIT = English slang for **Johnson** or TallyWhacker)Quote:
Originally posted by QuadDamage
you should read threads like "Post your Hexus PiFast scores" sometimes so youd know Tom has the most powerful cascade and runs his FX-51 at 3200mhz or so. :stick:
C
edit: before mods del this.... take notice, it is worked out.... next page.
Totally off topic and you dont know crap about the US. Bet you you've heard a bunch of urban legends. Tired of foreigners saying junk they know nothing about. How's this..... norway sucks! Bet you I just made some friends.Quote:
Originally posted by Shep
Sorry couldn't help commenting on this:
The coffee spilling- and lady/dog/microwave- and other similar cases tells more about the sorry state the US legal systems is in. Those cases are ridiulous :)
FYI, I think I speak for most americans when I say I'm tired of people with two brain cells fighting each other telling me what the 'problem' with my country is.
I had to comment on this. The sorry state your cognitive systems are in. It's rediculous.
Second time this week, I've read "problem with the US is..." :rolleyes:
Two letters: O J ;)
The legal system DOES suck in the US, and it does most other places as well. As with everything, life isn't fair. Legal decisions go to those with the most money. Tobacco, RIAA, Microsoft.
Anyone who claims that a rainbow shines out the DOJ's arse hasn't been to court. ;)
But arent we getting just a wee bit off topic here?
Any legal system that gives human kind the benefit of the doubt WILL be abused. Guess we should give it up then. I've been raised to believe it is better that ten guilty people go free than one innocent waste his life away unnessarily.
I've just seen this a few times and I dont know where the hell these people gather the nerve. Same goes for a US citizen belittling another country... other than how I did... to make a point. Furthermore, I dont beleieve they have gathered this from respected periodicals. Just some heresay BS they've heard.
If you think it's that bad... extend the courtesy you would extend to an already married friend who has a jerk for a wife. Some things you just let be. If you're friend has an ugly girlfriend do you tell him or do you stop and think "what good can come from this?"I'm not that bad a guy.... just give it up already! I extend that courtesy to our foreign members.
Back to talking about prommies.
Quote:
Originally posted by texuspete2k2
Totally off topic .....
Totally off topic is right... and my post was relative to the advertising aspects of the activity....
(Company) gets sued because of the high quality of their product. Where are you going to go, to get the (hottest and freshest food) best product in town?.... in the example given....
My point was regarding the previous statement about bad advertising is better than none.... which was relative to Asetek stating that their machine isn't as "cold" as the competition, but that the competition advertises their colder machine as *colder* than it really is..... Posing the "victimized competitor" as the *good guy*, who viola now has a competitive machine in the *colder*, higher capacity market....
That was the point of the posts, which were intended to be relative to the thread.
herefishy ->Uh... ok. I was talking to the guy that knows what my countries problems are. Even though some of us living here didnt know we had any extraordinary problems. I won't OT anymore in this thread because this very thing happenned a week ago with another member and the argumant went on and on because he couldnt figure why some of us were upset. All mentions of it were deleted and it obviously needs to be said because it doesnt stop. Hopefully an OT or two, which happens all the time, allows it to remain.
Asetek has put themselves in a sticky predicament. How are they to be 100% accurate. Im on the fence with that issue. We know a cpu won't be as cool as an evap but prommie takes it a step further by "creative placement" that they just might stretching a bit too far. But people put up with it because prommies have been the best. I dont think asetek is any better.... but if there were a prommie equivalent from a company that was a bit more honest we'd have an alternative. I think if an apple can actually beat a pc one day it will be hard to believe and get people to convert since its know they are a bunch of lying, manipulating folks when it comes to benchmarks. We know intel and amd will do it, but some stuff is just too far.
Sorry for my earlier OT'ness but this damn thread grows a page every minute. Quickly buried.
Herefishy... I will take a look around but you must have slipped under my radar.... I am interested in seeing your deep freeze creations just dont remember having done that. Lol... I do have to read a lot of posts at work with avatars scrolled off. Everyone with their half naked chicks.
LOL shoulda said "cooling" unit.Quote:
Originally posted by charlie
His joke was referring to your desire to have Tom's "UNIT" for a week, lol (UNIT = English slang for **Johnson** or TallyWhacker)
C
Prices are a bit cheaper here http://www.frozencpu.com/cgi-bin/frozencpu/cas-194.html
How much did the XE's used to be? Weren't they like $800 at one point?