For the people who lift/train, whats on your playlist?

[Th3MadScientist]

I have mixed taste on my play list, its usually 80's, 90's rock and some metal. Was just wondering what other members had on their lists, maybe give me something more to listen to. Currently on my list is as follows:

Bon Jovi - Runaway
Bon Jovi - Living on a Prayer
Iron Maiden - The Trooper
Survivor - Eye of the Tiger
Rob Zombie - Living Dead Girl
Rob Zombie - Dragula
Rob Zombie - Superbeast
Paul Engemann - Push It To The Limit
Arch Enemy - Enemy Within
Otep - Battle Ready

I'm always on the search for music that gets you pumped and focused. So if anyone cares to chip in even if you don't lift weights. That would be great :up:

[Jochenp]

The soundtrack of the rocky's

[Th3MadScientist]

Any specific one, looked it up on Amazon and there is various flavors.

[Jochenp]

"The best of rocky" all the numbers :D

[twilyth]

Sound track to Conan the Barbarian - if you can find it. More classical style than "pump you up" music, but inspirational. But since the treadmill has a tv, cup holder, heart rate monitor and does just about everything for you but move your legs, I've watching The Tudors on my daily walks. Since I'm only doing about 1 mile at 2% incline and 3 mph, something like Rocky would just be depressing.

[comrad]

DIO - Holy Diver - The most badass song ever made, especially when you watch the music video.
AC/DC - Back in Black and Money Talks
Metallica - Master of Puppets
Children of Bodom - In your face (and other COB songs)
In Flames - Take this Life (and other In Flames)
Megadeth - Washington is Next

And then all of the other 70/80's stuff like Boston, Queen, The Who, etc...

[[cTx] Nooc]

"I don't know what I've been told..." :D

[phelan1777]

Nooc;2996447']"I don't know what I've been told..." :D

"I dunno but ive been told"





C130 rollin down the strip!

airborne ranger gonna take a lil trip,

Stand up hook up

Shuffle to the door!

jump out and count to 4!

1(in cadence step with left foot)
........
2
........
3
.........
4
.........

pull dat rip cord

pull it hard

pray to god t opens wide

if dat canopy dont open true

look out below

im commin thru!

[[cTx] Nooc]

C-130s rollin down the strip,
U.S. Marines gonna take a lil trip

Mission top secret, destination unknown,
God only know when we are comin home

stand up, hook up shuffle to the door,
jump right out and shout, MARINE CORP!!!

if my parachute dont open wide,
i gotta reserve by my side.

if my reserve fails me too...
look out Devil, IMA COMIN FOR YOU!!!

Superman:

Me and Superman got in a fi-ight,
I hit him in the head with some kryptonite,
Hit him so hard down he fe-ell
Hit him so hard he went to he-ell

Me and Lowis had a baby,
He grew up retarted and joined the naVy.

[chunkylover77]

Micheal Bolton really gets me pumped!!











:sofa:

[pross]

the vandals :D

[ARC1450]

Silence.

I know, I'm uninteresting.

[strange|ife]

I lift and train with beer bottles

but mostly led zep or some ac/dc

and sometimes mozart

also drum n bass/EDM

i needa get back into working out though, was going to the gym for a couple of years about 3 days a week..i recently bought an exercise bike and some other home gym gear..but barely use it lol

[Jochenp]

Sound track to Conan the Barbarian - if you can find it. More classical style than "pump you up" music, but inspirational. But since the treadmill has a tv, cup holder, heart rate monitor and does just about everything for you but move your legs, I've watching The Tudors on my daily walks. Since I'm only doing about 1 mile at 2% incline and 3 mph, something like Rocky would just be depressing.

Running in the gym is for fat guys and women, real men do HIT on the road, just like rocky did ;):up:

When lifting, I don't really listen to music, I'm too focused on the weights to even notice what I'm listening. But for cardio, as I said, a couple of Rocky's or some drum and bass or psytrance does the trick.

[[cTx] Nooc]

I've gone from

1.5 miles in 15:00
0 crunches in 2 minutes
25 crunches in 2 minutes

To

3 miles in 24:15
14 pull-ups/2 mins
100 crunches/2 mins

In a little over 4 months, with no music (unless you count cadences) or gym equipment. If you think they are going to help, just roll over and let the bugs finish up the work right now. All you need is a right mindset and motivation. Until you get those first don't even bother doing a crunch.

First couple months you are not going to see significant results. Then a week later you will find out that your legs don't burn anymore when you run. Two weeks later it will shock you that you can do double digit pull-ups, and so on. After that, you can do ANYTHING.

I say go buy a pair of decent go-fasters if you don't own one already and hit up the streets. When your lungs start burning and legs turning into rubber, suck it up and run some more. Maybe after few weeks of that you will realize that shuffling your legs on a $1500 machine in an air-conditioned gym with Underarmour and an iPod isn't really a workout.

[Jochenp]

Well, running like a madman is a workout, if you go for endurance. I think working out for muscle development or strength training can be a lot more effective when done with proper equipment.

[twilyth]

Running in the gym is for fat guys and women, real men do HIT on the road, just like rocky did ;):up:
Well, I AM fat so I'm starting out slow - like my Dr. told me to. In another month or so once I have some endurance I'm going to try roller blading. But you're a slave to the weather if you're only going to work out out of doors. Around here it seems like it's been raining every couple of days for weeks now. And once the thunderstorms start, you have to be an idiot to go out when it's raining.

If you're into body building, the gym is the only way to go. When I was into that sort of thing I was benching 380lbs on a progressive resistance machine. But to really bulk up you have to take supplements - at least most people do. The only reason I got to that level was by taking plant sterols. They're like steroids but not as effective. However they also won't give you liver cancer or shrink your nads or give you b-acne. My favorite was gamma oryzanol (an extract of brown rice) and Source Naturals' Phytosterol complex (although it might have a different name now).

[Jochenp]

Hah, I live in Belgium. We celebrate any day without rain with a ritual slaughter.



Oh and by the way, plant sterols have been proven to do jack :banana::banana::banana::banana: but make you take bigger dumps in all science studies done the last 10 year. Only thing they might do is lower your LDL cholesterol.

[[cTx] Nooc]

Well, I AM fat

Shouldn't nom so much cake.

On that note, for all you fatbodies, to lose pounds you NEED 3 elements:

Cardio
Weight Training
Diet

If you don't have all 3 than it's not going to work. Start out on a diet high in protein and low in fat: egg whites, chicken breast, smoked salmon, flaxseed oil etc. Lift 3 days a week with one day of rest in between. Lift heavy, not 'low-weight high-rep' BS, you need to turn fat into muscle.

Do cardio in during your weight lifting rest days, something like 3 mile runs, 1.5 mile runs, swim 1 mile, run 400 meters/sprint 400, etc. If you have bad knees of such like I did when I started out running, swim and do squats to make your knees stronger.

Stretch everyday, and before and after your workout. Stretch even when you don't PT. Stretching IS exercise, albeit zero impact. It prevents you from getting hurt.

Have one rest day during week. This time is actually when you get stronger and allow your muscles to recover.

Hydrate plenty. Put salt on your food unless you want to go down with 106 fever for most of the week.

Do abdominal workout. If you attempt to lift with a weak core, you will get hurt and I won't care.

I will add that before you attempt to do any of these things, you have to have a right mindset. Motivate yourself. Otherwise just sit on your couch and be f<cking fat. We don't care. You are a waste to society. Just roll over and die. Honestly. Losing weight ain't sh*t if you've got determination to kick your own @$$ every day.

[Th3MadScientist]

Nooc;3002702']Shouldn't nom so much cake.

On that note, for all you fatbodies, to lose pounds you NEED 3 elements:

Cardio
Weight Training
Diet

If you don't have all 3 than it's not going to work. Start out on a diet high in protein and low in fat: egg whites, chicken breast, smoked salmon, flaxseed oil etc. Lift 3 days a week with one day of rest in between. Lift heavy, not 'low-weight high-rep' BS, you need to turn fat into muscle.

Do cardio in during your weight lifting rest days, something like 3 mile runs, 1.5 mile runs, swim 1 mile, run 400 meters/sprint 400, etc. If you have bad knees of such like I did when I started out running, swim and do squats to make your knees stronger.

Stretch everyday, and before and after your workout. Stretch even when you don't PT. Stretching IS exercise, albeit zero impact. It prevents you from getting hurt.

Have one rest day during week. This time is actually when you get stronger and allow your muscles to recover.

Hydrate plenty. Put salt on your food unless you want to go down with 106 fever for most of the week.

Do abdominal workout. If you attempt to lift with a weak core, you will get hurt and I won't care.

I will add that before you attempt to do any of these things, you have to have a right mindset. Motivate yourself. Otherwise just sit on your couch and be f<cking fat. We don't care. You are a waste to society. Just roll over and die. Honestly. Losing weight ain't sh*t if you've got determination to kick your own @$$ every day.

I disagree with some of these points. First of all there is two types of diets, the gain mass diet and lose fat diet.

With gaining mass, you need to eat, eat and eat. You need to eat alot of protein, a bit of carbs for energy for them heavy lifts and avoid fats, a little unsaturated fat is needed for normal bodily function.

Lifting heavy wont do anything if your not eating right, sure you'll get stronger but you will have no muscle to show off that strength. If you think this is B/S believe me its not, there are men in my gym that are smaller than me but yet they spank me in benchpress and other lifts. I just think to myself that if they ate right and frequently enough they would get big.

You dont want to gain mass and then cut at the same time it will take longer than just gaining mass and then cutting.

To lose weight, just cut the calories. Cardio speeds up the process of losing weight and burning off body fat. Weight training helps keep up your current strength and prevents muscle cannibalizism from cardio. When you are cutting or trying to lose weight, high reps is an order, 12+ reps for each set. Weight lifting burns little calories, your goal is not to gain muscle, its to preserve muscle while your burning fat.

You calling high reps B/S just proves you have no idea what you are talking about. High reps build endurance and tone out your muscles while building muscle but not as much as with low-rep heavy weight. You can do low reps with heavy weight, but the guy next to you who is doing low and high reps will beat you.

Here is an anology.

A guy that does only low reps with heavy weight can lift a heavy garbage can because low reps recruit slow-twitching muscle fibers (strength) but he has no endurance cause he has not recruited his fast-twitching muslce fibers to build endurance so he cannot carry the garbage can to the end of the street. The guy who does both low and high reps can lift the garbage can and carry it to the end of the street because he recruited both strength and endurance fibers with his training.

Stretching is also overrated, strecthing does not prevent you from being hurt, it just makes you flexible. I have never stretched a day in my life. It may prevent you from being sore the first couple of days, but your body gets used to the lifting and does not become sore after the first week. If you train with high reps those are your stretches.

Starting off you want to do cardio on your off days, as you get into it, you want to do them right after your workout. NEVER BEFORE YOUR WORKOUT. No matter what kind of cardio you do you want to do it so it elevates your heartrate above 70&#37;. If it doesnt, your just wasting your time literally. You can run on the treadmill for 30 minutes, ill get on next to you and in 15 minutes I will burn more calories and more fat then you.

You dont really need rest if your advanced, you jsut work different parts of your body different days.

The toughest part is gettings your a$$ to the gym, motivation is key.

I can keep going on and on.

[Jochenp]

Strechting muscles that aren't warmed-up is dangerous. Also, high-reps for definition is bull.

[[cTx] Nooc]

Losing 80 pounds ain't jack, check out this thread:

http://www.leatherneck.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29787

Also, I'm not giving advice to advanced athletes, just to disgusting fatties. They need to stretch. They need to life heavy things. They haven't PT in months. I don't want them going down and becoming even fatter at the MR.

Also, eat 5 meals per day while maintaining an appropriate calorie intake. It will kickstart your metabolism.

[twilyth]

There's a lot to respond to here and maybe I'll come back and edit or post again.

Supplementation is an individual thing and while I can't prove the plant sterols work, I know that I had worked out for years before taking them and only rarely was able to increase the amount of weight I could lift. When I started, I was benching 170lbs or so and in about 6-8 months I more than doubled that. That's a pretty huge difference to say it's just psychological or placebo effect. The people I worked with at the time were amazed and probably thought I was popping. Also when you do studies on these things, it depends a lot on who's in your study - is it a good mix of regular guys or is it all gym rats who are on other supplements anyway. Not saying it's for everyone, but I wouldn't turn my nose up at it either.

For the most part, I would have to agree with Mad about the importance of the different types of training. That's pretty much what I learned when I was reading up on these things. For me, the fastest way to build mass was to do the single biggest rep I could and then pyramid down in 10-30lb increments until the muscle group failed. Although normally I would only do this for large groups like pecs and lats. For smaller groups I would try to hit at least 2 or 3 reps on the first lift.

Muscle and Fitness is a great magazine for keeping up with the latest body building news. The only problem is that wherever you have it delivered, everyone will think you're gay. I mean, every cover is a Mr. Universe or some chick who looks like she could kick your *** and 3 of your friends.

I suspect at some point we're going to want actual facts and such and that point I'm bailing out since it's not a priority for me at the moment. But some background on my situation is that I gained most of my weight when I started lifting aggressively. I added a lot of muscle, but I also added as much fat. Some people just have the metabolism to bulk up and get cut and some are just weenies. I'm a weenie. Gaining the weight wasn't a problem since I had lost weight before - not sure how much but think it was 50-60lbs over a few months. I did it by starving myself and riding 70 miles a week. That didn't help with my weight management. Then several years ago I was diagnosed with a variety of problems including depression, lost my job and became a vegetable. I'd had these all my life but at a certain point in your life you just don't have the energy to deal with things as well as you used to. Get back to me in 30 years and you'll know what I'm talking about - I'm sure I'll still be here - well, in spirit anyway.

[Th3MadScientist]

Strechting muscles that aren't warmed-up is dangerous. Also, high-reps for definition is bull.

Your more prone to get hurt by having bad form and doing the exercise wrong then not stretching.


It is widely known that using high repetitions (15+) increases your muscular endurance, using low repetitions (1-5) increases your power and strength, and by using moderate repetitions (8-12) and higher training volume (total work done) you are training to achieve muscular growth or hypertrophy. Of course because some peoples bodies respond different to different types of training there are always going to be variances to these goal specific repetition ranges.

There are some bodybuilders who believe repetitions as low as 4 to 6 for most muscle groups are best for muscle growth while there are others who believe going as high as 15 repetitions is conductive for hypertrophy. But even with that said, in general the different repetition ranges do not deviate a w`hole lot.
:yepp: but I guess around here it is not widely known. Training variety is very important because it keeps your growing, if all you do is low reps, your body will get used to it and you will hit a plateau and be stuck there. No muscle growth nor growth in strength.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/goulet14.htm

In response to twilyth, I was 150lbs all through out high school and then I became a lazy bum and just ate junk food and I was at 165. It was not till I got kidney stones from drinking so much soda that all my calcium was depleted ( calcium prevents kidney stones) that I chose to workout. I started to eat healthy and bulked up, I ended up at 194lbs. Now im on my fat-burning diet, I'm down to 185.5lbs.

[twilyth]

I should have mentioned that as I would pyramid down, I increased the reps. So if I did a preacher curl at 160lbs and did 2-3 reps, I would go down to 30lbs and do 10-20 reps or as many as it took for my biceps to start quivering from exhaustion. At the end of a really good set I barely had enough strength left to touch my nose.

[Th3MadScientist]

I do a version of pyramids too, to keep my body guessing. I also switch up the order of exercises each time as well. I usually do 3 sets of 12 and then bump it up 10-15lbs and do however many reps I can get till muscle failure (On current diet and workout plan).

[Jochenp]

There's a lot to respond to here and maybe I'll come back and edit or post again.

Supplementation is an individual thing and while I can't prove the plant sterols work, I know that I had worked out for years before taking them and only rarely was able to increase the amount of weight I could lift. When I started, I was benching 170lbs or so and in about 6-8 months I more than doubled that. That's a pretty huge difference to say it's just psychological or placebo effect. The people I worked with at the time were amazed and probably thought I was popping. Also when you do studies on these things, it depends a lot on who's in your study - is it a good mix of regular guys or is it all gym rats who are on other supplements anyway. Not saying it's for everyone, but I wouldn't turn my nose up at it either.

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/phytochemicals/sterols/

Alterations in Testosterone Metabolism

Limited evidence from animal studies suggests that very high phytosterol intakes can alter testosterone metabolism by inhibiting 5-alpha-reductase, a membrane-bound enzyme that converts testosterone to dihydrotestosterone, a more potent metabolite (24, 25). It is not known whether human phytosterol consumption alters testosterone metabolism. No significant changes in free or total serum testosterone concentrations were observed in men who consumed 1.6 g/d of plant sterol esters for one year (26).

Link 26:


OBJECTIVE: To evaluate both efficacy and safety in humans of long-term consumption of spreads containing plant sterol esters. DESIGN: Randomized double-blind placebo-controlled parallel trial. SUBJECTS:: Hundred and eighty-five healthy volunteers (35-64 y). INTERVENTION: Volunteers daily consumed 20 g spread enriched with 1.6 g plant sterols as fatty acid esters or a control spread for 1 y. They continued their habitual diet and lifestyle. Outcome measures included efficacy markers such as total and LDL-cholesterol, a large range of safety parameters, and reporting of adverse events. RESULTS: Consumption of the plant sterol ester-enriched spread consistently lowered total and LDL cholesterol during the 1 y period on average by 4 and 6%, respectively (0.01 < P < 0.05). Plant sterols intake did on average not result in a lower carotenoid concentration (when expressed per LDL-cholesterol) after 52 weeks (P>0.05). However, carotenoid concentrations changed over time. Plant sterols intake reduced lipid adjusted alpha- and beta-carotene-concentrations by only 15-25% after 1 y, relative to control. Lipid-adjusted fat-soluble vitamin concentrations remained unchanged. Plant sterol concentrations in serum were increased from 2.76 to 5.31 ( micro mol/mmol total cholesterol) for campesterol (P<0.0001) and from 1.86 to 2.47 ( micro mol/mmol total cholesterol) for beta-sitosterol (P<0.0001). The increase in total plant sterol concentration in red blood cells (5.29-9.62 micro g/g) did not affect red blood cell deformability. Hormone levels in males (free and total testosterone) and females (luteinizing hormone, follicle stimulating hormone, beta-estradiol and progesterone) as well as all clinical chemical and hematological parameters measured were unaffected. Adverse events reported were not different between subjects consuming control spread and subjects consuming plant sterol esters-enriched spread. CONCLUSION: Consumption of a plant sterol esters-enriched spread is an effective way to consistently lower blood cholesterol concentrations and is safe to use over a long period of time.

It just doesn't work. Maybe your training regime was better during that time or you ate more proteins or I know what, but it wasn't due to the sterols.
Maybe, and this is speculation, those sterols weren't really sterols but pro-hormones. I don't know the company you said you bought it from, so I can't tell if they are thrustworthy, but in a study done on 20 well-known supplement company's last year, 17 of them were found to put steroids and pro-hormones into regular supps.

[Jochenp]

Your more prone to get hurt by having bad form and doing the exercise wrong then not stretching.

:yepp: but I guess around here it is not widely known. Training variety is very important because it keeps your growing, if all you do is low reps, your body will get used to it and you will hit a plateau and be stuck there. No muscle growth nor growth in strength.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/goulet14.htm


So because doing your exercices with wrong form is worse than stretching cold muscles, it is safe all of a sudden? Wrong form is deadly and can harm your back for the rest of your life. It is about the worst mistake one can make while lifting. Quite obvious that stretching cold muscles is less dangerous.
Cold stretching is a sure way to get torn muscles over time.
http://www.landry.com/stretchingpreventinjury.htm
http://www.kidshealth.org/teen/food_fitness/exercise/stretching.html
http://www.pponline.co.uk/forum/talk-injury/stretching-cold-muscles
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/90650/stretching_and_fitness_why_when_and.html


By the way, I'm not saying that high repetitions don't deserve a place in a training program. It's great to keep your body guessing.
But I want to debunk the myth that low rep is for mass and high rep for definition. Both low rep and high rep are for strength and mass (to a certain extent). Definition is how your muscles stand out. You get definition by training hard so you get muscles and by cutting so fat doesn't cover them. It's a result of training and diet, not a result of doing high rep sets.

[twilyth]

That's very interesting and thanks for taking the time to look it up and post it.

The part about DHT is pretty interesting and might be the explanation. That's the same hormone that's involved in male pattern baldness although I don't recall if baldness is the result of too much DHT or a heightened sensitivity of the hair follicles. If the former, then that would explain why I still have all my hair even though most men on both sides of my family tend to go bald.

The only other possible difference is the fact that at the time I had started taking Prozac. That increases serotonin levels and elevated serotonin raises your pain threshold. But it's not a huge difference - possibly comparable to being slightly intoxicated - if that. Plus I've never heard about SSRI's like Prozac having any impact on the effectiveness of one's training. It's not like GHB - which works differently anyway.

You could be right and maybe there was something else that I was unaware of, but if so, it would have had to have been something pretty minor which had a very significant effect. I wasn't exaggerating about the progress I made or the amount of time involved.

edit - Source Naturals is a very well know brand in the US - at least among us supplement poppers. Could you post a link to the article about the companies that were doping their supplements?

edit - ok, good thing I go back and reread my posts. I got the DHT thing backwards. For my logic to work, inhibiting conversion to DHT would have to have been the key - in which case the stuff about baldness is completely irrelevant. Apologies.

[Th3MadScientist]

So because doing your exercices with wrong form is worse than stretching cold muscles, it is safe all of a sudden? Wrong form is deadly and can harm your back for the rest of your life. It is about the worst mistake one can make while lifting. Quite obvious that stretching cold muscles is less dangerous.
Cold stretching is a sure way to get torn muscles over time.
http://www.landry.com/stretchingpreventinjury.htm
http://www.kidshealth.org/teen/food_fitness/exercise/stretching.html
http://www.pponline.co.uk/forum/talk-injury/stretching-cold-muscles
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/90650/stretching_and_fitness_why_when_and.html


By the way, I'm not saying that high repetitions don't deserve a place in a training program. It's great to keep your body guessing.
But I want to debunk the myth that low rep is for mass and high rep for definition. Both low rep and high rep are for strength and mass (to a certain extent). Definition is how your muscles stand out. You get definition by training hard so you get muscles and by cutting so fat doesn't cover them. It's a result of training and diet, not a result of doing high rep sets.

I apologize, I was refering to myself when I was talking about stretching not to the general public, if you want to stretch thats fine with me, but I just view it as wasting time at the gym. You can do high rep with light weight and it will be the same thing as stretching plus stimulating your muscle. It's like giving your muscle a one-two punch and cutting your gym time. Like i mentioned before depending on how many reps you do, it will recruit different muscle fibers for low reps it will recruit slow-twitching muscle fibers, medium will recruit a bit of both slow/fast twitching and high will recruit fast. These two types have different functionality. Although you are absolutely correct about the "toning" myth, there is someting I want to point out, some folks will consider it toning, but what they are actually doing it offsetting muscle breakdown from cardio. If a person did training and gained a decent amount of muscle but then decided they want to lose weight and just focus on cardio and not training, the body is gonna cannibilize muscle for energy during extended cardio, which is bad for body fat reduction because in the end you'll have no body fat but also no muscle to show off. Why would you run for 8 miles all at once:shakes:. Most gym people do not get the concept of HIIT and that it preserves muscle mass. Back to my point. You have different types of people, different mindset and a whole lot of wrong information, it's amazing what people believe:shakes:. First is the person who lifted gained some muscle mass, then stopped and did extended amounts of cardio and nothing but cardio. He did so much cardio that he lost most of his body fat, became shredded but also lost most of his muscle mass, these are the shrimpy looking fellows at the gym that bench twice their weight. Second you have a person who lifted, gained huge amounts of muscle mass and did cardio. He gained so much that even with muscle breakdown he had plenty of muscle left over, those are rare. Then you have the smart fellow who gain muscle mass, not as much as the second guy but more then the first and he did HIIT which helps preserve muscle as well as high reps which keeps muscle in check, and even though some cannibalism had occured, his strength training had offset it with some muscle growth.:up:

[Jochenp]

I can't find the exact studie I recalled, but here are some similar studies:
http://www.ergogenics.org/beyondbalco.html
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=17364927
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/21/sports/tennis/21tennis.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22120084/
http://cyclingnutrition.blogspot.com/2007/12/dirty-supplements-study-finds.html
http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/18/1676_52453.htm

And the list goes on and on...

[Jochenp]

I apologize, I was refering to myself when I was talking about stretching not to the general public, if you want to stretch thats fine with me, but I just view it as wasting time at the gym. You can do high rep with light weight and it will be the same thing as stretching plus stimulating your muscle. It's like giving your muscle a one-two punch and cutting your gym time. Like i mentioned before depending on how many reps you do, it will recruit different muscle fibers for low reps it will recruit slow-twitching muscle fibers, medium will recruit a bit of both slow/fast twitching and high will recruit fast. These two types have different functionality. Although you are absolutely correct about the "toning" myth, there is someting I want to point out, some folks will consider it toning, but what they are actually doing it offsetting muscle breakdown from cardio. If a person did training and gained a decent amount of muscle but then decided they want to lose weight and just focus on cardio and not training, the body is gonna cannibilize muscle for energy during extended cardio, which is bad for body fat reduction because in the end you'll have no body fat but also no muscle to show off. Why would you run for 8 miles all at once:shakes:. Most gym people do not get the concept of HIIT and that it preserves muscle mass. Back to my point. You have different types of people, different mindset and a whole lot of wrong information, it's amazing what people believe:shakes:. First is the person who lifted gained some muscle mass, then stopped and did extended amounts of cardio and nothing but cardio. He did so much cardio that he lost most of his body fat, became shredded but also lost most of his muscle mass, these are the shrimpy looking fellows at the gym that bench twice their weight. Second you have a person who lifted, gained huge amounts of muscle mass and did cardio. He gained so much that even with muscle breakdown he had plenty of muscle left over, those are rare. Then you have the smart fellow who gain muscle mass, not as much as the second guy but more then the first and he did HIIT which helps preserve muscle as well as high reps which keeps muscle in check, and even though some cannibalism had occured, his strength training had offset it with some muscle growth.:up:

QFT :up:

[Th3MadScientist]

Speaking of supplements, what do you guys take?

I take three, Optimum Whey Protein, Optimum 2-1-1 Recovery and Hydroxycut Hardcore.

Whey Protein just as a snack, I usually do one scoop with milk once a day.
Optimum 2-1-1 Recovery right after a workout, its critical to give your body nutrients within the first 45 minutes after a workout for optimal muscle growth and recovery.
Hydroxycut Hardcore for fat-burning - I know someone will object, but I know that all it is, is caffeine. 300mg of caffeine is like 3 cups of coffee, and that costs of the one pill compared to one cup of coffee justifies its price. It is a great energy booster during cardio.

[Jochenp]

Homemade ZMA, local brand Whey Protein. That's all. I drink coffee as a supp too :D

[Th3MadScientist]

Whats ZMA? I also sip on some Lipton green tea as well as it helps raise metabolism.

[twilyth]

I can't find the exact studie I recalled, but here are some similar studies:
http://www.ergogenics.org/beyondbalco.html
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=17364927
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/21/sports/tennis/21tennis.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22120084/
http://cyclingnutrition.blogspot.com/2007/12/dirty-supplements-study-finds.html
http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/18/1676_52453.htm

And the list goes on and on...
I think I read almost all of the articles. The one from ergogenics is excellent. You never really knew what you were getting even from brand name manufacturers since any given ingredient is normally synthesized by only a handful of companies most of which no one has ever heard of. So it's possible my supplements were contaminated. I had actually bought one of the Universal products (NYT article) but the dose of gamma oryzanol was so huge I never used it. I do know that whatever was in it, aside from the gains I saw, my recovery time went from a few days minimum to 48 hours. So maybe there were some steroids in there but not enough to give me any side effects.

@mad - I don't take any performance supplements any more - mostly vitamins, minerals and anti-oxidants. If I did, it would probably be an amino acid complex with some extra Ornithine and Arginine.

[Th3MadScientist]

Yea I understand but with the world we live in, we honestly do not have the time to eat what we would like to eat and the supplements provide a shortcut I'd say. Green tea is a great source of anti-oxidants, much more than orange juice, plus having a cold really stops lifting dead in its tracks.

I take a multivitamin as well, mostly for Vitamin C since all I drink is water and usually avoid orange juice due to empty calories.

[[cTx] Nooc]

I buy flaxseed oil from Costco. Omega 3 is good for avoiding joint problems, among other benefits.

Other than that I don't take any supplements.

What Scientist said, don't drink your calories, you won't feel any more full but they are still going straight on you butt.

[Jochenp]

Yeah ergogenics is my homepage :D I love the site.
I forgot, I take a huge amount of Omega3 every day, about 3 grams of DHA and 5 grams of EPA.

[Th3MadScientist]

The worst for you is soda, so many empty calories and 25g of sugar, thats like taking 6 1/4 teaspoons and adding it to your coffee but yet with more calories. People have no idea. It's frightening considering that's only a can and not one of those extra large cups at McDonalds. Thats besides that fact that it strips the enamel of your teeth and robs you of calcium.

Even with diet soda your still drinking carbonate, carbonate is just a fancy disguise name for carbonic acid, imagine if the soda companies put "carbonic acid" instead of "carbonated water" on their ingredient lists. They would have a lot less customers.

[T1Cybernetic]

The gym where i go to has some great dance music all day long every day so i dont even need to take my own music! i recently started running /jogging again but there is so much to see while out and about i dont need music :P