Designing the loop.

[whatever]

Hi there guys.

First of all this is my current setup:
Intel E8200 (530 FSB at 1,25V)
Blood Iron rev. A2
2x1GB Crucial BallistiX PC6400
Gigabyte HD3870 860/2400
Chieftec BA-02-B-B

The rest doesnt matter.

I want to cool both the GPU and CPU as all other did.

First stop is the CPU. I was thinking at the Swiftech Apogee GT, but saw that various people recommend the Fuzion V2 instead of Apogee.

Next stop is the GPU. As you all know, the memory heatsink is separate from the GPU cooler. That leaves me some options:
Either keep the heatsink and install the MCW60, or purchase a larger waterblock to accomodate the memory chips as well.

How about the rads ? Well, I want to purchase a Swiftech MCR320 or 2 MCR220.. Why this ? Because, in the near future, I will install a NB into the loop, and more probably some DDR2 blocks. And after all, if I will limit the waterblocks just for the GPU and CPU, it wont be a problem.

Now the pump. The MCR320 is not so restrictive, but both the block require a pretty good pump. So, for the moment I`m stuck at Swiftech MCP350/355. I think it will do just fine.

Tubbing part is somehow tricky. The radiator has 1/4", the pump 3/8 and the blocks have 3 pairs of barbs : 1/2", 1/4" and 3/8".

The order is gonna be like this, I think:

I (MCR320): CPU->GPU->RAD->PUMP.
II(2xMCR220): CPU->RAD->GPU->RAD->PUMP.

Both of these setups have a common flaw: The heat from the pump is injected direct into the CPU block.

Why only a radiator (in case of I) ? Because the CPU will not produce enormous quantities of heat to increase the water temperature so much.

What do you think ?

Regards,
Bogdan

[Giannis86]

i would recommend the fuzion v2 first of all. You might also want to check the xspc acryllic edge. It also performs quite good
As about pump, if you are planning to get the MCP350/355, you should get an aftermarket top. Otherwise get the MCP655
I would also go with the MCW60 as you can reuse it if you change gpu.

[septim]

"Tubbing part is somehow tricky. The radiator has 1/4", the pump 3/8 and the blocks have 3 pairs of barbs : 1/2", 1/4" and 3/8". "

the radiator has g1/4 thread (newer mcr radiators comes with g1/4 threaded holes standard.),
the pump you can buy an aftermarket top with g1/4 thread for better effeciency and pumping power,
and most blocks have g1/4 threading standard.

with all these with g1/4 thread, you can just buy several g1/4 threading 1/2 High Flow Barbs like those of EK, dtek, and bitspower(dd fat boys)

btw you forgot a reservoir or t-line, this goes before pump inlet, so that you can fill up and supply your pump with water...

heatdump of pump going to cpu block does not really matter, because when it reaches the radiator then it would still be cooled down...

loop order, you can do it anyway you like, but the basic idea of Reservoir or T-line of water before the pump inlet you must always follow...

[whatever]

OK. I see that the Fuzion v2 is quite impressive.

Regarding the aftermarket tops. If I chose a top which has 1/2" barbs, and some threading for the radiator to fit, it wont be better ?

What about the noise, regarding the two pumps MCP355 vs MCP655 ? From the specs it is clearly that the 655 is noisier.

What about the rads ? What configuration should I use ?

I`m thinking that 2 is always better than 1 :D. And this could change the equation. If the Wolfdale isnt outputting so much heat, a good 120 RAD will be just fine. The GPU is more friendly with the heat, so a 240 RAD will change the relationships.

[whatever]

Is there a major difference between Fuzion v2 and EK-Supreme, excluding the part that the EK is more restrictive ?

I am forced to add some DDR2 ramblocks, but I cant find some decent ones, just Koolance.

About the loop. If the CPU cooling will be separated from the GPU cooling, it will give me lower temperatures ? I think it will, but sure adds more funds.

[Giannis86]

main difference is that the EK Supreme needs a more powerful pump (RD30 or 2ddc3.2s for example) in order to give best performance.
As about ram watercooling i would say its a waste of money. I would get a corsair or OCZ ram cooler instead.
CPU only loops will have best temps but im guessing you should be looking at 2-3C lower which shouldnt affect your overclocking...

The pumps: indeed the D5 can be a bit louder. If you dont mind the extra cash, get the DDC3.2 +XSPC restop. It outperforms a D5 and it looks sexy

[DRT-Maverick]

If that's the problem, why not do this?

I (MCR320): CPU->GPU->-PUMP>RAD
II(2xMCR220): CPU->RAD->GPU->PUMP->RAD

Pump it through the radiator before it reaches the CPU, so the coolest liquid reaches the CPU first.


Honestly though, I'd just set up two loops and use one radiator per loop, that'll help keep the water cooler in each loop (as the heat won't all be in one loop), and better flow rates. :) Though this is a little more costly, you have to buy a second pump and such, but this isn't as costly as imagined, if you get say the XSPC res-top with the pump. (I'm sending my swiftech micro-reservoir back because this res-top is so cool!)

[septim]

as i said above: "loop order, you can do it anyway you like, but the basic idea of Reservoir or T-line of water before the pump inlet you must always follow..."

temp diff of doing it his way or your way (rearranging block and rad) won't really matter. lets say Less than 1 to 2C which is easily dealt with when water reaches the radiator...

ddc (mcp355) with after market top or d5 (mcp655) are both quiet running pump, given proper vibration dampening you can lessen vibrational noise transfered to your case
or proper with noise canceling material, you probably won't here much of it V.S. your raptor/velociraptor hard disks...

also with a ddc3.2 pump, you have a smaller footprint pump that you could tuck away.

also another suggestion to keep your pump running smoothly is to give it proper ventilation & air circulation, or even its own 120mm fan...

[whatever]

Thank you guys for your time.

As you all guessed it this is my first time making a watercooling chain. I only studied waterblocks and several tipes of radiators. I had various designs of blocks, but I was unable to put them in practice.

Are there any major differences between several radiator makers ? Such as Black Ice vs Swiftech...

I have some issues choosing the proper fans. I want from my loop, to be quiet and effective.
I saw people using Scythe S-Flex / NMB fans. How about Silverstone ?
Some options :
1. Scythe DFS123812-3000 "ULTRA KAZE" 120 x 38 mm Case Fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185054)
2. SILVERSTONE FM121 120mm Case Fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811999344)
3. Scythe SY1225SL12SH 120mm "Slipstream" Case Fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185060)
4. Scythe DFS123812-2000 120mm Case Fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185053)
5. SILVERSTONE FM123 120mm Case Fan (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835220022)

This are some examples. I heard that the ULTRA KAZE even at low speed has a disturbing noise.

[Giannis86]

if silence is what you want i would go with the S-Flex..the silverstones dont seem to be that effective. You might want to check the fan review by Vapor in the stickies...

[Lloyd]

I was using some Sythe S-Flex Ultra Quiet 1600rpm on the below sig - and they are superb! I've change to the full speed Yate- Loon LEDs and seen no difference in temps just noise, oh and the blue light, lol
So i'm using the Sythes in my new build, they're expensive but very good

[whatever]

Thanks Lloyd for your feedback.

Yes the S-Flex, both the E or F versions are quite expensive.
I`ve read the fan review. Good job there !

Looking at Petra`s Shop, I found some good price offers:

1.120mm Yate Loon D12SH (http://www.petrastechshop.com/12yalod1cafa2.html)
2.120mm Yate Loon D12SM-12 (http://www.petrastechshop.com/12yalod1cafa1.html)
3.Zalman ZM-F3 (http://www.petrastechshop.com/12zazmsicafa.html)

In my PC i have only 3 Nexus Fans, which are quite silent at 12V.

[whatever]

Clock is ticking.

To buy list:
1 x Fuzion V2 Waterblock
1 x MCP355 ( x 2 if two loops )
1 x XSPC Laing Top ( x 2 if two loops )
1 x MCW60
Tubings
Fittings

And now the tricky part:
One MCR320 for one loop, or 2 MCR220 ( maybe one MCR220 and one MCR320 ) to create 2 loops ?

[generics_user]

Clock is ticking.

To buy list:
1 x Fuzion V2 Waterblock
1 x MCP355 ( x 2 if two loops )
1 x XSPC Laing Top ( x 2 if two loops )
1 x MCW60
Tubings
Fittings

And now the tricky part:
One MCR320 for one loop, or 2 MCR220 ( maybe one MCR220 and one MCR320 ) to create 2 loops ?

one loop is more than enough, both blocks aren'T restricting and you shouldn't have any improvement with a second loop, only more heat dumped by the pump...

go this way: pump-mcr320-cpu-mcr220-res-pump

[septim]

Thanks Lloyd for your feedback. Yes the S-Flex, both the E or F versions are quite expensive. I`ve read the fan review. Good job there !
Looking at Petra`s Shop, I found some good price offers:
1.120mm Yate Loon D12SH
2.120mm Yate Loon D12SM-12
3.Zalman ZM-F3
In my PC i have only 3 Nexus Fans, which are quite silent at 12V.

have you seen how much 1 nexus fan is? almost same price or more vs 1 scythe sflex-f...
for long term investment, and any mounting orientation (vertical or horizontal) go for sflex-f and undervolt them to 7v... (i have several still running quietly for almost 2 years)

or if only vertical orientation fan mount (because of sleeve bearing grind when horizontal), the Yates Medium Speed are good bang for the buck &
those zalman f3, with their emphasis on anti vibration mounts and silent running undervolting resistor which are both included...

1 loop with 1 ddc with top and mcr320 is more than enough to handle those 2 blocks you have...
or if you plan to go 2sLi or 3, the extra ddc and rad is what you'd call investment...

tubing, if you plan on doing several loops, or just changing tubing every time you want to change coolant mixture, then masterkleer is for you...
if you plan on going pure distilled with a few drops pt Nuke, then you might want some fesser colorful tubings with the color of your choice...

barbs, ek, dtek, bitspower/danger den "fat boys" all High Flow 1/2 barbs with captured o-rings...

[whatever]

Thanks septim,

Performance wise, 2 x MCR220 compared to one MCR320 ?
Why these ?
First of all, more radiator surface -> low rpm fans -> less noise.
Second thought : -> PUMP -> RAD -> CPU -> RAD -> GPU -> PUMP ->

[Polizei]

The heat added to the loop from the pump is very. The pump dumps what, 18w into the loop when your processor is dumping 180w.

The most important thing after making sure your reservoir or T-line is before the pump is to order your loop so that you use the shortest amount of tubing possible. Putting radiators between the CPU and GPU won't effect temperatures that much, if at all. Just order your loop so you use less tubing.

[whatever]

Thanks for the advice Polizei.

Tomorrow I think I will start to imagine the component placing.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/Malk4vi4n/31-01-07_2125.jpg

This is the case interior ( not my picture ). The HDD cage is removed, in my case. In that space I can easily place 2 MCR220. A MCR320 wont fit in the vertical position. Another option, will be to mount the pump with the res top there.

[whatever]

Are there some differences between MCR320 and PA120.3 ?