Laing DDC pump repair PCB mod [Archive]

wizard1238

01-11-2011, 04:13 AM

After replaced the PCB of DDC 18W, the ampere increased from 1.5A to 1.8A,
the flow rate increased about 20% (using stock top)
The audible noise is also increased:eek: it should be caused by the increased rotation speed:up:
The IC leg spacing is only 0.33mm, drag soldering is the only way:rolleyes:
I have accidentally reverse the diode and the most expensive IC burn immediately at connecting the power:shrug:
This controller TB6588FG is an all-in-one design, it has built-in overheat and restart protection, only a few external component can get it work, the original laing design is unnecessary complex.
This IC also have built-in speed control, connecting a variable resistor can adjust the rotation speed.
More information can be found in the Toshiba semiconductor website, it has datasheet and official circuit to follow.

DDC pump repair in 3 mins video guide
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_Rpty4lWgg

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/8620/tb6588fg1.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/84/tb6588fg2.jpg
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/4426/tb6588fg3.jpg

Church

01-11-2011, 04:37 AM

How it can be regulated? Can it be downvolted, and at low voltage/speed at that? Is pwm regulation possible for this controller? (who knows, maybe DIY cheap PWM MCP35X mod is possible :) )

wizard1238

01-11-2011, 04:52 AM

no need to downvolt, the IC has a pin to control the rotation speed:)
the IC spec. told it can run at 50V. I will try it later to see if my DDC can run at 3X rotation speed i.e. 20000rpm:eek::cool:

Church

01-11-2011, 05:07 AM

Hheh, something like Iwaki RD pumps but in DDC housing? :D
What was cost of your mod? Does that controller include that PCB or it's original from pump?

wizard1238

01-11-2011, 08:36 AM

the mod cost 9.95 only, it's a repair kit from the internet

TJ TRICHEESE

01-11-2011, 08:52 AM

looks good, i might look into this

SpuTnicK

01-11-2011, 09:12 AM

the mod cost 9.95 only, it's a repair kit from the internet

share a link please.

edit: found it (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-repair-kit-TB6588FG-MCP355-/330518183306?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf46b3d8a)

also found these two interesting lots from the same guy:
Laing DDC water pump 12W swiftech MCP350 with heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c)
Laing DDC water pump 18W blue rotor MCP355 heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a)

If the specs are true and the quality is high, then these are great alternative considering the price!

Waterlogged

01-11-2011, 09:19 AM

http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-repair-kit-TB6588FG-MCP355-/330518183306?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf46b3d8a

Church

01-11-2011, 09:54 AM

Hmm, really cheap. Should help those with fried PCBs DDCs. Only problem - required soldering skills on advanced side. And how speed regulation is actually done?

NaeKuh

01-11-2011, 10:50 AM

omg u serious?

this works?

>.<

how much soldering is required?

If this is a good repair, then i can think of a lot of people who u just made super happy, as well as vendors who can sell this as well.

Hmm, really cheap. Should help those with fried PCBs DDCs. Only problem - required soldering skills on advanced side. And how speed regulation is actually done?

sell the presoldered boards for a straight drop replacement and u win even if you were to sell the pcb @ 29.99

Waterlogged

01-11-2011, 10:55 AM

omg u serious?

this works?

>.<

how much soldering is required?

If this is a good repair, then i can think of a lot of people who u just made super happy, as well as vendors who can sell this as well.

sell the presoldered boards for a straight drop replacement and u win even if you were to sell the pcb @ 29.99

I have a couple of DDC-2's still hanging around that I'd buy these for but, not from overseas (or fleaBay for that matter).

SpuTnicK

01-11-2011, 11:23 AM

And how speed regulation is actually done?

Based around a Toshiba PWM sensorless driver ASSP, the TB6588FG evaluation board (TB6588FG_EVB1) allows engineers to modify key parameters that adjust start-up performance, motor efficiency and acoustic noise. The board is designed for direct control by voltage input or connection to a host processor, and connects directly to the motor under test with no additional hardware components. Target applications for the new board include home appliance, pump, industrial and automotive motion control designs.

source (http://www.toshiba-components.com/motorcontrol/pdfs/NEWSFlashTB6588_0811_M.pdf)

Church

01-11-2011, 12:06 PM

Hmm, thanks for info SpuTnick. Then it seems that for 29.99 presoldered board with PWM regulation capability for reviving dead DDC pumps might indeed find it's market :). A bit too expensive if working new 355 pump + board for 29.99 though, as it's already MCP35X price, with better top aswell.

SpuTnicK

01-11-2011, 12:32 PM

Why $29.99? it costs $9.95 (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-repair-kit-TB6588FG-MCP355-/330518183306?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf46b3d8a)? or I am missing something?

Petra

01-11-2011, 12:35 PM

share a link please.

edit: found it (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-repair-kit-TB6588FG-MCP355-/330518183306?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf46b3d8a)

also found these two interesting lots from the same guy:
Laing DDC water pump 12W swiftech MCP350 with heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c)
Laing DDC water pump 18W blue rotor MCP355 heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a)

If the specs are true and the quality is high, then these are great alternative considering the price!

Very interesting... but I hate small surface mount components.... but it looks so interesting.... but I hate surface mount..... but...but... Gwaargh!!! CONFLICT!!!

Hm, wait a second... I'm sure I could mod my toaster oven to serve as a crude reflow oven.

I think I'll pick one up to play with. :D

Holst

01-11-2011, 12:38 PM

Church

01-11-2011, 01:15 PM

SpuTnicK: $29.9 was mentioned by Naekuh as good price to sell such $9.95 board/controllers but with all needed chips already presoldered as answer to my post on 'advanced soldering skills required' :)

SpuTnicK

01-11-2011, 01:18 PM

:doh: missed that one.

NaeKuh

01-11-2011, 02:39 PM

:doh: missed that one.

lol the fictional 20 dollar labor charge!

:D

seriously i can see vendors selling this unit at 29.99 if they had it pre soldered and it being a hot item.

I myself have 2 ddc's i can easily change the PCB too, and give it a resurrection.

Now im waiting for alex to somehow drop a super charger on it... or Martin to somehow throw NOS voltages of 20V on this badboy, and we can call it a THREAD!

Sparky

01-11-2011, 02:55 PM

I wanna see this running at least 36V :D

Alexandr0s

01-11-2011, 03:17 PM

"If my calculations are correct, when this baby hits eighty-eight Volts... you're gonna see some serious :banana::banana::banana::banana:. "

Spazloy

01-11-2011, 04:00 PM

wizard1238

01-11-2011, 04:40 PM

so hold on... ive got my MPC 355 at home, and a soldering kit handy.

are you saying if i buy this kit for 10 bucks

i can volt up my DDC so it more or less equals the power of 2 of them???

and i wont need any other components?

if i do need other components could someone make me a shopping list :)
im in the UK so it will take a while for it to get here but if this is correct it will save me a lot of cash

According to the datasheet, the Toshiba controller IC is 50V maximum. For higher than 12V operation, the power stabilization capactior 22uf and 0.1uf voltage rating need to increase. For higher than 30V operation, the Schottky Diode voltage rating need to increase as well.

fgw

01-11-2011, 05:02 PM

ok folks,

could not resist! just ordered one of this kits!

its just 10usd and free shipping so who cares? was too curious.

let you know how this turns out ...

Tetrafluorometh

01-13-2011, 03:24 PM

Have ordered one my self to the UK. I have someone with a reflow oven so hopefully get a good join. This DDC 3.2 i have has been dead for sometime so i will test it out fully, 20K RPM be cool

lowfat

01-13-2011, 03:53 PM

also found these two interesting lots from the same guy:
Laing DDC water pump 12W swiftech MCP350 with heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c)
Laing DDC water pump 18W blue rotor MCP355 heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a)

If the specs are true and the quality is high, then these are great alternative considering the price!

Damn those are some snazzy prices. Looks like I am going to have to order a bunch. :p:

Installing the modifier PCB looks like way too much work for my lazy ***.

SpuTnicK

01-14-2011, 01:39 AM

It would be good to know if those pumps are a good bargain.
So don't forget to share your exp. here ;)

Boogerlad

01-15-2011, 08:24 AM

with this new pcb, is it still possible to mod the 3.1s to 3.2s via the solder mod? Ｉ wanna buy like 4 of these pumps because it's such a good deal!

Waterlogged

01-15-2011, 08:40 AM

with this new pcb, is it still possible to mod the 3.1s to 3.2s via the solder mod? Ｉ wanna buy like 4 of these pumps because it's such a good deal!

If I understand things correctly, you don't mod this like the 3.1/3.2 mod, it works of straight voltage control.

Boogerlad

01-15-2011, 08:51 AM

so since 3.1=3.2 other than solder difference, with this new pcb, there's no performance difference between 3.1 and 3.2?

Waterlogged

01-15-2011, 08:54 AM

There is no 3.1 or 3.2 (or 3.25 or MCP35x for that matter) with this repair kit. How much voltage you use is how fast it runs.

bmaverick

01-15-2011, 02:24 PM

So, you will need to solder the items to the board first before putting the PCB into a DDC pump? Then, solder 8 copper tiny lead-wires of the pump armature to the new PCB?

It sounds like a job for really tiny fingers and a professional hobbyist soldering station.

But the thrill to have an all out DDC with no limits and a POT (variable resistor) is very intriguing. I have several dozen DDC-1T (MCP350) pumps on hand but no pro solder station.

jumper2high

01-15-2011, 02:38 PM

Very interesting... but I hate small surface mount components.... but it looks so interesting.... but I hate surface mount..... but...but... Gwaargh!!! CONFLICT!!!

Hm, wait a second... I'm sure I could mod my toaster oven to serve as a crude reflow oven.

I think I'll pick one up to play with. :D

I've been using a heat gun (used to strip paint) to reflow-solder dozens of LEDs onto various types of PCBs. Works like a charm. If you happen to have a thermocouple sensor as well, you can even regulate the temperature by raising the whole thing up and down over time (and thus follow proper reflow preheat, solder and cooldown times and rates). :)

Boogerlad

01-15-2011, 03:27 PM

There is no 3.1 or 3.2 (or 3.25 or MCP35x for that matter) with this repair kit. How much voltage you use is how fast it runs.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c
=
http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a
???
according to you right?

Sparky

01-15-2011, 03:33 PM

http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c
=
http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a
???
according to you right?

The one is POST-REPAIR PCB mod.

The other is PRE-REPAIR PCB mod.

So no, they are not the same. Why the attitude?

Boogerlad

01-15-2011, 03:46 PM

sorry, Ｉ didn't mean any attitude. I'm really confused lol

lowfat

01-15-2011, 03:49 PM

The one is POST-REPAIR PCB mod.

The other is PRE-REPAIR PCB mod.

I do believe Boogerman is right. Neither of those pumps are using the PCB that diyinhk has for sale on eBay. If you do this modification to both of those pumps, then yes they would be exactly the same.

Waterlogged

01-15-2011, 04:23 PM

http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c
=
http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a
???
according to you right?

Neither of those are using the repair PCB kit. They are regular DDC's with the special liquid compensator housing. What you asked about was the repair kit being modable like the old 3.1 to 3.2 hack.

Boogerlad

01-15-2011, 04:30 PM

sorry, Ｉ was referring to

share a link please.

edit: found it (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-repair-kit-TB6588FG-MCP355-/330518183306?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf46b3d8a)

also found these two interesting lots from the same guy:
Laing DDC water pump 12W swiftech MCP350 with heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c)
Laing DDC water pump 18W blue rotor MCP355 heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a)

If the specs are true and the quality is high, then these are great alternative considering the price!

Waterlogged

01-15-2011, 04:36 PM

Can't really say but it does look like they are the right models for the mod.

Sparky

01-15-2011, 10:47 PM

Now I'm confused.
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g270/SparkyJJO/smileys/silly.gif

lowfat

01-15-2011, 10:51 PM

Now I'm confused.
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g270/SparkyJJO/smileys/silly.gif

The pumps he is selling do not come w/ the modified PCB that he also sells. He sells DDC3.1's and DDC3.2's. The only real difference is the PCB on them. So if you were to throw in the modified PCB's in them. Then they would be pretty much the same pump.

zenix

01-16-2011, 02:37 AM

The pumps he is selling do not come w/ the modified PCB that he also sells. He sells DDC3.1's and DDC3.2's. The only real difference is the PCB on them. So if you were to throw in the modified PCB's in them. Then they would be pretty much the same pump.

He is using another PCB on the MCP350 But not the blue one.
Also the MCP350 is not a 3.1 but it has a black impeller, so its a 2.

The PCB is replaced by the famous Japanese SANYO motor driver. It has built in overheat, motor lock and even water leak protection. It's much more advance, reliable and silent than the original. Moreover, it use 2oz copper thickness PCB and Teflon wire for the power cable. It also has the TACH/RPM wire(blue wire in pics). We have confidence and our custom PCB is provided with 1 year warranty

The seller also told me this

The 12W DDC use our new Sanyo motor driver PCB, it's not on sale in ebay yet. It's running at 3600rpm, the same speed as a MCP350. The 12W is black impeller. There are test in the internet that black impeller has bigger center hole than the latest blue impeller, and the performace is better.

And the MCP355 is 3.2, without any modifications on the PCB.

SpuTnicK

01-16-2011, 02:43 AM

Most definite is that someone has to buy each of those three parts and fully examine what are they capable of.

Church

01-16-2011, 03:56 AM

zenix: you could also ask him if he can make PCB or premoded pump to be regulateable via PWM / MCP-35X alike, and consider selling presoldered kits, even if at higher price.

NaeKuh

01-16-2011, 11:08 AM

guys keep note, that our current tops were designed with the pumps which we use right now.

Not ddc's with volume compensator.

Last thing to note, not all tops are M4 threaded.

These ddc's with larger base housing will require your screws to fit in stock housing or your gonna have one hell of a time at a hardware store looking for the proper bolts.
Also another thing that scares me is that the FAKE Laings had larger bases... :wasntme:

and to my last knowledge, it wasnt the black impeller DDC-1 which were the best, it was the RED Impeller 18W DDC-2:
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p73/aigomorla/Pumps/IMG_0082.jpg

bmaverick

01-16-2011, 11:37 AM

Interesting to know that the ebay ad states,

"...This is the rare special edition Laing DDC1A-VC with built in liquid volume compensator. It is the famous black rotor version with bigger center inlet hole. These pumps were originally pulled from working Mac G5 liquid cooling assemblies. The liquid volume compensator is a deluxe feature of Laing DDC water pump for OEM order only and it is not available for sell in the retail market until now. ..." http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c

The DDC1A-VC 12W for the Apple G5 workstation used a corrosive salt based coolant. Since these were pulls from actual G5 machines, I would not even dare get involved with those pumps. There are reports all over several of the Apple forums about this coolant leaking and ruining hardware. :down:

Now, when the Dell H2C 720 gaming rig came out, Dell did not want the to replay warranty issues Apple had with those VC pumps. Instead, they went with a distilled water and propylene glycol mixture with a custom corrosion inhibitor package. :up:

Church

01-16-2011, 11:47 AM

salt based coolant? why for? what advantages it might bring? :confused: (except of course corrosive disadvantages)

Alexandr0s

01-16-2011, 11:52 AM

Probably 0.01C and 'low costs'.

mav2000

01-16-2011, 10:38 PM

So these should not be bought?

Also what do all the extra things do...like the liquid compensator and stuff.

Petra

01-17-2011, 07:28 AM

I've been using a heat gun (used to strip paint) to reflow-solder dozens of LEDs onto various types of PCBs. Works like a charm. If you happen to have a thermocouple sensor as well, you can even regulate the temperature by raising the whole thing up and down over time (and thus follow proper reflow preheat, solder and cooldown times and rates). :)

Hmm... I hadn't thought of that. :up:

wizard1238

01-17-2011, 09:16 AM

yes, I also found that using hot air gun has much better success rate than drag soldering for this kind 0.33mm leg spacing IC. but it should be done very carefully, 360 degree maximum 10 second. After the solder melt and the IC self align , hold the temperture for 10s and stop the heat gun immediately. For me, drag soldering is good for >0.4mm leg spacing.

SpuTnicK

01-25-2011, 10:36 AM

Another item on sale from diyinhk

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/1639/pumpmodmcp350.jpg

Each pump is modded and tested one by one. The PCB has going over three version and It's 100% bug free. We only use top quality component, Dale resister, Japanese capacitor, 2oz copper PCB, Gold plated heatsink, Kester lead free solder etc.. As the price told, profit is not the target, more user of our product and your good comment is the mostly wanted.

Laing DDC water pump 12W swiftech MCP350 with heatsink (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-12W-swiftech-MCP350-heatsink-/230572382236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af2f581c)

Waterlogged

01-25-2011, 10:48 AM

I would have to question the actual effectiveness of that heat sink with it being buried inside the plastic housing.

Church

01-25-2011, 11:33 AM

+1 on doubts.
I remember simple mod with cutting holes in pump plastic casing, was very effective in bringing temps down even with original PCB.

wizard1238

01-25-2011, 04:24 PM

I would have to question the actual effectiveness of that heat sink with it being buried inside the plastic housing.

This is another PCB mod, sanyo motor driver:welcome:
Test shows that without the heatsink, the pump can only run with stock top. i.e. maximum ~0.9A.
with the heatsink, it can run with aftermarket top and up to 1.5A before trigger the overheat protection. The pump stop when overheat detect, and auto restart when temperature is reduced. This should be a standard feature seems not available in the Laing original PCB.

this sanyo uses "sine wave" can drive motor more silent than "PWM", but more heat. Test shows that Toshiba PWM can drive up to 2A without extra heatsink. for xtremer, toshiba PWM. for silent love - sanyo sine wave:)

thegcpu

01-25-2011, 08:00 PM

@wizard1238

How do you mount the pump as there is no mounting ears?

Waterlogged

01-25-2011, 09:21 PM

This is another PCB mod, sanyo motor driver:welcome:
Test shows that without the heatsink, the pump can only run with stock top. i.e. maximum ~0.9A.
with the heatsink, it can run with aftermarket top and up to 1.5A before trigger the overheat protection. The pump stop when overheat detect, and auto restart when temperature is reduced. This should be a standard feature seems not available in the Laing original PCB.

this sanyo uses "sine wave" can drive motor more silent than "PWM", but more heat. Test shows that Toshiba PWM can drive up to 2A without extra heatsink. for xtremer, toshiba PWM. for silent love - sanyo sine wave:)

I'm not saying it doesn't work, I'm saying it doesn't work as well as it could.

Heat sinks require a constant supply of moving air in order to be able to efficiently shed the heat they collect, yours isn't getting any fresh air because it's inside the pump housing. If the housing had even a few holes in them, the heat sink would do a much better job. :up:

wizard1238

01-25-2011, 10:54 PM

I'm not saying it doesn't work, I'm saying it doesn't work as well as it could.

Heat sinks require a constant supply of moving air in order to be able to efficiently shed the heat they collect, yours isn't getting any fresh air because it's inside the pump housing. If the housing had even a few holes in them, the heat sink would do a much better job. :up:

Yes, It should perform better if open to free air:up: you are right:welcome:
But it has already let the sanyo driver run at it's full potential 1.5A inside the original plastic housing.
Without it, we can only use stock top and test shows that the sanyo driver will overheat at only 0.9A even run nude without the original plastic housing:p:

Church

01-25-2011, 11:32 PM

Alexandr0s

01-26-2011, 12:22 AM

I'm still confused as to why Koolance decided to go with the color they choose for it. I really think either nickle or black would've looked much better.

wizard1238

01-26-2011, 02:18 AM

Maybe this thread (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=254343) might be of interest. Should be simple to make with dremel at hand. This (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=262204) was done by just drilling holes in hausing.
But though not the cheapest, most effective and best looking probably would be this replacement pump hausing by Koolance (http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/product_info.php?product_id=1058). It's not only air open, but also from metal, +heatsink, +thermal pads from fets to heatsink, +superb looks. :up:

the koolance solution is good for long run and it's the only solution for the original laing PCB. It's amazing and superb looks:D heat transfer from IC leg to PCB first to thermal pads to heatsink.

this gold plated heatsink is designed only for this sanyo solution, It make direct contact to the IC top for immediately and quick heat dissipation. I tried 3M silicone thermal pad between the heatsink and sanyo IC top in the very beginning, the pump can run up from 0.9A to 1A only and trigger the overheat protection...direct contact heatsink rise the overheat protection trigger originally at 0.9A to 1.5A. Actually, I am very lucky to find it out, the 12W pump can use aftermarket top and run stable finally before it's go public:) Test result shows that EK/XSPC aftermarket top rise the current from 0.9A to 1.1A, there are still 40% headroom to go for this sanyo with heatsink solution:cool: Actually, 40% headroom may be too much even for aerospace industry:p:

lowfat

01-27-2011, 10:27 AM

Also what do all the extra things do...like the liquid compensator and stuff.

All it is 4 metal springs. Although I haven't used the pumps yet but I do not think they are all that useful.

Anyways is anyone willing to do the soldering required to these PCBs if I were to send the gear to him?

Sparky

01-27-2011, 03:07 PM

I had a DDC pulled from a mac with one of those compensator things. The rubber diaphragm split and it leaked :( I'd sooner get a DDC without that compensator thingy.

bmaverick

01-27-2011, 09:58 PM

I had a DDC pulled from a mac with one of those compensator things. The rubber diaphragm split and it leaked :( I'd sooner get a DDC without that compensator thingy.

This is a common issue with the DDC-VC pumps once they are taken out of the 12psi pressure loop and used in a regular WCing loop with a RES. The diaphragm has no pressure to keep it pressed against the backing plate held by the four springs, thus the rubber diaphragm can easily split.

lowfat

01-27-2011, 10:23 PM

Honestly the diaphragm doesn't look all that cheap to me. Both of mine look to be in great shape. And if by chance it leaks from there I don't see why I couldn't just block small hole to the diaphragm w/ a dab of silicon.

thegcpu

01-28-2011, 08:32 AM

I would like to order one to play with, but how do you mount it?

SpuTnicK

02-06-2011, 12:33 PM

I know it was already posted somewhere on XS, but just keep all in one place:
http://i.ebayimg.com/08/!CD2JnwQBmk~$(KGrHqF,!hcE0ieTd(zJBNP7c7meJQ~~_35.J PG

This is a Laing DDC pump bottom heatsink with vibration damper. It is suitable to all version of DDC pump include MCP350 MCP355, the newest MCP35X, and the taller Apple G5 VC version.
http://www.diyinhk.com/ebayimg/DDCIMG_9964.jpg

It is a gold plated metal plate with direct contact to the ddc bottom. The metal plate has a silicone feet to ensure better air flow in the bottom. It avoid the danger of overheat problem like the traditional way which fullly cover the bottom with sponge gel for vibration damping. The silicone feet also turely decoupled the ddc pump, not direct load path from the pump to the computer case, it is ture isolation.
Link (http://cgi.ebay.com/DDC-pump-bottom-heatsink-damper-MCP350-MCP355-MCP35X-/330523605231?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf4bdf8ef)
do i hear gold? :confused:

BTW, I am Xtreme Enthusiast now :D

wizard1238

02-06-2011, 04:07 PM

This bottom is made from mcpcb (metal core pcb). It has 2OZ copper layer and 1.6MM aluminum layer(like a double layer heatsink).
This type of professional PCB is used for best thermal transfer of electronic component. It is much expensive than ordinary PCB.
The copper area under the DDC bottom is gold plated, it uses the same treatment of PCB terminal(aka gold finger).

wizard1238

02-12-2011, 10:40 PM

DDC pump repair in 3 minutes guide video:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_Rpty4lWgg

lowfat

02-12-2011, 10:57 PM

DDC pump repair in 3 minutes guide video:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_Rpty4lWgg

Is there another part to that? :shrug:

Martinm210

02-13-2011, 12:06 AM

DDC pump repair in 3 minutes guide video:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_Rpty4lWgg

But you didn't finish soldering the wires to the PCB...:D

Pretty neat seeing the heat gun soldering iron in action.:up:

Tetrafluorometh

02-13-2011, 01:33 AM

Mine is sat in customs still :(, so has anyone gotten anything yet? I am going to run a dual pump setup and tempted to run these togther

SpuTnicK

02-13-2011, 03:37 AM

DDC pump repair in 3 minutes guide video:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_Rpty4lWgg

we need part two.
great work.:up:

Tetrafluorometh

02-14-2011, 01:07 AM

I just been chatting to the man on eBay

Thank you for interesting in our product, The Sanyo pcb assembled version for the 10W black rotor DDC is on sale in the ebay store now. The Toshiba assembled pcb for the 18W purple rotor DDC will be on sale soon. What is your ddc rotor color to repair? Thanks

Seams like they are apealing to our need. Most of us can solder. Im sure we don't need the reflow air gun to remove the coil wires, an soldering iron will do fine

lowfat

02-14-2011, 12:14 PM

This is everything that comes in the envelope. So uh where does everything go? http://smiliesftw.com/x/tounged.gif (http://smiliesftw.com)
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/57288db582dcffe94c642baf61c70e79.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)

If the completed PCB's are going to be on sale soon I might as well not attempt to (and likely destroy) to do the soldering myself. Hopefully he will have versions available capable of more than 12V.

Boogerlad

02-27-2011, 05:18 PM

No more sanyo pcb + ddc anymore? I was going to buy one. =(

@lex

02-27-2011, 11:26 PM

No more sanyo pcb + ddc anymore? I was going to buy one. =(
Why? It says "more than 10 available" on Ebay

wizard1238

02-28-2011, 04:29 AM

a review from russia:):clap:

http://people.overclockers.ru/AlexT/record3

http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/7761/204876.png

Boogerlad

02-28-2011, 09:17 AM

Why? It says "more than 10 available" on Ebay

not with the modified sanyo pcb preinstalled =(

does http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-10W-repair-kit-MCP350-/230585420948?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35aff64c94#ht_914wt_932 work on ddc 3.1 blue impeller too?

SpuTnicK

02-28-2011, 10:14 AM

not with the modified sanyo pcb preinstalled =(

How about this (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-10W-DIY-kit-Swiftech-MCP350-/230589174409?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b02f9289)?

does http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-10W-repair-kit-MCP350-/230585420948?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35aff64c94#ht_914wt_932 work on ddc 3.1 blue impeller too?
Why not... :yepp:

wizard1238

02-28-2011, 12:56 PM

does http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-10W-repair-kit-MCP350-/230585420948?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35aff64c94#ht_914wt_932 work on ddc 3.1 blue impeller too?

DDC3.x copper coil wire has larger diameter and the location is different than DDC2 and DDC1.
Only the Toshiba TB6588FG can use, and also need to extend the copper coil wire to the location which is designed for DDC2/1.
The DDC3 10W and 18W has the same copper coil wire diameter. The speed is depend on the copper coil wire diameter, so they will run at the same speed. And it's near 30W:eek:, the maximum current rating of Toshiba TB6588FG:cool:

lowfat

02-28-2011, 01:06 PM

So is there still plans to release a pre soldered board using the Toshiba chip?

Boogerlad

02-28-2011, 02:25 PM

How about this (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-10W-DIY-kit-Swiftech-MCP350-/230589174409?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b02f9289)?

Why not... :yepp:

I'd gladdly pay extra money if the pcb was already soldered onto the ddc pump. I just don't have the time to solder it myself.

lowfat

02-28-2011, 04:12 PM

I'd gladdly pay extra money if the pcb was already soldered onto the ddc pump. I just don't have the time to solder it myself.

I hear that. Not just the time but the tools or know-how. Reflowing isn't exactly an easy solder job.

SpuTnicK

03-10-2011, 12:33 AM

So is there still plans to release a pre soldered board using the Toshiba chip?

I'd gladdly pay extra money if the pcb was already soldered onto the ddc pump. I just don't have the time to solder it myself.
LINK (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-pump-18W-repair-kit-SMT-soldered-MCP355-/330540505301?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf5bfd8d5) :up:

lowfat

03-10-2011, 08:46 AM

Only $5 more! Ordered....

SpuTnicK

03-12-2011, 02:33 AM

lowfat

03-12-2011, 09:14 AM

According to the datasheet, the Toshiba controller IC is 50V maximum. For higher than 12V operation, the power stabilization capactior 22uf and 0.1uf voltage rating need to increase. For higher than 30V operation, the Schottky Diode voltage rating need to increase as well.

Can you tell me there this needs to be soldered on to the PCB?

wizard1238

03-12-2011, 05:57 PM

wizard1238
I suspect you are the man behind those DDC repair kits or very close to its production.;)

We need some clarification on whether this (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-pump-18W-repair-kit-SMT-soldered-MCP355-/330540505301?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf5bfd8d5) kit is suitable for DDC3.x pump repair. The coil wire length problem can be easily solved. But is there something else that should be taken into consideration?
There are some reports that this "blue" kit does not work with DDC3.x pumps - controller get burned or even if it works, the overheat safety feature restarts the pumps every 3 sec. Not sure what revision it was, the first one or the second one (with pre-soldered elements).

this board is designed for the black and purple rotor DDC1/DDC2, use in the blue rotor DDC3 is left for diyer to play:p: The extended wire may have chance to short circuit the board, it should be very careful. When using with blue rotor DDC3.x and stock top at full speed, the current is about 2.1A, it's still within the safety limit of this chip(1.5A typ. 2.5A max) Use with aftermarket top is 2.35A, I would recommend connect a resistor between VSP and Vref to reduce the current.
1. if the pump restarts every 3 sec, most likely the TB6588FG need to be resolder:yepp: it cannot read the feedback signal from the coil. it's very common.
2. the toshiba burn immediately if the leg short circuit/bridging due to soldering problem. remember to wear safety glass, the chip can explode when connecting power. Page 8 of this document have the information, it is available in english but only can found in toshiba japan web.
http://www.semicon.toshiba.co.jp/docs/application_note/en/TB6588-E_en_090317.pdf

wizard1238

03-12-2011, 06:03 PM

Can you tell me there this needs to be soldered on to the PCB?

There are many things to consider when mod the board, the official datasheet and circuit is available at the toshiba semiconductor web site for xtreme modder to enjoy.

lilmanmgf

03-12-2011, 06:47 PM

Interesting. From the pictures I thought you would have to solder the surface mount ic as well which seemed insane.

glide 1

03-12-2011, 07:44 PM

i have a burnt pump that ide like to repair but the soldered tips look as if they are on the inner side (towards the center) of the pcb. Will this kit work with this version pump? Could i use this (Laing DDC pump 18W repair kit SMT soldered MCP355) also?

edit: just checked model

Type: DDC-1plus T
DC 12V 18W TF 60

SpuTnicK

03-13-2011, 01:22 PM

Found this video on disassembling of DDC pumps with that compensator expansion chamber that are apparently the same ones sold by diyinhk (http://shop.ebay.com/diyinhk/m.html?_trksid=p4340.l2562):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqaiiC27PB8

cka3o4nuk

03-14-2011, 11:30 AM

instaled 10w board with blue impeller
but not with stock top
on 12v pump starts and then some of phases shuts down(i think the toshiba ic just overheating)
on 5v pump works and bottom of the pump is quet hot.

SpuTnicK

03-14-2011, 12:28 PM

cka3o4nuk
any photo or video or both would be great!

bmaverick

03-14-2011, 04:46 PM

this board is designed for the black and purple rotor DDC1/DDC2, ...

I know where an ample supply of DDC-1, DDC-1T pumps are available with the black impeller. :cool: The pumps are surplus "new", never used, never rejects with the 50,000K run life fully intact.

This would help anyone wanting to convert a pump from a 10W to the 30W powerhouse.

glide 1

03-16-2011, 11:18 PM

wizard1238

03-17-2011, 12:50 AM

can anyone report back on here if they have had any success with these pcb's as a replacement? i have 2 of these pumps that ide like to DIY repair and would really like some feedback. - not into modding for better performance really, just want these running again. thanks in advance.
of course it work, only depend on the diyer's skill
there are 5 version before the blue one, many $$ in developing, is it too serious for this small diy product...
actually, it work from the 1st version, but more idea come out one by one to improve...so...
http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/940/tb6588fgverimg0129resiz.jpg

colex

03-17-2011, 02:55 AM

Hi all,
I don't understand if there's a PCB repair/mod kit (soldered) for my Laing DDC-1T 3.1 modded to 3.2 with blue impeller/rotor?

Those're my laing pics:

http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110317115702_DSC_0246copia.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110317115702_DSC_0246copia.jpg)

http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110317115705_3.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110317115705_3.jpg)

Thanks for answer

wizard1238

03-17-2011, 04:21 AM

colex

03-17-2011, 05:14 AM

please refer to #90...

Thanks for reply.

I think it's best don't make mod for the owners of this pump revision! :(

DumpALump

03-17-2011, 01:43 PM

I have mine on order, but I don't know how long it takes to get to California. I'm going to install it into a DDC 3.25 pump with aftermarket XSPC top.

I took a look at the datasheets and wanted to figure out the power dissipation. Plugging in the typical for Im, Ron(H), and Ron(L) with 12v and 2.35A I get 3.3675W. According to the spec sheet a value of 39C/W is given for a 140mm x 70mm x 1.6mm 50% CU board. Since swiftech's pumps are only 60mm x 60mm and the board has a big hole in the middle, I'm just going to assume the second rating given which is 65C/W. So P = ~219C. I think I read somewhere that the base gets to about 50C and that is on the plastic. So Tj = 3.3675W x 65C/W + 50C = ~269C. Of course I'm not factoring in the heat removal by the water.

Maybe I messed up somewhere, but it doesn't look like this would work or for very long in a 3.25 since the thermal shutdown is 165C-180C. Datasheet also says to keep under 150C Tj. Didn't really think of this before ordering, though I wish the IC was mounted to the other side of the PCB. Then at least I could put a heatsink with direct contact onto the IC.

Martinm210

03-17-2011, 01:53 PM

Yeah, I don't think I would consider using this board on a blue impeller motor. If you want to try it out, it should work well on bmaverick's DDC-1 pumps (http://martinsliquidlab.org/2011/03/09/laing-ddc-1-ddc-1t/) though. They are the original black impeller DDC-1 and DDC-1T motors.

lowfat

03-18-2011, 09:55 AM

Will it work on these PCBs? I ordered two of the ebay DDCs that use the expansion compensators but they don't seem to work. I was hoping just to through the new PCB on them.

http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/4e00fb5819df405863da3bda4249aa9f.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)

Martinm210

03-18-2011, 10:53 AM

That looks like a DDC3 series PCB. Does it have a blue impeller?

DDC-1 series look like this and have a black impeller:
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/laingddc1-4.jpg?w=614&h=640
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/laingddc1-2.jpg?w=614&h=452

SpuTnicK

03-18-2011, 12:35 PM

Yeap

This is the rare special edition Laing DDC-3.2VC with built in liquid volume compensator. It is the much more reliable and newer BLUE rotor 18W version with the original LAING 3.3 PCB.
Source (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a)

lowfat

03-18-2011, 12:37 PM

That looks like a DDC3 series PCB. Does it have a blue impeller?

Yes they are blue. I think I may still try to mod them though. I'd rather not just have these two dead DDCs laying around.

this board is designed for the black and purple rotor DDC1/DDC2, use in the blue rotor DDC3 is left for diyer to play:p: The extended wire may have chance to short circuit the board, it should be very careful. When using with blue rotor DDC3.x and stock top at full speed, the current is about 2.1A, it's still within the safety limit of this chip(1.5A typ. 2.5A max) Use with aftermarket top is 2.35A, I would recommend connect a resistor between VSP and Vref to reduce the current.
1. if the pump restarts every 3 sec, most likely the TB6588FG need to be resolder:yepp: it cannot read the feedback signal from the coil. it's very common.
2. the toshiba burn immediately if the leg short circuit/bridging due to soldering problem. remember to wear safety glass, the chip can explode when connecting power. Page 8 of this document have the information, it is available in english but only can found in toshiba japan web.
http://www.semicon.toshiba.co.jp/docs/application_note/en/TB6588-E_en_090317.pdf

Shame I haven't taken any electronics after high school as this just went WAY over my head. :p:

I tried to read over the spec sheet but it just looks like a bunch of gobbledygook to me.

How would I find out what size resistor is going to be needed between VSP and Vref in order to keep the amperage at safe levels?

Yeap

Source (http://cgi.ebay.com/Laing-DDC-water-pump-18W-blue-rotor-MCP355-/230570370858?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35af10a72a)

Ya those are the ones I have and they don't work.

SpuTnicK

03-19-2011, 01:48 AM

lowfat
So basically you have bought the item that don't work? care to get your money back? oh BTW, what that fourth cable is for (the red one)?

How would I find out what size resistor is going to be needed between VSP and Vref in order to keep the amperage at safe levels?
I would suggest to use a potentiometer, connect it to those pins and turn it off, then try to start the pump and increase the resistance step-by-step.
Though even 2.35A is safe for this chip, according to this (http://www.toshiba-components.com/motorcontrol/pdfs/TB6588FG_E_P20_080424_.pdf)

DumpALump

03-24-2011, 01:48 AM

How would I find out what size resistor is going to be needed between VSP and Vref in order to keep the amperage at safe levels?

Like SpuTnicK said you'll probably have to just connect a pot and guess. I finally received my kit and it looks like VSP is being fed from Vref to set VSP to 5v.
Vad(H)<VSP<=Vref = 100% speed
Vad(L) is 1.2v and Vad(H) is 4.1v
I'm not sure what current is flowing through it, but it looks like either 1mA or lower. We want to drop the 5v down to at least 4v. So using Vdrop / I = R
1 / .001 = 1000 ohms.
2 / .001 = 2000 ohms.
etc...
If the current was lower then it'd be a greater resistance. So make sure to start out high then reduce resistance. I'm still debating whether I want to install it on my pump or not. I was thinking you could use the motherboard to control it, but VSP requires an analog signal, so no pwm :(

lowfat

03-24-2011, 07:23 AM

lowfat
So basically you have bought the item that don't work? care to get your money back? oh BTW, what that fourth cable is for (the red one)?

There was never any mention of warranty on the eBay page and they did work for a while before dying out. The red wire is for 5V, which I am not sure why it is there but the pumps wouldn't work without it.

EDIT: I finally got my pre soldered DIYINHK PCB. I can see the problems w/ installing it on a DDC 3.2 already. Since all the coils are soldered to the inside of the PCB instead of the outside it is a tad on the difficult side of things to remove them. Plus the coil wires are too short to reach where the need to be on the new PCB.

Sparky

03-24-2011, 10:53 AM

The 5V is probably to feed the logic of the control chip.

lowfat

03-24-2011, 07:43 PM

I got the old PCB's off my DDC3.2s. There are 6 coils w/ two wires a piece. However on the new PCB there are only 10 holes for wires to pass through AFAIK. There are two more places where I think the wires should go but no holes to push them through.
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/221b9a10c027706ad87f2f22f392c341.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)

SpuTnicK

03-24-2011, 11:02 PM

The holes are in places where electric contact from one side of PCB should pass to the other side. So, i guess you should not worry about that, as it is more of PCB developer's duty. Just solder all 12 wires to those contacts and the board should work as planned.

wizard1238

03-25-2011, 01:17 AM

connect like this, and be care the two ending of each coil cannot be reverse connected.
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/e7a1f9b4eee40504ad6542c0a04e9a89.jpg

penguins

03-25-2011, 01:44 AM

This is Certainly off topic.

but, Lowfat nice picture of that pcb.. it's so photogenic.
and I love John Criton and Mal.

that is all.

lowfat

03-25-2011, 12:25 PM

Getting close. I just hope it works afterwards. http://smiliesftw.com/x/eek5noes2.gif (http://smiliesftw.com)
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/f4cf69e23dc4fa748e861973303b397d.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)

mochti01

03-25-2011, 12:31 PM

Looks good. :) Keep us posted. I'm actually waiting about 3 weeks for my circuit boards... And of course good luck!!

wizard1238

03-25-2011, 01:58 PM

double check the copper wire is not touching/short circuit the PCB before connect the power. it should work immidiately:clap:

The PCB can also be place outside the pump housing, you have very long copper wire extended. The heat from the controller will never go into the water loop in this arrangement.

Martinm210

03-25-2011, 02:08 PM

Cool!...

Rise

03-25-2011, 03:26 PM

I'm really confused after looking through all of the posts... which PCB will work for the blue impeller ddc 3.1?

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm3/Sc2ggrise/IMG_0191.jpg

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm3/Sc2ggrise/IMG_0190.jpg

lowfat

03-25-2011, 03:36 PM

Well I got it completed but it isn't working properly. It is trying to pump but it just spurts on and off about 2 times a second. Moving almost next to no water though.

serialk11r

03-25-2011, 03:46 PM

Been a while since I posted here...

Anyways, does anyone know if this would work on the original DDC-2 with ORANGE (gasp I know right) impeller from 2007? I'm thinking about selling mine soon and given it's poor reliability track record, this mod being available might bring peace of mind to whoever may be interested in buying it. Certainly doesn't look too hard to solder the few wires on.

Martinm210

03-25-2011, 03:57 PM

Well I got it completed but it isn't working properly. It is trying to pump but it just spurts on and off about 2 times a second. Moving almost next to no water though.

Thanks for trying and sharing, sounds like it's a DDC-1 only mod..

serialk11r

03-25-2011, 04:05 PM

lowfat

03-25-2011, 04:30 PM

Wait so just making sure, by DDC-1 you mean the old 10W one before they switched to 3.1 and 3.2 right? I thought the PCB for the DDC-1 (black) and DDC-2 (orange) were supposed to be very similar, so could it work on an orange impellered pump?

Yours looks similar to mine in that the coils are soldered to the inside of the pcb. Chances are you will run in to the same issues of mine.

I haven't given up yet though. I will take it apart and redo everything. Maybe I have a wire backwards or something. I'll likely just order a couple of MCP35x in case I can't get it working though.

Martinm210

03-25-2011, 04:33 PM

Wait so just making sure, by DDC-1 you mean the old 10W one before they switched to 3.1 and 3.2 right? I thought the PCB for the DDC-1 (black) and DDC-2 (orange) were supposed to be very similar, so could it work on an orange impellered pump?

Not sure about the DDC-2, I just heard the windings are different(longer) between the revisions.

bmaverick has new old stock DDC-1's (http://martinsliquidlab.org/2011/03/09/laing-ddc-1-ddc-1t/) if you want them.:up:

DumpALump

03-25-2011, 06:26 PM

Have you put a resistor between VSP and Vref?

lowfat

03-25-2011, 06:43 PM

Have you put a resistor between VSP and Vref?

I didn't but I did try running the pump @ 5V and 7V and they didn't work either. Once I get the pumps working I will be hooking them up to a BigNG so I shouldn't have a problem keeping them below 2.5A.

wizard1238

03-25-2011, 07:11 PM

I didn't but I did try running the pump @ 5V and 7V and they didn't work either. Once I get the pumps working I will be hooking them up to a BigNG so I shouldn't have a problem keeping them below 2.5A.

12V should work, the pump cannot start at 7V.
try to check the coil ending is not reverse connected.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4792349&postcount=115
If the extended coil wire is long enough, the pcb can also place outside the pump housing.

lowfat

03-25-2011, 09:41 PM

Well I removed the pcb and redid everything again. This time using longer wires and gauranteeing that I had it soldered right. I have it exactly like how the picture above. I powered it up without the casings to see what it did. The pump does not move at all. But it is doing something as you can feel it vibrate and make noise.

wizard1238

03-26-2011, 12:12 AM

cka3o4nuk

03-26-2011, 01:53 AM

http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/3127/sam4224.jpg

wizard1238

03-26-2011, 03:06 AM

http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/3127/sam4224.jpg

the sanyo PCB is designed for the black rotor DDC. It cannot be use in the blue rotor DDC3, it will overheat and the chip will explode when connect the 12V power:shocked:
how can it be done:eek: use extra resistor in series with the coil:confused:

mochti01

03-26-2011, 04:04 AM

@cka3o4nuk does it work with the sanyo pcb and the blue rotor?

lowfat

03-26-2011, 07:32 AM

is it connect like this

That is exactly how it is connected.

http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/9910189b20f48e03e3920190d3a9653b.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)

wizard1238

03-26-2011, 08:38 AM

1. the yellow circle may have chance short circuit together. the painting of the metal core is not hard enough.
2. the red circle and some wire ending is long enough connect to the pcb directly, it will be more tidy.
3. the green circle look like a bad soldering join, the gold plated surface is still be seem? it's will be better to use flux
hope everyone success
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/be497201012fd5bca5e02ae5e04b0eff.jpg

lowfat

03-26-2011, 07:52 PM

Even after pulling the wires up and touching up the solder it doesn't work. I've been talking to someone else and he believes the stepped motors are not firing in the correct sequence. I would really like to know if anyone else has tried to install this PCB on a DDC3.1/3.2 to see if they had similar issues.

DumpALump

03-27-2011, 01:25 AM

When I get home on monday I'll see if I can get it working. Though I've never done drag soldering before, so hopefully I don't screw up.

Lowfat you should tin your wires (if you did, then twist them before you tin) and use a little flux before soldering. It'll help the solder flow a little better so you have better joints. Also clean and tin your soldering iron here n there. If you take a look at cka3o4nuk's soldering job, you can see how the solder joints are nice and shiny, as dull usually means a dry or cold joint. Looks like you're trying to heatsoak to get that solder to stick and a tiny bit of flux will help with that.

Have you checked all your connections with a multimeter? When testing it are you running it at 12v with water in the tubing? Since I think water is supposed to lube up the impeller. Do you have an aftermarket top? Just trying to figure out if the issue is the TB6588 is going into protection mode where it resets over and over or if its some other cause.

smanet

03-28-2011, 02:17 PM

Hello,
I've upped some pics of my two pumps I had apart.
The blue impeller one is considered as working, the red impeller is surely dead (the impeller doens't spin, I can hear a click but I didn't measure if it's powered).
http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110328233420_28032011047_mod.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110328233420_28032011047_mod.jpg)
http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110328233454_28032011048_mod.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110328233454_28032011048_mod.jpg) http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110328233517_28032011049_mod.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110328233517_28032011049_mod.jpg)
http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110328233540_28032011050_mod.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110328233540_28032011050_mod.jpg) http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110328233618_28032011053_mod.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110328233618_28032011053_mod.jpg)

Hope this help identifying your pump revisions.

BTW, can anyone confirm the DYINHK kit is good for my red impeller Laing?
This kit looks like an upgrade to the original, hope there'll be soon some for the blue ones, since I have two of them... :D

Martinm210

03-28-2011, 03:14 PM

Hmm... I may have to order one of these and try it on a DDC-1 pump. It just looks like too much fun to resist..:D

glide 1

03-28-2011, 06:00 PM

ordered the sanyo kit for a 10w laing aswell as an 18w version for a burnt blue impeller pump. Will report back if i get this to work, quite excited to recieve these. The only problem i see is the length of the wire, might have to extend it so that it can be soldered to the traces on the outer side of the pcb.

lowfat

03-28-2011, 06:18 PM

Hmm... I may have to order one of these and try it on a DDC-1 pump. It just looks like too much fun to resist..:D

I almost want to order one as well to see if it is user error that is causing me not to get this DDC3.1 to work. :p:

bmaverick

03-28-2011, 07:17 PM

Hmm... I may have to order one of these and try it on a DDC-1 pump. It just looks like too much fun to resist..:D

Martin, I have a package of two DDC-1 pumps that have only dead PCB, the coil is fully intact and I've included all the other hardware and more. It should be mailed out this week for you. :)

I have dozens of surplus "new" DDC-1 pumps. Very few are non-functional to mod with this PCB upgrade. To bad I'm not the worlds best solder master, else I would convert a fleet of DDC-1 pumps. :P

Martinm210

03-28-2011, 07:26 PM

Martin, I have a package of two DDC-1 pumps that have only dead PCB, the coil is fully intact and I've included all the other hardware and more. It should be mailed out this week for you. :)

I have dozens of surplus "new" DDC-1 pumps. Very few are non-functional to mod with this PCB upgrade. To bad I'm not the worlds best solder master, else I would convert a fleet of DDC-1 pumps. :P

Awesome, thanks!

I will report back how the modification goes and put together a little blog of the process.:up:

smanet

03-29-2011, 12:07 PM

I have dozens of surplus "new" DDC-1 pumps. Very few are non-functional to mod with this PCB upgrade. To bad I'm not the worlds best solder master, else I would convert a fleet of DDC-1 pumps. :P

...need a hand? :D
Well, a dead DDC-1 + PCB mod + DYI could be cheaper than buying a new one, and performing better.

NaeKuh

03-29-2011, 03:24 PM

mmmm.... i want 2 to play with.. :P

But i think i only have 1 DDC-1. And im very bad with soldering.. lol...

I threw out all the ones that died out thinking repair was almost impossible.

xcooling

03-30-2011, 08:59 AM

lowfat

03-30-2011, 10:31 AM

The issue you are having with the pump rotor not moving or vibrating, is caused by the coils "firing" incorrectly. Not the soldering. (btw: i have also tried switching the wire pairs around)

Ill post more info later.

That is what I've been told as well. I was hoping someone else had tried it on a DDC3.1 so I know it wasn't a mistake of mine.

xcooling

03-30-2011, 11:14 AM

ive tried it 2x, so its not ur soldering. (btw: all my joins are insulated and tested)

Right now im testing a totally different way of wiring the coils, way more complex, but im sure ill get it working.

lowfat

03-30-2011, 11:38 AM

Well if you do definitely post your findings. I'd love to be able to get these pumps working again.

cka3o4nuk

04-02-2011, 12:24 AM

@cka3o4nuk does it work with the sanyo pcb and the blue rotor?only on 5v

glide 1

04-10-2011, 02:30 AM

does not support mcp350 pumps with the coil wires on the inside of the pcb. (blue rotor)

The issue you are having with the pump rotor not moving or vibrating, is caused by the coils "firing" incorrectly. Not the soldering. (btw: i have also tried switching the wire pairs around)

Ill post more info later.

xcooling - Would appreciate some more info on this. I have an 18w pcb coming which i will try to repair a blue impeller pump with.

So your saying that this diagram posted by wizard1238 will not work? this is how i would have wired it. http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/15adb459aba465c251d9a88d62155880.jpg

xcooling

04-10-2011, 07:39 AM

Tested and NOT working:

wiring the coils as the diagram indicates
reversing the wires of individual coils.
wiring the coils in pairs as they are stock.
wiring opposite coils with each other
wiring every 2nd coils
wiring 2 coils together

I have also tested inverting the board

You will need to add a resistor (50K) or a 100K pot and cut the bridge on the pcb between VSP and Vref (otherwise u will melt the ic)

lowfat

04-10-2011, 07:43 AM

Hats off to you xcooling, sounds like you tried damn near every combination possible. Really sounds like it isn't possible with this PCB.

xcooling

04-10-2011, 07:54 AM

Original Install on a DDC3.1 / MCP350

I inverted the pcb to expose the IC, so that i can stick a heatsink on it. coil wire pairs were swapped around due to the board being inverted.

this should of worked, as it follows the guide 100%.

All the joins were tested and cleaned with acetone after soldering to prevent any shorts.

does NOT work, (i later tested it without inverting the board and swaping the coil wires, does NOT work either)

xcooling

04-10-2011, 07:56 AM

These are pics of trying to find a possible solution..

Tested and NOT working:
wiring the coils as the diagram indicates
reversing the wires of individual coils.
wiring the coils in pairs as they are stock.
wiring opposite coils with each other
wiring every 2nd coils
wiring 2 coils together
I have also tested inverting the board
You will need to add a resistor (50K) or a 100K pot and cut the bridge on the pcb between VSP and Vref (otherwise u will melt the ic)

Every combination i tried.. did NOT work.

conclusion.. does NOT work

xcooling

04-10-2011, 09:36 AM

I bought the pre-soldered board from him.

Ive attached pics of the board and pump i used.

Martinm210

04-10-2011, 10:35 AM

Perhaps there are different DDC3.2s?

I've got one of each of the DIY pcbs as well as one of each pump already modded.

Here is the blue impeller version and it seems to work fine. Starts around 6V and works clear up to and beyond12V. Planning to do some testing and also installing of the PCB myself.

Not sure this helps any, but this is how the working DDC3.2 flavor looks with the mod installed.

There is no sticker on the pump, but it does have a blue impeller and it was one of the volume compensator types that was removed (that's what the oring is for, seals against a block off plate).

I did a quick test and it does seem to operate fine, so I'm going to add an RPM wire and do some tests..:up:

xcooling

04-10-2011, 10:43 AM

To the best of my knowledge the volume compensator types are from a MAC G5's.

orientation of the pcb doesnt matter if the coil wires are swiched around. I also tested it the right way.

On a mcp355, the ic will overheat if you do not use a resistor. (in 15seconds it will read 85degC+)

lowfat

04-10-2011, 10:54 AM

mochti01

04-10-2011, 11:10 AM

The 18W board from diyinhk works fine with ma blue rotor Laing. No idea what you are doing wrong. It must be a fault at soldering the chip. I tested 5 pumps and all work great. :) I will make a video tomorrow. The noise without a resistor between VSP und Vref is enormous. You have to break the connection between the two contacts and put a 33K resistor between it than it would slow the pump down.

lowfat

04-10-2011, 11:14 AM

Well that is definitely some good news to know that it works properly on the blue rotor DDC's. I guess I'll just buy another couple PCB's and give it a try.

mochti01

04-10-2011, 11:15 AM

Buy a presoldered PCB. They are tested and should work with your pump. :) I will also test the green PCBs tomorrow. I will put a 0,1 Ohm resistor to each coil. Then they should have the same resistance as the black rotors coils and the pcb might not explode. I keep you posted.

Edit: Just saw the presoldered 18W pcbs are sold out :(

Edit 2: I can solder you one if you want. Shipping to USA is only 5$

Edit 3: Also to Canada ;)

Edit 4: Also tetesd it a night on 12V without a resistor between VSP and Vref and it did not overheat. Performance was amazing!! 200l/h with one modded pump in my system. Before I had around 190l/h with 2 MCP355.

Martinm210

04-10-2011, 12:28 PM

Did you add a resistor to Vref or anything? That does look how I had mine soldered, but all it would do is misfire.

If you were able to get it to work properly I will definitely be looking forward to your results.

I didn't do anything, that was one of his pre-modded pumps, but it doesn't appear to have any resistor in place.:shrug:

Martinm210

04-10-2011, 06:30 PM

Oh...my.......oh my...I see a lot of PSI...:D

Church

04-10-2011, 07:54 PM

I'm guessing guy that thought out this PCB just didn't went for artificially limiting rpm-s like Laing did.
Kind of like Laing DDC, not D5, Strong :)
I wonder how are things noise-wise with higher rpm-s though.

lowfat

04-10-2011, 08:38 PM

Sparky

04-10-2011, 08:59 PM

The message i got from the seller was these do not work on the blue impeller version of the pump and is ment for 3.1 only. From what i can tell no one has gotten it to work on a 3.2 which is more comen and std 18w. This really high rpm has not even shown which i want to see

These DDCs I can't seem to quite keep straight. I thought the 3.1 was the same as the 3.2, only difference being the jumper wire in place or not.

Martinm210

04-10-2011, 09:27 PM

This is what I have so far...not quite done with this or the Sanyo/DDC1 flavor yet.
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhktoshibacomparison2.png?w=558&h=656

12V detail:
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhktoshiba12v-xspc1.png

9V is about the same as a DDC3.25.

To be continued...

Not quite sure what to make of the RPM frequency...my best guess is RPM = Hz x 10, but that's just a guess trying to match up similar pressures. The normal Hzx30 gives you huge numbers which don't make sense.

Cheers!
Martin

Martinm210

04-10-2011, 09:30 PM

FYI, also found this:
http://www.toshiba-components.com/motorcontrol/pdfs/TB6588FG_E_P20_080424_.pdf

Church

04-10-2011, 09:32 PM

62% over 3.25?! That's way more then D5 Strong or DDC2, isn't it? Huh, you got mini iwaki on hands :D

Martinm210

04-10-2011, 09:37 PM

I'd also like to better understand the variable resistor deal between VSP and Vref. What sort of variable resistor should go between these?

Martinm210

04-10-2011, 09:38 PM

62% over 3.25?! That's way more then D5 Strong or D2, isn't it? Huh, you got mini iwaki on hands :D

And it'll do more than 12V if you give it to her..lol:D

It is pushing upwards of 2.5 amps with just 12V though and I am a bit paranoid about heat. Supposedly the Toshiba manual says Tjmax is 150C...so maybe I worry too much?

Church

04-10-2011, 10:04 PM

Martinm210: and how noise subjectively seems with that high rpms relative to common DDCs/D5s?
As for heat, imho no need for much worries. Weren't fets that overheated most on stock DDC PCB?

mochti01

04-10-2011, 11:28 PM

I'd also like to better understand the variable resistor deal between VSP and Vref. What sort of variable resistor should go between these?

You have to cut the connection between VSP and Vref. Than you can put a resistor between it. Or you use a 47K poti to regulate the little monster.

lowfat

04-11-2011, 12:16 AM

Those numbers are insane! I most definitely will be trying to fix these two extra DDC's once those pre-soldered PCB's come back in stock. As for going above 12V, I do believe the TB6588FG lists a max of 2.5A. Although if you feel like being the Guinea pig to see if they'll last above that much juice and by how long, feel free. :D

SpuTnicK

04-11-2011, 12:43 AM

It is pushing upwards of 2.5 amps with just 12V though and I am a bit paranoid about heat.
i bet every is paranoid about the noise level at that performance, not to mention the consumption rate - almost 30W - hello Lamprtron FC5V2 :D
Heat wise, try attaching a temp sensor to IC case.

Can you make a video of the pump running at 2.5A?

xcooling

04-11-2011, 12:50 AM

use a 100Kohm variable resistor.. it allows u to control the speed of the pump.

On the mcp355, the controller will overheat if u don't do this.

mochti01

04-11-2011, 01:04 AM

It will not overheat... I left it 24h to run on 100% in my system and nothing happend. With 50Kohm the pump will not start. 47Kohm varibale resistor is perfect.

mochti01

04-11-2011, 01:42 AM

50V would be impossible because the maximum current is 2.5A and on 12V it takes 2.1A. So you can imagine whats gonna happening on 50V or? ;)

mochti01

04-11-2011, 02:12 AM

I had two of them with a watercool duallaing top. Two MCP355 made 190l/h in my very restrictive system and two diyinhk 3.2 on 100% with 12V made 300l/h.

glide 1

04-11-2011, 09:10 AM

Success!!!

Here are the 2 pumps i'm working with:

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r132/glide1/IMG_5274.jpg
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r132/glide1/IMG_5277.jpg
used the pre soldered 18w pcb for this and followed this diagram - http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/15adb459aba465c251d9a88d62155880.jpg

pump works fine and seems to move a lot more water than a stock MCP355. only problem is that the case gets a little hot to the touch after a few minutes. i doubt it can stand sustained use like this. Will look into the vref, VSP mod to slow motor a bit or maybe a pot - just want to make sure what values to use.

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r132/glide1/IMG_5275.jpg
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r132/glide1/IMG_5276.jpg
used the 10w pcb for this. no problems except that the pump pulsates after about 10sec. then eventually stops. if i restrict the outlet side with my finger (simulating cpu block, rad restriction hahaha) then it is ok and runs very smooth and quiet. flow is also better than stock ( as far as i remember). i think once this is in an actual working loop, it will do ok.

These were all very quick, non scientific tests obviously. i just wanted to see if i could get the pumps working.

Big thanks to all who have contributed to this thread, much appreciated.

lowfat

04-11-2011, 11:39 AM

Tried once more to get my blue prop DDC to work. My solder joints are considerably better and I heat shrink all of the extensions. Still unable to get it to work though, it doesn't vibrate as before though. I can hear a clicking sound coming from it, but that is it.
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/84947973ee1477d6725ab64d7419740f.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/d87548e7e072de23ac0ff078254dd4f3.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/e0597469735ade1a4ba1f45812bf2ed8.jpg (http://hostthenpost.org)

Martinm210

04-11-2011, 01:56 PM

Martinm210: and how noise subjectively seems with that high rpms relative to common DDCs/D5s?
As for heat, imho no need for much worries. Weren't fets that overheated most on stock DDC PCB?

Subjectively I think the Toshiba controller is a bit more buzzy than the DDC3 motor controller, but better than the DDC1 motor controller. Hard to tell though with the different RPM values.

You have to cut the connection between VSP and Vref. Than you can put a resistor between it. Or you use a 47K poti to regulate the little monster.

Thanks! I'll see if I can round one of those up at radio shack. I have some larger ones, but I'd like to have a nice small one I can mount to the pump case.

i bet every is paranoid about the noise level at that performance, not to mention the consumption rate - almost 30W - hello Lamprtron FC5V2 :D
Heat wise, try attaching a temp sensor to IC case.

Can you make a video of the pump running at 2.5A?

Yeah, I'll work on a video comparison as part of my blog, but I'll wait until I test the Sanyo flavor as well so I can get both done in the same noise test session. It might not be until next weekend though...it's about the only time I can do good noise testing in the wee hours.

It will not overheat... I left it 24h to run on 100% in my system and nothing happend.

My motor has a metal plate on the bottom and I measured roughly 53C max on the metal plate. If TJmax is 150C, it's probably still within operating range.

The Toshiba controller spec manual says it also has thermal protection. At 165C it'll shut down and turn back on at 150C.

Supposedly the plastic can melt at 170C, so this thing would have to get pretty darn toasty to destruct. It would be nice if you could invert the PCB and put a large heatsink on it though.

The Sanyo version does have the IC on the bottom, and that's what the heatsink PCB attaches to. You could also install just about any large heatsink on that model.

I'll be working on this off and on over the next week or so and hope to have all the testing and blog published by the end of the next weekend.:up:

mochti01

04-12-2011, 03:58 AM

@Martinm210 How do you pick out the tacho signal? My pumps show a signal, but is a bit weird. More voltage -> lower rpm, lower voltage -> higher rpm... Strange, but the pumps work.

xcooling

04-12-2011, 04:16 AM

SpuTnicK

04-12-2011, 04:30 AM

@Martinm210 How do you pick out the tacho signal? My pumps show a signal, but is a bit weird. More voltage -> lower rpm, lower voltage -> higher rpm... Strange, but the pumps work.

He is using his multimeter set to frequency (pulse) measurement. Comparing this data with the one from original DDC3.2, he gets a rough multiplier that he uses to calculate the RPM from modded pump.

RacingTurtle

04-12-2011, 04:35 AM

Supposedly the plastic can melt at 170C, so this thing would have to get pretty darn toasty to destruct. It would be nice if you could invert the PCB and put a large heatsink on it though.:

Pretty soon we're going to be getting waterblocks for pumps!

m_jones_

04-12-2011, 05:19 AM

Pretty soon we're going to be getting waterblocks for pumps!
Waterlogged is one step ahead:D
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4810504&postcount=31

mochti01

04-12-2011, 07:46 AM

Here is a little comparison video of a diyinhk 18w ddc 2 and a diyinhk 18w ddc 3.2. Just to check the level of noise.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OZUg-hETyA

DumpALump

04-12-2011, 09:11 AM

So originally I was going to install this mod, but then xcooling said it doesn't work after lowfat couldn't get it to work. Since I have a working MCP355 I figured I'd skip it. Now with this info :eek: I think I'm going to have to install it.

xcooling

04-12-2011, 12:53 PM

@ DumpALump Please try the mod on your mcp355...

pretty easy to revert it, if it doesn't work.

Martinm210

04-12-2011, 02:55 PM

@Martinm210 any chance you can overvolt it to 13v on with the Koolance CTR-SPD10 Pump Speed Controller.

@lowfat its either bad quality control because neither of us can get our pumps to work, or it does not support them.

Ive ordered a DDC1 which i will be trying the mod on... grr will be a few weeks until it arrives.

Yeah, it will go more, but you'll hit a current limit before too long. At almost no restriction I was already almost getting 2.5amps draw at only 12v. I'm curious to get that variable resistor in place and see what happens. At higher restriction, I'm sure you could push 13v if heat is kept in order.

The toshiba is good far beyond 12v, but current and heat may be the constraint. I'ml do some more on this over the weekend.:)

DumpALump

04-13-2011, 05:44 AM

@ DumpALump Please try the mod on your mcp355...

pretty easy to revert it, if it doesn't work.

I'm going to work on it later today. Got everything soldered onto the board yesterday. Actually my first time soldering smd components this small. Not to mention figuring out how to solder the chip. Didn't have any solder paste so I had to do it all with a soldering iron. Actually not too hard.

mochti01

04-13-2011, 12:30 PM

I made a video with a 50K variable resistor. Thats really nice to control a Laing with a 6x6mm 50K var. resistor. :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnNWrA4o3Fc

Martinm210

04-13-2011, 02:28 PM

Awesome, thanks! That 50K sounds perfect and seems to dial it way down if needed. Voltage control works too, but that resistor would be the better way to go for most people. Then you get a "DDC Strong Vario" of sorts..:)

Martinm210

04-13-2011, 04:53 PM

Alright, I picked up a 50K pot at the shack for a couple of bucks. Now looking at the PCB, it appears there is a trace between Vref and Vsp. I'm assuming I need to remove this trace and connect up the pot something like this?

DumpALump

04-13-2011, 06:19 PM

Yeah the way the controller works is through the voltage given to VSP. Since vref outputs 5v that puts it at max. You have to cut the trace since it'd bypass the pot.

You can see the info in http://www.toshiba-components.com/motorcontrol/pdfs/TB6588FG_E_P20_080424_.pdf

VSP:
Duty cycle/motor speed control input (This pin has a pull-down resistor.)
0 ≤ VSP ≤ VAD (L): Sets the PWM duty cycle, based on the analog input.
VAD (H) ≤ VSP ≤ VREF: 100% duty cycle (127/128)

0 ≤ VDUTY ≤ VAD (L) → Duty cycle = 0%
VAD (L) ≤ VDUTY ≤ VAD (H) → Figure on the right (1/128 to 127/128)
VAD (H) ≤ VDUTY ≤ VDD → Duty cycle = 100% (127/128)

Since he is using the example application circuit with 100pF Cap and 20kΩ for clock generation

PWM Input Voltage:
VAD (L) = Typical is 1.2v
VAD (H) = Typical is 4.1v

I'm not sure exactly if this would work, but I would figure you could connect Vref to a resistor to ground. Then I would figure you could hook up VSP to a fan controller. It'd have to be an analog voltage though. So possibly control it via a motherboard header. Or you could make a circuit to convert a pwm signal to analog if your motherboard only had fan control via pwm. So then as the heat goes up the pump could speed up. Also could change the parameters of the pwm to analog to set a max voltage applied so it never hit max speed (keep noise down). Just a random thought.

Martinm210

04-13-2011, 06:52 PM

Thanks!...It works!

Except I like it this way to make right turn an increase in speed. I tried the 50K pot and a 100K pot. The 100K would go below startup, but the 50K is just right. I used some thinner guage wire about a foot long to the 50K pot and it works out so the resistance is never too much for startup. The current is extremely low, so you could also use one of the mini pots, but they only had 100K at radioshack in the mini sizes.

12V shutoff:
Low end 2,460 RPM (VSP=5V)
High end 6,240 RPM (VSP=2.44V)

Works great..nice DDC Strong Vario..:up:

Martinm210

04-13-2011, 06:59 PM

One more question, I found this:

Rotation speed output pin (open-drain)
This output is held low at startup and when an abnormality is detected. In sensorless mode,
pulses are generated at 3 ppr according to the back-EMF.
Note: 3 ppr = 3 pulses per electrical degree (With a four-pole motor, six pulses are generated
per revolution.)

The DDC is a 6 pole motor.

Electrical degrees is something completely new to me, but it appears that Hz x 10= RPM...is that right?

DumpALump

04-13-2011, 07:33 PM

Electrical degrees is something completely new to me

You and me both :D I'm an econ major. Has jack all to do with electrical or physics lol.

I never bothered figuring out how rpms are actually read other than something like there are a certain amount of pulses per rotation. According to what it says I'd figure it's just 3ppr per 2 poles (6ppr for 4 poles) and so it'd end up being 9ppr for the DDC 6 pole motor.

It's something like
RPM / 60 = Rotations Per Second
Rotations per second * 9 ppr = Hz

So I'd figure RPM = (HZ / 9ppr) * 60

Note: Its just a guess :D

m0r7if3r

04-13-2011, 07:37 PM

You and me both :D I'm an econ major. Has jack all to do with electrical or physics lol.

I never bothered figuring out how rpms are actually read other than something like there are a certain amount of pulses per rotation. According to what it says I'd figure it's just 3ppr per 2 poles (6ppr for 4 poles) and so it'd end up being 9ppr for the DDC 6 pole motor.

It's something like
RPM / 60 = Rotations Per Second
Rotations per second * 9 ppr = Hz

So I'd figure RPM = (HZ / 9ppr) * 60

Note: Its just a guess :D

If there's an interest I can take a fan down into the lab and hook the tach up to a scope and the source up to a lab PSU and see what comes out for a fan at a known RPM :shrug: (cool gear is just one of the many perks of being an EE major :D)

Martinm210

04-13-2011, 07:41 PM

You and me both :D I'm an econ major. Has jack all to do with electrical or physics lol.

I never bothered figuring out how rpms are actually read other than something like there are a certain amount of pulses per rotation. According to what it says I'd figure it's just 3ppr per 2 poles (6ppr for 4 poles) and so it'd end up being 9ppr for the DDC 6 pole motor.

It's something like
RPM / 60 = Rotations Per Second
Rotations per second * 9 ppr = Hz

So I'd figure RPM = (HZ / 9ppr) * 60

Note: Its just a guess :D

Thanks!
That's sort of where I was too, but it seems too low. I'll just have to finally test the DC3.2 with RPM sensor then I can match them up exactly. When comparing to the DDC3.25 it seemed like Hzx10 was close, but the 3.25 has a slightly different impeller.

I never recorded RPM on a DDC3.2 test before, so I'll have to do that to be sure. Either way this will not follow the normal PC fan multiplier of Hzx30, so you'll see really high readings.

Maybe 9 is right though.

Martinm210

04-13-2011, 07:45 PM

If there's an interest I can take a fan down into the lab and hook the tach up to a scope and the source up to a lab PSU and see what comes out for a fan at a known RPM :shrug: (cool gear is just one of the many perks of being an EE major :D)

I noticed my Crystalfontz has a setting for PPR, normally 2 PPR is where it's set. Never knew what PPR meant before..

But it must already have a factor of 15 built in per PPR.

I've just been using my multimeter to record Hz because it seems more accurate.

The DDC has 6 windings, does that mean 6 poles?

Us CE's shouldn't be tinkering with EE stuff....we're bound to pop a cap now and then...:D

DumpALump

04-13-2011, 08:18 PM

From what I could find out, regular fans have a 2 ppr tach wire, which is what the motherboard reads. I tried looking up the voltage used, but couldn't find it

Using the calculations and a 1800rpm fan.
1800rpm / 60 = 30 rotations per second
30 rotations per second * 2 ppr = 60hz
60hz * 30 = 1800

Makes sense. Would figure if your meter is set to 2 ppr that it should correctly read fan speeds. It should be the same for the DDC pumps too since they can be read by the motherboard header.

1800rpm / 60 * 9 = 270hz
1800rpm / 270hz = 6.67 multiplier
Testing 6.67 multiplier:
4500rpm / 60 * 9 = 675hz
675hz * 6.67 multiplier = 4502rpm

So that what you are looking for?

I'm currently looking for a circuit that could convert the 9ppr to 2ppr so that it could be read by the motherboard header. I'd figure it'd be a fairly simple circuit. If it's easy enough, might be mod the diyinhk pcb for it as there is some unused space just for ground.

mochti01

04-14-2011, 03:53 AM

Here a picture with the poti at his final place. Only the rpm gives me headache.

http://www.abload.de/img/imgp0469i9js.jpg

Martinm210

04-14-2011, 09:58 PM

Nice!

FYI,
I've completed a draft of my blog for the Toshiba controller version, the Sanyo is next. Since they are two different controllers, I chose to keep them separate blogs.

This is just the Toshiba:
http://martinsliquidlab.org/2011/04/14/diyinhk-ddc-pump-mods/

http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhk-1.jpg?w=614&h=583
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhktoshibacomparisonall1.png?w=548&h=602
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhktoshibacomparison3.png?w=558&h=656
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhktoshibacomparisonall2.png?w=548&h=602

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRoBNHz2cDo&feature=player_embedded

Cheers!
Martin

lowfat

04-14-2011, 11:05 PM

:cool: very nice. It does sound quite a bit louder but in my opinion a good trade off for the extra performance.

wizard1238

04-15-2011, 03:14 AM

mochti01

04-15-2011, 07:38 AM

A simple RC Filter :)

Do you have an idea how to get the rpm read by the motherboard?

Martinm210

04-15-2011, 02:12 PM

Use motherboard PWM to control the Toshiba PCB modded DDC pump speed seems very simple:D
Only one resistor and capactior can do the trick!
http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/617f8e11daf3c0497b4e06e1108b02e4.jpg
anybody have time can test and let us know if it work;)
Reference: http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/00538c.pdf

Interesting, we would just need to target the 2.5 to 5.0V range, so you'd probably have to tweak the values to get it just right. One of the electrical guys on the board probably can figure it out..:shrug:

A simple RC Filter :)

Do you have an idea how to get the rpm read by the motherboard?

Mine works on the crystalfontz, but RPM readout can be hit and miss on motherboards unless you also provide the ground. Try running both the signal and ground wire to a motherboard header and see if that works. That's what I have to do. It will read high if you get it to work, but it should work if you have the Tach wire soldered up.

I also can't get Hz to read via multimeter until I connect both signal and ground to a fan connector as well. Probably something about a need to drain the pulses being sent or something like that..for whatever reason it won't read unless both are connected...same for fans..:confused:

Sparky

04-15-2011, 04:42 PM

Simple electronics - you have to have a complete circuit or you get nothing ;) :D

wizard1238

04-15-2011, 05:28 PM

Interesting, we would just need to target the 2.5 to 5.0V range, so you'd probably have to tweak the values to get it just right.

PWM from all motherboard is 5V ~25kHz,
50%-100% PWM = 2.5V-5V after the RC filter:p:
R=4k and C= 0.01uF is for ~20kHz (and it should work for ~25kHz) according to AN538:clap:

the next project is PWM control the sanyo board, but it's already very silent at 12V, is it need to speed down:confused:

bmaverick

04-15-2011, 08:30 PM

This has been a great thread to keep tabs on. :)

Martinm210

04-15-2011, 09:15 PM

Simple electronics - you have to have a complete circuit or you get nothing ;) :D

I'll pour a little water on it next time, that always seems to complete my circuits..:D

PWM from all motherboard is 5V ~25kHz,
50%-100% PWM = 2.5V-5V after the RC filter:p:
R=4k and C= 0.01uF is for ~20kHz (and it should work for ~25kHz) according to AN538:clap:

the next project is PWM control the sanyo board, but it's already very silent at 12V, is it need to speed down:confused:

Nice! Yes, PWM would be a nice addition:up:

This has been a great thread to keep tabs on. :)

FYI, the Sanyo motor is nice and quiet, it sounds much more like a DDC3.1.

Doing a quick and dirty test, not even apples to oranges. The DDC1 had an old PTS acetal top, the Sanyo had and acrylic top.

Ambient = 35.5 dbA
Ambient + DDC1 = 41.7dbA (+6.2dbA)
Ambient + DDC1 with DIYINHK Sanyo PCB = 38.1 (+2.6dbA)

I'll have to do a more apples to apples (Same Top) video recording type of test in an actual loop, but the Sanyo controller is nice and quiet.:up:

Church

04-16-2011, 12:34 AM

There are silent/passive builds, and there are moders which are very anal about loudness, where even silent fans @500rpm are marginally tolerable. And i recall some complaining that even DDC3.1 is too loud for them. So pwm imho won't hurt, especially as it gives easy way to regulate pump by software without purchase of expensive smart controllers.

Martinm210

04-16-2011, 07:38 AM

Yeah, after running the MCP35X on PWM, I'm completely sold on throttling pump speed dynamically...definitely the way to go for silence and it's good for heat and saving pump life as well.

FYI, I found this on the Sanyo controller:
http://semicon.sanyo.com/en/search/property.php?prod=LB11683V&clcd=34

I'm testing the premodded Sany DDC1 now and going to try to solder up one of Bmaverick's pumps he sent over next.

Not sure which DDCs this one is compatible with, but obviously the DDC1s work.

Martinm210

04-16-2011, 10:45 AM

Sanyo curve on a DDC-1, Laing original controller vs with the DIYINHK Sanyo board.

Small bump in performance which is nice to see considering it's also an improvement in noise. Power consumption does go up a couple of watts, but nothing significant. RPM also seems to read like any normal fan.

So no huge gains on this one, but a good quiet DDC3.1 like experience with a touch higher performance. It will also dial down to 7V if ultra silence is needed.

Church

04-16-2011, 11:22 AM

Even 1:1 performance would be good, as after all, reviving of otherwise unusable dead pump.
But nevertheless, this forum is called XtremeSystems not for nothing, so "overclocked" Toshiba's DDC"4.5" (or mini-iwaki) rises greater interest of mine :)

smanet

04-16-2011, 12:30 PM

chorner

04-16-2011, 01:16 PM

I wonder if you plotted a graph with the Toshiba controller versus something like the MCP35x comparing noise output at similar/identical performance settings (whatever voltage that may be for each pump to perform the same)?

That would definitely interest me :)

Martinm210

04-16-2011, 09:53 PM

Just revived my old DDC with red rotor... Well, not only I can reuse it, but I got a better pump for the main loop.
I'm amazed! :D I'm controlling it with a Lamptron FC5.
Just a question: if I hook up a poti, will I have still 12V @ full?

PS: in our country we started talking about DIYINHK here (http://www.pctuner.net/forum/tuner-waterblock/137602-laing-ddc-water-pump-18w-repair-kit.html), just as a repair... now it's modding excitement!

Yes, the poti will not degrade full speed performance like most fan controllers do. When VSP hits around 4.5V it's 100%...no loss by adding the controller:up:

I wonder if you plotted a graph with the Toshiba controller versus something like the MCP35x comparing noise output at similar/identical performance settings (whatever voltage that may be for each pump to perform the same)?

That would definitely interest me :)

Yeah, I'm going to have to make another pump noise round, it's too hard to tell with the informal tests. The Sanyo is better than the DDC-1, but I'm not sure about the DDC 3.1 or MCP35X, etc.

FYI, I published my blog on the Sanyo along with an installation video of the process.

I worked through installing both the Sanyo and the Toshiba into DDC-1 pumps thanks to Bmaverick and both operate just fine.

I did notice that the DDC-1 is not nearly as power hungry with the Toshiba as the DDC3 series pump tested, so I'll have to run some more tests on the Toshiba to see what DDC-1 performance. The different windings between DDC1 and DDC3 makes the controllers behave differently.

SANYO blog:
http://martinsliquidlab.org/2011/04/16/diyinhk-ddc-pump-sanyo-pcb-replacement-mod/

INSTALL video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5E5kPQnSxvQ&feature=player_embedded

glide 1

04-16-2011, 10:40 PM

smanet

04-17-2011, 05:59 AM

I've notice that your are installing an heatsink on the SANYO PCB.
Is it usefull for the Toshiba too? It came just as showed before, w/o heatsink I mean. I'm using my revived pump @10V, it's a bit hot.
http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110328233618_28032011053_mod.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110328233618_28032011053_mod.jpg)
The pump on the left is the dead one. It has this coil :
http://www.pctunerup.com/up//img/jpeg.gif (http://www.pctunerup.com/up//image.php?src=_201104/20110416184050_16042011062.jpg)
This is the back of the revived one (sorry for no preview and bad soldering):
http://www.pctunerup.com/up//img/jpeg.gif (http://www.pctunerup.com/up//image.php?src=_201104/20110416184313_16042011063.jpg)
Swapping the red rotor with the blue one will make the pump operate better? I still have some probs understanding the color revisions of Laing impellers...

Martinm210

04-17-2011, 10:24 AM

martin - i watched your video and noticed that the coil assembly came off while you were desoldering the wires. I'm thinking that the 10W pump has more winds on each of the 6 coils compared to the newer DDC3.1's giving the DDC3.1 higher RPM output and amp draw.

My question is, if anyone has tried re-winding the 10W pumps with lesser winds to bring it up to DDC3.1 specs and using the Toshiba pcb. If i had spare pumps to try out, i would do this. Count the number of winds/coil of the 18W version and wind the exact amount on the 10W version. :)

Yeah, I didn't intend for the coil to come out that way, it actually made more work for me in gluing it back in there, but it was easier to remove the coil wires that way without tweezers.:D

I'm not an electrical guy, but I assumed the winding difference was not so much the number of windings, but the orientation of the windings? The DDC3 series pumps have the windings wrapped parallel to the perimeter. Completely different magnets as well. You could always try it, but I don't have any deceased pumps left now...they have all been brought back to life..:)

I've notice that your are installing an heatsink on the SANYO PCB.
Is it usefull for the Toshiba too? It came just as showed before, w/o heatsink I mean. I'm using my revived pump @10V, it's a bit hot.
http://www.pctunerup.com/up/results/_201103/th_20110328233618_28032011053_mod.jpg (http://www.pctunerup.com/up/image.php?src=_201103/20110328233618_28032011053_mod.jpg)
The pump on the left is the dead one. It has this coil :
http://www.pctunerup.com/up//img/jpeg.gif (http://www.pctunerup.com/up//image.php?src=_201104/20110416184050_16042011062.jpg)
This is the back of the revived one (sorry for no preview and bad soldering):
http://www.pctunerup.com/up//img/jpeg.gif (http://www.pctunerup.com/up//image.php?src=_201104/20110416184313_16042011063.jpg)
Swapping the red rotor with the blue one will make the pump operate better? I still have some probs understanding the color revisions of Laing impellers...

Not the smaller PCB version, it looks like it's made specifically for the Sanyo IC. I don't think there is room for it inside the case either on a DDC3 pump, there is just enough room for the toshiba PCB. The Sanyo also has the IC on the bottom where the Toshiba sits on top.

The Toshiba on the DDC-1 could use one of the magnets as a heat sink though, it sits about 3/4 directly below one of the large magnet flat spots, so I did just that when I did the DDC1/Toshiba. I scraped away the paint on the magnet and put some heavy/thick TIM on the IC. The DDC-1 also doesn't draw as much current on the Toshiba, so heat should be lower anyhow.

I would simply look into heatsinks for the casing base if you want to cool a DDC3.

He does have that decoupler/heatsink that extends beyond the base. That would help spread the heat:

http://cgi.ebay.com/DDC-pump-bottom-heatsink-damper-MCP350-MCP355-MCP35X-/330523605231?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf4bdf8ef#ht_1207wt_1005

Or you could make your own, or Koolance, or Swiftech is coming out with one....lots of options.:up:

Not sure on the impellers if it makes any difference or not. I know the current tops are designed for the smaller inlet opening on the blue impellers, so but I'm not sure what is different internally if anything.

I kind of like the Toshiba on the DDC1 pump as it is. It's quite a bit smoother in sound than the DDC3 pump and I suspect it's more powerful than the Sanyo on a DDC-1. The noise was a bit too much on the DDC3 for my taste, but it's not bad on the DDC-1. More tinkering and testing is in order on the Toshiba/DDC-1..:D

m0r7if3r

04-17-2011, 10:30 AM

I'm not an electrical guy, but I assumed the winding difference was not so much the number of windings, but the orientation of the windings? The DDC3 series pumps have the windings wrapped parallel to the perimeter. Completely different magnets as well. You could always try it, but I don't have any deceased pumps left now...they have all been brought back to life..:)

Magnetic field is a function of the number of turns, so it does matter (biot savard law if you wanna buff up on the specifics)

smanet

04-17-2011, 01:23 PM

Not the smaller PCB version, it looks like it's made specifically for the Sanyo IC. I don't think there is room for it inside the case either on a DDC3 pump, there is just enough room for the toshiba PCB. The Sanyo also has the IC on the bottom where the Toshiba sits on top.

The Toshiba on the DDC-1 could use one of the magnets as a heat sink though, it sits about 3/4 directly below one of the large magnet flat spots, so I did just that when I did the DDC1/Toshiba. I scraped away the paint on the magnet and put some heavy/thick TIM on the IC. The DDC-1 also doesn't draw as much current on the Toshiba, so heat should be lower anyhow.

I would simply look into heatsinks for the casing base if you want to cool a DDC3.

He does have that decoupler/heatsink that extends beyond the base. That would help spread the heat:

http://cgi.ebay.com/DDC-pump-bottom-heatsink-damper-MCP350-MCP355-MCP35X-/330523605231?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf4bdf8ef#ht_1207wt_1005

Or you could make your own, or Koolance, or Swiftech is coming out with one....lots of options.:up:

Not sure on the impellers if it makes any difference or not. I know the current tops are designed for the smaller inlet opening on the blue impellers, so but I'm not sure what is different internally if anything.

I kind of like the Toshiba on the DDC1 pump as it is. It's quite a bit smoother in sound than the DDC3 pump and I suspect it's more powerful than the Sanyo on a DDC-1. The noise was a bit too much on the DDC3 for my taste, but it's not bad on the DDC-1. More tinkering and testing is in order on the Toshiba/DDC-1..:D

Thanks Martin, I'll look for an heatsink mounted on the base. When I put the DIYINHK, I just scratched some glue from the coil base (but there weren't so much) and put the PCB on it, dunno if Toshiba chip is touching the metal.
I didn't know that tops were designed for the smaller hole in the blue impeller; I'm just looking now for the two original tops (one from a MCP355 and one from the older 18W DDC3.2, you can see both in some pictures I posted some posts ago) and are exactly the same. :shrug: I should send you the red impeller to get some of your precious tests. :D
The strange fact is that my 18W pump, the famous red impeller one I revived, has a "flat" coil as DDC1, differently from the "flower-like" coil in DDC3.
I think Laing has changed coil/rotor combos during the marketing period of DDC3.2 / 1Plust-T.... Maybe I had a DDC1 coil with DDC3.2 motor driver... :shrug:

UPDATE: I found this:
http://www.cooling-masters.com/images/news/200706/laing.png
So this paces my doubts. I revived a DDC2 not a DDC1 and nor a DDC3.2 ..that's why I have DDC1 coil and still 18W.

Martinm210

04-17-2011, 02:30 PM

Yeah, I'm kicking myself for throwing away my old DDC2 that I ran 30V through (My test power supply when bonkers and fried that one). It would have been a perfect candidate for one of these boards..:)

I can try impeller swaps, but I've only got a DDC1 (Black), DDC3.2(Blue), and DDC3.25(Blue/Orange) on hand.

While the new tops are narrowed up on the opening to better serve the DDC3 series pumps, they still work well in DDC1/2 pumps as well. Perhaps not perfect, but still a very good gain over stock.

I also have a pair of PTS DDCT-01 acetal tops that were designed for the old larger impeller inlets. They will now have a happy home on some modded DDC-1s...:D

Martinm210

04-17-2011, 06:31 PM

FYI,
Finished up a couple more voltage runs on the Sanyo. 8V is really quiet as you might expect. The controller scales well with voltage control and since it doesn't take a ton of power you could probably do this with most fan controllers.
http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhksanyovoltscomparison.png

Martinm210

04-21-2011, 04:59 PM

Added a noise comparison video to a DDC-1 and DDC 3.2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCMiFDsNRHY

Cheers!
Martin

lowfat

04-21-2011, 05:55 PM

The DDC-1 w/o the DIYINHK board sounds awful.

Martinm210

04-21-2011, 08:02 PM

Funny thing is everyone complained when Laing went from the DDC2 to DDC3.2s because of power loss. While I was still pretty much a D5 user at the time, I don't remember too many people noting an improvement in noise.

It's pretty clear to me there was a really good improvement in noise from the DDC1/2 series to DDC3 series.

Fortunately the Sanyo PCB brings the otherwise gritty/buzzy DDC1/2 series to nearly DDC3 smoothness. Subjectively I think there is actually a little bit less high pitched whine, while a bit more buzz. BUT...that's a bit apples/oranges with the 18w vs 12w comparison. I don't have any DDC3.1s so I just threw it in there for a secondary comparison.

Sideroxylon

04-21-2011, 09:19 PM

Added a noise comparison video to a DDC-1 and DDC 3.2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCMiFDsNRHY

Cheers!
Martin

Martin why is there never any commentary from you in your vids? Your vids are great but they'd be better with a bit of narration.

Church

04-22-2011, 02:21 AM

Martin: imho most actual voltage step is not 8V but 7V, as it can be directly got from molex by simple wire swap.

Martinm210

04-22-2011, 04:37 AM

Martin why is there never any commentary from you in your vids? Your vids are great but they'd be better with a bit of narration.

That's my style..I just like letting the data do the talking and let the user make their own judgments. Narration during noise testing doesn't work either...screws up the meter with its slow response time, so it would have to be mixed in post processing. Not sure what to say...Listen carefullly?..:D

wizard1238

04-22-2011, 05:16 AM

Martin: imho most actual voltage step is not 8V but 7V, as it can be directly got from molex by simple wire swap.

should be very careful, the sanyo board damage immediately if the + - power is reverse connected. and some motherboard cannot read the rpm signal if the low level is 5V not the normal 0V
it's better use a good fan controller to varies the speed

Church

04-22-2011, 06:09 AM

wizard1238: better, right. But molex 7V mod is cheapest of them all. Nice for price/performancy builds. And to regulate DDC from controller controller must handle relatively lot of power per channel.

Martinm210

04-24-2011, 08:50 PM

FYI, I tested the Toshiba PCB on Bmaverick's DDC-1 he sent over. It is slightly more powerful than the Sanyo version, but not quite the extreme of the DDC3 install. It is more noisy though, so as a personal preference, I would go with the Sanyo for the better noise quality on DDC-1 pumps.

Also of some interesting note: The Toshiba on a DDC-1 is extremely efficient. Darn near hit 29% efficiency which is probably the best to date on any pump I've tested. As you can also see, the Sanyo consumes about the same power as the Toshiba yet produces less pumping power.

In the end, the Toshiba produces more pumping power and more electrically efficient, but the Sanyo is more silent on a DDC-1. Both provide some gains in pumping power over the Laing controller though.

m_jones_

04-24-2011, 11:22 PM

The next project is PWM control the sanyo board, but it's already very silent at 12V, is it need to speed down:confused:
Any update since im looking to replace my 18w 3.2 burnt pcb ?
Thanks

Martinm210

04-25-2011, 11:13 AM

I don't think the Sanyo can handle DDC3 series pumps. Per the Sanyo tech specs, max current is 1.5 amps. I hit 2.5 amps on the toshiba based DDC3 series pump, so it probably wouldn't work at 12v. Maybe at really low volts, but I think the Toshiba is the only option for DDC3 pumps at 12v, per specs it should handle 2.5 amps and testing seems to support that in short term tests.

bmaverick

04-29-2011, 06:29 PM

More data by Martin has been added since my last visit here. The new charts for comparison are really easy to understand. :) That I like. LOL

I have a few of the rare DDC2 pumps never used, still new. These are more of a collectors interest rather than running them. ;)

Sparky

04-30-2011, 07:06 PM

Also of some interesting note: The Toshiba on a DDC-1 is extremely efficient. Darn near hit 29% efficiency which is probably the best to date on any pump I've tested.

At first glance 29% efficiency sounds pretty horrid lol :rofl:

mib

05-21-2011, 06:03 AM

I have a moded pump using TB6588FG. On PCB there is a revolution reading. Is it really working??

Martinm210

05-21-2011, 06:11 AM

At first glance 29% efficiency sounds pretty horrid lol :rofl:

Yeah, small centrifugal pumps are very low in efficiency. A better part of the power consumed is converted to heat. 29% is actually the best I've ever measured though..:D D5's for example are usually half that.

I have a moded pump using TB6588FG. On PCB there is a revolution reading. Is it really working??

Yes, I got it to work, but it's not following the standard fan 2 pulses per revolution (I think it's 6). It's much higher and will give you a reading that is what I presume to be about 3X higher than actual. Some fan controllers will let you correct up for this, but if not you can divide by 3 and be in the ballpark.

I "Assumed" that RPM = Hz x 10 instead of the Hz x 30 normal conversion in this test, but I'm not sure if that's correct or not. It seems reasonable is all.

http://martinsliquidlab.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/diyinhktoshibaddc-1-xspc.png