**Need advice on Watercooling my Lian Li V2100B* Similar to Vadim Gaming PC's!!** [Archive]

blazarcher

03-28-2010, 10:48 AM

I am planning on watercooling my Lian Li V2100B. I will be watercooling an Intel Core i7 930, EVGA X58 Classified MOBO, and 2 or maybe 3 GTX480's. I will have 3 radiators all in one loop for this setup. I'll have a 480mm Magicool Radiator, a 240mm radiator, and a Single 120mm XSPC radiator. The reason I am going with Magicool is because they will fit in the lower section of the case where there is limited space. Here is a picture of the case I found on the internet...
http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/3489/20050328li5.jpg (http://img180.imageshack.us/i/20050328li5.jpg/)

And here is how I want it to look like eventually.. First the exterior...

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/2614/13254timg3009t.jpg (http://img687.imageshack.us/i/13254timg3009t.jpg/)

Now here is a very rough estimate of how I want the interior to look like...

http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/5396/13215iimg2915ii.jpg (http://img707.imageshack.us/i/13215iimg2915ii.jpg/)

Here is how the tubing and fittings (I want to go with Koolance but will stick with bitspower) will look like (ignore the excessive radiator setup)

http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/6454/03005.jpg (http://img526.imageshack.us/i/03005.jpg/)

And the GPU setup when the GTX 480 DD waterblocks come out...

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/289/03006.jpg (http://img180.imageshack.us/i/03006.jpg/)

NOTE I am not sure whether to go with PrimoChill Clear Coils or should I go with Pearls?

Anyways, I was wondering where I should get my side panels cut. I need them to look exactly like how it looks above. Has anyone worked with Performance-PCs before? They offer custom modding services as well and was wondering if it's ok to go with them. Lastly, are they any good at sleeving PSU cables? I am spending 100 dollars having my enermax 1050W PSU sleeved by them and was wondering how they would come out.

The water travels in this order: ****Look at my latest posts, my setup has changed a bit****

Reservoir > Pump > 120.4 Radiator > 120.2 Radiator > CPU block > northbridge block > 120.1 Radiator > VGA waterblocks > returns to the reservoir.

Going with two separate loops reduces the flow rate of my CPU loop considerably. This is why I am going with a single loop not to mention it is less messy.

Anyone have any idea whether the GOLD from the CPU block my deteriorate over time?

NOTE, This is my FIRST time watercooling. I know this is a bit ambitious but if your gonna go watercooling, you might as well go 100%.

blazarcher

03-28-2010, 11:07 AM

If anyone would like to recommend any other fan other than the Noiseblocker M12-S3 HS for LOW noise/CFM that would be great. But for now I'll stick with these fans. The M12-P is actually even better but since it's a PWM version, it has a noticeable motor noise at low RPM's.

I was wondering where I could get an Enermax 1050W PSU sleeved (UNI-sleeved like in one of the pictures above). I am will to spend anywhere from 100 dollars to 200. Performance-PCS offer sleeving services but they don't specify how it will be sleeved.

Inglewood78

03-28-2010, 11:29 AM

damn, thats quite a bit of change you are spending there. Don't forget to post up some pics when you are done :)

blazarcher

03-28-2010, 11:43 AM

damn, thats quite a bit of change you are spending there. Don't forget to post up some pics when you are done :)

I sure will. But it will be a while till this all comes together. I am waiting for danger den to come out with some GTX480 waterblocks before I buy everything. Also the Magicool 240mm radiator are on back order so I'm gonna have to wait for them to restock on them.

I still need to get those side panels cut however, without those modded side panels, those radiators will be USELESS.

blazarcher

03-28-2010, 11:26 PM

Church

03-29-2010, 12:14 AM

blazarcher

03-29-2010, 12:22 PM

Check for reviews from trusty sources. I'm still prefering revolution 1250 with it's overall set of often best in class parameters, like quietness, voltage stability under load and high efficiency. It's looks also help a bit for moding projects :)
If i'd ever need more then it's power, i'd go for dual psu-s or 1700W liquid cooled psu.
Yeah, actually I've checked reviews of both PSU. The 1250W Enermax isn't as good as the 1050W version. Odd I know but they are actually "different" version of the same PSU. The 1250W being the cheaper version. I can't find the review off the top of my head but they preferred the 1050 over the 1250 because it was not only quieter but MORE efficient.

I understand that the Enermax has the HIGHEST EFFICIENCY of all PSU currently out right now. But with the new GTX 480 and the upcoming ATI GPUs, this PSU will be pushed to its MAX.

However, if I went with the Silverstone, not only will it NOT be pushed to the max (meaning less overall noise) but it will be ready for any future GPUs as well.

Also, the Silverstone has MUCH longer cables and the case itself with its black ?polished? case looks SO MUCH better than the matte version of the Enermax. If you take a look at the pictures above, that Lian Li V2000B has the same PSU as well and it fits in perfect. Now imagine the Enermax being there instead, which would look better? Anyways, the Silverstone will be more efficient because it won't be pushed 100% and as we know with all PSU's, they perform worst when they are maxed out (also when running at extremely low loads). Finally the cables when they are "uni-sleeved" would be much better if I went with the Silverstone PSU because the cables are "extremely long" compared to the Enermax. This way I could make it look some what similar to the setup shown above. Because of this, I can't think of any other reason why not to go with the Silverstone over the Enermax. Sure the customer support of Enermax is much better and yeah, it also has the better reputation. But in terms of quality and craftsmanship, down to the soldering, the Silverstone wins here. Not only is it more powerful but it's quieter AND better looking by far.

blazarcher

03-29-2010, 12:58 PM

Anyone know what those two things are?

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/1873/03008.jpg (http://img229.imageshack.us/i/03008.jpg/)

Church

03-29-2010, 12:59 PM

Actually Mod87+/Pro87+ pro have higher efficiency (revo+ rated silver, these lines - rated gold). But top of those lines are 900W and 700W respectively. As for 1250W being different and worse .. wierd .. only thing i now that's different in 'em is - in north america 1250W is sold under line name Galaxy Evo (with insides being almost 99.9% same as revo @worldwide), and in some reviews it was rated even higher (except efficiency though. as from review sounded that it's efficiency is a bit downtuned compared to revo+(though who knows if it's not simply because of 110V voltage being used @NA), but few minor flaws fixed, as in some components soldered more solid way).

Waterlogged

03-29-2010, 01:46 PM

Anyone know what those two things are?

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/1873/03008.jpg (http://img229.imageshack.us/i/03008.jpg/)

Those are reservoirs. Many res's of that type are made of aluminum and should be avoided. There are a few that are made from Delrin (aka POM), copper and brass that are OK to use. Those particular res's look like they are from AC (http://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=2331&XTCsid=28jkvj24cpllte2pqb1fhlhjech45uhv).

blazarcher

03-29-2010, 01:52 PM

Those are reservoirs. Many res's of that type are made of aluminum and should be avoided. There are a few that are made from Delrin (aka POM), copper and brass that are OK to use. Those particular res's look like they are from AC (http://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=2331&XTCsid=28jkvj24cpllte2pqb1fhlhjech45uhv).

Why exactly are these to "be avoided"? Do they add "stuff" to your loop? (Like delrin) I'm actually going with the XSPC Aluminum radiators, are those alright? GRUNTVILLE have a review of the reservoir and they say that "The annodization process serves two purposes, it makes it look good and will prevent any chemical reactions that could lead to corrosion in your cooling system". Since these are made to fit 3/8" tubing, these reservoirs are very restrictive and will increase temps. Because of this, I won't be going with these. But I can see how these "might" cause trouble with your loop (adding harmful material). However, the XSPC radiators seem fine because the water isn't on "direct" contact with the bare aluminum.

Waterlogged

03-29-2010, 01:58 PM

Why exactly are these to "be avoided"? Do they add "stuff" to your loop? (Like delrin) I'm actually going with the XSPC Aluminum radiators, are those alright?

Aluminum + copper or brass = galvanic corrosion (which is very bad). Also, the thermal transfer of aluminum is lower than that of brass or copper which hurts performance, so I would seriously consider choosing some different rads.

BAH!, I hate edits.

GRUNTVILLE have a review of the reservoir and they say that "The annodization process serves two purposes, it makes it look good and will prevent any chemical reactions that could lead to corrosion in your cooling system". Since these are made to fit 3/8" tubing, these reservoirs are very restrictive and will increase temps. Because of this, I won't be going with these. But I can see how these "might" cause trouble with your loop (adding harmful material). However, the XSPC radiators seem fine because the water isn't on "direct" contact with the bare aluminum.

GRUNTVILLE is wrong about "The annodization process serves two purposes, it makes it look good and will prevent any chemical reactions that could lead to corrosion in your cooling system". The only type of anodizing that has a chance of delaying the process is hard coat anodizing and it needs to be 100% prefect for it to have a chance, which is rare. Hard coat is also much more expensive than standard ano which most companies feel isn't necessary for their bottom line enhancement.

Vinas

03-29-2010, 02:23 PM

penguins

03-29-2010, 03:03 PM

check check and check again to make sure parts aren't aluminum, or even cheap steal pieces, i remeber a post not to long ago here or another forum where someone got some bunk res screws that started rusting.if you're not sure i bet waterlogged can tell you if it's got aluminum in it : ).

you're going to want to make sure you're getting brass or copper everything bassically. nickle plated brass or copper, painted anodized brass or copper. that stuff

blazarcher

03-30-2010, 09:12 AM

Yup, do your homework before you start this or you'll be sorry in the long run. Stay away from mixed metals at all costs. If this is your first WC build then you've got your work cut out for you. Take it slow!!!
Yeah, I've heard from others that it's not good mixing metals in a single loop. But if you've got Feser One, it should be fine to mix some aluminum with copper??

My CPU Waterblock is Gold plated solid COPPER, the graphics cards will also be COPPER, the radiator is aluminum. The northbridge/southbridge waterblock is COPPER as well... Does that mean I should stick with COPPER throughout? Will the aluminum reservoir cause any problems in the long run? (XSPC)

And lastly what do you think about the triple DDC pumps... I saw a video of them running really LOUD because there were still some air bubbles left. How would I go about undervolting these?

blazarcher

03-30-2010, 09:17 AM

I've got a picture of the ALL COPPER Danger Den GTX480 waterblocks...
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/8514/8232834534ndrym1.jpg (http://img149.imageshack.us/i/8232834534ndrym1.jpg/)

Now I just hope they come out with a gold plated version to match with my CPU waterblock. In about 2 weeks after the ALL-COPPER version, the Nickel version will come out.

NaeKuh

03-30-2010, 11:19 AM

so make an uber expensive waterblock for an uber expensive card.

That all copper block wont be cheap, and a all nickle block will be more.

i think im really gonna wait for the revision on fermi.

blazarcher

03-30-2010, 03:40 PM

Even though I told myself that I will stick with a SINGLE loop because of the pressure/flow I can get from the three XSPC tops in one loop. However, one thing that keeps bothering me is the fact that the CPU will be vulnerable to the HEAT of the graphics cards... Would it be better going to 2 Seperate loops??? One for the CPU and the other for the northbridge/southbridge+the graphics cards?

Proximon

03-30-2010, 04:37 PM

Just another update, I've decided to ditch the Enermax PSU for the Silverstone Strider 1500W PSU. Not only does it cost 100 dollars more but it has 50% more capacity. NOW this is what I call serious future-proofing. Think I made a good choice? Let me know.

Marketing wins again.

Strider 1500W is capable of 110 amps on the 12V rail(s), the only thing that matters.

Enermax Galaxy Evo 1250 will put out 104 amps.

Antec TPQ-1200 ... rated for 100 amps

Here's a big list of 75+ amp PSUs, ranked and with links to reviews.
http://rankedpsulist.dabbledb.com/publish/rankedpsulist/16ade452-d856-4632-b18e-fb151c3280af/76ampsorhigher.html

blazarcher

03-30-2010, 05:39 PM

Marketing wins again.

Strider 1500W is capable of 110 amps on the 12V rail(s), the only thing that matters.

Enermax Galaxy Evo 1250 will put out 104 amps.

Antec TPQ-1200 ... rated for 100 amps

Here's a big list of 75+ amp PSUs, ranked and with links to reviews.
http://rankedpsulist.dabbledb.com/publish/rankedpsulist/16ade452-d856-4632-b18e-fb151c3280af/76ampsorhigher.html

Thanks for the link. When I buy PSU's I usually focus on their amperage and their build qualilty. The Silverstone wins hands down. Not to mention, it has the wattage for future products.

Now you might say that only amps matter.. But wattage also matters.. This is why I went for the Silverstone.

Waterlogged

03-31-2010, 01:44 AM

Yeah, I've heard from others that it's not good mixing metals in a single loop. But if you've got Feser One, it should be fine to mix some aluminum with copper??

My CPU Waterblock is Gold plated solid COPPER, the graphics cards will also be COPPER, the radiator is aluminum. The northbridge/southbridge waterblock is COPPER as well... Does that mean I should stick with COPPER throughout? Will the aluminum reservoir cause any problems in the long run? (XSPC)

And lastly what do you think about the triple DDC pumps... I saw a video of them running really LOUD because there were still some air bubbles left. How would I go about undervolting these?

Have you read this?

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=226632

I'm not saying it's guaranteed to happen but it is a risk you take by using any premix coolant.

As for the XSPC res (or any anodized aluminum for that matter) this,

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=77406&d=1209282982

is also a potential outcome when used in a loop that isn't 100% aluminum.

IMO, triple DDC top is a moronic joke, unless you plan on doing an uber geothermal type loop where you have 100+ feet of tubing/hardline, you don't need that kind of power. If your insistent on multiple pumps, go with 2 DDC 3.25's. They have almost 6 feet more total lift and generate a little over 2PSI more than the 3.2(355).

blazarcher

04-05-2010, 12:46 AM

Have you read this?

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=226632

I'm not saying it's guaranteed to happen but it is a risk you take by using any premix coolant.

As for the XSPC res (or any anodized aluminum for that matter) this,

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=77406&d=1209282982

is also a potential outcome when used in a loop that isn't 100% aluminum.

IMO, triple DDC top is a moronic joke, unless you plan on doing an uber geothermal type loop where you have 100+ feet of tubing/hardline, you don't need that kind of power. If your insistent on multiple pumps, go with 2 DDC 3.25's. They have almost 6 feet more total lift and generate a little over 2PSI more than the 3.2(355).

My god, that :banana::banana::banana::banana: is disgusting! I'm planning on using Feser One so this might be an issue. What should I do? Go with the Clear version or just use regular distilled water with some sort of additives?

I understand that Triple DDC might seem like a joke to some but I'm seriously considering undervolting these to about 10.5V. Dunno how I'd go about doing that but it should definitely be quieter than two 3.25's running at 12V.

I'm also a bit confused about the whole aluminum vs copper argument. Are you saying that I SHOULD go with ALL aluminum or just all COPPER? Basically I should stick with one or the other.

RCG_Bex

04-05-2010, 01:52 AM

blazarcher

04-05-2010, 12:37 PM

All copper - aluminum isn't as good - DO NOT MIX

I wouldn't bother yer backside with Feser, Potential to crack acrylic, heavily clog your blocks and is just nasty end of.

If you want colour, get coloured hosing and using distilled water and a silver kill koil. I've got PC Pure clear running in my rig atm until I can be bothered changing... EC6 clear is also very good.

~Bex
I really don't care if it has color or not lol if you haven't noticed I'm using black tubing... I'm ok with clear but I chose Feser One mainly because it offers better cooling than regular distilled water.

And if I do go with distilled water, wouldn't I need to add some sort of additives like HydroX or whatever it's called?

Waterlogged

04-05-2010, 12:54 PM

My god, that :banana::banana::banana::banana: is disgusting! I'm planning on using Feser One so this might be an issue. What should I do? Go with the Clear version or just use regular distilled water with some sort of additives?

I would go with distilled and PTNuke and/or Killcoil. There really is no guarantee that the colored Fester fluid won't gunk up the loop, and temps are likely to be a few degrees worse anyway. Every test I've seen comparing temps of Fester's fluid to other common coolants, the reviewer adds crap like water wetter to the distilled water to worsen it's performance and make the Fester stuff look better, even then, it usually comes out a draw.

I understand that Triple DDC might seem like a joke to some but I'm seriously considering undervolting these to about 10.5V. Dunno how I'd go about doing that but it should definitely be quieter than two 3.25's running at 12V.

There is very little difference between all the DDC models in the term of actual noise. The biggest change, which also isn't much, is the pitch of the different models. I re-visited your OP and honestly, I think 1 DDC 3.25 would be fine with your proposed loop.

I'm also a bit confused about the whole aluminum vs copper argument. Are you saying that I SHOULD go with ALL aluminum or just all COPPER? Basically I should stick with one or the other.

If your dead set on using a part that is aluminum (such as the XSPC res), then your better off going with an all aluminum setup...blocks, rad, res, fittings, etc., just be aware that your temps are really going to suffer. How do I know?...first hand experience. I built this system (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2847834&postcount=7698) a while ago as an experiment and was very disappointed with the results (so disappointed, it only lasted about 3 months before I switched it over to a real loop). I had set the temp warning in BIOS to 65°C and it would routinely go off while at Youtube watching videos. There was no OC on the CPU either. In short, your better off avoiding aluminum all together.

Copper, brass, nickel plate, gold all work well together and will give much better temps. It's also easier to find all the parts you'll need made of these materials as well.

Here's some other things I would change from your OP as well. Forget about the teflon tape, it's not meant to work with the thread style the fittings we use have. The Sunbeam pin extractor kit is junk, I have one and don't use it. This (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=60_143_272&products_id=894) is the best ATX pin extractor tool but it's a bit pricey. This (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=60_143_272&products_id=2964) is also a very good ATX pin extractor and is a bit more reasonably priced. It can also easily be used on floppy and 3 pin connectors as well, unlike the first one. I have both and use which ever one is closest at the time. For the 4 pin molex, I use one similar to this one (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=60_143_272&products_id=2076) though mine is from FrozenCPU.

blazarcher

04-07-2010, 02:17 PM

I would go with distilled and PTNuke and/or Killcoil. There really is no guarantee that the colored Fester fluid won't gunk up the loop, and temps are likely to be a few degrees worse anyway. Every test I've seen comparing temps of Fester's fluid to other common coolants, the reviewer adds crap like water wetter to the distilled water to worsen it's performance and make the Fester stuff look better, even then, it usually comes out a draw.

Really? I had no idea that reviewers would do that. Honestly the only reason I am not going with distiller water is because I'm not very good with measuring and determining the right amount of PTNuke or whatever additive I use, to mix with a liter of water for example. xD IF you were to recommend a concentration how much of each additive would you add to a liter of distilled water? Is PTNuke + Killcoil a good combination? Or should I just stick with one. I am really looking for the best performing/least maintenance requiring liquid/coolant. -- And on a side note, a lil' color wouldn't hurt either (Still, if it requires more frequent maintenance, I can live without it)

There is very little difference between all the DDC models in the term of actual noise. The biggest change, which also isn't much, is the pitch of the different models. I re-visited your OP and honestly, I think 1 DDC 3.25 would be fine with your proposed loop.

One DDC is enough? -- And I thought my setup is restrictive. Keep in mind that I will be adding an additional XSPC RX120 and two Aquagratix COPPER waterblocks.

I am thinking about going with maybe... 2... but I still think three is good.

BTW, I'd like to add in some Quick Disconnects.. I was thinking the Koolance VL3N due to its low drop in water flow yet it is a "no-spill" design. I have a question though... Kind of a noobie one but w.e. How exactly does it work? If I am going to connect two radiators for example and wanted to have the Quick Disconnects on both ends.. Would I have to use a female and a male connector for BOTH ends? Or would one male and one female connector be sufficient.

If your dead set on using a part that is aluminum (such as the XSPC res), then your better off going with an all aluminum setup...blocks, rad, res, fittings, etc., just be aware that your temps are really going to suffer. How do I know?...first hand experience. I built this system (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2847834&postcount=7698) a while ago as an experiment and was very disappointed with the results (so disappointed, it only lasted about 3 months before I switched it over to a real loop). I had set the temp warning in BIOS to 65°C and it would routinely go off while at Youtube watching videos. There was no OC on the CPU either. In short, your better off avoiding aluminum all together.

I've decided not to go with Aluminum... It's too much trouble lol. Instead of the XSPC Aluminum reservoir.. I was thinking of going with the FrozenQ liquid fusion reservoir. It's pricey yes.. But take a look at this...

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/5523/lfredglow01.jpg (http://img411.imageshack.us/i/lfredglow01.jpg/)

Copper, brass, nickel plate, gold all work well together and will give much better temps. It's also easier to find all the parts you'll need made of these materials as well.

I've decided that I am going ALL-COPPER. Unfortunately, they do have a tendency to get discolored. Is there a way to reduce this ill effect?

Here's some other things I would change from your OP as well. Forget about the teflon tape, it's not meant to work with the thread style the fittings we use have. The Sunbeam pin extractor kit is junk, I have one and don't use it. This (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=60_143_272&products_id=894) is the best ATX pin extractor tool but it's a bit pricey. This (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=60_143_272&products_id=2964) is also a very good ATX pin extractor and is a bit more reasonably priced. It can also easily be used on floppy and 3 pin connectors as well, unlike the first one. I have both and use which ever one is closest at the time. For the 4 pin molex, I use one similar to this one (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=60_143_272&products_id=2076) though mine is from FrozenCPU.

I also heard that the Sunbeam is junk lol. I took it out and am going with all three of those kits you recommended xD

Anyways.. Thanks a lot for your insight in watercooling. This is my first time and am a bit overwhelmed.. Well not really xD

On another note, I still have to wait another 1-2 weeks for them to restock on the radiators... *sigh This build seems like it will never finish.

blazarcher

04-07-2010, 02:27 PM

Alright well here's how my final setup will look like (after I get the GTX 480 and waterblocks of course).

Water Flow: FrozenQ Liquid Fusion Reservoir -> Dual/Triple XSPC DDC Acrylic Top -> Magicool Extreme 480mm Radiator -> Magicool Extreme 240mm Radiator -> EK Supreme HF GOLD CPU Waterblock -> EK X58 Classified Waterblock (Northbridge/SouthBridge) -> XSPC RX120 Radiator -> 2xGTX 480 Aquagratix Waterblocks (connected with Koolance SLI connector 3-4 slot) -> XSPC RX120 Radiator -> **Bitspower HDD Cooler** (Not sure about this out) -> Reservoir
Yeah its quite a lot of stuff... For a rough sketch take a look at this Vadim PC...

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/5396/13215iimg2915ii.jpg (http://img263.imageshack.us/i/13215iimg2915ii.jpg/)

Alright now for all my questions xD
This mainly concerns my placement of 90 degree elbows. I want to put 4-5 into my loop without any ill effect. Here's the places where I need them...
1. CPU OUT
2. Motherboard IN (1-2 because the radiator blocks room for a regular compression fitting)
3. Top GPU OUT for clean look
4. (last) Reservoir IN

Waterlogged

04-08-2010, 01:07 AM

Really? I had no idea that reviewers would do that. Honestly the only reason I am not going with distiller water is because I'm not very good with measuring and determining the right amount of PTNuke or whatever additive I use, to mix with a liter of water for example. xD IF you were to recommend a concentration how much of each additive would you add to a liter of distilled water? Is PTNuke + Killcoil a good combination? Or should I just stick with one. I am really looking for the best performing/least maintenance requiring liquid/coolant. -- And on a side note, a lil' color wouldn't hurt either (Still, if it requires more frequent maintenance, I can live without it)

Best mix would be to start the loop with 1-2 drops of PTNuke and have a killcoil inside the loop somewhere. Like that, when the drop(s) of Nuke fade out, the silver ion content from the coils would have been building up to do it's job. This setup is about as low maintenance as possible.

We've learned over time that Fester is only willing to hand out samples of their products to reviewers that will give their products favorable reviews, by whatever means necessary. Here are 2 such rigged reviews.

http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID=1704&pageID=7761 Not sure why this twit decided to try windshield washer fluid as a coolant but he did. I'm guessing it might have something to do with not being right in the head. :shrug:

http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/2008/02/16/watercooling_fluid_shootout/1

...and as far as non conductive claims, here's the truth about that (http://www.youtube.com/user/PTPetra#p/u/15/O-yT7cvfo3o).

One DDC is enough? -- And I thought my setup is restrictive. Keep in mind that I will be adding an additional XSPC RX120 and two Aquagratix COPPER waterblocks.

I am thinking about going with maybe... 2... but I still think three is good.

Well, I think 1 DDC 3.25 should be good enough to get you ~1GPM but 2 will be enough to pretty much guarantee 1.5GPM minimum.

BTW, I'd like to add in some Quick Disconnects.. I was thinking the Koolance VL3N due to its low drop in water flow yet it is a "no-spill" design. I have a question though... Kind of a noobie one but w.e. How exactly does it work? If I am going to connect two radiators for example and wanted to have the Quick Disconnects on both ends.. Would I have to use a female and a male connector for BOTH ends? Or would one male and one female connector be sufficient.

For each tube to part connection you want, you'll need 1 male and 1 female. . .so for each part (say a rad), you'll need 2 male and 2 female.

I've decided not to go with Aluminum... It's too much trouble lol. Instead of the XSPC Aluminum reservoir.. I was thinking of going with the FrozenQ liquid fusion reservoir. It's pricey yes.. But take a look at this...

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/5523/lfredglow01.jpg (http://img411.imageshack.us/i/lfredglow01.jpg/)

Good decision on the XSPC. As for the FrozenQ, meh...not really my style. Just beware, he has had a handful of res's that developed some problems. . .bad glue joints, damaged CCFL, etc. Most of which I recalling him taking care of.

I've decided that I am going ALL-COPPER. Unfortunately, they do have a tendency to get discolored. Is there a way to reduce this ill effect?

Nickel plating is the most common method. There is also stuff like Brasso and Tarn-X that you can rub onto the sides and non contact points of the bottom that will slow or prevent the oxidation process. You do not want to put it on any of the contact points or inside the water channel inside the block as it will hurt thermal transfer. Honestly though, the discoloration doesn't affect thermal transfer, so it boils down to a bling factor.

I also heard that the Sunbeam is junk lol. I took it out and am going with all three of those kits you recommended xD

Anyways.. Thanks a lot for your insight in watercooling. This is my first time and am a bit overwhelmed.. Well not really xD

On another note, I still have to wait another 1-2 weeks for them to restock on the radiators... *sigh This build seems like it will never finish.

The most important thing is no matter how long it feels like it's taking, never rush. Take your time setting up and you'll avoid having to RMA expensive stuff and wait even longer.;)

Is there a reason for the Magicool rads? Swiftech makes the sizes your after for a little cheaper and they work a little better, and more importantly, they're in stock. ;)

blazarcher

04-09-2010, 09:41 PM

Best mix would be to start the loop with 1-2 drops of PTNuke and have a killcoil inside the loop somewhere. Like that, when the drop(s) of Nuke fade out, the silver ion content from the coils would have been building up to do it's job. This setup is about as low maintenance as possible.

We've learned over time that Fester is only willing to hand out samples of their products to reviewers that will give their products favorable reviews, by whatever means necessary. Here are 2 such rigged reviews.

http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID=1704&pageID=7761 Not sure why this twit decided to try windshield washer fluid as a coolant but he did. I'm guessing it might have something to do with not being right in the head. :shrug:

http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/2008/02/16/watercooling_fluid_shootout/1

...and as far as non conductive claims, here's the truth about that (http://www.youtube.com/user/PTPetra#p/u/15/O-yT7cvfo3o).

Where would I place the killcoil? Here is a picture... (I don't exactly know how it functions xD, is it placed "inside" the loop?)

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/8217/sw10011.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/i/sw10011.jpg/)

Well, I think 1 DDC 3.25 should be good enough to get you ~1GPM but 2 will be enough to pretty much guarantee 1.5GPM minimum.

Doesn't a HIGHER flow rate equal MORE heat dissipation? And considering that probably with 2-3 GTX480 that heat would be more than 1KW. Going through all 4 radiators, all the waterblocks, that at LEAST 2 DDC 3.25 would be required? The way I see it, going with 2 is the minimum and going with three will allow for more flexibility in the future. And going with a HUGE 250mm reservoir will result in more time for ALL that water to cool down before having to go back through the loop.

Here is quote by skinnee @overclock...
"When you put two pumps in series, you're boosting the PQ curve way up (as seen in the charts above), the restriction of your loop or pressure drop moves further along the X or flow axis...translating into a higher flow rate for your loop."
And with a greater flow rate, equal more heat dissipation. So right now I'm thinking of either going with 2 or 3 (Pricing Aside of course, just all for performance).

For each tube to part connection you want, you'll need 1 male and 1 female. . .so for each part (say a rad), you'll need 2 male and 2 female.

What if I just had 2 male and 2 females in TOTAL for 2 radiators? The only part I'd replace would be simply whats between the radiators (So the QDC would connect to the OUT of one radiator and the IN on the other). In this case would one (male and female) QDC ends on EACH radiator be sufficient?

When I want to replace my graphics cards for example, I'd shut down the system. And unplug the tubing between the 2 radiators (and consequently the GPU blocks).

I really don't want to have QDC's everywhere because of their enormous size. It would really mess with the overall look of the system. Again, I'm aiming for this setup to be accepted at MDPC... Yeah I know a bit optimistic but spending 2500USD+ just on the watercooling setup+some uni-sleevings should be more than enough to look similar to those featured on their site. Damn sleeving those EXTRA LONG PSU cables of the Silverstone ST1500W PSU is gonna be A LOT of work. lol, I am also ordering uni-sleeving extensions for all my PSU cables just in case I get lazy.

Good decision on the XSPC. As for the FrozenQ, meh...not really my style. Just beware, he has had a handful of res's that developed some problems. . .bad glue joints, damaged CCFL, etc. Most of which I recalling him taking care of.

Wow, had no idea about all those problems with the reservoir. It seems to ooze quality although I could be wrong. What reservoir would you recommend? I'd like one similar to the Coolplex radiator but if I were to go with those, I'd need to go with RED fluid. And as discussed before, simply going with distiller water and a lil' additive is most optimal. -- Heh, this is why I went with the XSPC Aluminum radiator. I thought the aluminum wasn't in direct contact with the water so that it wouldn't cause any problems.

Is there a reason for the Magicool rads? Swiftech makes the sizes your after for a little cheaper and they work a little better, and more importantly, they're in stock. ;)

Well I checked the Swiftech radiators and they are much too big at 128mm. They need to be exactly 120mm. Unfortunately this means I can' fit XSPC radiators down there. However, these magicool radiators are better than the swiftech radiators @ low speeds. It's thickness is also much larger than the Swiftech's 34mm, at 45mm.

Waterlogged

04-10-2010, 01:30 AM

Where would I place the killcoil? Here is a picture... (I don't exactly know how it functions xD, is it placed "inside" the loop?)

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/8217/sw10011.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/i/sw10011.jpg/)

Inside the res or a tube would be fine.

Doesn't a HIGHER flow rate equal MORE heat dissipation? And considering that probably with 2-3 GTX480 that heat would be more than 1KW. Going through all 4 radiators, all the waterblocks, that at LEAST 2 DDC 3.25 would be required? The way I see it, going with 2 is the minimum and going with three will allow for more flexibility in the future. And going with a HUGE 250mm reservoir will result in more time for ALL that water to cool down before having to go back through the loop.

Here is quote by skinnee @overclock...
"When you put two pumps in series, you're boosting the PQ curve way up (as seen in the charts above), the restriction of your loop or pressure drop moves further along the X or flow axis...translating into a higher flow rate for your loop."
And with a greater flow rate, equal more heat dissipation. So right now I'm thinking of either going with 2 or 3 (Pricing Aside of course, just all for performance).

That's true, to a point. There is also the point of diminishing returns. This is the point where you start throwing absolutely ridiculous amounts of money at the loop and get very little drop in temps in return, for most ppl, this is ~1.5 GPM. On the graphs, this is the point where the line turns sort of flat.

What if I just had 2 male and 2 females in TOTAL for 2 radiators? The only part I'd replace would be simply whats between the radiators (So the QDC would connect to the OUT of one radiator and the IN on the other). In this case would one (male and female) QDC ends on EACH radiator be sufficient?

When I want to replace my graphics cards for example, I'd shut down the system. And unplug the tubing between the 2 radiators (and consequently the GPU blocks).

I really don't want to have QDC's everywhere because of their enormous size. It would really mess with the overall look of the system. Again, I'm aiming for this setup to be accepted at MDPC... Yeah I know a bit optimistic but spending 2500USD+ just on the watercooling setup+some uni-sleevings should be more than enough to look similar to those featured on their site. Damn sleeving those EXTRA LONG PSU cables of the Silverstone ST1500W PSU is gonna be A LOT of work. lol, I am also ordering uni-sleeving extensions for all my PSU cables just in case I get lazy.

If I'm understanding you correctly and everything else is between the rads, that would work. You should really talk to the master of QD's, NaeKuh. He had a topic a little over a year ago about QD's extolling their virtues. (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=217483):up:

Wow, had no idea about all those problems with the reservoir. It seems to ooze quality although I could be wrong. What reservoir would you recommend? I'd like one similar to the Coolplex radiator but if I were to go with those, I'd need to go with RED fluid. And as discussed before, simply going with distiller water and a lil' additive is most optimal. -- Heh, this is why I went with the XSPC Aluminum radiator. I thought the aluminum wasn't in direct contact with the water so that it wouldn't cause any problems.
Whoa, slow down there, I think you may have taken what I said a bit too seriously or little out of context (maybe both:shrug:). Frozen has had a few problems, maybe 7-8 total (IIRC) out of probably a 100+ (maybe more:shrug:) total units made. He's also been really good about his customer service responsibilities in those cases so if your still interested, go ahead and order one. :up:

Well I checked the Swiftech radiators and they are much too big at 128mm. They need to be exactly 120mm. Unfortunately this means I can' fit XSPC radiators down there. However, these magicool radiators are better than the swiftech radiators @ low speeds. It's thickness is also much larger than the Swiftech's 34mm, at 45mm.

Ah, gotcha. :up: Actually, I believe they're a little bit worse because they are more or less the old Black Ice Xtreme design which were pretty much one of the the first true designed for PC rads, second only to the Black Ice Pro (IIRC). You probably wouldn't notice a difference in performance though.

avddreamr

04-10-2010, 09:25 PM

blazarcher

04-14-2010, 03:54 PM

Inside the res or a tube would be fine.

lol so I just drop it in there and it'll do the rest? I'll probably have to replace it every year or so. Anyways, about the whole distiller water plus additives. How much would you put for ever liter... Would you only have to add a few drops? I still want to go with Feser One and I'm pretty sure it can't be THAT bad considering there are a lot more people using Feser One than simply distiller water.

That's true, to a point. There is also the point of diminishing returns. This is the point where you start throwing absolutely ridiculous amounts of money at the loop and get very little drop in temps in return, for most ppl, this is ~1.5 GPM. On the graphs, this is the point where the line turns sort of flat.

Well with 3 pumps how much flow do you think I'd pull out? Can't be that much higher than 1.5 GPM. Especially considering how big my loop is gonna be.

If I'm understanding you correctly and everything else is between the rads, that would work. You should really talk to the master of QD's, NaeKuh. He had a topic a little over a year ago about QD's extolling their virtues. (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=217483):up:

Sent NaeKuh a message, hope to get a reply soon.

Whoa, slow down there, I think you may have taken what I said a bit too seriously or little out of context (maybe both:shrug:). Frozen has had a few problems, maybe 7-8 total (IIRC) out of probably a 100+ (maybe more:shrug:) total units made. He's also been really good about his customer service responsibilities in those cases so if your still interested, go ahead and order one. :up:

Guess I'll go with the FrozenQ xD What would you get if you needed a large reservoir (not to be fit into ODD bays)?

:) Great news!! Turns out I can go ahead and purchase all this stuff... They re-stocked on everything including the radiators so I'm really happy. Gonna order the hardware first though with the motherboard/processor, ETC. I've decided to go with the Intel X25-E SSD. Let me know what you think!! -- Unfortunately, still gotta wait for EK to come out with 480 waterblocks. Gonna get those as soon as I sell these GTX 260's.
**No, wait... The fans are on back-order... DAMN**

Waterlogged

04-14-2010, 10:38 PM

lol so I just drop it in there and it'll do the rest? I'll probably have to replace it every year or so. Anyways, about the whole distiller water plus additives. How much would you put for ever liter... Would you only have to add a few drops? I still want to go with Feser One and I'm pretty sure it can't be THAT bad considering there are a lot more people using Feser One than simply distiller water.

Yep

Nope, it'll probably last longer than you'll live.

I covered this in the beginning of post #28

The majority of ppl that have been around the water cooling block a time or two use distilled water. We've all done the dye/special coolant thing and have all found it to be not worth the headaches or cost.

Well with 3 pumps how much flow do you think I'd pull out? Can't be that much higher than 1.5 GPM. Especially considering how big my loop is gonna be.

Probably not much more with the extra pump. It's your loop, if you want 3 pumps go ahead, I'm just saying that IMO, it isn't worth the extra money. It may also not be worth the extra heat dump into the loop.

Guess I'll go with the FrozenQ xD What would you get if you needed a large reservoir (not to be fit into ODD bays)?

Ek multioption or Koolance Inline V2 work well. I prefer the Koolance because their mounting systems attaches to the ends of the res and then to a fan and doesn't risk scratching the tube part of the res.

:) Great news!! Turns out I can go ahead and purchase all this stuff... They re-stocked on everything including the radiators so I'm really happy. Gonna order the hardware first though with the motherboard/processor, ETC. I've decided to go with the Intel X25-E SSD. Let me know what you think!! -- Unfortunately, still gotta wait for EK to come out with 480 waterblocks. Gonna get those as soon as I sell these GTX 260's. Re-post your full list so we can double check it and make sure your not forgetting anything important.

blazarcher

04-16-2010, 07:36 PM

Yep

Nope, it'll probably last longer than you'll live.

I covered this in the beginning of post #28

The majority of ppl that have been around the water cooling block a time or two use distilled water. We've all done the dye/special coolant thing and have all found it to be not worth the headaches or cost.

K, so I won't be going for any special coolants. I'll get 2 liters of distilled water. And add 4 drops of HydroX. I'll get 2 liters even though I really only need one for maintenance. And as you know, the water will eventually run out so yea...

Probably not much more with the extra pump. It's your loop, if you want 3 pumps go ahead, I'm just saying that IMO, it isn't worth the extra money. It may also not be worth the extra heat dump into the loop.
Now that you mention it, the extra heat dump won't be worth a lil' extra flow. I really only wanted to go with 3 because it looks better.. Guess I'll stick with 2. Will this still provide over 1.5 GPM considering how many things this loop will go through?

EK multioption or Koolance Inline V2 work well. I prefer the Koolance because their mounting systems attaches to the ends of the res and then to a fan and doesn't risk scratching the tube part of the res.

I've decided to go with the Frozen Q because of the LED's inside. Although that koolance v2 looks really good, with distiller water, it won't look all that great. Still paying double for a reservoir with LED's isn't exactly a good buy.

RE-post your full list so we can double check it and make sure your not forgetting anything important.

Yeah I'm gonna post the Hardware and H20 supplies seperately.

UPDATE** Ignore what I said about going with 2 pumps instead of 3. If you think about it these pumps each only output 18W. What difference will 18W really make when I'm cooling hardware that have a potential power draw of well over 900W??

blazarcher

04-16-2010, 07:42 PM

EVERYTHING IS IN STOCK. But before buying, I wanna make sure that I'm getting the right stuff... First the hardware...

SAMSUNG Spinpoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive
Item #: N82E16822152185
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
$89.99

SILVERSTONE ST1500 1500W ATX 12V 2.3 & EPS 12V SLI Ready 80 PLUS SILVER Certified Active PFC Power Supply
Item #: N82E16817256054
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
$20.00 Mail-in Rebate
$399.99

LITE-ON SK-1688U/B Black USB Wired Standard Keyboard
Item #: N82E16823107128
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
$6.99

GIGABYTE GM-M6880 Metal Black USB Wired Laser Gaming Mouse
Item #: N82E16826146010
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
$19.99

MASSCOOL G751 Shin-Etsu Thermal Interface Material
Item #: N82E16835150080
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
$4.99

Patriot Viper 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model PVT36G1600LLK
Item #: N82E16820220363
Return Policy: Memory Standard Return Policy
$20.00 Mail-in Rebate
$193.99

Link Depot SCW-10-BK 10 Pack of Black Anodized Thumbscrews
Item #: N82E16811989004
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
$8.97
($2.99 each)

EVGA E760 CLASSIFIED "Overclocker's Pick" 3-Way SLI + PhysX 1366 Intel X58 EATX Intel Motherboard
Item #: N82E16813188048
Return Policy: Limited Replacement Only Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
-$20.00 Instant
$419.99
$399.99

Intel Core i7-930 Bloomfield 2.8GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Model BX80601930
Item #: N82E16819115225
Return Policy: CPU Replacement Only Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
-$5.00 Instant
$294.99
$289.99

Intel X25-E Extreme SSDSA2SH032G1 2.5" 32GB SATA II SLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) - OEM
Item #: N82E16820167013
Return Policy: Limited Replacement Only Return Policy

Gonna run the X25-E as the boot drive and have all my stuff on the Spinpoint. BTW I went with the F3 because it's a lot quieter than the 2TB Caviar Black which is what I was GOING to go with. Anyways, I went with 930 because its a great overclocker, and patriot memory because its really different from corsair. Everyone is buying corsair so I decided to be a lil' unique. Also considering their memory is made in the USA and have lifetime warranty, this really is the :banana::banana::banana::banana: xD

Went with E760 Classified because of the EK waterblock that it is compatible with. Really expensive but I have a feeling Core i7 will be around for another 2-3 years.

1500W overkill?? I don't think so.. 3 GTX480 = 900W + CPU and that's well over 1200W on load. So yeah, also it's black glossy surface compliments my case's styling.

Gonna use my old hardware as another computer so got some cheap ol' keyboard and mouse for it. Already got a monitor for 'em too.

Wondering where the GTX 480 is? It's coming xD Gonna order it together with some new EK waterblocks or maybe the Aqua Computer blocks.. Gonna wait for a comparison to come out before I do anything...

**EDIT** Going with the OCZ Vertex Limited Edition instead of the X-25E due to it's superior SandForce platform. Dunno how long it will last though. Definitely not as long as the X-25E. Pricing stays around the same.

blazarcher

04-16-2010, 07:49 PM

I guess your all eager on seeing what is to come as to the Liquid Cooling hardware.. Well here it is.

Total Items: 167 Weight: 117.7lbs Amount: $2,714.93

K, I'm just gonna show the important stuff...

Frozen Q Liquid Fusion Reservoir 250ml

XSPC Triple Acrylic Top w/ 3 DDC 3.25 Pumps

Magicool Xtreme 240mm Radiator

Magicool Xtreme 480mm Radiator

Magicool Xtreme 360mm Radiator

EK Supreme HF Gold Plated CPU waterblock

EK X58 Classified SLI waterblock

XSPC RX120 Radiator

**FUTURE WHEN AVAILABLE**
*EK Gold Plated GPU Waterblock For GTX 480*

XSPC RX120 Radiator

Bitspower Acetal/Silver Top HDD waterblock

Then all back to the res.

If you can't tell already, this is how my water will flow.

I'm going with distiller water with 3 drops of HydrX per 1 liter of water.

NOTE: QDC will be placed between the two RX120 Radiators so when I replace my GPU's I won't have to drain the whole system. Other than that, I shouldn't have to do much maintenance besides polishing the Gold Plated Copper every now and then.

I'm going with 1/2" ID and 3/4" OD with 1/8" wall -- Primoflex PRO LRT Black Tubing with Primochill Clear Anti-Kink Coils.

Sub-Total: $2,714.93 (Some other stuff not mentioned...) What a coincidence, I was born in 93'... 117.7 items... Hmm.. 117, Spartan 117 anyone? xD

Yeah a lot of stuff and did you see the price? lol. This is well worth the money because most of it won't be replaced in the future including the CPU block. Anyways, ignore a few things such as the Lian Li case. That's where I'll put my old stuff in. Also went with those custom RAM sinks because all them "million dollar PC's" have that same one. Still not sure about the HDD block. Will it increase the noise of my hard drive?

*Bad News* They are out of the Blacknoise Noiseblocker Multiframe S-Series M12-S3 73 CFM... All I needed was 11!!!!!

Took out the 360mm radiator, MIGHT add it in the future. But right now gonna keep my build simple.

blazarcher

04-16-2010, 07:56 PM

First time using AutoCAD so ignore my crappy sketch of my PC and the path of the loop. Note the ATX area there is a CPU at the bottom, and two GPU's above that. Also, bottom right is the PSU which is limiting my radiator setup in the lower portion of the case to a 480mm and a 240mm. Note at the top left I've got an RX120 radiator there. It won't be getting any airflow though but it should help a lil' with cooling all the hardware. Finally the northbridge/southbridge waterblock isn't very clear. Basically underneath one of the RX120 there is an IN where I'll have a 90 degree fitting. And where you see the line coming out from the middle, well that's the OUT of the waterblock going straight to the RX120. Note the QDC's, one coming out of the first RX120 and the second one at the IN of the 2nd RX120.

Not very clear but the reservoir isn't all that big so the QDC of the 2nd RX120 won't be in the way as the reservoir will be positioned right under it.

Do you guys think I should go ahead and purchase the EK waterblock for the GTX480's before any actual reviews? They make top quality stuff and trust them with my money. Or should I wait and see what WaterCool and Aqua Computers are coming out with?

http://pdfcast.org/pdf/iojfoi

Its a .pdf but just download take a gander and delete if necessary xD

blazarcher

04-16-2010, 08:18 PM

Just wondering if anyone knew what sort of GPU waterblocks these are. They look like they have a gold plated or copper base and plexi or stainless steel on the top but not sure..

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/289/03006.jpg (http://img180.imageshack.us/i/03006.jpg/)

http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/3795/03012.jpg (http://img693.imageshack.us/i/03012.jpg/)
They look like the Koolance VID-387 for the Radeon 3870. Was wondering if something like this will come out for the GTX 480's. I hate Koolance so I was thinking about the Plexi/Copper version of the EK GTX 480 waterblocks. How in the world would I get them gold plated??

Waterlogged

04-16-2010, 09:13 PM

I see a fair bit of wasted cash and some blatant disregard of advise you said you'd take. :rolleyes:

I give up because I don't enjoy :brick:

blazarcher

04-17-2010, 05:18 AM

I see a fair bit of wasted cash and some blatant disregard of advise you said you'd take. :rolleyes:

I give up because I don't enjoy :brick:

What do you mean xD I took all your advice. Went with distilled water with some Swiftech HydrX. Then I took out that aluminum reservoir for the FrozenQ. the only thing I don't think I took into consideration was the dual pump idea. I remember seeing a review of the XSPC Dual DDC Acrylic Top and the GPM that it was pulling out for just going through a single radiator wasn't THAT high.

Anyways, I pretty much followed all your advice. This is my first time watercooling thats why I posted this for some advice.

And the only reason why some of the stuff aren't updated on the cart is because they aren't available.

blazarcher

04-17-2010, 05:22 AM

If you are going to spend 2,000.... you might want to talk to a builder on one of the forums. Your money may even go further with them.
I hear Charles at MurderMod.. does exceptional work :)
In a TJ-07 ... bottom area, 480+ 240 + PSU+ pump (maybe)
Top mounted swiftech mcr 320.
Mesh panel instead of plexi... You'll have plenty of air flow.

1500w psu.... at 88% eff, you're looking at 1704 watts at the wall. Assuming you can get 120volts from your electrical system you would need 14.6 amps just for the psu.
Usually most house holds only get 110-115volts. You'll need a dedicated line... :)

Good luck

I've always thought of asking around from builders but no one seems to do mods with a Lian Li V2100B. And even if they did, they wouldn't have the case and that would mean me having to ship it over. And since I lost the packaging xD It'll be a lot of trouble on my part. Plus I like to do things myself xD I get the right to say, you know, I made this.

But if you know anyone who does single sleeving for PSU's maybe then can give me some advice or help me out with sleeving these REALLY LONG cables.

blazarcher

04-23-2010, 01:30 PM

Yeah well right now the problem is having enough money to go through with this build. I'll be spending 5K+ for the Watercooling and the Core i7 upgrade.

Anyways I'm still debating whether I should go with the Aquagrafx or the EK GTX 480 waterblock. The Aquagrafx looks better in my opinion and even has the voltage regulators in the back covered. However EK always seem to push ahead in terms of cooling capabilities. Anyways here are some pictures of the two...
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/6159/aquagrafxgtx4801.jpg (http://img249.imageshack.us/i/aquagrafxgtx4801.jpg/)
http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/8112/aquagrafxgtx4808.jpg (http://img689.imageshack.us/i/aquagrafxgtx4808.jpg/)
Pretty thin block too, perfect for heat transfer.
http://img697.imageshack.us/img697/5161/aquagrafxgtx4809.jpg (http://img697.imageshack.us/i/aquagrafxgtx4809.jpg/)
Even has cooling for voltage regulators on the back! Can't get that on an EK.

And the EK...
http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/1764/fc480gtxacetalfront1w.jpg (http://img682.imageshack.us/i/fc480gtxacetalfront1w.jpg/)
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/6240/ekfc480acetalcopperdeta.jpg (http://img227.imageshack.us/i/ekfc480acetalcopperdeta.jpg/)
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/4473/ekfc480acetalnickeldeta.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/i/ekfc480acetalnickeldeta.jpg/)

If I were to go with the EK, which version should I get?

blazarcher

04-25-2010, 08:58 AM

bump...

blazarcher

04-27-2010, 11:40 AM

I'm planning on adding ANOTHER 360mm radiator right on top of the 480mm Magicool radiator. Here is a picture of how it'll look.

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/193/v2100a02.jpg (http://img32.imageshack.us/i/v2100a02.jpg/)

The red is the 480mm, the blue is the 240mm right underneath.
The yellow represents the 360mm that will be in front of the 480 rad.
The light green is the reservoir where water will travel to the [GREY] Triple DDC Pump -> [BLUE] 240mm RAD -> [RED] 480mm RAD -> [YELLOW] 360mm RAD

If I am going to go with this setup, the water will flow like this: Res [Light Green] -> Pump -> [GREY] Triple DDC Pump -> [BLUE] 240mm RAD -> [RED] 480mm RAD -> [YELLOW] 360mm RAD -> CPU Waterblock -> [BLACK] 120mm RAD -> 2 GPU Waterblocks (at the top) -> [BLACK] 120mm RAD -> [DARK RED] HDD waterblock -> Back to RES [LIGHT GREEN]

Yea that's a lot of things for the water to go through. This is why I've decided to go with 3 DDC 3.25's.

Remember this is a BTX case. So motherboard is inverted.

blazarcher

04-27-2010, 11:42 AM

I NEED my side panels to be cut exactly like this...
http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/2903/10758texternalresized.jpg (http://img99.imageshack.us/i/10758texternalresized.jpg/)

I'm thinking Smok'd plexi...

Was wondering where I can get this done here in the US. I'm willing to spend 200-300 dollars for this job.

blazarcher

04-27-2010, 11:48 AM

Here is another picture of how the case's exterior should look like.
http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/3738/dsc00311vu.jpg (http://img714.imageshack.us/i/dsc00311vu.jpg/)

The flames will provide plenty of airflow for the 3 radiators down there.

blazarcher

04-27-2010, 12:13 PM

Here is a rough sketch of the water loop...
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/3035/11572iinternalresized.jpg (http://img13.imageshack.us/i/11572iinternalresized.jpg/)

Damn that's alot of tubing. Does 10FT of tubing seem enough?

NOTE the 120.1 radiator in the ODD area looks too big. But I measured 6.3" and it took up more than half of the ODD area. Don't really like how the tubing from the last 120.1 rad has to travel all the way down to the HDD block. I'll probably hide it behind the reservoir or something.

Anyways, if you look closely at the TOP GPU, what exactly is that fitting? It's not a 90 degree fitting...

And almost forgot, the WHITE rectangles are where I'll be placing Koolance VL3N Quick Disconnects (1 male and 1 female each). These 3 strategically placed QDC's will allow me to replace the CPU and the GPU with ease. And if needed I can even replace the WHOLE MOTHERBOARD when LGA2011 comes out next year. All this without having to drain the PC. Yes, I am a bit lazy xD

Shoggy

04-28-2010, 12:56 PM

Should be an adapter like that one:

http://shop.aquacomputer.de/images/product_images/info_images/90053.jpg

avddreamr

04-28-2010, 02:41 PM

I've always thought of asking around from builders but no one seems to do mods with a Lian Li V2100B. And even if they did, they wouldn't have the case and that would mean me having to ship it over. And since I lost the packaging xD It'll be a lot of trouble on my part. Plus I like to do things myself xD I get the right to say, you know, I made this.

But if you know anyone who does single sleeving for PSU's maybe then can give me some advice or help me out with sleeving these REALLY LONG cables.

Honestly, if you think spending 100 dollars at a ups store to have it packed and sent to a competent builder, when you are spending 5k on a build.... is to much... then man .. there may be no point in advising you. But if you want to do it yourself, we learn best by doing.

The thing is, when you do a but load of research, you get obsessed with an idea, and with that obsession you ignore sensible advice.

I noticed that now you want to mount yet another rad in the case, where is the air flow going to come from?

BTW you will gain NOTHING ZIP ZILCH from three PUMPS, except heat dump, power consumption, noise, and a bunch of other undesirable things.
Take a look at vapors test, and temp vs flow rate on any block you may be looking at.. .above a certain point, there is nothing worthwhile gained, or what is gained, is within measurement errors, in other words statistically insignificant. Let say the gain is 1c, you gain as much from having one pump, and using indigo extreme instead of shin-etzu !
It happens that the best block, right now, is also one of the least restrictive.

My advice, dual loop, 3 radiators.
One top mounted quad rad ala koolance, (it works and it looks alot nicer with mesh instead of wire grills) for the cpu/chipset.
Two rads on the bottom, maybe quad rads, exhausting air, drawing air from the bottom of the case, a but load of gt-14 fans, and some aquacomputer gear to manage the mess.
Even a dual 140 mounted on top with just a standard rad grill will do the trick for the cpu.
At 4ghz you are probably looking at 200-250watts worse case scenario heatdump.

Blocks, basically EK.
Do tri-sli + phsx (gts 250, or 240)
I would put the phsyx card at the begining of the gpu loop for the lowest heat dump.
Two quad rads will more than take care of the heat.

Distilled water, biocide, silver kill coils, bp true silver components.
Pick which ever Res suit your fancy, but pick two. The bling is nice, but you may run into reliability issues.

Also... try.. KISS!! Keep it Simple ...

Hell you might even just send your case to origin. Let them do it, warranty it, etc!
But if you must spend 2 grand on w/c, you have to realize that you are going far beyond the point of diminishing returns.

How are you going to manage, and control your system? Are you planing to buy an aquaero, mcubed, or koolance monitoring system?

It's more important to make sure the rads that you do use are getting the right amount of airflow, not so much shoving as many rads as possible.

good luck with your build, i'm sure you will learn from it, and benifit from the experience. However don't be surprised if you end up having buyers remorse.

Truthfully, I'm sure that you could get by with 1 quad for the gpus, and a dual/triple for the cpu/mosfets. You're going to have a hell of time building everything, reserve a weekend and a case of 5 hour energy.

blazarcher

04-29-2010, 03:14 PM

Honestly, if you think spending 100 dollars at a ups store to have it packed and sent to a competent builder, when you are spending 5k on a build.... is to much... then man .. there may be no point in advising you. But if you want to do it yourself, we learn best by doing.

Yeah the truth is I just want to do it myself and learn from the experience.

The thing is, when you do a but load of research, you get obsessed with an idea, and with that obsession you ignore sensible advice.

You are so right!!! I've been obsessing over this setup. I've completely ignored the main purpose of watercooling!! It's for silence! Why should I go with three pumps when two will be QUIETER. And adding another rad on the bottom! That might be too much. It would be much louder going from 8->11 fans.

I noticed that now you want to mount yet another rad in the case, where is the air flow going to come from?

My advice, dual loop, 3 radiators.
One top mounted quad rad ala koolance, (it works and it looks alot nicer with mesh instead of wire grills) for the cpu/chipset.
Two rads on the bottom, maybe quad rads, exhausting air, drawing air from the bottom of the case, a but load of gt-14 fans, and some aquacomputer gear to manage the mess.
Even a dual 140 mounted on top with just a standard rad grill will do the trick for the cpu.
At 4ghz you are probably looking at 200-250watts worse case scenario heatdump.

The thing is, a top mounted quad radiator is gonna look kinda ugly. I've seen many watercooling setups while browsing the forum and never found one that looks good with a Koolance EXO's for example, mounted on the top.

Blocks, basically EK.
Do tri-sli + phsx (gts 250, or 240)
I would put the phsyx card at the begining of the gpu loop for the lowest heat dump.
Two quad rads will more than take care of the heat.

Distilled water, biocide, silver kill coils, bp true silver components.
Pick which ever Res suit your fancy, but pick two. The bling is nice, but you may run into reliability issues.

Also... try.. KISS!! Keep it Simple ...

Heh, funny you mention keeping it simple yet recommending I go with two seperate loops.. Meaning 2 seperate pumps... res.. etc xD How does a single loop sound?

Hell you might even just send your case to origin. Let them do it, warranty it, etc!
But if you must spend 2 grand on w/c, you have to realize that you are going far beyond the point of diminishing returns.

Like I said earlier, I'd like to do this myself xD

How are you going to manage, and control your system? Are you planing to buy an aquaero, mcubed, or koolance monitoring system?

Glad you mentioned that, I'll be going with an mcubed to control fan speeds and ?pumps?

It's more important to make sure the rads that you do use are getting the right amount of airflow, not so much shoving as many rads as possible.

In the case of fitting a 360mm radiator over a 480mm radiator, wouldn't mesh on both side panels serve as enough airflow?

good luck with your build, i'm sure you will learn from it, and benifit from the experience. However don't be surprised if you end up having buyers remorse. [/QUOTE

Ah buyers remorse, the only remorse I get is when I upgrade videos cards and they become outdated. The only reason why I wouldn't feel buyers remorse in this case because this stuff won't need to be replaced.

Truthfully, I'm sure that you could get by with 1 quad for the gpus, and a dual/triple for the cpu/mosfets. You're going to have a hell of time building everything, reserve a weekend and a case of 5 hour energy.

But how does a 480mm, 240mm, and 2x120mm radiator seem for a single loop consisting of a CPU, North+Southbridge, Mosfets, and 2 GPU's?

----
Hey man thanks a lot for the advice. I'll definitely be making a few changes to my setup.

blazarcher

04-29-2010, 04:50 PM

CHECK BELOW FOR UPDATE! My setup has changed drastically!

Alright here is an update to the watercooling setup:

FrozenQ Liquid Fusion 250ml Reservoir Side Port Edition <-- One question for this, does it matter where the water enters from?

XSPC Dual DDC Clear Acrylic Top

Magicool Xtreme 240mm Radiator

Magicool Xtreme 480mm Radiator *Koolance QDC OUT

EK Supreme HF Gold Edition Block *90 degree adapter out

EK X58 Classified Full Board Northbridge/Southbridge Water Block

XSPC RX Series 120mm Radiator *Koolance QDC OUT

2x EK-FC480 Waterblocks *90 degree adapter OUT

XSPC RX Series 120mm Radiator *Koolance QDC IN

Bitspower HDD Acetal+Nickel Top Water Block

Back to res with that adapter thing Shoggy mentioned (thanks man!)

*NOTE - All items above are in order of how water will flow starting from the res and going back of course

That must've covered everything...
Gonna be using a mcubed to maintain low fan speeds.
Gonna order some NZXT Single Sleeved extension cables, not gonna sleeve them myself. Maybe after the build is finished...

Going to use PrimoFlex Pro LRT Black Tubing -1/2in. ID X 3/4in. OD with PrimoChill Anti-Kink Coils - Clear

Also, 20 of these Bitspower Premium G1/4" Black Sparkle High Flow 1/2" Compression Fitting (For Tygon 1/2" ID). A few extras of course xD

Planning to mount the Dual Pumps vertically right in front of the Magicool 240mm Radiator (just to the right of the inlet) on top of some AcoustiPack™ EXTRA - Foam Blocks Soundproofing Material. Should reduce noise but am worried about heat buildup. Also planning on mounting the OCZ Vertex 2 SSD on the middle 5 1/4" bay (facing outwards) with a (UN)Designs X Bracket Vertical Rev 1. Finally gonna use this Lian Li PC-343B Radiator Brackets to mount one of the XSPC 120mm radiators in the upper portion of the ODD area. This radiator won't be getting much air flow I know, but it's only there to help me manage the tubing (and have it routed nicely).

Some other stuff as well.
Gonna mount that BP HDD block in one of the lower 5 1/4" bays with this SilenX 5.25" Luxurae Hard Drive Cooler and Silencing Solution. Not sure how good it'll do but should be sufficient. Just thinking also to keep the Dual Pumps up with a (UN)Designs Infinite Pump Bracket (for DDC pumps) - Vertical Version.
A few other things... A Koolance Drain Valve (1/2") mounted somewhere at the bottom of the case, AND finally, three sets of Koolance QDC (High Flow) No-Spill Shutoff, Male + female [For ID: 13mm (1/2"); OD: 19mm (3/4")] These are the Koolance VL3N versions which feature a NO-Spill design (a bit more restrictive though).

The fans that I'll be using, 8x Blacknoise Noiseblocker Multiframe S-Series M12-S3 73 CFM. Expensive fans at 23 a pop but feature the least noise at 12V. Won't be running at those speeds but the possibility is there.

I think that covers everything...
All parts are coming from Performance-PCS. I heard that they only have a handful of employees, hope they don't get the order messed up.

**See some MSI GTX 480's available, gonna get 'em ASAP**

Church

04-29-2010, 06:09 PM

blazarcher

04-29-2010, 06:55 PM

I would swap NB multiframes to undervolted gentle typhoons. GT-s do better then NBs on blowing through air restrictive things like rads. Should cost less aswell. I'm gonna buy noisblockers myself for my future build, but only because there are no gentle typhoons of 140mm size :(

But Gentle Typhoons are so UGLY xD I do care a bit about looks too you know. I'll definitely give it a thought, those Gt's are quiet! They have an amazing noise to CFM ratio too.

blazarcher

04-30-2010, 12:08 PM

Alright, just an aesthetics question, should I go with the EK Acetal Waterblock or the EK Acetel+Nickel Waterblock. They both would look good but bare copper itself doesn't look THAT good. I was thinking if I went with the Acetal, I can get the copper gold plated in the future. But if I opted for the Acetal+Nickel, it would look nice but if I wanted to get it gold plated, the Nickel would have to be removed at an extra cost.

http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/1764/fc480gtxacetalfront1w.jpg (http://img682.imageshack.us/i/fc480gtxacetalfront1w.jpg/)

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/4473/ekfc480acetalnickeldeta.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/i/ekfc480acetalnickeldeta.jpg/)

avddreamr

04-30-2010, 10:47 PM

blazarcher

05-01-2010, 08:39 AM

It might be better to stick to nickel, gold plating might become a fad, and in the future it might be harder to match aesthetically.

But gold is bling! heh. Hey did you check out shaza's build on the work logs... It's a tagan case very similar to yours.... check it out.

Yeah funny you mention that, I was just checking out shaza's build. Love the red and black contrast. Matches that mobo very well.

blazarcher

05-01-2010, 10:34 PM

Sorry about the relatively "boring" posts, this thread has ALL been about planning.. and LOTS of it. So far things look good... If anyone has any other advice, let me know before I go ahead and place my order.

And for pricing... We're looking at 3K for the hardware and another 3K for the watercooling setup. It's actually a lil' under 6 grand. But damn 6 grand, that's about the most I've ever spent on a computer build. :shocked:

misho

05-01-2010, 11:21 PM

I would go with distilled and PTNuke and/or Killcoil.

Hmm, if you use silver fittings, do you still need the coil , ptnuke??

Thanks

blazarcher

05-02-2010, 06:30 AM

Hmm, if you use silver fittings, do you still need the coil , ptnuke??

Thanks

Well you don't really need ptnuke if you go with the killcoil. But having both will minimize algae buildup. --- Mind you, using silver fittings doesn't affect your WATER whatsoever. The fittings aren't even in CONTACT with the water.

blazarcher

05-02-2010, 06:38 AM

I'm so confused! -- Now we've got a 50/50 tie. I want to go with 2 3.25's.... If anyone voted for 3, let me know why you think I should go with three.

On another note, I've been thinking a lot about going with two separate loops. I don't want 2 GTX 480's to ruin my CPU temperatures. But now I need to think about how the loop is gonna look.

I was thinking the huge Magicool 480mm radiator and one of the XSPC RX120's for the CPU.

Then the Magicool 240mm and the other XSPC RX120 for the 2 GTX 480's. Mind you, the GPU's will have a much higher temperature as the RX120 that I'll be using won't have much airflow.

If I was going down this path, I'd have a single 3.25 for each loop.

**Advantages of Single Loop**
- Better loop routing
- Less clutter
**Advantages of Dual Loop**
- Isolating heat = Better CPU temps

--------- Not a LOT of advantages with dual loop -------------
Anyone have other thoughts?

avddreamr

05-02-2010, 07:19 PM

I'm uncertain if there will be any benefit of a single 120mm radiator over high end air cooling.
The key benefit if having more fans exposed closer to a source of air, than they wood otherwise, or at least that is how i have come to understand it.

Waterlogged

05-02-2010, 09:01 PM

Well you don't really need ptnuke if you go with the killcoil. But having both will minimize algae buildup. --- Mind you, using silver fittings doesn't affect your WATER whatsoever. The fittings aren't even in CONTACT with the water.

:slap:

Do you think the water magically transfers from the block/res/rad to the tubing?. . .Of course the water touches to fittings. :rolleyes:

This really does deserve a clip from Billy Madison but I don't need another slap for using it. . .again.;)

blazarcher

05-02-2010, 09:10 PM

:slap:

Do you think the water magically transfers from the block/res/rad to the tubing?. . .Of course the water touches to fittings. :rolleyes:

This really does deserve a clip from Billy Madison but I don't need another slap for using it. . .again.;)

Heh, I guess giving it a bit more thought, the water would probably be in contact with just the small bit of the fitting (the barb part). But I don't think it would make a big difference using different fittings. I'm really not seeing the point of even talking about this xD BP compression fittings FTW

heh, Waterlogged, it's great to see you back!! Did you come back because you saw that I abandoned the Triple DDC idea? xD j/k

blazarcher

05-03-2010, 02:30 PM

Taking some ideas from shazza :D, I'm gonna be ditching those magicool radiators. Rather than simply fit a 480mm and a 240mm radiator in the lower compartment, I'd like to fit 2 monstrous 154mm high radiators almost in a stacked configuration. Simply mounting the Silverstone ST1500 "up" rather than having it laying down will leave me with exactly 154mm of headroom. This will allow me to fit even a TFC Monsta Radiator! The dimensions are as stated... 476 X 148.6 X 104.2. So length-wise, minus 476 from 510 still gives me 34mm of room. And considering the 154mm that is given to me, height-wise, 148.6mm isn't too bad. But damn 104.2 for the width!!! That's almost twice the size of a RX480! And given that the case is 210mm's thick, 104.2x2 yields 208.4 So only 1.6mm of clearance!

So now I can ONLY place one Monsta radiator down there. BTW, look at this!
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/8664/x1071.jpg (http://img153.imageshack.us/i/x1071.jpg/)

Well even with one Monsta, that should offer me better performance than those two magicool radiators, I mean it even beats the Mora 2 Pro! And that is equipped with 9 120mm fans!!! And that's with the Monsta ONLY being equipped with 3x140mm sharkoon fans.

So if I were to go with this setup, what sort of fans would you guys recommend for silent purposes. --- And on that note, will it even be possible to run the fans @1000-1500rpm with adequate airflow considering the radiator's immense thickness?

blazarcher

05-03-2010, 03:25 PM

Heh that is one massive radiator!! I don't even think I can buy them as they seem out of stock everywhere... Are there any other radiators that people would like to recommend? Ideally, I'd like to place 2 massive 480mm/420mm/360mm variant radiators in an almost stacked configuration where I'd have fans intaking cool air from both sides and the hot air would then travel to the back of the case and would be sucked up by the Silverstone ST1500w PSU's 135mm? fan and finally, exhausted out the back.
*NOTE there will be optimal room between the radiators for air to "escape" to and also this room provides a neat place to hide the Dual DDC pump xD

The way I see it, as long as I get these side panels cut properly, I shouldn't have much of a problem with airflow. So enough about that.

All this time I was focusing on placing radiators in the case that ONLY had a height of 120mm. Because of this, I haven't really done any research on what is truly the BEST radiator where dimensions don't really matter.

So far, 2x XSPC RX480 radiators seem OK for the setup I want.

But then again, there is the TFC MONSTA radiator! -- If I can find it, I'd probably have to buy it from somewhere else other than Performance-PCS.

Or should I go hybrid? With a TFC Monsta on one side, and a RX480/SR1 on the other. Decisions, decisions, decisions. I honestly didn't think I'd be making THIS many changes. Good thing I've been very patient with this build.... And in all this time, the availability of them GTX 480's went up so now I can get the EVGA variants whenever the time is right.

Anyways, here is how the NEW setup will look like...

Note there are a few things missing like the Motherboard waterblock but nothing drastic. Also, QDC's not shown but not gonna change much.
http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/3573/drafttx.jpg (http://img14.imageshack.us/i/drafttx.jpg/)
*NOTE RX is abbreviated.. In regard to the XSPC RX120 radiators of course.

The path of the water has changed!

Res -> Pump -> Monsta Radiator (or two RX480's, or w.e is decided on) -> EK Supreme HF -> Motherboard Waterblock (actually thinking of downgrading to X58 LE, as LGA 2011 is coming next year) -> First XSPC RX120 -> EK 2x 480 GFX waterblock -> 2nd RX120 -> BP HDD waterblock -> back to res.

The TFC Monsta has lots of room down there and is actually able to move a lil' to the left and right.

blazarcher

05-03-2010, 03:28 PM

Just something on the side... Do you think the PSU will be stressed by it's placement? It's only hanging up there with the aid of 4 screws in the back. And considering this PSU's weight (10-20 pounds I think?), I'm gonna need to put something to "hang" it there. I mean shazza didn't really have a problem because she used a much smaller PSU in comparison.

blazarcher

05-03-2010, 04:34 PM

Now I'm leaning towards 2x Black Ice SR1 420's. They offer the same performance as the PA 140.3 and actually surpasses it at higher RPMs. And with a thickness of 153. It's PERFECT. Seriously, this thing will fit like a sock in the case. Leaving exactly 1mm between it and the PSU. So that means I can put in some insulating foam there to reduce vibrations from the PSU AND it would also act as support (to keep the almost 10 pound PSU in line).

Here is a picture of it, it doesn't look like much but will provide "almost" Monsta' like performance. I wish I could've gone with the SR1 560 but it's too long. Imagine that!

http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/4876/imagephp2z.jpg (http://img693.imageshack.us/i/imagephp2z.jpg/)

Oh and also thought about getting the Monsta Lite... But it isn't as good as the SR1.

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/4286/monstalite38o6g.th.jpg (http://img203.imageshack.us/i/monstalite38o6g.jpg/)

Ahh, so many choices. So for almost 300 dollars, or 291 to be more exact, I can get 2 Black Ice SR1 420's. Or should I spend 300 for just one MONSTA, if I can find it that is. Oh and 300+ a Black Ice SR1 420... That's almost 500! Just for radiators.

Which ever offers better performance, I'll go with.

But now it comes down to which fan I should use... I wanna go for the Noiseblocker Black Silent Pro PK2/3.

blazarcher

05-03-2010, 04:53 PM

Heh just noticed that since the SR1's are only 460mm in length, I'll have exactly 50mm to fit a small EK reservoir (which has a 50mm diameter.. Real tight fit). Hmm... More options so if I don't like the look of the BIG reservoir next to the motherboard, I can go with that instead.

That could actually solve my whole tubing route where going from the top RX120 to the HDD waterblock looks awkward.

----
So how would my cooling performance be if I limit all my fans to 1000rpm.

2x RX120 Radiators and 2x Black Ice SR1 420 Radiators
To cool an Intel 930 @4.6 Ghz, an EVGA X58 LE mobo, and 2x GTX 480's @ 940mhz (not very familar with GPU O/Cing so I left out two other things!)

Some of the overclocking is a bit aggressive, but this is just to get a feel for the cooling performance of the whole setup.

*If you haven't noticed already, I'm going with the EVGA X58 SLI LE mobo instead of the Classified. The reason being, LGA 2011 is coming out next year. This mobo will be used later in my secondary computer (in a Lian Li A05B). Since that computer won't be seeing much games, it's not worth paying an extra 200 dollars for a mobo designed for extreme overclocking and gaming.

Also, the LE's ALL BLACK internals will look really nice. But I'll be paying another 150 (same price as if I went with the classified) for the EK waterblock. DAMN expensive waterblock! -- Alright just to hint at my second build, although I'm thinking a bit too far, I'll be installing a Mora 2 Pro on the side of a Lian Li A05N. Heh but that's in another year when LGA 2011 comes out and when I'll have to trash my old Q6600+780i combo.

-----
IF anyone would like to be paid 200 dollars for single-sleeving some PSU cables, PM me. *Note shipping won't be a big deal because the PSU is 100% modular so I'll only be sending the cables + MDPC sleeving. I WOULD sleeve them myself but I don't really trust myself enough. I'm too worried that I might mess 'em up.
-----

So yeah, any advice on the whole 140mm vs 120mm fan argument?
I could go with a 480mm (4x120) radiator or a 420 (3x140).... I heard that 140mm fans do offer better CFM and in the case of radiators, better performance, but I also heard some people talk about them making more noise than the 120's. So if it's better to go with a 3x140 radiator configuration, the difference in temperature will be more PROFOUND as I'll be going with 2x the radiators.
So basically, 2x 480mm Radiator VS 2x 420mm Radiator <-- 480mm seems to win here xD

I only want my fans to be loud enough so that they'll drown the noise of the pumps. So they won't be like DEAD silent. But still pretty quiet nonetheless.

345T4R

05-04-2010, 07:23 AM

Well even with one Monsta, that should offer me better performance than those two magicool radiators, I mean it even beats the Mora 2 Pro! And that is equipped with 9 120mm fans!!! And that's with the Monsta ONLY being equipped with 3x140mm sharkoon fans.

So if I were to go with this setup, what sort of fans would you guys recommend for silent purposes. --- And on that note, will it even be possible to run the fans @1000-1500rpm with adequate airflow considering the radiator's immense thickness?

This Monsta radiators looks like really good, xtreme cooling performance and monstrous price
you can buy 2x Magicool 480 radiator for this :p:
I've seen both radiators and I think the quality from Magicool isn't worse.
Except of the elegant radiators

blazarcher

05-04-2010, 02:16 PM

This Monsta radiators looks like really good, xtreme cooling performance and monstrous price
you can buy 2x Magicool 480 radiator for this :p:
I've seen both radiators and I think the quality from Magicool isn't worse.
Except of the elegant radiators

Yeah I heard about the cracks that people are getting from the Elegant radiators. But since I can only fit one Monsta radiator... Wouldn't it be better to go with two Black Ice SR1 420's? Two of them will surely beat one Monsta considering a Monsta Lite can't even beat one Black Ice SR1 420.

blazarcher

05-06-2010, 04:36 PM

Was wondering if anyone had suggestions as to how I would attach the radiators together. I want to use a whole bunch of fittings so that I can get a solid seal between the two radiators to make them seem as one unit. Not sure how much room should be between the radiators so any suggestions would be helpful.
Basically I have 210mm to play with and since the radiators are 54mm thick, that gives me 102mm of room... Wait 25x2 for the fans and that's about 52mm of room to play with. Should I keep all that real estate for the space between the two radiators? Or should the space be given for the fans, although they would get less airflow because they would be farther from the mesh side panel.

A bit confusing I know, I'm not exactly sure how I want it to look. :shrug:

avddreamr

05-07-2010, 10:03 AM

I was thinking that if you are determined to fit as much rad as possible...

You have a huge cavern in there, its 240 mm.... Mount the psu vertically.
Have it suck in air from the bottom of the case, drill appropriate intakes, have it exhaust out the back.

Psus are what 87mm thick? That leaves you with plenty of space. You could either place 4 360 rads, from magicool ect... 4 Rs 360 (121mm thick), if you angle them slightly, or even some other better rads... depening on how you fab up mounting... having them angled.
Rx 360 is 125mm thick, but 55 mm deep, you may not get enough space from angleing that the air flow will be efficient.

For the bottom of the case, reinforce it with 1mm steel, if you want just at the corners and down the middle, b/c you 'll need to cut a hole in the bottom for either intake or exhaust depending on how you work it.

So there you'll have *laughs* 12 120mm ... even if the rads you can fit aren't the best ones... the shreer quantity.. will out perform everything you know.

Fans... hit up martins fan review.. its hosted on madshrimps.be

So at this point you won't be copying that UK pc company, you'll make your own extreme system.

If you elect to go dual loop still, pick up a pair of ddc 3.1's per loop, and put them on a dual top from ek. You'll get better performance than a single ddc 3.25, at similar power consumption.

Just an idea...it's amazing when finals are over, your brain returns to normal :)

blazarcher

05-07-2010, 06:53 PM

I was thinking that if you are determined to fit as much rad as possible...

You have a huge cavern in there, its 240 mm.... Mount the psu vertically.
Have it suck in air from the bottom of the case, drill appropriate intakes, have it exhaust out the back.

Yeah but keep in mind that a PSU is gonna already be taking 86mm there. So that's 154mm left. And 87x2=174! So not even two can be stacked let alone with any fans fitted on. And if you ignore the PSU by going with 240mm radiators, well guess what you've just halved your cooling capabilities! -- That's why unlike most people, I'd like airflow come from both sides of the case. 2 massive 420mm radiators will be placed in a stacked like configuration. Hot air's nature to rise will determine how effective my setup is. So cool air coming from both sides, through their corresponding radiators. Hot air comes out and travels upwards where it meets the PSU's fans which intakes that HOT air and exhausts it out the case.

This is how I want my setup to look like. I need some advice though on what fittings that I should use to "connect" the two radiators together. Naturally the fittings will act as "spacers" keeping the two apart.

Psus are what 87mm thick? That leaves you with plenty of space. You could either place 4 360 rads, from magicool ect... 4 Rs 360 (121mm thick), if you angle them slightly, or even some other better rads... depening on how you fab up mounting... having them angled.
Rx 360 is 125mm thick, but 55 mm deep, you may not get enough space from angleing that the air flow will be efficient.

For the bottom of the case, reinforce it with 1mm steel, if you want just at the corners and down the middle, b/c you 'll need to cut a hole in the bottom for either intake or exhaust depending on how you work it.

Heh, this is my FIRST watercooling build! I'm not much of a modder either. I don't mind getting my hands dirty but is it really all that necessary (in this case)? This is why I'm not willing... YET to actually have the backplate cut out to configure the PSU vertically. On that note, the PSU here is really long and routing cables won't be easy. But nevertheless, if it provides better cooling, it will be done.

So there you'll have *laughs* 12 120mm ... even if the rads you can fit aren't the best ones... the shreer quantity.. will out perform everything you know.

If I go with my setup, I'll have 6 140mm (excluding the other 2 120mm radiators). I know... 1440 > 840 but whats the use of 1440mm when they are not getting enough airflow? Where are the fans gonna be placed if I place everything stacked one on top of each other?

It sure looks like I JUST want performance but really, it has to look the part too. I thought about having the radiators "angled" but then the radiators that can be used will be limited by their dimensions. So I might just be stuck with "slim" versions of radiators that don't perform as well.

If you elect to go dual loop still, pick up a pair of ddc 3.1's per loop, and put them on a dual top from ek. You'll get better performance than a single ddc 3.25, at similar power consumption.

About the whole DDC debate. I was thinking of replacing the pair of 3.25 with some quieter DDC's. Not sure which to get but there is one, can't remember the name right now, but it only uses up 10W.

Finally thanks a lot for the helpful advice avddreamr, I will definitely keep them in mind. I have to make some additional measurements of my case before making a decision.

blazarcher

05-08-2010, 07:38 PM

Has anyone tried ever gold plating their own hardware? Just came across this site and was thinking of gold plating 2 EK GTX 480 waterblocks. So that means I'll be going with the Acrylic/Copper version. I'll apply the gold straight to the copper. I won't be doing the contact area however. So basically just the things you can see, so the sides of the block only.

Here is the site: http://www.goldplating.com/Products/products-brushgold.htm
Should I go with the pen or the gel solution?

It's pretty expensive too at 70 dollars a bottle so I want to make sure it works before buying.

blazarcher

05-13-2010, 04:04 PM

Another update! Turns out I can actually fit TWO Black Ice SR1 560's! That's right, 8x140mm fans! Check out these stats.. and later some pics of the beast itself.

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/8361/deltat5004b1i.jpg (http://img249.imageshack.us/i/deltat5004b1i.jpg/)

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/3144/deltat8006b8txsf4.jpg (http://img99.imageshack.us/i/deltat8006b8txsf4.jpg/)

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/8776/deltat1200gzov.jpg (http://img27.imageshack.us/i/deltat1200gzov.jpg/)

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/1340/deltat1400q9qn.jpg (http://img341.imageshack.us/i/deltat1400q9qn.jpg/)

How about one more with measurements?

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/8942/sr7u.jpg (http://img171.imageshack.us/i/sr7u.jpg/)

Hmm.. Almost 61cm that's about 24 inches... The case's depth inside is 590mm or 23.2 inches. Staggering the 2 radiators will make them fit perfectly! Unlike the SR1 420, I won't have annoying "gaps" to ruin the look. BTW, lets look at the thing, thickness wise.

At 59.9mm, it's pretty thick. Almost as thick as the MONSTA which is 104.2mm... OK maybe not AS thick but 60x2 is 120 > 104.2 xD Thickness shouldn't be a big deal because doesn't more thickness = fan having to spin faster?

Now talking about fans, I want to go with the Blacknoise Noiseblocker PK3's. They run at 1700rpm, fast I know. But they'll be controlled by a m-Cubed. I got a question though. Is the 1700rpm version (PK3) a PWM version? I heard that most PWM's have lots of motor noise so even at lower rpms, they are LOUD. So would it be better to go with the PK2's instead? The PK2's run at 1200rpm and I don't think they are PWM's.

I want to go with the PK3's because it will give me more cooling potential... So If I were to do a benchmark and want to max my OC, running the fans at 1700rpm will keep 'em quiet.

So basically... Is the NB PK3 a PWM? And if not, should I go PK2 > PK3?

http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/5058/deltat1700894m.jpg (http://img526.imageshack.us/i/deltat1700894m.jpg/)

This had better beat the MONSTA, else I don't know what will.
(Considering the 560 has the advantage of an extra 140mm fan, I'm pretty sure it beats it xD)

Now what you've all been waiting for.. some pics of the BEAST itself.

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/281/sr1m.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/i/sr1m.jpg/)
http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/3439/sr2l.th.jpg (http://img41.imageshack.us/i/sr2l.jpg/)
http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/7149/sr3.th.jpg (http://img514.imageshack.us/i/sr3.jpg/)
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/4690/sr4w.th.jpg (http://img522.imageshack.us/i/sr4w.jpg/)
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/6721/sr5b.th.jpg (http://img62.imageshack.us/i/sr5b.jpg/)
http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/7141/sr6.th.jpg (http://img714.imageshack.us/i/sr6.jpg/) - And that one is compared to a "puny" XSPC RX360!

**Pictures accredited to bundymania**

blazarcher

05-13-2010, 04:07 PM

People always talk about how the bigger the thickness of the fan, the more pressure it has. Since radiator fans need as much pressure as they can get to push air through all the fins, should I go with a different fan other than the PK3's? These fans have a standard thickness of 25mm... I'm thinking of getting one with a thickness of 38mm. And on that note, has anyone heard of Zaward ZFSB0010 Stay 140mm Fan? They are supposedly, the best 140mm fans you can get.

Heh, got bad news. Can't use 38mm fans.

If I did, I'd only have 14mm of empty room between the radiators.. That isn't sufficient to add in the fittings. So forget about this xD

Limited to 25mm fans, I still have lots of options.

blazarcher

05-13-2010, 04:17 PM

Now I need a plan to get the tubing routed nicely throughout both radiators. I will have limited space as it's taken up mostly by the radiator.

At 60mm each, that's 120mm.

And at 210mm of total space, I only have 40mm to space in terms of "wiggle room" minus the 2x25mm fans. To maximize airflow, I'll leave the whole 40mm open in the middle of the case. The fans will be just by the 2 side panels that will eventually be cut. The mesh won't be too thick so it will not detract from the airflow much.

Anyways, with 40mm of space left, I need to find some fittings to use for connecting the two radiators together.

I was thinking a Triple Rotary 90 Degree G 1/4 Male to Female Fitting coming into the first radiator, then it will go out to the 2nd radiator by means of an G1/4 extender (Don't know which to use). From there it will exit by means of another Triple Rotary 90 Degree G 1/4 Male to Female Fitting.

This is my plan so far. I'm using triple rotary fittings so that it won't be as restrictive as say, if I were to use Dual Rotary 90-Degree Compression Fitting-ID 1/2" OD 3/4" instead.

Hopefully this all makes sense to somebody, it makes perfect sense to me :)

blazarcher

05-13-2010, 04:32 PM

I know I said earlier that I was going with the EVGA X58 LE motherboard. But after hearing lots of problems about the BIOS and the overclocking limitations due to the BIOS, I'm gonna stick with the Classified.

Now since I'm fitting a Blacknoise fan+ an XSPC RX120 radiator in the 120mm exhaust area, I won't be able to route the tubing properly.

To help understand, here is the picture of the block itself.

http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/4823/ekclassified.jpg (http://img210.imageshack.us/i/ekclassified.jpg/)

As you can see, the tubing will HAVE to go from the EK CPU waterblock straight into the mobo block. The problem being, the radiator is in the way. I was thinking of placing 2x Bitspower G1/4 Black Sparkle Dual Rotary 90-Degree Compression Fittings. This way, it shouldn't interfere with the radiator. However, I want to "cover up" the tubing that will travel in between the fittings because it won't look good as the tubing travels a very short distance.

Now I don't want it to look sloppy, remember my end goal is ending up being on milliondollarpc (not like that's ever gonna happen xD). So should I forget about the EK waterblock and go with a BP Black Freezer instead? If I went with that, I won't have to make the tubing go to the VRM's because the BP block has two parts to it. So I'll leave the VRM's stock and watercool the north/southbridge.

Here is a pic of the block itself:

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/9545/411o87.jpg (http://img204.imageshack.us/i/411o87.jpg/)

Yeah, she's a beauty, but so is the EK block.

NOW there is ANOTHER problem if I go with this block. Remember, the CPU block can't fit 2 BP compression fittings side by side. The fittings that I'll be using will have to support tubing with ID 1/2" OD 3/4".

So here are my options.

EK - Have to place 2 90 degree fittings, hopefully the radiator will cover up the "mess".

OR

BP - Have to use 2x 45 degree fittings that will make the setup look ugly xD

The BP 45 fittings don't look that good. If anyone has recommendations for some 45 degree fittings, please let me know.

blazarcher

05-13-2010, 04:50 PM

On an unrelated note, I want to hide my front panel cables. It's gonna be awhile till I can sleeve them (MDPC sleeving FTW but shipping will take forever!). So in the mean time I was thinking of getting 5 feet of Techflex Flexo Wrap Hook and Loop Expandable Sleeving 1/2". I was looking for smaller sizes but these are the smallest.

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/3074/flwxowrap04.th.jpg (http://img13.imageshack.us/i/flwxowrap04.jpg/) - Sleeving ain't bad either.

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/7719/flwxowrap02.th.jpg (http://img443.imageshack.us/i/flwxowrap02.jpg/) - Easy installation, can't beat that!

blazarcher

05-13-2010, 05:25 PM

BTW, here are the original pictures of the Black Ice SR1 560 from bundymania.

http://www.abload.de/img/img_1741m2us.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/img_1721f2sp.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/img_1722y3ny.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/img_172433nt.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/img_1729f5wb.jpg

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/9992/img1732.jpg (http://img143.imageshack.us/i/img1732.jpg/)

http://www.abload.de/img/img_1749cpse.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/img_171370d3.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/img_1716q47k.jpg

ascl

05-13-2010, 05:32 PM

Hmm.. Almost 61cm that's about 24 inches... The case's depth inside is 590mm or 23.2 inches.

Am I missing something here? The rad is 610mm and the case is 590mm inside, how will they fit?

blazarcher

05-13-2010, 06:42 PM

Am I missing something here? The rad is 610mm and the case is 590mm inside, how will they fit?

I discussed that already xD Maybe wasn't to clear. Simply staggering the radiators will solve that. -- This will probably work. If not, I'm either planning on forcing it in there (aluminum bends, good thing I guess) or actually cutting a lil'. <-- Got to start modding from somewhere!

BTW, what do you think about the whole BP vs EK waterblock situation?

blazarcher

05-14-2010, 08:19 PM

Now in regards to getting my side panels cut, I'd like to use brand NEW panels due to the limited stock of Lian Li V2100B panels.

Right now, Performance-PCS are the only ones with the Lian Li V2100B Side Panel. However, they only have one side.... They don't have the motherboard side.

I was thinking that since the Lian Li PC-201B has the same EXACT internals and locking mechanism, I can get a set of those side panels instead. They SHOULD measure up to be the same.

What do you guys think? -- And anyone got ideas for some case designs?

I was thinking maybe some flames (with mesh) at the bottom half of BOTH side panels. And a nice rectangular window that only stretches to the whole length of the motherboard. Something "like" this...

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/2614/13254timg3009t.jpg (http://img513.imageshack.us/i/13254timg3009t.jpg/)

Hmm now how will I translate that into CAD language?

NOTICE how my build is turning to be very different from Vadim PC's. Well that's excluding the custom cut side panels of course... Now if only I can get in contact with someone who works at Vadim.... Hopefully they will be nice enough to send over a copy of their case design xD

RCG_Bex

05-15-2010, 03:45 AM

blazarcher

05-16-2010, 09:26 AM

I did something very similar with mine ages ago - I'm going back to simple though becayse I want better air flow...

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w292/marcus000/laser/IMG_8380.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb22/Elemental-Dragon/Xtreme%20PC%20Mod/TeaserBW1.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb22/Elemental-Dragon/Xtreme%20PC%20Mod/TeaserBW2.jpg

Video of panel being made : http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&hl=en-GB&v=em8H5AThPls

I've now gotten a hold of a V2010 - same as what you have - and plan on modding it soon but as I say - I won't be going down the complex laser cut design because drawing it up in CAD is a pain and restrict air flow too much in the end for my personal use.

~Bex

Sorry for the late reply I'm at my vacation home that has no internet (using my phone to write all this)
Anyways, thanks so much for those pictures, your design (the bottom half part of the main panel) is very similar to what I want have done, nothing to complicated.

Was wondering if you could help me with a CAD design. I'm really new at all this. As I've said before all I want is a simple rectangular window and a simple flame design that looks kind of like yours (BTW it looks amazing).

Just some technical things as well...

My case is very similar to yours, I've got the Lian Li V2100B which is a few inches taller than the 2110 and also, the motherboard is inverted so the main panel vs mobo side panels are switched.

blazarcher

05-18-2010, 02:57 PM

bump

blazarcher

05-18-2010, 03:02 PM

Heh, I wonder if I can change the title of my thread lol. This is coming out to be very different from what Vadim has.

The 140mm fans are on backorder... Should I go with Zaward instead? I also heard the Sharkoons are pretty good too.

Anyways.... Right now I'm debating the sort of case design that I want done. I like what Bex has there. It looks amazing and the "flame" design is almost EXACTLY how I want it!

Is there a place people recommend I go to (to get my side panels cut)?
I'll be ordering an extra side panel just in case something goes HORRIBLY wrong.

I thought of cutting the window my self, it shouldn't be that hard. Just need a dremel kit and some acrylic to place. But I don't want screws to stick out. So I thought maybe get it bolted on (from the inside). How would I go about doing that?

---
I know... lots of questions again... But seriously, once I get this straightened out. I shouldn't have any hiccups during actually building the system itself.

blazarcher

05-19-2010, 02:39 PM

Seriously?!?! 9-7 favoring Dual pumps over Triple! Why is there all of a sudden ppl thinking I should go with three pumps?

So in this case.. 2x3.25's or 3x3.1's? -- The 3.1's are quieter so adding an extra one should be just as quiet as 2x 3.25's.

I'd still like to go with a Dual Pump setup as Waterlogged recommended. So if anyone thinks otherwise, please speak up.

ascl

05-19-2010, 02:49 PM

blazarcher

05-19-2010, 04:32 PM

If you really want excellent 140mm fans, grab some SanAce... they come in quiet versions, and also in insane power versions. Aint cheap tho:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248834

Thanks for the advice but I'm limited to a 25mm thick fan. So there goes the San Aces.

ascl

05-19-2010, 04:57 PM

SanAce has 25x140 fans too.

EDIT: I take that back, I am mistaken. Sorry.

blazarcher

05-19-2010, 05:23 PM

Quick question; Is it possible to cut a 4mm thick aluminum panel with a dremel... The Dremel MultiPro 300 Rotary Tool Kit in particular <-- Only 60 dollars too

Will post pictures soon showing where I will be cutting.

blazarcher

05-20-2010, 02:29 PM

Alright getting near to purchasing everything. Right now I'm just waiting for the Frozen Q **Side Port** reservoir to be available at performance-pcs. Hopefully I get everything by next friday and I can finally go through with this build. As for getting the panels cut, thankfully there is actually someone that has the EXACT (without the window though) side panels w/ the flames that I need. I'll let you all know who after it's all done xD

That takes care of the cutting part which made me really nervous. The side panels are coming from the UK so yeah, it'll be a while.

Anyways, there's still the issue of routing the tubing under that first RX120 rad. So I've decided, what the heck, might as well take it out. But now, to fit 2 of them 3/4" OD fittings, I'll need to get 2 45 degree angle fittings. Here is a pic of what I'm thinking of these BP's in particular....

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_04aqtqhwFu4/S-B1vkUhQKI/AAAAAAAAAcQ/UGTaxTAq1Ao/s800/NIGRORIS_Worklog64.jpg

Pics from Melampus' build.

-OR- Should I go with some Feser 45 degree fittings. They look pretty good but I heard that the water's path has an abrupt angle which will affect the flowrate.

blazarcher

05-20-2010, 02:53 PM

Alright, now that I don't have to worry about routing the tubing, I was thinking I should go with the BP mobo over the EK. I LIKE the look of having lots of tubing so should I go with the BP > EK?

Here is a performance chart showing the cooling performance of several EVGA X58 Classified mobo blocks.

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/333/temp2xt7m.jpg (http://img341.imageshack.us/i/temp2xt7m.jpg/)

And some info about the block straight from HESmelaugh.

Bitspower Black Freezer

http://www.abload.de/thumb/21opxx.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=21opxx.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/223rpt.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=223rpt.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/29yr20.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=29yr20.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/31tqdj.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=31tqdj.jpg)

"Bitspower's cooling solution consists of one main waterblock (copper base, brass top, both black nickel plated) called the EIX58NSC and a mosfet waterblock (black nickel plated base, POM top) called the EI58DP II.
At this point it's worth noting that the Classified's heatsink is modular, so it is possible to watercool the NB/SB and NF chips and leave the air-cooler on the mosfets."

http://www.abload.de/thumb/23hzbl.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=23hzbl.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/24zlwv.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=24zlwv.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/25599x.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=25599x.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/26copy7l7z.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=26copy7l7z.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/27eafp.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=27eafp.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/30wbke.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=30wbke.jpg)

"The design and finish of the Black Freezer blocks is very well done. The nickle plating is almost flawless. Unfortunately, the block i had here still had one blot of slight discoloration. Nothing tragic, but perhaps annoying to perfectionists."

Here are the blocks' internals:

http://www.abload.de/thumb/34dl6a.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=34dl6a.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/33qa62.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=33qa62.jpg) http://www.abload.de/thumb/32elq5.jpg (http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=32elq5.jpg)"

Am a bit scared though about the imperfections, the EK block didn't have any.

blazarcher

05-23-2010, 09:38 AM

I know that my build has been stalled for a while now. I've had some financial problems and am unable to get everything all at once. But this does give me more time to flesh out my build.

Now I know I've spoken about this before but since my build has changed drastically since then, it's time to think it over.

Should I go with a SINGLE or a DUAL loop?

If I go with a SINGLE

I've got 560x2 + 120 = 1240W worth of cooling performance

Now let's say my heat dump is 900W (300Wx2 for the 480's and 300 for the 930)

So that's 900/1240 = 0.726 Cooling Performance

So the smaller the number, the more cool the components will run.

As for going Dual...

560 for the CPU --> 300/560 = 0.536

560+120 for GPU --> 0.882

And the AVG if that matters... 0.709

So as you can see, if I go with a single loop I'll get better GPU cooling but MUCH worse CPU cooling

Now If I go with Dual loop, I'll get worse GPU cooling but MUCH better CPU cooling.

So what do you guys think? I've already decided on going with the XSPC Single SLOT 5.25 bay reservoir and will probably be switching the pumps to 2x Dual DDC 3.1 pumps.

So it will perform worse than 2x3.25 but will be quieter. And since they both will be ISOLATED, I SHOULD get better pumping performance if I go with seperate loops.

So should I go SINGLE:

Better GPU cooling, Worse CPU cooling.

OR DUAL:

BETTER CPU cooling, WORSE GPU cooling

Keep in mind if I go SINGLE, I'll have Dual DDC 3.25's.

If I go DUAL, I'll have 2x DUAL DDC 3.1's (Dual DDC 3.1 for CPU and the other for the GPU loop).

ascl

05-23-2010, 01:36 PM

blazarcher

05-23-2010, 02:27 PM

**UPDATE**

Got a picture of the watercut side panels. They'll be coming from the UK xD

Kind of "off-topic" but was wondering if anyone had a recommended courier to use where they won't charge too much and WON'T damage the panels as they are quite fragile.

Here is the side panels in all it's glory:

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/4714/first0041.jpg (http://img522.imageshack.us/i/first0041.jpg/)

Church

05-23-2010, 02:29 PM

I somehow didn't get how rad length got converted to heat dissipation capabilities. sum in millimeters of one rad length (not area, length) + another rad length + length of third rad (forgetting it has less width) somehow got equal to same number but in watts (ignoring rad model cooling performance, no specified temp deltas, fan speed, ammount/way of setup of fans, different performance of 140 vs 120mm fans), then sum of cooled components heatdump got divided by rad length?
OK, i get what you wanted, so this dissecting of calculations was more meant as harsh joke :), but if you wanted to divide rads proportionally to cooled components heat dump you should at least (if rads are of same model line) count their area. as in instead of 560 use 4*140^2, 1*120^2 and such. And to find out proportion one has no need to replace mm2 with W :)
+ascl already noted, that cpu o/c is more low temp needy then gpus, even though heatdump is similar. Though then again, with that big rad area i doubt both ways will differ much more then 2-4 degrees C be it of single or dual loop. Also nothing beats real world testing numbers - you can simply try both setups.
As for 140mm fans .. i stayed at downvolted NB PK-3 fans. Of course, those ain't no GTs :(, but i better take their hidrodynamic bearing, then yateloon 140mm fans with sleeve bearing (i'm gonna mount my 560sr1 horizontally after all)

blazarcher

05-23-2010, 02:31 PM

Generally, you want better CPU cooling and GPU cooling doesn't matter so much, which is why, if you have hot GPUs, 2 loops can work out better, as you can run the GPUs a bit hotter and have a nice cool CPU.
So I guess I'll be going dual loops! Gonna have to do some re-thinking... I should have a diagram of the new setup soon. Single vs Dual loops was definitely something that had to be addressed.

blazarcher

05-23-2010, 02:36 PM

I somehow didn't get how rad length got converted to head dissipation capabilities. sum in millimeters of one rad length (not area, length) + another rad length + length of third rad (forgetting it has less width) somehow got equal to same number but in watts (ignoring rad model cooling performance, no specified temp deltas, fan speed, ammount/way of setup of fans, different performance of 140 vs 120mm fans), then sum of cooled components heatdump got divided by rad length?
OK, i get what you wanted, so this dissecting of calculations was more meant as harsh joke :), but if you wanted to divide rads proportionally to cooled components heat dump you should at least (if rads are of same model line) count their area. as in instead of 560 use 4*140^2, 1*120^2 and such. And to find out proportion one has no need to replace mm2 with W :)
+ascl already noted, that cpu o/c is more low temp needy then gpus, even though heatdump is similar. Though then again, with that big rad area i doubt both ways will differ much more then 2-4 degrees C be it of single or dual loop. Also nothing beats real world testing numbers - you can simply try both setups.

lol, it was a very ROUGH estimate of how things SHOULD work out to be. As for your comments about saying 140x4 over 560... Well they are the same thing. The SR1 560s are 140x4's so I just simplified them to being just called 560's. As for the 140x120 argument, honestly I completely ignored the difference of WIDTH and just wanted to see how much of an effect it would have on the cooling performance of individual components. Turns out it made a very small difference. Therefore taking out of my the RX120's wasn't such a bad idea after all.

As for it being a joke, I guess you COULD call it one xD

blazarcher

05-23-2010, 02:45 PM

As for 140mm fans .. i stayed at downvolted NB PK-3 fans. Of course, those ain't no GTs :(, but i better take their hidrodynamic bearing, then yateloon 140mm fans with sleeve bearing (i'm gonna mount my 560sr1 horizontally after all)

How are the NB PK-3's working out for you? I've been comtemplating whether I should be going with the PK 2's max @ 1200rpm or the PK 3's max @ 1800rpm. Been curious about noise as well because I want these for silence more than for performance.

I see you've got a SR1 560! - What's it like having the current best performance radiator?

Church

05-24-2010, 01:07 AM

I'm using PK3 downvolted @ 1000rpm. Their maximum range is just extra, if i'll ever need more performance eg. in hotter summer days or adding more waterblocks to loop without adding more rads :)
As for current absolute best cooling single rad, it most probably be MoRa3, but i don't know of cases where it can be mounted internally :)

blazarcher

05-24-2010, 02:55 PM

blazarcher

06-02-2010, 11:46 AM

It's been awhile hasn't it? Waiting on a few components still. Anyways, I've decided on the EK-FC480 GTX and the BP X58 Classified waterblocks.

Here is a ROUGH sketch of how I want the Dual Loops to look like.

http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/3961/46047495.th.png (http://img375.imageshack.us/i/46047495.png/)

Black - GPU Loop
Blue - CPU Loop

*NOTE* There are 2 circles that I have deliberate made to show where I'll have Bitspower Black Sparkle "T" Fittings installed to reduce loop clutter.

**NOTE** The 2 GPU's are connected with Koolance Dual VID Connector, Adjustable 3-4 Slot Spacing.

The pumps will be mounted in the bottom of the case with (UN)Designs Infinite Pump Brackets (for DDC pumps) - Vertical Version - Black.

blazarcher

06-02-2010, 11:49 AM

On another note, what thermal paste should I use for the GPU's? I was thinking some Shin-etsu but I hear it has a very high viscosity. In this case would I be better off with AS5 or even MX-3?

blazarcher

06-02-2010, 11:55 AM

359 dollars worth of pumps!!

I'll be using Dual DDC 3.25's for each loop for maximum performance. But paying almost 400 dollars for pumps alone seems a bit too much. Are there any recommendations for what other pump I should use? Preferably something a bit more cheaper (and quieter). I'll have all "4" pumps mounted on some foam so noise will PROBABLY be a non-issue.

blazarcher

06-05-2010, 02:51 PM

bump

blazarcher

06-06-2010, 01:23 PM

QUICK UPDATE

Removed the RX120, honestly a 120mm radiator with no fan is NOTHING compared to a SR1 560. Removing it from the loop shouldn't make much of a difference.

What do you guys think?

blazarcher

06-06-2010, 02:05 PM

Apparently Waterlogged isn't accepting PMs lol. Here's what he had to say about the GT's vs NB's.

Hey man, just been around the forums and noticed how you are not inclined on persuading people to go for Noiseblocker fans. If I recall correctly you called them overly expensive and state that they don't have enough static pressure to move air through something like a radiator.

For my build, which is being pushed back to June, I need to get 8 140mm fans to push through 2x 60mm thick HW Labs SR1 560's. But seeing as you don't recommend Noiseblocker, would it STILL be alright to go with the Noiseblocker NB-BlackSilentPro PK-2 140mm fans?

I heard that the Sharkoon 140mm fans are pretty good and need a recommendation on which fan I should go with if I want SILENCE AND a lil' bit of performance.

I'll be using an mCubed controller to control the fans and would like to have the ability to turn the fans down for silence, so PWM fans are out of the question because I heard they usually have a LOUD "motor" noise resonating from the fan @ low rpms, and when benching, I'd like to turn the fans up for performance. However I mainly want a fan that is QUIET and will probably run at around 800-1200rpm.

I think you answered your own question. ;)

As for SR1's, read this

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?p=4403103#post4403103

I know your looking at the 140mm versions but my thoughts still ring true. Over priced, under performing. Go with that $166 recommendation and some 1850 GT's and call it a day.

*Sigh, I guess I'll be going GT's xD Better than the PK2's which can only spin up till 1200. The PK3's aren't available ANYWHERE! Thanks alot man, I've just saved 40 dollars lol. BTW, check out my thread, I've changed a few things hopefully for the better. Though the cost is still up there, I hope it's to your liking. If you have anymore helpful advice, let me know xD

P.S. I think you won't be to happy about my Pump setup =)

EDIT

Just came across some 120mm roundups, found something very interesting.

Take a look at the GT's (-15) and the NB MF12-S3HS.

http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/469/12scgentleresbig.png (http://img708.imageshack.us/i/12scgentleresbig.png/)

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/8673/14nsblkmframeresbig.png (http://img171.imageshack.us/i/14nsblkmframeresbig.png/)

Just looking at 1000 rpm, look at the CFM.

The NB's and GT's have similar DBA but the NB seem to have more CFM at the same rpm. NOTE that the reviewer states that the GT's optimal rpm is 1440 while the NB's are only 1000, does that make any sense? - Anyways, doesn't more CFM equal more static pressure? Assuming it does, shouldn't the NB's be better in terms of rad use.

There was another roundup I saw, can't seem to find it. But it was concerning radiators. So all the fans were tested with rads. The GT's came on top.

These 2 difference sources have different opinions of the NB's. One state them having higher CFM, the other says that the GT's have higher static pressure. Does that mean CFM does not equal static pressure?

----

Although these are reviews of the 120mm models, both companies probably created the 140mm fans around the same concept so assuming the GT's or NB's are better, they should ALSO be better in terms of the 140mm versions.

Sorry to confuse things a bit, I still think I'll probably be going with GT's but the NB's don't seem bad at all, though they are WAY too overpriced. =)

Then again.... Looking at the DBA, the GT's seem the way to go. I mean just look! @ 1850, the GT is only producing 38 DBA while the NB produces the same noise at ONLY 1400! Waterlogged is definitely a person to listen to lol, I can't believe I didn't see that!

blazarcher

06-06-2010, 02:06 PM

So yeah, looking at the last post, I think I'll be going GT's from here on out. Gonna have to buy from elsewhere so I won't really be saving any money.

Vapor

06-06-2010, 02:25 PM

Dual DDC3.1s in each loop will save some money and be quieter...and perf drop shouldn't be appreciable from 2xDDC3.25s.

As for radiators....I think you have too many (no sarcasm) :eh:

blazarcher

06-06-2010, 03:17 PM

Dual DDC3.1s in each loop will save some money and be quieter...and perf drop shouldn't be appreciable from 2xDDC3.25s.

As for radiators....I think you have too many (no sarcasm) :eh:

Yeah my plan was actually to get some 3.1's. They would definitely be quieter.

A SR1 560 per loop is too much? That's ONE radiator xD

Church

06-06-2010, 03:52 PM

blazarcher

06-06-2010, 06:03 PM

blazarcher: make it MoRa3 per loop. That's also one single rad. In push-pull single rad with 18 fans :)
As for GTs vs NBs, yeah, first one wins. As for 140mm versions .. well, judging by responses i've got by mail from both Scythe & Nidec Servo (actual makers of GTs) there are no planned 140mm GT. So it's rather choice between Yate Loon D14 vs NB PK3 (btw, i've seen it several european shops, maybe because vendor is im Deutchland? :) ). If we keep on extrapolating 120mm version performance to 140mm, probably both perform same, but Yate Loons are 2.5 times cheaper :). And probably no 140mm GT in nearest 2 years, so if one has to buy fans for LC build now, no need to wait.

Cool, lol I was actually thinking about the Yate Loons as I wrote that post. About the Mora... I want to keep this as an all internal loop. I don't like the idea of having radiators sticking out the back or tubing (prone to leaking) outside.

Right now I think 2 SR1 560's are the way to go for a fully internal watercooling loop. BTW, I'm actually getting the Mora 2/3 for my Lian Li A05N build. But right now, like I said, I'm gonna stick with the 560's.

Thanks a lot for the advice! You've saved me over a hundred dollars, them NB's are EXPENSIVE.

blazarcher

06-06-2010, 06:14 PM

Although a bit plain compared to these (NB's), http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/7237/nbbspropk201.jpg (http://img24.imageshack.us/i/nbbspropk201.jpg/)

I think I'll be going with the Yate Loon 140mm High Speed Silent Case Fan - D14SH-12's. At a max RPM of 2000, they should give me plenty headroom when I'm benching. Hopefully motor noise won't be a problem.

Here is a pic of the Yate Loons, I should definitely do something about the look. Maybe paint them a glossy black.

http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/906/yateloond14sh12intakevi.png (http://img231.imageshack.us/i/yateloond14sh12intakevi.png/)

Yeah, very reminiscent of my Lian Li stock fans lol.

blazarcher

06-08-2010, 05:06 PM

I've had a change of heart. Going with the NB's =)

PK3's are now in stock and I have been doing a lot of reading on the Yate Loons and am hearing mixed reviews. Many are basically saying, "you get what you pay for". Yate Loons are CHEAP and I also hear that they are really loud if not undervolted, and although they will be undervolted, there is still a chance of other noises due to poor build quality. Again, I'm not familiar with Yate Loons so don't take what I say to heart, I will from now on be going with the NB PK3's unless anyone has anything to bring forth.

Seriously, Paying 84 dollars > 200 seems good but if the Yate Loons are not quiet, then there really isn't any point in buying them.

Not to mention, the NB's are bundled with lots of stuff. They even include some Anti-Vibration Silicon Pads! Don't really know how good they are, but it's nice to see them include it. Although paying 25 dollars for a fan, it's to be expected.