Few wiring and fan splitter-adapter questions

[Church]

Can somebody remind me what type of wires are used for normal 3-pin fan cables and what for more powerful power cables (like 4pin molex/6pin & 8pin cables), preferably in both European & American standarts. I recall it asked and reading here before, but unfortunately i hadn't bookmarked it then, and didn't manage to formulate right search terms to narrow down big pile of search results to find it again.

Also is it wise at all to try to make 1 (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1167) to 10 (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=1166) fan mini splitter/adapter (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4425614&postcount=47) where all, including incoming power one are those of 3-pin type? (as in can normal 3pin wire handle 10fans?) I might use some thick 4pin (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=60_923_164&products_id=1168) molex, but imho it will look ugly on adapter/splitter and on the end of fan controller i'd need to go back to 3-pin anyway.

BTW, are 4pin connectors backwards compatible with 3-pin fans? (reading in description of 4pin connectors (female (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=29516) & male (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=29520)), that those have 3-pin ridge) - So maybe i should make "more universal one" that i can use with any, 3-pin or 4-pin fans?

[Creekin]

this link may answer some of ur Qs
http://www.playtool.com/pages/psuconnectors/connectors.html

u can fit a 3 pin female on a 4 pin male, but it does bend a bit.

i would not recommend making a 1 - 10 adapter by linking a chain of 1-3 adapters, the current in the first adapter would probably melt it, in that scenario you would need thicker wire for first few "Ys"

i would use a terminal block or a pcb like that adapter u linked to

similar to how i did in this pic

http://www.xtremesystems.org/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=108926&stc=1&d=1288347266

[Alexandr0s]

I'd indeed recommend what Creekin said. Using a standard 3 fan splitter to connect 10 fans is rather dangerous. Even with a good pcb, it's smart to be careful when connecting 10 fans, because of the high current. If you have 10 fans that have a startup current of 0.4A (a normal startup current), you have a power draw of 0.4x12x10= 48W, and the max power draw from the 4 pin molex connector is 60W, so you're getting close to the max power draw.

About the 4 pin fan connectors, they are backwards compatible, but some motherboards can't detect there is a 3 pin fan connected, and will always pump 12v through the connector (because the speed of the fan is determined by the pwm signal, not the voltage). I believe the reverse is also possible, so that 4-pin fans are compatible with 3 pin connectors.

[Red Maw]

I agree with Alexandr0s. Your best option would be to figure out the load you'll be putting on device and then get the smallest gauge wire that will handle the load.

Off the top of my head I highly doubt you could run 10 fans off a single 3pin connector.

[MagisD]

Well it all depends on fan controller eg fc-2 with 45 watts per channel.

Does it have to be 10?

Phoyba does 1 to 3,4,6,and 9 adaptors.

Btw the gt's 1850 i belive you were planning on useing are 5 watt safe startup.


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[Alexandr0s]

Well it all depends on fan controller eg fc-2 with 45 watts per channel.

Does it have to be 10?

Phoyba does 1 to 3,4,6,and 9 adaptors.

Btw the gt's 1850 i belive you were planning on useing are 5 watt safe startup.


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Yup, though it's a bit lower actually, 4.32W ;).

[Church]

On one i intend to put 10xNB PK-3, on another 5xNB PK-3+1xGT 1850
NB PK-3: (startup minimum voltage 3.5-4.5V, running 2.4 W)
GT 1850: (startup minimum voltage 3.6V, running 0.94W)
So on first normally working power draw ~ 24W, on second ~ 13W. Anyone can tell what startup current draw for these fans are?

[MagisD]

Yup, though it's a bit lower actually, 4.32W ;).

Allways leave overhead where power concerned thats why i said safe startup. Everything tends to degrade slightly with use so you don't want to cut it too close.


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[MagisD]

On one i intend to put 10xNB PK-3, on another 5xNB PK-3+1xGT 1850
NB PK-3: (startup minimum voltage 3.5-4.5V, running 2.4 W)
GT 1850: (startup minimum voltage 3.6V, running 0.94W)
So on first normally working power draw ~ 24W, on second ~ 13W. Anyone can tell what startup current draw for these fans are?

On one what?

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[SpuTnicK]

here is an example of 1 to 9 splitter
http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/9702/191h.jpg

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/6193/192df.jpg

http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/4336/193ii.jpg

[Alexandr0s]

I'm really wondering how well the wire of the input power holds, seeing as it looks like a standard fan cable, of which I'm not quite sure it's rated for that current. It looks great though ;).

[Church]

I know of these 1:9 phobya splitters. Question is how much power can be safely passed through single 3-pin header (as those 10 fans will be all on rads (4x140 push-pull +2x140, and i want to regulate them simultaneously, through single aquaero channel (chan1 for powerboosted AE4 can handle 25W, with poweramps any chan upto 35W).
I loved that DIY splitter i gave URL to in first post, so much more compact/neater looking then those 9 fan splitters, so i planned to make two similar to such myself, just with more (10) fan headers each.
I recall reading thread that specific maximum current is for specific types of wires (AWG crossection something?) and that there were two different standart types, so just reasking that info from that older thread i couldn't find.

[SpuTnicK]

maybe this (http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm) will help you.

[MpG]

If you're looking for a quick alternative to splicing a whole load of wires together, and can use a soldering iron, you might consider using a pre-printed breadboard PCB. You can basically fill it will fan headers, and if you think you'll be going over more than a few amps, just lay down extra solder over the copper pathways.

Edit: Didn't catch that link in the first post. Same idea.

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/5683/assembled2.jpg (http://img257.imageshack.us/i/assembled2.jpg/)
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/9519/assembled1.jpg (http://img257.imageshack.us/i/assembled1.jpg/)

[Creekin]

i would NEVER use that 1-9 adapter, i have seen pics of them melted,
the breadboard MpG put up would be the go.

if you make it yourself out of cable, just over spec them, use normal 4 pin molex cable. 10awg i think

[Waterlogged]

churchy, why not link the fans together like I've done here on some 92mm GT's (similar to Triebwerk...only thing worth liking about those fans ;))?

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/1281/connectors1.jpg

http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/5868/connectors11.jpg

How I do it is make the wires long enough to run to the edge of the fan and cut them there. Take the left over wire (or wire of the same awg if not enough is left over) and run it back the way it came making sure it reaches the other edge of the fan, crimp the two wires together for each pin in the female 3 pin and put a male 3 pin on the other end of the wires you've run back the other way. To keep the RPM signal from becoming screwy, I fold the yellow wire under the heat shrink for every fan except the first one, like that, if I need the RPM from that fan in another build, I just pull it out and pop it in place.

[Creekin]

that would be fine for up to about 4 or 5 fans, (wattage dependent) anymore than that and you would risk overloading the cable or pins.

great idea and beautiful work WL :up:

[Church]

Yes, wonderful idea/implementation, WL. Great resulting looks / compactness / simpleness of fan replacement. :up:

I'm still leaning more to 1>10 on mini pcb splitter route, as it would help for lazy me to not rewire each of 16 fans :).