Which one Has better performance?

[NoobCake]

hey guys, looking for some advice on which one would perform better? temp wise...

ok here it is:

D-TEK fuzion
Swiftech MCR220
Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP



OR

Swiftech apogee GT
Thermochill PA120.2
Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP

Ok then, thats the 2 options i guess so what do you guys think?

thanks :up:

[giorgos th.]

D-TEK fuzion
Thermochill PA120.2
Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP

[NoobCake]

D-TEK fuzion
Thermochill PA120.2
Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP

lol its one or the other... unfortunately :down:

[perfection]

I'd go with the Swiftech apogee GT, Thermochill PA120.2 and the Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP

edit: they actually might be the same, as the Thermochill PA120.2's better performance may make up for the Swiftech Apogee GT.

I'd still get this anyway, having a Thermochill is having a bigger e-penis :D

[NoobCake]

I'd go with the Swiftech apogee GT, Thermochill PA120.2 and the Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP

thanks for your input perfection, any reason though?

[fepple]

lol its one or the other... unfortunately :down:

How come? :(

[giorgos th.]

So we have
Swiftech apogee GT
Thermochill PA120.2
Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP

[NoobCake]

How come? :(

im not a money bag aiight?

cheers

[fepple]

im not a money bag aiight?

cheers

I was hoping it was going to be a choice between e-tailers that you'd found :)

What chip is it for?

[NoobCake]

umm chip, gonna be either a e8400 or one of the quads, dunno yet bro

[fepple]

I'd have thought that both Rads would be enough for just a CPU in the loop.

I know the flow through the FuZion is better than the Apogee but I dont know for sure if it actually cools better... anyone?

[perfection]

thanks for your input perfection, any reason though?

edited my post with the reason

[NoobCake]

edited my post with the reason

LOL cheers for that...

anyone got any similar parts to this one and want to share a brother here? :up:

[MorGo7h]

I should go for the D-tek with mrc220 IF you buy a NOZZLE KIT!

[NoobCake]

aiight, cheers

yea nozzle wont hurt if i ask the parents for $9 :shrug:

[Cronos]

It will be very hard to notice any difference in performance between both Apogee GT -
D-Tek Fuzion and PA120.2 -MCR220.

If the price that important, MCR220 + Apogee GT wins hands down.

Another saving can be made from choosing another pump, as the pump is even less important here.
Either D5 or even D-Tek dB-1.

Compare the price between (PA120.2 + Fuzion + DDC2/Petra) vs (MCR220 + Apogee GT + D-Tek dB-1), it's almost two times for some
maybe 1-2C difference (at max load)!

[Xilikon]

IMHO, get the Apogee GT with the PA120.2. My reasoning for this choice is because the radiator and pump can be kept for a few years to handle any cpu you throw at it now and in the future. The only thing to change would be the block and it's a minimal investment if you sell the Apogee GT to recoup the losses.

However, if we want to mix and match parts, then ditch the DDC 3.2 top and invest the 20$ saving into a D-Tek Fuzion with a nozzle kit. Just get 3/8" ID and 5/8" OD tubing and you should be done. With that setup (Fuzion+PA120.2+DDC3.2), you should be good for years of use as long as D-Tek keep releasing new mountings for future boards.

If you wanted the cheapest price, then I agree with Cronos but don't skimp too much on the pump and get a DDC 3.1/3.2 at least without a aftermarket top. You will still have room for upgrades.

[Cronos]

For many-years perspective, there is still (much) better choice -MCR320.

Also, keep in mind that future Intel CPUs (and current AMD CPUs ) will be single-die. For single-die CPUS, D-Tek Fuzion is nowhere near the current top performers.

[Kosior]

For many-years perspective, there is still (much) better choice -MCR320.


PA120.3 would be even better but our friend doesn't have cash though. Havin' said that, it still isn't a problem.
I'd go with:
- PA120.2
- D-Tek Fuzion with nozzle
- DDC 3.2 without the Petra's top.
Havin' a loop like that you'll only have to change the cpu block in the future. It's also upgrade friendly. If you want, you can add Petra's top in a year or so. It'll let you even join your GPU sometime - You'll only have to mount good fans.

My final arguments are:
-good performance
-upgrade friendly pump
-possibility of joining the GPU up
-pieces of stuff that may be used in your future rigs

[IanY]

Doesn't make much of a difference, buddy. Get the cheapest combination if you are strapped for money. A Thermochill isn't exactly the most cost effective product. In the end, its up to you, but if I were you, and if I were truly broke, I would buy the Apogee GT, MCR220 and DDC 3.2 with no top.

[nikhsub1]

For single-die CPUS, D-Tek Fuzion is nowhere near the current top performers.
Really? Where do you see that? My testing has been only on a single die, and still to this day the Fuzion with nozzle has not been beat. Not even close yet.

[cka3o4nuk]

D-tek fusion (nozzels)
ddc without petra top
Swiftech MCR320
will be perfect
later you can buy petra top
and with mcr320 you loop will be ready for other wb on gpu and mb etc.

[ZL1Killa]

that pa120.2... lets just say thermochill does there homework ;)

im a great fan of them now.

and get you some yateloon fans to go with the pa rad. you can find them at jab-tech or petras tech shop.
i used the medium speed yateloons and they are quiet and cool plenty

[Cronos]

This PA madness should be stopped for the sake of common sense.
I have both PA120.3 (a pair actually) and GTX480, as well as some previous gen.
Black Ice Pro, and the quality of BI radiators is way ahead. I would choose the quality of GTX any time over PA.

[Mekrel]

This PA madness should be stopped for the sake of common sense.
I have both PA120.3 (a pair actually) and GTX480, as well as some previous gen.
Black Ice Pro, and the quality of BI radiators is way ahead. I would choose the quality of GTX any time over PA.

That's funny, because everyone else who's commented on the same subject has said otherwise.

[Cronos]

Really? Where do you see that? My testing has been only on a single die, and still to this day the Fuzion with nozzle has not been beat. Not even close yet.

Sorry, i forgot about nozzles. Impingement-style WB works best for single-die CPUs, where CPU die is located directly under water jet.

I guess, for dual-die CPUs, properly constructed dual-jet WB can show significant advantage as well.

[FallenCow]

I've own a few Thermochill rads and while the performance is there, the finish isn't quite as nice as Swiftech's rads.
That being said, I agree w/ the person who suggested that you buy the best rad/pump you can now so it'll last you over the course of a few upgrades because the tech in those items isn't likely to change very often.

[NaeKuh]

It will be very hard to notice any difference in performance between both Apogee GT -
D-Tek Fuzion and PA120.2 -MCR220.

If the price that important, MCR220 + Apogee GT wins hands down.

Another saving can be made from choosing another pump, as the pump is even less important here.
Either D5 or even D-Tek dB-1.

Compare the price between (PA120.2 + Fuzion + DDC2/Petra) vs (MCR220 + Apogee GT + D-Tek dB-1), it's almost two times for some
maybe 1-2C difference (at max load)!

oh gowd i hope you have proof for all these statements.

Expecially the pump aspect. I loaned martin a DB-1 pump so lets get real numbers out instead of fake manufactors statements.

Also, the MCR320 /w 56CFM fans will beat a PA120.2 So i dont see why you guys are downgrading him. The MCR320 is an awesome radiator at HALF the price of the PA.

Pump wise, get a D5, dont get me started on what im hearing about the DDC-3.2 its gonna be a while b4 i recomend that pump out.

CPU Block, is say D-tek NOT becaues its the besst performer, but because it has a hugh multi universal application role to it. Without nozzles and washer, its one of the most unrestrictive blocks. With nozzles, it turns the block into a Monster.


And i probably have more watercooling EQ then everyone posting in this thread minus nikhsub1(maybe, im becoming more of a collection whore then he is). So if you feel im wrong, Proof please. And i mean REAL PROOF. not some noobie review throwing blocks on a setup at random and running benches. But real thermal calculations with C/W graphs.

PS Martin also has a MCR320 to throw on his thermal test.

[Cronos]

Unless there is some strong reason not to trust Thermochill officially published data,
the difference between MCR220 and PA120.2 is ridiculously small in all fan rpm range. Yet PA120.2 is 2.5x more expensive than MCR220.

[Xilikon]

Unless there is some strong reason not to trust Thermochill officially published data,
the difference between MCR220 and PA120.2 is ridiculously small in all fan rpm range. Yet PA120.2 is 2.5x more expensive than MCR220.

You are wrong, the numbers is close between a MCR320 and PA120.2. Look up yourself and unstruck your own feet from your mouth.

[Cronos]

We can actually explain the small difference in performance between PA and MCR if we compare the total tube width in both rads.
PA has two rows of tubes with total width ~35mm while MCR has one tube with width ~28mm. So, PA is effectively only 25% wider than MCR, not almost twice from the total width comparison.

Thermochill data shows max of ~15% difference in C/W between equally sized PA and MCR. There is ~50% difference in C/W for MCR320 and MCR220, as well as between PA120.3 and PA120.2.

[Snyxxx]

We can actually explain the small difference in performance between PA and MCR if we compare the total tube width in both rads.
PA has two rows of tubes with total width ~35mm while MCR has one tube with width ~28mm. So, PA is effectively only 25% wider than MCR, not almost twice from the total width comparison.

Thermochill data shows max of ~15% difference in C/W between equally sized PA and MCR. There is ~50% difference in C/W for MCR320 and MCR220, as well as between PA120.3 and PA120.2.

All the data and graphs can be examined and referenced, but my real world experience using both of these shows the PA120.2 easily out performs the MCR220. The wider fin density of the PA has several advantages such as not a dust magnet and not as noisy with fans. It also has less pressure drop from my sink tests.

As above, the MCR320 may be a closer choice.

As mentioned above, please lend some credibility to your statements with actual testing info and results as many of us do.

[Cronos]

As mentioned above, please lend some credibility to your statements with actual testing info and results as many of us do.

Most ppl. just repeat what they heard from others and don't even try to think and make their own conclusion from published data. And please don't tell me about personal experience, it is practically very difficult to notice the difference between MCR320 and PA120.3 in most normal loops without special equipment, yet i see so many ppl. saying how great their Thermochill is and how they recommend it over any other rad. This is just laughable.

Now if you want some credibility,
Thermochill's site contains excellent set of data i am sure everyone seen many times, which clearly shows PA has minor advantage over equally sized MCR.

Run the excellent Martin's Flow Rate Estimator and compare the flow between
D5 and dB-1 in single CPU loop with low-resistance WB (Apogee GT), both can sustain at least 1gpm and we all know anything over 1gpm has diminishing effect on WB and rad performance.

And there are so many comparisons between Apogee GT and D-Tek Fuzion. There are some showing clear advantage of one and some showing clear advantage of another, as well as some showing they are very close. From my personal experience :) , i was not able to notice any real life difference between Apogee 1U and D-Tek on Core 2 Quad.

[Snyxxx]

Fair enough Cronos.

My experience was with a .2 radiator with CPU, SLI GPUs, NB , SB and 2x Mosfets. Maybe I was at heat saturation limit and noticed the differences.

Everyone's mileage varies.

[NaeKuh]

Fair enough Cronos.


Everyone's mileage varies.

your result on the full cover got pretty dayam close to my estimates tho. :up: :yepp:

[SiGfever]

D-TEK fuzion
Thermochill PA120.2
Laing DDC 3.2 + TOP

Save up your money and buy what this poster listed. It will be money well spent.

[Snyxxx]

your result on the full cover got pretty dayam close to my estimates tho. :up: :yepp:

Good job with the estimate.:)

[Nate P.]

Save up your money and buy what this poster listed. It will be money well spent.
100% agree.

[Cronos]

Fair enough Cronos.

My experience was with a .2 radiator with CPU, SLI GPUs, NB , SB and 2x Mosfets. Maybe I was at heat saturation limit and noticed the differences.



There is no such thing as "heat saturation limit".

And if you noticed the difference, this rather indicates your rad is inadequate. By the way, very strange choice - a dual rad for such heavily loaded loop. Replace it with MCR320 and you'll see the real difference.

[Snyxxx]

There is no such thing as "heat saturation limit".

And if you noticed the difference, this rather indicates your rad is inadequate. By the way, very strange choice - a dual rad for such heavily loaded loop. Replace it with MCR320 and you'll see the real difference.

Maybe so, but it showed the MCR220 was more inadequate than the PA120.2 :D

I like to keep everything inside the case, so no 120.3 of any type in my future.

My temps are good enough for me with only a PA120.2. CPUs and GPUs idle around ~35C and load to ~45C. All the other stuff did not change much. Ambient is a constant ~21C.

I prefer one loop, but will be moving to two loops on my next build that is under way.

[NaeKuh]

There is no such thing as "heat saturation limit".

And if you noticed the difference, this rather indicates your rad is inadequate. By the way, very strange choice - a dual rad for such heavily loaded loop. Replace it with MCR320 and you'll see the real difference.

nope... trust me.

a MCR320 will only handle a quadcore G0 + 8800GTX on a Core ONLY config.

Synxxx proved my estimate that a full cover block will meddle with your cpu temps

if your looking to just silence the machine, then yea, its fine. However if your looking at overclocking, then you definitely need to split the loop up.

And dude the MCR320 is > PA120.2 Give it good fans like the zalman or SANACE, and its bye bye PA120.2

You guys dont understand what a PA is designed and ment for. Its not a super radiator, its a larger then normal radiator designed for LOW CFM fans. Also on testing it shows to not scale as well once high cfm fans are attached to it

The PA120.3 will own in a silence rig, however if a little buzzing isnt something that bothers you, the HWLABS 360 and 480GTX will make pie out of it with good san ace fans.


Why the hell are you guys telling him to go PA120.2 when it has a less heat load capacity of a MCR320 and is ALSO about DOUBLE the price? :shrug:


F the PA120.2 get a PA120.3 for 20 dollars more. Dont look at that small dinky thing.


There is only 2 PA series which i feel are "truely" worth it. Unless you live in the UK where things are a lot cheaper.

PA120.3 <--- the king at silence and does a great job at cooling.
PA160 <--- does very close to a PA120.2 with good FANS!

[Nate P.]

F the PA120.2 get a PA120.3 for 20 dollars more. Dont look at that small dinky thing.
What if you have space limitations (like me)?

[NaeKuh]

What if you have space limitations (like me)?

then you have no choice.

But i would dual loop it with cheaper radiators.


Maybe someone can explain to me why you need to keep your gpu's sub 30C? I dont understand this unless your volt moding.

A MCR120 /w D-tek DB-1 pump could keep a single full cover GTX in "acceptable" temp ranges. It will still be better then air, but not what water cooling demands.

Now someone tell me how much more OC you get off a GPU thats not voltmoded @ 30C vs 50C you'll see where im going with this....

Now pull the gpu's off your main loop and drop them on a cheaper secondary, while your cpu is on its own.
This gives you more control of your cpu loop and temp. This also means you have more control of your OC because you can volt change the cpu.

Split your loop up into 2 smaller ones. There is no way in hell a MCR220 or a PA120.2 will handle a loaded quadcore + G80 GPU.

EDIT i take this back that can handle it but your setup would perform on par to this:

Thermalright ultra120 extreme lapped with thermalright HR-03 should match your config. Yea nice to be matched by air when your on water eh?

[Cronos]

You guys dont understand what a PA is designed and ment for. Its not a super radiator, its a larger then normal radiator designed for LOW CFM fans. Also on testing it shows to not scale as well once high cfm fans are attached to it

The PA120.3 will own in a silence rig, however if a little buzzing isnt something that bothers you, the HWLABS 360 and 480GTX will make pie out of it with good san ace fans.


It is not much large than MCR, only 25% effectively wider. GTX series is actually wider and this partly explains why it has better thermal capacity.

And there is no need for san aces for GTX to overcome PA, GTX should already be better at 1200rpm.

[NoobCake]

wow, dammm

so many great replies within a day...

sorry guys for keeping you waiting, but i got school to attend and :banana::banana::banana::banana:..

but atm.. all these post are confusing me real bad....

some ppl say get a MCR320 and tht will kick the pa120.2 ass...

then ppl say get the pa120.3... WTF bro? im no mR Money bag here... lol

For the block should i just get a apogee GT and then upgrade to whatever is good after a while? coz i can save about $35 right there.. :)

for running the liquid, does any coolant stuff up my parts? coz i want to keep it clean, like run one coolant only, something like distilled water? is tht possible only? nothing else?

[IanY]

If you are a student and don't have money, buy whatever is cheap. If it means Apogee GT and MCR220, then so be it. You won't see a drastic difference.

These people are arguing about largely theoretical differences, and in practice, all the equipment that you listed work well and will do.

Don't go spending money that you do not have.

I would readily recommend Thermochill, but its highly non-cost effective and not for the tight of budgets.

[NoobCake]

If you are a student and don't have money, buy whatever is cheap. If it means Apogee GT and MCR220, then so be it. You won't see a drastic difference.

These people are arguing about largely theoretical differences, and in practice, all the equipment that you listed work well and will do.

Don't go spending money that you do not have.

I would readily recommend Thermochill, but its highly non-cost effective and not for the tight of budgets.

yea thanks for that mate. Yeah im a student, and don't have a job yet :( just concentrating on school ATM, but i usually get my $$ from occasions for example, bday, CNY, normal NY, christmas, the list goes on, so yeah.

of course i was thinking about the thing don't buy high end stuff always, just get something mid range and slowly upgrade from there?

So instead of the getting the DDC3.2 should i just get the laing d5?

whats the difference between these? or should i stay with the laing DDC 3.2 and just get the apogee GT + MCR220?

EDIT: one more question, could i run straight distilled water into my loop? whats the other water called? starts with D also but forgot the name, and its apparently better...

[septim]

climbing up a mountain...

i agree with Sigfever, save up and buy it right the first time around...

distilled water is not de ionized water...

if you ever go with mcr220 over the pa120.2, then i would suggest getting medium or stronger fans to go with it...

with regards to d5 vs ddc3.2, d5 has reliability under his belt, while 3.2 is getting over/over the stigma of predecessors startup failures...
you can add after market top, so that its more mounting flexible (alphacool top) and that you could use 1/2 or 7/16 hose with it...

[IanY]

yea thanks for that mate. Yeah im a student, and don't have a job yet :( just concentrating on school ATM, but i usually get my $$ from occasions for example, bday, CNY, normal NY, christmas, the list goes on, so yeah.

of course i was thinking about the thing don't buy high end stuff always, just get something mid range and slowly upgrade from there?

So instead of the getting the DDC3.2 should i just get the laing d5?

whats the difference between these? or should i stay with the laing DDC 3.2 and just get the apogee GT + MCR220?

EDIT: one more question, could i run straight distilled water into my loop? whats the other water called? starts with D also but forgot the name, and its apparently better...


Happy CNY :D Hope you get lots of little red objects... or is that already factored into the w/c budget lol ? My boy (12 yo) is also looking to spend serious red packet money on w/c gear rofl :)

[IanY]

yea thanks for that mate. Yeah im a student, and don't have a job yet :( just concentrating on school ATM, but i usually get my $$ from occasions for example, bday, CNY, normal NY, christmas, the list goes on, so yeah.

of course i was thinking about the thing don't buy high end stuff always, just get something mid range and slowly upgrade from there?

So instead of the getting the DDC3.2 should i just get the laing d5?

whats the difference between these? or should i stay with the laing DDC 3.2 and just get the apogee GT + MCR220?

EDIT: one more question, could i run straight distilled water into my loop? whats the other water called? starts with D also but forgot the name, and its apparently better...


Buddy,

Don't worry about w/c equipment. As your experience and budget grows, there will be lots of time for the ultra high end.

I would suggest that you buy a A-GT and a MCR220 for now. You can either buy a DDC 3.2 or a D5. It doesn't really matter. The stock DDC 3.2 has 3/8" barbs, so you would be pretty much stuck with 3/8" ID tubing, not that its bad.

If you have the money,
D-Tek FuZion, MCR220, DDC 3.2 with Petra's Top, 1/2" or 7/16" ID tubing

If you don't have money,
Apogee GT, MCR220, stock DDC 3.2, 3/8" tubing

If want to have 1/2" ID tubing and don't have much money, substitute the stock DDC 3.2 for a D5/MCP655.

You are young, and water cooling is a silly luxury. Your money would be best spent in another manner. Albeit, its still nice to have a water cooled computer lol



For all you critics, I love high quality equipment. You all know I love my Thermochills. However, my first instincts to a question such as "what's a good car" is not "Mercedes or BMW" If a college kid comes to me and says that he has $3,000, I don't go... "you better buy a BMW"... it'll be a BM-Trouble-You and cost him three times the price to fix it.

[Xilikon]

IanY, it's hard to compare a inert radiator to a sophisticated piece of engineering like a car ;)

While I agree with you, it's sometime better to think about the future and see if I want to maximize the return on investment. In those cases, paying a bit for for something which can last a while is a good idea. However, in this case, without any budget numbers, it's hard to make a good suggestion so everyone's view is as good as mine or you.

[NaeKuh]

Dude PA120.2 ~ 109

PA120.3 ~ 129.99

ummm.. get the PA120.3

OR get a MCR320.

Get a D5 also. The DDC-3.2 requires a top. which = more $$$

[NoobCake]

umm, whats the difference between the Laing D5 and the DDC 3.2 + top?

So you saying i should get a triple rad now?

But with what CPU block? should i stick with the apogee GT?

Cause i was still thinking getting a MCR220 + Apogee GT + Laing D5 or DDC 3.2 depending which one is better, if minimum diff i wouldn't mind.

Also anyone know what water that it starts with D called?

its not distilled, but its better then distilled.

thanks

[Snyxxx]

Also anyone know what water that it starts with D called?

its not distilled, but its better then distilled.

thanks

Deionized. Better is debatable.

[septim]

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=151627
have a read at martin's charts

you'll see that the ddc with aftermarket top outperforms the d5 pump (by a small margin to some)...

as advice, i would save up some more and get my parts right the first buy around...

so you'll probably get a dTek fuzion with nozzles, mcr320 (find a way to fit this) and ddc3.2 with top...

de ionized??

[Xilikon]

Deionized. Better is debatable.

Deionized water might still contain organics lifeform, like demineralized water. Distilled is the only way to go for a clean loop IMHO.

[NoobCake]

Deionized water might still contain organics lifeform, like demineralized water. Distilled is the only way to go for a clean loop IMHO.

awesome... cheers for that.. So thats done.

regarding the pumps.. I can get the DDC 3.2 + TOP from petras for $100 US which will roughly = $111 in AUS..

Or i can get the DDC 3.2 + XPSC TOP or some :banana::banana::banana::banana:, said tht will outperform any top atm? from Flabbergast for $139

Or i can get the Laing D5 from pccg, which is the easiest as im in tht state for $139.

so which one? lol

for parts, what do you reckon? im still wanting to get a dual rad just to keep it inside the MM H2G0

[IanY]

Hey... you never said that you have a MM H2Go !!

In that case (pun intended), you will be **very unhappy** with a MCR, any MCR, whether 220 or 320.

The only dual radiator that fits perfectly on either side of a MM H2Go is a PA120.2. ***Nothing*** else fits.

You told me that you are a student and I thought you are broke. You bought a Mountain Mods case... that's where all the money went to.

Take a look at this stunning H2Go build log and see how PA120.2s are a drop-in fit. Swiftech spacing is different and will not work.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=174525

[Nate P.]

Hey... you never said that you have a MM H2Go !!

In that case (pun intended), you will be **very unhappy** with a MCR, any MCR, whether 220 or 320.

The only dual radiator that fits perfectly on either side of a MM H2Go is a PA120.2. ***Nothing*** else fits.

You told me that you are a student and I thought you are broke. You bought a Mountain Mods case... that's where all the money went to.

Take a look at this stunning H2Go build log and see how PA120.2s are a drop-in fit. Swiftech spacing is different and will not work.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=174525
Very true, that's why I sold my MCR-220 and got a TC PA120.2.

[NoobCake]

Hey... you never said that you have a MM H2Go !!

In that case (pun intended), you will be **very unhappy** with a MCR, any MCR, whether 220 or 320.

The only dual radiator that fits perfectly on either side of a MM H2Go is a PA120.2. ***Nothing*** else fits.

You told me that you are a student and I thought you are broke. You bought a Mountain Mods case... that's where all the money went to.

Take a look at this stunning H2Go build log and see how PA120.2s are a drop-in fit. Swiftech spacing is different and will not work.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=174525
:rofl:

i haven't bought it yet... lol.. I was planning to so yeah.. The silver one is only $199...

anyways there is no way you could fit a mcr220?

i thoiught you could, i read a thread that it will give less airflow or something, by 10mm? spacing

[Nate P.]

:rofl:

i haven't bought it yet... lol.. I was planning to so yeah.. The silver one is only $199...

anyways there is no way you could fit a mcr220?

i thoiught you could, i read a thread that it will give less airflow or something, by 10mm? spacing
You can, but you can only screw in one fan, and it looks bad. Also, that $200 case is going to be much more expensive when shipping to AUS...

[IanY]

:rofl:

i haven't bought it yet... lol.. I was planning to so yeah.. The silver one is only $199...

anyways there is no way you could fit a mcr220?

i thoiught you could, i read a thread that it will give less airflow or something, by 10mm? spacing

In that case, I have **zero pity** for you :rofl: :ROTF: I am here to spend all your money !!! :ROTF: :rofl:

No, you can't fit a MCR220 in a stock case. It is not possible. If you want to do so, you would have to order a customized case from Mountain Mods, in which case there would be zero cost savings from the cheaper radiator, and it would be a futile exercise because it will be worse performing.

The other complication, if I am not off-base, is that you are Aussie and not American. Customized cases take forever as it is and, as always, ordering from the US to OZ can be a PITA and the shipping is always murderous.

Now.. you MUST.. order two PA120.2s and at least one PA120.1 :D

Look forward to your build with four DDC 3.2s with Petra tops, D-Tek FuZion with nozzles, Silver Tygon and EK Full cover video block :) :up:

[NoobCake]

You can, but you can only screw in one fan, and it looks bad. Also, that $200 case is going to be much more expensive when shipping to AUS...

so fking dam true :(

150 shipping :shakes:

and thats not it, thats US.. Prob around 400 in AUS :(

omg....

[Nate P.]

so fking dam true :(

150 shipping :shakes:

and thats not it, thats US.. Prob around 400 in AUS :(

omg....
I guess you'll have to rethink your plans...;)

[NaeKuh]

your paying how much for a D5? 139?

WTF! Is this 139 CA dollars? wait that still doesnt make sense.

Dude.. You seriously need to learn to shop around at different stores.

http://www.jab-tech.com/Swiftech-MCP655-12-VDC-Pump-pr-2982.html 79.99

http://www.petrastechshop.com/dadenlad5in1.html 82.99

Holy crap, liang raised the price on this sucker? I bought 3 2 year ago, all varios for 69.99. :shrug:

OMG


Also sorry i missed the case, your case is a h2go, then only rad that can fit perfectly is a PA120.2

[Xilikon]

NaeKuh, it's in australia ;)

[Mech0z]

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=151627
have a read at martin's charts

you'll see that the ddc with aftermarket top outperforms the d5 pump (by a small margin to some)...

Which pump would you get from http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/index.php?cPath=40_101 ? D5 vario or one of the Laing with top.

[NoobCake]

NaeKuh, it's in australia ;)

i rkn, cheers for stating mate, i was about to just rage.... JOKES :rofl:

anyways yea, im thinking of just getting a stacker then, $195 AUSSIE!

@ Nate P., i guess i have to, my fking dream case right there.

Stupid ass aussie can't even get tht :banana::banana::banana::banana: over here :down: :( i so want it

[iandh]

I haven't personally seen any solid proof that the D5 is in any way superior to the DDC3.2.

I have however heard both, and can say that the D5's I've heard have been much louder than my DDC3.2, which in my case at least makes the D5 highly inferior.

It is still a debatable subject, but for a person such as myself who watercools for silence, the DDC3.2 is the obvious choice between the two.



To the OP, if you are hurting for money, bargain shop. I got my DDC3.2 w/Petra's top used in new condition for $75 shipped, my MCR320 for $50, and there are several very workable waterblocks that can be had for dirt cheap if you are patient. I've seen D5's go for as low as $55 or $60 shipped. :up:

[NoobCake]

I haven't personally seen any solid proof that the D5 is in any way superior to the DDC3.2.

I have however heard both, and can say that the D5's I've heard have been much louder than my DDC3.2, which in my case at least makes the D5 highly inferior.

It is still a debatable subject, but for a person such as myself who watercools for silence, the DDC3.2 is the obvious choice between the two.



To the OP, if you are hurting for money, bargain shop. I got my DDC3.2 w/Petra's top used in new condition for $75 shipped, my MCR320 for $50, and there are several very workable waterblocks that can be had for dirt cheap if you are patient. I've seen D5's go for as low as $55 or $60 shipped. :up:

thanks for that mate.

Cheers for the offer, i MIGHT consider it, but i don't like buying things 2nd ESP if its something that can GO faulty quite easily. Petra's sell it for a extra $25, and i would always buy it brand new just for warranty purposes and all.

thanks mate

[iandh]

thanks for that mate.

Cheers for the offer, i MIGHT consider it, but i don't like buying things 2nd ESP if its something that can GO faulty quite easily. Petra's sell it for a extra $25, and i would always buy it brand new just for warranty purposes and all.

thanks mate

Haha, and speaking of D5 noise issues, I just saw this thread after responding to your thread:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=174672


I understand your concern with used items; especially with watercooling gear. I was lucky enough to purchase my goods from trusted friends on this forum and another forum. I also would be wary buying an item such as a used pump from someone I didn't trust/know very well.

[NoobCake]

Haha, and speaking of D5 noise issues, I just saw this thread after responding to your thread:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=174672


I understand your concern with used items; especially with watercooling gear. I was lucky enough to purchase my goods from trusted friends on this forum and another forum. I also would be wary buying an item such as a used pump from someone I didn't trust/know very well.

lol yea i read that too

thanks...

ummm guys,

Im thinking of getting a apogee GT + MCR220?

so i can put it at the rear of the case, which i don't think will require any modding?

then maybe add a mcr120 at the front or something?

[Snyxxx]

It is still a debatable subject, but for a person such as myself who watercools for silence, the DDC3.2 is the obvious choice between the two.:up:

+1 for DDC and silence FTW

D5 been there, heard that:D

[NaeKuh]

i rkn, cheers for stating mate, i was about to just rage.... JOKES :rofl:

anyways yea, im thinking of just getting a stacker then, $195 AUSSIE!

@ Nate P., i guess i have to, my fking dream case right there.

Stupid ass aussie can't even get tht :banana::banana::banana::banana: over here :down: :( i so want it

ahhhhhhh .... okey... no you seriously scared me. i was like WTF....

[NaeKuh]

I haven't personally seen any solid proof that the D5 is in any way superior to the DDC3.2.

I have however heard both, and can say that the D5's I've heard have been much louder than my DDC3.2, which in my case at least makes the D5 highly inferior.

It is still a debatable subject, but for a person such as myself who watercools for silence, the DDC3.2 is the obvious choice between the two.



To the OP, if you are hurting for money, bargain shop. I got my DDC3.2 w/Petra's top used in new condition for $75 shipped, my MCR320 for $50, and there are several very workable waterblocks that can be had for dirt cheap if you are patient. I've seen D5's go for as low as $55 or $60 shipped. :up:

Iandh.. the DDC-3.2 im hearing have a pretty high failure rate. Not as high as the DDC-2 but fairly close.

Also according to martin's own flow charts, the D5 Vario @ setting 5 will push more head pressure then a DDC-3.2 w/o top. Now you drop a top on it, and it just increases the chance of it dying by another 10-15% so its your call if that route is yours.

Lastly, Iandh you missed his case. LOL its an MM H2GO which is has native mounts for a PA120.2 :P So the MCR wouldnt fit unless he made it ugly and had it outside

[adpr_02]

K. I've been looking all over the web for comparisons for the past week, and haven't found anything but ppl. saying that the thermochill is *in theory* better... by how much, nobody knows and estimates go from 5% to 15%....

After all this talk about which is better between the PA120.3 or the MCR320, how about someone actually tests their system with an MC320 and then switch it for a PA120.3 and post the real-world results?

I was myself torn between the two, but found the MCR320 for 39$, so I went for that. I couldn't justify spending 3.5x the price for a PA120.3, and it felt that much better to see that when i got back home, the price had jumped back to 70$ for the swiftech. heh. heh. heh.

[iandh]

Iandh.. the DDC-3.2 im hearing have a pretty high failure rate. Not as high as the DDC-2 but fairly close.

Also according to martin's own flow charts, the D5 Vario @ setting 5 will push more head pressure then a DDC-3.2 w/o top. Now you drop a top on it, and it just increases the chance of it dying by another 10-15% so its your call if that route is yours.

Lastly, Iandh you missed his case. LOL its an MM H2GO which is has native mounts for a PA120.2 :P So the MCR wouldnt fit unless he made it ugly and had it outside

I've heard a lot of people talking about the high DDC3.2 failure rate, but I haven't seen it.

At good portion of comments regarding the DDC3.2's reputed failure rate seem to be second hand backlash from the DDC-2's failure rate; AKA mistaken identity. I think I have only seen personal accounts of DDC3.2 failure maybe 2-3 times. It seems that the DDC name is tarnished forever by the 18W pump housing bashing rattle-box impeller mistake that was the DDC-2.

As I said before, at this point I have seen no convincing evidence to indicate that the D5 is signifigantly more reliable than the DDC3.2, mostly a lot of "I read about a guy who read about a guy who said his second cousin's roommate's ex-girlfriend's little brother had a failed DDC3.2" :)

Don't get me wrong, if I had to put money down on a pump for the long haul, I would put my money down on the D5. As far as noise goes, no amount of reliability could convince me to use the D5 in my system. Others can choose which they prefer based upon their own research and judgement.

He hasn't bought that case yet... he just mentioned that he was thinking about purchasing it, but being that he is on a budget and in Australia may put a damper on that idea.

[Waterlogged]

I've heard a lot of people talking about the high DDC3.2 failure rate, but I haven't seen it.

At good portion of comments regarding the DDC3.2's reputed failure rate seem to be second hand backlash from the DDC-2's failure rate; AKA mistaken identity. I think I have only seen personal accounts of DDC3.2 failure maybe 2-3 times. It seems that the DDC name is tarnished forever by the 18W pump housing bashing rattle-box impeller mistake that was the DDC-2.

As I said before, at this point I have seen no convincing evidence to indicate that the D5 is signifigantly more reliable than the DDC3.2, mostly a lot of "I read about a guy who read about a guy who said his second cousin's roommate's ex-girlfriend's little brother had a failed DDC3.2" :)

Don't get me wrong, if I had to put money down on a pump for the long haul, I would put my money down on the D5. As far as noise goes, no amount of reliability could convince me to use the D5 in my system. Others can choose which they prefer based upon their own research and judgement.

He hasn't bought that case yet... he just mentioned that he was thinking about purchasing it, but being that he is on a budget and in Australia may put a damper on that idea.

iandh, NaeKuh was kind enough to give me as well as Xilikon access to where he was getting his info from. I will say his source is reputable but, with no disrespect meant to either NaeKuh or his source, I really wasn't given enough to come to the conclusion that the 3.2 is suffering the same problem rate as the DDC-2. In fact, I was left with more questions. I too, am not seeing the "dead 3.2" topics that were abundant for the DDC-2.

[Xilikon]

iandh, NaeKuh was kind enough to give me as well as Xilikon access to where he was getting his info from. I will say his source is reputable but, with no disrespect meant to either NaeKuh or his source, I really wasn't given enough to come to the conclusion that the 3.2 is suffering the same problem rate as the DDC-2. In fact, I was left with more questions. I too, am not seeing the "dead 3.2" topics that were abundant for the DDC-2.

Exactly, I have given the remaining questions to NaeKuh so he can ask the source and no word about it yet. Also, keep in mind that normally, stores and manufacturers never disclose any RMA numbers simply to protect their business.

Also, if the failure rate is that high with the DDC 3.2, we would have heard more than once about that here, which isn't the case. The only 3 cases I saw are users error. Even Alex, from Petra's shop, is defending the DDC 3.2 vehemently ;) I'm not saying to avoid DDC 3.2 at all costs, just pick which one you can get your hands at a reasonable price and you feel good getting either one. For those who are unaware, it seems pump prices is over 100-125$ in lots of areas so in those cases, the choice might be obvious.

[NoobCake]

so guys, i need to know what parts.

ill just get the DDC 3.2 + TOP, comes out cheapest...

Should i just get the Apogee GT + MCR220?

or should i get the D-TEK for a extra $20?

[Xilikon]

If you can afford the extra 20$, you won't regret it. The Fuzion is considered one of the best.

[septim]

basically like i said, save up and get the best from the start, so you wont have regrets later on...

[iandh]

iandh, NaeKuh was kind enough to give me as well as Xilikon access to where he was getting his info from. I will say his source is reputable but, with no disrespect meant to either NaeKuh or his source, I really wasn't given enough to come to the conclusion that the 3.2 is suffering the same problem rate as the DDC-2. In fact, I was left with more questions. I too, am not seeing the "dead 3.2" topics that were abundant for the DDC-2.


Exactly, I have given the remaining questions to NaeKuh so he can ask the source and no word about it yet. Also, keep in mind that normally, stores and manufacturers never disclose any RMA numbers simply to protect their business.

Also, if the failure rate is that high with the DDC 3.2, we would have heard more than once about that here, which isn't the case. The only 3 cases I saw are users error. Even Alex, from Petra's shop, is defending the DDC 3.2 vehemently ;) I'm not saying to avoid DDC 3.2 at all costs, just pick which one you can get your hands at a reasonable price and you feel good getting either one. For those who are unaware, it seems pump prices is over 100-125$ in lots of areas so in those cases, the choice might be obvious.

I'm not necessarily questioning NaeKuh's opinion or sources, just stating my personal observations and experience with both pumps.

In my day job I manufacture many small very high precision mechanical assemblies, and do a fair bit of engineering work as well. Having seen the internals of both pumps I understand why the DDC-2 had a higher failure rate, and also why the D5 has slightly less head pressure than a DDC3.2 w/top and also a reputed higher reliability. I wonder what the DDC3.2's reliability rate would be if all of them were left with stock tops, or the DDC-2 for that matter. ;)

The mag-lev turbopumps we use at work use a ceramic bumper-bearing to protect the rotor if the pump is disturbed while at full spin, and after about ten solid jolts the bearing is toast, much like theories of DDC-2 spinup related bearing damage I've heard. Not exactly the same operating principle, but interesting speculation at the very least. :)

[NoobCake]

basically like i said, save up and get the best from the start, so you wont have regrets later on...

save up until i have alot of money to get best?

cause atm, i got roughly around $300-320 for the WC parts.

AUS dollars of course

i got 200 saved for the ram, 250 for a new cpu.

so how much should i save up for the WC?

[Xilikon]

Just save a extera 20$ for the Fuzion then you should be fine for now.You can always resell the radiator later and get a better one if the need arise.

[septim]

austrailian?, you could try 2nd hand decent watercooling parts, some Aussies here might want to part with...