Recomend me a new hdd setup (no Raptors!)

[skuliaxe]

Here's what I have now:
1x 74Gb Raptor (OS/Apps/Games)
2x 320Gb Seagate 7200.9 for storage

My issues with that setup:
1) According to HDTune, the Raptor is not performing any better than the the 7200.9 drives !! (see attachment)
2) The Raptor is so loud! I'm all for Cool & quiet

What I was thinking:
[You recomend me a FAST setup] - nothing to pricy though.
I was thinking about 2x 320Gb 7200.10 in RAID-0...
And a 500Gb 7200.10 for storage.


P.s.: All my hard drives are now with a Zalman ZM-2HC1 to keep them quiet and cooler. I do not want to hear "Get a Raptor Raid-0 and put them in asilencer unit..." UNLESS somebody can find me a silencer that is better than the Zalman (ie. more silent, but same cooling effect).

[zanzabar]

i like the samsung sata drives i have 2 500gb and i score 75-80 on hd tune for average and im on a promise fast trak 2k sata 150 controller

[Kobalt]

A budget would really really help!

[Rattle]

http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16822148262

these are nice, single platter, quiet

grabbed 40gb off each for intel matrix raid 0 for OS

[Soulburner]

Seagate 7200.10 and Samsung HD501LJ are both solid buys. Also the new WD 750gb drive really flies, if you need that much space.

[skuliaxe]

http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16822148262

these are nice, single platter, quiet

grabbed 40gb off each for intel matrix raid 0 for OS

I would like to compare my drives to your HD Track results. But I can't seem to find that applications. Could you link me?

Those numbers are very impressing. And a Intel Matrix Raid is a great solution as there would have been a lot of wasted space with 250-320Gb in raid-0

I did find this Seagate 250Gb (ST3250620AS) here (http://start.is/product_info.php?products_id=1750) or here (http://www.computer.is/vorur/4971). Do you think these are the same as your ST3250410AS, just a newer model maybe?

Last but not least, I have two of these right now ST3320620AS (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148140&Tpk=st3320620as)(2yr old drives), would you still recommend the 250Gb drive? Because of ONE platter?

[tiro_uspsss]

Here's what I have now:
1x 74Gb Raptor (OS/Apps/Games)
2x 320Gb Seagate 7200.9 for storage

My issues with that setup:
1) According to HDTune, the Raptor is not performing any better than the the 7200.9 drives !! (see attachment)
2) The Raptor is so loud! I'm all for Cool & quiet

What I was thinking:
[You recomend me a FAST setup] - nothing to pricy though.
I was thinking about 2x 320Gb 7200.10 in RAID-0...
And a 500Gb 7200.10 for storage.


P.s.: All my hard drives are now with a Zalman ZM-2HC1 to keep them quiet and cooler. I do not want to hear "Get a Raptor Raid-0 and put them in asilencer unit..." UNLESS somebody can find me a silencer that is better than the Zalman (ie. more silent, but same cooling effect).

wow. *imho* something is a lil amiss, no offence. lemme explain:

ur 7200.9 average MB/s: 62
anandtechs average MB/s for 500GB 7200.9: 52 (HDTach tho)

ur 7200.9 burst MB/s: 105
anandtechs average MB/s for 500GB 7200.9: 250

link: http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=2577&p=8

this is cause its a SATA2 HDD - i dont know if burst rates are affected by the spec of the mobo SATA port.. *if* they are, the only thing i can think of is that u have ur 7200.9 plugged into a SATA1 port... ?

ok, moving on..

the 74 GD Raptor (while still good, its not as fast as the lastest incarnation, the ADFD. There are some figures from various review sites (unfortuneately none are HDTune..

@ Storagereview, max MB/s in WB99 is: 72
same review, min MB/s is: 54 ( *significantly higher than ur 22MB/s :confused: :shrug:
link: http://www.storagereview.com/WD740GD.sr?page=0%2C1

@ anandtech, they tested the 36GB GD (dunno which benchmark they used), results:

min MB/s: 45
max MB/s: 63
link: http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=1799&p=5
dont forget, thats the smaller 36GB, the 74GB is faster..

now on to cooling matters... *IF* irc, the Zalman thingy wasnt *that* crash hot (no pun :D)... if i were to try a HDD cooler, it would be this one:

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=211&products_id=20376

so, imho, something is not right with ur figures, something u may wanna look into.
bottom line is:
ur Raptor min MB/s is obscenely low
ur Raptor max MB/s is not too shabby
ur Raptor ave is on target (according to my friends memory, he also has a GD)

as for the figures of ur 7200.9:
ur burst is obscenely low
dunno about the min & ave MB/s
re: the max MB/s - the first mentioned anandtech article, they only got ~65MB/s.. so ur 73MB/s is incredible, yet mysterious!

if ur raptor(s) (?) r 2 noisy for u, u can either try the aforementioned cooler, or... well I guess a RAID-0 might help u... in which case go for 7200.10.

[tiro_uspsss]

I would like to compare my drives to your HD Track results. But I can't seem to find that applications. Could you link me?

Those numbers are very impressing. And a Intel Matrix Raid is a great solution as there would have been a lot of wasted space with 250-320Gb in raid-0

I did find this Seagate 250Gb (ST3250620AS) here (http://start.is/product_info.php?products_id=1750) or here (http://www.computer.is/vorur/4971). Do you think these are the same as your ST3250410AS, just a newer model maybe?

Last but not least, I have two of these right now ST3320620AS (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148140&Tpk=st3320620as)(2yr old drives), would you still recommend the 250Gb drive? Because of ONE platter?

HDTach: http://www.simplisoftware.com/Public/index.php?request=HdTach

WB99 (WinBench 99): http://www.softlookup.com/display.asp?id=9140

[tiro_uspsss]

corrections:

the Logisys solution, while probably quieter, actually increases hdd temps - oops :D

& so does the Zalman according to this review (vs normal mounting & a fan) :

http://www.bytesizedreviews.com/index.php?action=reviews&rev_id=178&page=4

not sure what u wanna do, ur call!

[Intern]

How about the new models from Seagate? 7200.11 with 105MB/s

[Soulburner]

The big drives are going to be able to match the Raptors in average read and write speeds due to high platter density. However in seek times there is no way they can keep up. Invest all they want in 7200rpm drives but there is nothing they can do to improve their seek times.

If they had a 300gb Raptor it would destroy everything currently available.

HDTune 2.54 on my 320gb Seagate on the left, 150gb Raptor on the right for comparison:
6480164799

Both drives are 50% full.

Is your Raptor really full, or fragmented?

[Polizei]

http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16822148262

these are nice, single platter, quiet

grabbed 40gb off each for intel matrix raid 0 for OS

How do you do something like that, taking 40GB from each disk? I have 2x 80GB in RAID 0 for Windows/Programs and I cant get any speeds close to those. I know it has something to do with how close the parition is to the outer edge of the disk, but other than that, I dont know what to do.

[Rattle]

when I go into intel matrix raid setp thru ctrl-I you set your size there.
it will take the outermost by default. set that as your first raid, then set the remaining part of your drives to the rest of the space... I used 128k also

thats all nothing special.

[Polizei]

Well, I just have both disks set to the single array... 2x80GB for 149GB formatted.

Would my bench speeds increase if I had a say, 40GB partition for OS/Programs and the rest of the disks for storage or something?

[Rattle]

yes

[Polizei]

Oh. Would boot up times decrease as well? I already notice a difference with loading games like Stalker or BF2 compared to other computers with similar or better specs without RAID, but would it get any better?

Sorry about the thread-jack OP, you can just PM me rattle.

[nn_step]

Normally people think Lower Access time means better performance

[Rattle]

The big drives are going to be able to match the Raptors in average read and write speeds due to high platter density. However in seek times there is no way they can keep up. Invest all they want in 7200rpm drives but there is nothing they can do to improve their seek times.

If they had a 300gb Raptor it would destroy everything currently available.

HDTune 2.54 on my 320gb Seagate on the left, 150gb Raptor on the right for comparison:
6480164799

Both drives are 50% full.

Is your Raptor really full, or fragmented?

ORLY so $150 to the house for a raptor 150 if your lucky is better than this for $140 to the house, I dont think the minimal difference in access time will be felt by humans

[Polizei]

I thought RAID 0 got around that somewhat by having one drive read while another "seeked" and accessed?

[Soulburner]

$140 for what?

[Polizei]

2x 250GB Seagate 7200.10's I would think.

[Rattle]

$140 for what?

2x 250gb single platter perps

[Soulburner]

I don't put much faith into that benchmark to show me if they are really that much faster. 2500mb/s burst? Get real. I bet if you loaded up BF2 and a map, that you wouldn't get in any faster than me. :)

[Rattle]

the burst rate is more bandwidth off the SB of the mobo than anything.
your right there wont be much difference, I have had pretty much every HD setup known to man and a 150 raptor is sweet as is a 74 16mb cache, but if you want performance and space I wouldnt go for a raptor.

[Polizei]

I don't put much faith into that benchmark to show me if they are really that much faster. 2500mb/s burst? Get real. I bet if you loaded up BF2 and a map, that you wouldn't get in any faster than me. :)

My rig currently:
E6600 @ 3.2
2GB DD2-675 @ 713MHz
2x 80GB WD SATAII RAID 0

Roommate's rig
E6850
2GB DD2-800
1x 250GB Seagate 7200.10

I can load a BF2 map a good 5-7 seconds faster than he can.

[skuliaxe]

Great speeds Rattle, thanks for the HDTune bench (I won't need to get HD Track now to compare to your first post :))
I'm fragmenting my Raptor right now and I'm going to run the HDTune again (I might have had some torrents running the last time).

If I'm still far from your speeds, I'm probably going for the same as your Seagate disks... That is some BURST speed :)
Soulburner, almost missed your question. My Raptor is only 25% full and now just fragmented.

P.s.: Haha... no wonder I din't find HD Tack, with my dyslexia and all I always read HD Track

**EDIT**
Here are the new HDTune results for my single Raptor (after fragmentation). A little better, but not much. I've almost desided now to switch to 2x250Gb Seagates in Intel Matrix Raid (128k).
Thanks Rattle for helping me get a huge step closer on making my mind on this :)

Your 2x250Gb Seagates deliver 3x the speed and are only a mere 2ms slower in Access Time !

One last question...
I read that my Asus P5B-Deluxe supports Intel Matrix Raid solutions, is it a lot of hassle to install on a new format?

[Soulburner]

My rig currently:
E6600 @ 3.2
2GB DD2-675 @ 713MHz
2x 80GB WD SATAII RAID 0

Roommate's rig
E6850
2GB DD2-800
1x 250GB Seagate 7200.10

I can load a BF2 map a good 5-7 seconds faster than he can.
That isn't the same comparison though. I was talking about the Raptor vs 2 7200rpm drives in RAID0.

Also graphical settings have a big effect, the more textures and effects there are to load the longer it will take.

[Polizei]

Oh, I thought you were just arguing single drive vs RAID, not Raptor vs 7200.10 RAID.

We both have everything maxxed at 1280x1024, 4xAA.

[Soulburner]

That's interesting because Anandtech has never found any gain in level loading times from using RAID0...

[ChaosMinionX]

Raptors emphasize access speed... look at difference in access latency and seek times.... drive performance comes about equal with new 7200's but their seek tiem and latency dont match the raptors.

[Jodiuh]

...and they can be tamed. :D (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2412306&postcount=1254)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/jodiuh/HDD/0831071721.jpg

Here's 2 74GB ADFD 16MB cache drives w/ 35GB pulled for the OS. Yes, they're not any faster, maybe even slower than the Seagate single platter's Rattle's got...but they do go a long way to make thing snappy for day 2 day operation! :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/jodiuh/HDD/intel.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/jodiuh/HDD/hdtune.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/jodiuh/HDD/hdtach.jpg

[tiro_uspsss]

The big drives are going to be able to match the Raptors in average read and write speeds due to high platter density. However in seek times there is no way they can keep up. Invest all they want in 7200rpm drives but there is nothing they can do to improve their seek times.

If they had a 300gb Raptor it would destroy everything currently available.

HDTune 2.54 on my 320gb Seagate on the left, 150gb Raptor on the right for comparison:
6480164799

Both drives are 50% full.

Is your Raptor really full, or fragmented?

dude... that min on the Raptor is... dunno if i can swallow that :D - y is it so low?!

as for platter density; mm.. i thought the 7200.9 *wasnt* perp. recording tech (?) - i thought the 7200.10 was the only seagate stuff with it... ?

[LagunaX]

My rig currently:
E6600 @ 3.2
2GB DD2-675 @ 713MHz
2x 80GB WD SATAII RAID 0

Roommate's rig
E6850
2GB DD2-800
1x 250GB Seagate 7200.10

I can load a BF2 map a good 5-7 seconds faster than he can.

I am a raid noob.

Bottom line, which is faster load/seek then, 2 x 7200rpm in raid 0 or a single raptor?

Thanks.

[tiro_uspsss]

I am a raid noob.

Bottom line, which is faster load/seek then, 2 7200rpm in raid 0 or a single raptor?

Thanks.

access time: Raptor
outright MB/s: 7.2K rpm R0

[Soulburner]

dude... that min on the Raptor is... dunno if i can swallow that :D - y is it so low?!

as for platter density; mm.. i thought the 7200.9 *wasnt* perp. recording tech (?) - i thought the 7200.10 was the only seagate stuff with it... ?
It started low. That's the spot at the very beginning.

And yeah the 7200.10 was the first to have perpendicular recording.