coments about the cell processor

[[XC] leviathan18]

today quite early in the morning i was thinking about the cell processor

back in time they told to us they wont use a graphic card, now they use the rsx from nvidia, the cell have like 6 ppu and they are going to use the phisyx to handle the physics in the game so for what they are using 200gflops or whatever it was just to handle the mem bandwith ?????

[trance565]

2000gflops .... ummmmm they using it to ummmm ..... aid .... the gfx card? ummmm .... damn, now u got me thinking the same fing thing

[[XC] leviathan18]

oh i know to decode the music xD j/k really i want idea maybe just and overated cpu in the ps3 ?????? or it just can handle all what they tought this is just weird

[Jamo]

well i never heard they werent gonna use a video card, bit far fetched that tbh, but the architecture does look promising, be good to see how they perform whats its out rather than them telling us it can push 2000000000000gflops or whatever

[eddieate]

i thought that the gfx card wasnt going to have a 'core' as such it would just be a few instructions and
stuff and whatever nvidea does that IBM cant but a couple of the cores out of the cell processor were dedicated to it?
i never really lookd into it much but thats what I understood...
I might be entirly wrong
/Ed

[Disposibleteen]

And it can run Mac's latest Tiger OS, sounds good to me.

[[XC] leviathan18]

the rsx will be known as the g80 or something like that is a fully co processor just dedicated to graphics so why they have this over rated cpu ?????? any idea

[eddieate]

maybe theyr hoping for some huge-ass bandwidth out of the memory and multi-threaded games?


And it can run Mac's latest Tiger OS, sounds good to me.
where did you hear this? intresting how about it running on the Xbox 360?
/Ed

[alexio]

the rsx will be known as the g80 or something like that is a fully co processor just dedicated to graphics so why they have this over rated cpu ?????? any idea

I believe the final specs of the Cell processor in the PS3 will be much lower than what you read now. You shouldn't believe anything that Sony says untill you have something in your hands yourself that you can test.

[[XC] leviathan18]

lol i know they like to hype but so why are they putting that little beast if they are using a PPU from novodex and the gpu from nvidia :S they can put a DC to fit their needs i know they need heck of a cpu to handle the XDR ram bandwith but that is all

[Dimitriman]

I believe the final specs of the Cell processor in the PS3 will be much lower than what you read now. You shouldn't believe anything that Sony says untill you have something in your hands yourself that you can test.

The overhyping move began quite a while ago when It was promised that the cell processor would run at least 4 Ghz, possibly 4.6Ghz they were saying at the time (about 6 months ago from today). Now we get 3.2 Ghz... well, this is 6 months before it is released, if Sony goes its usual way I wouldn't be surprised if Cell turns out 2.8, 2.6 Ghz.

[Dimitriman]

Cell will aparently handle the sound too...
[edited triple post, you're right ed and I dun wanna postwh :banana:re =P

[eddieate]

tripple post, someone want to get into the for sale forum ;)
but yea I thought 4.6 was excessive when i first read it...
/Ed

[Disposibleteen]

maybe theyr hoping for some huge-ass bandwidth out of the memory and multi-threaded games?


where did you hear this? intresting how about it running on the Xbox 360?
/Ed

Linky (http://theinquirer.net/?article=25229)

Its the Inq so dont take it for the word of god.

[[XC] leviathan18]

but i thin the os x is confirmed by sonys site

[Master_G]

Am i right in thinking they pushed back the release date of the PS3? I always wonder how good it will actually be once it is released (ie comparisons with processors then not current ones)

G

[[XC] leviathan18]

i think xbox360 revolution and ps3 will be quite similar

[onewingedangel]

they are using a PPU from novodex

no theyre not, they not having a ppu. they bought the right to use the physics engine and development tools. the cell will be doing the calculations though, not a seperate ppu.

[Sz1hart]

Anandtech was talking about the Cell awhile back, http://anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2379
I think they talk about it several times.

[onewingedangel]

that backs up what I said, they'd use the cells own ppe's (parrallell processing elements) to deal with the physics calculations, along with other suitable tasks such as sound etc. There is no stand alone ppu for the physics engine.

[[XC] leviathan18]

but do you have a source that backs what you said they wont use a stand alone ppu??? i want to read that

[aver]

Check out arstechnica.com they have a better review of the architecture then Anandtech its more complicated but its a better overview. I think that the XBOX 360 is going to end up being the more powerful of the two systems. Only because the current PC coding focus is going to change to a dual core (parallel processing enviroment) which is extremely similar to the 360. Also the 360 has XNA developer tools which i am assuming will be very similar to VS.net which is a great development enviroment.

I feel where PS3 is going to flop is in the approach they took to their architecture. I feel like the cell is something great, but I don't believe they designed it around the idea of Gaming. I beleive developers will strugle to maintain quality and performance when coding for the PS3.

[einCe]

i think xbox360 revolution and ps3 will be quite similar
pretty much except the revolutions gonna be as good as a brick
as for the cpu speeds ill be amazed if they put out over 2ghz just look at the jump from ps1 to ps2, shoot me if im wrong but i dont think that putting out specs comparable to a high end pc system for 300-400 dollars just doesnt seem cost effective.

[[XC] leviathan18]

i think nintendo is going dual core 2.5ghz power pc but not 100% sure.... besides they are creating a new "revolution" in the way we play

[trance565]

pretty much except the revolutions gonna be as good as a brick
as for the cpu speeds ill be amazed if they put out over 2ghz just look at the jump from ps1 to ps2, shoot me if im wrong but i dont think that putting out specs comparable to a high end pc system for 300-400 dollars just doesnt seem cost effective.

then what about microsoft? they setting price to 400, and they gonna have tri-core @3.2 ghz, each core being HT/2 theoretical cores

[KoHaN69]

comment...

[cadaveca]

ok, guys. even though the cell processor inside the PS3 has how many ever PPU's or SPE's or whatever you wanna call them, to expect the console to be using 100% of the provided power on release while having a life-expectancy of 10 years is insane. :slapass:

The original PS2 features 2 processors...that's how they were able to make the signifigant leap in visual quality of games through the life of the PS2...at the beginning, the second wasn't even used at all! :fact:

So, 6PPU/SPE's? sounds about right for what the games they are showing are going to need. when the graphics have become a bit outdated, then they start turning the others on... :rolleyes: like c'mon.

[Tim]

the rsx will be known as the g80 or something like that is a fully co processor just dedicated to graphics so why they have this over rated cpu ?????? any idea

Ahem, G80 is not the RSX...RSX is RSX, 90nm slightly better then the 7800GTX, G80 is DirectX10 compatible and scheduled summer 2006....(probably)

And yeah they weren't gonna use a GFX in the first place....also we see abit of a slimmed down cell here... :p:

[cadaveca]

RSX is NV47 w/128 bit bus and memory controller different from the "G70" that i supposedly have here in my machine...a memory controller that will allow AA and HDR, i hope! :mad:

[[XC] leviathan18]

well i read like the r500 for the xbox360 will be the r600 for desktop the same was going to happen with nvidia the rsx was closer to g80 than g70

[cadaveca]

Yes, becuase both of the console units will feature unified shaders, while becasue of the delay of Vista and WGF 2.0, there is no support for such things at the desktop level. The gpu's in the consoles will most likely be the very first gpu's the support WGF 2.0 properly, if i understand it correctly. BEcasue these consoles are in development, and not released yet, and neither is windows vista, but all of these products are very old, and close to release, the usual marketing mumbojumbo to cover things up before release is well underway.

The unfied shader scheme is one that will allow them to bring such high-detailed graphics at a very low processing requirement based on what is used today. Becasue Microsoft made it explict that the XBOX360 can do AA as well as HDR, unified shading is about the only way to go, IMHO.

There is no "g80" or "r600", really. these are names that stand as filler for whatever processor will meet the needs of that current generation of the market. A great example of that is the current crap about NV47 being cancelled, etc...it was the NV47 that filled the "G70" shoes, and the NV50, i think(no facts here folks!), that may become the G80.

NV47 refers to the makeup, and layout of the current 7800GTX gpu, meaning the pipeline tech, the memory controller, et al. I'm sure there are codesnames for those individual parts too.

[[XC] leviathan18]

yeah i understand what you mean...

what im saying is rsx and r500 are going to be the next generation of video cards for PC

for me the cell procesor and the ps3 is over hyped (first they said the wont need a gpu now what?)

[cadaveca]

Well, technically, they don't need a GPU, but they would be unable to do any fancy lighting effects. it's only this that really stresses a gpu as much as they are stressing GPU's now...besides, of course, AA, and AF. AA and AF, tho, are more memory dependant than they are GPU dependant, so it's possible that the "cell" could do such processing. It would mean writing brand new shaders, but it could work.

I think part of the problem is that you have taken what have been performance comparisons as literal performance. The cell processor IS more than powerful enough to do these operations, but having a specialized unit for just graphics means that the longevity of the console can be greatly enhanced. I mean really...10 years is a long time before a platform refresh, and this is exactly what Sony has planned with the PS2.

In reality, you can't compare a console to a pc, as the entire perspective outlook for sevice-life is greatly different between the two devices, and although they can share functionality, the space they take in our lives is one that has been engineered to fill a different niche in daily living than a pc does. A pc is supposed to be a workhorse, while consoles are entirely for play. Becasue of this fact alone, ANY comparison is rendered null and void, as it's definately not a apples-to-apples comparison when you keep this in mind.

Also..remember that 10-year lifespan...18 months from now pc's will be far faster, and the majority of tech we enjoy today will already be on the short road to the End Of Life shelf, while the console will still have 102 months left before such a thing is planned to take place. It HAS to have future-based tech. Like really. :rolleyes:

[Reznik Akime]

Does anyone happen to know how much more efficient these cell processors are over standard ones we have now in our PCs?

[einCe]

well if they are going out in consoles first, i would say not much

[Shadowmage]

And it can run Mac's latest Tiger OS, sounds good to me.

Apple personally said that Cell does NOT give a substantial performance increase over the existing G5 processor.

Unfortunately, as all Comp Eng majors know, Cell is a specialized CPU, definately not a multi-purpose CPU.

[Ugly n Grey]

That is not correct Shadowmage, Cell is not a processor per se. It's a design theory that allows you to match components of CPU architecture to whatever you need it to do . It's like buying a lego set, you can build a car or you can build a house. IBM supplies the know how and the programming tools. You supply the cash.

Cell is not general purpose in any sense of processing that I am aware of.

[Shadowmage]

If it uses OSX, then it'll be a "general purpose" processor, in that it'll run general purpose applications.

However if those vector processors are fully utilized, then it'll be definately a good CPU :)