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View Full Version : BlackOps: 4870 and 4870x2 POST problems



saaya
10-06-2008, 03:17 AM
Hi Guys,

First of all make sure you use BIOS G30 or newer, there was a vga BIOS incompatibility problem with those cards on a couple of boards, ours included, and G30 and newer fix that problem :D
It seems that using only 2 6pin vga power plugs can cause the cards to not boot reliably or run unstable, at least in the first pciE slot on the blackops.
Apparently it might work fine if you use only one card, but as soon as you use a second or third card you need to use an 8 pin and 6 pin power plug and not just 2 6 pin power plugs.

So remember to plug em good and give em all the juice they need if you want them to run xfire and clock high :D

Gendo
10-14-2008, 07:40 PM
I'm having problems with a single 4870 (sapphire flashed to asus top bios I think, it's not my card). This is in combination with my blackops and it happens on all 3 slots. I'm using 2x6 pins cause this card doesn't have an 8-pin. I'm already using bios G30 so I'm thinking it might be the card itself. Just wondering if there are other known cases of these cards not working with G30 bios?

saaya
10-14-2008, 07:45 PM
not that i heard of...
so it doesnt boot at all?
but it boots on other boards?

i know that there was a problem with the asus 3870x2 card, but that card had issues on asus boards too, there was something wrong with the VGA bios iirc...
but besides that i havent heard of any issues...

Gendo
10-15-2008, 04:16 PM
I'll investigate further tomorrow. It wouldn't boot last night but I was also running the cpu on dice. Now that it's on air it boots fine with bios defaults. But last night I got a variety of debug codes: ff with fans spining, all fans spinning but no debug led, b2, b3, a0 and beeping. basically the whole bunch. I even tried a different psu. More will follow tomorrow, and if I feel confident I'll throw some more dice on the cpu and try it again:p

edit: forgot to mention that last night everything was running without any hassle until I removed my 9800gtx and put in the 4870. the sh*t hit the fan when I changed gfx cards.

NCspecV81
10-16-2008, 09:59 AM
Can someone tell me why my 4870 isn't working on my blackops? =o)

http://www.overclock.net/gallery/data/500/medium/4850blackops.jpg


However, the main reason for my post. It's regarding pcie clock stability with the hd4870x2. When I use a single 4870x2 my pcie clock can't even reach 110mhz, however with 1, 2, or even 3 4870's I can get to 125mhz and pass all the futuremarks. On the single hd4870x2 or any other combination where the x2 is in the slots, pcie locks up at anything near 110mhz. I'm bummed again! =o(

Gendo
10-16-2008, 10:01 AM
It must have been one of these 2 things: the board got to cold from the dice while switching gfx card. OR it wouldn't boot because the gfx had too high values flashed into it. Cause on air it booted without any problems, the only problem I ran into was that the core and the mem had too high clocks that resulted in 12500 3dmarks06. I know that an 4870 combined with an E8600 @4500Mhz should not result in this so I started playing with the clocks and now I get 17700 3dmarks06. So i flashed a new bios into it and I'll once again try it with the cpu on dice this evening or tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

Broken
10-16-2008, 10:23 AM
Alright, G30 or newer, meaning there is a G31/32 etc? Where?:D

saaya
10-16-2008, 08:26 PM
Can someone tell me why my 4870 isn't working on my blackops? =o)

http://www.overclock.net/gallery/data/500/medium/4850blackops.jpg


However, the main reason for my post. It's regarding pcie clock stability with the hd4870x2. When I use a single 4870x2 my pcie clock can't even reach 110mhz, however with 1, 2, or even 3 4870's I can get to 125mhz and pass all the futuremarks. On the single hd4870x2 or any other combination where the x2 is in the slots, pcie locks up at anything near 110mhz. I'm bummed again! =o(
hmmm sounds like a limitation of the PLX chip amd uses on the 4870x2 :(
Or do you know if it can be clocked higher on other boards?


It must have been one of these 2 things: the board got to cold from the dice while switching gfx card. OR it wouldn't boot because the gfx had too high values flashed into it. Cause on air it booted without any problems, the only problem I ran into was that the core and the mem had too high clocks that resulted in 12500 3dmarks06. I know that an 4870 combined with an E8600 @4500Mhz should not result in this so I started playing with the clocks and now I get 17700 3dmarks06. So i flashed a new bios into it and I'll once again try it with the cpu on dice this evening or tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

yes, thats all i could think of as well...
or maybe water in the pciE slot? but the card was on air right?
and the board wasnt that cold right?
hmmmm


Alright, G30 or newer, meaning there is a G31/32 etc? Where?:D
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3363175

NCspecV81
10-17-2008, 08:49 AM
hmmm sounds like a limitation of the PLX chip amd uses on the 4870x2 :(
Or do you know if it can be clocked higher on other boards?



yes, thats all i could think of as well...
or maybe water in the pciE slot? but the card was on air right?
and the board wasnt that cold right?
hmmmm


http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3363175

I haven't personally been over 110mhz on the pcie with the X2. However, I do have some friends with ASUS formula brand boards who can generally get around 120ish. Figured I'd bring it up incase you guys had time to look at it!

Gendo
10-17-2008, 12:40 PM
Well I'm happy to report that everything is working fine this time. I still don't know if it was the board that got cold or the clocks on the 4870 that were too high.

But hey, it's working now so what do I care:p:

saaya
10-17-2008, 11:36 PM
I haven't personally been over 110mhz on the pcie with the X2. However, I do have some friends with ASUS formula brand boards who can generally get around 120ish. Figured I'd bring it up incase you guys had time to look at it!hmmmm did you try bumping up nb and sb voltages? did they maybe mod their cards? higher gpu volts should help in getting the pciE interface clocked higher...


Well I'm happy to report that everything is working fine this time. I still don't know if it was the board that got cold or the clocks on the 4870 that were too high.

But hey, it's working now so what do I care:p:good to hear :toast:

Xello
10-23-2008, 09:00 AM
MY 4870x2's came today, and i've spent the last 3 hours trying to get them working properly. The current problem that i can't seem to get rid of:

http://xellotath.vox.com/library/video/6a00d09e64db94be2b00fad6b70ada0005.html

saaya
10-23-2008, 05:41 PM
wow, looks like the cards are way out of sync there...
is that with the latest drivers? :eek:

KingGnome
12-17-2008, 11:24 PM
are people still having problems with these cards? I was thinking of buying a sappire 4870 tomorrow maybe the 4870x2 if i feel like dumping that much money in a card.

cadaveca
12-18-2008, 06:59 AM
On BlackOPs, yes, we need a proper bios for 4870x2's, but G32 does work semi-ok...

tripgood
12-19-2008, 12:46 PM
On BlackOPs, yes, we need a proper bios for 4870x2's, but G32 does work semi-ok...

I have 2 BlackOps boards with dual 4870x2 cards and have not had a problem since G30 came out.:clap:

cadaveca
12-19-2008, 12:55 PM
So? We need an official bios, not beta...no support for end users with this board and 4870x2...is not good.:fact: I am glad your config works, but mine does not.

KingGnome
12-31-2008, 09:23 AM
I have 2 BlackOps boards with dual 4870x2 cards and have not had a problem since G30 came out.:clap:

Which card di you get then? I was thinking the Sapphire 4870x2 or the aus 4870x2 with the trifan.

tripgood
12-31-2008, 12:30 PM
Which card di you get then? I was thinking the Sapphire 4870x2 or the aus 4870x2 with the trifan.

Either one would be a good choice.:up:

saaya
01-02-2009, 10:24 PM
On BlackOPs, yes, we need a proper bios for 4870x2's, but G32 does work semi-ok...
hmmm semi ok? what problems are you having?

and yes, there should be a public bios with 4870x2 support, ill ask the bios engineers :)

cadaveca
01-02-2009, 10:38 PM
honestly, I don't know what the root cause is, but this bios is very flakey for me. P05 much more stable.

Also, dimm read delay and such varies on boot, without reason, making some boots ok, some not, when above 550FSB. 500FSB requires more real voltage than P05. PL8 @ P05, 1.25v. G32, 1.45v.:shrug:

saaya
01-05-2009, 12:49 AM
wow, really? same Trd?

Broken
01-05-2009, 10:51 AM
So is there going to be an official bios that has support of two 4870X2's or what? I hate being mister negative but after two months of " yeah new bios is coming out soon" makes me think otherwise. That and the obvious reluctance of posting in the threads about a new bios. (Is the Black Ops the only X48 motherboard without official support of two 4870X2's, or is it common practice these days to rely on unsupported fixes?I know you are working hard on your new bread and butter but please don't forget those of us that have not jumped on that bandwagon yet. Realistically these should be easy fixes no? I can live with having my board not showing correct VTT as I found out about that here, or revised GTL ref table or whatever tweaks were planned... I would however like an official bios that supports two 4870X2's as I plan on getting another soon and don't like to hear from tech support that too bad, G30 is not supported. My system is running rock solid now that I have changed from the OCZ to G.Skill HZ dimm's so I don't foresee a problem, but you never know.

Thanks,

Mister Negative Meany guy

cadaveca
01-05-2009, 02:30 PM
wow, really? same Trd?

Yep. I've it left at as issues with the read fine delay....one boot 4/4/7/7, next boot 0/0/4/4...(dimm=1/2/3/4)


Of course, the 4/4/7/7 is not stable, this issue is present even @ 333mhz FSB, and is causing issues. Nothing I adjust affects this it seems, and manual setting is of no use, as it seems read delay is set at boot, and bios adjsutments merely add/subtract from what the bios sets.

saaya
01-06-2009, 11:25 PM
So is there going to be an official bios that has support of two 4870X2's or what? I hate being mister negative but after two months of " yeah new bios is coming out soon" makes me think otherwise. That and the obvious reluctance of posting in the threads about a new bios. (Is the Black Ops the only X48 motherboard without official support of two 4870X2's, or is it common practice these days to rely on unsupported fixes?I know you are working hard on your new bread and butter but please don't forget those of us that have not jumped on that bandwagon yet. Realistically these should be easy fixes no? I can live with having my board not showing correct VTT as I found out about that here, or revised GTL ref table or whatever tweaks were planned... I would however like an official bios that supports two 4870X2's as I plan on getting another soon and don't like to hear from tech support that too bad, G30 is not supported. My system is running rock solid now that I have changed from the OCZ to G.Skill HZ dimm's so I don't foresee a problem, but you never know.

Thanks,

Mister Negative Meany guyi already pushed for a P bios for Blackops with adjusted VTT reading and official 4870x2 support, im sorry its taking so long... its not me holding it back :(


Yep. I've it left at as issues with the read fine delay....one boot 4/4/7/7, next boot 0/0/4/4...(dimm=1/2/3/4)


Of course, the 4/4/7/7 is not stable, this issue is present even @ 333mhz FSB, and is causing issues. Nothing I adjust affects this it seems, and manual setting is of no use, as it seems read delay is set at boot, and bios adjsutments merely add/subtract from what the bios sets.sorry, i dont get what you mean...
you mean when tweaking the memory clock skews it works, but once you shut down and boot again the same settings are not working anymore, or the settings are reset to default, or changed?

cadaveca
01-07-2009, 06:58 AM
Even the defaults change from boot to boot, Saaya, hence the issues, IMHO. Tweaking it just makes the issue WORSE. Every boot a new value is seen, for example, this morning's boot made for 3/3/7/7...yesterday was 0/0/4/4...all i did was shut down pc, properly, adn then turn it back on about an hour ago...

Don't worry about the slow release...really, we all understand that you've only got a small team there dedicated to the foxconnbrand, and you guys need to get bloodrage good so it can keep selling, before visiting older products that really seem to do well, and only have issues with specific configs...the 4870x2 non-support is a bit bad, but you guys have an excellent track record that this will not mar, regardless of how some people feel initially. I'd rather have one final bios that addresses most, if not all, current issues, as I do understand that alot of times fixes makes overclocking less successful.

DWade
01-07-2009, 09:21 AM
i already pushed for a P bios for Blackops with adjusted VTT reading and official 4870x2 support, im sorry its taking so long... its not me holding it back :(

sorry, i dont get what you mean...
you mean when tweaking the memory clock skews it works, but once you shut down and boot again the same settings are not working anymore, or the settings are reset to default, or changed?

I can't keep this board if it won't support the 4870x2. Oh well, going to have to find another board.

cadaveca
01-07-2009, 11:03 AM
1 card works fine. It's 2 cards that cause no boot.

saaya
01-07-2009, 09:50 PM
Even the defaults change from boot to boot, Saaya, hence the issues, IMHO. Tweaking it just makes the issue WORSE. Every boot a new value is seen, for example, this morning's boot made for 3/3/7/7...yesterday was 0/0/4/4...all i did was shut down pc, properly, adn then turn it back on about an hour ago...

Don't worry about the slow release...really, we all understand that you've only got a small team there dedicated to the foxconnbrand, and you guys need to get bloodrage good so it can keep selling, before visiting older products that really seem to do well, and only have issues with specific configs...the 4870x2 non-support is a bit bad, but you guys have an excellent track record that this will not mar, regardless of how some people feel initially. I'd rather have one final bios that addresses most, if not all, current issues, as I do understand that alot of times fixes makes overclocking less successful.

if you fix one thing you might break another... and many problems are quite complex and not easy to understand to begin with, not to mention how to fix them. hmmm so the values for the dimms are changing all the time for you?
thats weird, i never noticed that... hmmm what bios are you on again?
could you flash the bios again and clear cmos, then load optimized defaults and try again? i know some timings are adjusted during coldboot by the cpu and chipset automatically, but i didnt know those timings are affected, and even if, once you overwrite them manually they should stay set at whatever you set them to... could you send me all the hw and bios setting details with a guide on how to see those values changing, then ill try to reproduce it and get it fixed :)


I can't keep this board if it won't support the 4870x2. Oh well, going to have to find another board.it does, it supports 2 cards in xfire too, there just hasnt been a complete test and debug run with the latest beta to make it an official release. thats all the difference between a beta and final bios is, the final one is a beta that has been tested thoroughly to work fine while beta has only been tested quickly, and alfa usually hasnt been tested at all.

cadaveca
01-08-2009, 07:05 AM
Just boot up with 4x1gb HCF0, E8400, stock speed; check everest is easiest. I'll find my cheap cam and shoot a quick vid of bios settings, etc...gotta wait until 8hrs from now, I have my kids to deal with today.

cadaveca
01-12-2009, 07:40 AM
OK, so I took a video of it as it happens, so you can see what it is that I am talking about. Sry for the delay...I think it was worth the extra bit of info I found though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09I7USmvDdo

(Video now live)

Godmyster
01-25-2009, 06:43 PM
Hey,

i dunno if this is a problem or not but i was doing a little OC on my card and noticed that the memory wont pass 1050, starts getting artafacts in 3dmark2006 and GPU freezes at 840, so like if i want to OC the card and get it to pass without artafacts and freezing i have to do like 830/1050, is this a problem with these cards from sapphire? is it possible to resolve this? like with a diferente bios or something like that?

Here is the model that im talking about..

http://www.sapphiretech.com/en/productfiles/250specimage.jpg

http://www.sapphiretech.com/us/products/products_overview.php?gpid=250&grp=3

Thanks

saaya
02-05-2009, 11:24 PM
OK, so I took a video of it as it happens, so you can see what it is that I am talking about. Sry for the delay...I think it was worth the extra bit of info I found though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09I7USmvDdo

(Video now live)
weird hmmm... it always worked for me...
ill try to check this again...

Godmyster, thats a card problem, not a board problem :P
i suppose the card is either getting too hot or the memory needs more juice...
unfortunately there are no bios mods to increase the memory voltage as far as i know, only gpu voltage...

cadaveca
02-06-2009, 06:48 AM
Don't worry about it too much, Saaya. It makes it hard to boot over 550FSB, but becuase it hcanges, you jsut need to try the boot again, and eventually it works. It's a bit frustrating at itmes, but I'm not benching so much any more, so it's not so important.

If BloodRage is doingthe same though, then maybe something to consider...depends on what direction you guys are taking the boards.

saaya
02-09-2009, 11:26 PM
BloodRage is way different, thankgod, intel no longer messes with the ancient fsb bus so we dont have to fine tweak that anymore :D