New Mozart TX Dual Loop Build with Lots of Pics [Archive]

Sunayknits

11-09-2007, 10:11 PM

Hi everyone, good day and welcome to my build log.

I've found more answers and good info here than anywhere else on the 'net, so out of thanks to the great posters I'm going to document my latest build here on xtremesystems.

My build will be based on the Mozart TX case from Thermaltake and will have the following design goals:

a) clean clean clean - through an iterative process I intend to hide as much wiring as possible and generally keep everthing super-tidy and neat. I will cut wires to length once the build is finalized, sleeve everything, use hold-downs, etc.

b) no major metalwork - this will be a custom build using mostly off-the-shelf stuff and modding the case will only be done when it makes sense for fitment (for instance making the doors easily removeable or adding fillports to the top)

e) balance between silence and performance adjustable but leaning mostly toward performance as a dedicated gaming machine

f) able to run a 30" monitor at 2560x1600 res with current games at ~60fps or better (I like vsync!)

g) simple maintenance - fillports and drainports so I can flush it just like a car!

h) COMPLETELY 100% internal cooling - applies to clean clean clean above :)

i) visually interesting - have a couple features in mind to give it an 'oooh' factor for laypeople / bystanders

j) lights up like a freaking carnival at the touch of a button - I've long hated LED fans and cold cathodes, I mostly find them irritating and annoying but I guess in my old age I'm relenting - but I must be able to turn off all lights/leds/blinky stuff instantly so it doesn't blind me while trying to watch movies on the projector!

k) 100 percent stable in games - looking for a high overclock, but not at the expense of stability. This is meant to be a gaming monster, not a benchmark queen lol :clap:

So some equipment has arrived and I did a dry build just make sure no RMAs were necessary. I've played the entirety of HL2:EP2 on it and found that just because 3DMark06 runs all night long, doesn't mean you're stable :D After an hour of HL2:EP2 you will find that 'stable' overclock wasn't so stable after all ...

Here is a component list, most of it is either here or on its way:

Thermaltake MozartTx VE1000SWA Silver Aluminum Cube Tower Computer Case
Sunbeam RHK-S Rheobus 20W Fan Controller (Silver)
ASUS P5N32-E SLI Plus LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 650i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard
2x Foxconn FV-N88XMAD2-ONOC GeForce 8800GTX 768MB 384-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported OverClock Video Card - Retail
SILVERSTONE DA750 ATX12V / EPS12V 750W Power Supply 100 - 240 V
Intel Core 2 Duo E6420 Conroe 2.13GHz 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail
Atech Flash Xm-4U 11-in-1 USB 2.0 Black & Silver Internal card reader - Retail
2x G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB 10,000 RPM 16MB Cache Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM
(more drives later, probably 750GB Hitachis, nearly as fast as Raptors)
LITE-ON Black 20X DVD+R LH-20A1S
2x EK High Performance Full Coverage Nvidia GeForce 8800 GTX Series Water Block
Swiftech APOGEE GTX Extreme Performance Universal Water-block
2x Magicool Extreme Slim Profile 2X120mm Radiator - Black
120mm rad gaskets
2x Swiftech MCP350 12 VDC Pump
2x Alphacool Cape Bullseye PRO [BE-II] POM reservoir
2x Alphacool Cape Bullseye Bay Mount
2x Alphacool Melvin Pipe
2x EK Asus 1 Mosfet Water Block for ASUS Motherboards LGA 775
2x EK-NB/SB ASUS 1 Chipset Block - LGA 775 ASUS Motherboards
EK TIM Pads for FC8800 (for mosfets maybe)
8x Scythe S-FLEX SFF21F 120mm Case Fan - Retail (push-pull on both rads)
6x Scythe S-FLEX SFF21E 120mm Case Fan - Retail (probably replace the power supply fan with one too)
Arctic Silver Ceramique
Primoflex 3/8"ID x 1/2"OD
Koolance Reusable Hose Clamp [10mm, 3/8"]
Koolance Misc 3/8" fittings (compression, mostly)

And finally, the moment you've all been waiting for (thanks if you read this far lol), the PICS!: :clap:

(keep in mind this is a work in progress and will probably take me a fairly long time due to my limited schedule, I will update as I go)

http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_001.jpg
Some parts
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_002.jpg
Case looks like a small beer fridge :)
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_003.jpg
It has wings!
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_004.jpg
Lots of room for junk
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_005.jpg
Look ma no hands!
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_006.jpg
Face off
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_007.jpg
Ridiculous room
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_008.jpg
Drive cage
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_009.jpg
Faceplate is thick, sturdy aluminum
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_010.jpg
Mobo stuff
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_011.jpg
Core 2 Duo is cheap performance!
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_012.jpg
Not even close to stable at factory-overclocked speeds (630/1000). Hopefully water will alleviate this, maybe even get higher
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_013.jpg
Simple no-frills, don't-care dry build (I don't wanna hear it!)
http://brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/initial_build_014.jpg
Nicest power supply I've seen yet (Silverstone DA750)

Next installment whenever I find some time to tinker :up:

Oh btw, please comment on the size of these pictures? Originals are HUGE, is this big enough or too big? I'm doing the hosting so I can go crazy if you want ...

Nate P.

11-09-2007, 10:23 PM

Perfect sized pics, and very nice build there! Dang, I would have sold you my P5N32-E SLI Plus for cheap... oh well, if you ever need a replacement, PM me!

disruptfam

11-09-2007, 10:30 PM

nice... but where's the wc gear lol

mildseven7

11-10-2007, 01:09 AM

My Rad design for your reference

PA120.3 + PA120.2 External

disruptfam

11-10-2007, 02:30 AM

cool ! looks sweet!

newls1

11-10-2007, 04:38 AM

love it. MOre pics

ls206

11-10-2007, 05:08 AM

nice... but where's the wc gear lol
:p: water!!

looking good

ginnz

11-10-2007, 05:59 AM

Awsome!!!! ive been waiting for a Mozart TX build! good luck!

shazza

11-10-2007, 06:00 AM

Nice case! Looking forward to more pics.

NickS

11-10-2007, 08:45 AM

/Subscribed. Can't wait to see it done. :D

IanY

11-10-2007, 09:19 AM

Nice mountain bike :)

Nate P.

11-10-2007, 09:38 AM

Nice mountain bike :)
Expensive, yes, but it a cross-country bike... eww... Freeriding is where it's at!:D

Daemonfly

11-10-2007, 11:01 PM

I'll be doing a very similar build. Already got the case, stock components, and some of the WC gear, just ordered the rest.

I have an idea for a custom solution for 2x 2x120mm rad mounting though. I'll have to wait & see how badly I'd have to hack up the upper rear 2x2 fan area before I decide if I'll have to mod it or not.

I'll have to keep an eye on your build.

mildseven7

11-11-2007, 12:56 AM

Great project and Welcome,

I've got that case and I run a 30in at 2560X1600. But, I couldn't get a build in it that met those same requirements so I had to move to another case.

To get a hi end system water cooled and keep everything clean and internal will be quite the under taking, so gl to you and keep the pics coming. I couldn't do it so I'm very interested in your build progess and pics.

andyc

You tried to do 3 loops?

I was thinking going SLI,
PA120.3/ 2xGPU (External)
PA120.2/CPU (External)
Adding PA120.1/ Chipsets,Mosfet,Ram,HDs to the Harddisk area, since all my disks will go the the left compartment, i dont need the HD case.

SO i want to ask, is it worth it to go SLI? Big difference?
Now im going single on maximus board and mostly online FPS games in 30in LCD

TKS``

Sunayknits

11-11-2007, 02:09 AM

Hehe, thanks for the positive vibe everyone. I'm pretty stoked on getting it together too! I just started a new job tho so things are gonna be slow. It will get done ... just be patient :yepp:

As far as gaming goes, SLI is absolutely required for a 30" monitor. The native res of 2560x1600 means you will be GPU-limited if you don't go SLI. At lower resolutions you really don't need it (yet) for good framerates in modern games, but at that high res you'll be lucky to get ~30fps in most games with a single card. Keep in mind that I'm talking about maxing all the settings cause that's what I consider true gaming. You could get away with a single GTX if you were willing to crank settings down a notch or two ... that's what I'm doing with my current in-use system and it runs most stuff ok. Just not fantastic.

With 8800gtx SLI and this system on air, I can play COD 4 with everything, I mean EVERYTHING maxed out on my HP 30", and get a minimum of ~50fps. Most of the time it's in the hundreds, however I like to use vsync so 60fps is happyland for me. With water I'm hoping to get a minimum of 60fps in everything since I should be able to overclock it significantly higher. In retrospect I probably should have gone with the Ultras instead of GTXs since their pricing is not as ridiculous anymore. Oh well it's an easy swap :)

My bike is a GIANT NRS-C1, with a carbon frame it's super light and has enough travel for my limited riding. I'm no pro lol so mad travel would just make me work harder. I ride mostly x-country in the mountains nearby, but it's too damn cold now so it will sit inside for a while and I'll get fatter :rolleyes:

I can't imagine how you couldn't fit even the most extreme build into this case, there is just so much ridiculous room in there! Oh well I hope what I do gives you some ideas so you can try it again.

As far as mounting rads, after tons of online research I was unable to find out exactly what the spacing is for the holes on the back. So I just decided to buy the g0ddamn thing and find out!

The spacing is a square, 240x240mm. In other words, you can stick 4 120mm fans up there and they will all be touching with no space in between. This of course limits rad selection tremendously, as most rads are > 120mm wide. I found the Magicool Extreme Slim Profile rad (http://http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_200&products_id=21116) at Performance-Pcs and I think it will do the trick since it's exactly 120mm wide. We'll see, it should be here next week!

Anyhow I will have more pics soon, I have just completed modding the Sunbeam Rheobus into the 7" drive bay. Needed the room down below (only 5 bays are exposed) plus it just looks a whole lot cleaner.

More soon, please be patient :)

Garrett

11-11-2007, 03:11 AM

Looks cool, never noticed that case before...
Oh don't think Crysis will run @ 60 fps or more with ALL settings maxed and very high :p:
It tends to be VERY powerhungry ;)

Nate P.

11-11-2007, 08:57 AM

Yeah, I have a Specialized Demo 7 (bike). Awesome bike, I can hit some pretty big drops on it (5-6ft. range). I also race downhill, and that's pretty fun also.

dengyong

11-11-2007, 09:34 AM

Cut the back of the case, make an aluminum plate to mount two pa120s side by side and then pop rivet the plate to the case with the rads inside.

dengyong

11-11-2007, 09:52 AM

No but I'll take some later today. I have 2 gtx240s in mine I wish I had pa120.2s instead, but if I did the fans would have to mount outside the case due to the tc rads being thicker.

Scubar

11-11-2007, 09:57 AM

Im so tempted to get one of these Cases for an Ultimate Air cooling solution with loads of space. I would have to spray the case black though and get the version without the window as i really dont like silver cases or cases with windows.

dengyong

11-11-2007, 10:19 AM

Mine is black with no windows but they all have the same front.

Scubar

11-11-2007, 10:43 AM

Yea i was just going to buy it and then respray it black, i still might just get one at the end of the month because i have a couple hundred £ spare and have always looked at buying that case purely because there is so much you can do with it.

Nate P.

11-11-2007, 10:53 AM

dengyong

11-11-2007, 12:29 PM

got any pics of that or a build log, be nice to see.

andyc

Here's a few pics. (I live in a dust factory)

I cut this with a jig saw. It's kinda sloppy but I never look at this side.
67054
67055
67056
67057

There's another 50z in the bottom of the 5.25 drive bays.
It's one big loop. Pump/8800gtx/rad/cpu/pump/rad/and back to the bottom pump with a T just before each pump for fill, drain and air removal.
The rads I have require to much airflow so I use the noisy fans.
PA120.2s are the way to go, with quiet fans mounted outside the case.

Scubar

11-11-2007, 12:34 PM

Not keen on Mountain Mod cases, All of them are cubes which i dont really like the look of.

dengyong

11-11-2007, 12:48 PM

I'm also a fan of 18 cent a foot 1/2" tubing from my local hardware store.
It stays clear and works as good as the expensive stuff for me.

Scubar

11-11-2007, 02:03 PM

Cant even find the TT Mozart TX Silver w/no window in the uk :(

Anyone know where i could get the one without the window because all the TT approved dealers dont have that model only the window models.

That Rad mod you have done is really good btw.

Nate P.

11-11-2007, 04:11 PM

Not keen on Mountain Mod cases, All of them are cubes which i dont really like the look of.
This TT is pretty square too... :P

Scubar

11-12-2007, 12:16 AM

Its more rectangle because of its height though instead of just being a small square on wheels :)

Sunayknits

11-12-2007, 01:50 AM

Hi all, as promised here is another quick update. I installed the Sunbeam Rheobus fan controller into the (oh so worthless) 7" drive bay. This bay is meant for some gimmicky bull:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana: that I'll never use so I figured I would make it more useful. Plus I need the space down below ;-)

I also modded the LEDs by adding a 12k resistor to each. Easy since they plug right into a connector on the Rheobus board. The LEDs are STILL quite bright, I may have to try a different kind of LED since I like them super mellow ... or I might try sanding down the LEDs until they're flat and maybe using some superglue to make them more opaque ...

The rest of my water cooling gear should arrive on Tuesday, hopefully I'll be able to get started with that next week. Until then, hang tight!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/sunbeam_mod01.jpg
Panel removed and LEDs modded
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/sunbeam_mod02.jpg
Cut off and modified supports
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/sunbeam_mod03.jpg
Dremel some holes (a steady hand I have not)
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/sunbeam_mod04.jpg
Ready for fitment
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/sunbeam_mod05.jpg
Top view
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/sunbeam_mod06.jpg
In the case
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/sunbeam_mod07.jpg
Looks better than stock after some touch-up paint

hecktic

11-12-2007, 03:38 AM

wow nice job

ginnz

11-12-2007, 04:03 AM

lookin' good! keep em' coming! :-)

mildseven7

11-12-2007, 04:37 AM

I personally don't like those old fashion fan control knob. may be you can consider some auto control via temp like Aquaero or BigNg..etc. Expensive but worth it.
Remember to put some noise pad for look and noise. I put my pump on it.

Here's my work if you dont mine sharing your post. Still waiting few part for the second loop.

mildseven7

11-12-2007, 05:04 AM

got any pics of that or a build log, be nice to see.

andyc

Found one but in chinese tho, may be create account needed
http://bbs.ocqq.com/viewthread.php?tid=4521&extra=&highlight=mozart&page=1

For myself, i just drill some new holes, that's all, no cutting

disruptfam

11-12-2007, 07:32 AM

how's that enzo cpu block? good?

could you take some more internal shot's of your hardware please cheers

mildseven7

11-12-2007, 08:45 AM

how's that enzo cpu block? good?

could you take some more internal shot's of your hardware please cheers

The D-tek usually sits at 30-31 idle, the Enzo sits at 28C most of the time. But i have changed new coolant and updated my bios between that. SO im not sure if that have effect the temp diff. The new bios said cpu temp sensor will be updated for more accurate measurement. Well, at least it is not worst that D-tek, look better, strong backplate, good built quality, no nozzle need, no gap problem..etc. NO excuse not to buy it:up:

That's all i got now, the second loop still waiting for some parts to come, hose, fitting, temp sensor, Ultra X3, 2 x Silentstar HD-single Block( Can only fit one double at the top slot where you can install a LCD, have to order another 2 single HD Block)

The second loop will be:
Loop2(1/4): DDC+3.2(Petra Top) -> PA120.2 -> MIPS RAM Freezer4 -> Asus fusion chipsets block -> Silentstar HD-Dual Block 1 -> Silentstar HD-single Block 2A -> Silentstar HD-single Block 2B -> Pumps cooled by Alphacool HDD3CU/Plexi 3.5" HD Block -> EK-RES150

The pump set will be sitting on other side of the case, still struggling if i should add the third loop, PA120.1 or PA120.2 fits to the harddisk compartment(Since all my HD will go 5.25 compartment, but not sure if the PA fits over there) and change to SLI. But its difficult to place the third pump set plus i dont like internal rad, it might heat up the internal temp, what ya think? should i do it....or do it all with 2 loop...

This is my first build, 2 months ago i am looking at the us299 Kit, now spend almost few G now, worst that drug. :help:

Nate P.

11-12-2007, 08:52 AM

Nice mod, and the Enzotech block looks pretty spiffy...:up:

Waterlogged

11-12-2007, 11:17 AM

Fuzion with nozzles and bow spank the Enzo block.

nikhsub1's testing results (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=163525)

IanY

11-12-2007, 11:19 AM

Fuzion with nozzles and bow spank the Enzo block.

nikhsub1's testing results (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=163525)

Pretty much the best around right now, at least thebest that is publicly available.

Daemonfly

11-13-2007, 09:58 PM

Thanks for the pics of the 2 different dual-rad setups. I was planning on doing the first one, with the custom aluminum plate (already have some 1/16" aluminum here on-hand), but the 2nd version with the rad grills looks cleaner.

As for original poster, I like the fanbus work, looks clean. I was wondering what I was going to do with that spot myself, and planned on possibly going with a custom bay res with Danger Den fillports coming out the top recessed area.

Sunayknits

12-12-2007, 05:21 PM

Okay, let's get started! Here's some pics of the gear I'll be using:

a) Sythe s-flex fans with super-crazy 150,000 hour MTBF
b) MCP350 pumps, quiet but powerful
c) Apogee GTX, one of the better coolers available and super easy to install
d) Sweet little keyboard and cheap but functional MS Scroll Mouse
e) Magicool Extreme Slim Profile radiators - what makes these special is their 120mm width - allowing for a clean install without modding my Mozart case at all!

Notice that the 2 rads are different. They are the same model, but apparently different production runs. I have since replaced the silver-finish one (steel riveted housing) with another all-black one (thanks to Performance-PCs for great service)

The newer version is much cleaner, has no rivets, and the screw holes are tapped better. Make sure if you order one you get the newer version.

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/components_001.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/components_002.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/components_003.jpg

Work is kicking my ass, and family life is very busy but I am making progress. More soon!

karl_eller

12-12-2007, 09:40 PM

Sunayknits, is that rig up and running at the moment (even if it's only on air)? If it is (or if you're going to test it soon), can you do me a big favour and really load out that PSU? Ie Prime95/Orthos/OCCT on CPU + ATI Tool's Artifact Tester or Fur Benchmark on the GPUs. The DA units (mainly 550, 650, 750 and 850 watt units, revision 1.0 or 2.0, but not 1.5 or 2.5) sometimes have a problem with making a fairly noticeable whine when under load. It'd be interesting to see if yours has that "problem". If it does, don't bother trying to RMA it back to Silverstone, they tend to be a bit anal about whine RMAs.

Looking like a very nice build log.

Eller

Sunayknits

12-13-2007, 06:47 PM

I've had it drawing up to 500 watts from the wall (HL Episode 2), and have not noticed any kind of whine/noise whatsoever.

I have since replaced it with a DA850 (used the DA750 for another build) and it's just as quiet.

These are the quietest, highest quality power supplies I have ever used.

Bought them both from NewEgg, so likely they have the latest version.

mildseven7

12-16-2007, 01:39 AM

Can the server board like tyan or Skulltrail fit in this case?

SNiiPE_DoGG

12-16-2007, 02:02 PM

no, it is not big enough. the e-atx is 12x13, versus atx 12x9.6.

to fit a skulltrail/tyan you need a g70/a70, a mountainmods, or a tj0x case. im sure there are others, I wont list them all though

Pudi

12-16-2007, 05:19 PM

Another fantastic build :up:

mildseven7

12-17-2007, 01:02 AM

no, it is not big enough. the e-atx is 12x13, versus atx 12x9.6.

to fit a skulltrail/tyan you need a g70/a70, a mountainmods, or a tj0x case. im sure there are others, I wont list them all though

How about Lian 343B??

.Logic

12-17-2007, 01:10 AM

How about Lian 343B??

:up: :up:

Listen to the man ;)

mildseven7

12-17-2007, 01:12 AM

:up: :up:

Listen to the man ;)

DO u mean Tyan/Skulltrail fits on Lian 343B?

.Logic

12-17-2007, 01:54 AM

DO u mean Tyan/Skulltrail fits on Lian 343B?

Sorry, my above post may have been a bit misleading, I have no idea whether or not the 343B fits Tyran/Skulltrial. It was merely an emphatic display of my incredible love of the 343B and thus should probably considered spam. Oops :shakes:

tiro_uspsss

12-17-2007, 03:03 AM

DO u mean Tyan/Skulltrail fits on Lian 343B?

no - dont think so, as ST mobos are 12x13 i think.. 343B onl takes 12x9.6...

mildseven7

12-17-2007, 03:40 AM

no - dont think so, as ST mobos are 12x13 i think.. 343B onl takes 12x9.6...

Thx:up:

Sunayknits

12-17-2007, 05:13 PM

After staring at this case for what seemed like an eternity, I finally came to some conclusions.

I decided to mod the case to support my WC build, and add a couple nice features for cleanliness/simplicity:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_001.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_002.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_003.jpg

Naked case, just for reference

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_004.jpg

Drive cage mod: original drive mounting on bottom, my new position on top. This keeps the drive away from the radiator/fan assembly, and allows me to hide the wires a lot more cleanly

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_005.jpg

Fill/bleed ports

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_006.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_007.jpg

Cut an extra 1/2" from the door hangar locations which allows the doors to be removed without taking them off the hinges (why oh why this wasn't done like this stock?)

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_008.jpg

Drain ports

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_009.jpg

Installed studs for pump mounting - allows for easy pump removal/maintenance. No need to remove motherboard just to get to the pump

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_010.jpg

See how it works? Bingo!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_011.jpg

Hole cut for reservoir return lines

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/othermods_012.jpg

Another hole for SATA data + power

Next up: radiator/fan assembly test fitting!

Thank you to those complimenting the build. Another thanks to those using my build log to discuss motherboard compatibility :clap: LOL KIDDING! :up:

DavidP

12-17-2007, 09:45 PM

nice job so far :up: Subscribed.

Waterlogged

12-18-2007, 12:48 AM

Nice to see you mounted the one on the MoBo tray you did. I'd have a bad feeling if it were the other way, too easy for rouge air to get trapped in the pump the other way.

As for EATX cases, I'm fairly certain (like 99.92615% certain) the YY-0221 will accommodate such a large board, at least that's the impression I get from mine. :D

mildseven7

12-18-2007, 02:10 AM

Ya, it would be great if the side door can take off easily, i will check your mod method when i got home

BTW, are there any buy/sell category ?

Scubar

12-18-2007, 05:33 AM

mildseven7

12-18-2007, 11:18 AM

Looks very good so far, i will be taking notes because i plan on getting this case and modding it for a dual loop wc setup.

Just a couple of questions i would like to ask.

How easy was it to remove the doors ? Im getting the full Alu side panel version and i will need to remove the doors so that they can be painted.

Are the feet removable ? If so what is the total height of the case without the feet. I have 72cm of space under my tabletop that i would ideally like to slide the case underneath. If not i will have to mod my desk abit.

To remove the panel, you just need to remove the front panel. It is not difficult.

The feet are removable, just one screw

Height is 27.5 inch without feet or 72.2cm with feet. May be u can make it with feet as well

I have 2 rad on back external, now planning the third loop, its not ez tho

Scubar

12-18-2007, 12:19 PM

mildseven7

12-19-2007, 01:45 AM

Yea im planning 2 loops and 2 PA120.2s on the back 1 for cpu/chipset and other for gfx.

Thanks for the info should come in handy when i can finally get the case in about a months time when its in stock ( really hard to find the non window version in the uk )

I will get the Non window if i can make the choice again. I want complete silence, with the see thru window, i cant install the noise foam.

You may already know the screw hole on the black of case won't line up with thermochill, you need either cut out the whole thing or just make some new holes. Also, if you gonna hang them at the back of case, i would suggest PA120.2 and PA120.3, i mean why not..

Scubar

12-19-2007, 05:41 AM

Thats the plan i have in mind. Im going for the non window version and installing a bucket load of noise reducing foam. Having 2 Loops with 2xPA120.2 mounted on the back and repainting the outside of the case.

Sunayknits

12-19-2007, 06:02 PM

I will get the Non window if i can make the choice again. I want complete silence, with the see thru window, i cant install the noise foam.

You may already know the screw hole on the black of case won't line up with thermochill, you need either cut out the whole thing or just make some new holes. Also, if you gonna hang them at the back of case, i would suggest PA120.2 and PA120.3, i mean why not..

The loudest parts of this build right now are:

a) WD Raptor - annoyingly loud. Get some Samgung Spinpoints for a quiet build or the new 750Gb drives using perpendicular recording. They are almost as fast as Raptors and much more quiet. I mean seriously you can hear this thing seeking in the other room. When I add 3 more (RAID 1+0) it will be absolutely ridiculous! :rofl:

b) Fans at full blast. At 1500 RPM, it sounds like an air conditioner, but you can play at 2560x1600 with upwards of 100fps in most modern games. At about 800 RPM, the rig is rather quiet and cooling is sufficient for most tasks.

I decided early on I am going for pure performance with this build so I don't care how loud it is. My work machine, on the other hand is very quiet since it runs 24/7 and runs my home theater as well ...

When you have the fans turned down you can hear the pumps humming along :p: I never would have guessed 20 years ago I'd be building a water-cooled computer??? Sometimes I have to laugh at how far things have come - I mean there are 2 water pumps in my Pee Cee! :eek:

Vargher Warg

12-19-2007, 06:53 PM

Hey!

I really like this Mozart case of yours! I'm looking forward to follow this build :up:

About the annoying sound from the Raptors!

I bought a mCubed "vertical silence" hhd cooler/enclosure box for my Raptor, and It's quite good.
It's doing a fare job with the sound, but you need to have
a fan nearby pushing fresh air over the heat sinks, since the
Raptor gets hot inside the box.

But I really like how it changed the overall sound in my silent system. :)

http://www.mcubed-store.com/catalog/product_reviews_info.php?products_id=96&reviews_id=42&language=en

Scubar

12-21-2007, 12:17 PM

Not sure why everyone complaining about the raptor. i have the 150GB Raptor Enterprise and its practically silent, i have it in a 5.25 anti vibration adaptor

Sunayknits

12-21-2007, 05:44 PM

Not sure why everyone complaining about the raptor. i have the 150GB Raptor Enterprise and its practically silent, i have it in a 5.25 anti vibration adaptor

Well I suppose it all boils down to your tolerance for noise. Or how good/bad your hearing is :eek:

I personally find the Raptor extremely annoying and I would never use it for a normal, everyday use computer. For this box, I just don't care since it will only be used for gaming so it doesn't matter.

I guess you could put it in an enclosure and all that, but why bother? Just get a new WD 750Gb drive and it will be quiet with performance equal to or better than a Raptor :confused:

Sunayknits

12-21-2007, 05:47 PM

Allrighty tighty, here we are installing the radiator and fans in a push/pull configuration.

Just making sure everything is going to fit, before I do any wiring or plumbing ...

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/radical_001.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/radical_002.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/radical_003.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/radical_004.jpg
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/radical_005.jpg

Initially I hooked up all 4 fans on the same channel for the upper rad. On the lower rad, I hooked up 2 fans on each controller channel.

I was considering the latter for finer fan control - in other words, you could run just 2 fans (on one half of the rad) for normal day-to-day stuff, then turn up the other side when you wanted to game.

I quickly decided that option had little utility, so I now have all 4 fans on each rad tied together.

Also, a single fan on each rad/fan assembly is plugged into a motherboard fan connector. This allows me to read the RPM for each loop.

I found that using 4 fans on a single channel as opposed to 2 fans on a single channel yields only about 50RPM difference, which further strengthened my opinion that 4 fans on each channel is the best solution.

Not to mention, it's much simpler to operate with only 2 channels instead of 4 :up:

The_Beast

12-25-2007, 07:25 PM

I don't like the case but you're project is looking good :up:

mildseven7

12-26-2007, 05:04 AM

Well I suppose it all boils down to your tolerance for noise. Or how good/bad your hearing is :eek:

I personally find the Raptor extremely annoying and I would never use it for a normal, everyday use computer. For this box, I just don't care since it will only be used for gaming so it doesn't matter.

I guess you could put it in an enclosure and all that, but why bother? Just get a new WD 750Gb drive and it will be quiet with performance equal to or better than a Raptor :confused:

I hate the HD noise the most cus the noise not in constant, H/L pitch, Long, Short, fast, slow. I put them in a watercooling closure. It's expensive but worth it for dead silence.

Sunayknits

12-27-2007, 07:29 AM

I don't like the case but you're project is looking good :up:

Thank you. I'm stoked with how it's turning out. ;)

Scubar

12-29-2007, 02:18 AM

smee

12-29-2007, 09:29 AM

Sunnayknits, Your build is looking great! but your avatar's freakin me out :eek:
Any ways, keep up the good work! :up:

Martinm210

12-29-2007, 10:09 AM

I really like these cases, if they made them one fan taller to fit two triple rads, I'd buy one for sure.

Very nice build, all these awesome case builds are making me want to redo my case build.

Sunayknits

01-04-2008, 03:33 PM

I dont suppose you could do me one last favour and measure the distance i have marked out with the yellow line from the center of the top hole on the back to the top of the case. Im hoping that the gap is more then 40mm

http://xs122.xs.to/xs122/07526/initial_build_003.jpg (http://xs.to)

It's exactly 2 inches, which means about 5 centimeters. This is from the center of the hole to the top of the case. Keep in mind that top of the case is recessed about 5 mm and the metal is a few mm thick ...

Sunayknits

01-04-2008, 03:40 PM

Hey guys and girls, haven't had much time lately but here is a small update ;)

These are some photos of the reservoirs I'm using, they are AlphaCool Cape Bullseye reservoirs. I really like how they look and they hold enough fluid to be practical too.

I chose the fancy mounting options and also the 'melvin pipe' which is a tube that extends from the center opening into the middle of the reservoir - it makes bleeding a whole lot easier!

I've decided to start using larger images. Lemme know if you like!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_001.jpg
Here you see the res as it comes from the factory - with the pre-installed mounting gizmo (which I don't need).
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_002.jpg
Closeup of the res. Made of POM (Delrin I think). Also you can see the plastic plug used for adding LED lighting if you wish. I'm thinking about using all 3 plugs, with Red Green and Blue LEDs. I can connect them to a microcontroller and do some crazy lighting effects inside the res ... maybe later!
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_003.jpg
Another closeup - here you can see the Koolance barb fitting in the center vs. the EK fittings on each side. I fell in love with the Koolance fittings and will replace all the EK fittings when I get around to it.
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_004.jpg
Assembled into bay holder
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_005.jpg
Just a cool shot, playing with camera settings :)
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_006.jpg
Here you can clearly see the Melvin Pipe in the center
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_007.jpg
I LOVE LOVE LOVE these Koolance fittings! They're expensive, but well worth it for the level of quality ...
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_008.jpg
From left to right: EK barb, Koolance barb, EK stubby (useless!), Koolance compression 90 degree. You can also see the notch cut into the Koolance compression fitting at the top, which works great with a quarter to make 'em nice and tight
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_009.jpg
Can you say FUGLY? These are the EK barbs in the EK blocks. Not only do they look terrible, but the diameter of the thread ends is slightly oversize. This makes them difficult to thread in (have to use a wrench) and when you remove them you have little bits of Delrin (like hairs) on the inside of the blocks. Not good! In contrast, the Koolance fittings thread in easily by hand and fit absolutely perfectly. Furthermore, the threads on the Koolance fittings are shorter so they don't protrude into the blocks as far - particularly important on the copper side of FC 8800GTX blocks. You don't have to use that goofy spacer provided with the block ...
http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres_010.jpg
A good closeup of the EK barbs vs Koolance compression. Quality!

I know I'm gushing about the Koolance fittings, but they do have a bad side. They rust very quickly. I left distilled H20 in the system for a week, thinking everything would be ok for such a short period, and found rust inside all the fittings before I could add anti-corrosives. Ever since I changed the fluid I haven't seen any more rust but just be aware - DO NOT run without anticorrosives for ANY length of time :shocked:

Sunayknits

01-04-2008, 03:46 PM

Sunnayknits, Your build is looking great! but your avatar's freakin me out :eek:
Any ways, keep up the good work! :up:

Hehe, thanks for the good vibes! I love how that avatar is so sick. I chuckle whenever I see it :clap:

Nate P.

01-04-2008, 08:00 PM

While the Koolance fittings are nice, I like the EK ones more. And the Stubbies aren't useless. (can you say "SLI"?)

Sunayknits

01-05-2008, 10:50 AM

While the Koolance fittings are nice, I like the EK ones more. And the Stubbies aren't useless. (can you say "SLI"?)

Why?

And for SLI, I suppose if the cards were really close together ... but they're not even long enough to put a normal sized clamp on so I found they have little utility.

Hey listen, I'm a fan of EK stuff too - just look at all my H20 blocks - but I call bull:banana::banana::banana::banana: when I see it and I think their fittings straight-up suck :rolleyes:

smee

01-05-2008, 11:26 AM

Why?

And for SLI, I suppose if the cards were really close together ... but they're not even long enough to put a normal sized clamp on so I found they have little utility.

Hey listen, I'm a fan of EK stuff too - just look at all my H20 blocks - but I call bull:banana::banana::banana::banana: when I see it and I think their fittings straight-up suck :rolleyes:

Stubbies are great, heres my dad's WC SLI build.
http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/7907/cimg4223gt6.jpg
Between the two vga's and that turn on the bottom vga you see in the pic he used stubbies, they fit the normal sized clamps just fine, and we've had no leaks at all.

The stubbies are mainly used for tight turns or SLI.

Anyway, good job on the build!

Nate P.

01-05-2008, 01:15 PM

Well, the EK's have little ridges perfect for zipties (two of the small ones). I dunno, I guess I just prefer EK over Koolance.

Smee, your dads build looks awesome... I guess your dad is a little more enthusiastic about spending money than my parents.:ROTF:

smee

01-05-2008, 03:04 PM

Smee, your dads build looks awesome... I guess your dad is a little more enthusiastic about spending money than my parents.:ROTF:

Ya well... :rolleyes: It was time to upgrade from our old p4 pressy (which was also watercooled), and because the mobo (ABIT IC7-MAX3) died.
We first where just going to have one vga, but after some convincing :rolleyes: ... he bought another one.
Here's the specs of the system:
M2N32-SLI mobo
AMD 6000+ @ stock 3.0GHz (he's not into overclocking)
4GB Corsair XMS2
2x eVGA 8600GTS 512MB Superclock
850W Antec PSU
and like 1.2TB of HDs.

It's our home comp, my mom uses it the most :)

Nate P.

01-05-2008, 03:26 PM

When I built my first computer my parents were really enthusiastic, but after that it was downhill. Now it's just like, "can't you be happy with the computer you have?" Me: "NO.":rofl:

disruptfam

01-05-2008, 03:36 PM

i'm with nate... ek barbs i'm my fav... so easy to work with and they look great...

imho i dont like the look of those koolance ones...

builds coming along nicely btw :)

teko

01-05-2008, 04:31 PM

It's to types of barbs, and different price ranges, what do you expect? Appart from that, nice work :)

dethred

01-05-2008, 05:27 PM

Nate P.

01-05-2008, 05:36 PM

Sunayknits

01-06-2008, 12:13 AM

Can anyone, or the OP, tell me if Thermochill 120.2's will fit side-by-side on the rear fan openings? My swiftech MCR320's wouldn't even bolt in next to each other on the back of the case. I am trying to figure out a few ways of making my setup 100% internal so I can actually move the case in a few months.

Sure man, look at my previous posts, around the fan/rad testing area. I think I mentioned earlier that the spacing on the back is a perfect square. The holes are placed such that you can fit 4 120mm fans on the back and they will all be touching.

Normal rads will not fit without case modification, since most are > 120mm wide. Magicool Extreme Slim Profile rads (bought from Performance-PCs) work great since they are exactly 120mm wide. They may not perform quite as well as PA120's but the difference is minimal especially at the high fan speeds I'm using in this build.

And BTW, thanks for the kudos, I appreciate everyone's comments :)

Scubar

01-06-2008, 03:00 AM

With regards to the locking mechanisms on the side panels, Can they be removed at all ? I Ask because i want to paint the side panels.

Sunayknits

01-06-2008, 11:45 PM

With regards to the locking mechanisms on the side panels, Can they be removed at all ? I Ask because i want to paint the side panels.

Shouldn't be a problem. You can remove the latch assembly, acrylic and hinges from both doors. The latch just snaps in, the acrylic uses plastic rivets (which look re-usable but I haven't tried), and the hinges are screwed on.

Sunayknits

01-07-2008, 12:02 AM

Anyone wanna see my plumber's butt? I do a crack job with this tubing! Lolz :p:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/plumbersbutt_001.jpg

The pumps are installed!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/plumbersbutt_002.jpg

And so are the drains!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/plumbersbutt_003.jpg

Should be easy to flush!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/plumbersbutt_004.jpg

But testing remains!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/plumbersbutt_005.jpg

Computer veins!

... I'm a dork :shakes:

disruptfam

01-07-2008, 07:11 AM

nice!!!

that case has so much room!!

Evil-Fruits|R4z

02-16-2008, 03:48 AM

Shouldn't be a problem. You can remove the latch assembly, acrylic and hinges from both doors. The latch just snaps in, the acrylic uses plastic rivets (which look re-usable but I haven't tried), and the hinges are screwed on.

The plastic rivets can be re-used for the acrylic panel but, are a b:banana::banana::banana:h to get back in, I advise the use of pliers to squeeze all but one of the legs in then use extreme force and bad language to get the last leg in.

Either that or use metal pop-rivets or some sort of hex nut and bolt solution maybe.

R4z

Sunayknits

02-28-2008, 10:33 PM

Finally I had some time to work on my project again! :D

Here are my Foxconn 8800GTX cards and EK blocks:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/gtxglam_001.jpg

Overclocked from the factory @ 600 / 1000Mhz

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/gtxglam_002.jpg

Backside

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/gtxglam_003.jpg

Naked!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/gtxglam_004.jpg

Playing with macro

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/gtxglam_005.jpg

The stocker

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/gtxglam_006.jpg

She's mounted! :up:

These Foxconn cards are not completely stable at these speeds on air. After an hour or so of HL2:EP2 they would inevitably cause a hang.

Hopefully on water they'll work better.

I mounted the block once, took it off and checked for good contact, and found a couple areas that needed more pressure. Gotta be careful not to get the screws too tight, but they gotta be tweaked to get proper contact.

Next up, motherboard waterblock mounting!

Also, for you eagle-eyed readers who've noticed my signature has changed (all zero of you lol), you might be interested to see I now have 2 Gigabyte i-Ram boxes (http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Products/Storage/Products_Overview.aspx?ProductID=2678&ProductName=i-RAM%20BOX) on hand fresh from Hong Kong. Both are fully loaded with brand new memory, tested and ready to go. They are simply incredible and I will talk more about these later!

hecktic

02-29-2008, 12:34 AM

My Rad design for your reference

PA120.3 + PA120.2 External

I really like these cases, if they made them one fan taller to fit two triple rads, I'd buy one for sure.

Very nice build, all these awesome case builds are making me want to redo my case build.

You can definitely fit 2 PA 120.3 rads... the orientation of physical location would seem a bit weird but it will be possible to fit 2 PA 120.3 radiators in this case.

You can actually fit, 1 x 120.3 on back, 1 x 120.2 on back, and 1 x 120.3 in the front behind the front cover/door :D

P.s. I am going to try this :D :D :D

QuadSLI

02-29-2008, 06:45 AM

You can definitely fit 2 PA 120.3 rads... the orientation of physical location would seem a bit weird but it will be possible to fit 2 PA 120.3 radiators in this case.

You can actually fit, 1 x 120.3 on back, 1 x 120.2 on back, and 1 x 120.3 in the front behind the front cover/door :D

P.s. I am going to try this :D :D :D

Are you serious, PA120.3 in front interior..
Which area? Under drive or floppy area or under floppy?
I have PA120.2, 120.3 hanged at back, will do it after you if you done it.

QuadSLI

03-01-2008, 07:39 AM

Are you serious, PA120.3 in front interior..
Which area? Under drive or floppy area or under floppy?
I have PA120.2, 120.3 hanged at back, will do it after you if you done it.

Any news on your Front PA120.3 build?

Sunayknits

03-02-2008, 09:52 PM

Here we go with another update, this time installing the motherboard heatsinks!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_001.jpg

Stock ASUS P5N32-E SLI Plus board, a close relative of the Striker Extreme :D

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_002.jpg

Look at that crappy contact patch!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_003.jpg

The NB and SB were nearly epoxied on, I was cursing during this removal!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_004.jpg

A bit more contact here, but still very poor. No wonder the stock solutions don't work well!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_005.jpg

All stock parts removed

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_006.jpg

Shoddy machining on the EK mosfet blocks was a surprise. They're flat, but sharp edges and lower quality than Eddy's other parts gives me sadface :(

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_007.jpg

NB + SB blocks are flawless

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_008.jpg

Starting to look like a comfuser again!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_009.jpg

Yeah!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_010.jpg

I'm gettin' excited!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobohobo_011.jpg

More macro madness

It's hard to believe that sensitive electronics can be man-handled like this without being harmed. When I'm prying off my old heatsinks I always get a bit worried :eek:

Nate P.

03-02-2008, 09:55 PM

I'd be worried with that alu top... see http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=179040

Sunayknits

03-02-2008, 10:10 PM

I'd be worried with that alu top... see http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=179040

Thanks for the heads up, however I use a considerable amount of anti-corrosives in my mix so I don't have to worry about this problem. I learned that the hard way, and verified that it does work.

You just have to be diligent about changing out your coolant every 6 months or so and use the proper amount of Zerex or antifreeze :)

QuadSLI

03-03-2008, 07:10 AM

Looks like your taking your time and doing a great job Sunayknits,

Very intresting build. Keep up the great work.

andyc

What ya doing, you didnt do much for like a half year already, get to work:cord:

:)

Sunayknits

03-03-2008, 05:49 PM

Looks like your taking your time and doing a great job Sunayknits,

Very intresting build. Keep up the great work.

andyc

Thanks! I hate taking so long, but priority 1 is making enough money to fund my hobby, and that simply takes time :cool:

Sunayknits

03-03-2008, 05:51 PM

What ya doing, you didnt do much for like a half year already, get to work:cord:

:)

Hehe nobody is as frustrated as me :eek:

Justintoxicated

03-03-2008, 07:20 PM

Those Fenix Flashlights are great for working on computers :)

disruptfam

03-03-2008, 07:27 PM

i like the colour scheme going on here :)

what model ram is that?

IanY

03-03-2008, 08:01 PM

Pardon me while I vent some frustration... please....

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING WITH A GTX WITH STOCK TOP ?!?

At least get the copper top, or get rid of that water block altogether.

Please !!!

Breezyjr

03-04-2008, 04:02 AM

Looking good...

I actually just got rid of my Mozart case, cause I absolutely hated it... but I didn't do any modding, kept case stock....

Can't wait to see it finished...

Now, My daughter is looking over my shoulder to see all the smiles... so you'll have to excuse the next part....

:shocked: :rofl: :lol: :stick: :woot: :sofa: :am: :moon: :fight: :shoot: :spill: :rehab: :bananal: :party: :YIPPIE:

Thanks..

breezyjr

QuadSLI

03-04-2008, 08:21 AM

Xilikon

03-04-2008, 08:40 AM

Breezyjr

03-04-2008, 09:42 AM

I thought the Mozart case wasn't deep enough. With my 8800GTX installed, I the fan in front barely fit, and I wanted to put in a triple rad there. The mobo header for my card reader wasn't long enough, as well as the floppy (I know, could have got another cable).
I would have preferred the 5 1/4" drive bays were opposite side, and the HDD cage opposite as well.

It had a great deal of potential, I just didn't find this site in time to do a bunch of mods. I'm now working on my triple loop UFO duality case (yes, "another" UFO case....I didn't know they were so popular when I bought it).

Also, I don't know why they put the front fans behind the solid part of the front panel. But, if they flip flopped the optical bays section (the black part) I think there would have been better airflow.

Really just my opinion, I like what this build is turning out to be. I wish I had seen found XS prior to building the mozart case... I just may have liked it.

Good luck...

Breezyjr

Again... apologies for all the smilies in my post... 6 year old was buggin me about them and wanted to see 'em... hope they aren't too distracting....

Sunayknits

03-04-2008, 09:00 PM

Those Fenix Flashlights are great for working on computers :)

HELLZ YA! I'm a self-described "Flashlight Afficianado", or "total nerd" according to some :rofl:

LEDs, LUMENS and such get me off. Guess that sums it up!

Waterlogged

03-04-2008, 09:17 PM

LEDs, LUMENS and such get me off. Guess that sums it up!

TMI :stick:

systemviper

03-04-2008, 09:22 PM

Man that is one hell of a case! WOW

Sunayknits

03-04-2008, 09:25 PM

i like the colour scheme going on here :)

what model ram is that?

G.Skill something or other, it's been replaced recently with something faster, black in color ... you'll see in the final build :)

Sunayknits

03-04-2008, 09:30 PM

Pardon me while I vent some frustration... please....

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING WITH A GTX WITH STOCK TOP ?!?

At least get the copper top, or get rid of that water block altogether.

Please !!!

Look, seriously, you really need to consider some anticorrosives. I ran my loop for a week with just distilled and it corroded the fittings. I cleaned it all up, put it back together with the proper mix, and zero problems. Just run the right stuff and you're good. Simple as pie. I don't know why this is such a point of contention. :rolleyes:

Sunayknits

03-04-2008, 10:33 PM

Man that is one hell of a case! WOW

Love to see some of those pelt loops, got pix? ;)

Sunayknits

03-04-2008, 10:36 PM

systemviper

03-04-2008, 11:29 PM

Love to see some of those pelt loops, got pix? ;)

Yo Yo yO. first, must say, your the bomb, that case is so slick. it almost makes me change my mind back from the Mountian Mod back to the Mozart.

BUT, i just need the room, don't need the bling and don't care about sound. My #1 priority is space and the MM got what it takes. I DO NOT want to have to stress about adding something....

here is the build I am ordering tomorrow....

U2-UFO CYO (Choose Your Own)
- Acrylic Color Smoked Grey
- Side 3 Big Window Panel (MB side for show off)
- Window Etching 1 Window Top (SystemVipers Logo based on the superman look)
- Side 2 Triple Original Panel (Chiller side)
- Side 1 Diamond Panel(top w/logo)
- Front Panel Type Duality
- Horizontal MB brace No
- Finish Black Wrinkle
- Front Panel Fan Spacing Swiftech/Black ICE
- Back Panel Fan Spacing Swiftech/Black ICE
- Back Panel Type Standard

Component list
Evga 780i
Evga (2) 8800 GTS 512 (92)
CPU E8400 till the Core 2 Quad Q9450 comes in.
2 PSU's Roswill 950 (main) plus a Roswill 650
Swiftech GTX copper top (?)
MCW60 for GPU's or DD Ion if got funds.
Pumps 2 D5 vario plus a 355 w/petra top
resi's still undecided.
lots of temp monitoring- still thinking of best way. Prob the inline mod.
RAM Dominator 8500 V1.2 Micron 2G
Asus monitors.

So that is what i am thinking, have 95% of everything except MM box.

Plus the in line chillers, i will break out my home brew design in the next month during this build.

Will start a seperate thread for that.
Plus just about finished my pelt bench.
Main board to start will be Evga 680i LT
Tankguys Micron 8000 ram, hmmmm
have 2 swiftech pelt mcw60's plus the swiftech pelt CPU block. Then add in my home brew chillers right before the pelt blocks, should help get temps down....

Also have several Variable 8-15v 30a power supplies to tune in the pelts....
Again need to figure out best way to monitor temps.

Sorry for being longwinded in your thread, but your build of the Mozart was a learning exp for me and just want to thank you again for taking the time to fill us in.

I will do the same in my thread.
Now back t o your regularly scheduled thread....

QuadSLI

03-05-2008, 08:28 AM

Hi System Viper,

You have choose DD ion over EK-88 FC, any reason for that?

Sunayknits

03-05-2008, 07:09 PM

Yo Yo yO. first, must say, your the bomb, that case is so slick. it almost makes me change my mind back from the Mountian Mod back to the Mozart.

BUT, i just need the room, don't need the bling and don't care about sound. My #1 priority is space and the MM got what it takes. I DO NOT want to have to stress about adding something....

I totally hear that. You would think with all this space I would want for nothing, but this case still leaves something to be desired. For example, I now have 2 Gigabyte i-Ram boxes to install (5.25" bay devices) and no bays to put them in, so I gotta figure out some way to mount them unnaturally ...

But I suppose each case has it's own challenges :up:

Thanks for the support and I look forward to your new build!

Sunayknits

03-17-2008, 09:37 PM

Here's the mow-bow gettin' its smarts all plumbed up:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_001.jpg

Leftover tubing from my old Zalman Reserator! Best tubing I've seen yet. Real rubbery and great bend radius!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_002.jpg

Dat dem der thing suer is neet.

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_003.jpg

Wonder if dem der smarts is gonna werk?

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_004.jpg

Dem 'puters suuuuuure is neat.

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_005.jpg

I'm a-lookin down on dem toobers!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_006.jpg

Noobers! Jim go get ma a pickle!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_007.jpg

UH OH! HEY LOOK PARALLEL 8800GTX's in SLI! THE WHISTLES GO WOOO! :rofl:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/mobotoob_008.jpg

Would ya get a load o that ma!? Parallel GTX cards. SHOOOO - WEEe! :rofl: :yepp: :yepp: :yepp:

Whew. Anybody notice my oops? :shakes:

Till next time! :D

Swingerton

03-24-2008, 01:26 PM

Um...you're lines are going out the back of the pc when this is suppose to be internally cooled? I don't know...memory isn't water cooled? :P

Pedalmonkey

03-24-2008, 02:34 PM

Evil-Fruits|R4z

03-25-2008, 09:44 AM

Output for parallel blocks is on the wrong card.

QuadSLI

03-25-2008, 10:38 AM

Why da heck he connect both line between the FC block?:shrug:

Sunayknits

03-26-2008, 03:22 PM

Um...you're lines are going out the back of the pc when this is suppose to be internally cooled? I don't know...memory isn't water cooled? :P

The lines going to the rear are only for draining the system. There is a removeable plug on the outside which can be unscrewed for draining.

Water-cooling memory is almost as useless as water-cooling your hard drive. Neither require it. Of course I'll get some flack for that :eek:

Sunayknits

03-26-2008, 03:27 PM

1 SB out looks like its kinking and its a different color, 2 where the heck is the out line on the parallel SLI blocks?? :P

:edit: and it looks like u missed your mosfet block. could create a few issues. maybe water flying across the room and you mobo.

The clear tubing is thin-walled. It's all I had at the time. It will be replaced eventually, but I do like the clear vs. blue contrast so that'll stay. It's not kinking, and regarding the mosfet block that is the input for that loop and I just haven't hooked up the pump line yet.

I should have stated before, what you are looking at are 2 separate loops ...

Sunayknits

03-26-2008, 03:34 PM

Output for parallel blocks is on the wrong card.

Hehe, look carefully and think about how the blocks flow. In through the bottom (on the left in the last photo), through both blocks at the same time, then out the top. This is a parallel configuration without using a 'y'.

Not only will I get less flow resistance, but the card temps should remain very very close to one another.

Still, nobody has yet found my egregious (and totally obvious) error :shrug: :)

karl_eller

03-26-2008, 03:47 PM

I'd be somewhat inclined to swap the inlet and outlet on the left-hand mofset block, but aside from that I can't see anything wrong with the loop layout...

Eller

oerekum

03-26-2008, 04:00 PM

no clamp on the other GTX barb? wrong motherboard screws?

karl_eller

03-26-2008, 04:22 PM

All the mobo screws look right. And yeah, he's missing a clamp on one of the Apogee GTX barbs (inlet).

Eller

Maxx103

03-27-2008, 04:34 AM

karl_eller

03-27-2008, 10:34 AM

I'm gonna guess here...I only see one hose going to the dual cards - no output hose???

Looking at the card configuration and factoring in the two hoses coming from the rear of the case.....

If you look closely - the two hoses come from the back of the case and then disappear through a cutout in the motherboard tray. Then you have one hose going to the bottom graphics card, followed by two hoses from the bottom card to the top card.......but I don't see another hose from the top of the card to the rest of the loop.
Water loop for the GPU goes in the bottom card, through both, then out the top.
The two hoses coming out the back of the case are just the drains for the CPU/mobo and GPU loops.
And he hasn't finished tubing everything, since the CPU/mobo loop doesn't have an inlet yet.

Eller

Sunayknits

03-27-2008, 04:38 PM

no clamp on the other GTX barb?

Hehe yup after I took the pics I noticed I had forgotten a clamp on the GTX :yepp:

Sucks 'cause that tubing is rather difficult to get on the barbs :rolleyes:

Good catch! :clap:

CoNMaN

04-11-2008, 09:12 PM

Any updates?

My Mozart build:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=182793

NoobCake

04-11-2008, 09:38 PM

WOW, are they the koolance compression barbs?

making me drool

Waterlogged

04-12-2008, 11:30 AM

WOW, are they the koolance compression barbs?

making me drool

:confused:......:lol2:.......:rolleyes:........... :brick:

smee

04-12-2008, 01:12 PM

making me drool

Yea man! noob cake is my fav!!!!!!!!!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :ROTF: :ROTF: :D :D :p:

Jk jk!! lol. But yes I agree, koolance compressions are awesome, it's just the word "koolance" that makes me shivver....... :ROTF: :ROTF: :rolleyes:

Sunayknits

05-19-2008, 05:04 PM

(me) :clap:

Hey everybody, I've been away for a while, dealing with life and what not ... mostly due to my mom getting cancer. She's doing pretty good now, chemo seems to have stopped it for now so we're all pretty stoked.

So anyway I have resumed my build and will be adding more pics soon.

I've changed several things since my initial build and learned a few lessons along the way:

Compression fittings have some disadvantages:

a) initially I had used some very soft Primochill tubing and I knew I would regret it. Well it turned out exactly like I expected, the tubing slipped right out of the fitting after running the system for a few days (I'll post a pic for reference later) and coolant poured all over everything. Luckily I had just turned off the machine so hopefully no permanent damage was done ...

b) The whole fitting will often unscrew instead of just the outer part when you try to remove the hose (just means you have to cut the hose, no biggie but kind of dumb)

c) You are limited to thin-walled tubing

I've since changed everything 'cept the mobo to Koolance barbs, with large O.D. tubing (3/8" x 5/8") and Herbie clamps. This doesn't look as nice but damn those Herbie clamps sure are sweet. They're super easy to remove and do a great job of sealing :up:

The next couple of posts will detail what failed in my initial build, then I will move on to my current status. Take care everybody, and eat right and excercise so you don't get freaking cancer! :eek:

madmaxx

05-19-2008, 05:44 PM

a little dab of loctite will keep those barbs from twisting out & leaking

Sunayknits

06-02-2008, 08:43 PM

The failure of de feet

Well I told you I'd let you in on a couple failures I had that kinda killed my enthusiasm for a while:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fail_001.jpg

Here you see the EK Southbridge block splayed open for your enjoyment. This is a very nice part. Notice the Koolance compression fittings (sigh).

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fail_002.jpg

Here it is installed. The arrow is where I had a problem. The hose I used was too thin-walled and over time, it ended up coming loose from the fitting. Apparently the weight of it pulling down was enough to release it from the fitting entirely. Fortunately I noticed right away (I was just showing off the system and had just turned it off!) so I was able to get the machine into the bathtub quickly. Coolant went everywhere, all over the mobo and gfx cards, so I pulled it all apart, fired up the air compressor, rinsed the affected parts under tap water and blew everything off thoroughly.

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fail_003.jpg

After I had it all apart I noticed something rather disturbing ...

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fail_004.jpg

Yep, they're both cracked.

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fail_005.jpg

Gotta be careful with Acrylic! :rolleyes:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fail_006.jpg

Crack is fun in a pipe, but not in your res.

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fail_007.jpg

That beatch has a deep crack!

This failure was due strictly to my own stupidity. The mounting bolts for the res were not perfectly flush with the bayres mount and I cranked the acrylic down too hard. I've fixed this in the new version that you will see soon :clap:

MomijiTMO

06-03-2008, 03:41 AM

Crack is fun in a pipe, but not in your res.
ROFLMAO.

Anyhoo thanks for sharing with us. I for one will make sure I don't screw my res down too hard. Lucky you were aware of the problem before you lost any parts. Good luck with the rehash!

septim

06-03-2008, 06:21 AM

ouch, bad cracks...

i found nemo

06-03-2008, 08:24 AM

daang dude, hope it runs good now. and sorry to hear that about ur mom, but glad she's gettin' better ;)

Sunayknits

06-03-2008, 11:32 PM

sorry to hear that about ur mom, but glad she's gettin' better ;)

Very kind of you to say so, thanks :up:

Sunayknits

06-06-2008, 11:55 PM

Here we go, picking up a bit of steam again ...

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_001.jpg

Curiosity did WHAT to the cat???

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_002.jpg

FoxConn 8800GTX cards, all dried out and new fittings installed. Those Koolance barbs are SEXY!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_003.jpg

The first time around I found that filling was tough so I made some modifications for an extra set of breather tubes

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_004.jpg

Yeah it's a bit ugly

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_005.jpg

I'm using white clamps for the upper loop (proc + mobo parts) and black for the lower (GFX) loop

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_006.jpg

This will be a pee cee someday ...

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_007.jpg

New fittings, including LED-hole plugs on top. Eventually I plan to add a custom controller with RGB LEDs in each plug - but that's later on

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_008.jpg

The paint job on the bayres mounts was a crappy rattle-can job (thanks Performance-PCs!) so I opted to polish them instead. I also countersunk the holes a bit more to keep the acrylic from cracking again

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_009.jpg

Shiny!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_010.jpg

Don't fall in!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/newlook_011.jpg

Polished is purrfect!

Sunayknits

06-08-2008, 02:12 PM

Hang in there buddy,

We're rooting for you and your Mom, keep the faith.

andyc

Thanks Andy!

Sunayknits

06-09-2008, 07:56 PM

Portholes

Installing some functional eye candy

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres2_001.jpg

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres2_002.jpg

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres2_003.jpg

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/bayres2_004.jpg

i found nemo

06-11-2008, 05:45 AM

Very kind of you to say so, thanks :up:

no prob ;) nice to see ur loop coming back together nicely.

Sunayknits

06-14-2008, 02:20 PM

I like to think of the pump as the 'heart' of the system
In this case it's like Doctor Who; he has 2 hearts :p:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/heart_001.jpg
Before surgery

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/heart_002.jpg
After a couple hours in the ER :eek:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/heart_003.jpg
The patient is looking good!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/heart_004.jpg
Stitching it up

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/heart_005.jpg
Hiding the sutures

Moving right along now ...

Sunayknits

06-16-2008, 09:56 PM

Allright b!tch3s, let's get to it! :cool:

I wanted the fans and radiators to be complete assemblies that I could control with a single +12v line for each loop.

I was going to make a power breakout board then I found this Sunbeam jobby that worked just great. No point in re-inventing the wheel, right?

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fannies_001.jpg
Early testing

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fannies_002.jpg
Sleeving cables. The adapter cables allow me to get rotational speed from a single fan in each assembly

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fannies_003.jpg
Testing my work

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fannies_004.jpg
Installed - left side

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fannies_005.jpg
Making progress!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fannies_006.jpg
Installed - right side

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/fannies_007.jpg
Closeup of right side

Sunayknits

06-20-2008, 06:33 PM

I had to relocate the hard drives to make room for a pair of i-Rams, so I used this elegant solution from Mountain Mods:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/raidofraptor_001.jpg
Mockup - it fits!

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/raidofraptor_002.jpg
Making it pretty

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/raidofraptor_003.jpg
The brackets are anodized, but it's a cheap type 1 and can be scratched easily :(

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/raidofraptor_004.jpg
Custom-made power cable. Gotta love those IDT power terminals! :up:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/raidofraptor_005.jpg
A bit more stuffing

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/raidofraptor_006.jpg
Some perspective

karl_eller

06-20-2008, 06:45 PM

Man, why can I never get my tubing looking that neat and tidy? Seeing your loop layout has convinced me to re-do my loop some time. That and I've found a freaking awesome Black/UV Blue dye that looks really hot.

Eller

disruptfam

06-20-2008, 07:10 PM

me likes... good work mate!

karl_eller

06-20-2008, 07:51 PM

:shocked: You better double-check that tubing run on the video cards. :rofl:
It doesn't look too bad. In the top card, through what is effectively a Y-split, out the bottom card. The layout of the cards means that each card is getting pretty much identical flow rate. The CPU and board is on a separate loop.

It's a bit unusual, yes, but it should work, when you think about the paths of the water through both GPU blocks.

Eller

Pellepel

06-20-2008, 07:58 PM

very cool :up:

CoNMaN

06-20-2008, 10:09 PM

Nice work!

karl_eller

06-21-2008, 05:43 AM

:shocked: Neither card is going to get much flow with that setup. :shakes:

May I suggest this fix:

http://www.spotswoodcustomcomputers.com/photos/flowsuggestion.jpg
It works exactly the same as a Y-Splitter would. Water goes in the top barb. Half of the flow goes through the first card, out the outlet, then bypasses the 2nd card, and through the bottom tube. The other half of the water bypasses the first card, goes through the second card, then out the bottom tube. Both water blocks have identical restrictions (well, should have :p:), and the lengths of tubing, so the flow rate will be identical. Half the flow rate, yes, but it's the same as if he was using a normal Y-splitter, except this one is simpler, easier to balance, and looks nicer.

A quick Paint edit, and flow would look a bit like this:
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n212/Karl_Eller/flow.jpg
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n212/Karl_Eller/flow.jpg

Eller

RockfordFosgate

06-21-2008, 05:51 AM

I love the last updates :up:

Sunayknits

06-22-2008, 11:09 AM

Thanks everyone for your comments!

The cards in this configuration amount to a Y-fitting, exactly as some of you have said.

I know for a fact that this works great since I had it set up this way before I rebuilt. The cards were usually within 1 degree C of each other, most of the time they were equal.

I don't know if this would work as well if there were other things in the loop, but since I have a dedicated GFX card loop it works perfectly. The flow is split evenly between each card and even tho the flow rate is reduced, it is not a considerable reduction. Under load I generally see under 50C for both cards, with an ambient temp of around 25C. This is with them both overclocked so I think those are pretty decent figures ...

Also, the flow goes from the bottom to the top. I find this allows the system to self-bleed much more easily, and it fosters clean and short lines. Both loops are set up this way:

Res -> Pump -> Blocks -> Rad

Pumps like to PUSH fluid, otherwise they can cavitate and give you trouble. For example you always find the fuel pump inside the gas tank on modern cars. I tried to model my loops that way for performance :)

I'll have more updates soon. I have to make a bracket for the iRams and that's gonna take a while ...

Sunayknits

06-22-2008, 11:19 AM

Oh one thing I forgot to mention, sorry no pictures :(

When I had it apart I added some EK backplates for the MOSFETs. Man what a difference! Previously the board would bend enough to prevent the blocks from actually touching the MOSFETS in the center. The backplates mitigated this problem tremendously.

Highly recommended! Install backplates if you're gonna water-cool your MOSFETS! :eek:

skinnee

06-22-2008, 12:06 PM

did you re-use the Asus backplates? I can't tell which board from the pics, so I don't know if your board had the mosfet and NB/SB backplates like the SIIE does.

Sunayknits

06-23-2008, 04:22 PM

did you re-use the Asus backplates? I can't tell which board from the pics, so I don't know if your board had the mosfet and NB/SB backplates like the SIIE does.

I didn't get any with the board (ASUS P5N32-E SLI Plus). I bought the EK backplates and used those.

I did have to find some longer screws at a local hardware store. Shame EK doesn't include them with the backplates ...

reppgoa

06-25-2008, 02:12 PM

bigslappy

06-26-2008, 03:29 PM

sub'ed

;p

dengyong

06-26-2008, 03:46 PM

Will you be able to remove the ram without removing the hard drives ?

HaCKs

06-26-2008, 04:29 PM

It works exactly the same as a Y-Splitter would. Water goes in the top barb. Half of the flow goes through the first card, out the outlet, then bypasses the 2nd card, and through the bottom tube. The other half of the water bypasses the first card, goes through the second card, then out the bottom tube. Both water blocks have identical restrictions (well, should have :p:), and the lengths of tubing, so the flow rate will be identical. Half the flow rate, yes, but it's the same as if he was using a normal Y-splitter, except this one is simpler, easier to balance, and looks nicer.

A quick Paint edit, and flow would look a bit like this:
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n212/Karl_Eller/flow.jpg
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n212/Karl_Eller/flow.jpg

Eller

That setup is not going to work very well.... the water is not forced to pass through both cards, and it won't.

aspire.comptech

06-26-2008, 06:05 PM

That setup is not going to work very well.... the water is not forced to pass through both cards, and it won't.

QFT.

DarthBeavis

06-26-2008, 06:23 PM

That setup is not going to work very well.... the water is not forced to pass through both cards, and it won't.

That is a total pass through. A guy at the last Intel LAN I went to had a boutique rig (not sure which one but a skull is their logo) in which they had a dual card DD loop in which the flow went down from card one to card two by passing card one as in this loop but instead of exiting the second card like this loop it returned the flow back up to the first card via the other barb and then exited the card loop via the right top barb . . .it would operate at stock but if you oc'd it even a hair all hell would break loose . . .

Sunayknits

06-27-2008, 09:03 PM

Hi, I havebeen following your progress for some time now and I am very impressed with it. I was wondering what kind of computer education you have. I am very interested in this type of modding as a hobby and would like to take a few classes to learn some of the stuff that you have displayed. For example making your own custom power cables, the work you did on the LED and fan controller and some of the more complicated hardware aspects of building and modding PCs. I have a pretty good basic knowledge of computers and have been building them for awhile now but would like to go beyond what I currently know. Thank you in advance for any help you can provide and have a great day.

Well first of all, thx for the props :up:

I have a BS (bull:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:) in Computer Engineering. This is not what fostered my growth (or education, really) in computers. I've been building (and taking apart) things since I was old enough to remember. I've had one of nearly every major computer ever made, and kept up on most of the architecture changes since I could read. Unfortunately this is becoming nearly impossible now with the changes coming so fast ...

Honestly the most important skill you can have is "googling". College teaches you jack squat, the most important skill you get from College is the ability to research something. I had to find crap in an Encycolpedia back in the day, but now I have a VAST resource for absolutely ANYTHING I want to know. That is what you call a paradigm shift

The key is to know WHAT to search for and HOW to find it! :shrug:

The next important thing is the willingness to screw up, and screw up often. The time you spend thinking about how to do something is time that you could have spent actually trying it. The moral is, do 10 minutes of research on say, creating cables, then spend a few hours actually trying it!

There is no substitute for experience in any trade. When people are awed with my fuel-injected '57 Chevy and ask me how I did it, it always seems to surprise them that I "just did it"! I tried and tried and by about the 5th time, I finally achieved something useful. Failure is the greatest teacher, and you can't be afraid.

The difference between a layman and an expert is very simple: experience.

Give it a shot and every time you fail, you have the opportunity to learn. Share with others when you get the chance (which means "dont be lazy") and try to create a dialoge with those people who are better than you.

So first, be clear on what you want, then go out and find as much information as you can. Then try it and see what happens! That's the best advice I can give you.

Good luck and when you get something done, hit me again for some feedback. :)

Sunayknits

06-27-2008, 09:05 PM

Will you be able to remove the ram without removing the hard drives ?

No, but I can pull the cables from the Raptors and remove 4 screws and I'm good to go. One of the drawbacks of making something so completely custom is that maintenance becomes a bit of a pain ... even so it takes me literally 30 seconds to remove the Raptors.

Sunayknits

06-27-2008, 09:07 PM

That setup is not going to work very well.... the water is not forced to pass through both cards, and it won't.

I know this works because I've tried it :shrug:\

Go out to EK and see how the cards flow, and you will quickly see why this works. Frankly after I thought about it, I was amazed that more people didn't do this. However it's always easy to see something after you understand it, just like you always find things in the last place you look :)

Sunayknits

06-27-2008, 09:09 PM

QFT.

QFT?

Forgive my internet ignorance, but I have no idea what that means :eek:

karl_eller

06-27-2008, 09:15 PM

That setup is not going to work very well.... the water is not forced to pass through both cards, and it won't.
Except it IS forced to pass through both cards. The resistance in each water block is identical (or as close to identical as the manufacturing process allows), and the water is going to be forced to split between both blocks. Just take a couple of minutes to think about how the internals of the blocks are laid out. If he only had one of the tubes connecting the card, then yes, you're right, it wouldn't work, but with both connections there, it WILL work just like a Y-splitter, except the flow would be more even than you'd be able to get using a Y-Splitter.

Sunayknits: QFT is short for "quoted for truth", basically a way of saying you agree with something someone said.

Eller

Sunayknits

06-27-2008, 09:18 PM

That is a total pass through. A guy at the last Intel LAN I went to had a boutique rig (not sure which one but a skull is their logo) in which they had a dual card DD loop in which the flow went down from card one to card two by passing card one as in this loop but instead of exiting the second card like this loop it returned the flow back up to the first card via the other barb and then exited the card loop via the right top barb . . .it would operate at stock but if you oc'd it even a hair all hell would break loose . . .

Hmm, that sounds a bit goofy ... no surprise it was unstable. I think mine works well because the loop is super simple, and this loop is dedicated. Honestly I'm very surprised most ppl don't do it this way ...

Beavis, your Cherry build is blowing my mind. I have dreams about that crap :p:

Sunayknits

06-27-2008, 09:37 PM

Except it IS forced to pass through both cards. The resistance in each water block is identical (or as close to identical as the manufacturing process allows), and the water is going to be forced to split between both blocks. Just take a couple of minutes to think about how the internals of the blocks are laid out. If he only had one of the tubes connecting the card, then yes, you're right, it wouldn't work, but with both connections there, it WILL work just like a Y-splitter, except the flow would be more even than you'd be able to get using a Y-Splitter.

Sunayknits: QFT is short for "quoted for truth", basically a way of saying you agree with something someone said.

Eller

QFT

:clap:

karl_eller

06-27-2008, 10:22 PM

Hmm, that sounds a bit goofy ... no surprise it was unstable. I think mine works well because the loop is super simple, and this loop is dedicated. Honestly I'm very surprised most ppl don't do it this way ...

Yeah, if I end up getting dual HD4870 X2's, chances are I'll be using FC waterblocks (the XSPC Razor blocks look REALLY nice), in which case I think I'll probably steal your way of setting the bocks up.

Eller

Breezyjr

06-28-2008, 04:17 AM

Sunayknits

06-29-2008, 10:40 AM

QFT... good to know.

My first thought was that QFT stood for, Quit Effing Talking...... hheheehe

I am liking how your build is turning out. I had the same case, water cooled, and absolutely hated it. But, I also didn't put as much effort into mine.... I used to just put all the parts in, and hoped it would all work.... hehe

later,
breezyjr

Yeah this case requires quite a bit of thought and modding to get everything nice and tidy. I've had to move things around quite a bit to get it like I want. For example, I quickly ran out of 5.25" bays so I have to make a custom bracket for my iRams and that's gonna be a huge pain in the butt. :shakes:

hotdun

06-29-2008, 08:44 PM

QFT?

Forgive my internet ignorance, but I have no idea what that means :eek:

I heard somewhere that "googling" was your friend...

disruptfam

06-29-2008, 09:13 PM

I heard somewhere that "googling" was your friend...

Wow great 1st post man!!

:clap:

:shakes:

Sunayknits

06-29-2008, 11:12 PM

I heard somewhere that "googling" was your friend...

Heh, well I suppose I deserve that :yepp:

shachar2

06-29-2008, 11:39 PM

Sunayknits

07-02-2008, 07:33 PM

So if a radiator can handle the capacity you should be able to create a 'virtual' two loops to cool a cpu and two gpu's
using a y connector to split the outgoing cool water: one goes to the cpu then a radiator
the other goes to gpu, gpu then the radiator

wouldn't it work?

I suppose it would probably work. The major benefit (to me anyhow) of 2 separate loops is to keep the gfx cards from heating up my proc/mobo. The cards generally run 15-20 degrees C hotter than the other parts ...

However the water temp doesn't change a whole lot through the loop, on the order of a few degrees at most, so I'm guessing 'virtual' loops might yield similar benefits even if they shared a reservoir.

Some more nice things about 2 loops: you can run different color coolant in each loop if you want, and you could potentially have them run the fans at different speeds, ending up with a quieter machine. Also, you will get better flow with separate loops. Just a few thoughts.

I mostly did it because this hobby is all about being eXtr3m3! :rolleyes:

NaeKuh

07-02-2008, 07:50 PM

I know this works because I've tried it :shrug:\

Go out to EK and see how the cards flow, and you will quickly see why this works. Frankly after I thought about it, I was amazed that more people didn't do this. However it's always easy to see something after you understand it, just like you always find things in the last place you look :)

in all tests shown gpu1 or 2 is seriously a lot higher.

The cores are no where near evened out.

Ive tried it as well, and i personally like my gpu's to be within 1-3C of each other when i sli or xfire.

That looping is another example of bling over performance. Sad to say. :\
Simular to how people throw in random 90's cuz they look cool.

The simplist option would be to paralell the cards if your that anal about tubing layout, and it would solve your uneven core issue.

oh one more thing, the best way to test it is to load up your GPU's and watch GPU 1 or 2 SKY rocket, while the other stays almost FLAT.
That is the result i and many others got while twiddling with this setup.

Was a great waste of 4 hours. :P

dopestuff

07-02-2008, 11:00 PM

Sunayknits

07-03-2008, 04:49 PM

in all tests shown gpu1 or 2 is seriously a lot higher.

The cores are no where near evened out.

Ive tried it as well, and i personally like my gpu's to be within 1-3C of each other when i sli or xfire.

That looping is another example of bling over performance. Sad to say. :\
Simular to how people throw in random 90's cuz they look cool.

The simplist option would be to paralell the cards if your that anal about tubing layout, and it would solve your uneven core issue.

oh one more thing, the best way to test it is to load up your GPU's and watch GPU 1 or 2 SKY rocket, while the other stays almost FLAT.
That is the result i and many others got while twiddling with this setup.

Was a great waste of 4 hours. :P

a) I really don't understand your post
b) If you're talking about dual loops vs. single loops then it still doesn't make sense
c) When my machine is pulling 500 watts from the wall, with both GPUs going flat-out for many many hours, both cards are still within 1 degree
d) This IS a parallel layout

Forgive me if I misunderstood, but it's not clear what you're talking about.

Sunayknits

07-03-2008, 04:52 PM

wow great build!

and i have a question for you (cause you have a mozart tx to, mine arived yesterday :P: ) i have read the manual but the pictures in there are soo bad and i can't find what i was wondering on the internet to..
so the question is: where exactly doesn the mylar tape supposed to go??

greatings, dope

Hey Dope, thanks man!

The mylar tape goes over the raised cutouts underneath the motherboard. I think there are 2. They could potentially touch the mobo and short it out. These mounts are designed for the BX standard IIRC, which is pretty scarce anyhow, so I just removed them with a cutoff wheel since I never plan to use them.

NaeKuh

07-03-2008, 05:54 PM

a) I really don't understand your post
b) If you're talking about dual loops vs. single loops then it still doesn't make sense
c) When my machine is pulling 500 watts from the wall, with both GPUs going flat-out for many many hours, both cards are still within 1 degree
d) This IS a parallel layout

Forgive me if I misunderstood, but it's not clear what you're talking about.

okey im sorry. Lemme see if i can simplify myself.

I am only talking about your gpu loop.

You said you had the first card setup as inlet outlet, and connected to the second card.

Basically the water is going in a U. The first card will heat up while the second card will stay still.

You said it was okey to config it like this. I am saying its not, because you'll have a very big delta between card 1 and card 2.

DB also warned you about this type of config, and you still said it was okey.

I am mearly double verifying what DB said. I have tried that config, and as i said card 1 and card 2 has too much of a temperature delta.

2. Can you show a pic of this. Cuz i never could get 1C within the cards. AS i said I noticed it being more then 10-15C varianace.
A program like ATI Tool or RTHDRIBL is great to load up your gpus

3. No a true paralell would have = flow to both cards. So inlet would be on both card 1 and 2 using a Y and exit via card 1 and 2 on outlet via Y.

Once again here is DB saying IT WONT WORK.
And i am saying ive tested this, and IT DOESNT WORK.

That is a total pass through. A guy at the last Intel LAN I went to had a boutique rig (not sure which one but a skull is their logo) in which they had a dual card DD loop in which the flow went down from card one to card two by passing card one as in this loop but instead of exiting the second card like this loop it returned the flow back up to the first card via the other barb and then exited the card loop via the right top barb . . .it would operate at stock but if you oc'd it even a hair all hell would break loose . . .

If you have pictures of it working. I would definitely like to see them. Im not calling shins, if you have a working setup, i would like to see how you pulled it off.

The closest i got to it was using a 3/8th id tubing instead of 1/2id tubing for the bridge on gpu1 and gpu2.

Adding restriction to the bottom cards will allow more water to flow to the top card. This might work, but i still wasnt happy with the temp deltas.

My last attempt although very painful, was to use some form of reducers to mirror the flow. Another failed attempted. :X

Sunay please dont get me wrong, i am really curious on how you pulled it off. I would love to tube like that, but my OCD wont allow my gpu's to be like that unless i can = the temps.

Gunners

07-04-2008, 04:03 AM

I like your Mozart TX Dual Loop

This my MoZart
http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb114/Gunner_FD/MoZartTX/Build/b25r.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb114/Gunner_FD/MoZartTX/Radiator/R14r.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb114/Gunner_FD/MoZartTX/Build/b19r.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb114/Gunner_FD/MoZartTX/Final/t4r.jpg

wait 4 upgrade 2 Dual Loop

IanY

07-04-2008, 05:40 AM

Sunyakits,

Listen to Naekuh. You are just recirculating the heated up liquid between gpu1 and gpu 2. With a large temp delta between gpu1 and gpu2, you are prone to video crashes.

While you are at it, you are killing the head pressure, which is really ultimately what's important to cool your video cards. That parallel setup you have there does not work as well, and you are wasting the entire water cooling effort. If you really want a parallel setup, get two pumps and two radiators, with Y junctions coming off the reservoir.

You appear to be driven by looks rather than performance. Who cares about how it performs as long as it looks coll, right? The whole forum is headed that direction as well.

Number Three here. IT DOESN'T WORK

CoNMaN

07-04-2008, 08:15 AM

Any updates?

Sunayknits

07-05-2008, 10:41 AM

okey im sorry. Lemme see if i can simplify myself.
You said you had the first card setup as inlet outlet, and connected to the second card.
I said no such thing.

2. Can you show a pic of this. Cuz i never could get 1C within the cards. AS i said I noticed it being more then 10-15C varianace. A program like ATI Tool or RTHDRIBL is great to load up your gpus Once again here is DB saying IT WONT WORK. And i am saying ive tested this, and IT DOESNT WORK.
You're looking at a picture right in this post. I don't see what further evidence I could provide, aside from some screenshots showing temperatures which I could not prove came from my machine. DB knows what he's doing and he did not say this setup doesn't work. He said a similar setup that he had seen did not work, which is something entirely different.

Sunay please dont get me wrong, i am really curious on how you pulled it off. I would love to tube like that, but my OCD wont allow my gpu's to be like that unless i can = the temps.
I appreciate that, but it seems to me like you're just being argumentative. I have told you several times that I am using this setup right now, and that it works exactly as I have described. I have absolutely nothing to gain from lying. If you can't believe me, there is nothing I can do about that. If you tried this setup exactly as I have it outlined here, then you would have been successful and had similar results.

Sunayknits

07-05-2008, 10:43 AM

Sunyakits,

You appear to be driven by looks rather than performance. Who cares about how it performs as long as it looks coll, right? The whole forum is headed that direction as well.

Number Three here. IT DOESN'T WORK

There is no need to be insulting.

I will not discuss this further. Either you believe that it works, or not. :rolleyes:

Sunayknits

07-05-2008, 10:50 AM

Any updates?

Indeed. I need to finish this damn thing up :ROTF:

Here is something I've been working on, it's going to be a fan filter for the radiator assembly.

I used the software from www.emachineshop.com to design it, but I'll be damned if I'm gonna pay over $200 for a single sheet of acrylic. I found another place that does custom laser cutting, www.customlasercutting.com and their prices are very reasonable.

Once I get this finished up I'll move on to the i-Ram bracket, but I'mma need to buy a micrometer and do a lot of measuring before then :p:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/4x4fanfilter001.jpg

Sunayknits

07-05-2008, 10:58 AM

I like your Mozart TX Dual Loop
This my MoZart
wait 4 upgrade 2 Dual Loop

Thanks man! Yours is looking good too!

I was wondering if that Magicool Extreme 4x120 rad would work in this case. Does it line up without modification?

Also I like the VFD MediaThingyJob you've installed. I thought about buying that for mine but I read some unfavorable reviews ... how do you like it? :shrug:

Sunayknits

07-13-2008, 01:45 PM

I wanted to make a custom fan guard/filter that I could install as a single piece inside the case in front of my radiator assembly. I started digging around and came up with www.emachineshop.com. They have this free CAD software that's pretty easy to use, and provide a service to create whatever you build using their online machine shop.

Their software is easy to use, but other than that it's straight-up dogpoop. Crashes all the time, really slow, I could go on ... but ultimately it got the job done.

I then found www.customlasercutting.com, who offered much more reasonable prices for custom laser-cut plastics. I decided to go ahead and use them so I sent them a .dxf file of my design and they responded very quickly over email. I asked for a quote last Sunday, and I had the part in less than a week. Now that is some good service!

I ordered 2 of these for $149, including shipping. I got an extra just in case I broke one, but it turns out that the parts are extremely strong and I now realize that was totally unnecessary. Live and learn I guess ...

Anybody need a 4x4 fan guard? $40 shipped!

Have a look:

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/4x4fanguard_001.jpg
Here is the design in their crappy CAD program

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/4x4fanguard_002.jpg
Here is what I received from customlasercutting.com

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/4x4fanguard_003.jpg
A close-up of the cuts. Here you can see the kerf width is super small

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/4x4fanguard_004.jpg
Everything just falls right out after you remove the tape

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/4x4fanguard_005.jpg
Sheets of acrylic are extruded between rollers using a tape-like film, so you have to remove that as well

http://www.brimbo.com/temp/mozartbuild/4x4fanguard_006.jpg
Everything came out perfect!

More soon ...