looking for advice

[enok]

hi 2 all,

i need WC! :D so i'm trying to find a good solution for a newbie on the matter.
as i'm very limited at money i have to find a good performance/price kit or handpick some components.
i intend to do some heavy OC at CPU + MB.

my two choices (for now) are:

http://www.alphacool.de/perl/shop.pl?s=6f13dac530ee204ca4b0&l=2&rm=get_art&menu_id=2&&art_id=10115

http://www.revoltec.de/english/produkte/rw003.htm

wich of them you think is the best?

tks for ur help,

enok

[MaxxxRacer]

Well the sad but honest truth is that there is no really good kit. alphacool just came out with a very good kit (if you like the low flow style systmes), but its a bit more expensive than what your looking for and only cools the cpu.

I suggest going with building your own. Question is, can you order from anywhere in the world? Because the stuff that I would have u buy is american stuff.

If you dont want to do it the american way (LOL, that sounded so stupid) and you order from EU your probably going to end up having to get german blocks, which alphacool would be your best choice.

[enok]

unfortunaly, ordering stuff from outside EU, and particulary from US - in fact major US e-stores only ship inside US: newegg, etc. that's a bit of a problem :\ - is very expensive... :(

anyway what would u advice for a simple (but eficient) WC system: CPU, NB, Pump and Rad. :)
first with US parts and then with EU (german?) parts.

tks for ur help :P

[MaxxxRacer]

well dont bother with the NB block. If you want me to get into the many reasons why not, I will, but if you trust me on this one youll be a happy person who just saved himself 25euros on a NB Block.

But for US parts here we go
Danger Den TDX or Swiftech MCW6002 (tdx for high flow mcw6002 for low flow)
Danger Den Maze4gpu cooler with brass top
cooltechnica 50Z pump (Formerly mcp600 Rev2)
Weapon Heatercore and shroud (purchase that from our forum member weapon for 65US dollars) He ships internationaly, so if your going with EU or US i suggest his custom heatercore as it outperforms pretty much any rad including the thermochill HE 120.3

EU parts
NexxosXP for cpu
As for the gpu I have NO idea what so ever, but i would suggest trying one of the high end alphacool products.
Pump would have to be the mcp350 (its low flow, but high head pressure and its darn small with 3/8inch fittings which is perfect for EU blocks.
Rad is still the same with the Weapon heatercore. If you want something smaller, then i suppose go with the therochill 120.1 but it wont give that great of performance.

[enok]

ehehe, tks for the quick reply. :)

i'm really curious about the reason why u don't like NB blocks. :P
i intend to make atleast 250mhz on my nforce2, so i really think it'll be an essential part of my WC. plus, the new nforce4 chipsets are making 280mhz, and if i choice a compatible NB block i will make a nice buy to the future.

i think i should have given some more tips of what i was initially thinking, for an handpicked WC system:

- CPU block - to be excelent, should be socket A and 939 compatible - Cuplex 1.3 is compatible (after buying a special part), but dunno... NexXxus XP is really a good block too. if it was socket A and 939 compatible it would be great! 1A-Cooling blocks look to be nice aswell... i only wnated a good and both sockets compatible block. (not asking too much)
- NB block - no sure about this one... maybe one of the new 1A-Cooling, with low flow resistance. or Aquacomputer Twinplex wich is nforce compatible.
- Pump - Eheim 600 - quiet and with good flow... but i don't like the led's to be honest... the mcp350 seems to be a hell of a pump, but i doubt i will find it at Portugal (our elsewhere) for a decent price. Hydor L20?
- Radiator - some 2x120 - Evo240? Black Ice Pro II? Black Ice Xtreme II? Car radiator? really many choices at this one. :P

oh, other thing... i think i will go for G1/4".

[Reflex1]

NB blocks gain you nothing, i used to have one and it only clutters up your tubing, lowers your flow and increases the temp of water. Only thing is that it looks cool to have 3 blocks.

everyone will tell you to get a car rad here with shroud. but since im also in europe i know how hard it is to find a nice one, so get a danger den heatercore if you can, otherwise a black ice xtreme II would suffice.

[enok]

i understand your point of view, but you have to admit something: it surely would be cooler with WC than with AC. so you would gain some advantage on OC and on "security", cause you don't want to screw your MB. :P
and i'm really worried about the high fsb that i will have to deal from now on (i bought a good DC kit :D ) at my nForce2 and in the future with the nForce4.
as i newbie i thought it was a nice move... :|

about the car radiator, i was just kidding! :P tho i know some ppl actually use car radiators! :eek:

[FallenAngel]

I know of a shop in Portugal who sells good wc stuff, I can't find the url though, where do you live exactly? I think the shop is in Lisbon if I'm not mistaken...

[MaxxxRacer]

Again you gain nothign with it. Unless you plan to volt mod the crap out of the NB it wont gain you anything. the NF3 and NF4's go up to 350-400mhz btw. And they do it ALL with stock cooling and voltages.

Actually the best is a car heatercore (the thing that heats up the air condition heat). Like i said, drop Weapon a PM. He can hook you up. he custom makes the shroud for them and can put custom fittings on the heatercore for your purpose. And the great part is, it only costs around 40Euros plus shipping costs. The pic below is one of his creations. The radiator itself he does not make, but he paints them (pretty much any color you want, but at a little extra cost if he doesnt have the paint on hand) and can put pretty much any fitting on the rad u want. The shroud he custom designed and has made at a local machine shop.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=22419


Now back to the pump. The two choices of pumps you gave are HORRIBLE. Let me explain one thing. The EU blocks are low flow but they are SUPER HIGH resistance. That means you need a pump with TONS of head pressure. The pumps u listed have absolutly NO head pressure and will give you HORIBLE flow.

The mcp350 is where i would start at for pumps. Personally I have a huge iwaki pump that absolutly masacres most other pumps out there but its a tad bit expensive. I know you can get the 350 in portugal under the Laing DDC name. I have seen a few of the EU rigs using the pump. Ironicly, Apple also uses the pump in their new 2.5ghz G5.

[FallenAngel]

I found it is http://www.aquapc.net/

[MaxxxRacer]

angel, i just looked at those prices and about crapped in my pants. Hell, my iwaki and my waterblock seem cheap compared to that. 60euros for those blocks. my god... my block was like 35-40euros and my pump was around 70, and they are selling pumps of half the quality at the same price. wow just wow.

[FallenAngel]

And some german sites:
com-tra (http://www.com-tra.de/shop/en_EN/Index)
moddingcorner (http://www.moddingcorner.de/) (doesn't work, but yesterday was good, try it later)
watercooling.de (http://www.watercooling.de/catalog/)

in Netherlands
spacepromotion.nl (http://www.spacepromotion.nl/)

All this shops speaks english

[FallenAngel]

angel, i just looked at those prices and about crapped in my pants. Hell, my iwaki and my waterblock seem cheap compared to that. 60euros for those blocks. my god... my block was like 35-40euros and my pump was around 70, and they are selling pumps of half the quality at the same price. wow just wow.
Only to help my country m8, if you add the shipping and border fees it will cost a little more if ordered from the states.

EDIT: I didn't saw it, before it was a lot cheaper, but for the NB he could put a silent fan like the ones we wore talking the other day from SilentX (http://www.silenx.com/productcart/pc/viewCat_Z.asp?idCategory=3)

[MaxxxRacer]

well I found ways around the high shipping costs and other things for guys in eu.. it takes a while to get the parts but it works out to be cheaper.

[enok]

@ MaxxxRacer that pic of the car radiator has 2x120mm fans? (just to have an idea of the size of it)
actually my uncle is a mechanic, so i'm really looking at car radiators as an valid option from now on. especially at that price and considering it has an good performance(?).
Weapon do those for 40€? maybe i will take the risk and order it from the US! :)
about the pumps and the costs... u see my problem now. besides it's expensive u have only some few choices. (and i know other shops that sell WC material with the same products and prices... so no luck here)
where are u from Max? how do u work around shipping costs?

@ FallenAngel besides that shop u have also www.nainformatica.com at Portugal. but it has the same products and some better prices (and plus it's from my town, Porto :D (Gaia to be more exact)) so it would be better.
but from ur reactions to the current prices i think i will just order from outside Portugal.

[FallenAngel]

I'm in Luxembourg and I never bought here, always outside, better prices and quality, either from the US, Germany or Netherlands

[idleuser]

it's true you can't go wrong with a heatcore :)

[MaxxxRacer]

enok: You really cant go wrong with weapons heatercore and shroud. There is really no risk involved with him, he isnt going to screw you over here or anything. He does this to help us out.

I Live in Los Angeles in the USA, but I am helping a friend in belguim get a dfi mobo and some ocz ram (have the box sitting here waiting to be shipped). He just sent me the money via paypal (tried wire transfer but i dont have an international bank account) and then I bought the stuff for him and will ship it out to him. I just need to get over to the post office.

[enok]

hey, plz don't misunderstand my words! :P: when i talk of risk i was talking about (mostly) of custom-house tricky situations (like objects missing...) and others problems that might happen. i never bought anything from a foreign e-store, so u see my problem! :P

but i really would like to talk with Weapons, to discuss prices (but first i have to be certain that those holes on heatcore (that's what u call it?) can fit the usual G1/4") and maybe to make some aditions to the pack. ;)
now about that pic again MaxxxRacer, are those fans 120mm ones?

maybe i will buy pump and blocks from those german e-stores. and radiator+fans (silenX seem nice) from US.

[MaxxxRacer]

Those are 120mm fans. They are 120x38. They are called sanyo denkis. They are the fans that i suggest. They are not as quiet as the silenx but they are 1/5 the price and give way better performance (you just need to put an inline resistor or a fan controller) beucase they are noisy at 12 volts.

I see your concerns with buying from the US. But as far as the custom part being a problem, weapon pretests and checks over all the work he does before it goes in the box. The 1/4 fittings will be non standard for him, as he uses 1/2inch usually and is now switching over to the flow cannon 5/8inch ID fittings.

Try getting the mcp350 if you can, as from what I can tell it is the optimal pump for the german blocks.