Baking Soda as an additive?

[BGP Spook]

What would baking soda do as the water additive in a water loop with only copper in it?

It would raise the pH to a maiximum of 8.3. Which should discourage growth slightly. But what else would it do?

I am conducting an experiment to find out. I don't think it will do anything, honestly.

I placed one penny in each of the following solutions. I am doing this for kicks anyway so it doesn't matter how it turns out.

1 tsp in 100ml
1 tsp in 250ml
1 tsp in 500ml
1 tsp in 1 L

250ml with only a penny added. (For a comparison.)

All water is my local tap water.

[naTTen]

The baking soda will react with the water and form CO2 so you should not use too much in a WC system becuse the pressure could cause a leak.

[Holst]

Ive no idea to be honest.

Let us know how you get on.

[chinkgai]

wouldnt it clog things up after some time?

[Ugly n Grey]

I'd think it would...but I have no idea...it's a reactive chemical I can;t see putting it in a loop, personaly

[BGP Spook]

I will be the guinea pig. :D

I don't think it will clog in any reasonable amount of time.(months) As long as I keep the concentration below the maximum solubility which is about 8g per 100g water at 20C.

Here again this is speculation. So I will have a front row seat to find out.

Responding to naTTen:

Sodium Bicarbonate will only form CO2 when it neutralizes an acid. Once the pH level of the solution has reached an equilibrium it should stop producing CO2.(Until something with a lower pH is intorduced.)

(Disregard)
I do need to consider CO2s by product NaOH Sodium Hydroxide. (sp?)
(Disregard, I was reading the chemical formula wrong. When Sodium Bicarbonate neutralizes an acid it forms CO2 + H2O + something neutal from what is left of the reactants.)
I will pick this up later. Got to eat. :D

[Bloody_Sorcerer]

I have no idea why you would want to put baking soda in a loop, but whatever floats your boat.

[skycrane]

id say give it a try spook, and tell us what happens ;)

i was great in chem in college.... but that was many years, and a few beers ago.....

And now ive forgotten more than i remembered....

[BGP Spook]

I have no idea why you would want to put baking soda in a loop, but whatever floats your boat.


The reason I am considering it is to raise the pH of water for the purpose of dissuading normal corrosion and biological growth.

I had considered other additives like antifreeze but I wanted it to be cheap, be easy to access, and easily disposed. That last part almost all the normal additives can't claim. Especially in my city which has some very restrictive laws about the disposal of antifreeze.



id say give it a try spook, and tell us what happens

i was great in chem in college.... but that was many years, and a few beers ago..... ;)

And now ive forgotten more than i remembered....

Yeah, I am in the begining of college Chemistry 111 right now, but it has been many years since my high school Chemistry. I smoked high school chem, but I am a little rusty. :D

[skycrane]

ummm.... its not rust, its oxidation :D

[BGP Spook]

:clap: Good one! :toast:

[skycrane]

hey, where in va?

[saratoga]

Why not drop a piece of copper in some for a week and see if it does anything bad to the metal before risking a whole system?

[Ugly n Grey]

He already said he was doing that, read up

[moonlightcheese]

man, there is no end to this guy's goal of cheap water cooling lol. he has no limit! bringing chemistry into the matter to achieve water cooling under $100. that's frugal right there lol.

[fareastgq]

your better off buying some fish pet water based algae junk. That by product from any type of reaction may just clog up your block. A bottle of your local auto store's pump lubricant I bet doesn't cost anything either.

[BGP Spook]

One of the conditions of whatever I add to my water is I must be able to either thow it out or dump it down the drain.

I can't use antifreeze and most other car products because of very strict laws in my city governing how I can dispose of it and who can accept it. No one but the city recycling center can accept any such product legally and I can only dispose of it on first and third Tuesdays of odd months. It is really stupid.

The anit-algae would work but I doubt it would be cheaper than baking soda.

As for any precipitate, once the initial reaction occures when Sodium Bicarbonate is added to water I dont think much further reaction is likely to occure. And the inital precipitate should be quite easly dealt with provided I premix before I add to the water loop.

[Ugly n Grey]

I can't use antifreeze and most other car products because of very strict laws in my city governing how I can dispose of it and who can accept it.

RV anti freeze is alcohol based and dirt cheap...it's considered harmless to the environment, though you cannot drink it. It can be put in a regular household drain, the same way you can dump a mixed drink (rum and coke) down the drain. standard water treatment works on it.

[J-Mag]

why are you worried about algae in the first place? Is your loop connected to a Pond?
It won't grow in a closed loop system, especially one in a computer case that doesn't see freaking sunlight.
Everyone who "claims" they have algae are most likely seeing green copper corrosion.

[MaxxxRacer]

I can ask my chemistry 101 teacher tommorow if it would do anything in regards to the chemical side.

[skycrane]

RV anti freeze is alcohol based and dirt cheap...it's considered harmless to the environment, though you cannot drink it. It can be put in a regular household drain, the same way you can dump a mixed drink (rum and coke) down the drain. standard water treatment works on it.


:nono: :nono: you cant dump a rum and coke down the drain... thats alachol abuse :toast:

Maxxx is the Zerex glycol based anti freeze?

Spook, how about something like water wetter? guys use it all the time in thier rads for racing. and it has anti alge and anti corrosive additives added to it.

[BGP Spook]

Spook, how about something like water wetter? guys use it all the time in thier rads for racing. and it has anti alge and anti corrosive additives added to it.


Water wetter eats the rubber in some hoses. :( (Depends on the manufacturer, interesting llink (http://www.wizdforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2338).)

Concerning disposal, I didn't check but I don't think I can just dump it in my city.
(Water Wetter has ethers in it if I remember correctly, but the company says it isn't toxic.link (http://www.redlineoil.com.au/Uploads/Downloads/MSDS%20WaterWetter%20Euro%207_01.pdf))

Valvoline makes Zerex and you can find several varities of stuff to add to your cooling loop. And among them is regular Zerex antifreeze (glycol based) and Zerex Racing super coolant.([shh...its a secrete] based, I couldn't find an apt listing of ingredients.)


RV anti freeze is alcohol based and dirt cheap...

I will look into that. But it could end up in the same boat as Water Wetter.



I can ask my chemistry 101 teacher tommorow if it would do anything in regards to the chemical side.
:woot:



why are you worried about algae in the first place? Is your loop connected to a Pond?
It won't grow in a closed loop system, especially one in a computer case that doesn't see freaking sunlight.
Everyone who "claims" they have algae are most likely seeing green copper corrosion.

My water cooling wont be a fully closed system. I will be using a penny, well away form the in spout of the pump in the reservoir, to monitor corrosion. So I will need to remove the top frequently to check it.

It is very humid where I live.

We have to scrub algae off our house's where it has grown because it gets too little light. We have to air out our garage frequently (a few times a week) to keep mold from growing. We can't push our furniture against the walls in an air-conditioned house because it would promote mold growth. All House walls leak air slightly and moisture from the outside finds it way in so if you don't get rid of it quickly....


Most of Virginia, I think, has a humidity problem.
Though, I feel it is especially a problem in the Hampton Roads area, where we are close to the ocean.


Update on the pennys.

They don't seem to be affected noticeably either by normal tap water or water with baking soda in it. I realise now that I should have used distilled water because tap water has too much other stuff in it.

[moonlightcheese]

We have to scrub algae off our house's where it has grown because it gets too little light. We have to air out our garage frequently (a few times a week) to keep mold from growing. We can't push our furniture against the walls in an air-conditioned house because it would promote mold growth. All House walls leak air slightly and moisture from the outside finds it way in so if you don't get rid of it quickly....


Most of Virginia, I think, has a humidity problem.
Though, I feel it is especially a problem in the Hampton Roads area, where we are close to the ocean.
georgia is the same way. damn this southeast coast humidity >.<

[killxswitch]

just as a quick fyi, sunlight actually inhibits growth in plants, though it also triggers photosynthesis so that the plant can feed itself.

plant growth happens away from sunlight. it soaks up the energy of the sun, then uses it to grow when the sun is down, or behind clouds, or whatever.

good luck with your uber-cheap watercooling, spook. lemme know how that 1300 works out :D

[Holst]

May I suggest test number 2.

Take some pennies, put them somewhere where the algae grows easily and see if you can get some to grow on them.

Then put them into the liquids you tested above and see what happens.

[Holst]

just as a quick fyi, sunlight actually inhibits growth in plants, though it also triggers photosynthesis so that the plant can feed itself.

plant growth happens away from sunlight. it soaks up the energy of the sun, then uses it to grow when the sun is down, or behind clouds, or whatever.

good luck with your uber-cheap watercooling, spook. lemme know how that 1300 works out :D

Some things can grown without light , like mushrooms or moulds.
Ive had things growning in my water when I was running my micro bong, but never in a closed system (and I dont run ANY additive, just tap water)

[killxswitch]

mushrooms are fungi, not plants. and mold is... bacteria? or is it also a fungus? i don't actually know.

most plants need some sunlight, even if it's not direct, to grow.

[naTTen]

Mold is fungus.

[BGP Spook]

I decided to go ahead and just use distilled water for now. Though, I am also conducing an experiment with a 5% baking soda and 95% distilled water solution.

I have two small plastic containers each with 250 ml of distilled water, a copper penny and a very small amount of dish soap. One also has a table spoon (~1/2 fl. oz) of baking soda. I will be monitoring them for two weeks to track any degradation of the copper penny or any other reactions.


I completed my water cooling setup the other day. (A mostly closed system.)

(I have an AMDXP 2600, overclocked form 11.5x166 to 10x200. Ambient is 25C. All non-ambient temperatures are as reported by CPU sensor. I realise it is HIGHLY inaccurate and inconsistent but it is all I have.)
I had been idleing at 48C-50C now I am idleing at 30C-31C.
At full load, as made by a 100% CPU utilazation and normal length S&M FPU test, I went from ~70C to 34C!

(Now at 11x200 with ambient at ~27C.)
~34C idle and ~37C prime95 full load blend test. (About to work on the S&M test.)

I am very pleased with the effectiveness of my water cooling.

All told I spent about $95 including all parts, tubing, fittings, shipping, gas, and taxes.


Now I have two questions:

[question 1] Assuming I had the correct mounting hardware would the stepped MCW6002 work with socket 478, 757, 939, and 940 CPUs?

[question 2] Would there likely be any appreciable cooling disadvantages?