Anyone Ever Attempted Liquid Helium?

[kouch]

Hi guys,

I am no expert by any means but at our school physics department, they use some liquid helium for some superconductor experiments. I was just wondering if anyone has tried using this stuff (around 10 deg K) or at those temps do the physical properties of silicon change too much to work anymore?

[Jort]

isn't it very expensive?


Liquid helium boils at -268.93 Centigrade

who doesn't want that.
maybe it is to cold like your saying.
you need very thick insulation too i guess :p

[Stewie007]

Not satisfied with liquid nitrogen? hehe

[SoddemFX]

With liquid nitrogen, you spill it on yourself and get a nasty burn at worst. Liquid helium would penetrate your skin, expand inside the body -and you'd die :)

Ignoring the cost, its just too dangerous.

Tom

[Muffe]

Maybe someone should borrow a laboratory with the correct suits and see if there is any borders for a WR that can be moved on some CPU/GPU's

Would probably be VERY expensive :)

[dippyskoodlez]

Maybe someone should borrow a laboratory with the correct suits and see if there is any borders for a WR that can be moved on some CPU/GPU's

Would probably be VERY expensive :)

Very cool nonetheless :D

[Dissolved]

i don't think processors would run that cold.

[blinky]

theyd definitely not boot up

[9mmCensor]

Once long ago, Fugger concidered (and bought a helium Compressor), but it seems the project never got off the ground.

[D_o_S]

Yeah, my dad said he could get me a whole container of liquid helium (well, how much I needed anyway, he knows a guy who works with it every day). Should I give it a shot? Where can I get that big "chimney" from, to pour it into?

[dippyskoodlez]

Yeah, my dad said he could get me a whole container of liquid helium (well, how much I needed anyway, he knows a guy who works with it every day). Should I give it a shot? Where can I get that big "chimney" from, to pour it into?

I'd talk to chilly1 about his ln2 containers.... and use tons of insulation... tons and tons of insulation....

[D_o_S]

OK, I'll send a PM to chilly1 then.

[Disposibleteen]

i don't think processors would run that cold.
i thought electricity worked better the closer it got to absolute 0. Isnt that what all of the experiments with superconducters are doing?

[Aphex_Tom_9]

yes, but there comes a point where the semiconductors in a silicon chip will simply stop conducting altogether, and just become insulators. LHe2 might be too cold...
only one way to know for sure :)

[Disposibleteen]

yes, but there comes a point where the semiconductors in a silicon chip will simply stop conducting altogether, and just become insulators. LHe2 might be too cold...
only one way to know for sure :)
ah, gotcha, didnt know that, thanks for the headsup

[Muffe]

Highly recommended to use some protective Gloves, and maybe clothing, whe don't want anyone to lose a finger, or get som flesh severely burned!

IF you really try this out, D_o_S then remember to take, more than enough pictures! No.. Better yet, get a mate to come over and take alot of pictures :)

[Charles Wirth]

My Helium rig is complete but the capacity is so low that is not not a good option. We are working on a practicle use for it. One problem that exists is the freezing of capacitors near the CPU socket. I found once fired up they stay running but beyond -50c they are deaded when I reboot.

[Muffe]

I know this might sound like the ravings of a madman, but why not heat the capacitors with some electrical heating, something that would keep the capacitors above -50? - Something that would not affect the CPU cooling or any other things!

[dippyskoodlez]

I know this might sound like the ravings of a madman, but why not heat the capacitors with some electrical heating, something that would keep the capacitors above -50? - Something that would not affect the CPU cooling or any other things!

How about start the system with maybe a dry ice mix in the container, or ln2, and then slowly step up to ln2 (if starting with DI) and then finally for the grand finalle, the helium? :slobber: Or possibly insulate them with something heated, as suggested above? like heating blanket, etc... :D

[Magnj]

lol so cold that you need to heat it up, this some how sounds counter productive :P good luck

[Kazoo]

Once long ago, Fugger concidered (and bought a helium Compressor), but it seems the project never got off the ground.
Well the helium compressor and the Cryocooler and that is sitting in my workshop. The real issue with it is capacity @ 70 K it is about 40 watts
Maybe a little dothan action? There is also the vibration issue and the fact that the head weighs 15 lbs. And then there is the fact that the head needs near perfect vacume for insulation, the heat gain at 70k from air only on the head is more than 40 watts.

[oublie]

I read somewhere that below -120c electrons stop flowing properly, in other words the processor would stop working properly, that doesnt mean that a super cold system couldn't be used, just that the processor would need to be kicking out enough heat to stay above 120 ish.

[Aphex_Tom_9]

I read somewhere that below -120c electrons stop flowing properly, in other words the processor would stop working properly, that doesnt mean that a super cold system couldn't be used, just that the processor would need to be kicking out enough heat to stay above 120 ish.
LN2 gets down to -196c though...of course that doesnt mean a die temp of -196, but it might be below -120

[oublie]

Not sure on this tom, i read it on a uk over clock forum, this came from their expert, he had a problem with the idea of using cascades. But if someone can confirm this as wrong or right id appreciate it.

[SoddemFX]

Hi,

I posted this before, but what the hey, its relevant:

Consider the forward drain current:

Id = Z/L (electron mobility)x(Oxide capacitance)x((Gate voltage-Threshold voltage)^2)/2

Decreasing the temperature will decrease the electron mobility as the electrons move from the conduction to valence bands (decrease in thermal excitation energy). This term will be a major factor as the mobility dependency is to temp^-3/2. This will be compensated to a small degree as the threshold voltage reducing and the increase in oxide capacitance (as reducing temp will increase the relative permativity of the dielectric).

So all in all I can only guess that reducing temperatures will decrease the performance of the actual silicon part of the device. I assume that most increases in switching speed with reduced temperatures come from reduced propagation delays on the metallic interconnects, which should respond very well to lower temperatures.

So i think we have a gain vs. loss situation. Gains in speed from reduced temps for the interconnects vs. losses in speed from the silicon under reduced temperatures.

This also explains why increases in voltage are necessary when a CPU is running at reduced temperatures, as increasing voltage will increase forward drain current -keeping the silicon "happy". The gains in speed will probably still come from the reduced metallic interconnect propagation, the extra voltage will probably just keep the semiconductor working.

All of this is just speculation from the basic microelectronics/fabrication stuff ive done. We obviously dont deal with things this complex and everything is moddelled operating at room temperature :D

I'd say that liquid helium is too cold...

Tom

[[XC] moddolicous]

The real question is, how much more overclock do u get from going from -120C, maybe -90C loaded to -196C, -150C loaded? I think that if you cant reach the max OC with a cascade or LN2, then you wont get much more from liquid helium, but thats y this is xtremesystems, so maybe it will make thing more stable.

[LardArse]

I say do it... apart from all reasons, there's still the fact that you'll be the world's first.... at least home-user wise.

[D_o_S]

OK, but one question before I do: will it work, or will the silicon on the CPU just start acting as an insulator?

[Rippthrough]

Just some advice, be careful with the amount of load you put in the motherboard at that temperature, it will be brittle to say the least.

[gloatlizard]

where do you achieve liquid helium?

[bxa121]

IF you really try this out, D_o_S then remember to take, more than enough pictures! No.. Better yet, get a mate to come over and take alot of pictures :)

i thinks its better to make a vid or somethingto that effect..!
do it
DO IT!
:banana4:

[Rauf]

D_o_S: I hope your not gonna use it on that winchester of yours ;)

[zabomb4163]

liquid helium doesnt have nearly the same heat capacity of liquid nitrogen

helium - Molecular weight : 4.0026 g/mol

nitrogen - Molecular weight : 28.0134 g/mol


It would take A LOT of helium to have the same cooling abilities as nitrogen.

[gloatlizard]

you mean that liquid nitrogen removes more watts?

[D_o_S]

D_o_S: I hope your not gonna use it on that winchester of yours ;)

No, of course not ;) . I might first try it on a Duron I have lying around here... just to see if it even works (boots up).

[gloatlizard]

when you will try L He on the duron?

[D_o_S]

when you will try L He on the duron?

Probably.

[gloatlizard]

yes but when? :D what is the price of liquid helium?

[Muffe]

liquid helium doesnt have nearly the same heat capacity of liquid nitrogen

helium - Molecular weight : 4.0026 g/mol

nitrogen - Molecular weight : 28.0134 g/mol


It would take A LOT of helium to have the same cooling abilities as nitrogen.

So basicly, the cooling pipe would dry out very quickly? - Then he needs to pour more often? Maybe to often, to do it by himself!?

[bxa121]

just a moot point...

of course the ln2 cylinders would be the most appropriate way of geting the he;ium to cool, evenb tho the cylinders are designed for ln2 really.

i was thinking of this issue of having to refill more often (maybe too often) - why not, instead of an open cylinder, have a closed system? like a pressure cooker with a blow off valve.
perhpas you can have this for the cylinder - a blow off valve so that the pressure isnt so much that the thinkll explode.. or yo can have it automated so that after a certain pressure threshold, the will be a circuit or somit that will open the pressure valve and releive the pressure. maybe that will help with the cooling, as as the pressure is releived, the cooling effectbecomes greater - like with a soda bottle thats is opened, the gas escapes or something - but if this idea is dumb, then forget it..perhpas some experts can give their opinions?

[shadowing]

And I thought helium was dangerous... I honestly think it should not be attempted.

[kouch]

yes guys, this was meant to be a theoretical discussion only. Please don't attempt to do this and get hurt in the process. I didn't mean to :stick: I just wanted to know the theoretical limitations on cooling. If you attempt this D_O_S, please be careful bro and talk to that guy who works with Liquid He to find out the proper precautions and dangers etc.

[bxa121]

i second what kouch said

[snowwie]

liquid helium doesnt have nearly the same heat capacity of liquid nitrogen

helium - Molecular weight : 4.0026 g/mol

nitrogen - Molecular weight : 28.0134 g/mol


It would take A LOT of helium to have the same cooling abilities as nitrogen.

what does molecular weight have to do with heat capacity?

[Stewie007]

Liquid helium is much colder than liquid nitrogen. Because of its molecular structure, it can remain a gas for much longer than the more robust nitrogen. Its liquid form measures as low as -270C, -452F. Whereas Nitrogen measures a standard -196C thereabouts... -320F.

So in liquid form, helium would be much more effective. Of course, it evaporates very quickly. And the equipment you need is too expensive.

However, its much more dangerous. In liquid form forget frost burns... You're gonna lose your hand on contact. If you breathe the vapours you could die by asphixiation.

[illmatik]

What kind of power do you need to condense and compress helium?
I'm picturing some sort of 3 phase power supply and one of those heavy duty cast steel/iron units you see on 30ton building a/cs.

Can you say run a line to hoover dam turbine #3? Or a nice T-Line tap into the Marcy line for those of us on the east coast?

[babalouj]

semiconductor were only meant to run at 100K to 350K. where at below 100K the semiconductors balance of electrons and holes across its band gap turns it into an insulator, while at high temps it turns into a conductor. so as long as the proc stayed above -173C i would say that it COULD be possible but highly unlikely. also, make sure that the copper container (copper does not become brittle like other metals at low temperature approaching absolute zero) is not brazed or soldered together. make sure it is casted into its form or else the joints will become brittle, shatter and pour liquid helium onto the board warping and shattering it.

On the other hand, try it try it try it!!!!!!!!!!

[STEvil]

we need to design a different cooler really.

The current dry ice/ln2 ones are horribly inefficient.


What we need to do is look at water cooling vs. aircooling. Air relies on surface area and bulk of the heatsink (aluminum/copper) to cool larger heat loads, while water can contact more surface area due to its density.

Given phasechange uses gas largely (air is a gas, this is the important part) to cool (lots of energy transfer takes place in liquid form too of course), we need to force the phasechange gas/chemical to be in contact with the heatsink longer so it can transfer more energy faster.

I'm not saying to take an aircooler and dump liquid LN2 on it, but to look at aircoolers and how they increase surface area and use the amount of heatsink material to their advantage.

[dippyskoodlez]

However, its much more dangerous. In liquid form forget frost burns... You're gonna lose your hand on contact. If you breathe the vapours you could die by asphixiation.

Ahaha.. wow.. come to think of it..

When you do it, make a video. and I must hear everyone there talk.
:D

LOL :p:

[gloatlizard]

hi guys,a friend of mine has told me that liquid helium became gas more slowly than liquid nitrogen,it seems to me strange,but you are sure that it evaporates faster than n2? :eek:

[gloatlizard]

anyone knows its cost?

[Stewie007]

Its just the nature of helium. Like I said before, it can retain istelf as a gas for longer since it has less a molecular structure. On the reverse side, the smaller structure will accelerate to a gas much more quickly because of that.

As far as its cost. I would say its alot more expensive than liquid nitro. Its less plentiful than nitrogen.

[R.Rabbit]

i think the price has less to do with its abundancy in nature but rather how hard it is to produce it, liquid helium obviously being much harder to produce because fo its much lower temp, i think i actually heard about some japanese overcclocker using liquid helium to make the wr for p4 speed, but fugger destroyed it of course

[sjohnson]

LHe is expensive because of the immense energy required to produce it.

20 years or so ago, I had a work-study job at the Physics department of the South Dakota School of Mines & Technology. My job was LN and LHe production.

We had two chillers, one produced LN from atmospheric Nitrogen extraction and cooling.

One produced LHe from bottled Helium and a cascade cooler that used LN on the condensor stages.

It took this old, hand-made cascade 60-100 litres of LN to produce 1 litre of LHe, plus a large amount of electricity.

The transport dewar needs to be highly insulated, much more so than LN dewars, and loss is rapid due to boiling off even with specialized dewars. It's hard to describe how it behaves, but LHe does not pour "normally", some of the isotopes contained in a mix of LHe will even seemingly defy gravity and pour "uphill" due to surface tension effects. Some of the rarest & coldest Helium isotopes require magnetic confinement, since they try to escape any normal container.

[dippyskoodlez]

LHe is expensive because of the immense energy required to produce it.

20 years or so ago, I had a work-study job at the Physics department of the South Dakota School of Mines & Technology. My job was LN and LHe production.

We had two chillers, one produced LN from atmospheric Nitrogen extraction and cooling.

One produced LHe from bottled Helium and a cascade cooler that used LN on the condensor stages.

It took this old, hand-made cascade 60-100 litres of LN to produce 1 litre of LHe, plus a large amount of electricity.

The transport dewar needs to be highly insulated, much more so than LN dewars, and loss is rapid due to boiling off even with specialized dewars. It's hard to describe how it behaves, but LHe does not pour "normally", some of the isotopes contained in a mix of LHe will even seemingly defy gravity and pour "uphill" due to surface tension effects. Some of the rarest & coldest Helium isotopes require magnetic confinement, since they try to escape any normal container.

That sounds so much fun.. Just wanna get some to play with..
:rehab:

[R.Rabbit]

LHe is expensive because of the immense energy required to produce it.

20 years or so ago, I had a work-study job at the Physics department of the South Dakota School of Mines & Technology. My job was LN and LHe production.

We had two chillers, one produced LN from atmospheric Nitrogen extraction and cooling.

One produced LHe from bottled Helium and a cascade cooler that used LN on the condensor stages.

It took this old, hand-made cascade 60-100 litres of LN to produce 1 litre of LHe, plus a large amount of electricity.

The transport dewar needs to be highly insulated, much more so than LN dewars, and loss is rapid due to boiling off even with specialized dewars. It's hard to describe how it behaves, but LHe does not pour "normally", some of the isotopes contained in a mix of LHe will even seemingly defy gravity and pour "uphill" due to surface tension effects. Some of the rarest & coldest Helium isotopes require magnetic confinement, since they try to escape any normal container.
holy crap thats cool as hell!

[sjohnson]

The LHe generator was a combo of a cascade and an auto-cascade.

The cascade used LN. We had to run it first in order to get any liquid helium at all. The autocascade used strictly helium (and electricity for the pump).

The cascade had valving where we could dump LHe into the autocascade.

The autocascade had a seperator designed by a physicist that seperated the various helium isotopes. Don't ask me how, that's just what I was told. Helium 4 and Helium 3 were what we generated. Helium 4 boils at about 4 degrees Kelvin, Helium 3 at about 3. When gen'ing LHe3, the LHe4 was used as the coolant for the condensor With a one degree difference, you can guess that it took a long time to get a batch of Helium 3.

To get the colder liquid helium isotope, Helium 3 (went within about 3 degrees Kelvin), it would take 1-2 weeks to generate a 100 ml or so for lab use and required the prof and I to watch it, in shifts, 24 hours/day. Talk about your electrical bills :D

[sjohnson]

A simple, yet interesting discussion of Liquid Helium, http://cryowwwebber.gsfc.nasa.gov/introduction/liquid_helium.html

[gloatlizard]

only the helium 2 has the superfluid feature...

[gloatlizard]

what are the dangers of breathin' it? :stick:

[sjohnson]

Breathing Helium? Oxygen displacement is the main hazard. Otherwise, it's a noble gas, inert and harmless.

[wittekakker]

sjohnson, I'm not good in english, but what u are saying is that u had a compress system with LN2? I've have never heard of something like that before, but yesterday I was asking myself if it would be possible te make a phase change setup with LN2. What are the hardest parts, and is it better then cascades?

[sjohnson]

The LN2 was used at atmospheric pressure in a total loss exchanger. No pressure involved. What boiled off was evacuated to the outside of the building, more LN2 was manually added as the level dropped. That's one reason why someone had to be there 24/7. The LN2 was used to precool Helium gas. Another reason someone had to be there was to keep the LN2 generator operating constantly to provide the coolant for the LHe generator.

We also had to watch the He pressures/vacuum and manually adjust valving to keep the LHe generation within operating parameters. I'm no expert, I just had a "cookbook" prepared by the physics prof to guide me.

One thing I also remember was that the Helium tanks were marked USN and were dated in the 1950's. Apparently we had either bought from or had the Helium gas donated by the U.S. Navy.

[gloatlizard]

:lol: i've heard that its cost is 30€ per liter :lol:

[gloatlizard]

is right?its possible?

[gkiing]

I'm not sure, but you could call up airliquide and see if you can get a tank of liquid helium, maybe with a dip tube so you can get liquid out. Althought personally I would advise against using helium, from what I've gathered so far teh risks outweight the benefits by far. It's not worth the safety risk in my opinion.

[BigPanda]

aww i think you guys scared DOS with that part about your hand coming off :D

anyway like as been daid before (i think) There must be a temp when the procesor wont work anymore.

[Bloody_Sorcerer]

from what i've heard, P4s freeze solid around -200 (that is, die. completely.)

[Aphex_Tom_9]

from what i've heard, P4s freeze solid around -200 (that is, die. completely.)
howsabout we verify that? :D

[Redwolf]

Liquid Neon
Boiling point (1.013 bar) : -246.1 °C
Latent heat of vaporization (1.013 bar at boiling point) : 38.13 Btu/lb

Liquid Helium
Boiling point (1.013 bar) : -269 °C
Latent heat of vaporization (1.013 bar at boiling point) : 8.72 Btu/lb

[Juicy629]

theirs no proven temperature that electricity stops conducting.. only theorys of superconducting when reaching ultra low temperatures.. something about boosts in performance when the silicon is cooled to that low of temperatures.. i dunno.. i read some data sheets.. not much help here

[gkiing]

I was reading some articles on cryogenics on the nasa site, some pretty cool stuff there

http://speedee.gsfc.nasa.gov/site_map.html

[Stang_Man]

It's hard to describe how it behaves, but LHe does not pour "normally", some of the isotopes contained in a mix of LHe will even seemingly defy gravity and pour "uphill" due to surface tension effects. Some of the rarest & coldest Helium isotopes require magnetic confinement, since they try to escape any normal container.

Some good info here sjohnson... I think this is what would make liquid helium most dangerous. One has no way of knowing how and where it will pour if it would begin to pour "uphill". Very easily it could get on your face or other body parts, and you can say goodbye to them..

some crazy stuff it's gotta be!

[krampak]

Maybe if we boot up at 3Vcore..... :D

[PytonOrm]

:eek: info about helium....

Melting point is - 272.2

boiling point - 268.3 degress


The fusion of hydrogen into helium provides the energy of the hydrogen bomb. The helium content of the atmosphere is about 1 part in 200,000. While it is present in various radioactive minerals as a decay product, the bulk of the Free World's supply is obtained from wells in Texas, Oklahoma, and Kansas. Outside the United States, the only known helium extraction plants, in 1984 were in Eastern Europe (Poland), the USSR, and a few in India.

Cost
The cost of helium fell from $2500/ft3 in 1915 to 1.5 cents /ft3 in 1940. The U.S. Bureau of Mines has set the price of Grade A helium at $37.50/1000 ft3 in 1986.

Properties
Helium has the lowest melting point of any element and is widely used in cryogenic research because its boiling point is close to absolute zero. Also, the element is vital in the study of super conductivity.

Using liquid helium, Kurti, co-workers and others have succeeded in obtaining temperatures of a few microkelvins by the adiabatic demagnetization of copper nuclei.

Helium has other peculiar properties: It is the only liquid that cannot be solidified by lowering the temperature. It remains liquid down to absolute zero at ordinary pressures, but will readily solidify by increasing the pressure. Solid 3He and 4He are unusual in that both can be changed in volume by more than 30% by applying pressure.

The specific heat of helium gas is unusually high. The density of helium vapor at the normal boiling point is also very high, with the vapor expanding greatly when heated to room temperature. Containers filled with helium gas at 5 to 10 K should be treated as though they contained liquid helium due to the large increase in pressure resulting from warming the gas to room temperature.

While helium normally has a 0 valence, it seems to have a weak tendency to combine with certain other elements. Means of preparing helium difluoride have been studied, and species such as HeNe and the molecular ions He+ and He++ have been investigated.

Isotopes
Seven isotopes of helium are known: Liquid helium (He-4) exists in two forms: He-4I and He-4II, with a sharp transition point at 2.174K. He-4I (above this temperature) is a normal liquid, but He-4II (below it) is unlike any other known substance. It expands on cooling, its conductivity for heat is enormous, and neither its heat conduction nor viscosity obeys normal rules


:D :banana: :toast:

[GunnerMan]

I say give it a try. Yes it is very very dangerous, get a friend or 2 or 3 or 4 over there to help you. Place motherboard on a styrofoam bed so it does not shatter, get a fridn to hold a blow drier on the motherboard, and pour the helium very very very carefuly, dont spill any and make sure everyone is wearing gloves filled with insulation. Play it safe then why not. If I were you I would tak to the guy that handles the stuff on a daily basis to at least come and help/supervise. If you don't feel comfortable then don't do it.

[sjohnson]

Trying to find some info on dewars, I came across this. Thought it was interesting
(Fermilab insulates its liquid helium lines with both liquid nitrogen and vacuum.) From http://www.fnal.gov/pub/news/history_lowtemp.html

So, a pipe in which they run LHe is surrounded by a second pipe and the space between the two is evacuated, creating a vacuum.

Then a third pipe encases the first two, and they run LN through it.

Or maybe the LN is first and the vacuum is last. Who knows?

All to keep LHe from heating up.

There's a wild, xtreme cooling design for LHe delivery lurking in there. :D

[redwraith94]

My Helium rig is complete but the capacity is so low that is not not a good option. We are working on a practicle use for it. One problem that exists is the freezing of capacitors near the CPU socket. I found once fired up they stay running but beyond -50c they are deaded when I reboot.

you could just desolder the caps, and put a foot or so of wire on them, so they don't freeze. Any Updates?

[evilentity]

Well, you could always do something truly suicidal and use liquid hydrogen.

It seems like solid Nitrogen (melts at -210C) would be a better solution than LHe, at least it would turn into LN2 instead of a deadly gas like LHe

[dippyskoodlez]

you could just desolder the caps, and put a foot or so of wire on them, so they don't freeze. Any Updates?

Hmm... SPDL or someone would probably want to comment on that one. :p: He would suggest thats a bad idea, but an idea, atleast.


I still propose we make a mini heatblanket for all capactitors and stuff? :)

[RAMMAN]

helium has been around since like, the big bang :D .are you guys trying to say no one on this amazing forum has even tried to bench a liquid helium rig yet :p: .just dont start up a liquid hydrogen rig and create another big bang :lol: :lol: :lol: than without internet we would have to start all over again from square one.

[dippyskoodlez]

helium has been around since like, the big bang :D .are you guys trying to say no one on this amazing forum has even tried to bench a liquid helium rig yet :p: .just dont start up a liquid hydrogen rig and create another big bang :lol: :lol: :lol: than without internet we would have to start all over again from square one.

wtf? :confused:

[RAMMAN]

so, no one likes my sense of humour :eh: i can take a hint :) .

[dippyskoodlez]

so, no one likes my sense of humour :eh: i can take a hint :) .

I didnt understand a single thing that post had....

[RAMMAN]

never heard of the big bang theory? the beginning of the universe?

[dippyskoodlez]

never heard of the big bang theory? the beginning of the universe?

well yea, but what does He have to do with it? :confused:

[RAMMAN]

big bangs, liquid hydrogen, hydrogen bomb anecdotes...get it yet?

[Revv23]

but we are talking about liquid helium, not hydrogen.

[redwraith94]

Hmm... SPDL or someone would probably want to comment on that one. :p: He would suggest thats a bad idea, but an idea, atleast.


I still propose we make a mini heatblanket for all capactitors and stuff? :)

Well, AFAIK the electrolytic caps are only for power line conditioning and 1 foot of decent copper wire shouldn't affect anything that much imo. If they are smaller caps i.e. not electrolytic than they are probably used for other things and would be sensitive for variations in wire length, but I still think it is a better idea than heating what you're trying to cool :p:

[M.Beier]

Hmm, didnt TAM use it once ? - And actually succeded ? - Anyway... As far as' Im told its not good at transfering the heat... :\\

[dippyskoodlez]

Well, AFAIK the electrolytic caps are only for power line conditioning and 1 foot of decent copper wire shouldn't affect anything that much imo. If they are smaller caps i.e. not electrolytic than they are probably used for other things and would be sensitive for variations in wire length, but I still think it is a better idea than heating what you're trying to cool :p:

we arent trying to cool the caps :P so it wouldnt be heating what we're trying to cool.... :stick: I'm sure teh CPU wouldn't notice a thing.

[redwraith94]

but why install a heater, when you don't have to? especially with Liquid helium, that stuff evaporates extaordinarily quickly :slapass:

[sokarul]

Liquid helium is a natural resource so it is controled buy they government. I dont think they will give it to you to use at home on your computer.

Not sure if anyone said that yet.

[FireDragon]

only the helium 2 has the superfluid feature...

This is not true He III will "defy" gravity when a test tube is put into He III and the He III will climb the side of the tube and fill the test tube until the He III is level with He III outside.

The unfortunate part of ANY liquid He ANY isotope of it is that it will be so cold that the semiconductor of the cpu no matter how pure or how oxidized some of it is it will turn into an insulator and will take a VERY VERY large amount of voltage more than ANY stock board can provide (not that if you are doing this that you would have a stock board…) to over come the increased resistance of the CPU and because of the increased voltage and increased resistance the CPU will generate so much more heat then normal and because of He molecular structure it will turn into a gas at about the same rate that you can sanely poor it in not to mention that you would have a room full of He that could make you float off the face of the earth!!! (ha that would be great if that could happen) Not to mention that the caps and ALL of the surrounding resistors with have to be heated to maintain a “normal” operation that will allow everything to properly work…so it is truly more work then what it seems at first glance…

Just my .2

Dragon

[Grayskull]

Before considering the effects of electron mobility, consider the fact that ASICs are produced with specific timing checks at certain process, voltage and temperature corners. Having an ASIC work properly at -100C is actually quite miraculous, considering that -100C is so far away from the pratical limits anyone characterizes with. Going beyond this, especially significantly beyond this, is only going to be an exercise in frustration. You wll run into other problems before electron mobility becomes an issue. ;)


This is not true He III will "defy" gravity when a test tube is put into He III and the He III will climb the side of the tube and fill the test tube until the He III is level with He III outside.

The unfortunate part of ANY liquid He ANY isotope of it is that it will be so cold that the semiconductor of the cpu no matter how pure or how oxidized some of it is it will turn into an insulator and will take a VERY VERY large amount of voltage more than ANY stock board can provide (not that if you are doing this that you would have a stock board…) to over come the increased resistance of the CPU and because of the increased voltage and increased resistance the CPU will generate so much more heat then normal and because of He molecular structure it will turn into a gas at about the same rate that you can sanely poor it in not to mention that you would have a room full of He that could make you float off the face of the earth!!! (ha that would be great if that could happen) Not to mention that the caps and ALL of the surrounding resistors with have to be heated to maintain a “normal” operation that will allow everything to properly work…so it is truly more work then what it seems at first glance…

Just my .2

Dragon