Thermochill PA120.3 enough for QX6800 and Tri-SLi?

[Darkstar782]

I'm currently setting up a loop as follows:

Swiftech Microres -> MCP655 -> Swiftech Apogee -> Thermochill PA120.3

Now, obviously thats fine, but the system also has 3*8800GTXs in Tri-SLi that I was going to put into the loop, after the CPU, probably all running in parallel to reduce the flow restriction with Swiftech Stealth GPU blocks, at a later date.

At this point will I be pushing the Rad too hard? Fans will be running at 12v, noise isn't really a concern. Just wondering if I should consider dual loops, or possibly two parallel rads... but then will the pump be enough?

Thoughts?

[Yeknom]

Overclocking? Two loops will be a must.

[Nate P.]

I would do two loops, one for CPU, one for GPU's. PA120.3 on each.

[Darkstar782]

Very helpful, thanks!

I have a Swiftech 2*120mm Rad laying around, is that likely to be sufficient for the GPUs? As has been said, its alot of heat dump, but those PA120.3s are massive and hard to mount!

If the GPUs are all in their own loop and using the same blocks, I would just connect them in series seeing as they will all have the same flow resistance.

And yeah, overclocking. I have had this QX6800 up to 3.73GHz for months on a stupid, hard to control, Dell motherboard, I want to see how far I can push it on a proper board! (I have now cannibalised all my PCs to make this main PC, the Dell has one of my Q6600 G0s and a Radeon x2900XT in and is now a media center PC, about all it is usefull for...)

[smee]

+1 for two loops!
Get two PA120.3's, two MCP655's (aka laing D5) and get two swiftec Micro-Res's and your all set!

[smee]

Very helpful, thanks!

I have a Swiftech 2*120mm Rad laying around, is that likely to be sufficient for the GPUs? As has been said, its alot of heat dump, but those PA120.3s are massive and hard to mount!

If the GPUs are all in their own loop and using the same blocks, I would just connect them in series seeing as they will all have the same flow resistance.

And yeah, overclocking. I have had this QX6800 up to 3.73GHz for months on a stupid, hard to control, Dell motherboard, I want to see how far I can push it on a proper board! (I have now cannibalised all my PCs to make this main PC, the Dell has one of my Q6600 G0s and a Radeon x2900XT in and is now a media center PC, about all it is usefull for...)

I say no to the swify 2x120 rad. You won't be able to cool down the gpu's enough! A PA120.2 would do it though.

[disruptfam]

would a 120.2 be enough to cool 2x 3870x2's?

[Xilikon]

would a 120.2 be enough to cool 2x 3870x2's?

No chance, each card is using 200-220W so do the math.

[disruptfam]

120.3 it is then...

[Xilikon]

120.3 it is then...

Rock on :devil:

[disruptfam]

120.2 on a quad,vrm,vrm,ram,nb,sb on maximus board?

pushing it?

q9450 @ 3.6ghz 1.55v approx

i'de rather not do a triple loop build again if i didnt have too

[Xilikon]

I think you can get away like that but you can also spread the lil bits between 2 radiators so the cpu loop isn't soaking too much heat from the small components.

Something like :

PA120.2 = CPU -> NB -> SB -> RAM
PA120.3 = VRM1 -> VRM2 -> GPU1 -> GPU2

[disruptfam]

:up: :D :up:

cheers!

good thinking may not do it in that exact order i want to go for cleanest shortest look..

hmmmm......

[IanY]

Let's do some math, shall we?

A stock GTX has an output of between 175W to 190W, depending on superclocked or not. A stock Ultra puts out 200W, and the XFX XXX Extreme puts out 230W easily. If you overclock your video cards but not volt mod, add another 40W to the heat output for each card.

Assume you have a Yorkfield. At a decent overclock, you would be putting out 225W to perhaps 250W depending on your core voltage. Dittos for the G0 quad cpus. Good luck if you have a B3 QX quad core.

A single PA120.3 is capable of handling 600W of thermal output if you use ultra loud 140+ cfm Delta fans. Perhaps using Sanyo Denkis at the full 12V at 120 cfm.

For about 60 cfm medium Yate Loon style fans, a PA120.3 should handle 500W. The Swiftech MCR320 should handle 450W and the MCR220 should handle 350W.

Therefore, one PA120.3 is *inadequate* to handle three overclocked video cards. YOu would need at least two PA120.2s, if not two PA120.3s. Even a single PA120.1 at decent fan levels would only be adequate but not ideal for a 8800 video card.

I have thus far ignored the heatload from the pumps. You are not hoping to run three video cards in one loop using just one pump, are you ??

One PA120.3 is well equipped to handle a Yorkfield cpu. Perhaps a MCR220 may even be able to handle a Yorkfield cpu at 4.2 Ghz.

Hope this is helpful.

[Waterlogged]

Let's do some math, shall we?

A stock GTX has an output of between 175W to 190W, depending on superclocked or not. A stock Ultra puts out 200W, and the XFX XXX Extreme puts out 230W easily. If you overclock your video cards but not volt mod, add another 40W to the heat output for each card.

Assume you have a Yorkfield. At a decent overclock, you would be putting out 225W to perhaps 250W depending on your core voltage. Dittos for the G0 quad cpus. Good luck if you have a B3 QX quad core.

A single PA120.3 is capable of handling 600W of thermal output if you use ultra loud 140+ cfm Delta fans. Perhaps using Sanyo Denkis at the full 12V at 120 cfm.

For about 60 cfm medium Yate Loon style fans, a PA120.3 should handle 500W. The Swiftech MCR320 should handle 450W and the MCR220 should handle 350W.

Therefore, one PA120.3 is *inadequate* to handle three overclocked video cards. YOu would need at least two PA120.2s, if not two PA120.3s. Even a single PA120.1 at decent fan levels would only be adequate but not ideal for a 8800 video card.

I have thus far ignored the heatload from the pumps. You are not hoping to run three video cards in one loop using just one pump, are you ??

One PA120.3 is well equipped to handle a Yorkfield cpu. Perhaps a MCR220 may even be able to handle a Yorkfield cpu at 4.2 Ghz.

Hope this is helpful.

IanY, I don't mean to question the numbers your throwing out here but, where are you getting them from? Is there some TDP chart for GPU's I'm unaware of?

I ask these questions because the PSU calculator doesn't agree with your numbers and I'm genuinely baffled about why your #'s are a good deal higher.

[IanY]

IanY, I don't mean to question the numbers your throwing out here but, where are you getting them from? Is there some TDP chart for GPU's I'm unaware of?

I ask these questions because the PSU calculator doesn't agree with your numbers and I'm genuinely baffled about why your #'s are a good deal higher.

Those are not power consumption numbers. Those are heat output TDP numbers. Hang on. I'll get you corroborative informational links.

[IanY]

This is just a quick find. I will find Nvidia's white papers.

Regarding the stock non-overclocked 8800GTX card:

"The GeForce 8800 GTX is obviously a very power-hungry part, as you might have guessed from both the size of the chip, the card and the fact it requires dual power connectors. NVIDIA tells us that the TDP of the card is around the 185W mark. We wanted to see how it measured up against the competition, so we tested the total system power consumption at the wall using a simple power meter."

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2006/11/08/nvidia_geforce_8800_gtx_g80/18


Regarding the TDP progression, remember that the stock clocks of an 8800 Ultra are 612 Mhz, and not 655 Mhz (as in EVGA Superclock) or 675 Mhz (as in XFX XXX Extreme). Take 175W and scale it up for the increased core speeds...

"At launch, GeForce 8800 GTX had an 185W maximum TDP and over the past seven months, Nvidia has managed to get that down to 177W. However, has gone one step further with GeForce 8800 Ultra because, despite the higher clocks, its maximum TDP is rated at 175W."

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2007/05/02/nvidia_geforce_8800_ultra/1

My brother has three of these cards and fighting hard to cool them down lol.. I don't envy him...

http://www.xfxforce.com/web/product/listConfigurationDetails.jspa?series=GeForce%26tra de%3B+8800&productConfigurationId=1118128


Still looking for the Nvidia white paper official specs...

[NaeKuh]

your config alone wouldnt be good enough for a quadcore + dual 8800GTX.

Let alone another one.

3 8800GTX on 1 PA120.3 is pushing it even.

[Frank M]

hope this helps,

andyc

Andyc? Is dat sum second-account mixup? :3 :D



I have a Swiftech 2*120mm Rad laying around, is that likely to be sufficient for the GPUs?

the Dell has one of my Q6600 G0s and a Radeon x2900XT in and is now a media center PC, about all it is usefull for...)

No, but it will be enough for the CPU.

A QC, a 2900XT and you can only use it as a media center pc?
Rich bastard :rolleyes: :p:


Let's do some math, shall we?
[numbers]

Your numbers seem a bit high to me.

I think a 120.3 can handle 3 GTX's, albeit the temps won't be too good.
Just think of it, they have 3 70-80mm fans altogether, and that can handle
even the ultras. With the 120.3, the dissipating surface will be bigger, and
there will be 3 or 6 much higher cfm 120 fans. The temps will be lower than
with stock cooling even at vmodded and oc'd speeds, I'm sure.

[Darkstar782]

How about, CPU+ 1GPU on one PA120.3, and the other two GPUs on a 2nd PA120.3?

[Darkstar782]

Andyc? Is dat sum second-account mixup? :3 :D



No, but it will be enough for the CPU.

A QC, a 2900XT and you can only use it as a media center pc?
Rich bastard :rolleyes: :p:





But the x2900XT SUCKS. I did have two in crossfire, but one decided it couldn't cool itself despite being as loud as a Dyson and died.

That's why they got relegated to the media center PC. Plus they output audio over HDMI :)

Pile'o GPUs:
http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/2927/1000451in9.jpg

From left to right:
8800GTX cooler, tried to fit the fan from the broken x2900XT in there but no joy, its too tall by a couple of mm :(
Dead 8800GTX, water cooling leak from the stupid MCW30 NB cooler on my old x38 board.
Dead x2900XT, this is the one that decided to see if it could run at 5000°C. It failed.
Working x2900XT, this is in the Dell media center PC now.
other three are the 8800GTXs for the new build :) You can see cut wires as I have cut the Blue fan wires on them all, this is the PWM wire, meaning they all run at 100% fan speed at all times. Luckily they are quieter than the x2900XTs.

CPUs:
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/2803/1000454gz9.jpg
QX6800 G0 and Q6600 G0

RAM:
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/1613/1000460hl1.jpg
6*2GB OCZ Reaper 800MHz 4-4-4-15. Both PCs are running Vista x64... the x2900XT/Q6600 with 4GB ram, the other with 8GB.

Pile'o drives (and an Aux PSU):
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/8232/1000462jx9.jpg
The Aux PSU is in the Tri-SLi system alongside a PC P&C 1kW PSU, its a 300W 2*6pin PCIe job. The BD-Rom drive is in the Media PC with the DVD-Rom, the Plextor PX-760SA and Lite on DVDRW are in the main PC.

[Frank M]

But the x2900XT SUCKS. I did have two in crossfire, but one decided it couldn't cool itself despite being as loud as a Dyson and died.

Well if it's so bad, I'll get rid of it for you. I'll even pay shipping :D

That's what aftermarket cooling is for ;)

I don't think it will be good for an HTPC, because it's heat means noise and
that's not good for HTPCs. I think there are some lower-end cards with HDMI
with much less heat, some can even go passive.

[LockBreaker]

I'm thinking about a dual loop with a PA.120.3 for the GFX and a PA.160 or PA.120.1 for the CPU? :)

[Xilikon]

A good compromise with Tri-SLI is to cool 2 GTX on 1 PA120.3 and 1 GTX + CPU on the other.

[Darkstar782]

Well if it's so bad, I'll get rid of it for you. I'll even pay shipping :D

That's what aftermarket cooling is for ;)

I don't think it will be good for an HTPC, because it's heat means noise and
that's not good for HTPCs. I think there are some lower-end cards with HDMI
with much less heat, some can even go passive.

When I say "media center pc", I just mean it sits behind the TV with 2TB of HDD space full of :banana::banana::banana::banana:/films/TV, a Blu-Ray drive, an Xbox360 HD-DVD drive, in a full tower case (its actually a Dell XPS 720H2C I'm ashamed to admit). Its not one of these small form factor jobs!

As for the x2900XT - When I get a 9800GX2 for my HDMI out, maybe :P


A good compromise with Tri-SLI is to cool 2 GTX on 1 PA120.3 and 1 GTX + CPU on the other.

THAT sounds like an ideal solution :)

I think I may end up just having the Rads sat outside the case though, The case is only a Thermaltake Kandalf LCS (with the crappy Thermaltake Water cooling stuff removed), and I don't think I will get them both in there, with 2 pumps, 3 GPUs, and 6 HDDs!

[IanY]

Your numbers seem a bit high to me.

I think a 120.3 can handle 3 GTX's, albeit the temps won't be too good.
Just think of it, they have 3 70-80mm fans altogether, and that can handle
even the ultras. With the 120.3, the dissipating surface will be bigger, and
there will be 3 or 6 much higher cfm 120 fans. The temps will be lower than
with stock cooling even at vmodded and oc'd speeds, I'm sure.


You speak with great expertise. I am telling you that a PA120.3 cannot handle three GTXes and you are telling me that that's wrong. I'm saying that its cannot because I have seen with my own eyes. Yes the temps are better than with stock cooling, but its unacceptable.

My TDP numbers come from Nvidia. Like to contradict the company that manufactures the video cores ?

[Anemone]

500/3= 167, thus yes a 120.1 would not handle a 175 tdp output well, but it probably would handle it. GPU's don't go sky high clocks on water without voltmods and they do perfectly fine at temps in the 45-50c range. Again "perfectly fine" may vary in interpretation, so take this as a generalization. A 120.3 should handle 3 cards, but it's going to be a bit close, as you can see.

[Frank M]

You speak with great expertise.

No, I'm speaking with common sense :)

If the manufacturer sees fit to release Ultras with only an 80mm fan and
a medium-size heatsink, then a bigger heatsink with a higher-CFM 120mm
fan for each card can only be better than their stock solution, right?
That "500W dissipation" is with low-medium-speed fans, as you said, and with
the intent to keep temps in the low 40-50C range. With high-medium speed
fans and saying that 50-60C GPU load temps are fine too, since they were
designed to get much hotter with the stock cooling, then I think a 120.3
would handle it. I know, it's always better to oversize it and get it to run
cooler, and this load would be stretching the limits of the rad; but I still think
it would work and yield much better results than with the stock cooler.