Will it get warm

[mukmaster]

OK I am thinking of building a Liquid nitrogen rig and I was wondering if liquid nitrogen eher warms up od does it stay cold forever.

[speed bump]

It evaporates rather rapidly. So you need to keep adding it or you won't have any in your tube.

[eshbach]

it always evaporates at the same temperature at a given pressure :rolleyes:

considering your question i suggest you don't try to use nitrogen cooling just yet.

[n00b 0f l337]

There's two ways to make ln2. Uber cold, and pressure. Its made by condensing nitrogen into a liquid thru pressure normally. So then its room temp at liquid phase it gets cooled off and stuffs and they make ln2. When you put that uber coldness in a room. It begins to pop back to a gas as the air isnt -180~C.

[eshbach]

There's two ways to make ln2. Uber cold, and pressure. Its made by condensing nitrogen into a liquid thru pressure normally. So then its room temp at liquid phase it gets cooled off and stuffs and they make ln2. When you put that uber coldness in a room. It begins to pop back to a gas as the air isnt -180~C.

acutally you can laser cool molecules as well, so there are at least 3 ways to make liquid nitrogen.

[G H Z]

How can a laser cool anything?

[eshbach]

How can a laser cool anything?

the motion of a particle and the heat increase proportionally to each other, so by using a system of lasers to slow down or nearly stop a molecule, you can cause it to shift phases.

[n00b 0f l337]

Jah jah... Good point forget about lasers. But thats like saying we should send a tank of nitrogen into space to get it to condense and then pull it down with a giant rope. Not many people would remember or suggest something like that.

[mukmaster]

SO for the rig I would make would have to have the liquid nitrogen supercompressed to keep It cold and have some sort of insolation.

[n00b 0f l337]

Um..... Take a look somewere else...

Now.

[afireinside]

SO for the rig I would make would have to have the liquid nitrogen supercompressed to keep It cold and have some sort of insolation.


You put ln2 in a copper container on your CPU. Its a one time thing for benchmarking only. If you can't understand that I think you need to start with watercooling and work your way up :)

[n00b 0f l337]

He says he is watercooled. I think he just needs to leave this section.

[mukmaster]

OK someone delete this

[waddupmm]

^^ lol

[IYP]

i think your imagining a circulatory LN2 system....not very practical for someone just starting off

[sluflyer06]

your idea is great...however unless you can continue to keep the liquid cool it MUST EXPAND or it will kill you and anyone standing near you....I think your on a good start being on XS however it is most defenitely a material you should become very familiar with before you use it for cooling...otherwise kiss your rig goodbye and possibly hurt yourself.......with that being said there are member(s) of this forum that build and sell Liquid Nitrogen cooling towers........I'd do alot of searching of the threads here before you go any further though...maybe buy/build a phase change system first and get aquinted with sub zero cooling. Good Luck.

[IYP]

your idea is great...however unless you can continue to keep the liquid cool it MUST EXPAND or it will kill you and anyone standing near you....I think your on a good start being on XS however it is most defenitely a material you should become very familiar with before you use it for cooling...otherwise kiss your rig goodbye and possibly hurt yourself.......with that being said there are member(s) of this forum that build and sell Liquid Nitrogen cooling towers........I'd do alot of searching of the threads here before you go any further though...maybe buy/build a phase change system first and get aquinted with sub zero cooling. Good Luck.

definatly you should get used to insulating and such...although phase & cascade do get expensive

[Ugly n Grey]

He says he is watercooled. I think he just needs to leave this section.

Better he gets REAL information here before he blows himself up, it's easier to post some link to the how to threads or supply the data he needs by typing it..

The life you save today may be the parent of the daughter you get lucky with tomorrow....

[mukmaster]

Heres my final idea

supplys .
welder
steel tubes
a copper plate that will fit over a p4 socket 478cpu
retention plate
supporting back plate
pump that can handle temperatrues that low
insolation
liquid nitrogen
screws

now here is idea

I will have a hollow cilinder that has a hole in the top that is the width of a pencil I have sodderd a copper base that will fit on top of a p4 cpu. and a retention plate to hold it down. It is down at my dads shop being pollished now. I have a support plate also. here are the specs of the ln2 container the cilinder
3" tall
2.50" total diamater
2" left in diamater to fill with liquid nitrogen
the the actual thickness of the walls of the cylinder are 1/4 of an inch
the copper BASE IS 2" x 1.5" x 2/8"

Heres my ida to fill it

stick the pump nozzle in the pencil sized hole then then have pump fill it til it reaches not to high of pressure or it will blow up but pretty high pressure once full empty all of the liquid nitrogen out of the pump. the melt the end of the metal nozzle to fill the hole.

tell me if the ida is totaly flawed or if it will work

NOTE if all else fails I can use it as a dry ice rig

[BB mods's]

Please do not try LN2 yet...if u want to try something get a premade chilly1 tube and do a dryice project.

[BB mods's]

BTW a cryo pump is upward's of $10k+ and u dont have the room for it nor the flow needed to use it.

[MutantToad]

Heres my final idea

supplys .
welder
steel tubes
a copper plate that will fit over a p4 socket 478cpu
retention plate
supporting back plate
pump that can handle temperatrues that low
insolation
liquid nitrogen
screws

now here is idea

I will have a hollow cilinder that has a hole in the top that is the width of a pencil I have sodderd a copper base that will fit on top of a p4 cpu. and a retention plate to hold it down. It is down at my dads shop being pollished now. I have a support plate also. here are the specs of the ln2 container the cilinder
3" tall
2.50" total diamater
2" left in diamater to fill with liquid nitrogen
the the actual thickness of the walls of the cylinder are 1/4 of an inch
the copper BASE IS 2" x 1.5" x 2/8"

Heres my ida to fill it

stick the pump nozzle in the pencil sized hole then then have pump fill it til it reaches not to high of pressure or it will blow up but pretty high pressure once full empty all of the liquid nitrogen out of the pump. the melt the end of the metal nozzle to fill the hole.

tell me if the ida is totaly flawed or if it will work

NOTE if all else fails I can use it as a dry ice rigWell...
Even if you did have thousands of dollars at your disposal, this idea won't work, unless you could get the LN2 to an EXTREMELY high pressure, where its boiling point is over the temp of the CPU. Which is nearly impossible, and VERY dangerous. And if you did, what would you use to expel the heat produced by the CPU? You would need a phase change cascade for that. I'm not trying to sound like a :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: , but I seriously suggest you do some more learning. Try some DICE first, or build a single stage. Oh, and by the way, it's called brazing, and not melting. ;)

~Toad

[mukmaster]

I will go dryice ,liquid nitrogen later

[Waus-mod]

I will go dryice ,liquid nitrogen later

Well did you allready had an encounter with subzero temps? mayb its better to go for a home made chiller from a freezer or start with tec....

The way you want it is way to hard! (no offense)

[mukmaster]

I have tryed a freezer on a dual processor 1.0Ghz pIII Worked great till it took the whole thing appart because i was sick of noise of the fans to dissapate the heat. so the heat from the pc dosent overload the fridge.

[Waus-mod]

Well how much do you allready now from extreme cooling? how long are you learning about DI and ln2?

[MutantToad]

I'm not sure that's what Waus means. To make a chiller from a freezer, you have to take apart the freezer, change the evap/cap tube, and regas it. Then for a chiller, you must submerge the evap in a reservoir of water/anti-freeze or another coolant, and make that a water cooling loop.

[Waus-mod]

Well the first encounter with subzero for me was a chiller. I got a old fridge from a friend and took al the phch parts out of it. but didnt cut any things!, the evap (just some alu plates) i put in a insulated box, and filled it up with methanol and demi-water and there you go. water stayed -19 @ load. and cpu was an old axp running on 2.09v!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v233/waussie/projectchiller/Afbeelding030.jpg

[IYP]

definatly try phase....or chilled water first what your trying to do here is way above your head....its way over the head...and the budget of almost all of our members....very very hard to do a LN2 system like that...try your hand at phase or chilled water...if your confident enough you could get a tube from chilly1 and try DICE with that

[gkiing]

I have been contemplating for some time a refrigeration system to create LN2 from air... the largest issue is keeping it a reasonable size, while still being able to make decent amounts of ln2...

I spoke to some representatives from airliquide they liquify "air" and then separate it into its components. hmm

[Jack]

i probably won't be as easy as it sounds ;)

[harleybro]

I have been contemplating for some time a refrigeration system to create LN2 from air... the largest issue is keeping it a reasonable size, while still being able to make decent amounts of ln2...

I spoke to some representatives from airliquide they liquify "air" and then separate it into its components. hmm
Kinda cool idea. Do you happen to know the pressure needed to compress n into ln2? NM maybe I should google. As for muckmaster I would suggest just givin di A try first that was my first attempt at subzero. Whoever posted about the towers got any links? :)

[MutantToad]

To make a N2 liquifier, you need:
A pretty strong compressor
A -160 or less cascade
A tank that will hold liquified gas
A phase/gas separator
And a crapload of insulation.
Good luck to the first one who tries this!

[Trouffman]

Hey all !
To make a N2 liquifier, you need (at least!) :

_ at least a -198°c cascade (-200 or -210°c is better!)
_ A container like "Dewar", this container is isolated by an empty space.
_ A phase gaz/eparator could be made easily... :D

Information : The triple point of N2 is at -210°c (n2 will be appear in the third state : gas, liquid, and ice.).

If you want more information PM me ;) !

PS : Sorry, I haven't a good level in english :/)

[IYP]

what you could do is take air in a chamber and once it hits the various temps that the other gasses liquify at flush them out....once the nitrogen starts liquifying pump tht into a dewar

simpelist way i can think to do it

[MutantToad]

I was thinking that you could have an open compressor, then a -160 heat exchanger, filter out the solid water vapor/CO2/other gases, and pump the LN2 into a tank, and from there transfer it into a dewar.

[Trouffman]

Yes theoricaly it's possible but you must have :

first stage : R404a
sencond stage : r23 and you arrives nearly -85/-90°c
after you could use Acetyléne (in french sorry :/) in the third stage, and you probably arrives to -140°c :)
You must have at least an other stage with some gas (but I don't know his name :()

The dewar this is simply to make if you want to use ln2 in the day ..... :/
See you later ;)

[MutantToad]

Nah...not R23.
I would go:

First Stage: R402A or R410A
Second Stage: Ethylene
Third Stage: R-14 or methane with a strong compressor
(Theory) Fourth Stage: Perhaps Argon (R740)
(Theory) Fifth Stage: LN2
And if you don't have an EPA certification...

Propane (R290)
Ethylene (R1150)
Methane (R50)
Argon (R740)
Air

[Bloody_Sorcerer]

R1150 doesn't require certification?

Now we're talking about some extreme aircooling! :-)

[MutantToad]

R1150 is ethylene, which was not meant for refrigeration. It is a hydrocarbon C2H4, so it is environmentally safe. Check this (http://www.airliquide.com/en/business/products/gases/gasdata/index.asp?Formula=&GasID=29&UNNumber=) out for more info.