Does res size matter?

[Chris_redfield]

Right I'm in the planning stages of a new watercooled build and I just have a few questions to ask mainly about the size of res.

For my next liquid cooled rig I will be wanting to have reservoirs mounted externally for the different loops. So if I ever have to top off a loop I can just unscrew the cap and pour rather than fannying around with side panels. I will also be putting taps in the rear back of the case so if I ever want to flush one of the loops I can do so without ever having to enter the case.

Now because the reservoirs will be external I'll have a lot more space than usual so I wanted to ask is a bigger reservoir better for your temps? Will having more fluid in a loop make the temperatures lower?

From what I understand the temperature in a loop is pretty much at a constant (maybe a few degrees difference in and just after the blocks themselves but nothing huge.) So, by adding more fluid I would be in effect adding more liquid to absorb the heat generated by the components.

Would that actually be the case or because there is more fluid it would spend less time in the radiator so there would be less of a chance for it to dissipate the heat thus resulting in an eventual build up in the temperature.

I know more fluid also means slower flow and I might even have to throw in a more powerful pump configuration but because there is more fluid could I get away with slower flow?

I will also have spare drive bays that I was planning on putting some coolermaster cool drive 5 HDD coolers (mainly for looks, I liked the old fashoned analogue needles on them.) But after buying one and playing around with one it would need some serious modification to hold an SSD as well as getting it to look the way I want (get rid of the stupid flashy light show on start up, cut that stupid gril out the middle to have the fan exposed, paint it etc.) So I was wondering if I included additional drive bay res's in the front in a bid to get as much fluid into the loop as possible would that be a good idea or would it just be stupid because it would lower the pressure of the loop to far and there really would be no benefit to adding as much fluid as possible to a loop.

If the difference of adding an extra lot of fluid to the loop will only be a couple of degrees then to me personally I think it is worth it because I am wanting to get the lowest temperatures possible for the CPU and GPU's and I do not need those drive bays in the front.

I apologise for the length of this post but I just want to make sure that my next build is absoloutly perfect. I'm trying to make a hassel free easy maintenance liquid cooled build as I had one or two hardware problems with my previous one, and whilst there were no problems with the watercooling itself it did make trouble shooting a right pain in the arse. And tbh with you air cooling is so advanced now and easy compared to liquid cooling I feel that unless you do watercooling 'properly,' to fully take advantage of it rather than just slap any old loop together then for the CPU especially it isn't worth it.

[Webby]

Right I'm in the planning stages of a new watercooled build and I just have a few questions to ask mainly about the size of res.

For my next liquid cooled rig I will be wanting to have reservoirs mounted externally for the different loops. So if I ever have to top off a loop I can just unscrew the cap and pour rather than fannying around with side panels. I will also be putting taps in the rear back of the case so if I ever want to flush one of the loops I can do so without ever having to enter the case.

Now because the reservoirs will be external I'll have a lot more space than usual so I wanted to ask is a bigger reservoir better for your temps? Will having more fluid in a loop make the temperatures lower?

From what I understand the temperature in a loop is pretty much at a constant (maybe a few degrees difference in and just after the blocks themselves but nothing huge.) So, by adding more fluid I would be in effect adding more liquid to absorb the heat generated by the components.

Would that actually be the case or because there is more fluid it would spend less time in the radiator so there would be less of a chance for it to dissipate the heat thus resulting in an eventual build up in the temperature.

No, more liquid has no effect on cooling ability just the time it takes to reach equilibrium.


I know more fluid also means slower flow and I might even have to throw in a more powerful pump configuration but because there is more fluid could I get away with slower flow?

You know wrong, the amount of coolant has no impact on flow rate the pump will generate.


I will also have spare drive bays that I was planning on putting some coolermaster cool drive 5 HDD coolers (mainly for looks, I liked the old fashoned analogue needles on them.) But after buying one and playing around with one it would need some serious modification to hold an SSD as well as getting it to look the way I want (get rid of the stupid flashy light show on start up, cut that stupid gril out the middle to have the fan exposed, paint it etc.) So I was wondering if I included additional drive bay res's in the front in a bid to get as much fluid into the loop as possible would that be a good idea or would it just be stupid because it would lower the pressure of the loop to far and there really would be no benefit to adding as much fluid as possible to a loop.

As stated before more fluid will have no effect on temperatures, adding more reservoirs will introduce more restriction into the loop (all be it a small amount) lowering flow slightly but not by much, bottom line if you want the look go for it.


If the difference of adding an extra lot of fluid to the loop will only be a couple of degrees then to me personally I think it is worth it because I am wanting to get the lowest temperatures possible for the CPU and GPU's and I do not need those drive bays in the front.

I apologise for the length of this post but I just want to make sure that my next build is absoloutly perfect. I'm trying to make a hassel free easy maintenance liquid cooled build as I had one or two hardware problems with my previous one, and whilst there were no problems with the watercooling itself it did make trouble shooting a right pain in the arse. And tbh with you air cooling is so advanced now and easy compared to liquid cooling I feel that unless you do watercooling 'properly,' to fully take advantage of it rather than just slap any old loop together then for the CPU especially it isn't worth it.

So basically more coolant = nothing except more cost for buying it and it takes longer to reach equilibrium but unless you only use your PC for 30 minutes at a time that is really not going to help you in the slightest.

So basically do whatever makes you feel happiest to get the aesthetic you are after :)

[naokaji]

If a res is too small, it will be a pain to bleed the loop as you will have to refill constantly to prevent the pump from sucking in air.

Other than that, it doesnt really matter, but as said above, make sure you don't have a unnecessary large number of reservoirs to keep restrictions and tube length low.

[TheParadox2]

I don't think a bigger res makes much difference. The reason being is you have a heat source and a cooling source and somewhere they reach an equilibrium. Eventually, the fluid is heated to a point where the radiator cools it more aggressively, and vice versa; it can be heated quicker than the rad has time to cool. Having more fluid in this loop just lessens the temp "shock" in the system. The average fluid temp will rise slower, but it will also take just as long cool. It might make more sense to have a large res if its going to cool passively (with alu fins or something), but even then, this cooling will not compare to the cooling power of a rad.

A larger res may also make the system suffer from "thermal expansion"... that is if the system is pressure tight, heating more fluid will develop a higher pressure than a system will a lower volume and heated to the same temp. A higher pressure may start to develop leaks quicker or wear on fittings and tubing.

I do think a larger res looks nicer and would be better suited, but it won't necessarily provide cooler temps, it will just take longer for the average fluid temp to rise or fall. Im planning a system with a "larger" res of about 250ml, the 400ml is almost to big for the case.

[Henry8601]

If you have a large res it might slightly improve your temps as it will act a bit like a radiator, but the effect will be really minimal. But as naokaji says - a bigger res will made bleeding much easier.

[Zehnsucht]

If you have a large res it might slightly improve your temps as it will act a bit like a radiator

Only if the res is made of a metal. Acrylic/plastic does not transfer heat.

[Chris_redfield]

Right OK, that makes perfect sense cheers guys.

I don't know why I thought that more fluid would mean lower flow because logically thinking as long as there is no more tubing or reservoirs added to accomodate the extra liquid then the distance it has to travel is exactly the same. So all more fluid would in essence would be giving me is a longer time for he system to reach equilibrium I wouldn't be getting any better cooling performance.

I'm not really looking at having one large res for each loop though. It would be two medium/small res's for each loop. There would be the one external one (a cylindrical one like the EK multi option, I would like the XSPC one with the cooling fins however that is aluminium and from past experiences I don't want to go mixed metal loop again.) Which would be used as a kind of large fill port, and then there would be the drive bay res which would either accomodate the pump (if I can find a decent res that will allow me to do this.) Or just be used as a flow indicator.

I would then have another pipe in the bottom of the case running off a t-junction that runs to a small tap poking out the bottom back end of the case that I could just turn and drain the loop if I want. I anticipate that doing this shouldn't cause a problem as the tap would be at the lowest point in the case.

Would this be feasible or is there something that I have naively overlooked that would cause problems in draining, filling or just general running of the loop. Would I need an abnormally large or more powerful pump to take into account the extra resevoir? If I did then I would be tempted to scrap the idea of the front bay res completely. I'm mainly just exploring options at the moment, and having a drive bay res for the pump or flow metre would serve a purpose and have some aesthetic bonus's as well even if it isn't adding to the cooling performance.

If this would work could someone recommend a decent drive bay res (preferably single,) that would accomodate a good reliable pump. (doesn't have to be too quiet I'm anticipating that some of the fans I will be using will cause a reasonable amount of volume. I game with earphones and watch films through a deafening av amp so I probably wont be able to hear anything anyway.)

I apologise in advance if anything I have said is so stupid it seems offensive. My previous watercooling experience has just been single loops with just a res on top of the pump but now I can build those relatively easily I wanted to learn about watercooling more in depth and create something a bit more difficult and also easier to maintain.

[voigts]

For my next liquid cooled rig I will be wanting to have reservoirs mounted externally for the different loops. So if I ever have to top off a loop I can just unscrew the cap and pour rather than fannying around with side panels.

If you have an internal res, just run a line from the fill hole on the res to a fillport in the top of the case. I have done this for my reservoirs for a few years now and it makes them very easy to fill. An external res can be functional, but it will usually look like crap.

[Zehnsucht]

It's unclear from your post if you are going one or two loops, but if you are using one reservoar to fill two loops it is not per definition a dual loop system.

[moogle]

Only if the res is made of a metal. Acrylic/plastic does not transfer heat.

It does, just not as good as metals. It'd insulate more than conduct heat.

If I put boiling water in a plastic cup/glass the outside wouldn't remain at room/ambient temperature would it?

[Sadasius]

If a woman laughs at the size of your res then just beat her with it! :up:

[Chris_redfield]

I was originally considering just drilling a hole in the top of the case and havng a fill hole then running a line down but I think the external res's would look a bit better. It's a clumsy design as it makes the system less mobile but I'm not taking it anywhere other than my desk.

I'm looking to put in four seperate loops. I want to keep memory, chipset, GPU and CPU all completely separate so they would each have their own loop with their own reservoirs.

It sounds ridiculous I know not to at least combine the CPU with the chipset and the memory, but I want it so that is a stick of memory dies on me I don't have to completely drain my rig. I can just take out the RAM, and put in a replacement set while I await the RMA (It sounds a little paranoid to be wanting to run it like this but I have had bad luck with RAM recently.)

I also realise that I could solve this sort of problem by just running the memory on air, but I have the room in the case to run the memory on water so why the hell not.

This build is going to be a bit like the Americans who spent a fortune developing a pen that would work in space, as opposed to the russians who just took a pencil.

[Zehnsucht]

If you are planning to do this:


_____
| |
|Main |
| Res |
| |
|_____|
|
|---> Res Loop1
|---> Res Loop2
|---> Res Loop3
|---> Res Loop4

then you are using a single loop system as the temperature of all the loops will be the same since they are mixing the same water. If you are not, just ignore me.

Are you going to use an MM case?

[Eddie3dfx]

If a woman laughs at the size of your res then just beat her with it! :up:

:rofl::ROTF:

:bananal:

[Chris_redfield]

Lol, I had a good chuckle at that to. Though if I met a woman who laughed at the size of your res then surely she knew what it was used for and how to install it (make whatever innuendo out of that that you want,) then I'd think I'd have to marry her on the spot because surely she would have the same hardware addiction as me.

No I'm not doing that, each loop is going to be completely independant. So say my GPU or a stick of memory dies I can just drain the loop of the affected part, remove it, slap in a replacement being cooled by air for the time being whilst the faulty part is being RMA'd and the rest of the system can carry on business as usual. Thats why I want to make it so easy to drain and fill the loops as well because it wont be so much hassle to upgrade. I would love to use a modular GPU block however the only one that I would deem adequate of using would be the Blast Flow blocks though they don't seem as strongly supported anymore so I would have difficulty getting up to date plates.

I will also be dremeling a square out of the support plate for the motherboard tray as well so I can remove the CPU block and switch CPU's without having to remove the whole motherboard.

I'm not using an MM. I do like the mountain mods cases but I don't feel comfortable about the price and the shape. I'd be tempted to use a bobsled in the future for a HTPC though.

I'm a huge fan of Lian Li cases though and if someone put a gun to my head and said 'you can only use one brand of case from now on,' it would definately be Lian Li as they have a great case for every single eventuality.

So for this build I will be resurrecting a classic in the V2100. I will be heavily modifiying it though and at the moment am researching the different components and taking measurments for rads and the such like. I'm giving myself another month to finish planning exactly how I'm going to do everything and chose wc'ing components. Hopefully by which time the AM3 CPU's will be out (or X58 motherboards will have dropped by about £100 in price lol.)

[NaeKuh]

+1 webby's comment.

more coolant gives you a longer equalibrium. Does nothing other then that.

[zeroibis]

You could get a massive on that will make your equalibrium take like 20 hours so you get better cooling than normal :up:

[swale]

As already mentioned above more water makes no difference, it just a bigger pain filling,bleeding, and draining plus it costs more

[veedubfreak]

You could get a massive on that will make your equalibrium take like 20 hours so you get better cooling than normal :up:

50 gallon drum eh? I use a single 3bay MM reservoir for each loop and i can tell you, if you accidentally turn the fans down too low on your 4ghz q6600, it only buys you a few minutes before the computer shuts down :rolleyes: Freaked me the hell out when the computer shut down for no reason until i went to turn it back on and could feel the heat coming from the reservoir.

[NaeKuh]

50 gallon drum eh? I use a single 3bay MM reservoir for each loop and i can tell you, if you accidentally turn the fans down too low on your 4ghz q6600, it only buys you a few minutes before the computer shuts down :rolleyes: Freaked me the hell out when the computer shut down for no reason until i went to turn it back on and could feel the heat coming from the reservoir.

:banana::banana::banana::banana: wanna talk drums?

:rofl:

burry one in your back yard and use geothermal. :up:

[moreempty]

why do you drain your loop just to uninstall the gpu or cpu..??
just use a tiny bit more tubing than needed and remove the block with the loop running :)

if you cant rely on your fittings then get some better ones :)

[warriorpoet]

:banana::banana::banana::banana: wanna talk drums?

:rofl:

burry one in your back yard and use geothermal. :up:I am so going to do that with a huge bunch of copper pipe one of these days...

I'll need 2x RD-30s in series, but what the heck, I'll have t3h 0oB3rl227 73mPz0rZ

[NaeKuh]

I am so going to do that with a huge bunch of copper pipe one of these days...

I'll need 2x RD-30s in series, but what the heck, I'll have t3h 0oB3rl227 73mPz0rZ

0177G s0 PwN3RZ!

dude... that took too much effort to type out. :rofl:

[Fragger]

An external res can be functional, but it will usually look like crap.

They dont have to look ugly

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t168/beveldrive/Customres.jpg

[warriorpoet]

They dont have to look ugly

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t168/beveldrive/Customres.jpgrather pricey, no? ;)

[Chris_redfield]

The thing is though if I were to upgrade the GPU then I would be unable to use the same block and would have to replace that as well.

I like to use full cover blocks for the GPU's and the only modular GPU cooler worth its salt was the Blastflow blocks. Unfortunately they don't seem to be as heavily supported as they used to be and I would be worried that I couldn't get a plate for a future card.

Fragger thats a sweet looking res.

As for external res's looking crap not always. I don't want this to be a 'clean,' build. I like industrial, 80's sci fi looks and thats what I am going to go for with this. What I will end up building will be the anti murder mod. Don't get me wrong the murder mod stuff looks great but I like big banks of flickering lights and switches like computers have in old B-movies (though I won't be pushing it that far.) I like the 'used universe,' aesthetic.

[Fragger]

rather pricey, no? ;)

You get what you pay for ;)

[Chris_redfield]

Is that a custom res?

Where did you get it from?

[Fragger]

Yes it is custom built. I bought a bronze (which is 85% copper) pipe and had it machined, then got 2X25mm thick pieces of perspex and had them machined to screw into end of pipe with o rings to seal ends. It sits on another 25mm piece that has a 7 led light module in it to shine up through it.
It works as a passive rad as it warms up.

[Chris_redfield]

Thats really nice

[Fragger]

Thanks and im down with you on the used universe aesthetic, very cool look.

[John Planet]

If a res is too small, it will be a pain to bleed the loop as you will have to refill constantly to prevent the pump from sucking in air.

Yup, I lived there for about a week using a cape bullseye res. With only one pump running it wasn't SO bad and might have bled into my T eventually, but it would have taken a good while. The moral of this story: If you want to use a bay-style res make sure it's large enough/configured properly to fulfill its primary function, quickly bleed your loop.

[Chris_redfield]

Thanks and im down with you on the used universe aesthetic, very cool look.

I tried it on my first wc build.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/6006/uploadpic11wj1.jpg

http://img372.imageshack.us/img372/5877/uploadpic14od1.jpg


TBH after looking at the watercooled rigs on here I don't think I did it as much justice as I would have liked. Although I was going for a 'messy wires,' look I think I over did it a tad. Still, I was fighting for space with the sheer amount of components in there. I managed to squeeze in two HDD's mounted at the side and a bootable flash card reader in an empty PCI-E slot at the back as well as a loop with a PA102.2 and a UV ltd edition XSPC 120mm rad at the rear.

I will definately refine it for my next build though so I am spending a lot more time planning and checking out components rather than just trying to stuff as much stuff as possible into a mid tower case.