Could the Playstation 3 Kill Sony?

[JAWS]

Could the Playstation 3 Kill Sony? Isn't This Thing Supposed to Play Games First?

http://www.ehomeupgrade.com/entry/2100/could_the_playstation


As we quickly approach E3 in May, many people are eagerly anticipating more details on the Sony PS3. Since Sony burst onto the gaming scene with the original Playstation, they have been the company to beat in the console wars. As a matter of fact, while the rest of Sony has struggled, the Playstation division has been a cash cow that the rest of the company has relied on. With Microsoft having already launched the Xbox 360 to overwhelming demand, many are wondering what the counter from Sony will truly look like, hype set aside. It wouldn't be exaggerating to say that Sony is betting a large hand on the Playstation 3. It's not just the Playstation division that's making the bet, either. With the next-gen Hi-Def format war still raging, Sony is betting a substantial portion of it's future on Blu-Ray. While most analysts agree that HD-DVD will not likely win, some analysts are openly wondering whether Blu-Ray will as well. If it doesn't, Sony could be in serious trouble.

Isn't This Thing Supposed to Play Games First?
In order for Sony's Trojan Horse strategy with Blu-Ray to work, the Playstation 3 has to succeed as a gaming console. As a game console, the Playstation 3 has to deliver on several fronts. In pure horsepower and graphical ability, there's little doubt that the console will impress. There are serious reservations as to Sony's online strategy (compared to Xbox Live) and we'll cover that in a bit. However, one aspect of gaming that is often ignored, but can become a major issue is load times. Ask any Sony PSP owner what annoys them most about the portable console and you are sure to hear about it's dreadful load times. Gamers are an impatient breed and if Sony frustrates hardcore gamers - and developers, for that matter - it could greatly damage it's reputation with the group that will comprise PS3 early adopters.

Until now, it's been widely assumed that the Blu-ray drive that will make it's way into the PS3 will be single-speed. If true, this choice could be disasterous. Blu-ray single speed transfers data at a constant rate of 36Mbps (Megabits per second) or 4.5 MBps (Megabytes per second). Sound impressive? Think again. DVD single speed is rated at a little over 1.32MBps max. A 12X DVD, such as the one in the Xbox 360, transfers data at rates between 8.2 and 16.5 MBps for an average of around 13MBps. This article from Gamespot provides all the details on transfer speeds, but simple math should show that there are some serious concerns looming with a single speed Blu-Ray drive. So, all things being equal, a 20 second load-time on the Xbox 360 would equate to just under 60 seconds on the PS3!

In order for Sony to bring load times into the same range as the Xbox 360, it would have to use at least a 2X drive (which would transfer a little faster than a 12X DVD's minimum speed) or a 3X drive (which would closely resemble a 12X DVD's average transfer rate). Since Blu-ray is a new technology, it's a certainty that the faster speeds will increase the base cost of the PS3, which leads into the next point.

Money Doesn't Grow on Trees
The Playstation 3 will lose money for at least a few years. How much and for how long is key, and recent projections from Merrill Lynch Japan suggest that the PS3 could lose a tremendous amount of money for Sony in the first few years. Merrill Lynch is projecting losses of 1.18 billion in year 1, 730 million in year 2 and 457 million in year 3. By comparison, Sony's profits in the past three years has been about 1.86 billion. If the PS3 doesn't start turning a serious profit in year 4, Sony's bank accounts could start drying up. There's no indication if these losses also anticipate the costs involved with setting up the massive infrastructure for an Xbox Live competitor, which most people think Sony will provide. If not, Sony's losses could skyrocket even more as it looks to create a brand-new online presense.

Sony could try to offset these losses by launching the PS3 with a higher price point, but anything above $500 is considered too high for wide adoption. Will consumers agree with Ken Kutaragi's assessment that you will want to work an extra job to have one? Kutaragi has even lamented that "…the PS3 can't be offered at a price that's targeted towards households."

Additionally, Sony is stil having to compete with HD-DVD, which is getting significant backing from Microsoft (and their 37 billion in cash). Whereas Microsoft has little to lose if HD-DVD fails, Sony has everything to lose. Additionally, recent announcements at CES in January indicate that the least expensive Blu-Ray drives will start at $1000 while HD-DVD is hitting the market with players starting at $500. Many analysts saw these changes as giving HD-DVD a second-wind that could ultimately hurt Sony more than it helps HD-DVD, which leads to another point.

Tell Me Why I Need Blu-Ray More Than DVD?
Unless you have an HDTV set, you'll never see the difference between Blu-Ray and DVD. And considering that Hi-Def adoption is currently at 24% and more than half of consumers are waiting for price drops, the target market for Blu-Ray is not as lucrative as one might believe. When DVDs hit the market, there were several reasons to purchase them. For one, the quality far surpassed VHS. Additionally, menus and extra features made DVD content easier to access and gave it more value. Also, DVDs don't degrade in quality over time, making them a better long-term investment. The jump from DVD to Blu-Ray (or HD-DVD) is not as significant, unless you're an HDTV owner. Even then, the question remains: Is Blu-Ray content going to be compelling enough to make me say "I have to have it?"

Recent announcements also suggest that Blu-Ray disc prices will come at a significant premium over existing DVD prices. With broadband adoption growing rapidly, one also has to ask if a physical format has a long life ahead of it. Bill Gates has publicly stated that he thinks the format war is the last we'll see, because hi-def content will be soon be delivered over the Internet instead. HD-DVD may not win the war, but it doesn't mean that Blu-ray will.

Games, Games, Games
The Playstation 3 has wide support right now. However, rumblings have been surfacing that the PS3 is hard to develop for, due to the complexity of a brand new processor with multiple cores. Similar criticisms arose with the PS2, and while Sony was able to overcome the same hurdles then, there is one major difference now that may keep history from repeating itself: the Xbox 360.

Since the original Xbox came into the game a good bit later than the PS2, developers had to stick with Sony because it was the clear market leader. This afforded Sony liberties that it may not have had otherwise. Now, Microsoft has the head start. Additionally, the Microsoft unit has already been praised by the likes of John Carmack (creator of Doom, Quake, etc...) for it's great development environment, while Hideo Kojima of Metal Gear Solid fame has expressed some concerns that development for the PS3 could be more difficult than for the Xbox 360. Sony must have strong 3rd party support so that licensing fees will help recoup the costs of putting the PS3 into the market. Just being Sony may not be enough anymore.

Conclusion
While I don't think we'll see Sony close it's doors for good, I have some concerns about the affect the PS3 could have on Sony's financials over the next few years and into the future. Microsoft has created an impressive console with the Xbox 360 and while Sony has a strong history in the Playstation line, there are key components for concern. Blu-Ray, an online service like Xbox Live and a hard development environment create additional areas for financial loss that may not be recouped. For the sake of competition and a strong market, let's hope Sony can address these concerns adequately and while there is still time.

[4everCS]

I think Microsoft Xbox has completely taken over the market now with the new 360. I still am a ps2 fan but I don't see any hope for the future.

[JAWS]

http://www.activewin.com/awin/comments.asp?HeadlineIndex=33697

The estimated total bill of materials for Sony's next-generation game console will be between $725 and $905....................................WHAT?????? ??

[[XC] Lead Head]

The blue ray drive alone is like $300

[[XC] leviathan18]

thats what happen when you try to force a propietary format... if they assume the costs for a year they will place a lot of BR players in the market making HD DVD look stupid becasue there are a lot of BR around....


hope this fails i preffer HD DVD i dont like sony propietary garbage

[dinos22]

thats what happen when you try to force a propietary format... if they assume the costs for a year they will place a lot of BR players in the market making HD DVD look stupid becasue there are a lot of BR around....


hope this fails i preffer HD DVD i dont like sony propietary garbage
lucky there's still some form of ingenuity around.....that's just a dumb comment wishing for some company to fall over because you don't like a product....correct me if i'm wrong

[EvilCloudStrife]

i dont think so. If you have seen any of the screens for the new games it would amaze you.

[mr_knowitall15]

funny thing about those screenshots going around. i hear a lot of those are pre-rendered and not nessicarily what the ps3 is actually capable of doing real time.

[thegoatman]

Sony started dying when the rootkit fiasco happened. They were going downhill when they started outsourcing. The PS3 may be the killing blow, though.

[sin0822]

where are these screen shots?

[[XC] Lead Head]

From what I have heard the RSX in the PS3 is just a 7800GTX on 90nm

[Arkangyl]

I don't think it will kill Sony, Sony is a rather large company.

However I could definatly see the 360 beating the PS3 this round, I'm not sure the Revo falls into that fight (if we even want to mention it at all) for it seems to have its eternal cult following.

The PS3 though, costing more than the 360 for what? the few exclusive titles, Blu-Ray and, oh, probably more Sony DRM :banana: remember rootkit? I wouldn't put it past Sony to pull something like that with the PS3. I've heard mention of it 'marking' your games so they can only be played on the system of their owner.

[JAWS]

probably more Sony DRM :banana: remember rootkit?


I've heard mention of it 'marking' your games so they can only be played on the system of their owner.


that wouldn't surprise me one bit.

[Dave_Sz]

funny thing about those screenshots going around. i hear a lot of those are pre-rendered and not nessicarily what the ps3 is actually capable of doing real time.


Even funnier is all those demos they had running on the latest dev kits. Even the mgs vid where they had the game running in real time and they were messing around with cameras, lighting, in REAL TIME. If you think the PS3 can bring down SONY, you're dumber than 78% of the world. If you think the 360 will win this gen of gaming, you're wrong as well. They've been out since november and there is still no great game, besides COD2, and even that was out on the PC beforehand. All the other games that were supposed to be great, full auto, perfect dark, DOA, none of them are above average. The only thing I'm waiting for is gears of war. The n64 was supposed to destroy the ps1, the xbox was supposed to destroy the ps2, and that pattern will most likely not change. If it does, oh well. I've been a fan of the PS since 96 and have stuck with it cause their games are more what I like compared to what others offer.

[d94]

the only thing this could kill is sonys console depo

[hixie]

Half the people that have an xbox got it to play DOA xtreme beach volleyball. Yet you could still say that PS2 won that time. I remember they even had a special edition package which had an xbox, the game and a blow up character from DOA.
The only thing that will make one the winner over the other is the range and quality of the games (providing one console isn't largely more expensive than the other), and also the ability to play games from the previous console. If i remember correct the xbox360 cannot play xbox games, whereas sony were planning on making the PS3 capable of playing PS2 games.
Correct me if i'm wrong, i havn't looked that the specs for a long time.
Anyways, even if the PS3 eats up all of sony's money, i bet you some rich mainland chinese dude will buy sony. So it's not the last you will hear of sony.

[JAWS]

I can see it now; Microsoft releases Halo3 the day of PS3 ;)

[[cTx]Philosophy]

I can see it now; Microsoft releases Halo3 the day of PS3 ;)
thats their plan :)
the bad thing is this, theres only like a xbox per 50 square miles with their release, so I think if son gets their shipments right, there gonna own the market at some point, if they were to come out now while microsoft is messing up with this lack of consoles theyd have a good run at it..

But I think while there gonna be late 06 I dont see them being much competition once people start getting xbox in their homes..

[[XC] Lead Head]

Even funnier is all those demos they had running on the latest dev kits. Even the mgs vid where they had the game running in real time and they were messing around with cameras, lighting, in REAL TIME. If you think the PS3 can bring down SONY, you're dumber than 78% of the world. If you think the 360 will win this gen of gaming, you're wrong as well. They've been out since november and there is still no great game, besides COD2, and even that was out on the PC beforehand. All the other games that were supposed to be great, full auto, perfect dark, DOA, none of them are above average. The only thing I'm waiting for is gears of war. The n64 was supposed to destroy the ps1, the xbox was supposed to destroy the ps2, and that pattern will most likely not change. If it does, oh well. I've been a fan of the PS since 96 and have stuck with it cause their games are more what I like compared to what others offer.

Hum...What console cant you mess around with the cameras and lights? For god sakes you have been able to do that stuff for like ever. Its not some new never before seen technology. Every FPS game has different camera views etc... And how can that be real time when IBM doesnt even know how to program the freaking cell yet!

[Jarrod1937]

Hum...What console cant you mess around with the cameras and lights? For god sakes you have been able to do that stuff for like ever. Its not some new never before seen technology. Every FPS game has different camera views etc... And how can that be real time when IBM doesnt even know how to program the freaking cell yet!
you're missing the point. he's saying that since they were messing around with the camera's and lighting in realtime then obviously the game was in realtime and not a pre-rendered video like most of the stuff going around for launch titles.
but dave, you youself are missing the point that the manufacturing cost will be great, and sony will be taking a very large hit. they won't die of course but it will hurt then initially. however hardware wise the ps3 is going to be amazing (in particual the cell's architecture). in my opinion the xbox 360 is already behind graphics wise (compares the xbox 360's best looking game to a game like fear).
we'll just have to wait and see how things go.

[[XC] leviathan18]

lucky there's still some form of ingenuity around.....that's just a dumb comment wishing for some company to fall over because you don't like a product....correct me if i'm wrong

i dont like they always try to force some propietary format

[[XC] Lead Head]

you're missing the point. he's saying that since they were messing around with the camera's and lighting in realtime then obviously the game was in realtime and not a pre-rendered video like most of the stuff going around for launch titles.
but dave, you youself are missing the point that the manufacturing cost will be great, and sony will be taking a very large hit. they won't die of course but it will hurt then initially. however hardware wise the ps3 is going to be amazing (in particual the cell's architecture). in my opinion the xbox 360 is already behind graphics wise (compares the xbox 360's best looking game to a game like fear).
we'll just have to wait and see how things go.

You can't compare them at all. Different architecture,plus the xbox is bearly even 5 months old. Have you seen Far Cry instincts it beats the living :banana::banana::banana::banana: out of FEAR

[Jarrod1937]

please lead head, don't try to start the stupid arguement that consoles are better than pc's...
as for the new far cry for the xbox 360.... why don't you wait to see what some of the pc screenshots will look like, i bet you $1,00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000 that the pc version will look better. and yes you can compare thier power even though they have diffeent architectures, why not? its not like they are processing some foriegn code or are based on a completly different design type (like optical processing verses semi-conductor processing). and because they share these similarities you do have a basis for comparing, so again, why not?
on top of this, the new far cry screenshots are probably from a pc anyway running off of a xbox 360 dev kit. now, if a pc can run the game at the max settings that the xbox 360 is going to be running it at while also emulating some of the xbox 360's more unique features don't you think the pc version of that same game will run better and faster than the xbox 360 counterpart and therfore be able to push more graphic wonderfulness? i think so, on top of that the xbox 360's games don't look nearly as good as some of the pc games out now, sure the xbox 360 has only been out for 5 months... why does this matter? the gpu is still based off of the standard current pc gpu architecture, and so just like the xbox they are almost already using the gpu to its fullest extent. its not like the ps2's gpu which was completly unique in its architecture therefore requiring more experience to gain more graphics. basically the xbox 360's hardware will become outdated pretty fast. however since the xbox 360 platform is all based on the same hardware (it never changes) then you can expect them to be able to push more graphics than on a pc because of extra optimization that is possible, but this can't compete with upgraded hardware.

[[XC] leviathan18]

xbox360 will look good trough year with an initial inversion of 400$

if you want a game to look equal with pc you have to spend a lot more :fact:

[Jarrod1937]

xbox360 will look good trough year with an initial inversion of 400$

if you want a game to look equal with pc you have to spend a lot more :fact:
not really.

[[XC] Lead Head]

wtf you talking about? the Xbox 360 is a unified shader architecture WICH NO CURRENT PC GPU HAS! Unfied Shader allows for better gfx and stuffs.

[Jarrod1937]

wtf you talking about? the Xbox 360 is a unified shader architecture WICH NO CURRENT PC GPU HAS! Unfied Shader allows for better gfx and stuffs.
do you even know what unified shader is? a unified shader gpu basically no longer deals with vertex or pixel shaders seperatly but instead has 48 (for the 360 atleast) parallel shaders which can dynamically deal with pixel or vertex, which is a faster method.
however, this doesn't mean it can't be compared...

[[XC] Lead Head]

No jarrod I have absolutley no idea what a unified shader architecture is /sarcasm. It also proceses geometry too... And besides the r500 is partial DX10 compliant. And also the Xbox only has 512MB ram and FC:I probly needs liek 1GB ram to run good so of course they have to knock down textures abit. But i am more then positive the r500 has more graphics processing grunt then what is shown on games like FC:S

[Jarrod1937]

No jarrod I have absolutley no idea what a unified shader architecture is /sarcasm. It also proceses geometry too... And besides the r500 is partial DX10 compliant. And also the Xbox only has 512MB ram and FC:I probly needs liek 1GB ram to run good so of course they have to knock down textures abit. But i am more then positive the r500 has more graphics processing grunt then what is shown on games like FC:S
yeah, but atleast you get my point, while the xbox 360 can hang in there it can't get keep up with pc's for too much longer.
btw, the 512 mb is for system ram, textures resolution limitation really only relys on vid ram not system ram. the textures would have to be taken down mainly because of the video ram limitation (it has 10mb dram (very fast ram even though there is little of it, it probably partially shares its slower system ram for video rendering needs). and because it only has 512mb (less since it probably uses some unknown amount for the shared vid ram) then the level size per level of a game would then be limited, but not really the graphics.

[[XC] Lead Head]

then 10MB ed ram is for little things. The main system ram is GDDR3 with a throughput of 22gbps directly connected to the r500. So i wouldnt consider it slow. Its basicly the GPU ram. but the rest of the system can access it when needed

[Jarrod1937]

then 10MB ed ram is for little things. The main system ram is GDDR3 with a throughput of 22gbps directly connected to the r500. So i wouldnt consider it slow. Its basicly the GPU ram. but the rest of the system can access it when needed
its till slower than most vid ram that have come out recently (the 512mb system, not the rd).
either way, its still a bad idea to have them shared. ms would have done better to get 1 gig of slow memory for the system ram and 128 or 256 mb of the gddr3 ram for the vid instead of 512mb of more expensive ram, but i suppose they needed faster ram to feed the 3 cores so they were kind of forced into this. but hey, all this means is that levels will simply have to be split up more for the 360 and some things taken out, so its not too big of a deal.

[DTU_XaVier]

yeah, but atleast you get my point, while the xbox 360 can hang in there it can't get keep up with pc's for too much longer.


Perhaps not, but it's a hell of a lot cheaper in the long run :p:
what I mean is, that games will be programmed to run smoothly all the time on that thing... on a PC, that's not always the case.. And on the other hand, I don't think the programmers have taken a fraction of the potential out of the X360 yet! :cool:

Best Regards :toast:

[JAWS]

I don't think the programmers have taken a fraction of the potential out of the X360 yet! :cool:



I would definitely agree with that!

[[cTx]Philosophy]

I agree that the 360 looks good, I think it will get better too, but by no means can it hang with a pc...
Its built to do what it does and thats it, compared to a pc isnt even fair, wasnt this ps3 vs xbox?

as for that I will have to wait and see, I think microsoft has the edge here, but I havent really done my research too much, im just xbox fan, always have been..

[Jarrod1937]

Its built to do what it does and thats it, compared to a pc isnt even fair, wasnt this ps3 vs xbox?
well if this was a ps3 vs. xbox 360 comparison then the ps3 would win too. althpugh its hard to tell this early sony has hinted toward a form of sli and since they are probably going to be using the 7800 gpu then its going to be quite fast. and the cell processor completly owns ms 3 cores system it has. basically the cell gets its power from numbers not speed (sort of like how 6 1 ghz machines is faster than 3 2 ghz mamchines in a distributed processing system). basically the cell has 9 cores, 8 spe (side cores) and 1 ppe (main core) and the main core (which supports branch prediction) basically distributes proccesses out to all the side cores. since there are so many they don't need to be nearly as powerful as the xbox 360's cores and will out perform them. and please don't say that the spe cores mainly only do floating point calculations, this doesn't matter because if you understand how most games run then you understand that the majority of calculations are floating point, and the very few calculations that aren't the ppe core can handle fine. next about the cell is that it uses vmx vector instructions, sort of like mmx and sse it can speed up the processing on certain apps and certain types of processes. however the most intrigueing thing about the cell is the way it uses it's cache. instead of simply putting data there that it is processing at the time the cache on the cell can be used like ram and the programmer himself can specify its use. if done and used correctly this can also give a giant boost.
there are many more reasons why the ps3 will be more powerful than the xbox 360 (and the pc's for a short amount of time) but i think the above is enough to get my point through.
and don't get me wrong, i am an xbox fan (i understand that the xbox is more powerful than the gamecube and ps2) and that the xbox 360 is pretty powerful for a game console but from the facts the ps3 will more thanlikely out-do all in the tech area. however my main concern is going to be the price of the ps3, they're simply trying to pack too much new/expensive tech into one product that i fear the final price will be very large and will either hurt my wallet or will hurt sony financially (although will never kill them).

[[XC] Lead Head]

Dude. IBM doesnt even know how to program the cell well yet. So dont expect games to be using all those cores usefully for ~2 years. the xbox 360's GPU is awsome it just limited by ram. Considering thr r600 is gonna be based off the r500

[Jarrod1937]

Dude. IBM doesnt even know how to program the cell well yet. So dont expect games to be using all those cores usefully for ~2 years. the xbox 360's GPU is awsome it just limited by ram. Considering thr r600 is gonna be based off the r500
they don't know how to fully program for the cell because they don't have any hardware fully using it yet (except for the ps3 hardware which is still being developed). you would have to be a complete dumbass to think its going to take them 2+ years to be able to use all cores since to use all cores doesn't take anything new. have you heard of dual-core cpu's? they simply split up the the processing of multiple things into two different threads (like physics and AI) and then send them out to those seperate cores. the cell is no different in this aspect just a little more complicated, its going to be a slight change but it won't be that hard to use all cores. the thing they're probably having trouble with is figuring out how to program for some of the more advanced features like vmx (which is already used but not in thise many different cores) and the cache. i say by ps3 laucnh the devs will have a pretty good idea of how to use the cores but the performance won't be a 100% of what it is capable of, which will take some time (but no more than a year).
and yes the xbox 360's gpu is fast... but ram limitation is a very big limitation...

[JAWS]

you guys need to read this article. more info about:

Just How Powerful Is It?

All Right... How Much?

Okay, So When?

What About Online Functionality?

What's With the HDD?

http://www.1up.com/do/feature?pager.offset=2&cId=3148332#p1.2

[Jarrod1937]

you guys need to read this article. more info about:

Just How Powerful Is It?

All Right... How Much?

Okay, So When?

What About Online Functionality?

What's With the HDD?

http://www.1up.com/do/feature?pager.offset=2&cId=3148332#p1.2
yes, i've read the article already. its just that the specs don't lie. and thats also why i said "although its hard to tell this early". but from what i've heard the ps3 is very promising, and i've heard this from a developers who has a dev kit.
but again we can't really compare anything untill the ps3 is released.

[JAWS]

Sony CEO Howard Stringer confirms suspicions that the PlayStation 3 won't be released until the holiday season 2006 in an interview in Variety magazine. That would make it the last next-gen console to debut.

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117939258?categoryid=18&cs=1&s=h&p=0

[2fast4u-JR]

The xbox will still be king in my book no matter what the others do.

[[cTx]Philosophy]

The xbox will still be king in my book no matter what the others do.


AGREED...

[join nbk]

?Heres the thing, a xbox is a pc, sonys ps2 is a propritary pos,


i somehow thing MS is going o launch windows for 360 if it starts to due down and that will skyrocket salesof 360s, propritaey keypards, controllers, mice,hdds,




see my point here

[2fast4u-JR]

?Heres the thing, a xbox is a pc, sonys ps2 is a propritary pos,


i somehow thing MS is going o launch windows for 360 if it starts to due down and that will skyrocket salesof 360s, propritaey keypards, controllers, mice,hdds,




see my point here
I agree, if there is a company that can take over the console market it is Microsoft. Too much clout and cash for anyone to beat.

[2fast4u-JR]

Everything will be a "PC" except the hand helds before too long anyway.

[MaxxxRacer]

PS3 wont kill Sony. Sony has released TONS of products that absolutley fall on their face and will continue to do so as long as they exist.

The PS3 wont be one of these such producs though. If the PS2 is gonna cost 900 to make like Myril Lynch thinks, they sony wont sell it until the price of the components falls to an acceptable level.. period. they wont do something to catastrophic as to destroy the company.

With all of that said, by the release of the console after generation I believe MS will have the console market firmly grasped in their hands and Sony will be a distant second. As of now that seems highly unlikely, but MS products are easier to code for, Ms is easier to work with/for (its shocking i know.. but true), more user friendly, and is willing to throw more money at the console market than sony is willing to dream of. MS's biggest problem is the games. Right now Sony has the best games, but with MS strategy of not raping the developers and providing them with EXCELENT development tools (sony has crap for development tools), they will slowly win over alot of game developers. Their easy to use tools are key to this strategy as Sony is all about OpenGL, which is a whole different game from the DirectX/D3D world of MS.

As of now, MS is running at a loss on the whole console gaming market, but you dont see them slowing down. they are in it for the long term, and that thinking will lead them to victory in the Console market.


[/rant]

[join nbk]

PS3 wont kill Sony. Sony has released TONS of products that absolutley fall on their face and will continue to do so as long as they exist.

The PS3 wont be one of these such producs though. If the PS2 is gonna cost 900 to make like Myril Lynch thinks, they sony wont sell it until the price of the components falls to an acceptable level.. period. they wont do something to catastrophic as to destroy the company.

With all of that said, by the release of the console after generation I believe MS will have the console market firmly grasped in their hands and Sony will be a distant second. As of now that seems highly unlikely, but MS products are easier to code for, Ms is easier to work with/for (its shocking i know.. but true), more user friendly, and is willing to throw more money at the console market than sony is willing to dream of. MS's biggest problem is the games. Right now Sony has the best games, but with MS strategy of not raping the developers and providing them with EXCELENT development tools (sony has crap for development tools), they will slowly win over alot of game developers. Their easy to use tools are key to this strategy as Sony is all about OpenGL, which is a whole different game from the DirectX/D3D world of MS.

As of now, MS is running at a loss on the whole console gaming market, but you dont see them slowing down. they are in it for the long term, and that thinking will lead them to victory in the Console market.


[/rant]



While i know with the GTA series, thare is definitely a huge gain thare. but i i am not right, i remember reading that San Andreas was the last game that was under the sony exclusive contract. If MS was to go ahead and get Rockstars Exclusive GTA contract, every XBOX 360 would be sold out when GTA 6 comes out.



Do any of you guys remember when the halo series came out, xbox sales slyrocked something like 200 precent in a half year. Just keep that in mind.



If MS gets GTA, sony is screwed, becuase sony only has Gran Turismo, but XBOX has halo, GTA, and forza to fill the need for the GT fans. Forza 2 should give GT5 a major run for its money.

[2fast4u-JR]

They have the resources to take over for sure.

[2fast4u-JR]

I think it is al about game avialabilty. MS should pay the money and lock in the good games if they are smart.

[join nbk]

I apologize for the double post, but i just realized something

blu ray is already a consumer product in japan. I think sony may go be a japan exclusive, becuase the US is based off of microsoft more than sony. If you look in japan, you will find stacks of 360s due to japan supporting only japans industry

[perkam]

I apologize for the double post, but i just realized something

blu ray is already a consumer product in japan. I think sony may go be a japan exclusive, becuase the US is based off of microsoft more than sony. If you look in japan, you will find stacks of 360s due to japan supporting only japans industry Hiroshima didn't help the US rep there ;) :p:

But I hope we see a "revolution"ary difference in ps3 sales :D

Perkam

[join nbk]

Revolutanary as in negative or positive

[trakslacker]

Revolutanary as in negative or positive

Come on man, the quotes have to give that one away....

revolutionary as in the Nintendo Revolution. Perky's hoping it's gonna take a bigger bite out of the market than the GC did.

[join nbk]

Come on man, the quotes have to give that one away....

revolutionary as in the Nintendo Revolution. Perky's hoping it's gonna take a bigger bite out of the market than the GC did.
im not a nintendo fan, so i hope not

[JAWS]

im not a Nintendo fan, so I hope not

The gamecube has survived way longer then anyone ever expected. I wasn't a fan for a long time, but they sucked me in with all the G rated games for the children. Not sure, but if it came down to a $300(?) Revolution or $700(?) ps3.......;)

[AJF]

Do any of you guys remember when the halo series came out, xbox sales slyrocked something like 200 precent in a half year. Just keep that in mind.

I bought an Xbox for the Halo games, but like most people I branched out into others. That's a very valid point. If Microsoft were to lock up more of the popular games it'd be good for clearing their inventory.

[Breeze]

I only bought an Xbox on release for Halo. FInsished the game and have never played it since. What a waste of money :(.

Saying that I want to build a PC to play Oblivion so I havn't learnt anything.

[JAWS]

I only bought an Xbox on release for Halo. FInsished the game and have never played it since. What a waste of money :(.

Saying that I want to build a PC to play Oblivion so I havn't learnt anything.

waste of money.....come on ;) there are some many different things you could do to your xbox. create a media center box for the family room.

[Breeze]

Things just sitting there getting dusty. I should really do something with it, maybe a doorstop ;).

[CompGeek]

I think the fact that it isnt coming out until over a year after the 360, and will cost $200 more when it finally does is a huge blow. I certainly would rather buy a 360 at this point even though I was planning on PS3.

My PC > either though.

[`schr0et]

I refuse to buy Blu-ray (and probably HD DVD) since both of those companies will limit when and where and how you can use it.

I won't be buying Vista either, buying crap like this just chains you down to corporations even more (not saying we aren't already :P). You can keep your precious intellectual property all to yourself.

Oh yeah Xbox 360 is def not going to "take over" any market. The only place Xbox sold out was the U.S. and Austraila, and even here it sold only around 300,000 units.

Over its time the PS2 has sold close to 12,000,000.

That being said I'm not interested in console gaming to the least, so they wouldn't be able to sell me anyway =)

[andyisc00l]

i think whats really stupid is hd-dvd didn't go to 1080p..ces they said blue-ray@1080p just looks better then hd-dvd...isn't that just incredibly stupid?

[pocketbikeuk]

i think whats really stupid is hd-dvd didn't go to 1080p..ces they said blue-ray@1080p just looks better then hd-dvd...isn't that just incredibly stupid?
you have to remember this is all gen 1 there is nothin to say it wont support it in the future just for now at release there isnt the greatest need/demand.

[JAWS]

Sony to Lose $900M in 2006/2007 on PS3 Launch?

http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/sony/sony-to-lose-900m-in-20062007-on-ps3-launch-169963.php

[The_End]

Sony to Lose $900M in 2006/2007 on PS3 Launch?

http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/sony/sony-to-lose-900m-in-20062007-on-ps3-launch-169963.php

Really thats crazy, i hope sony pull out infront of xbox though (allthough i still like both)

[buff]

If ya'll dont remember the design of the 360.....

The GPU has the 512mb of ram at really insane bandwidth.
The GPU is also the chipset, so the CPU gets insane ram bandwidth.
10mb EDO dram is built onto the r500 to be used for AA, AF, etc, so that the rest of the bandwidth isn't bothered by those things. Essentially it gets free AA and AF.

[gohan773]

Why put value in console graphics when they are allready at a disadvantage?

[JAWS]

this will kill Sony.......:nono:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=100666

[Anarki]

this will kill Sony.......:nono:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=100666

Thats ludacris!

[andyisc00l]

To all who say sony will fail, they are a 70 billion dollar industry, on cnet reviews, sony takes the top 10 in just about every categroy that exists(best TV, cameras, recievers, dvd players, headphones, etc), psp sold 4 million units in the US alone, they own sony pictures which owns tons of television shows like seinfeld, king of queens, malcom in the middle, and movies like the da vinci code, pink panther, bac boys 2, mr. deeds, jerry maguires, top 20 semi conductors of the world, own alot of games like everquest, the matrix, tom raider, final fantasy, sony will not gao away..they own half of BMG music which owns columbia and epic and tons of other labels, they're friggen huge, forgot to mention sony computers (vaio), oh yea 150,000 employees worldwide...I just thought this information was kind of interesting for those who care..

[The_End]

good point sony never will die :)

[Andrew LB]

PS3 = BetaMax.

[Eclipsed]

As for Sony losing money on console sales, the same thing happened when ps2 hit. I remeber reading that they lost 100 bucks a console for a while. PS3 will own your soul unless all this crap about no used games turns out to be true.

[DilTech]

No jarrod I have absolutley no idea what a unified shader architecture is /sarcasm. It also proceses geometry too... And besides the r500 is partial DX10 compliant. And also the Xbox only has 512MB ram and FC:I probly needs liek 1GB ram to run good so of course they have to knock down textures abit. But i am more then positive the r500 has more graphics processing grunt then what is shown on games like FC:S

Umm, no, the R500 doesn't include the Geometry shader. That's what stops it from being a true DX10 part. This is *why* it's a partial dx10 part.
http://www.ukgamer.com/article.php4?id=322&page=1


ATi have a distinct edge when it comes to designing their unified shader silicon in that they've already done it once for the X-Box360, though the 360's lack of geometry shader capability mean it's not a true DX10 part, and true DX10 will be the only kind of DX10 you'll get. Gone is partial precision, gone is "caps bits" which allowed a game or application to poll the graphics card for information on its capabilities, gone are any of the inconsistencies of previous DX incarnations. Either the hardware supports DX10 in its entirety or it's mot a DX10 part at all, it's that simple. That's not to say ATi, or anyone else in fact, can't include capabilities above an beyond what's called for by DX10, in fact ATi admitted to having done just that, it simply means that they won't be accessible from within DX10 and will need to be coded for individually by games developers, perhaps then eventually being absorbed into the next release.



There's NOTHING it can do that the RSX cannot, other than have it's shaders switch on the fly. Therefore, there's nothing the Xbox360 can do that current, on the shelf PC's, cannot do.

[p360stick]

I think it just all depends on which HD format the will win if the HD DVD win then 360 wins. if the blue way then PS3

i think PS3 will have better games than 360 but i also think that HD DVD will win over blue ray because its cheaper.

[ak_47_boy]

Why would sony even make bluray? No video rental places are going to carry dvd and bluray... they will be avalible only online... plus who wants to use the ps3 for a bluray player, its like playing Cd's on a ps1.....

[Metroid]

Yes it could break Sony's financial at first at second send many people to home or saying properly fire all.
I'm very disappointed with sony not because what they are giving to us that I think is a fantastic hardware but for the games showed until now that lacks everything, they never say something to us , but I think their software programming is not good as the microsoft is. We all know microsoft is years ahead of any company you we speak about software programming being all excelents programs. I think Nintendo will really be the world choice because it play a important role inthe video game industry related just with games, that means made for gamers.

Playstation 3 = :(
Microsoft XBOX 360 = :)
Nintendo Wii = :toast:

[vudoodoodoo]

Sony is risking alot w/ the PS3.
WTF @ Blue Ray Disc... couldn't they at least use a better name lol. Something like DVD2 or DVD Plus or w/e. Nobody will know wtf Blue Ray is...
Who knows until release though. Maybe they have something up their sleaves...
But I am looking forward to MSG4. I'll get a PS3 eventually. I don't really like XBOX360 that much.
The Wii is pretty nice though. Probably gonna grab that up.

[Celcius]

Sony's definately risking a lot. Just to promote blu-ray, they put it in their system and risk having people not buy it because of price. Plus, the $600 version includes some features that $500 version owners won't be able to add later such as hdmi.

[Mat347]

A buddy of mine who frequents the local Game Stop told me that the guy who works there said the PS3 console will have different packages(like the 360) and will be comparable to todays 360 prices(360 is supposed to drop in price in the near future) but the games will be FROM $80 to ~$130....anyone else hear this???

BTW, I primarily game on PC..but will be getting a Wii...that controller has great potential and supposedly Nintendo will exploit it.

[clayton]

I hope PlayStation 3 would stink, so PS4 could turn out better.
________
Honda Shadow specifications (http://www.honda-wiki.org/wiki/Honda_Shadow)

[Bloody_Sorcerer]

in response to the question posed by the thread title: I sure hope so.

[SnakeEyez]

ps3 is only coming out for one reason and its because msoft is pushing the console scene to a new level. Sony lovers will realize this when they dont get as many games coming out and not nearly as fast as they will be not to mention already are coming out for the 360.

[Soulburner]

It won't kill Sony, they have their hands in too many other markets to be taken down that easily.

[Shift]

It won't kill Sony, they have their hands in too many other markets to be taken down that easily.
Very true, but other leaders in the other markets are taking Sony down. For instance Samsung is beating Sony to cell phones, and LG is beating Sony to televisions. I also read a few months ago that Sony closed down many of its factories due to the lack of sales. If the PS3 doesn't sell as expected, then yeah Sony will take a big hit.

[IMCL85]

sony will get owned because this peice of &$#! they soo called next generation of gaming. and yes I'm an anti sony person.

[mykeos]

sony does have problems in many markets.but yo are underestimating the power of cell(tm).It will take some time for game developers to learn how to program for it though.

[DonS1mpson]

Only time will tell.

I still can't understand why everyone is hating on the PS3 any way?

[milkcafe]

PS3 20GB version is 49800yen

this year 11.11

I will grab it from a osaka nihonbashi Game shop:cool:

[Kingcarcas]

It can and probably will, all i know is someone is getting fired after Sony loses the crown :slap:

[MrDeeds]

Im definately not a sony fan but its just not feasable that a company as diversified as sony would sink because the ps3 doesnt do well.

Did they dissappear when betamax didnt work out? No
Did they collapse when nobody bought minidisc player? No

They have a market cap of damn near 38 billion dollars. They could easily afford the ps3 tanking. They'd just go back to the drawing board and work on ps4. I do know i wont be initially purchasing the ps3 at launch prices because of the bend me over prices.

[luceri]

sony definitely isn't going to tank but there's no question it'd hurt them. they've been slowly losing the consumer electronics quality battle to samsung the past 5 years and this would be one more blow they really don't need right now.

[aintz]

ps3 is way 2 leet. releasing a super duper uber playstation with rsx technology 8 days after the release of dx10. truelllllly leet.

[Kerby1280]

PS3 launch reminds me of the PSP launch. Overhyped with beautiful looking games and lousy gameplay and it capable of playing movies. We all know about UMD movies and how they cost much more than their DVD counter parts and could only be viewed on the PSP- horrible idea. After all the eye candy is aborbed the games got boring. At the time of the PSP launch, alot of people predicted Sony to take the handheld crown from Nintendo- a year later it is struggling while Nintendo rehashes their hand-held over and over again and it sells like hot cakes. Nintendo is nostalgia- I'm sure everyone remembers when they first picked up Super Mario Brothers and Duck Hunt or when they first traverse Link thru Hyrule.

If only Miyamoto was given hardware as powerful as the PS3 to develop games on.

[Metroid]

Sony thought that it would take the Nintendo crowed to their side. What a mistake.

Experience speaks more than hardware power..

[squilliam]

First of all, both versions of the PS3 will have HDMI
output.

Saying the 360 and the PS3 are comparable
in price is arguable. With the HD-DVD drive
purchase, the 360 is as much as the "better"
PS3 and has less drive space.

The big point however, is that you are not
being forced to adapt into this new format
just yet and you can hook up the HD-DVD
drive to your 360 and your computer,
allowing for much more usage, if you decide
to later buy into it. Heck you can't even get
a BRD for your computer, for that cheap
($200 for the HD-DVD drive). Through a little
modding you can even get the drive to fit in
your PC.

Within the next year Msoft plans to drop the
prices, by how much I am not sure. Even if it
isn't much, I am sure you will see some really
good bundles. As for plans to incorporate the
HD-DVD drive into the system, I highly doubt it.

A really good reference to such information is
another set of posts I have made on the subject:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120773

One key thing from those posts is a technology
called "Procedural Texturing" it is one of many
new ways to make a really good looking texture
fit into 90% less of a space. Think of taking a
480MB game and making it fit into a 50MB space ;)
and you'll have the general Idea.

[Kingcarcas]

^ Which will make HD-DVD and Blu-Ray useless for games :rofl: So many people are going to get owned, "but teh teh PS3 is dah cheap blu-rayz playa" :doh: Do people need to be reminded Sony has never won a format war :stick:

[Bigpig]

Will it kill sony No.

Sony is still making a mint on the ps2 and it's software

As for Sony not ever wining a format war..

They have more Film studios than HD :stick:
And will have more Films on blu-ray over the next year

[[XC] Lead Head]

Will it kill sony No.

Sony is still making a mint on the ps2 and it's software

As for Sony not ever wining a format war..

They have more Film studios than HD :stick:
And will have more Films on blu-ray over the next year

Bumpity bump bump bump!

[serialk11r]

Well I must say, there are idiots who think bluray improves graphics, and there are idiots who think ps3s are like super powerful and like even better than the best computers...want verification? They're in my school :fact:

Sony was taking a risk by using the PS3 to try to get the bluray disc out. But seriously, what game needs 25GB?????? They're making the customer pay more for a total waste of EVERYTHING.

[afireinside]

Sony was taking a risk by using the PS3 to try to get the bluray disc out. But seriously, what game needs 25GB?????? They're making the customer pay more for a total waste of EVERYTHING.

I watch movies. I like my movies having HD content that takes up 25gb. I hate Sony and I hope bluray fails hard but as of now, it aint happenin. They do make some nice TVs though...

[Datalogger]

I'm loving my 60gb PS3.

The 360 Elite comes out the day after my birthday, I believe I'll be getting it, I only wish it was 65nm.

[Soulburner]

Well I must say, there are idiots who think bluray improves graphics, and there are idiots who think ps3s are like super powerful and like even better than the best computers...want verification? They're in my school :fact:

Sony was taking a risk by using the PS3 to try to get the bluray disc out. But seriously, what game needs 25GB?????? They're making the customer pay more for a total waste of EVERYTHING.
Blue Dragon (360) is going to be a 3-DVD game. That is why you need HD-DVD (which Microsoft skimped on) or Blu-Ray (which Sony didn't).

Look back a bit. A lot of games are now DVD games but a lot are still CD, and shouldn't be because my Titan Quest game is 5 CD's but could have been pressed onto a single DVD.

When you are putting high resolution (aka "HD") content into a game you will eventually exceed the limitations of a DVD.

[[XC] Lead Head]

Blue Dragon (360) is going to be a 3-DVD game. That is why you need HD-DVD (which Microsoft skimped on) or Blu-Ray (which Sony didn't).

Look back a bit. A lot of games are now DVD games but a lot are still CD, and shouldn't be because my Titan Quest game is 5 CD's but could have been pressed onto a single DVD.

When you are putting high resolution (aka "HD") content into a game you will eventually exceed the limitations of a DVD.

HD content being what? Because I've got some 2-3 year old games that can run on HD reses

[serialk11r]

Blue Dragon (360) is going to be a 3-DVD game. That is why you need HD-DVD (which Microsoft skimped on) or Blu-Ray (which Sony didn't).

Look back a bit. A lot of games are now DVD games but a lot are still CD, and shouldn't be because my Titan Quest game is 5 CD's but could have been pressed onto a single DVD.

When you are putting high resolution (aka "HD") content into a game you will eventually exceed the limitations of a DVD.

But what about dual layer DVDs? I don't think games will be exceeding 8GB anytime soon...

[Soulburner]

I'm not sure if Blue Dragon is using dual layer or not, but they said it will be 3 DVD's so I doubt it. Can these consoles read dual layer?

[saaya]

id say in the long run blueray will win, in the near term there will be hybrid players. about the ps3, i dont know but i doubt itll be very successfull even with killer game titles. i hope it follows the same fate as the dreamcast, but even if it does i doubt it would be the end of sony.

[Starscream]

the PS3 cant kill Sony.
at max a few people will lose their jobs. Sony is active in alot of markets. Yes the PS3 is a important product to Sony but it isnt everything.

the PS3 is important to them cause its not only a console but also a tool for them to market Blu-ray.

[Revv23]

I'm not sure if Blue Dragon is using dual layer or not, but they said it will be 3 DVD's so I doubt it. Can these consoles read dual layer?

of course they can dual layer dvds have been around since the birth of DVD's.

[Growly]

the PS3 cant kill Sony.
at max a few people will lose their jobs. Sony is active in alot of markets. Yes the PS3 is a important product to Sony but it isnt everything.

the PS3 is important to them cause its not only a console but also a tool for them to market Blu-ray.This is what I'm thinking. Sony may be making a bold move - with a bit of "because we can" thrown in there, but I don't see how it can bring the whole empire down. There's always potential though, and that'll be unbelievable. The PS3 will become "the little console that could".

[Kingcarcas]

^ That's my cat in your avatar:D IIRC they do use DL DVDs.

Blue Dragon (360) is going to be a 3-DVD game. That is why you need HD-DVD (which Microsoft skimped on) or Blu-Ray (which Sony didn't).

Look back a bit. A lot of games are now DVD games but a lot are still CD, and shouldn't be because my Titan Quest game is 5 CD's but could have been pressed onto a single DVD.

When you are putting high resolution (aka "HD") content into a game you will eventually exceed the limitations of a DVD.
Just like some RPGs on PS1 had multiple CDs......what's the big deal?? I'd rather switch a disc after 10+ hours then pay $200 for a format that might be obsolete down the road.

Well I must say, there are idiots who think bluray improves graphics, and there are idiots who think ps3s are like super powerful and like even better than the best computers...want verification? They're in my school :fact:

Sony was taking a risk by using the PS3 to try to get the bluray disc out. But seriously, what game needs 25GB?????? They're making the customer pay more for a total waste of EVERYTHING.
Finally someone who agrees :toast: And Kojima said MGS4 needs more than DL BD (50GB) :rofl:

[afireinside]

Just like some RPGs on PS1 had multiple CDs......what's the big deal?? I'd rather switch a disc after 10+ hours then pay $200 for a format that might be obsolete down the road.

Switching disks sucks, you now have 2 disks instead of 1 which sucks, and it doesn't help progress technology.

There's no risk that you'll buy a PS3 then be screwed if BL dies because THE DRIVE IS BLURAY THEREFORE THE GAMES MUST BE BLURAY.

[Webster]

I pretty much think that the PS3 is gonna push Sony to its crying point in the US. The PS3 reminds me alot of other failed consoles, like the 3DO, or the Neo Geo. It has superior technologies than all the other consoles, but not enough decent games. I dont really care how fantastic the graphics are if the games arent worth buying.

I personally see the 360 and the Wii dominating in the US. By now there are tons of great games out for the 360, and a few good ones, and tons of promise for the Wii. What does the PS3 have? Not too much.....Resistance, its worth playing maybe, Motorstorm, not my cup of tea. PS3 has already lost exclusive rights to FFXIII and Devil May Cry 3. So what does it have left? MGS4, maybe. I could possibly see myself buying a PS3 for $400 to play this, MAYBE.

I know you hear this alot, but im gonna say it again. Sony lost over 300$ (more than the PS2 originally cost) with every 20GB PS3 sold. Thats why they stopped selling them. They lose slightly less (something like $275) with the 60GB version. We'll just have to see how this one turns out, but my money is on the 360, with the Wii in a tie, or in a close 2nd

[ahmad]

MGS is not exclusive...

[Webster]

MGS4 is exclusive, at the present moment

[Soulburner]

MGS4 is exclusive, at the present moment
Sony is losing almost all their exclusives...even the Final Fantasy exlusivity is in jeopardy...

[trance565]

if anything the ps3 will become the main market for bluray players. dont most cost like 1k+ right now? the ps3 seems to be the cheapest lol.
although if they lose final fantasy, they are screwed royally.

[Webster]

Blu ray drives and players run around the same or slightly less than a PS3, that is if you look hard enough

[Kingcarcas]

If Blu-ray does win, picking up a PS3 for $200 in a few years with a bunch of cheap games would be a really sweet deal. Right now though i'll just wait for a 360 price drop. :toast:

[m0da]

Some/most Original XBOX games use DVD9 discs >>

[cursivearmy1]

is the ps3 still the cheapest blu-ray solution?

[firestarter71]

is the ps3 still the cheapest blu-ray solution?

At the moment, yes but Pioneer is releasing a $300 BD drive next month.

[JAWS]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/06/08/sony_job_cuts/

hmmmmm


Sony has confirmed it intends to cut jobs at its Computer Entertainment Unit in the US, just two months after it announced plans to slash eight per cent of its European workforce.

The troubled firm's game division reported an operating loss of $1.91bn for the year ended 31 March due to the high-costs associated with its PlayStation 3 console. Sony appears to have failed to re-coup those expenses because of the immense popularity of Nintendo's Wii.
In fact, according to recent figures published by the Japanese games magazine publisher Enterbrain, the Wii is currently outselling the PS3 by at least four to one in Japan, while in the US, it was the top-selling new console for the fourth consecutive month in April, with some 360,000 units shifted versus just 82,000 for Sony's latest machine.

[bullet2urbrain]

To answer the original question.

Nope dont think so, not anymore atleast. :D

[JAWS]

To answer the original question.

Nope dont think so, not anymore atleast. :D


I have to agree. I won’t buy a PS3 (maybe when they drop to $250), but Sony seems to be pulling through.

[eXclusive]

My answer is no, its like microsoft they havent made money on the xbox since its day of release but they made it clear they arent stopping

The Xbox 360 is actually profitable now.


I have to agree. I won’t buy a PS3 (maybe when they drop to $250), but Sony seems to be pulling through.

+1


_____________________________________

I just went and read the first page of this thread for the first time. Its funny how many people had it figured PS3 would fail and even Blu Ray wouldn't win. I think that the PS3 has really strong legs to stand on as a Blu Ray player and console in one right now. That makes it a very capable piece of technology for consumers to use for many different reasons. It also has a great Linux and homebrew environment for even the most hardcore purchasers. Above all of that the PS3 is still a reliable and quieter console with a great track record for non-failure, a la RROD. If you don't want to spend a butt load of money on a computer, or $500 on a crappy Dell, the PS3 can do all of your web browsing ETC ETC also! How could it fail now? Its software is showing us now just what it needs to be for the console to remain successful. But if Sony can't keep cranking out blockbuster software, then they could lose the hearts of the Sony fans out there.

They need to make big headlines with big titles:
God Of War Series - Slated
Gran Turismo - out, and another one coming.
MGS4 - On its way
Final Fantasy Series - Coming out, some time.. :(
Killzone - will have to be good and earn its spotlight, its not getting a lot of press so I'm not holding my breath for this one
Resistance 2 - actually looking like a good improvement on the first one.

I think a lot of the above software has most of the sway in how successful this console can be.

[Soulburner]

The Xbox 360 is actually profitable now.



+1


_____________________________________

I just went and read the first page of this thread for the first time. Its funny how many people had it figured PS3 would fail and even Blu Ray wouldn't win. I think that the PS3 has really strong legs to stand on as a Blu Ray player and console in one right now. That makes it a very capable piece of technology for consumers to use for many different reasons. It also has a great Linux and homebrew environment for even the most hardcore purchasers. Above all of that the PS3 is still a reliable and quieter console with a great track record for non-failure, a la RROD. If you don't want to spend a butt load of money on a computer, or $500 on a crappy Dell, the PS3 can do all of your web browsing ETC ETC also! How could it fail now? Its software is showing us now just what it needs to be for the console to remain successful. But if Sony can't keep cranking out blockbuster software, then they could lose the hearts of the Sony fans out there.

They need to make big headlines with big titles:
God Of War Series - Slated
Gran Turismo - out, and another one coming.
MGS4 - On its way
Final Fantasy Series - Coming out, some time.. :(
Killzone - will have to be good and earn its spotlight, its not getting a lot of press so I'm not holding my breath for this one
Resistance 2 - actually looking like a good improvement on the first one.

I think a lot of the above software has most of the sway in how successful this console can be.
Just to clarify, Gran Turismo isn't really "out" we just got a preview of the game. And there are actually far more really cool titles in development that I read about every month in GI that I never see talked about online much.

[Revv23]

I hated the PS3 when it came out, now, with it BRD capabilities, its codec support, and awesome UI i think it's the stronger platform. Especially at it's current competetive price (it's cheaper then most BRD players, and offers better support as it's constantly updating the BRD codec's. :))

[dexster]

i am NOT a sony fan and hence not a ps3 fan...

until the opportunity presented itself and i ended up getting a ps3... now i am still not a sony fan BUT the ps3 is my most played console (out of the wii and x360)

ps3 (despite being price prohibitive initially) is an brilliant piece of gear, good value for money (blue-ray) and as more people realise this more people will buy it

[Chris_redfield]

No way will the PS3 be the end of Sony. Hell i think the sony corporation would be impossible to kill off what with all the money they have so far succesfully managed in the Blu-Ray technology, their expansive electronics department, their film studio's, music studio's etc.

Sony are massive and if the PS3 is a failure I can't see it being a major deal but considering Sony entered the console market originally through a fall out with nintendo. I think they've come a bloody long way. I just hope that Sony can get the 'first,' console out of the next generation, that will give them a lead in the sales. Though I don't want them to sacrifice quality in order to do that like microsoft did. The 360 is a piece of tat, but its just got so many great games for it. Microsoft knew that they could get away with selling a piece of tat as long as it played games. Just look at windows. All microsoft have done is make sure they have a platform and then buy up a load of studios with which to provide great material for it. Meanwhile Sony spent time and effort developing a great platform to discover that all the game devs were suddenly sucking bill gates :banana::banana::banana::banana: in the hope for a flash of his wallet.

[Soulburner]

Sony also has a large manufacturing business, with customers like Nikon. They make LCD screens, Li-Ion batteries, digital camera sensors, and many other components.

There is no way a single item, even if it is such a high risk big ticket item like the PS3, could take down such a diversified company.

[JAWS]

Holiday Videogame Sales Meltdown Part 3: Sony's PlayStation Family Struggles
Old guard of PS2 beginning to fade, PSP lacking a big game, and PS3 selling sluggishly.


http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3171989

Reading the whole 3 part story it seems Sony really needs a price cut. The $199 360 has sold very well.

[knissel]

No its a great blu ray player!

[ownage]

No its a great blu ray player!

A blu ray player that can play games. :rolleyes:

From day one game developers say that they have trouble tweaking the games for enough FPS on PS3, while they say they have this problem far less on xbox360. If you see IQ comparisons between PC, x360 and PS3 you see that PS3 is already lacking graphical power. Xbox-360 seems most future proof in my eyes. I don't believe blu ray will be that important for a console in the next 3 years. For that reason I think they should make the console much cheaper.

[Xello]

Heh, the 360 will never be profitable due to the sheer mountain of cash they've had to put in place just to cover RROD. Neither will the PS3, Microsoft and Sony have always manufactured at a loss, they make their returns on software.

Nintendo is in another league there, they're manufacturing a machine that is essentially a gamecube, of course they're making bags of cash.


If you see IQ comparisons between PC, x360 and PS3 you see that PS3 is already lacking graphical power.

Care to back up any of this? I've only played a handful of games that are on both consoles but on each one the ps3 always has at least a slight advantage. Oblivion is a good example, Bethesda commented on being able to make improvements (http://uk.ps3.ign.com/articles/762/762108p1.html) with the ps3 (http://uk.ps3.ign.com/articles/738/73831http://uk.ps3.ign.com/articles/738/738319p1.html9p1.html) version due to the hardware.

[ownage]

Care to back up any of this? I've only played a handful of games that are on both consoles but on each one the ps3 always has at least a slight advantage. Oblivion is a good example, Bethesda commented on being able to make improvements with the ps3 version.

http://www.gamespot.com/features/6202552/index.html

:yepp:

[Xello]

http://www.gamespot.com/features/6202552/index.html

:yepp:

There are some differences there, but this (http://uk.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs.php?topic_id=26664089) shows some too, in favour of the ps3. More importantly i think, Bethesda haven't come out and actually said anything to indicate that the 360 offered them advantages over the ps3. I've been out of console gaming for a while but last i remember, the ps3 was generally accepted as having more power under the hood, i'll have to pull up a spec sheet.

[articu]

No disrespect, but the question of Sony Corporation being killed off due to the PS3 is silly

:shakes:

Just consider all the other branches of Sony

a poorly selling console will ruin Sony ? take out Sony BMG ? Sony Pictures ?

hm...

[reberto]

A blu ray player that can play games. :rolleyes:
A Blu-Ray player that can play games, run Linux, fold, have as much hard drive spaces as you feel like, and can download HD movies.

[PhxProvost]

if your keeping up with current events then you would know that sony is not doing very well as a COMPANY. I dont think the ps3 can kill sony but its not helping them at all right now either :down:

[DistortioniZm]

That's like asking if xbox360 could kill microsoft if it tanked. Sony has been around the block a few times and ps3 was probably more of a slow long term product to them. I have both an xbox3 and a ps3 and I keep asking myself if coulda saved money without buying an xbox and dumped into my pc. I get basically the same experience from both of those. I don't get the fanboy camps at all. Lately I've been playing games on my ps3 and watching HD movies on it as well and am contemplating selling my xbox3 because I never use it. It's all a matter of opinion anyways. My GF is pretty pissed about Final Fantasy being held off another year because of MS, but whatever.

[DistortioniZm]

A blu ray player that can play games. :rolleyes:

From day one game developers say that they have trouble tweaking the games for enough FPS on PS3, while they say they have this problem far less on xbox360. If you see IQ comparisons between PC, x360 and PS3 you see that PS3 is already lacking graphical power. Xbox-360 seems most future proof in my eyes. I don't believe blu ray will be that important for a console in the next 3 years. For that reason I think they should make the console much cheaper.
This is because developers can run their engines and optimize on a pc. PS3 developers have to run the compiled code on ps3 hardware. Pretty gey imo but I still like my ps3.

[reberto]

This is because developers can run their engines and optimize on a pc. PS3 developers have to run the compiled code on ps3 hardware. Pretty gey imo but I still like my ps3.

As do developers for the 360 and Wii :rolleyes:

[Kingcarcas]

Sony has lost a ton of cash, but so have other companies now days, will the Ps3 alone kill them? No.

P.s. Xello you can delete your posts in case you doublepost.

[KingKwentyne]

I dont believe that the PS3 will bring sony down. the only reason they are moving less units than the competition is because the ps3 is just more expensive.

[Xello]

Sony has lost a ton of cash, but so have other companies now days, will the Ps3 alone kill them? No.

P.s. Xello you can delete your posts in case you doublepost.

Thanks pal, did not know that :D

[trance565]

alot of my friends who have a 360 are now buying ps3, due to the bigger variety of games.

seems xbox has mostly shooter games with a couple rpg's and strategy games here and there, none of which are great, save fable. least that's how one of my friends put it. i dont pay much attention to xbox, but i do know that he has fable, and the rest of the games he has are shooters, or non exclusives.

and can you imagine how big the next final fantasy game could have been had they stayed ps3 exclusive and put the thing on a bluray disc? it would be like ff7 play time of 60+ hrs, which would be AWESOME.

[Soulburner]

trance, they will probably just do multi-DVD, just like Blue Dragon was 3 discs.

[trance565]

i would hope so, im tired of these 30-40 hour ff games with horrible characters and annoying story lines.

i miss the old fight system too

[GTSRboy]

boy this thread is 3 years old, and its now clear things have changed for the PS3. When the Slim comes out, PS3's will sell like crazy. And as we move into the future [better graphics and blu rays] the PS3 will continue moving forward and the XBOX will be the one hurting, unable to keep up with either of those

Speaking of 'killing' a company, i dont think the 360's 54% failure rate will help Microsoft's image :)

[skugpezz]

I dont think the slim is the cause of the sale increase, it is more caused by the price drop

[JAWS]

I dont think the slim is the cause of the sale increase, it is more caused by the price drop

I will have to agree. If the slim comes out at $399 it just sits there like the others.

[cmanser]

Dang - Sony is really hating it now even though the PS3 is a great system now.