You're about to buy a ready built HTPC - what does the deal have to include?

[haiwan]

Hey,

new to the forums, but long time reader.

I've been pondering the idea of making HTPC's for costumers for awhile now. I've got a great supplier with really good prices on the components I need, and I have most of the things I'd need to get a great web-shop online. The final thing I need to solve is what parts to use. It needs to be cheap while still being able to function as a great HTPC.

My idea for all of this came from the fact that in my country alone (9m ppl) there are about 500,000 people who daily download their movie and tv-series content. These people don't pay for TV-service plans, they download all of their digital media. And now with Spotify being avaible in most of europe, and the coming launch of voddler, more and more users will be viewing their movies and series through a computer.

The biggest hassle for alot of people is they want a great sulotion where they can watch all of this on their big 50" LCD and not on some small 24" computer monitor. They want to hook this up to the internets and they want to use their great HIFI speakers Without haaving some nasty ghetto setup. And lastly, they want to use a remote instead of some huge keyboard and mouse.

My idea is to use the moncaso 312 case, which looks fantastic, and has a good remote bundled, and throw in some OK motherboard with decent enough onboard VGA so it plays blue ray. I'd probably have a 1TB drive as standard option with 2 gigs of RAM, and a blue ray player. The HTPC would come with win7 installed. Oh, I'd also throw in some tuner card in there, or have it as an extra option mabye?


So I'm asking all of you guys and girls, if you ever bought a pre-built HTPC :rofl:, what would it have to include? And what kind of prices would you be willing to pay. Be reasonable here and try to think more like avrage joe instead of a XS member. :yepp:

/Stefan

[Donnie27]

Hey,

new to the forums, but long time reader.

I've been pondering the idea of making HTPC's for costumers for awhile now. I've got a great supplier with really good prices on the components I need, and I have most of the things >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.Be reasonable here and try to think more like avrage joe instead of a XS member. :yepp:

/Stefan

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=240295

Look through that thread for ideas and :welcome:?

[haiwan]

Thanks! Saw the thread and read through it. Seems like I'm not too far off on most things. But I'd like some more input on the whole user experience. If one were to spend lets say 1000$ on a HTPC, what does the HTPC have to do to be considered good value? What kind of user experience is there to be expected and what is it people want from a good media centre?

[trekie86]

In my opinion, $1000 is a bit high for a HTPC. I spent that much on my gaming rig that has the power to do much more than a HTPC should ever have to do. I think the best bet for value is available interfaces. Give the user alot of different interface options (DVI, HDMI, component video, SPDIF, Optical Audio, heck even coax). The more potential connections a user can make, the less you are limiting your market. Also, I want a HTPC to be quiet and stay cool. If your are putting in some premium graphics cards, they are going to get hot and going to get loud. The PC shouldn't be louder than the built in fans on a receiver or gaming console. This means a decent video card or on-board video, a medium grade processor, shouldn't need anything more than 2.5 GHz, 2-4 Gig of RAM, and plenty of HDD space. The last needed component is aesthetics, it has to look nice and not clash with the entertainment center. Hope that gives you some help.

[haiwan]

I was thinking about the moncaso 312 case. It's really clean and it blends in nicely with other components in an av rack.

Seems like I'm on the right path here. Decent onboard VGA, lower end CPU, just enough for HD content, a simple blue ray player, 2 gigs of ram and tonnes of storage.


Anyone have any experience with the MSI Media Live DIVA? Seems like a really good motherboard for what I'm trying to accomplish here. Great connectivity like you said, and decent enough onboard graphics.

[Neuromancer]

Wow nice looking case, but VERY expensive.

Are you looking at really building an HTPC or just a video playback/internet PC?

I would offer that case as the high end option with 2TB HDDs for storage.

[haiwan]

I will probably be selling two versions of this. On that's more or less only for watching movies, recording stuff, playing music and browsing the internet, etc, on your lcd. The other version would have more power so the user could play games on it too.

Both versions would be costumizable in the way that the user could choose to add additional storage etc. But that's about it. Key here is a simple functional user experience that looks elegant in the modern living room.

[Chris_redfield]

I'd want two versions with regards to sound card. One with high end sound card, the other with a straight optical output so the sound card can do the work.

Size, I'd personally be after Micro ATX and would want the Lian Li PC-V351B case. I don't really like that Monocaso 312 case. It will make the system look like a mid range DVD player. It does have a lot of nice features, BUT something like the Lian Li is cleaner, sleeker, and might spark a conversation when someone comes around and sees it in your living room due to its odd shape. However I am aware that its shape might cause a bit of a problem with people's shelves.

I'd personally look towards using an Nvidia GPU. Just for 3D. Optima do a projector that with an update (I think they will soon be selling them with the software update after christmas,) they can also project in 3D. The projector only does 720p, but it does only come to around about £800 with a screen.

Because the projector is only 720p the system wouldn't have to be ridiculously powerful in order to be able to game on it in 3D. You could maybe get away with a GT240. You could probably do two reasonably cheap bundle deals. A 3D projector bundle that gets you the screen and the projector with the lower end GPU and CPU. Or, as not everyone has room for the projector sell the system with a Samsung SM2233RZ 22" 120Hz and then as the monitor is cheaper (but has a higher res,) you'd have a bit more room in the budget to add a more powerful GPU.

A 3D gaming HTPC package sounds quite impressive, and people googling for a HTPC on the internet would more than likely click on that just for a quick look at it. Even if they have no intention of buying one. Then once you have them on your site, you could also offer them the basic system on its own at a much lower price and because its the base system the price looks a lot lower and people think that it is dirt cheap because they are comparing it to the other products on your site. Much like a lot of people who think the mac mini is an absolute bargain. You could even do a budget one that has a motherboard with an IGP.

As the Micro ATX boards have come on leaps and bounds recently, you could also offer a Asus Maximus III Gene overclocked or something just to add to the CPU grunt and do a 'top of the range,' version. Again mainly just to show off what is possible and fire up customers imaginations just to draw them into the website.

[Donnie27]

Thanks! Saw the thread and read through it. Seems like I'm not too far off on most things. But I'd like some more input on the whole user experience. If one were to spend lets say 1000$ on a HTPC, what does the HTPC have to do to be considered good value? What kind of user experience is there to be expected and what is it people want from a good media centre?

First if looks matter, take a well lit picture of your system/rig/set up with a blank space for your prospective HTPC case.

My Idea of an HTPC case is whatever the buyer likes, NOT what I like. That said, try to match what you already have for scheme. Buy Pewter if that's the color of what you already have. If black, don't mix Flat and Gloss, it looks kind of Tacky!

My Idea of a HTPC is start with the fastest cool running CPU and not frakkin' overlclocking LOL. Sorry AMD fans, E5200 or etc.... serves that purpose well. Even my old E6600 (no need to overclock) does everything with ease. I've yet to see any HTPC need anything more than Gygabte's P35 or P43.

AMD's 3650 makes a great HTPC video card if Games aren't a priority and 5750 if they are. FOR ME, AMD's HDMI out has worked better straight to my LCD TV at 1080P. Straight to the TV and NOT through my Pioneer receiver. It does have a "Lip-Sync" feature so no delay. I love great sounds so I use an Auzentech X-Fi Prelude in Analog mode for that. Straight Digital ain't bad through the Pioneer 819 but most (not all) sound better via Analog from the card. Blay Ray and DTS and DD True HD can't be touched right now for movies though.

I've gotten great results with Windows Vista 32bit, see little need for 64bit for a Home theater PC. In fact, I spend about 60% of the time in MCE and the rest on the desktop. Love the cheap MCE remote control. Though I would like to add Linux and dual boot.

I've not run into any problem with 2GB of RAM and a 750GB HDD and the rest on an external 1TB. I'm currently trying to find time to install a Blue Ray Player only so I can move my Set Top to the Living room, from MY DEN, for my Daughter. I have a Samsung 22X DL-DVD-RW Lightscribe and will remove my trusty old LiteOn 22X DL to make room for the BD player.

Too bad some of the prices have went up! I got the video card for $36, the RAM for the same and it 2GB of Muskin (good stuff). $89 motherboard, got a break and paid $69 for the Processor and a whoppin' $169 for the sound card. $89 X-Fi Gamer is about as low as I (Just me here) would go.

Both Opticals sold for $25 each, $16 card reader, $17 for the remote, $69, yes $69, for Vista Home Premium OEM, Mouse and Keyboard was $27. I got the WD Black HDD for $64 shipped. Case $20 + $10 for various cables, cheap HEC Desktop case with a highly underrated HEC 585W PSU that was $26 shipped. Didn't shop by wattage but price was the main factor. I was looking for a good name brand 400W PSU.

Besides the BD player, I will update the video card to at least a 5750 for better gaming performance. It doesn't need to be the ultimate Gaming rig or anything. Might also install Windows 7 for DX-11 and etc.....

Those are just mine, not best or the worse just mine. I easily could have went cheaper and built my $650 rig for $550 and a different sound card would have made this one less than $600 and closer to $500 with one optical. I can't stand On board sound or video, even the ATI based stuff.

[haiwan]

Thanks for the replys people.

Had a look at the Lian Li and it looks really good. Cheaper too, which is great. Better margins for me! :up:

What I'll probably do is that I'll sell this in two different ways.

1. Low end, just for video, music and browsing. This setup would be built on the cheapest avaible mobo with onboard VGA and a budget CPU. Would come with 2g of RAM and 750g HDD. On board soundcard and tv-tuner as addon option. Blue ray player.
I'd really want to play around with a zotac board with nvidia ION and an intel A330 here to see if it works like I'd want it to. This way, I could fit all of this into a really small setup too.

2. Same idea as above, but I'd fit the htpc with a video card good enough to run most games on. Add a good sound card and and tuner. 1 TB drive would be included as well as 4g of ram. For this option I'd use the Lian Li case or a similar case with good looks and same-ish price. I'd probably include a blue ray burner here, or mabye have the burner option as a choice for the customer and just include a good reader.

Both of these could be had as a deal where a HD projector and screen comes included, and would be advertised on the front page. Additionally both models would have the option to be costumised to add an additional SSD drive and other gadgets such as media keyboards, remotes etc.

[Donnie27]

Thanks for the replys people.

Had a look at the Lian Li and it looks really good. Cheaper too, which is great. Better margins for me! :up:

What I'll probably do is that I'll sell this in two different ways.

1. Low end, just for video, music and browsing. This setup would be built on the cheapest avaible mobo with onboard VGA and a budget CPU. Would come with 2g of RAM and 750g HDD. On board soundcard and tv-tuner as addon option. Blue ray player.
I'd really want to play around with a zotac board with nvidia ION and an intel A330 here to see if it works like I'd want it to. This way, I could fit all of this into a really small setup too.

2. Same idea as above, but I'd fit the htpc with a video card good enough to run most games on. Add a good sound card and and tuner. 1 TB drive would be included as well as 4g of ram. For this option I'd use the Lian Li case or a similar case with good looks and same-ish price. I'd probably include a blue ray burner here, or mabye have the burner option as a choice for the customer and just include a good reader.

Both of these could be had as a deal where a HD projector and screen comes included, and would be advertised on the front page. Additionally both models would have the option to be costumised to add an additional SSD drive and other gadgets such as media keyboards, remotes etc.

Last things first, HTPC's have almost NO use for 4GB of RAM and 2GB works great. Where as the first time any user goes to make a DVD or Video CD with one of the many One Click apps, built-in video will show its ugly head. Many of those apps depend on CPU and or Video card to help do H264 or etc..

Using digital only, mobo sound can pass for everyone but Music lovers. I love Music and the only digital I like is DVD Audio via one of the True HD formats or etc..

The problem you'll into trying to compete with HP, Dell, Gateway, Emachines and the rest is that their margins are thin but Volume is the key. They'll pay about 40% of what you'll pay for similar parts. Not to mention Support from selling noobs also sucks!

I used to do this as well! I still got at least 36 PC in my local area (many more sold and shipped LOL). One lady called me and said, it locked up! I went and she had 40 installs of AOL. She thought each time she logged in, she had to run the install with the disc:rofl: She said that's what she did for the Sims.

Still wanting to follow though, money can be saved by buying bare-bones and more than 6 with places that offer Volume discounts on 4 to 6 items at a time. During a bad economy isn't the time for a start-up.