Does a 1.3 liter capacity reservoir exist?

[Deadly]

I have a TFC Monsta radiator coming in June, but I'm not sure what reservoir I should be using with it. Feser's product page states that the Monsta requires a 1.3L fluid:



Attention - Liquid Volume
The Monsta needs to be filled with 1.3 Liter of Liquid. Please be sure to have enough Liquid around.


Most reservoirs I've looked at seem to have a 250ml and 500ml liquid capacity -- can you get by with that? Or is a Do-it-yourself job in order here?

Thanks.

[Vapor]

It means the Monsta itself has a capacity of 1.3l I think. Your res doesn't have to be larger than it, you don't even need a res :) :p:

[Brodholm]

you just fill up the res with destilled water or something. The water go in the rad you know, and one it is full it stays that way :)

You don't need a res that have bigger volume than the radiator. You don't even need a res. You can just use a T-line for filling the loop.

EDIT: of course... beaten by the nipplepoking dude :p

[alacheesu]

:rofl:

Sorry, OP, but that made me laugh. No offense intended. To answer your question: No, you don't need a 1.3l res.

[Eddie3dfx]

God this is funny lol.

[JOCKTHEGLIDE]

Deadly are you in the USA try sam's club Vlasic® Kosher Dill Pickles - 1 gallon jar (http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/navigate.do?dest=5&item=181986)

if want large res 4 liters works well

edit: guy with can't pass whitcha

the larger glass res volume works as secondary heatsink

damn that cracked me up so hard......:rofl:
on another note does having more water in general through your whole loop help decrease temps??? since it takes more heat to heat up the water to more volume?

[alacheesu]

on another note does having more water in general through your whole loop help decrease temps??? since it takes more heat to heat up the water to more volume?

No, but it will take slightly longer to heat up/cool down.

[pika198]

damn that cracked me up so hard......:rofl:
on another note does having more water in general through your whole loop help decrease temps??? since it takes more heat to heat up the water to more volume?

Takes more time for the water to heat up, but after an hour or so of use it will be the same.

[Russ_64]

+1 to above.

My first rig has a biggish Dual-bay Res and 2nd rig Single-bay Res - makes no difference to temps if running 24/7 but total loop needs more liquid......

[cx-ray]

96878

http://forum.aquacomputer.de/weitere-foren/history-produktank-ndingungen/93867-update-flaschen-ab-und-temperatursensor-g1-4-au-en-innengewinde-zur-montage-an-k-hlern-finale-gravur-s-2/

[pika198]

hahahahahaa cx-ray amazing, just amazing

[Brodholm]

96878

http://forum.aquacomputer.de/weitere-foren/history-produktank-ndingungen/93867-update-flaschen-ab-und-temperatursensor-g1-4-au-en-innengewinde-zur-montage-an-k-hlern-finale-gravur-s-2/

:worship: Pure genius! :worship:

[ILikeCosmosS]

:worship: Pure genius! :worship:


that work of art is great use for HTPC and yet i havent seen anyone try to use this
you could literally take a 2 liter soda sized bottle fill it with distilled and you got your self a big res :D

[YMAA]

I'm sorry...but if you're asking that question you should not have bought a Monsta.

[Levish]

No, but it will take slightly longer to heat up/cool down.

If you handled aquariums you would know this is not true, it does in fact heat or cool the water (whatever the temperature is in relation to your ambient temperature).

In fact with a sufficiently large res you could run with no radiator at all

My 75 Gallon aquarium would struggle to maintain temps above ambient with only a 200watt heater ;)

[Zehnsucht]

An aquarium is often not a closed loop system (if ever?). I thought you needed some kind of opening somewhere for exchange of air. If water is allowed to evaporate, it will take a small amount of heat when it does so. Just by reasoning this is how I think it would work, but I can't say I know for certain.

[Ozzfest05]

I always wanted to make a copper res from 2 3/4 inch diameter copper piping about 2 foot long with two end caps two pelts on both end caps and use a cheap OCZ vendetta to cool the pelts

[alacheesu]

If you handled aquariums you would know this is not true, it does in fact heat or cool the water (whatever the temperature is in relation to your ambient temperature).

In fact with a sufficiently large res you could run with no radiator at all

My 75 Gallon aquarium would struggle to maintain temps above ambient with only a 200watt heater ;)
That's a little different. More water will not, by itself, give better temperatures at equilibrium. For better temps you need more heat dissipation. It's perfectly possible to add more water to a loop without adding more heat dissipation.

[NaeKuh]

That's a little different. More water will not, by itself, give better temperatures at equilibrium. For better temps you need more heat dissipation. It's perfectly possible to add more water to a loop without adding more heat dissipation.

when you have that much water and mass, you dont need uber heat dissipation.

The surface area of the water itself can dissipate all the heat required.

Were talking 75 gallons here, 5 x 3 x 2 feet of water... 750lbs of water... do i need to convert it anymore for ya?

So im with that dude, 200W heater wouldnt put a dent in a 75 gallon water tank.


why stop at fish tank, connect it inline to your swimming pool.


An aquarium is often not a closed loop system (if ever?). I thought you needed some kind of opening somewhere for exchange of air. If water is allowed to evaporate, it will take a small amount of heat when it does so. Just by reasoning this is how I think it would work, but I can't say I know for certain.

No its not, but as i said when u have that much surface area, and that little heat, u dont need a radiator.

[alacheesu]

when you have that much water and mass, you dont need uber heat dissipation.

The surface area of the water itself can dissipate all the heat required.

Were talking 60 gallons here, 4 feet x 2 feet of water... 600lbs of water... do i need to convert it anymore for ya?

So im with that dude, 200W heater wouldnt put a dent in a 60 gallon water tank.

I think you missed my point.

Increased surface area => increased heat dissipation
More water (without increasing surface area) => no increase in heat dissipation, only time required to reach equilibrium.

Of course his aquarium would work, but that's because he's increased his surface area, not because he's added more water. You can add water without adding heat dissipation or surface area, so it wouldn't be correct to say that more water gives lower temps. Again, I'm not saying an aquarium wouldn't provide good heat dissipation.

[NaeKuh]

Of course his aquarium would work, but that's because he's increased his surface area, not because he's added more water. You can add water without adding heat dissipation or surface area, so it wouldn't be correct to say that more water gives lower temps. Again, I'm not saying an aquarium wouldn't provide good heat dissipation.

no but i think you missed my arguement and his arguement.

With that much water, you would have a decient rate of exchange DUE to the hugh surface area. :up:

Also the fact it would take water almost forever to raise the water 1C due to the massive volumn.

[alacheesu]

no but i think you missed my arguement and his arguement.

With that much water, you would have a decient rate of exchange DUE to the hugh surface area. :up:

The main thing is the size of the surface area, not how much water you have. He could have the same amount of surface area with much less water. He could add water without increasing surface area. And that's the whole point: More water does not necessarily mean more surface area or heat dissipation. It's not adding water that increases heat dissipation, it's adding surface area. He wouldn't have better temps because of more water, but because of more surface area.

[ben805]

The main thing is the size of the surface area, not how much water you have. He could have the same amount of surface area with much less water. He could add water without increasing surface area. And that's the whole point: More water does not necessarily mean more surface area or heat dissipation. It's not adding water that increases heat dissipation, it's adding surface area. He wouldn't have better temps because of more water, but because of more surface area.

amount of water does matter, if you have 100 gallon of water completely sealed off in an air-tight glass or metal container without any air gap (therefore no surface area), a 200w heater ain't going to put a ding on it due to the massive volume, the glass or metal container by itself will also act like a large heatsink and transfer heat.

[NaeKuh]

More water does not necessarily mean more surface area or heat dissipation.

:shrug:

this statement makes no sense...

with more volumn comes more mass which also translates to more surface area.

[alacheesu]

amount of water does matter, if you have 100 gallon of water completely sealed off in an air-tight glass or metal container without any air gap (therefore no surface area), a 200w heater ain't going to put a ding on it due to the massive volume, the glass or metal container by itself will also act like a large heatsink and transfer heat.
Of course it has surface area. Surface area does not imply direct contact with air. The whole point of radiators is that they have huge surface area relative to their size.

But let's assume no heat transfer is possible over the surface area so you just have a big box that is 100% thermally insulated. Use that box as a reservoir in your loop. It obviously does not help in heat dissipation at all since no heat transfer is possible. Do you agree that your temps once you reach equilibrium will be the same as without the reservoir? Of course it will take a very long time, but that's beside the point.


:shrug:

this statement makes no sense...

with more volumn comes more mass which also translates to more surface area.
Not necessarily. Say you're building a reservoir measuring 20x10x5. It has a volume of 1000 and surface area of 2*20*10+2*10*5+2*20*5=700. Let's say you're not happy with it, and want a larger, cubic reservoir measuring 10,8x10,8x10,8. This new reservoir has a larger volume of 10,8^3=1260 but exactly the same surface area of 6*10.8^2=700. So you have more water, equal surface area and equal heat dissipation.

That's why I'm saying more water by itself does not increase heat dissipation. If you increase surface area at the same time then of course you get more heat dissipation, but that's because surface area has increased, not because volume has increased.

[NaeKuh]

but that's because surface area has increased, not because volume has increased.


so how is the larger surface area obtained?

[defect9]

by making it not cube shaped, more flat rectangular

[Deadly]

Thanks for all the help!

[Waterlogged]

I think I know what alacheesu is trying to say. If the area that contact the air stays the same, actual overall surface area and mass are meaningless. If you have an acrylic res thats 1"x3"x4", 3"sq. in. is exposed to the air. Using those same dims, if you had a res that is 4"x3"x1", it would give you 12"sq. in. exposed to the air...which would cool better. By the same token, if you made the res bigger, say 1"x3"x10", it would have more mass and volume but have the same 3"sq. in. exposed to the air. ;)

You guys are right when you look at it from a raw physics point of view but that's not how you should be looking at it. Acrylic, delrin, anything else a common res is made out of isn't going to expose most of the water it holds to the air and doesn't dissipate heat to well either.

[LOUISSSSS]

soo back on topic... lol

what is that guy doing with a Monsta radiator when he doesn't know that you dont need a reservoir as large as the capacity of the radiator?

[Fragger]

soo back on topic... lol

what is that guy doing with a Monsta radiator when he doesn't know that you dont need a reservoir as large as the capacity of the radiator?

More money than knowledge is my guess.

[Deadly]

soo back on topic... lol

what is that guy doing with a Monsta radiator when he doesn't know that you dont need a reservoir as large as the capacity of the radiator?

"That guy" is obviously new to water cooling. I am still researching everything, hence the newbie question, which I knew would elicit the "WTF are you doing with a Monsta!?!!" comment. I haven't actually received the TFC Monsta and can still cancel without any obligations, so there's a big chance I won't even go with it in the end. I like to go big or just go home, and since it can fit in my system, that's why I had my eyes set on that particular radiator. I don't mind if people want to poke fun at me (and was expecting that), but I do thank all those who responded respectfully. :)

[LOUISSSSS]

More money than knowledge is my guess.

i may have to agree on this one.

i know i was a noob not too long ago, but at least i know i didn't make any huge mistakes in purchasing anything overkill or anything i didn't need that netted me no gains.

but after coming to XS, i now have 2 x triple rads cooling a Q6600 + 8800gt =)

[Levish]

You guys are right when you look at it from a raw physics point of view but that's not how you should be looking at it. Acrylic, delrin, anything else a common res is made out of isn't going to expose most of the water it holds to the air and doesn't dissipate heat to well either.

Most large barrels aren't made out of acrylic / delrin, if you are talking about 50-60 gallon barrels they'll be plastic, and fairly thin walled, granted not ideal passive conductors of heat.

Regardless its theory crafting since the market is very tiny for quasi-geothermal PC cooling :p

[alacheesu]

You guys are right when you look at it from a raw physics point of view but that's not how you should be looking at it.
Actually, from a physics point of view is where I'm saying they're wrong. Look at Fourier's law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourier%27s_law):
http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/2/f/e/2fe61cad3e199afded5646cd07e60f8f.png

Where is volume in that equation? It's not there because heat transfer is a function of surface area, not volume. So from a physics point of view only surface area matters. But as both you and I have pointed out, there is no function that relates surface area and volume in general. Or in other words, there is no unique answer to the question "What is the surface area of 1 liter of water?". 2 liters of water can easily have the same surface area as 1 liter of water. And this proves my point: More water (greater volume) does not necessarily increase heat transfer because surface area can stay the same (or even decrease).

This is why we in practice use rads (which are designed to have high surface area relative to their size), not gigantic cobber cubes, to cool our loops. :P

[adam9977]

"That guy" is obviously new to water cooling. I am still researching everything, hence the newbie question, which I knew would elicit the "WTF are you doing with a Monsta!?!!" comment. I haven't actually received the TFC Monsta and can still cancel without any obligations, so there's a big chance I won't even go with it in the end. I like to go big or just go home, and since it can fit in my system, that's why I had my eyes set on that particular radiator. I don't mind if people want to poke fun at me (and was expecting that), but I do thank all those who responded respectfully. :)

Please...try to ignore the negative comments. Everyone should feel free to ask whatever they want...unfortunately, that also means that rude people can also say what they want. Good luck with your build!

[Rise]

i may have to agree on this one.

i know i was a noob not too long ago, but at least i know i didn't make any huge mistakes in purchasing anything overkill or anything i didn't need that netted me no gains.

but after coming to XS, i now have 2 x triple rads cooling a Q6600 + 8800gt =)

he didn't make any mistakes - only the mistake of asking a question to elitists who felt the need to prove how much smarter than him they are.

do you even remember what these forums are called?

GO FOR IT DEADLY!!! don't listen to all these haters... :) and post a build log when you put it all together!

[Fragger]

My 1.5 Litre res built from a bronze pipe and 25mm perspex.


http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t168/beveldrive/Customres.jpg

[Sly Fox]

he didn't make any mistakes - only the mistake of asking a question to elitists who felt the need to prove how much smarter than him they are.

do you even remember what these forums are called?

:up::up:

People should feel free to ask whatever questions they want without getting grief about it.

Making posts solely for the sake of displaying ones superiority is pretty unnecessary imo.

I know that I for one have learned an awful lot from XS over the years, but it seems a lot nicer to not lord over newer faces to the boards. :D

Just remember, we're all human. So they claim!! :shocked::ROTF:

[JOCKTHEGLIDE]

"That guy" is obviously new to water cooling. I am still researching everything, hence the newbie question, which I knew would elicit the "WTF are you doing with a Monsta!?!!" comment. I haven't actually received the TFC Monsta and can still cancel without any obligations, so there's a big chance I won't even go with it in the end. I like to go big or just go home, and since it can fit in my system, that's why I had my eyes set on that particular radiator. I don't mind if people want to poke fun at me (and was expecting that), but I do thank all those who responded respectfully. :)

keep the MONSTA bro dont let anyone tell you different trust me if you get another item some other fool will come on board and mock you for it...then you switch to satisfy that fool who mocked you and then another fool comes by to mock you for listening the 2nd fool who mocked you and the 3rd mocker will tell you to buy something else....

[Martinm210]

The only bad question is one you're not man enough to ask and learn from. Enjoy the MONSTA! I'm sure you like it, and post some pics in a build log when you get it..:D

[alacheesu]

Sorry for highjacking your thread with pointless discussion, OP. Nothing wrong with the MONSTA, and nothing wrong with asking questions.

[Alphahydro]

I assume the reason why Fesser suggested a reservoir that size is for purposes of a buffer in the event that trapped air is suddenly displaced by water and they're being on the safe side but thats being too safe.

Everybody here has asked a question here and there either to reinforce something they already assume or for a second opinion. No one was born with water cooling skills.