MC-TDX Nozzle Kit + Bowed Base

[coolmiester]

As has been pointed out by Martinm210’s Danger Den MC-TDX Pressure Drop Test Results (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=172970) the MC-TDX is the new King of Flow for CPU pin matrix type blocks, which got us both thinking about a nozzle kit so decided to knock one up.

The pin arrangement does have a recessed section in the middle which may indicate the Danger Den have plans for something similar and would guess they have plans to put something out soon.

Anyway, basically got a splodge of Blu-Tac and pushed it into the pins which gave an exact impression of the recess then with a black marker I highlighted the bit in question and transferred it onto a piece of paper.

I hunted around for a piece of material the correct thickness (1.1mm) and came across an old CD case which was spot on so stuck the imprint onto it and cut it out with a fret saw.

I little bit of filing later and i have a finished nozzle that fits really snug and will stay in position once the top is re-fitted.

I’ll knock up a few more and if martinm210 wants to undertake the job of testing he can try a few different hole configurations, as he would do a much better job of testing than I could.

A few pictures of the making……

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_1.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_2.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_3.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_4.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_5.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_6.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_7.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_8.jpg

[septim]

cool, everything should improve with some more focused pressure.

pattern should probably be the same with dTek nozzles...

[coolmiester]

I would of thought directional flow to the four cores would be more beneficial as the original nozzle kit was more for single core but I guess it will be a bit of trial and error testing tbh

[Nate P.]

Looks good, some temp results would be nice...

[Martinm210]

Wow, that's a great idea an much simpler than what I was thinking.

I'm going to have to try that too. For a C2D, I'm thinking a nice simple slot nozzle or maybe an array of smaller jets in a rectangle.

Way to go!!

[Martinm210]

I didn't realize that depression was rectangular, that has to be what it's for.

[systemviper]

I have been sticking to my apogee GT since everything that has come out hasn't been a monster improvement over the go old Apogee gt, but i have been reading about the
MC-TDX and i think i am going to put one of these MC-TDX in my best rig to cool the quad even better.... It will be interesting to see what temp changes are on my quad.

but now i need this new mod lol

I lile the look of this new block but as we see , just a few tweeks and wazzzom, you got something pretty special

[coolmiester]

Yeah the depression is more of a square shape with rounded corners so there is no chance of it spinning or turning.

If you PM your address Martin i'll get a few more made and send them over for you to do some testing as you have the relivant equipment along with some DDC tops as per PM:up:

[Martinm210]

Yeah the depression is more of a square shape with rounded corners so there is no chance of it spinning or turning.

If you PM your address Martin i'll get a few more made and send them over for you to do some testing as you have the relivant equipment along with some DDC tops as per PM:up:


You have PM, this is a great idea. I'm really looking forward to this mod:up:

[nikhsub1]

problem is, this block will never contend for a top spot without being stepped or bowed.

[Vapor]

Doesn't DD have nozzles for the regular TDX? Are they compatible? If not, can they be cut down?


problem is, this block will never contend for a top spot without being stepped or bowed.

Agreed

[Martinm210]

problem is, this block will never contend for a top spot without being stepped or bowed.

Yeah, I'm curious if the thicker 1mm nozzle actually bowes the base, I think it will.

I can try stepping on the mill, but I need to finish testing all stock first to have good numbers to compare against.

[coolmiester]

The TDX Accelerator Nozzle Kit (http://www.coolercases.co.uk/acatalog/Block_Accessories.html#a244) is actually 3.2mm thick which might be a bit much tbh and could end up bending the copper pins but i'll have a bit play:up:

[coolmiester]

Used the blanc from the older TDX Accelerator kit but at 3.2mm it was never going to fit so filed it down to the correct rounded corner square then proceeded to shave off some thickness.

Eventually got it down to 1.88mm which fits just fine and low and behold it bows the base :up:

And some more pictures...


http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_9.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_10.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_11.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_12.jpg

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/mc-tdx_nozzle_kit/mc-tdx_nozzle_14.jpg

[Nate P.]

Nice! Lets see some temps! A comparison with the Fuzion, nozzled Fuzion, MC-TDX, nozzled MC-TDX, bowed MC-TDX, and the EK would be very helpful, if not over the top.

[coolmiester]

Nice! Lets see some temps! A comparison with the Fuzion, nozzled Fuzion, MC-TDX, nozzled MC-TDX, bowed MC-TDX, and the EK would be very helpful, if not over the top.

Martinm210 is kindly doing the number crunching so i'm sending them over to him on Monday.

[Nate P.]

Martinm210 is kindly doing the number crunching so i'm sending them over to him on Monday.
Sounds good, thank you Martin for all your hard work!:clap:

[Martinm210]

Awesome! That's great!!

Do you think you needed all of that 1.88mm?

1/16" acrylic or lexan sheet would be 1.58mm, it would be pretty easy to make blanks from that.

[coolmiester]

I would say 1.88mm would be maximum without doing damage to the pins and would imagine 1.58mm would do just fine - depends on how much of a bow is needed i would have thought.

[smee]

So your saying that this dd block with out perform the fuzion?

Also, this may sound noobie, what's the point in bowing a block? (I can't seem to figure it out)

[Nate P.]

So your saying that this dd block with out perform the fuzion?

Also, this may sound noobie, what's the point in bowing a block? (I can't seem to figure it out)
It puts more pressure on the center of the CPU (where the core is) and results in better temps.

[smee]

It puts more pressure on the center of the CPU (where the core is) and results in better temps.

Interesting.....
But then you don't want the motherboard to bow, right? Or is that a good thing?

[Nate P.]

Interesting.....
But then you don't want the motherboard to bow, right? Or is that a good thing?
No you don't. That's why people use backplates.

[smee]

No you don't. That's why people use backplates.

Gotcha.
So, the nozzel kit for the fuzion, the bigger the fitting you put in there the more the fuzion bends right?
The 5.5mm nozzel is the biggest one for the fuzion right?

[Nate P.]

Gotcha.
So, the nozzel kit for the fuzion, the bigger the fitting you put in there the more the fuzion bends right?
The 5.5mm nozzel is the biggest one for the fuzion right?
Yes, the 5.5 is the biggest, but that's the size of the hole. All the nozzles are the size, it's the size of the opening that's different. So the 5.5 would have the highest flow out of all of them, no bow the base the most.

[smee]

Yes, the 5.5 is the biggest, but that's the size of the hole. All the nozzles are the size, it's the size of the opening that's different. So the 5.5 would have the highest flow out of all of them, no bow the base the most.

Ooohhhh.
Got it. So they all bow the same, but it's your choice on how much flow you want. And the 5.5 (opending size) has the highest flow.
Thanks man!

[coolmiester]

So, has anyone got any idea for a good starting point with regard to hole shape / size for the nozzle, just to try and narrow it down a bit as it could turn out to be a pretty lengthy job having to re-fit and test each time??

[septim]

X?
2 parallel lines II?

[Mekrel]

I've had this idea as well when I first saw this block, but I don't have the block so I never bothered. I personally think an X would work best.

Within regards to "bowing" the block I'm not shure it would be possible or easy due to the shape of the block itself, a step would work I believe but I think it would be difficult to machine it precisely.

But who knows! Let's see what the future has in store for us ;)

I remember when the storm was first released most said it wouldn't get any better and look where we are today.

The block has already been bowed in the thread, nothing really got better since the Storm, things just changed and different designs worked better due to IHS and multiple/large dies.

[Martinm210]

So, has anyone got any idea for a good starting point with regard to hole shape / size for the nozzle, just to try and narrow it down a bit as it could turn out to be a pretty lengthy job having to re-fit and test each time??

I've been thinking of these:

-A single line slot type nozzle 1/16" wide as wide as the nozzle will go.

-Second would be a rectangular array of smaller holes that would line up with the pins gaps. Maybe 1/16" or 1/32". Maybe three rows worth as far as the nozzle will go. Actually I'm wondering if it wouldn't be better to have holes that line up directly on top of each pin? If the nozzle holes are large enough it would send little nozzle jets of water right over the surface of each pin. That might be pretty hard to do practically, but it would be interesting.

-Third may be a quad nozzle type, maybe just two 4mm holes that are adjacent to each other.

I created a shower head style for my fuzion a while back, and so it looks as if it performs better than the 4.5mm nozzle, so I think the smaller circle only doens't really perform as well as a nozzle that's more specifically directing flows at the die locations.

Anyhow, I finished up the stock thermal testing last night on this block, now I need to run my Fuzion completely stock for a comparison, but I think they are pretty close. I'm anxious to see how it does once bowed and nozzled..:up:

[[XC] DragonOrta]

Martin, would you say that a D-Tek nozzle would fit in the MC-TDX, maybe by just dropping it down the inlet barb?

[iandh]

Stepping the block might hurt the effectiveness of the outer pins depending on the thickness of the base.

This block could very easily be bowed but I think it would require a new top made from brass.

I considered building a brass top for the fusion with four sealed set screws that would allow for adjustable bow on-the-fly so you could watch the effect bowing has on temperature in real time, in addition to warping the bow geometry to match your particular IHS. If done right it should have less effect on flow or performance than the improvement it may give. You could bow individually for each core. :)

I ran the idea by Martin and a few others a while back but haven't gotten around to it. This block looks like a very good candidate for such a thing.


I've been thinking of these:

I created a shower head style for my fuzion a while back, and so it looks as if it performs better than the 4.5mm nozzle, so I think the smaller circle only doens't really perform as well as a nozzle that's more specifically directing flows at the die locations.


From the small bit I know about fluid and thermal dynamics, I think that having a showerhead type nozzle with the holes blowing directly over the pins would be ideal.

I could stick the block on the CNC and sharpen the tips of the pins (like a pencil) with a 60 degree chamfer bit so that the water wasn't essentially running straight into a wall (the end of the pin). The very center pins would need to be shortened down a bit and the nozzle would need to be correspondingly longer in the very center to acheive optimum pressure characteristics IMO.



For some reason I have a thing for the base of this block (I think the top/mounting plate is stinky) but with a nice brass or delrin top and the proper nozzle and bow adjustments we could probably turn it into a killer. I am offering up my help with the CNC mill if anyone would like to collaborate. :up:

[[XC] DragonOrta]

Danger Den offers a brass top. You can order it when you get the block for an additional $8.

[iandh]

DragonOrta;2700365']Danger Den offers a brass top. You can order it when you get the block for an additional $8.

Hmmm, didn't know that... with what I have in mind I'll likely be better off making one from scratch rather than modding the stock top. Plus I don't dig the "X" look of the mounting method.

[Kayin]

Count me in for rebuilding this thing too. I'm very interested to see what you guys come up with...

Does anyone have a .skp of this thing? If so, I can model what we want to build and try out some stuff...

[coolmiester]

DragonOrta;2700316']Martin, would you say that a D-Tek nozzle would fit in the MC-TDX, maybe by just dropping it down the inlet barb?

The outside circumference of the D-Tek nozzle is 9.75mm and the ID of a Danger Den barb is 10.12mm so it wobbles around quit a bit inside and would let water flow around the nozzle but if you swapped the Danger Den Barbs to EK with an ID of 9.85mm it fits much better though not perfect, plus you will be relying on the water flow to keep it in place.

Worth a go though!

[Martinm210]

The outside circumference of the D-Tek nozzle is 9.75mm and the ID of a Danger Den barb is 10.12mm so it wobbles around quit a bit inside and would let water flow around the nozzle but if you swapped the Danger Den Barbs to EK with an ID of 9.85mm it fits much better though not perfect, plus you will be relying on the water flow to keep it in place.

Worth a go though!

Good idea. I think I'll try that too.

I also thought about taking some heat shrink tubing and shrinking a short section over the outside of the D-tek nozzle to add some diameter to it. That might make it nice and snug.:shrug:

[Xilikon]

Heatshrink tubing is great since it's a kind of rubber so it won't slip ;)

[[XC] DragonOrta]

The outside circumference of the D-Tek nozzle is 9.75mm and the ID of a Danger Den barb is 10.12mm so it wobbles around quit a bit inside and would let water flow around the nozzle but if you swapped the Danger Den Barbs to EK with an ID of 9.85mm it fits much better though not perfect, plus you will be relying on the water flow to keep it in place.

Worth a go though!

Good to know. Especially since I've got like 5 EK barbs laying around. :)

[coolmiester]

Good idea. I think I'll try that too.

I also thought about taking some heat shrink tubing and shrinking a short section over the outside of the D-tek nozzle to add some diameter to it. That might make it nice and snug.:shrug:

There's the solution right there which would be perfect for Danger Den barbs...........just don't overheat the shrink wrap incase you melt the nozzle :eek: - plus it wouldn't bow the base.

[WoutZoR]

Not knowing there was a topic about bowing the MC-TDX I bowed my own (standard, not MC) TDX.
It wasn't my intention at first because I just wanted to get rid of the foam-like bushing between the fitting and the accelerator nozzle.
I had a couple of spare accelerator nozzles so I just modified one to stack on top of the other. The modified nozzle is the replacement of the foam-like bushing.

Some pictures to give you a clue whats going on:
http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0666_resize102.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0666_resize102.jpg) http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0668_resize699.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0668_resize699.jpg)

When stacked on top of each other its just as high as the copper block, so when the Lucite top is screwed on, the nozzles are loose (not secure).
I took a piece of neoprene/foam and cut it the roughly the same shape as the modified accelerator nozzle and placed it on top. (sorry, no picture from that).
When I then screwed the lucite top on, the base of the TDX suddenly got bowed :D.

Some pictures:
http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0673_resize223.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0673_resize223.jpg) http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0675_resize113.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0675_resize113.jpg) http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0678_resize580.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0678_resize580.jpg)

Temps just dropped like 3~6C Idle and Load !!

[Martinm210]

Not knowing there was a topic about bowing the MC-TDX I bowed my own (standard, not MC) TDX.
It wasn't my intention at first because I just wanted to get rid of the foam-like bushing between the fitting and the accelerator nozzle.
I had a couple of spare accelerator nozzles so I just modified one to stack on top of the other. The modified nozzle is the replacement of the foam-like bushing.

Some pictures to give you a clue whats going on:
http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0666_resize102.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0666_resize102.jpg) http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0668_resize699.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0668_resize699.jpg)

When stacked on top of each other its just as high as the copper block, so when the Lucite top is screwed on, the nozzles are loose (not secure).
I took a piece of neoprene/foam and cut it the roughly the same shape as the modified accelerator nozzle and placed it on top. (sorry, no picture from that).
When I then screwed the lucite top on, the base of the TDX suddenly got bowed :D.

Some pictures:
http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0673_resize223.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0673_resize223.jpg) http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0675_resize113.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0675_resize113.jpg) http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0678_resize580.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs123.xs.to/xs123/08032/img_0678_resize580.jpg)

Temps just dropped like 3~6C Idle and Load !!


Nice work!

I have a standard TDX with nozzle #1 sitting here that's next up for thermal testing, then I'm going to have some fun with the nozzles and bowing....Maybe stepping too:up:

[WoutZoR]

Nice work!

I have a standard TDX with nozzle #1 sitting here that's next up for thermal testing, then I'm going to have some fun with the nozzles and bowing....Maybe stepping too:up:
Thanks :toast:,

Looking forward to your results since I don't have good head to head comparisons between stock and modified (bowed) base on my new board and loop.
Happy testing/modding :D

[Lsdmeasap]

Hate to bring up a kinda old thread, but I found this googling and would like to know if the OP had any luck temp-wise with his selfmade nozzles?

Worth trying to make some myself with no real tools other then a dremmel?

[Martinm210]

Havn't run it yet, the MC-TDX is optimal on a quad core which I didn't have at the time. I'm guessing it'll be hard to measure if I couldn't really measure any gain from nozzles on the fuzion V2.

Still working on getting my new motherboard waterblocks in order and my quad core overclocked before I do any testing on a quad. I had also switched to radiator testing for a while until I get caught up there first.

[Lsdmeasap]

ahh well I was just wondering. I'm using one on a E3110

Please post when you do get some testing done