projekt: Chilla

[blinky]

yay im finally starting my chiller

so i got a 5050btu unit from homedepot, its a hampton bay one, which is a rebadged LG model.

i ran it for about 20 minutes and the temp of the air coming out was around 3c.

i have two issues:
1) some of the screws are incredibly hard to get out, and im gonna have to get a power drill or something with more torque than my arm.

2) the condenser and evap fans are connected to the same motor on the same axis, so im gonna have to do some work on that to take out just the evap fan

onto the pics:

[blinky]

heres the ice chest that im gonna use

[blinky]

heres it with the front cover off

[blinky]

heres the condenser

[chilly1]

Blinky the evap side of the fan can be cut off with a hack saw as this will not affect its operation. I also have one of those, I am going to mod it into a cascade system.
I'll set to notify i=on this thread and I will post answers to questions as time permits...

[blinky]

Originally posted by chilly1
Blinky the evap side of the fan can be cut off with a hack saw as this will not affect its operation. I also have one of those, I am going to mod it into a cascade system.
I'll set to notify i=on this thread and I will post answers to questions as time permits... yah thats what i was thinking

theoretically it shouldnt affect the other fan if i cut it right, but u never know

[afireinside]

Cut the squirl cage off (evap side of fan) with a hacksaw like chilly said. It wont hurt anything.

[OCme]

One very easy way of cutting off the fan shaft is to rest the hacksaw blade on the shaft up close to the motor with the motor running. Saw back and forth after the saw notches into the shaft a little bit. This way the motor will do most of the work for you, and you will end up with a nice neat cut.

[Gary Lloyd]

Cut halfway through and then stop the motor and snap it off. If you cut all the way through with the motor running you could end up with the shaft protruding from your forehead.

[blinky]

Originally posted by Gary Lloyd
Cut halfway through and then stop the motor and snap it off. If you cut all the way through with the motor running you could end up with the shaft protruding from your forehead. yah i was thinkin bout that myself

now i gotta source a hacksaw

i have basically no tools in my house, except screwdrivers and a dremel so ill have to borrow a hacksaw from the neighbors, or dremel it somehow

[OCme]

The long part of the shaft will wobble when your close to the middle. I stopped the motor at that point and snaped it off clean at the middle. No head trauma here!

[blinky]

alright so i went to kragen, and they only had one or two bottles of gas-line antifreeze, which was $1.20 for 12oz. so i think im just gonna use isopropyl alcohol, what mixture should i use of that and water?

[blinky]

heres the alcohol ill use

what mixture should i use
im estimating my chiller wont go below -40c

[kommando]

What wil you be missing it with?

[blinky]

Originally posted by kommando
What wil you be missing it with? water

[kommando]

Maybe 75/25...

[Gary Lloyd]

DaBit has done considerable research on this. Check out his website:

http://www.icecoldcomputing.com

[blinky]

Originally posted by Gary Lloyd
DaBit has done considerable research on this. Check out his website:

http://www.icecoldcomputing.com no i know ive read that already, but its hard to find gas-line antifreeze which has methanol.
so im gonna go with isopropyl alcohol

[afireinside]

gas line antifreeze IS methanol :p:

[blinky]

Originally posted by afireinside
gas line antifreeze IS methanol :p: well i found it, but its kinda expensive, and they only had 2 bottles left, and said they werent planning on stocking it anymore

[blinky]

do you guys think this will work as an evap/HX from refridgerant to alcohol

http://www.rparts.com/Catalog/Major_Components/accumulators/accumulators.asp its the one on the very bottom of that page

are there better HX's like the ones used in cascades, where can i buy those

or else i might have to make one

[chilly1]

Your local ac company RSD/Total control has a calgon antifreeze that is good to -60 at 80/20, I would use it straight -80F. it is 15% water,,, Its onlt 16 per gallon there...

[blinky]

alright, i will only need about a gallon if i use this HX cuz there will be no huge res to fill.

chilly u know of a good HX that would suit my situation, preferably with 1/2" ID openings for the coolant

[blinky]

hmm, u cant order online with them, and the nearest place is in san jose or san leandro or concorde, too far away considering i get places on my bike

also i found some nice cheap insulation: http://www.rei.com/online/store/ProductDisplay?productId=311&storeId=8000&catalogId=40000008000&langId=-1

[blinky]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=45040&item=3815293341&rd=1
how bout that one

[chilly1]

Originally posted by blinky
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=45040&item=3815293341&rd=1
how bout that one

Need more info on this one ... its huge and if it is what I think it is there are three circuits, It would make a good interstage HX for a dual head cascade with three compressors but it is huge, at a guess I would say it is a glycol colled condenser for a medium/low temp cases like the hussman protocol and would be used for 6 to 8. 5 ton compressors...

[chilly1]

Originally posted by blinky
alright, i will only need about a gallon if i use this HX cuz there will be no huge res to fill.

chilly u know of a good HX that would suit my situation, preferably with 1/2" ID openings for the coolant

COAX 1/2 ton I found one at johnstones for 55bucks I think runmc used the same one for his interstage...

[blinky]

alright i bought one for $30 from solo, on the XS FS/FT forum. looks good

[blinky]

aight after halting this project because of school, im back at it

i got 2 gal. of methanol, and ripped open the AC.

now im encountering a problem: the cap tube and suction line are both on the side of the evap about halfway up, so if i were to put it in my ice chest is couldnt drop in all the way, what should i do?

i was thinking of either, cutting a slot in the side of te ice chest for the cap tube and suction line pipes to go in, then seal it up,
OR
bend the two line going to and from the evap in such a way that they go up when they come out and in to the evap, so i can drop the evap in the res
OR
i can build a completey new res out of sheet aluminum or something


also what should i do with the thermostat?

pics to come soon the digicam batteries went dead

[chilly1]

Aren't you going to use the coax?

[blinky]

Originally posted by chilly1
Aren't you going to use the coax? weeeeeeellll

i dont have guages or a recovery tank, so i dont think i can take the r12 out. i might have pc ice do it for me over the summer if he is so inclined

[chilly1]

Use a recovery bag...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=66999&item=3820739935&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

[blinky]

Originally posted by chilly1
Use a recovery bag...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=66999&item=3820739935&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW okayyy, so once i open the little valves and the refirgerant goes in the bag, how do i ge it back in the system once ive made my modifications?

could you PM me with details

[chilly1]

You will need guages. The bag will have the refrigerant in it the valve is a two way valve, compressor will suck it back in...

[blinky]

Originally posted by chilly1
You will need guages. The bag will have the refrigerant in it the valve is a two way valve, compressor will suck it back in... aight that makes sense, but i have no guages. arent they like 80 bucks tho?

[chilly1]

59 at united refrigeration or allied

[blinky]

i still say i should get pc ice to do it, cuz i have 0 phase change experience and i could learn from him if he does it

[blinky]

here u can see how the tubs go in the side of the evap

[blinky]

aight no replies, i guess ill just cut the ice chest, cuz it was only 10 bucks anyways

now how would i reseal it? whats that foam stuff that expands to fit a certain area then u shave off the excess. i could use that stuff

chilly u wanna sell me some used guages man, i dont got much money

[chilly1]

Lay it flat and seal around the edges then set yout intake below ant the inlet above..

[bh2k]

Originally posted by blinky
considering i get places on my bike


that must suck :(

[boasist]

How is your progress coming with this? I have the exact same unit and was probably going to run a similar setup to yourself. Here is a shot after about 20 mins

Its at -26.1

[Gary Lloyd]

If you can move the electrical panel out of the way, it would be helpful to get a pic of the entire suction line, so that we can see what needs to be done to it to make it fit in a cooler.

[blinky]

Originally posted by chilly1
Lay it flat and seal around the edges then set yout intake below ant the inlet above.. wha wha?

u want me to lay it horizontal, over the ice chest, and then run the coolant over it?

im not sure that would work well


dude chilly u got any used guages for like 30 or 40$

[blinky]

Originally posted by boasist
How is your progress coming with this? I have the exact same unit and was probably going to run a similar setup to yourself. Here is a shot after about 20 mins

Its at -26.1 NICE dude, i wasnt able to cut off my fan yet, cuz sheograth broke his AC so we had to use this one for chilled air. but when i get back to my moms im gonna complete this, im tired of it being not done

[blinky]

Originally posted by Gary Lloyd
If you can move the electrical panel out of the way, it would be helpful to get a pic of the entire suction line, so that we can see what needs to be done to it to make it fit in a cooler. okay, the suction line is the one that has two comin out of the evap that join into one. if u look at the black foam on the bottom left, theres two pipes goin through. the left one is connected to the cap tube, the right one is the suction line, which after passing through that foam, makes a right hand turn and then goes up to the the top of the compressor where it goes back in

that help ya any?

[chilly1]

Guess your cooler isnt big enough to lay the coil flat inside it. I meant half way inside like a flow through..

[boasist]

here is a pic of the tube routing from evap to comp

[boasist]

as for the fan.....no need to saw it off. see the little collet that holds it on?....just take a screwdriver and push it off from between the fins of the fan. it works. yet so does the other way.

[blinky]

nice boasist, yah i saw that little thing, and was gonna take that off, but i didnt get a chance too.

how are you gonna fit it in your ice chest tho?
cut a slot in the side?


@chilly, i THINK, just think, that it would fit horizontally with the far end hitting the bottom, and the near end laying on the lip of the chest, but... iono if that would chill well.

i think im just gonna cut the ice chest, i can always buy another

[chilly1]

Rotate it 180 degrees and put it in that way... Upside down..

[Gary Lloyd]

Originally posted by boasist
here is a pic of the tube routing from evap to comp

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=470685

What would be ideal is to fit the evap and the suction line into the cooler. The problem is the distance between the front of the evap and the vertical section of the suction line. If a 90 degree bend could be made in the horizontal section of the suction line (at bottom of the pic), the line would wrap around the back of the evap, and the distance between the front of the evap and the vertical line would be greatly reduced.

You can get rid of the styrofoam, and cut off the front motor shaft. This will give you a lot more room to work.

[blinky]

so gary, u want me to move the evap closer to the compressor by wrapping the bottom part of the suction line around thee back of the evap. how would this help me?

to chilly, thats a good idea about putting it vertically, i think ill do that but i gotta get a pipe bender first,

any of u guys know refrigeration people in the bay area who could help me put the HX on.

[boasist]

so we have these 2 routings of tubing.

Which one do you feel should get bent? the closer or further one? and this gets bent right upwards or wouldn't that be 180? so right outwards?

[chilly1]

Does PC Ice live near you Blinky???

[boasist]

not I

[blinky]

Originally posted by chilly1
Does PC Ice live near you Blinky??? well... i thought he did, cuz in his location thingy it said south bay, i was thinking that meant south bay AREA. cuz when people from the bay area say south bay they mean the san jose/san bruno area. but i think he actually lives in a region of LA called south bay... so.... no

i gotta find some refrigeraion expert near me, hmm

my next door neighbor is a plumber, maybe he might know someone

cuz if i could get that HX installed it would be sweet.

also theres a big gap in the middle, so im afraid some coolant might pass through uncooled. so...
i was gonna put BBs in it, to add mass, and slow down the coolant. and keep the BBs inthe HX with a metal grate on each end or something

[Gary Lloyd]

The Rubbermaid 12 can cooler has an interior width in the bottom of 3 1/2 inches. If you measure the distance from the front of the evap to the vertical suction line you will find that it is more than this. The idea is to move the vertical line closer to the evap, by bending the horizontal line, so that both can fit inside the cooler.

Then do the same thing with the cap tube line.

Bending the tubing would be much easier with a tubing bender. Be careful not to kink the lines.

[blinky]

yah i see what ur saying now, the cooler i have is about 10" wide, so i guess i could just drop the whole thing in with the tubing too

aight ill try that

hey boasist, what res u planning on using?

[boasist]

I'm thinking about the one that Gary suggested to Pimpsho awhile back.

the rubbermaid one.....12 can cooler.

15 bucks at US plastics

thought I read someone got it for 10 at target.

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=USPlastic&category%5Fname=Rubbermaid%AE+Insulated+Coolers&product%5Fid=Rubbermaid%AE+12+Can+Slim+Insulated+C ooler

[blinky]

yah gary ima buy a pipe bender as soon as i can, and put it in vertically. u dont think that would hurt its cooling performance tho?

btw, im at my dads house for the summer, and i cant really bring the AC down here, so i have to work on it when i go to my moms, which is every other weekend or so.

[blinky]

ok update: i took of the fans, and bent the lines so that the evap is vertical but its hanging below the AC, so that i have to put it up on boxes so the evap isnt holding the weight on it. ill prolly do some more bending, and get it so that i dont have to do that anymore, also im gonna buy some polyeurathane elf-expanding foam, and fit it in so that the water is forced to flow through the evap before it can be pumped out

btw thanks to boshi :D

o and it pulled a low of -27c with a thermal probe in the evap

[beathoven]

very nice work. :)

[boasist]

any way possible for you to post pics of your success so far blinky?

the local HD sells a pipe bender for 10 bucks so if you can. let me see which pipe bender you got too so that I can create the same results.

[blinky]

dude we had two different pipe benders, and because of the tricky angles, neither could be used, we ended up just bending it by hand, if u support both sides of the bend it works well

i cant post pics because my dad has my digicam, grrrrrr

so my evap is vertical, and one problem is that the top of the evap gets waaay colder than the bottom, so im gonna have to make a custom eclosure because the ice chest i have now isnt tall enough to house the top of the evap

hmmm, maybe ill make it out of plexi

[blinky]

also take the line going fom the control station to the compressor off and then bend the suction line pipe going near em up, and then put the wires back but this time under the suction line pipe, whereas stock they are above the suction line pipe which would hinder its movement :)

[blinky]

also the evap is originally grounded, so we extended the ground wire so it could still be ground, dunno if u need to do that tho

[kayl]

grounding is good.
if the compressor shorts, or something else goes wrong every metal surface can be live, one touch and zap

[blinky]

okay so im gonna have to build a custom res so that i can make it decently compact, cuz the ice chest thingy is really wrong sized, so i was thinking of using either plexi, or sheet aluminum, or styrafoam. styrafoam would be ideal, i could coat the inside with a clear lacquer

do u guys think the methanol would eat through the styrafoam, my dad thinks it would be fine