Plasticizer leach?

Liquid: Distilled Water
Additive: Nuke-PHN (e.g., Benzalkonium)
Tubing: PrimoChill PrimoFlex PRO LRT
Rad: Aquacomputer Airplex Modularity 360 Copper

What the heck is going on here? :eek: I boiled the tubing in distilled water to soften it up prior to install. Could that cause an issue?

My other components don't appear to be covered in this film. The loop has been running on and off for at most a month.

http://images.thedigitalfoundry.com/...r_leech_01.png

Perhaps I should go back to Norprene even though it's stiff as a damn rod.

Thanks.

UPDATE: For those in denial that there's an issue I direct you here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1199158/p...ussion-gallery

yep, primochill I think was trying to be the king of flexibility in last year and only succeeded in being the king of plasticizer leach. My ~2.5 year old primochill has nearly invisible to naked eye feint layer of plasticizer, can only see it if run finger down a long stretch of cut open tubing.

But all the new primochill seems to get a thick layer of plasticizer within several days to few weeks, whole thread on ocn with tons of pics. yours is typical.

On my next build when no more of old stuff is left, I will go back to plasticizer free tygon beverage tubing b44-3x and if I want color, I will use dye. At least dye is water soluble, and even if all dye fell out of solution it would be a tiny fraction of the amount of plasticizer crap lining walls of that tubing. Dont know what primochill is thinking.

Tygon makes plasticizer free inner bore tubing as well, but it is silver tygon. Cant believe that at least 1 company doesnt make UV colored tubing with plasticizer free inner bore.

I do not believe B-44-3 is plasticizer free. I can't comment on if it clouds or not though yet. Hopefully in a month or so I'll actually get my rig working, then I'll be able to say if it clouds or not.

As for Primoflex, almost all recent batches cloud considerably worse than their older tubing. I had two different batches of Primoflex in my last build. One set turned brown while the older set stayed clear considerably longer. I won't be buying it again any time soon.

Any thoughts on Tygon 2001 High Purity Plasticizer Free Tubing? Tempted to overnight some from McMaster-Carr.

Ordered the following this morning. It should be here tomorrow.

10 Ft. High-purity Tygon Tubing White Semi-trans, 1/2" Id, 3/4" Od, 1/8"wall, 10'l
10 Ft. Durable Norprene Rubber/plastic Tubing 1/2" Id, 3/4" Od, 1/8" Wall, Black, 10' Length

Goodbye PrimoChill.

The high purity Tygon will also cloud, plus it is almost impossible to bend, at least the one I tried.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by schoolslave

The high purity Tygon will also cloud, plus it is almost impossible to bend, at least the one I tried.

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I purchased the Tygon 2001 which is 100% plasticizer free. By design the tubing is somewhat cloudy. I'm guessing you used Tygon B-44-xxx tubing and not Tygon 2001. The B-44-xxx is not 100% plasticizer free.

A pot of boiling water will bend tubing. Works every time. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by D749

I purchased the Tygon 2001 which is 100% plasticizer free. By design the tubing is somewhat cloudy. I'm guessing you used Tygon B-44-xxx tubing and not Tygon 2001. The B-44-xxx is not 100% plasticizer free.

A pot of boiling water will bend tubing. Works every time. ;)

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You are right, the tubing is cloudy to begin with.
I used it for maybe a month or two, and it definitely became "cloudier" with time; however, there was no "film" like you usually get with plasticizer leech.
Good luck with bending :up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by schoolslave

You are right, the tubing is cloudy to begin with.
I used it for maybe a month or two, and it definitely became "cloudier" with time; however, there was no "film" like you usually get with plasticizer leech.
Good luck with bending :up:

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I bummed to hear that you had further clouding with the Tygon 2001. I wonder what it was from. Did you use dyes? More details please.

Are we talking all LRT here?

My green tube hasn't leached at all in the 6+ months of 24/7 use, were there different batches per se?

-PB

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Originally Posted by paulbagz

Are we talking all LRT here?

My green tube hasn't leached at all in the 6+ months of 24/7 use, were there different batches per se?

-PB

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Some people think it has to do with batches. I've ordered LRT on two different occasions and noticed leaching both times. One sure fire why tell if you have leaching is to cut the tubing open and closely inspect it. It's easier to see on black tubing.

It is the older Primochill that seems to not have the bad leaching, it is more recently purchased people seem to complain about and post pics with bad leach.

I was thinking bev44-3 tubing was plasticizer free, but yeah site doesnt say it is, so probably has some plasticizer...though I have never seen it leach...though does yellow slightly over time.

Anyone ever try,

Quote:

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Tygon Plasticizer Free Ultra Chemical Resistant Tubing 2375....Offers an unequaled combination of chemical resistance, clarity and flexibility.

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It at least looks clear, unlike tygon 2001, it comes in 3/8 5/8 and 1/2 3/4. Also this tubing has some of lowest water absorption rates. But no tubing is going to bend like tubing with plasticizer, but wonder how 2375 does? Its also expensive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by D749

Some people think it has to do with batches. I've ordered LRT on two different occasions and noticed leaching both times. One sure fire why tell if you have leaching is to cut the tubing open and closely inspect it. It's easier to see on black tubing.

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Yeah, will find out if I ever tear down the loop shuld IB-E/SB-Ev2 show its face.

-PB

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rge

It is the older Primochill that seems to not have the bad leaching, it is more recently purchased people seem to complain about and post pics with bad leach.

I was thinking bev44-3 tubing was plasticizer free, but yeah site doesnt say it is, so probably has some plasticizer...though I have never seen it leach...though does yellow slightly over time.

Anyone ever try, It at least looks clear, unlike tygon 2001, it comes in 3/8 5/8 and 1/2 3/4. Also this tubing has some of lowest water absorption rates. But no tubing is going to bend like tubing with plasticizer, but wonder how 2375 does? Its also expensive.

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Water absorption is 0.04% for both Tygon 2001 and 2375. Tygon 2375 is the successor to Tygon 2075.

http://emurdock.com/tygontubing/tygon-2001.pdf
http://emurdock.com/tygontubing/tygo...comparison.pdf

I've learned more about tubing in the past 48 hours then I would have liked to. :lol2:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by D749

I bummed to hear that you had further clouding with the Tygon 2001. I wonder what it was from. Did you use dyes? More details please.

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It may have been radiator flux, dirt, etc. I don't think I cleaned the blocks/radiators before using them with that loop.
I wish I had taken pictures, but like I said, there was no film on the inside of the tubing, it may have just been natural discoloration.

My order of Norprene A-60-G (which I've used before) and Tygon 2001 (which is new for me) arrived today. I did some further reading and the water absorption rate is actually lower on the Tygon 2001. So I'm going to use that first. Both tubing is 100% plasticizer free.

http://images.thedigitalfoundry.com/...on_2001_01.png
http://images.thedigitalfoundry.com/...on_2001_02.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by D749

Water absorption is 0.04% for both Tygon 2001 and 2375. Tygon 2375 is the successor to Tygon 2075.

http://emurdock.com/tygontubing/tygon-2001.pdf
http://emurdock.com/tygontubing/tygo...comparison.pdf

I've learned more about tubing in the past 48 hours then I would have liked to. :lol2:

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The tygon 2001 tubing isnt clear though to begin with, ie looks ugly to me in pics anyway, I was trying to find something along same lines/same specs that is clear tubing, then also the bending issues, boiling for each turn would be a pita.

EDIT: actually that white tubing doesnt look bad, which is that?

Also between Norprene and tygon 2001, both have low enough water absorption that neither should have clouding from water absorption. Norprene also has very low water vapor transmission, so less refilling of loops, but some have had issues with it collapsing, but depends on wall thickness and pump power as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rge

EDIT: actually that white tubing doesnt look bad, which is that?

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Tygon 2001. It's not white but semi-transparent. Some would call it "cloudy."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rge

Also between Norprene and tygon 2001, both have low enough water absorption that neither should have clouding from water absorption. Norprene also has very low water vapor transmission, so less refilling of loops, but some have had issues with it collapsing, but depends on wall thickness and pump power as well.

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I'll take the 0.04 over 0.3 myself. ;)

I ordered 50ft of Tygon Norprene tubing, formula A-60-G. Lets see how it fares.

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Originally Posted by muskel

I ordered 50ft of Tygon Norprene tubing, formula A-60-G. Lets see how it fares.

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That's what's to the right of the white tubing above. ;) I like Norprene (used it in my first WC build) but be warned it kinks easily. I'd say that and the Tygon 2001 are the most prone to kinking and have the largest bend radius. I ended up using the Tygon 2001 (throwing out the PrimoChill PrimoFlex PRO LRT and shelving the Norprene) because it is 100% plasticizer free and has the lowest absorption rate even when compared to Norprene. Good luck.

I'm using the 3/8"ID 5/8"OD tubing over 7/16" fittings and it is by far the best tubing I have ever used, and I've used most of them. It has an incredible bend radius, can be formed into curves easily, has very little evaporation issues, and doesn't have any plasticizer. I don't care about it being black as I prefer black tubing anyway. I've tried the plasticizer-free Tygon and found it to be useless. It was too soft and kinked like crazy.

The duralene stuff I used in my old quad insanity loop ran for 1.5 years and had barely a hint of plasticizer leach and the tubes were still 90% clear.

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Originally Posted by voigts

I'm using the 3/8"ID 5/8"OD tubing over 7/16" fittings and it is by far the best tubing I have ever used, and I've used most of them. It has an incredible bend radius, can be formed into curves easily, has very little evaporation issues, and doesn't have any plasticizer. I don't care about it being black as I prefer black tubing anyway. I've tried the plasticizer-free Tygon and found it to be useless. It was too soft and kinked like crazy.

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I own 10 feet of Tygon 2001 which is 100% plasticizer free. I'm not sure what "plasticizer-free Tygon" you were using but the Tygon 2001 is far from soft. Their Norprene tubing, which I also own 10+ feet of, is much softer. Unfortunately, both the Tygon 2001 and Norprene have poor bend radii.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by D749

both the Tygon 2001 and Norprene have poor bend radii.

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If you have the thicker walled Norprene like I'm using, the bend radius is phenomenal, and is better than anything else I've used to include Primochill, Tygon, etc. The 1/16" walled Norprene is too thin to be sure, but the 1/8" walled is outstanding.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by voigts

If you have the thicker walled Norprene like I'm using, the bend radius is phenomenal, and is better than anything else I've used to include Primochill, Tygon, etc. The 1/16" walled Norprene is too thin to be sure, but the 1/8" walled is outstanding.

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I assume you're referring to this: http://emurdock.com/norprene-afl00038.aspx. My first WC build used that tubing and I recently bought an additional 10 feet of the same tubing. Phenomenal bend radius? I would instead say it has a phenomenal tendency to kink. Even though I'll never use PrimoChill PrimoFlex PRO LRT again it smokes Norprene in terms of flexibility and resistance to kinking. Granted, if you don't have any serious bends in your loop it's all a moot point.

In the end... between 1/2 ID 3/4 OD PrimoChill PrimoFlex PRO LRT, Norprene and Tygon 2001 I went with Tygon 2001. I own and have used all three types of tubing. My second choice would be Norprene.