Another Noob wants to get wet

[Megalamaniac]

I'm looking to get into water cooling and I've been reading and taking in so much data I'm going bug-eyed:shocked:.

Here's my ultimate goal. Dual loop system cooling MB (Mosfets,NB,SB), CPU, and both GPU's. I figure it's best to start small, with one loop and expand.

Now here's my first dilema. I was going to cool just the CPU first (looking at Swiftech Ultima H20-220 XT) but then got these 2 new GTX470's. They are great but they either run hot or loud. The fans on auto gives me temps in the 70c's and 80c's. Run the fans enough to keep them in the 60c's, 65-75%, and they get quite loud. Run them at 100% and it sounds like my PC is going to take off!

My plan was to start with the Swiftech kit because of the Apogee XT and I would later add a second loop with a 3 fan rad. But now I'm starting to lean towards the Heatkiller 3.0 because of the better flow.

The other blocks I've pretty much settled on, Enzotech WMST-73NP and WMST-88NP, Bitspower BLACK FREEZER Asus P6T NB/SB Water Block - Matte Black, and the Koolance VID-NX470 for the GTX 470's

Would the Swiftech kit be a smart purchase or should I just do everything from scratch? The kit is priced well but I want to do this right and rather not throw good money after bad.

I have tons more questions, especially about fans and rad combinations, so any advice and/or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. My system is in my sig

Thanx

[ottoyu34]

Sounds great, and start it off simple first and continue once you get the hang of things.

Once you ready to go dual loop. the 240 rad can be used in the GPU loop and mounted on the side of the HAF.

[Serpentarius]

dual loop?

try make your project target practical and achievable. Aim too high, and you'll end up junk it for a year or two before restarting the project.

trust me, everyone here including some old timers has the same problem.

for easy walk-through - just copy the completed worklogs, that way you won't be caught surprised. use the word reference if you like.

if budget possible, use full gpu blocks (considering you might o/c the ram)

[Gimmpy224]

dual loop?

try make your project target practical and achievable. Aim too high, and you'll end up junk it for a year or two before restarting the project.

trust me, everyone here including some old timers has the same problem.

for easy walk-through - just copy the completed worklogs, that way you won't be caught surprised. use the word reference if you like.

if budget possible, use full gpu blocks (considering you might o/c the ram)

/agree

and if you have any questions dont be afraid to post up (after reading around for a bit of course).

[Conumdrum]

Maybe you should bookmark/fav these links and start reading. There is so much good info out there, you just need pointed to it.

http://martin.skinneelabs.com/
http://www.skinneelabs.com/
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/25...rcooling-guide
http://www.overclockerstech.com/wate...for-beginners/
http://forums.extremeoverclocking.co...d.php?t=312743
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=232141
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=202394
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=170188
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...26&postcount=1

[Kurz]

I would go for the EK Supreme HF slightly better performance with better mounting system.
Compared to the Heatkiller 3.0

[Megalamaniac]

Thanx for the info but only the first two links work



Maybe you should bookmark/fav these links and start reading. There is so much good info out there, you just need pointed to it.

http://martin.skinneelabs.com/
http://www.skinneelabs.com/
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/25...rcooling-guide
http://www.overclockerstech.com/wate...for-beginners/
http://forums.extremeoverclocking.co...d.php?t=312743
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=232141
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=635806
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=202394
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=170188
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...26&postcount=1

I've been reading and checking Reviews for months now on and off. I've got a budget at the moment and a need to quiet these 470's so it's time to get started buying stuff. Problem is every time I settle on on what I'm getting I read a new review or discover another piece of equipment and change my mind.

I have, after reading reviews decided on the EK Supreme HF. I'm going to post an equipment list shortly and would like to get some feedback, but at the moment would like to know what Fan and Rad combinations some of you can suggest. I want performance for OC'ing but also don't want anything too loud.

Thanx

[shazza]

First, welcome to XS, Megalamaniac.

You're suffering from the "I've done some research, but I'm confused about what the best water cooling products are" syndrome. My advice - post your list. If something's really crazy, people won't hesitate to yell at ya. Realistically, there isn't always "ONE best product." It depends on your configuration and expectation. Also, there's often very little difference between the top 3 (or so) products, so - pick what you like and can afford, and give it a go! (Warning *** if you get hooked, you'll be changing out components soon enough, so best to just get with it)

[mbreslin]

So recently I did a rebuild of my loops to get some new fittings and switch my 920 for my shiny new 980x. for the past 2 weeks or more I have had chipset+cpu+5870 all stuck on 1 loop, pa120.3 with only 3 fans, (s-flex "F").This is temporary while waiting for parts and also just being lazy and not wanting to do a full rebuild quite yet. I didn't plan to overclock in this setup as I figured heat load would be pretty high already for just 1 360 rad. As I'm getting ready to have a go at pcmark vantage I couldn't help myself and couldn't wait to find out at least a little of what my 980 would do. 5870 overclocked past 1ghz core and 980 to 4.5-4.6ghz and temps were still pretty damn good. The point of this is since you're new (like I was until only a few months ago) to watercooling you're probably like me and are underestimating just how effective watercooling actually is (especially if you buy the right parts which it seems you are already on the right track with the ek hf). The 5870 isn't nearly as hot as 2 470s obviously, and also my stuff is all currently outside of my pc (though weather is crappy here and we have a small child so the heater is on 24/7 and ambients are quite high in here), but rest assured, as long as you aren't going for xtreme overclocks, you can have a computer that is all at once cool, overclockable, and nearly silent.

[millertime359]

I would pass on the kit and just build your own. The kit has a few things you don't really need, and a custom loop isn't that much different in price.

CPU blocks: Swiftech XT, HK 3.0, or EK Supreme HF are all great blocks and you can't go wrong with any of those. The EK has been the choice around here as it isn't as restrictive as the Swiftech block. The HK is a a bit more complicated than the other 2 to install, and you need a backplate. I would either go the EK or Swiftech personally.

Rads: I'm guessing noise is a concern, so anything from Swiftech, EK, XSPC RX series, HW Labs SR1 series, TFC, and Thermochill rads would be best bet. I personally prefer the Swiftech as the price to performance ratio is great. It cost almost half the price of the other rads and doesn't perform 1/2 as well. Normally you can never over do it on rads. You will probably be best to have 2 3x120mm rads for the whole loop or at least a 1 3x120mm and a 2x120mm.

GPU blocks: Skinnee is working on a review, but normally its personal taste, what ever you like the look of better. GPU only with unisink is great for the budget, but the FC blocks have been getting water over the VRMs, so they are better if you plan to volt mod your card. Most people also agree a FC looks better.

Pumps: D5(MCP655 or DDC(MCP350/355 or the DDC3.25) will work just fine. The DDC3.25 has been the choice lately as it has great head pressure. The D5 vs DDC war still is on going, the big difference is the D5 has more flow, is larger, and has a speed control built in (vario version). The DDCs have more head pressure, more top options and are smaller. head pressure is for restrictive loops. I also recommend a pump top, EK pump tops are some of the best.

Tubing: I like PrimoChill PRO LRT, pick your flavor. Size doesn't really matter with flow rates. The biggest thing to think about is the side wall thickness, thicker the side way, the more kink resistant the tube is.

fittings: Compression vs barbs and clamps. There is really no difference in sercurity vs a properly installed barb with a clamp and a compression fitting. Comp fittings are agreed my most to be better looking, but also carry a hefty price tag.

coolant: Most people here (including me) agree that distilled water with either PT Nuke or 0.999% pure silver is the way to go. Dyes can break down in the loop and cause issues.

Fans: Gentle Typhoons are my choice, by S-Flex or Yate Loons work great too.

Res: Not a big concern of performance, all for looks. I personally like IandH's res. It seems to be a great res. EK tube Res' are really nice too. Any res you want will work great though.

Hope that helps you some. As Sharon stated, there is alot of info out there and there really is not universal "best" setup. :)

[radaja]

regarding compression fitting are primochill ghost fitting reliable?
seeing that they are made out of Polycarbonate.

[millertime359]

regarding compression fitting are primochill ghost fitting reliable?
seeing that they are made out of Polycarbonate.

The biggest issue with the Ghost Fittings is they have no collar, so it is easy to overtighten them while tightening a comp ring. If you do, they will break.

I personally stopped using them as I had one break. Seeing that EK and ThermoChill have new metal Comp fittings priced in below BP's I would look into one of those options if the BP fittings are too costly for you. :)

[radaja]

ok thanks thats what i feared.i can afford to get $7-$8 fittings but i saw the plastic
ones and thought why not.thats why i checked thanks

[Megalamaniac]

Many thanx for the recent replies, pretty much quelled my concerns and answered a number of questions. So far here's what I've got:

EK Supreme HF and EK Mosfet block set and full motherboard block, I was looking at the black freezer MB block and mosfet block set or enzotech mosfet blocks but I figure might as well keep the CPU and MB blocks a set. As I understand it the P6T NB and SB don't run that hot, unlike my Striker Extreme. As for the mosfets, I know they run hot but I haven't seen much data on the different mosfet blocks out there.

I have to go with the Koolance 470 GPU blocks as they are the only ones out at this time, except for EK and I'd have to get those from overseas. I'd only order overseas in a pinch.

I'm leaning heavily towards the new EK Radiators since they are a bit cheaper than the Thermochill and the XSPC. I'm looking at getting a 3 120mm fan Rad and a 2 120mm fan Rad.

What are thoughts on a single 140mm fan rad instead of the 2 120mm. Black Ice has the 140mm's.

S-Flex fans

I'm still looking at Reseviors but I probably going to get either 2 single 5.25 bay or a dual loop dual bay from XSPC, maybe even the one for the dual DDC pumps.(Does the Res work like the XSPC tops?)


Question about pumps, what is the difference between the DDC3.25 and the MPC355? They are both 18w and seem to have simular specs. And is there any reason not to get the MPC350 and just mod it to 18w.(electronic tech so modding them isn't a problem)

As for fan control, the mCubed seems the best although they make sure that you have to buy 2 addons for more fans AND flow monoriting. I considered the Koolance TMS200 system but I don't like the software and the mCubed does more.

Metal compression fittimgs for sure and as far as the tubing and coolant, to many people agree Millertime to to veer anywhere there. Probably Blue tube for one loop and red for the other since dyes aren't a good idea, the only question is 7/16 ID or 1/2 ID for 1/2 fittings (I'm assuming the compression fittings eliminate the need for smaller tubing to get a tight fit).

Best way to configure loops? I'm thinking CPU and Mosfets for one and GPU's and MB block for the other.

That should be enough questions for now and again many thanx for the help (did I forget anything?).

[millertime359]

CPU on its own loop, MB blocks and GPUs on other. CPU is more sensitive to temps and flow than everything else when overclocking. So it best to leave it on own loop.

There really isn't huge differences on the MB blocks, so get what you like the look of.

For your pump question, see here (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=245795). I have been hearing that the MCP350's PCB board has been changed an the mod is a bit tougher to do now, if you even can. I would do more research before buying a MCP350 with the plan to mod.

I would wait before getting the GPU blocks honestly. EK should have state-side stores stocked soon. I hear he is on vacation right now, so that may be way they haven't been. Also Swiftech should have a block out soon too. It would be best to wait for them all to come out so you have a choice and you can make certain there aren't any minor issues with the blocks.

The only real issue with the 140mm rad is the fan selection isn't as good as the 120mm rad. Take a look here for rads reviews (http://skinneelabs.com/radiators.html).

The XSPC res is a great res as it has a pump top built in and it holds 2 pumps and res' in a small footprint. I have seen some reports of them leaking, but it hasn't been anything wide spread like the T3 so far, so just be certain to leak test it. :)

For info on fans (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=223391).

When it comes to comp fittings, you pick the tubing size then match it to comp fitting size. I like the 7/16 5/8 tubing, but currently i am using 1/2 3/4. So if you go with the 7/16 5/8, you get the 7/16 5/8 comp fittings.

Only rules when running a loop, res before pump then shortest loop possible. Rad placement doesn't matter as the water temp reaches a certain temp in each loop anyways.

[Megalamaniac]

CPU on its own loop, MB blocks and GPUs on other. CPU is more sensitive to temps and flow than everything else when overclocking. So it best to leave it on own loop.

There really isn't huge differences on the MB blocks, so get what you like the look of.

For your pump question, see here (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=245795). I have been hearing that the MCP350's PCB board has been changed an the mod is a bit tougher to do now, if you even can. I would do more research before buying a MCP350 with the plan to mod.

I would wait before getting the GPU blocks honestly. EK should have state-side stores stocked soon. I hear he is on vacation right now, so that may be way they haven't been. Also Swiftech should have a block out soon too. It would be best to wait for them all to come out so you have a choice and you can make certain there aren't any minor issues with the blocks.

The only real issue with the 140mm rad is the fan selection isn't as good as the 120mm rad. Take a look here for rads reviews (http://skinneelabs.com/radiators.html).

The XSPC res is a great res as it has a pump top built in and it holds 2 pumps and res' in a small footprint. I have seen some reports of them leaking, but it hasn't been anything wide spread like the T3 so far, so just be certain to leak test it. :)

For info on fans (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=223391).

When it comes to comp fittings, you pick the tubing size then match it to comp fitting size. I like the 7/16 5/8 tubing, but currently i am using 1/2 3/4. So if you go with the 7/16 5/8, you get the 7/16 5/8 comp fittings.

Only rules when running a loop, res before pump then shortest loop possible. Rad placement doesn't matter as the water temp reaches a certain temp in each loop anyways.

Tons of thanx, I really appreciate the help. :up:

As for the 470 blocks, looks like I HAVE to wait seeing everyone is now out of stock on them. I got a notify email from FrozenCPU this morning and they are already gone. Koolance is also out of stock as of today.


Thanx