ATI 5870 wanted by project for Beta test WUs [Archive]

Chumbucket843

11-09-2009, 02:56 PM

Whoa... glad they're already testing stuff for ati!

But that's a strong card to ask for... Hope they still take the 4 series, I have a feeling we have a lot of those around here!
(and I hope the compete point wise!)

it will be interesting to see where they end up point wise. i cant find anything at all about molecular dynamics or ffts running on ATi cards so i dont know what to expect. i still think nvidia could beat them if they dont have some serious skills at programming. i will still go with a fermi based card. maybe the opencl gpugrid app will work with the gtx 260 192s.

PoppaGeek

11-09-2009, 03:12 PM

It will be nice to have a choice. I hope they can do comparable point wise to nvidia.

shadowwind

11-09-2009, 03:17 PM

Otis11

11-09-2009, 03:56 PM

folding@home drop the ball on the ati cards they was not able to take advantage of the full streaming processing unit or ati wasn't not sure who to blame. lets hope the gpugrid can get it to work with 1600 streaming then we got some thing good. but i still think the 300 is going to win as far as the points
goes. time will tell.

See the key for me is PPD/$... not necessarily performance strait out.

Anyone trying it so far? Need to get some results!

...Oh bob... :rofl:

shadowwind

11-09-2009, 04:16 PM

im going to as soon as i can find a 2 5870s in stock ati is my card of choice but for PPD when i was folding Nvidia is the PPD king as for the 4 series i got 2 4850
X2s i would love to get working again.:D

PoppaGeek

11-09-2009, 04:23 PM

From what I understand ATI has made improvements in the Stream programing software and that is why gdf is trying them. Not so much new hardware as software. ATI never put the resources behind Stream that nVidia put into CUDA.

shadowwind

11-09-2009, 04:57 PM

now that your refreshing my memories i think i said all ati cared about was getting the gaming crown back a year ago in the folding section thanks poppa for the reminder. I also have trouble remembering but im just not ready to look for a rest home just yet,:ROTF:

PoppaGeek

11-09-2009, 05:23 PM

Specs have been lowered.

hi,
AMD does not want us to distribute any DLL at the moment, so you must install it yourself. Sorry about that.
YOU NEED:
1) ATI-opencl-beta driver
2) ATI-opencl-sdk stream SDK
from
here

The minimum card is a Radeon 4850. Below this one shared memory is emulated so it is terribly slow.

WU submitted will be very short just for us to get some data.

gdf

Guess I better dust off my 4850 and put it in a machine!

:toast:

Otis11

11-09-2009, 08:20 PM

Specs have been lowered.

Guess I better dust off my 4850 and put it in a machine!

:toast:

Let us know! Can't wait to see how these compare!

And best of luck - hope they don't cause any problems!

Naja002

11-12-2009, 06:20 AM

The timing is :up: Perfect! :up: I just received a 5850 yesterday and found another and promptly ordered it! It will be here early next week. :up:

I am as setup as I can get until they come help a flunky out. Says I have no Nvidia Gpu...well, uh, yeah....DUH! :D

These cards are monsters! :yepp: $300 for ~150K/day on Collatz. Not sure what they will pay on GpuGrid, but it's about advancing the technology! :up::up: The next step forward.....I'm in! :up:

Gispel is the guy that got ATI going on MW and Collatz....now he's helping GpuGrid! :up:

Collatz WUs:

8800GS--50-60min
260/216 65nm--30min
5850 stock--8.5min
5850 @ 902/1250--6.8min
5850 @ 920/1250--6.5min

Otis11

11-12-2009, 09:26 AM

Hope they get this working that well on GPUGrid! That would be intense!

even 100k PPD from a single cards would be incredible! :shocked:
And for $300... How could I not? :rofl:

Naja002

11-12-2009, 09:39 AM

Hope they get this working that well on GPUGrid! That would be intense!

even 100k PPD from a single cards would be incredible! :shocked:
And for $300... How could I not? :rofl:

I've received ~2.5x as many points on Collatz as GpuGrid. So, assuming everything stayed the same...it should be worth ~28K/day. However, I'm still trying to determine what this 5850 is worth on Collatz. I doubt it's worth much less than 50k/day, but may turn out to be worth ~80K/day. Just going to take a little waiting to find out.

I've moved the OC up to 920/1250...not really pushing too hard too fast, but I've had zero OCing issues so far. That's on air. These babies are going on Chilled water.....:up::up:

Going to add the new OC into my previous post...

EDITED: To correct bad information....

PoppaGeek

11-12-2009, 02:54 PM

shadowwind

11-12-2009, 04:24 PM

my 4850s did the same thing Pops im going to keep them.
the 4850s still play games that i play online and i dont see the point to upgrade them for playing games. now to find a pair of 5870s in stock for the GPUGRID,:up:

PoppaGeek

11-12-2009, 05:34 PM

The 57xx would be easy to buy, wonder how they will do?

Chumbucket843

11-12-2009, 06:00 PM

you should be able to run gpugrid with your 4850 when ATi gets an updated openCL driver. the same thing happened with CAL 1.4 earlier this year. you can wait or just buy a 5xxx card. its up to you. basically with out shared memory it would run like ATi on f@h.

shadowwind

11-12-2009, 06:15 PM

that is what worries me about getting a 5870 or even 2, I bought my 4850s for F@H point wise they are not very good.
Pops will tell you the same thing and my 4850s was a full time baby sitting job when i was folding with them. Nvidia is
the way to go for folding.

shadowwind

11-12-2009, 06:32 PM

The 57xx would be easy to buy, wonder how they will do?

not sure how they will do i guess we wait and see what a real
WU can do to show us the PPD, right now they are still testing small WUs.

Otis11

11-12-2009, 07:37 PM

not sure how they will do i guess we wait and see what a real
WU can do to show us the PPD, right now they are still testing small WUs.

This can't come fast enough!

...Christmas lists anyone? :rofl:

Naja002

11-12-2009, 09:29 PM

I tried the 4850 and all WUs error within 20 secs. gdr has now said 4000 series way too slow and they will not support them. So I guess I will sell it and the GTX 260. Ebay gonna nickel and dime me to death.

They're just having a lot of issues atm, PG. I can only recall 1 person getting things going successfully. IIRC, it seemed that everyone else was erroring out. I can't even get the thing to give me some WUs....:p:

my 4850s did the same thing Pops im going to keep them.
the 4850s still play games that i play online and i dont see the point to upgrade them for playing games. now to find a pair of 5870s in stock for the GPUGRID,:up:

Word on the street is= save yourself $100/card and go with the 5850. It's damn near as fast and can be OCed like crazy (with Asus or MSI Bios). I got mine up to 1003/1330 before it started failing. :up:

The 57xx would be easy to buy, wonder how they will do?

Just a headsup: the 57xx won't run MW. Something to do with the lack of double precision. :shrug: No sure exactly, but from what I can gather there's a difference in the 57xx series...and it's a reason to avoid the cards.

you should be able to run gpugrid with your 4850 when ATi gets an updated openCL driver. the same thing happened with CAL 1.4 earlier this year. you can wait or just buy a 5xxx card. its up to you. basically with out shared memory it would run like ATi on f@h.

GDF:

We managed to try on a 4850 and shared memory is still emulated, so the card seems to be quite slow.

It is likely that the only cards where ATI put a good hardware support for shared memory are the new 5000 cards.

That sounds like a hardware issue to me.....:shrug:

PoppaGeek

11-12-2009, 10:57 PM

Looking for an XFX Radeon HD 5850? We Got'em! (http://www.hardocp.com/)

XFX and HardOCP have teamed up to offer our registered HardForum members first shot at purchasing an XFX ATI Radeon HD 5850! Stocks have been low, but XFX is letting [H]'ers get first dibs! XFX part number - HD585AZNFC (XFX HD 5850) - $299.99 Plus tax, shipping, and handling. This offer is for USA shipping addresses only. XFX is also offering a bundle on its new 850 watt BE PSU and with the above listed 5850. Cost for XFX 850W Black Edition PSU is normally $199.99. A $50.00 bundle discount for a total of $449.98 for both the PSU and the video card. Plus tax, shipping & handling to USA only. Stock will be limited to the first fifty PMs sent the XFXSupport account at HardForum.com. Please include your full name, USA shipping address, and phone number. An XFX representative will call to process the billing information. Discussion - Permalink

Naja002

11-12-2009, 11:25 PM

Nice find, PG! I found the 1 I ordered yesterday through an "In Stock" online tip. Was all set to grab one of these, but they are limited to the first 50, and a rep will call to process the payment info.....not really wanting any calls, personally. If I could order and then call them...that would be cool. I'm ok atm, but twitching to possibly get a couple more of these and start selling off my 8800's + water blocks....:up:

I just wanted to add in here that these reference cards are all exactly the same...the only difference in the cards themselves is the sticker. Other then that, it's just brand name, warranty, free game, etc....

And from what I can tell, stock should start trickling in ~Nov. 20th. I would expect these cards to still be flying off the shelves, but in stock availability should start improving around then.....that's a week from now, so not so bad....

shadowwind

11-13-2009, 01:46 AM

thanks PG and Naja for the heads up on those cards,:up:

we should start seeing some work unit numbers in a couple of
weeks i would think, im hoping for some positive feed back on them.:shrug:

Naja002

11-13-2009, 02:37 AM

The 57xx would be easy to buy, wonder how they will do?

Here's more direct info on the 57xx series cards and why they won't work for our purposes:

5770 & 5750 (http://milkyway.cs.rpi.edu/milkyway/forum_thread.php?id=1154&nowrap=true#32384)

thanks PG and Naja for the heads up on those cards,:up:

we should start seeing some work unit numbers in a couple of
weeks i would think, im hoping for some positive feed back on them.:shrug:

There's already numbers out....like the ones that I posted above. They're not GpuGrid numbers, but I think that will be more then a couples weeks before we start seeing any numbers of value. Maybe not though. At least they are working on it! :up:

A 260 does MW in ~3 or 3.5mins. A 4870 in 43secs. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNMp3e7jpMU) A 5870 in ~ 21secs. (http://milkyway.cs.rpi.edu/milkyway/forum_thread.php?id=1154&nowrap=true#31959)

PoppaGeek

11-13-2009, 03:14 AM

Well the 5850 will be fine but only one for me. I have a 4 slot AMD MB and thought some crossfire with 2 5700 would be nice but 1 5850 will do all I want I am sure. Hopefully the price will drop a little after first of the year.

Naja002

11-13-2009, 03:31 AM

Well, I just went ahead and sent a PM on the combo deal. The offer says "Tax". :down: They are in Ca and I am not, so there's no way I'm paying tax. If they want the tax...I'll just skip the deal. Don't want or need it that badly. :up:

Hopefully the price will drop a little after first of the year.

I would guess that with Fermi coming out that the price won't drop any time until then. And nobody really seems to know much truth about Fermi, so who knows what will happen when it's released....

ATI is suppose to release a 5870x2 (http://www.brightsideofnews.com/news/2009/4/24/ati-radeon-5870-and-5870x2-specs-revealed.aspx) before long.....

Naja002

11-13-2009, 09:01 AM

Ok, just got off the phone with XFX. No tax for my state. I'm assuming that's for most or all states, except Ca. I did the combo deal. I can use another psu and this one has some really nice reviews (http://www.google.com/search?q=XFX+850W+Black+Edition&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a)on it. 1.31% voltage fluxuation max on the 12v rail. 1% or less on the 3 and 5v rails. 88-90% efficient (80 Plus Silver). Modular. So, anyway:

449.98 for the combo
15.99 shipping out today via fedex (HD or ground)
465.97 Total

I'm going to go jump off a building now. It's been fun.....http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f347/Naja002/Smilies/bolt.gif

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f347/Naja002/Smilies/banana015.gif

Otis11

11-13-2009, 10:04 AM

Haha, nice. :up:

Any clue on when we'll get some real grid WUs?

Naja002

11-13-2009, 10:33 AM

Not atm. Here's from the thread at GpuGrid:

GDF:

So far:
Any of the 4xxx cards proved to be very very slow. It is unlikely that we will support them due to lack of proper shared memory. For 5xxx, we still could not test because we don't have any, AMD does not send us any and the ones attached do not run at the moment.

We will see in the following days if we can get the performance of a 5xxx card.

gdf

Me:

Well, I just picked up a 3rd 5850 via HF/XFX combo deal. Shipping today. So, by this time next week I will have 3x 5850s in hand.

I'm ready....

Let's DO this....; )

Of course, there's posts/discussion in between, but that's what it comes down to....

I'm ready. Afaik, he's in France. I can't afford those kinds of long distance charges. But if he's got anybody in the US....I've got 2 days and free long distance to sit on the phone and help them work some things out. :up:

Otis11

11-13-2009, 10:51 AM

If you want to talk to him in France, just get Skype. Free Video conferencing if both users DL it. :up:

Naja002

11-13-2009, 10:55 AM

Actually, I could change my Logmein password to give him or whoever direct access to my PCs temporarily. That's an idea....:up:

Otis11

11-13-2009, 01:02 PM

Actually, I could change my Logmein password to give him or whoever direct access to my PCs temporarily. That's an idea....:up:

If you're willing to do that, might not be a bad idea... :shrug:

Depends what they need to test.

Chumbucket843

11-13-2009, 01:46 PM

That sounds like a hardware issue to me.....:shrug:
the driver is preventing the hardware from being used. if you look at a die shot the cache is there.

PoppaGeek

11-13-2009, 03:13 PM

Glad that link proved useful!

Next I guess is some water blocks for those 5850s. Then maybe some pics? :)

Naja002

11-13-2009, 04:41 PM

Heads up, Gentlemen:

Radeon HD 5870 - like new (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=238861)

Naja002

11-13-2009, 04:56 PM

Man, you guys are slow:

SAPPHIRE 100282SR Radeon HD 5850 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102857)

Newegg

$299

Sold out in less then 1 hour....

PoppaGeek

11-13-2009, 05:15 PM

No i is broke. I have 7 grandkids to buy Christmas for. My time comes first of the year!

Naja002

11-13-2009, 05:37 PM

I understand. It's for whoever chooses to partake. :up: But I assume that since GpuGrid isn't actually up and running ATI atm....there probably isn't a whole lot of interest currently--but ya never know! :up: Might be 1 or 3 people floating around that would like one...:up:

BTW, PG, Thank You for that HF link. :up::up: Yes, it turned out very useful for me. I'm glad I went that route. I've been scratching my head over another psu, and with 3 of these---I'm definitely going to need one. That one has really good reviews. I didn't need to buy new, modular, etc, but I'm still glad that I went for it. I think I'll be quite happy all the way around! :up::up:

Now I think that I am going to match up a 4th card to one of the brands that I already have...put those 2 in my everyday i7 rig. And then put the other 2 in 1 or 2 other rigs.

Chilled WCing is definitely in the future. It's winter, so it may wait a bit. Right now, I'm waiting on Gabe of Swiftech to let me know if the 5850 heatsinks to go with the MCW-60 blocks are out yet. ETA was end of Oct., but I'm not seeing them anywhere. That would save me ~$230 after I pickup a couple more MCW-60s used. Otherwise it's looking like $105 + shipping each!! :shakes:
But I'll ride these until they're mopeds just like I have with these 8800's. :yepp:

PoppaGeek

11-13-2009, 08:30 PM

EK Waterblocks EK-FC5870 - Acetal+Nickel $109, does not seem like a bad deal. (http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/ekwaekac1.html) :shrug:

Naja002

11-14-2009, 03:10 AM

EK FC-5850 (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=579&products_id=26605)

Yeah, pretty much the same thing at PCC for $5 less. The problem is that GPU blocks are just a bad investment. :D Resale value drops immediately and just keeps dropping....fast. These 8800 FC blocks that I've got, I've probably got $120 each invested w/the mosfet coolers. I'm not actually expecting to get more then ~$45 each out of them, IF anybody buys them at all! :down: :p:

I'm trying to go with and stick with the MCW60's, because they are reuseable. Sometimes ya just need to get a new mounting kit--usually $5-$10 (x4 in this case) and some heantsinks (aka Unisinks) again x4. The MCW-60's are $25-$35 each used. I've got 2, so I would only need 2 more (=$50) plus 4 heatsinks ($30 x4). Instead of $420 for FC blocks. According to Gabe the MCW-60's fit the 5850s w/o a new mounting kit. So, that's $20-$40 to spend elsewhere....:up:

Gpu crunching is just an expensive hobby. I'll spend probably $1,700 on 4 cards and FC blocks and in 60 days I'm lucky to get $600 back out of it. :rofl: Plus all the hassle of resale. :down: That's why it has to be a "hobby!" :yepp: To me, a hobby is something you do because it's something you enjoy doing, so expense is not the bottom line. :up: And when compared to what people invest into other hobbies....this isn't as bad as it may seem. But, sheesh, it all still adds up! :p:

If I run these cards and FC blocks for 18 months and get $600 back ($100/card + $50/block)....that's still $61/month plus electricity. 12 months = $92/month plus electricity.

The problem with crunching is that everything is multiplied.

I hope this doesn't come across as whining. :D It's not. This subject has been had before and I'm not the only one that understands the economics involved here. I've just learned over the years to seek: Bang-for-buck! :up: I enjoy all of this. As I've said in the past, Internet, crunching, WCing, messageboarding, etc have all become hobbies within hobbies for me. I love WCing. Yes, I'm an Addict. I admit it. :up: But I've gotten a lot of entertainment miles out of all of this. While so many others today are running the roads, texting, partying--whatever--because they are "bored"......uh, whatever! :up: I'm busy. I've got stuff to do. Stuff I want to do. Stuff I enjoy doing! :up:

But in the end, I still seek bang-for-buck. The less dimes I spend to accomplish something....the more dimes I have to accomplish something else. :up: Gpu cooling is a bit of a dilemma for many people. It's nice to see companies like swiftech and dtek trying to come up with some standardized way of accomplishing the same thing. :up::up: And I'll support that, if I can. I'd buy x4 of the new 5850 heatsinks in sec, if Gabe will tell me where to get them! :yepp:

shadowwind

11-14-2009, 07:11 AM

i wished you had posted that at 4:00 am eastern time i would
of ordered from the egg :shakes:just my luck.:mad:

Naja002

11-14-2009, 07:54 AM

What are you looking for? Are you willing to buy from a private party or only from a retail business? I just picked up a 5870, so I'm done buying cards. I decided to scoop up one just so I would have one to help GpuGrid out. Instead of all 3850s, now there's a slight mix. 2 of mine from businesses, 2 from private parties.

Anyway, you interested in just the 5850 or either? Private party or no? Let me know. I can keep looking around for others...

BTW, some stores are starting to show ETAs of the 16th and the 20th.....they're coming!

Plus the last word on the XFX deal at HF is that there are still a few left....

shadowwind

11-14-2009, 08:10 AM

im looking to stay with the retail for my purchase of video cards easier to send back if i have problems i prefer insure them so i don't need to pay again to send them back,after 3 rma of 1 video card it got expensive out of pocket sending that thing back till i told them to keep it.:rofl:

oh i forgot im looking for 2 5850s pm me i will see that on my note book no matter where i am in the world i travel alot now a days.

Naja002

11-15-2009, 02:42 PM

So far, according to the statistics tab within Boinc, it's looking like 72K PPD, but hasn't leveled off yet.....for Collatz, of course:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f347/Naja002/CollatzPPDScreenshot.jpg

Anybody know of a good FREE screenshot program that works well in Vista HP 64?

EDITED: To correct bad information....

PoppaGeek

11-15-2009, 02:52 PM

I just use "Printscreen" button and paste into Paint. It works. :shrug:

Naja002

11-15-2009, 03:06 PM

Ok, Thanx, PG. I just did that and swapped out the image above. I could swear I've had issues with that method in the past. In FF I just use the screengrab and it works well for me. It's outside of the browser that I've had issues....:up:

shadowwind

11-15-2009, 03:37 PM

Naja that is with only 2 5850s crunching away correct.

Naja002

11-15-2009, 03:41 PM

No, that is only one card.....:up:

I only have 1 card atm......

shadowwind

11-15-2009, 03:45 PM

woow:shocked:that is some really good bang for the buck i hope the gpu grid can get a least 1/2 or all of that PPD wise,

Naja002

11-15-2009, 03:49 PM

My hope right now is that GpuGrid will pay at least the same.....that's currently looking like 28K PPD, but still rising. These cards I bought still won't put me up with DAK, Stonageman and JackofAll, but, hey, what can I say? Those guys are MONSTERS!!!! :up::up:

EDITED: To correct bad information....

shadowwind

11-15-2009, 03:58 PM

yup they are monsters hmm just need 6 of those 5850s to become a monster if they work out for the gpugrid.:slapass on the grid.:rofl:

Otis11

11-15-2009, 04:00 PM

I have a feeling if these post those numbers, our Team PPD is going to skyrocket!

French for Christmas anyone? :ROTF:

Naja002

11-15-2009, 04:04 PM

yup they are monsters hmm just need 6 of those 5850s to become a monster if they work out for the gpugrid.:slapass on the grid.:rofl:

Agreed. :up: But right now, I think I'm just going to sit on my hands and focus on helping GpuGrid get it together, and wait to see what happens with Fermi. I might perk up again when the 5950/5970s are released though, but I think I'm going to wait and see about Fermi....:up:

I have a feeling if these post those numbers, our Team PPD is going to skyrocket!

French for Christmas anyone? :ROTF:

Agreed, but it will come down to which team get's the most cards running the soonest....:D

shadowwind

11-15-2009, 04:24 PM

im also doing the waiting game to see what the 300 and fermi can do but i will get a pair of 5850s for now and hope i can run both ati and nvidia on the gpu grid, that would be a good way to start off a new year on the gpugrid.:up:

MikeB12

11-17-2009, 07:12 PM

who's in the know on what's going on with the 5850's.. I'm thinking about replacing my 2xgts250 in my main rig with a 5850 when they become more available... they're out of stock now. but I'm a noob.. I saw the gpugrid thread http://www.gpugrid.net/forum_thread.php?id=1458

but want to know from my xs brethren on what's up... I see my friend naja's gpugrid user, but cant make heads or tails from the numbers http://www.gpugrid.net/hosts_user.php?userid=7218

anyone know what's up with the ati cards for gpupgrid... ? I'd hate to waste $300 on a 5850 and ditch 2xgts250 for nada...

PoppaGeek

11-18-2009, 12:46 AM

I plan on getting a 5850 after they are more available and prices settle some. Lower power at full load, ATI getting serious about Stream and OpenCL, GPUGrid working on supporting it, and LOTRO game is going to support DX 11, the only game I play now, when I play. The new F@H core_15 will take advantage of the added features as well. Things look good for ATI selling alot of 5800s. :up:

Naja002

11-18-2009, 05:19 AM

Hey Mike,

Here's what I know/believe atm:

For our purposes, save the $100/card and just go with the 5850s. They OC like crazy (with Asus and MSI Bios). The 5950s and 5970s should be out soon and they are 5850x2 and 5870x2, respectively. Avoid the 57xx, they are single precision. Gpugrid is not currently running ATI cards, but are moving in that direction directly. They are waiting on their own 5850 to arrived for in house testing/troubleshooting and it's expected to arrive this week. The 4xxx series is currently not expected to be supported, because of the issue(s) mentioned previously in this thread (ie, they are very slow). Because of the headaches of trying to get these things going with multiple OSs...GpuGrid is requiring Win7 for ATI cards---I have no idea if that's just going to be for alpha/beta...or long-term. :shrug:

Personally: I have 3 cards in house and the 4th plus psu is set to arrive today. I ordered a Win7 family pack yesterday. I've been running Collatz while waiting on GpuGrid. Lucky for me, Milkyway is down for the count until they get their server fixed (no work) and Collatz went down yesterday and is apparently still down, so I'm frickin' idling. :shakes:

When I swapped my 8800s over to Collatz I was receiving ~2.5x as many points as GpuGrid. The only reference that I have is the first card started leveling out ~72K PPD ....all else equal that's about 28K PPD on GpuGrid. Who knows how it will actually play out though....:up:

I'm new to ATI, but my understanding is that their cards generally get better and better as the drivers "mature". :shrug:

Now if someone could give Gabe a kick in the behind and have him respond to my PM or post with a new ETA for the 5850/70 heatsinks...it would be much appreciated. :D

No doubt that I've forgotten something....:p:

The only reference that I have is the first card started leveling out ~72K PPD

Well, looks like it started climbing again and is still climbing @ 46K PPD.....

The 5870 is showing 56KK PPD and still spiked upward....it's At stock and I've had it less then 24 hrs. So, I'm not sure what's going on....

EDITED: To correct bad information....

Otis11

11-18-2009, 07:48 AM

Anyone eyeing the 5970 (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-5970,2474.html)?

Where's JackOfAll when you need him? :ROFL:

Naja002

11-18-2009, 07:55 AM

HIS ATI Radeon 5970 2048MB GDDR5 PCI-Express Graphics Card + DIRT 2 (http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/prods/Components/Graphics-ATI/ATIHD5900Series/H597F2GDG.html)

£573.86 inc vat

shadowwind

11-18-2009, 01:47 PM

i wonder if you can pre order the 5850s i guess im going to give the egg a phone call to see if i can.i hate hot selling items they never seem to be in stock.:shrug:

MikeB12

11-18-2009, 02:19 PM

cool, thanks Naja. I think I'll wait a bit.. but looks like 5850 is what is on my plate when they get more plentiful and the ati gpugrid stuff gets finalized.

06F150fx4

11-18-2009, 08:00 PM

Anyone eyeing the 5970 (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-5970,2474.html)?

Where's JackOfAll when you need him? :ROFL:

I'm getting one. Maybe a Fermi based card as well. Have to sell off my gtx295 and 275 to get the fermi though. Anyone in the market for a 295 haha?

Otis11

11-18-2009, 08:10 PM

I'm getting one. Maybe a Fermi based card as well. Have to sell off my gtx295 and 275 to get the fermi though. Anyone in the market for a 295 haha?

Goin for cheap? :rofl:

Like I have that kind of money... :shakes:

06F150fx4

11-18-2009, 09:19 PM

Goin for cheap? :rofl:

Like I have that kind of money... :shakes:

Define cheap. I'd like to get around 400 for it, but doubt that I will. I paid 550 for it like 6 months ago.

Naja002

11-19-2009, 05:11 AM

Not in stock, just for price reference:

Newegg--Radeon HD 5970 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010380048%20106793261%201067950589&name=Radeon%20HD%205970)--No ETAs

Also, showing ETAs of 11/23/09 for 2 of the 3 brands of 5850...

Naja002

11-19-2009, 09:18 AM

Ok, folks, word of warning here:

Not exactly sure what the deal is, but apparently these cards are OC limited, except for the Asus and MSI Bios. People are flashing non-asus cards with the Asus or MSI bios in order to by-pass the limit.

Now, the first card I received was an Asus 5850....and it OCs like crazy. The 5870 I bought is an XFX "with Asus Bios" (--I had no idea what that meant at the time). The Visiontek and XFX 5850's that I have will not go above 775/1231. Doesn't matter what I do.

So, before anybody buys a card thinking that they all OC very well....it's apparently not so. :down:

I guess I'll have to learn a bit more about this....

123bob

11-19-2009, 02:34 PM

Thx for your continuing info on this Naja. The 58xx and 59xx series is of great interest to me.

I've had that really annoying KVM issue with the 260 GTX fleet and the newer nVidia drivers. I'm rather tired of it.

My new plan is to go back to driver 182.50, fold on all my 260s, consolidate them in empty slots in the rigs, then populate the remaining rigs with multiple 5XXX somethings. (Right now I have one 260 card in each rig. Consolidating would free up a bunch of slots for ATI cards.)

This will only work if the grid is successful getting ATI cards working. I think they will. They seem to be busting butt to make it happen. I do agree with the comment above that we could shorten our overtake of the French team if they get it going soon, and we can find a stock of cards....:up:

What I will be trying to figure out is what the best investment in cards will be with this series. PPD/$.

Regards,
Bob

Naja002

11-19-2009, 05:49 PM

NP at all, Bob. :up: :up:

More info on the Bios flash:

Official Radeon HD5800 Series Overclocking Thread (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4066161&postcount=422)

It's apparently easy to do, but I have not done it yet myself....

jcool

11-19-2009, 06:07 PM

Otis11

11-19-2009, 07:18 PM

yay!

Guys, I'm in. Right now, my 5870 is idling :/
Milkyway servers are down, and I didn't know it could do GPUGrid now :D

Soo.. what do I have to do? Someone point me in the right direction real quick please :)

Oh yeah, did I mention it can run ~1050 core :D :D :D

Well, it's still in the Beta stages, but once it comes out well we'll spread the word! Seems like there are a lot of users who have ATI running Milkiway or Collatz, or have it idling b/c it doesn't crunch well, but that's changing!

As for where to go, I'm not exactly sure, but someone will point you in the right direction pretty soon!

Naja002

11-24-2009, 05:58 AM

Ok, Everybody, I need to go ahead and make a correction here....and I apologize for the goof! :up:

The PPD info that I posted previously is not correct!!! :down: The screenshot shows User Average---that's for my entire account aka Farm! Not just one card (5850/5870) which is the "Host Average". So the roughly 174K PPD figure is more then a bit off!! :down:

With Collatz having gone up and down like a yoyo lately....I still don't know what the PPD is on 1 of these 58xx series cards. :down: Right now, it's looking like ~72K PPD on Collatz. Which, all else being equal, would translate into ~28K PPD GpuGrid.

I am going to edit the previous posts to avoid confusion. I would really hate for someone to buy a card based upon reading that info and not this post here clarifying the situation.

Again: Apologies!!! :brick:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f347/Naja002/CollatzPPDScreenshot.jpg

Chumbucket843

11-28-2009, 02:31 PM

GDF still doesn't have his 5870. cant wait to see optimized opencl client for gpugrid. we must recruit 5000 series owners soon!

jcool

11-28-2009, 02:34 PM

I'll happily leave Milkyway for GPUGrid if they can make it work.

Chumbucket843

12-03-2009, 01:42 PM

I'll happily leave Milkyway for GPUGrid if they can make it work.

We are working on the optimization now. We will not put the application out until it delivers what a 5870 should deliver in terms of performance. Be patient.

gdf
enough said.:up:

Otis11

12-03-2009, 02:43 PM

Hey, has anyone heard any news about this?!?

Snow Crash

12-03-2009, 02:48 PM

Otis ... GDF just posted they got a card this morning ... they are good but give them a day or so will ya ;)

Otis11

12-03-2009, 06:07 PM

Otis ... GDF just posted they got a card this morning ... they are good but give them a day or so will ya ;)

Well tell them to get a move on! :sonic:

Haha, I didn't know that... And haven't heard anything in a while, so thought i'd ask! :up:

Snow Crash

12-03-2009, 06:12 PM

They actually have some 5870s in stock at New Egg but I don't think I have enough PSU oomph to handle another high end card ... if the ppd looks real nice i might give it a try anyway :shocked:

Chumbucket843

01-06-2010, 04:36 PM

hi,
we are back to work now.
There will be several good news in the next couple of weeks. We have been working a lot on the optimization for both nvidia and ati.

GDF.:up:

Otis11

01-06-2010, 10:44 PM

Sweet! Looks like this might mean a boost no matter what card you're running!

lkiller123

01-07-2010, 04:36 PM

We better speed up our production, our daily points is just a little bit away from the #2 team.

jcool

01-08-2010, 05:17 AM

Does this work yet? About to put my 5870 on water so it's just about ready to go.

Naja002

01-08-2010, 07:52 AM

So far, we still strongly suggest to wait for the Fermi-based Nvidia cards.
This is most certainly the fastest card.

GDF

http://www.gpugrid.net/forum_thread.php?id=1458&nowrap=true#14153

And, no, they are not sending any WUs out yet.....

HTH

jcool

01-08-2010, 07:57 PM

PoppaGeek

01-08-2010, 09:22 PM

Just because the NV card will be, may be, faster does not mean the ATI won't do well.

jcool

01-09-2010, 02:28 AM

Yeah, just laughing at his "prediction" that Fermi will "most certainly" rule all :p:

Chumbucket843

01-10-2010, 09:59 AM

:ROTF:

What kind of NV fanboys are these guys?
Here's to hoping that FAH will come through with the new V3 client... if used right, ATI cards are way faster for DC work, see milkyway. Raw shader power :>

milkyway isnt a benchmark for gpgpu performance. molecular dynamics (http://vimeo.com/2505856) is very different from n-body (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ua7YlN4eL_w) sims. n-body has high locality and is purely compute bound. MD is much more bandwidth hungry and f@h shows this. nvidia client uses on chip memory which provides terabytes per second. the Ati client cant use this. there really is no project today that could help us speculate how well ATi performs on gpugrid but we could just go by the fact that they have been optimizing their app for nvidia for years and they are just starting an Ati client.

Snow Crash

01-11-2010, 09:59 AM

update ...

http://www.gpugrid.net/forum_thread.php?id=1458&nowrap=true#14174
Last modified: 11 Jan 2010 11:08:49 UTC
Today we start to perform local performance tests on ATI.
A new nvidia beta application should come out in a couple of days as well.

gdf

Chumbucket843

01-13-2010, 12:56 PM

On linux,
the new driver simply hangs the machine as soon as it runs.
Also, the driver seems to be still beta (at least for linux) reporting a "for testing only".

We shall try under Windows.

gdf
so apparently opencl drivers for linux arent very good yet.

anubis

01-21-2010, 04:22 AM

deleted

PoppaGeek

01-26-2010, 02:24 AM

ATI STATUS.
The situation with ATI cards is the following:
We failed to produce performances better than a GT8800 with a HD5850. Even bigger problem is that the ATI OPENCL SDK is still very unstable, hanging the machine easily, so that we cannot optimize the application until it is stable.

We currently don't know if we can make it faster or not, but certainly it will take several months before the SDK becomes stable enough to be of practical use.

GDF

GPUGrid.net (http://www.gpugrid.net/forum_thread.php?id=1458#14324)

jcool

01-26-2010, 02:45 AM

Gna :/

zalbard

01-26-2010, 06:39 AM

Meh, I was gonna give it a try.
MW@GPU doesn't accept more participants either...

Naja002

01-26-2010, 07:15 AM

Thanx for the heads-up, PG....:up:

Meh, I was gonna give it a try.
MW@GPU doesn't accept more participants either...

If you want to run your gpu on MW....then just join up via the regular MW website and then select your preferences inside your account. The MW@GPU is no longer being used....it's all being done via the main MW site. :up:

HTH

zalbard

01-26-2010, 07:20 AM

If you want to run your gpu on MW....then just join up via the regular MW website and then select your preferences inside your account. The MW@GPU is no longer being used....it's all being done via the main MW site. :up:
Oh, and I thought I read something about them not being interested in more participants, so I thought not being able to register meant just that! Thanks for the tip! :up:

Chumbucket843

05-08-2010, 02:00 PM

i know im kinda necroing this thread but ATi SDK 2.1 released and it might provide some hope for 5K owners.

One ATI HD5850 and a HD5670.
The current speed of a HD5850 on ACEMD is twice as slow as a GTX275 (one month ago was ten times). There is still scope for improvement. The code is not stable yet, maybe with 2.1.

gdf

5x speed up.:clap:

CaptMorgan

05-08-2010, 03:31 PM

Nothing wrong with "Thread Resurrection". Heck i love my Nvidia cards but please give me an excuse to buy an ATi card:D

Otis11

05-08-2010, 05:24 PM

I'd love the option between the two.

I honestly have no preference other than NVIDIA seems to crunch better... But if that changes...

Chumbucket843

05-08-2010, 05:41 PM

options would be nice. it always frustrates me when some one new to gpugrid/DC posts "can my radeon XXXX crunch here" and then they find out its cuda only so they crunch MW or collatz instead.

ATi cards are great and their arch is elegant although i have to hand to nvidia for spending their time and money to support gpgpu well both in software and hardware. this is why i think they will have an edge at crunching. amd seems to be not as aggressive as nvidia at investing in gpgpu, probably from their financials.

snoro

05-08-2010, 09:33 PM

so if i got a hd5770 idling right now, what should i do =, get it running at MW or collatx or seti or gpugrid is working on ati card now ?

Blauhung

05-08-2010, 10:05 PM

If i were to attach my 5850 to GPU grid, does this mean It would receive work, or will I have to setup some openCL drivers or something?

Snow Crash

05-09-2010, 03:23 AM

There are currently no WUs for ATI on GPUGrid.
They have worked up alphas for the last two SDKs but performance is not good.
They have managed to go from 10 times slower than a 275 to 2 times slower, great improvement but still not worth while for the project.
Currently a 275 takes 4-6 hours (depending on OS, OC, etc.) and they want to double the size of WUs (which is what we are running on fermis now).
They are currently working on a version for ATI based on the latest SDK so hopefully they can wring out more improvements and we see betas in the near future.

jcool

05-10-2010, 01:12 PM

Be sure to keep me posted people.. TWO 5870's idling here now.

Chumbucket843

05-11-2010, 12:53 PM

The SDK2.1 is better but still has several bugs in parts which are required to run the code reliably. We must wait for the next release.

In the meanwhile we are working on the performance with the help of AMD.

gdf

fingers crossed on v2.2 or maybe 3.0:D

WhiteFireDragon

05-13-2010, 01:56 PM

so only the HD5000 series cards are somewhat capable? any hope for the HD4000 series?

mreuter80

05-13-2010, 04:09 PM

I believe the first tests were running on a 4850. Card is very slow, because the share memory still needs to be emulated (shared memory is handled differently compared to the 5000 cards).
No info whether they will be still running with the new version.

lkiller123

05-13-2010, 08:44 PM

I am looking foward to this.

Chumbucket843

07-01-2010, 08:49 AM

we are waiting for ati to fix their compiler and libraries. There is no much we can do. Some new tests are in progress these days.

Looking at the progress we are moving, i would expect to be in a stable, production situation with a opencl ati application for gpugrid before the end of the year. Of course beta work will start several months before. Maybe even just after the summer. All depends on them.

If they do a good job, i would expect an ati 5870 to be within a factor 2 slower or faster than a gtx480. I know that the two extremes are quite different, but remember that few months ago, an ati 5850 was 10 times slower than a gtx275 with acemd...

Gdf
they finally have some sort of date on when it should be ready.

Naja002

07-01-2010, 09:08 AM

a factor 2 slower or faster than a gtx480.
Factor 2? What does that mean in English? :shrug:

Chumbucket843

07-01-2010, 10:46 AM

in between 2 times faster and 2 times slower.

WhiteFireDragon

07-01-2010, 11:08 AM

in between 2 times faster and 2 times slower.

this is what confuses me. they're not sure if it will be twice as fast or slower than nvidia's top card? makes no sense to not be able to predict it being faster to slower, but they do know it would be double in something :confused:

Chumbucket843

07-01-2010, 02:04 PM

it's hard to predict how fast the code will run because there is a lot they dont know. they are just giving an idea of what performance should be, not an exact speed up over fermi.

Otis11

07-01-2010, 10:04 PM

Oh I sure hope it's a beast... one of my college friends got one and already runs WCG for me. Would gladly join this too if it was something worth while... :up:

trn

07-01-2010, 11:34 PM

*Hoping for 2x faster*:D:D

Chumbucket843

07-13-2010, 07:38 AM

Originally Posted by BOINC
Hi,

We'll probably be in a position to start testing of an ATI application after SDK 2.2 is released in a month or so. It will require a 5800-series card initially.

MJH
:up:

Otis11

07-13-2010, 05:52 PM

SWEET!

And here I was thinking I wasn't going to be able to increase my contributions for a while...

Chumbucket843

08-11-2010, 08:57 AM

Originally Posted by GDF
ATI 2.2 fixes most serious bugs and we will probably put out a test application for ATI. The performance is still poor for several reasons. ATI on one side and us on the other, will work to make it faster. Most likely, SDK 2.3 could be a better release performance wise, now that bugs are under controls.

gdf
:clap:

Snow Crash

08-11-2010, 12:10 PM

Keep in mind they are a University and are on summer holiday so I wouldn't expect to see anything for at least another month. Even then they already know what optimizations they need to make for the 460 so they might tackle that first.

lkiller123

08-11-2010, 04:28 PM

Chumbucket843

08-11-2010, 05:25 PM

I don't get this. A

A 5770 can perform about 100k stock in projects such as Collatz and MW, and even upwards to 130k in DNETC. While a GTX260 can get merely one-third the points that the 5770 produces, is the GPUGRID project not mature enough to crunch efficiently under CUDA?

collatz and milkyway are fairly simple algorithms. f@h, gpugrid, and other projects that use molecular dynamics have much more complicated algorithms and many more lines of code. it is harder to make them run as fast.

also BOINC points are really an arbitrary number. FreeHAL used to give loads of credits for wu's that used 0% of cpu.:rolleyes:

it is simply way too complex to judge how much a wu is worth. for example lets say we have to projects, A and B. let's just say they are solving an n-queens (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/N_queens) problem for a chess board that is 8*8 chessboard with 8 queens.

there are about 3 trillion possible combinations.
project A tries every possible combination and awards 1,000 point per wu.
project B uses logic to rule out many obviously wrong combinations and only has to check 3 billion combinations. it awards 1,000 points per wu.
project B wu's do 1,000x more work for the same credit.:down:

Snow Crash

08-11-2010, 05:28 PM

Points awarded have absolutely no value and are not indicative of the actual work done, the skill of the developers or the relative merits of each project. Some projects follow the BOINC guidelines for awarding points and others just give whatever they think will get more crunchers on their project. If you want to map the universe or count numbers then Milkyway / Collatz are what you are looking for, but if you want to work in biomedicine then GPUGrid is where it's at. On top of that, GPUGrid does much more complicated calculations and is much more difficult to code, in fact, as they have pointed out, some of the functionailty in the AMD developer kit does not even work correctly.