Need suggestions; upgrade to PIII Alienware Machine...

[Bigal]

Hi - I'm new to this forum, and I am looking for some ideas or help with an upgrade to my friend's Pentium III Alienware machine. He wants to take this 500MHz machine up as far as he can, but within a reasonable dollar limit (yet to be set :p ). I think that if we need to spend more than $500, then he might as well buy another box. Anyway, first I'll list his system specifications, then I'll tell you about my ideas. If you have other suggestions, or if you know something I'm considering just won't work right, then please help me out. I thank all of you in advance!

System as it now stands:

Motherboard: Abit BE6, with Award bios (440BX chipset)
3 SDRAM slots, two filled with 2 X 128 MB PC100 SDRAM
SLOT 1 Pentium III (500 / 512 / 100 / 2.0V) = 500 MHz, with
a heatsink / fan combination
Antec 300 W power supply
Geforce 3 videocard (I don't see any markings to verify this yet)
Sound Blaster Live sound card, with midi port and other ports
attached via a separate slot adapter
ISA modem
IBM 22GB hard drive on one IDE port
DVD ROM and a 100 MB Zip internal drive on another IDE port
1 floppy drive
four IDE ports (2 unused), in which two of them are Ultra DMA/66
2 empty 5.25 drive bays, 1 empty 3.5 drive bay

My ideas (keep in mind that he wants this to look good too - as in adding a side window, cold cathode lighting, etc.)

(1) Upgrade the bios to be6th.exe (dated 2000/07/31). Go into the bios, and see how high the CPU multiplier will go; I want at least a 10X - will this be available?
(2) Insert an Abit Sockett device to go from the Slot 1 configuration to the socket 370 used by the PPGA Pentium IIIs.
(3) Buy a 1 GHz (or faster?) Pentium III socket 370 chip. Get the system running with the new CPU, old RAM, old hard drive.
(4) Buy new hard drive (60 - 80 GB), CD-RW, network card, 2-3 Vantec 80mm Stealth fans; install all and verify proper operation.
(5) Cosmetic stuff - install custom laser-etched photo window, multicolor cold cathode, rounded IDE cables; maybe paint the inside of the case satin black. Consider painting outside of case - this is the early Alienware beige case.

Biggest issue is the Slot 1 to socket 370 adapter - will it work properly with this system? My friend has one that I can get for $20, so this will save me big bucks upgrading the CPU, as Slot 1 CPUs top out at 850 MHz and go for over $200!

Thanks for any help you can provide! :toast:

[TheDude]

With a $500 limit, I would sell the old mobo, ram and cpu and replace these with AMD, DDR setup. That's the best upgrade for performance...will do far more than anything you can come up with existing hardware. Depending on what he uses it for, consider other replacements as cash allows. Maybe a KX7-333 board, OCed 16 or 1700 cpu and best DDR ram you can afford...this would blow away anything you could do with modding existing stuff and is in your range, especially if you get a few bucks from old hardware on Ebay.

With your existing cards, case, etc...$500 will build a kickass AMD rig these days! Hope this helps:D

[Bigal]

I have built four systems, all with AMD processors (Athlon Classic, Athlon T-bird, Athlon XP Palimino, Athlon XP Thoroughbred-A). I hear what you are saying. One issue might be the noise increase, as running the Athlon XP 1800+ requires some significant air flow - more than the Pentium III. Other issues include the need for reinstallation of his operating system, games, etc., and the hassle of selling off the old parts.

Keeping the conversion from Intel to AMD as my last option, has anybody had experience with the Abit slot 1 to socket 370 adapter? :confused:

[CCW]

AGree with TheDude

Epox 8RDA+, XP 1800+, 512 Kingston should be well within that price range...

Craig

[split]

[i]
Keeping the conversion from Intel to AMD as my last option, has anybody had experience with the Abit slot 1 to socket 370 adapter? :confused: [/B]

You mean a slocket...old technology, and a waste of time IMO.

[Bigal]

You guys think I should just forget about the slocket device altogether? If I go with AMD, I'll need to go for a new install of the operating system, and I'm already going through that pain tonight upgrading one of my old W98 machines to W2K. I didn't want to spend all my time installing crap, when I could have more fun installing a window, cold cathode, and stuff like that!

Has anybody had experience with the slocket install? Is it a pain, and can I get a decent heatsink for the Pentium III that will fit with the socket 370 rotated perpendicular to the motherboard?

[TheDude]

As far as the new installs...if you OC for any length of time at all, you realize quickly that this has become a part of your life and come up with a good backup and install plan. I don't dread it anymore...when need be, I can re-install everything and be back up and running in very short order and have done so many times. Sorting out a good plan for this is time well spent.:D

[Tweaked!]

The Dude has a very good point, You could spend close to your 500 dollars and possibly get upgraded to a p/// 1 gb or so w/ a slotket (which I've used in the past and they work ok) But if you compare the prices of a nice p/// -vs- a Amd higher end proc setup, you'd be very close in costs. Performance wise though, the Amd would blow it away. As far as reinstalling all the software, a simple investment for Symantec Ghost would alleviate those headaches. But before I'd go with a slotket, I'd go ahead and upgrade the mobo to a Abit vh6t or so and get a few more o/cing options. But then again, there you go spending more on a system that won't compare to whats been suggested and will still cost as much if not more.

[akarukus]

I agree with Tweaked and The Dude.

With today's games that demand more processing power and memory bandwidth, you'll be wasting time and money trying to get the most out of what you already have. It will never compare to any decent AMD rig you can put together for $500 or less. Don't forget that with the socket converter you'll still be limited to 1GHz and that disgustingly slow PC100 SDRAM :eek:

IMO it is not worth going that route. If you do, he'll be wanting to upgrade again as soon as any of the new games come out this year. Then you'll be back at square 1. Reinstalling the O/S and Apps should be the least of your worries at this point. Do him a favor and perform this upgrade the way it's being recommended here. I don't think anyone here at Xtreme would steer you wrong ;)

[Bigal]

Ok, I hear you guys. I'd rather build an AMD system anyway. Of course, this will cost more than just the slotket / Pentium III 1 GHz CPU / heatsink / fan / hard drive / CDRW upgrade. In fact, it's very close to needing a whole new box!

Maybe I should look at some motherboard / CPU deals, or bare-bones systems at the computer show coming up on 02-08-03 in Chantilly, VA. We can still use the Geforce3 card from this Alienware system, and even that Alienware case if he really wants to salvage it. I'll save on the shipping and handling, and we'll have a new case to mod too (the Alienware case is a little worse for wear). He's coming to the computer show anyway, so he'll be able to pick out a case that looks good to him. Yeah, then we throw his old TNT AGP (this card came with the machine back when he bought it) card back in the Alienware machine, and set him up with a network using the NIC card I already installed. His wife can use this old box for e-mail and browsing the Internet - and pass on the gaming aspects. There's still the issue of another monitor, as his current 21" monster will go to the gaming machine. I guess we'll have to pick one up at the computer show too!

[Bigal]

Just got through flashing to the BE6_TH bios (2000/7/31). Now we have some overclocking options - a 12X multiplier, and the FSB can be jacked up to 150 MHz! Unfortunately, this 500 MHz CPU does'nt want to go any higher than 500 MHz. It won't even go to 525 MHz with the 5X multiplier and a FSB of 105 MHz. Rats, what a lame CPU. I wonder if pumping up the voltage a bit would make a difference, as if you would notice 500 MHz going to 525 MHz?

[lefthandedgoat]

www.powerleap.com has adapters that will allow you to run a new 1.0-1.4ghz pIII tualatin processor on that board. The covertor + 1ghz celeron is 119, convertor + 1.2 is 139, and convertor + 1.4 is 159 bucks. They include a heatsink/fan too.

You would just take his current processor out, and slide this in. Super eary, just like installing a classic slot A athlon.

I would still just got with an athlon system. Their stock heatsink/fan is not loud at all, and works okay.. not great, but ok.

[Bigal]

lefthandedgoat: You're on the same frequency I am, but I am one step ahead of your suggestion. I was pointed in that direction Friday morning, and after realizing that the Celeron 1.2 GHz chip from Newegg.com ($43) wasn't going to work with the Abit Sloket adapter (voltage conversion necessary but not present here), I found that powerleap product (PL-iP3/T 1400C) that fit the bill nicely. There were even reviews from folks who tried it and were successful. One guy even stated that you need to set CPU Soft in BIOS to User Defined Processer and disable Stop on Speed Error. That last comment fixed my problem with overclocking the current system - the stop on speed error halts the posting if the CPU speed doesn't match it's rating!

So, right now the system is running 550 MHz (5.0 X 110 MHz FSB), and appears stable. I ordered the PL-iP3/T 1400C for $167.95 (including shipping), and I've put about $200 into this machine so far. Once the 1400 MHz Celeron arrives, I'll put that baby in there and see if it fires up. Assuming all goes well, I think we will get another hard drive and a CD-RW at the computer show this weekend. My friend will be very happy indeed.:banana:

[Tedinde]

Just read this thread. I still Would have went with a AMD upgrade. The $167 you just paid could of bought a epox nforce2 board and 1700-1800 Tbred that could of been clocked to death.

Your friend would have been a lot happier.


Hehe, funny all of us in the intel forum are saying get AMD

[lefthandedgoat]

Glad to hear your friend is going to be happy. Good luck man

[UNCLE GREG]

Hi guys.

Big Al cc:d me on your e-mails regarding the propsed upgrade suggestions to my old Alienware system. Quite honestly, I don't understand all the terminology yet, but know that there are some great proposals out there.

Big Al and I are going to a computer show this Saturday, any suggestions for a good flat screen monitor in the 19-21" range? :banana:

[Bigal]

Uncle Greg - You really mean an LCD panel, not another CRT display, right? And where was all this money when I was pulling this system apart, looking for the biggest bang for the buck?

Just so you know, Powerleap processed the order late Monday (02-03), so I hope they ship your CPU upgrade real quick like. Your cooling solution is installed and ready for the increased load. We may still consider an upgrade to the power supply, but I want to see how that new CPU does in the system first. I stopped by Microcenter yesterday to see if they still had a few of those Antec True-Blue 480 Watt power supplies left for only $69, but those were long gone. They are back up to the regular price of $119! Good things never last...

Cooling wise, I cut out the back hole for the 60 mm Vantec Stealth fan. I cut out the two front holes for an 80 mm Vantec Stealth fan, and an Enermax 80 mm variable speed fan. I also put a Coolermaster neon fan in the side, with the coolest looking Alien metal fan grill you'll see this side of the Potomac. Oh yeah, I bumped up the FSB to 112 MHz, so your system is running at 562 MHz right now.
:toast:

[Bigal]

Whoops....the system is running at 575 MHz now. You know, it might even hit 600 MHz, but since the Powerleap 1.4 GHz Celeron is currently due to arrive tomorrow (02-05), I might not have a chance to push this CPU further.....:slobber:

[UNCLE GREG]

Sounds like I'm going to have a real "cool" machine. :-)

What's are the major differences between a LCD and a CRT display? (No, I didn't win the Lottery, and money is still tight. I'm married now, remember?)

By the way, I received a "rain check" at Best Buy for the 42X CD re-write for $30 (taking into account the two mail-in rebate offers). Once the new shipment arrives, they'll notify me and I can purchase the 42X at the discounted price.

[Bigal]

An LCD is a Liquid Crystal Display. This is generally a flat panel, only a few inches thick. Every cell is addressed much like memory. The LCD consumes much less power than a CRT, which is a Cathode Ray Tube. CRT's were among the first display devices for video signals. They provide a nice image by focusing an electron beam on the inner surface of the tube (glass enclosure), this excites the phosphor coating to create your image. Confusion comes into play when people refer to "flat screen" displays - this means a CRT with a "flat" tube, at least with respect to the display area that you can see. So flat panel means an all electronic display screen - an LCD or plasma device. A flat screen generally means a CRT with a flat surface on the tube.

[UNCLE GREG]

How much do Liquid Crystal Displays cost? Is there a brand that we should be looking for?

Any comments from the gallery?

Semper Fi!

[Bigal]

:banana:

Well, what can I say? The Powerleap PL-iP3/T 1.4GHz (Tualatin) CPU arrived this afternoon, and it didn't take long to pull the Slot 1 Pentium III and replace it with this beast. The hard drive cage sits right over the CPU (almost touching it), so I spent a few minutes trying to relocate the hard drive. I need to keep one bay open for the additional drive we'll pick up this weekend, so I considered mounting the existing hard drive on the top (above the power supply). Unfortunately, the mouting holes are set up for a 5.25 inch device, not a 3.5 inch device. So for now it sits above the CPU.

Anyway, a few tweaks with the bios, and using the default jumper settings on the PL-iP3/T unit, we were up and running at 1.4 GHz. I just had to try a little overclocking, so I bumped up the FSB from 100 MHz to 105 MHz, and as you see with the WCPUID screen snap, we have about 1470 MHz. This is effectively a 3X improvement over the stock 500 MHz original CPU.

Now it's a matter of installing a custom window, a cold cathode, and if necessary - a more powerful power supply.....:toast:

[UNCLE GREG]

Bigal

Thank you!

See you Saturday for the computer show.

I'm still hoping we can get some recommendations for a new flat screen monitor.

Dude, Tweaked, Lefthandedgoat, Tedinde, any suggestions?

[TheDude]

Nice job with the upgrade guys! :D

So happens that I just went monitor shopping and this may help with your question.
The LCD type flat screens are nice! But not the price! The best looking picture I saw was on a 17"..18" viewable LCD from NEC...but it was priced at 11 hundred odd dollars. I like at least a 19" monitor...and the actual viewable area was close.
I spent maybe 30 minutes adjusting the brightness, contrast, color, etc on all the display monitors at Staples.
I walked out with a 19" "flat screen" CRT made by Envision. It has a 20mm dot pitch and a 3 year warranty and was on sale for $199. Got it home and tweaked the settings and it has a great picture!
If money is an issue and you want value also, consider a flat screen CRT with the lowest dot pitch "mm" , longest warranty and lowest price.
If you wipe with $20 bills, then by all means get the LCD...the picture on a good one is great and the frame rates have gone up lately. I will get one when the prices drop, which they are slowly doing. :D

[UNCLE GREG]

Thanks for the great info TheDude. I'm a nearsighted guy and prefer a 19" screen or larger as well.

Good scoop regarding the CRT at Staples.

[TheDude]

I am quite pleased with the monitor for the price. Also be aware that if you find a model that they carry, for a cheaper price anywhere on the internet...if you print it out with the price and specs, including shipping, they will match it. I have done this a few times and saved significant $. :D Don't forget, usually no tax on net, but no shipping at the store. So it must be a good deal lower on net to be worth it as they match price with shipping, then add sales tax.

[Bigal]

Follow-up (03-06-03)

Well, Uncle Greg got a 17" LCD and used it for about a week before deciding that the screen was too small. He elected to use his 21" CRT instead, even though the LCD looked pretty nice at 1280 X 1024 in my opinion.

On the machine side of things, we installed a custom laser-etched photo window from www.xport1.com into the side of the Alienware case. I swapped out the red cold cathode for the blue one he wanted, and then installed a PC Mods Rheostat bus (using the 4 super bright blue LEDs) to control the rear, side, and two front intake fans. Uncle Greg also picked up a TDK 48X CDRW drive for $30 (after rebates), and we put that in there too. To top it off, I overclocked that baby a little bit more, pushing it to 1540 MHz. Even with a 300 Watt Antec power supply, it's still stable. Oh yeah, on the storage side of life, we installed that 60 GB Maxtor Ultra ATA 133 fluid bearing hard drive, and copied over his old drive contents to make it the new C drive. I then reformatted the old drive to get him back his 20 GBs. The machine is truly working very well. I think it was a smart idea to leave the original W98 operating system in there, as I believe Alienware must have tweaked the settings quite a bit. I haven't seen a W98 system run so well before......