Crucial Ballistix, PC3200 or PC4000?

[dav]

i'm thinking of getting a pair of Crucial Ballistix 512MB (1GB total) now.
should i go for pc3200 or pc4000?
i do like to overclock and apparently pc4000 looks like the choice.

however review on anandtech shows that the pc3200 module could run at DDR500, or even DDR514 as well.
http://www.anandtech.com/memory/showdoc.aspx?i=2145&p=9

i doubt if a pair of pc3200 ballistix could really run at DDR514 here? that's why i am hesitated if i should go for the pc4000.

does anyone have any idea or has anyone got these memory?

thanks in advance! :)

ADDED:
found a link on pc3200:
http://www.bigbruin.com/reviews/crucialballistix/index2.php

While maintaining tight timings, I was able to run these DDR-400 chips up to DDR-480 with zero stability issues on the test system referenced previously. Systems with a CPU and motherboard combination with greater overclocking potential may experience better results, but for a pair of 512MB sticks of DDR-400, that is still quite impressive.

[shafty]

What do you plan on doing with you system? Benching or Gaming. If your just doing gaming that GEIL you already have will do just fine.

[MaxxxRacer]

If here is here i think he is ocing.. just a guess :confused:

[dav]

i would like to oc.
my current geil max out at 215MHz..

[NeoGeo]

I would like to know the difference between the ballistix pc3200 and pc4000 too. Has anyone tried either memory?

On Crucial's website all they say is that the pc3200 is cas2 and the pc4000 is cas 2.5, but they don't list the full timings and they don't seem to sell them in dual channel kits only single 256MB or 512MB sticks.

[dav]

FYI:
the pc3200 could run at 2-2-2-5@DDR400, and pc4000 could run at 2.5-4-4-8@DDR500.
however the pc4000 could also run at 2-2-2-5@DDR400......

[NeoGeo]

Dav,

You bought the crucial ram already?

2.5-4-4-8 for the pc4000 seems a little slow. Anandtech got 2.5-2-2-5 with just 2.65V from their ballistix pc3200

[dav]

no i have not bought them yet that's why i'm posting.

yeah i have read the anandtech review... but by no mean it would guarantee i will get a pair of pc3200 that would also perform that well.............

[Crankster]

Get that EB already!

[dav]

got which module? 3500 or 3700?
how's it performing? :-)

[Tedinde]

I've got the 3200 ballistix 512 sticks. They are killer. Im tesing in a stock IS7, and a weak 2.6 chip. Right now they are running 250 fsb 1:1, the max of the chip. I had to back the timings down to 2.5-2-2. 2-2-2 gives up @ 225fsb, with only 2.75 actual mem volts of the board.

I tested a single stick in my MSI AMD64 board, 262fsb with the same timings and same 2.75 volts. And backing off the timeings to 3-4-4-8 like my OCZ PC4200 the stuff ran @ 300fsb 1:1.

Finally all around memory!!! I've got every brand of memory out there. Killer BH5 to expensive Corsair, OCZ, ADATA, and 4200 GIEL, everything. This beats all my others hands down, And it's all i'll be buying for high end rigs i'll build for customers.

Im a Ballistix FANBOY now. I even bought the tshirt with my second order of the stuff!!

I didnt believe the anandtech review until i got the stuff, i figured crucial just sent them some "RINGER" memory. But it is the "shiznit" You can have your EB and corsair that costs $100 more for a gig.

I'll be testing @ high volts this week, when my DFI board get's here.

[shafty]

How high did you get them at 2.5-2-2 and what volts?

[Tedinde]

read the post 262 fsb 1:1 with the boards stock volts of 2.75 @ 2.5-2-2 and 300fsb @ 3-4-4-8.

And again read above that i'll be testing with higher volts this week, I have a OCZ booster for the IS7 testing, and i have a dfi NF250gb board coming this week for a64 testing.

I replaced the adata pc4000 that your using in the IS7 for the crucial.

[dav]

awesome awesome awesome!
2.5-2-2 at 250....! is it 1T or 2T??

i am now even more in a dilemma... :eek:

[shafty]

damn i might be selling my adata.

[Mikael]

All Ballistix don't seem to do this well. I have two 512MB sticks of PC3200 and they can't do more than 215MHz on any timings, even at 2.9V. POS memory...

I have an Abit NF7-S 2.0 and it may be that this board just doesn't like the memory... Does anybody know of any other people that have had problems overclocking with this mem on the Nforce2 platform?

[dav]

that's not good if it could only reach 215MHz... where my geil could also do at 2.6V..

perhaps i should make sure my CPU could go further before i make the ballistix decision..

[SLN]

Regarding the question of this thread...
It is my understanding that nowadays many manufacturers semm to tweak their PCB's. If... BH5 would come out today in value ram and OC ram flavours, I am fairly certain that value ram would not do 2-2-2 because of crappy PCB. Am I the only one that sees a tendency that timings are more and more "fixed" in each mem module? If not "fixed", certainly more "rigid" than 2 years ago! That is the reason that many modern memory overclocks do not require loosening of timings to go up in FSB. If they reach it, good, if not loosening the timings will not make much difference. Because the ballistix modules come from the same company and uses the same chips I doubt this will apply "per say", but I think of it this way. Maybe the 3200PCB has a lot more tolerance to tight timings, while the 4000 PCB guarantees higher speeds.
Other than that the boys that spoke before are 100% right, the ballistix suffers from inconsistency regarding performance. You can get a great chip, or a not so great one. That is why they ' re relatively cheap, when compared to e.g. EB who can guarantee you, at least 250 @ 2.5-2-2.
My 2 cents...

[H2OGun]

It does not look that EB is a sure clockers either.

Look here: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=42397

[SLN]

I' ve looked at the thread H2OGun.
What can I say... the EB seems like the safest bet for relatively high FSB's and reasonable timings. Here in EU they cost about 330 euros. about $400!! If $400 can't buy you 250FSB... I don't know what to say. RMA them!!
Besides that, subsequence's luck is not represantetive of EB's performance. I am sure there others like him. That percentage however is low compared to the people who are getting other low ocing ram (ballistix, etc).

[H2OGun]

Another hint: my 3700EB definitely don't do 250 @2.5-2-2. Heck, they can't even do that with 3-3-2. The max for dual channel is 248 3-3-2. I will probably get a few MHz higher with tons of volt but it is quite pointless since they are petty much at a point of diminishing return already. And this is my 2nd 3700EB and I did try them with OCZ DDR Booster. Don't want to keep RMA-ing since I can probably get another pair of 3700EB very soon with all the accumulated shipping fees.

I guess what I as trying to say is that you will only get the guarantee for its rated speed. Anything beyond that is a bonus unless you are Wesley Fink or someone who posts influential reviews. It's part of every memory manufacturing's marketing strategy nowadays, I guess.

So, in this sense, get 3700EB since the likelihood of geting 250 may be statistically better than Ballistix 3200 --> 3200<3700<250FSB :toast:

[SLN]

Can't argue with that, m8 :toast:

[dav]

h2ogun i think you have good points.
i am also not convinced that i would get a pair of ballistix pc3200 to run at DDR500, or even DDR466...

i will think about what I need carefully.
if i'm hoping to get a ram which will do at least DDR466, i think i will go for the ballistix pc4000, or 3700eb..

so then my problem would become "Ballistix PC4000 or OCZ 3700 EB?"... lol.

thanks guy!

[SLN]

dav,
actually your chances are really good at running the ballistix memories at high speeds.
As I said, they use the same chips, they are from the same company and they rolled out at the same time. How different can they be?? The trick is you are not guaranteed that speed increase...
The ballistix4000 have micron -5B G chips relabeled as 4ns (ddr500). I assume the 3200, while they use the same chips, do not need such relabeling...
Here in europe the pc4000 is approx 50-70 euros cheaper than EB. Add to that fact that EB can't be found anywhere at the present, and you've got your answer. There is no doubt in my mind that (the majority of...) EB is a better performing memory than (the majority of...) ballistix pc4000 but sometimes there are other side things that influence our desicions... ;)

[Tedinde]

Nothing is guaranteed, Im on my second set of ballistix and have been happy with both pairs. And both are better than any corsair, OCZ, ADATA that i own.

[dav]

i think the 3700eb is out of stock, but 3500eb is still available?

SLN, do you mean that i have a high chance getting the pc4000 running at high speed? or you mean the pc3200?

Tedinde, i would not hesitate buying it if i know i WILL perform like yours... :)
do you run it at 1T or 2T at 250 HTT 2.5-2-2 1 : 1?

[SLN]

dav
regarding your particular question about 3200,4000. It is my belief that you have a greater chance hiitng higher FSB's with 4000, than 3200. Having said that, the 3200 should hold tighter timings at the same speeds. However as I said before, these are very similar sticks and many users here have demonstrated 3200 sticks running at sppeds+timings of 4000, and 4000 sticks running 200@2-2-2-5.
I am not sure what you have in your mind when you say "high speed", but all the reviews and experiences with either ballistix stick (besides Anand) do not reach 260 easy, but do so with good timings. Somebody correct me if I am wrong on this last bit.

[NeoGeo]

Mine will be here Tues or Wed. (2x512)

I can't wait to see how it does, please post back with results :)

[Blue078]

I have to cast my vote for Ballistix PC4000.

It's OCed well in GA K8NS Pro--MSI Neo Platnum--Abit AV8--and has found a final home in the lovley MSI K8N NEo2 :) @2.85vdimm

[dav]

by high speed, i mean sth like DDR466 or above..
probably for ballistix i would go for pc4000 instead... as i could not complain if i got a pc3200 that could only do DDR400 but no more.

right now my options are:
1) get the ballistix pc4000
2) get the ocz 3700 eb
3) stay with my geil value

ADDED:
Thanks Blue078, it is nice to have 262@2.5-3-3-7!

[hollywood]

I just got a Gig of the Ballistix PC4000. I'm running an Athlon 64 3500+ @ 2.5GHz atm on an MSI K8N Neo2 Platty.

Runs 2,2,2,5 1T all the way up to 232 @ 2.85v

Runs 2.5,3,3,8 2T up to 290 @ 2.85v

It's killer memory...Get it and be done with thinking...

[Tedinde]

by high speed, i mean sth like DDR466 or above..
probably for ballistix i would go for pc4000 instead... as i could not complain if i got a pc3200 that could only do DDR400 but no more.

right now my options are:
1) get the ballistix pc4000
2) get the ocz 3700 eb
3) stay with my geil value

ADDED:
Thanks Blue078, it is nice to have 262@2.5-3-3-7!


the 3200 and 4000 ballistix use and are the same chips, they just are set up with different SPD's.

[Tedinde]

i think the 3700eb is out of stock, but 3500eb is still available?

SLN, do you mean that i have a high chance getting the pc4000 running at high speed? or you mean the pc3200?

Tedinde, i would not hesitate buying it if i know i WILL perform like yours... :)
do you run it at 1T or 2T at 250 HTT 2.5-2-2 1 : 1?

It will run 1t @ 262fsb 1:1 2.5-2-2-1 2.75 volts. That's the fastest it will run with tight timings and hardly any volts on the stock volt board.

[SLN]

The boys have spoken....Very good results!!
Ballistix runs great on A64 platforms. However given the very good mem compatibility that the DFI brings to the game...if I upgrade to A64+DFI I would go for mem with TCCD chips. IMO they are better performers... If DFI is not your mobo, go for the "safe bet" and choose micron chips.

[dav]

ballistix uses micro chips doesn't it?

hey hollywood, it's not good to have 1T up to 232 @ 2.85v....
Tedinde has got a better pair.. :)

[The Runner]

im glad a thread like this came up, as i am currently reshuffling my system.

And I think its about time i got 1gb ram as well, so everyones convinced the ballistix is the ram to have? the 4000 of course, however it is dearer than the adata 4000 here in europe (95 @ crucial site)

or I could go for geil value 3200... people say this performs pretty well.

Btw on a gb k8npro can i use 2 modules of ram as well as the ocz booster?

[dav]

i have the geil value pc3200 now and looking for either ballistix pc4000 or ocz 3700eb... :)

my geil is better than I think... running 212@2.5-3-3-5, 1T, 2.6V.

[Romaster]

dav I had a similar situation as you...

I spent about 3 days, the front of my brain wanted OCZ 3500EB, the back of my brain wanted Ballistix pc4000 and a couple terror "cells" here and there wanted corsair 2-2-2-5 xtreme ll..

after that civil war ended.. my brain is now 100% on the ballistix side and I ordered them well.. tuesday.. after all the research I did on those 3 sticks, as well as polls, asking ppl etc the decision was clear..

I recommend the ballistix pc4000 btw.. since the price difference between 3200 and 4000 is only $8, saving $8 and getting possibly less overclockable ram isnt worth it to me..

EDIT: plus they give you free 2 day UPS AIR shipping on anything over $40.. so it will arrive very fast.. I get mine tommorow :D

[dav]

too bad that the 3700eb is out of stock.. so if i am buying then ballistix pc4000 would be my choice.

i'm running my geil value 210.8@2.5-3-3-5@2.6V...

[Levish]

I have 1 bad stick of PC4000 Ballistix memory

wouldn't pass memtest86 at any speed 200-240mhz fsb

the other one did it all no problems

rma-ing the bad one keeping the good one

[dav]

did you get it from crucial.com?

[Levish]

yep ^^

[Levish]

250x10 @ 2.5,3,3,8,1T - 2.8vDimm

10 hours Memtest86 Stable

[Apocalipsis]

if I upgrade to A64+DFI I would go for mem with TCCD chips. IMO they are better performers... If DFI is not your mobo, go for the "safe bet" and choose micron chips.

Hi there SLN, any info or link about how TCCD chips performs on the DFI?

And by the way let me throw a question guys, I see some of you running 512Mb sticks at 1T, is that with only one stick on the system or you can run 1T also with 2 sticks?

[Blue078]

2x512mb with 1t here. Sandra reports it as 2t no matter what, but when set to 2t in the BIOS their is a big difference in scores.

Try dfistreet.com for info on the TCCD and the DFI board, but from what I've read their TCCD chips are the IC of choice for the DFI 754 board.

[Apocalipsis]

Thx Blue.