2 loops 3 rads?

[zinsco]

Rampage III, 980x, 2-Radeon 5970's / 2 loops, 2 res, 2 pumps
I was thinking to put the CPU and MB together with the 1.140 & 1.120 rads on one loop, and the 2 - 5970's with the 480 rad on the 2nd loop.
What do you guys think?


http://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx95/zinsco/DSC00257.jpg

Obviously missing some fans and the 2 5970's at the moment, not to mention the ram.

[makavelijm]

i think you should put the cpu nb+sb on the 480becasue that cpu will get hot! and the 5970s on the 2 single rads

other wise i think it would be best to have a single loop.

[Church]

If i'd be able to get 3x120 for gpu loop (imho 1x120+1x140 is a bit lacking for 2x5970), i'd put 4x120 for cpu+NB. But simpliest would be single loop, yeah. As Gabe's test shown, not much cooling is lost, yet you will save a lot by going single loop, eg. one less pump & res to buy, less fittings, less tubing, simplier to find space/mount components. I advise to connect gpu blocks then in parallel though. +Single loop builds are more advisable for first LC builds ..

[zinsco]

Well, I already have the 2 pumps and a dual res. Should I just incorporate the 2 pumps and the dual res and rads all together on 1 loop? Would the 2 pumps actually benefit the loop by giving better flow?

[zinsco]

So, I was just reading that the 2-5970 can draw around 600 watts and the 980X probably around 200 watts. Sounds like the cards would run much hotter than the cpu, buy you guys still think the 2 singles wouldn't make?

[makavelijm]

well the reason i say that the 120.4(480) would be best for the motherboard +mosfets + CPU is because i know this from experience, i have a i7 920 @ 3ghz on a feser 480 rad and a PA 120.3 and my temps are idle@31c load@58c ambient is 18c (its winter in Australia). i know that in summer my temps will probably get another 10c hotter so its best to be prepared.

Ive got some work to do on my system as well, i was thinking to get a mcr420 rad+ the 120.3 for the cpu and the feser 480 for my single 5970(will add another in the future).2 loops instead of one.

Do you plan on overclocking you system much?
i still think its best to go with a single loop but seeing as you already have some hardware for a dual loop its probably best to work with what you got, maybe see if you can add another rad in there somewhere?
here a link for an example of where to put another rad
http://forum.corsair.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85943 it doesn't have to be a dual rad it could maybe be another 140.1

hope this helps, let me know what you think

[Grinder]

As Gabe's test shown, not much cooling is lost, yet you will save a lot by going single loop

Do you mind pointing me at that test Churchy? I am currently running an mcr320, xt, mcp650, and microres. I just ordered an mcp655 and a v2 res, and am trying to decide between one loop and two (if I were to add gpu or other components). I also have a spare mcr120, but didn't figure it would be worth adding it as well...

[MpG]

He's talking about this thread (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=253337). Heavy on the numbers, but it can be seen that very little performance is lost from running everything as one loop, and things become much simpler to setup and maintain. If you do decide to go with two loops, then the way you suggested in the first post is probably your best option.

For best cooling, make sure none of the radiators are receiving exhaust air from any of the other radiators.

[zinsco]

Do you plan on overclocking you system much?

YES



i still think its best to go with a single loop but seeing as you already have some hardware for a dual loop its probably best to work with what you got


very little performance is lost from running everything as one loop


Would the double res and 2 pumps help at all with a single loop? Would I get better flow? If I decide to go with 1 loop will it be a benefit that I have this extra hardware or will they just be waisted and I should keep them for another build some day?

[Systemlord]

He's talking about this thread (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=253337). Heavy on the numbers, but it can be seen that very little performance is lost from running everything as one loop, and things become much simpler to setup and maintain. If you do decide to go with two loops, then the way you suggested in the first post is probably your best option.

For best cooling, make sure none of the radiators are receiving exhaust air from any of the other radiators.

Wouldn't the water already be pretty warm after passing through the GPU's by the time it got to the CPU and effect CPU temps in a single loop even with multiple radiators?

- Systemlord

[Church]

Imho outside mounting (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4437544&postcount=2705) is not that bad when done right, and can take out lot of moding to do to fit rads internally.
Grinder: Was easy to find :P. Members List>search: gabe>in his profile 'statistics'/all threads started by him: voala, 4th one (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=253337)

[Polizei]

Wouldn't the water already be pretty warm after passing through the GPU's by the time it got to the CPU and effect CPU temps in a single loop even with multiple radiators?

- Systemlord

No. The water doesn't spend enough time in the blocks to raise its temperatures noticeably. It doesn't enter the GPU block and leave it 15C hotter, and then dump 15C water temp in the radiator.

In a closed loop system like our watercooling, the water temperature evens out to the point where there's like .1C temperature difference between radiator out and the last block.

[Grinder]

He's talking about this thread (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=253337).



Grinder: Was easy to find :P. Members List>search: gabe>in his profile 'statistics'/all threads started by him: voala, 4th one (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=253337)

Thanks guys:doh:

I have the same sort of question as the OP. Trying to decide what to do with spare pump, res, and 220. One lump, (eerrr loop) or two.

[makavelijm]

ditch the res, add the second pump into the loop for better flow in your system (i assume you have laing DDC pump)?
sell anything that you think you wont use in the near future

[MpG]

Wouldn't the water already be pretty warm after passing through the GPU's by the time it got to the CPU and effect CPU temps in a single loop even with multiple radiators?

- Systemlord
Not really. At 1gpm flowrate (very easy to achieve these days), it takes 266W of heat to raise the water temperature by 1*C. At 1.5gpm, it takes 400W. And this is only heat that actually enters the block, rather than get dissipated into the surrounding air. So if you're running a strong pump, or even a pair of pumps, anything after a pair of 260's would still be pretty unlikely to see more than an extra degree of water temperature rise.

[Systemlord]

No. The water doesn't spend enough time in the blocks to raise its temperatures noticeably. It doesn't enter the GPU block and leave it 15C hotter, and then dump 15C water temp in the radiator.

In a closed loop system like our watercooling, the water temperature evens out to the point where there's like .1C temperature difference between radiator out and the last block.

So from the time the water leaves the radiator to where it enters the radiator there is an overall temperature value troughout the loop?

- Systemlord

[MpG]

So from the time the water leaves the radiator to where it enters the radiator there is an overall temperature value troughout the loop?

- Systemlord
The water temperature goes up as the water passes through each block, just not by very much (as I mentioned above). In a very cool system that's idling, it might actually be as small as 0.1*C. But even in a fully loaded system, it would be uncommon to see more than a few degrees difference between the exit and entrance points on the radiator.

[Conumdrum]

Yes, each chip adds a bit of heat. In a good loop with a 5C DT it would be 2C maybe even 1.5 C between rad inlet and outlet. Lots depends on how many parts before the rad etc.

LOL, lots depend. Anyhoo, the aceppted normal is 2-3 diff.

[Systemlord]

The water temperature goes up as the water passes through each block, just not by very much (as I mentioned above). In a very cool system that's idling, it might actually be as small as 0.1*C. But even in a fully loaded system, it would be uncommon to see more than a few degrees difference between the exit and entrance points on the radiator.

I understand, I could imagine a larger temperature difference in an undersized radiator with to many blocks in the loop.

- Systemlord

[Church]

Systemlord: with undersized rad overall temps will be higher, yes, when LC sys will reach it's higher equilibrium, but if we speak about differeneces in water temps in different loop places, it will be same, almost none. That's why the brought up reasoning to make tubing simpliest/shortest (will increase flow a little) possible by not looking for specific component order (except one rule that reservoir must be before pump for bleeding/filling purposes).

[Systemlord]

Systemlord: with undersized rad overall temps will be higher, yes, when LC sys will reach it's higher equilibrium, but if we speak about differeneces in water temps in different loop places, it will be same, almost none. That's why the brought up reasoning to make tubing simpliest/shortest (will increase flow a little) possible by not looking for specific component order (except one rule that reservoir must be before pump for bleeding/filling purposes).

So should the pump go into the components or the radiator after passing through the res?

- Systemlord

[makavelijm]

So should the pump go into the components or the radiator after passing through the res?

- Systemlord

it doesnt really matter

[bomberboysk]

So should the pump go into the components or the radiator after passing through the res?

- Systemlord

Generally it is preferable to put the water through the radiator beforehand, to reduce heat dump into the water from the pump...however, if it is shorter to put it to the components, the overall increase in flow may very well make up for the small amount of heat dump you get from the laing pumps.

[Biffa]

res->pump->components->rad->res
or
res->pump->rad->components->res

I've heard so many pros and cons for each I reckon your best bet is try what works for you, thats what I have done, I've tried both and in my particular setup I have one loop one way and the other the other way :D

So I have a dual pump BayRes.

Flow is as follows:

BayRes/Pump1->GTX470->GTX470->GTX470-GTX480->PA120.3->BayRes

Then the second pump in the res goes:

BayRes/Pump2->TFC Xchanger 120->i7->XSPC240->BayRes

So where I have two Rads in the second loop it makes sense to go pump-rad-components-rad-res otherwise you would be have the two rads next to each other; pump-rad-rad-components-res, which might not be a bad thing, but just felt "not right" :)

[Grinder]

ditch the res, add the second pump into the loop for better flow in your system (i assume you have laing DDC pump)?
sell anything that you think you wont use in the near future

I'm actually thinking of adding the second pump (yes, D5 vario/mcp655) as well as the 220 rad and a gpu block (probably komodo) in a single loop, versus setting up a second loop for the gpu with the 220 and the old pump and res.

i.e.
mcp655->mcr320->XT->mcp650->mcr220->komodo->microresv2

versus

mcp655->mcr320->XT->microresv2
AND
mcp650->mcr220->komodo->microresv1

From Gabe's comments in another thread, it sounds like he has some relevant data for this scenario that he hasn't published yet.

[mlee49]

Good luck getting it all to fit. You'll probably be using alot of 90 degree fittings and all your bends are going to be very tight. That and your PSU wiring is going to be limited by that honkin 104.1.

Why not do the Obsidian Mod(aka cut out the 2.5" drive bay out of the bottom) and put in a 120.2 or maybe a 140.2? Temps would be nearly identical, maybe even less considering you might gain some pressure from relieving a couple tight bends.

IF you put all three in there and fit it, I'd love to see that my friend.

[zinsco]

Good luck getting it all to fit. You'll probably be using alot of 90 degree fittings and all your bends are going to be very tight.

Actually, I'm really pleased because it will only take 2 90's and only one on each loop. It's true that I will have one tight bend. It's coming off the 120.4. I'll have a pic as soon as I get my 2nd 120.1 rad.




Why not do the Obsidian Mod(aka cut out the 2.5" drive bay out of the bottom) and put in a 120.2 or maybe a 140.2?


Yeah, I would do that if I had to. I didn't want to lose the 2 hard drive bays, so I tried to come up with a way to get enough rad without doing that mod. I think this may work. The mod is probably better. You can fit 2-120.2's down there and have better air flow in the case most likely, but you lose the bays.