Disaponted over themochill

[Hellemyr]

Hello

So i bought the best radiator out there, and paied the duble of that other radiator costs, and what do i get. A radiator ofc, 8 usless wierd iperial screws, a gasket that was too small, a sticker, and a note that said that the screws are too long. And all the holes on the radiator isent threaded.

This means that you are almoust certain to make some modifications to your case, and a trip to the hardware store, to get tools and screws.

Why do they have to make it so hard, why arent there longers metric screws, why arent the holes in the radiaotr threaded.

The Bigwater set that i had before had like 2 bags of screws, and all the holes was threaded.

[MrToad]

8 usless wierd iperial screws[...]And all the holes on the radiator isent threaded[....]why arent the holes in the radiaotr threaded

There you go. They are not useless because they are self-tapping, and the holes in the radiator are not threaded because it's designed for self-tapping screws.

I also found metric screws more suited for my particular application, so I tapped them myself. TC leaves that choice open to the customer while still provides a suitable way of fastening straight out of the box.


a gasket that was too small

Could you please elaborate that? The gaskets (at least the ones I've got) are made of neoprene, and they stretch perfectly to the size they should.



and a note that said that the screws are too long.

Could that be a note of warning over using screws that are too long, because they could pierce the radiator?


This means that you are almoust certain to make some modifications to your case, and a trip to the hardware store, to get tools and screws.

Welcome to the custom water cooling world. Believe me, this won't be your last trip to the hardware store. In fact soon you will receive invites to the hardware store owner's children parties.


The Bigwater set that i had before had like 2 bags of screws, and all the holes was threaded.

So, you got yourself a crap water cooling kit with a lot of screws. Big deal.

If you don't want the ubiquitous-hardware-store-owner in your list of acquitances buy a swifty kit. The holes are threaded, their performance is a million light years away of anything TT has ever produced, and they come with more screws you've ever dreamt of too! :D :D :D

[Hellemyr]

There you go. They are not useless because they are self-tapping, and the holes in the radiator are not threaded because it's designed for self-tapping screws.

Yeah, they are selvetapped, means that you cant screw them through the case and mount the radiato that way. And since the radiator is mean for self tapped screws, you cant use normal metric screws, unless you thread the holes in the radiator.



I also found metric screws more suited for my particular application, so I tapped them myself. TC leaves that choice open to the customer while still provides a suitable way of fastening straight out of the box.


fasting the radiator straight out of the box, i needed to make some modifications on both my cases if i wanted to do that.



Could you please elaborate that? The gaskets (at least the ones I've got) are made of neoprene, and they stretch perfectly to the size they should.


The gasket was too small, and yeah you can strech it, but mine snapped, and i needed to trip away alot of the gasket so that it woudent hit the fan blade.



Could that be a note of warning over using screws that are too long, because they could pierce the radiator?


Yeah, its a warning that the screws provides can punchure the radiator, why do they use screws that can puncture the radiator?



Welcome to the custom water cooling world. Believe me, this won't be your last trip to the hardware store. In fact soon you will receive invites to the hardware store owner's children parties.


Ofc you are almoust certain to make some trips to the harware stor when you are watercooling, and want it to look nice, but i just think that the thermochill makes it more tricky than needed.

And i have moust of the tools i need at home or at school, so personaly i dont need to take so many trips to the hardware store.



So, you got yourself a crap water cooling kit with a lot of screws. Big deal.




If you don't want the ubiquitous-hardware-store-owner in your list of acquitances buy a swifty kit. The holes are threaded, their performance is a million light years away of anything TT has ever produced, and they come with more screws you've ever dreamt of too! :D :D :D

Just saying, it isent a bad thing when someone brovide extra screws. and threaded holes.

[weihk]

ermmmmm..........

i always thought different company does things differently no?

just like cars....no?

if everyone makes a 'item' exactly the same as others, wouldnt that be a bit boring?

besides......its known for PA's rads to be bigger.....did you not check their size before you bought it?

[MrToad]

Yeah, they are selvetapped, means that you cant screw them through the case and mount the radiato that way. And since the radiator is mean for self tapped screws, you cant use normal metric screws, unless you thread the holes in the radiator.

As TC ships the radiator "as is", and not as part of some sort of kit, they only provide means to fasten the fans to the rad. How you mount it on your computer is a bit of a "get a life" situation.


fasting the radiator straight out of the box, i needed to make some modifications on both my cases if i wanted to do that.

"Out of the box" is an expression. It roughly means "without additional requirements", not "outside your computer enclosure".

This holds true for TC rads. As far as TC is concerned the rad includes all what you need to attach the minimum required fans with appropriate seal "out of the box". Which fittings you prefer, and how and where you place it is left entirely at your discretion.


The gasket was too small, and yeah you can strech it, but mine snapped, and i needed to trip away alot of the gasket so that it woudent hit the fan blade.

No comment on this. More and more I'm led to think that the more "extras" you provide, the more problems you create ^^


Yeah, its a warning that the screws provides can punchure the radiator, why do they use screws that can puncture the radiator?

They don't. The screws are perfectly suited for the task. Is the end user the one that will find a way to use them in such manner that they will puncture the rad. Then immediately blame TC for it. Call it a "disclaimer" if you wish.


Ofc you are almoust certain to make some trips to the harware stor when you are watercooling, and want it to look nice, but i just think that the thermochill makes it more tricky than needed.

It's your personal opinion, which you are entitled to. I personally love choice. It leaves plenty of room for investigation, and hopefully an opportunity to learn something in the process :)


And i have moust of the tools i need at home or at school, so personaly i dont need to take so many trips to the hardware store.

Might be a good reason to go back to Uni. In the engineering school they have a fantastic laboratory with laser, CNC and abrasive waterjet facilities. Hmmm... the idea of getting a second engineering looks more and more appealing :D


Just saying, it isent a bad thing when someone brovide extra screws. and threaded holes.

Different approaches to the same issue, that's all :)

[LinusTech]

Personally I think whichever radiator manufacturer steps up and provides all of the appropriate mounting hardware for their rad (30mm, ~43mm, and 5mm) to mount whatever you want to it would get a LOT of respect for caring about making water cooling easier for the consumer.

Look at Swiftech's example. Right now they are the market leader in this regard in my opinion. They provide retail clamshell packaging on their mainstream product with colourful instruction manuals, and the most idiot-proof mounting systems around.

And yet custom water cooling will never hit the mainstream because HW Labs and Thermochill will never get on board. Swiftech seems to have a little bit more figured out than the rest, but I'd still like to see a variety of labelled screws inside a radiator box. "this baggie is for a 38mm fan with a fan grill", etc.

Earth to Thermochill: 98% of your customers do NOT have a tap & die...

[Hellemyr]

ermmmmm..........

i always thought different company does things differently no?

just like cars....no?

if everyone makes a 'item' exactly the same as others, wouldnt that be a bit boring?

besides......its known for PA's rads to be bigger.....did you not check their size before you bought it?

What the hell are you talking about? im not saying that themochill shud make they radiaroe just the same as a swifctec for an example, im saying they shud thread the holes to metric threads and provide maybe a extra set of screws. And yeah, i know the rad is bigger, but thats not my problem.

And MrToad, im shure we coud argue about the all day, im just saying that its a bit trickyer than needed to mount the themochill. :)

[Waterlogged]

Look at Swiftech's example. Right now they are the market leader in this regard in my opinion. They provide retail clamshell packaging on their mainstream product with colourful instruction manuals, and the most idiot-proof mounting systems around.

I think Linus has hit the nail on the head, every other manufacturer (this includes HW labs, GT series is tapped) has dumbed down their product line so even the least intelligent idiot could use their product except Thermochill. This is because most ppl in general, are dumb. Only the smart ppl know what the best rads to use are. Do we really want every idiot in the world to know about TC's? Just think how hard they'd be to come by then. ;)

*Puts on flak jacket*

[MrToad]

And MrToad, im shure we coud argue about the all day :)

You can put your money on that any day of the week and twice on Sundays ^^

"Argumentative" is my second surname. (My first one is Anally-Retentive, just in case you were wondering.)

[CyberDruid]

You can put your money on that any day of the week and twice on Sundays ^^

"Argumentative" is my second surname. (My first one is Anally-Retentive, just in case you were wondering.)

Feel free to use me as a reference to that effect MrToad:yepp:

RE TC rads...well they are primarily marketted to those already familiar with how-to...they are not kits...they are not entry level.

They are the best around IMO so I am willing to overlook the several "flaws" like crap poly fittings instead of proper BSPP:rolleyes: fittings, terrible paint job and warpy shape (especially the PA160...out of 5 not one is "square" or in plane) and lack of "colorful instruction manuals:rofl:

If you buy a TC you are assumed to be a [H]ardcore LC nutcase anyway so no sympathy there...

IMO TC should not ship any screws or gaskets at all...just putting holes in the shroud is plenty...RE the gasket...I would not use that gasket on anything...I have a baggy of TC gasket material in the shop...there are far neater ways to acheive the same result.

[Waterlogged]

I'm guessing you tried using solid YL's if the screws were too short?

Full disclosure of all parts involved would be nice.

CyberDruid, please place blame of crappy fittings where it properly belongs...with Danger Den. TC does not ship fittings with their rads, they are added by the North American Distributor.

[AndyM]

...RE the gasket...I would not use that gasket on anything...I have a baggy of TC gasket material in the shop...there are far neater ways to acheive the same result.


+1 on that. And all you need to do is get a $2.00 box of black 1.25" screws...and tapping the hole? In sheetmetal? Self-tappers rock!

[MrToad]

and tapping the hole? In sheetmetal? Self-tappers rock!

They do.

However, I didn't find button head black Torx self-tapping screws, and I think that button head black Torx is the next sexiest thing to Angelina Jolie into her thirties, so I ended up tapping the rad and using bolts instead....

[The[R]eaper]

sorry for this noob comment... so with the TC rads screw holes come without threads? you can use any self-tapping screw that fits your fancy? if that is true that is awesome. glad i came across this thread

[Jedda]

eaper;2391899']sorry for this noob comment... so with the TC rads screw holes come without threads? you can use any self-tapping screw that fits your fancy? if that is true that is awesome. glad i came across this thread

Exactly, or you can drill and tap the holes to suit any thread that happens to be the rage in your part of the world. Not everyone lives under the DD thumb.

[arfett]

I would very much like for everyone to know and use ThermoChill as it might lower pricess and they would be forced to increase production so the supply issue would be moot.

[Martinm210]

It came with screws and labels?

If I remember right my MCR320's didn't come with anything...nada...not even the 3/8"NPT barbs that you need to make it flow water let alone mount it or mount fans to it...

In the end...I was glad I didn't pay for a bunch of stuff I'd have to put into my parts bin..:D

[sergers]

I would rather get no screws than screws I dont need.

how hard is it to goto a hardware store and purchase the correct length self-tapping screw? this is not holding the industry back, it holds morons back...

thermochill makes radiators, some that fit in PCs... what you get is a radiator. sure it would be nice to get everything, but It is upto the distributor/retailer to provide necessary mounting hardware for the application they are selling it for.

swiftech makes cooling components for pcs... what you get is the neccesary mounting hardware in retail packaging.

[jimmyz]

just a tip to keep from damaging rad when drilling or installing the screws or while tapping threads, is to use a spoon to slide under the lip you are working on. then slide a credit card under the spoon to ditribute any pressure evenly. shallow spoons work the best.

[Jedda]

The piece you've cut out from the case to fit the rad makes a great core protector when drilling or tapping.
If you've cut a round one just roll it along. lol

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/sulk/Radthreadingholedrillres.png

[AndyM]

They do.

However, I didn't find button head black Torx self-tapping screws, and I think that button head black Torx is the next sexiest thing to Angelina Jolie into her thirties, so I ended up tapping the rad and using bolts instead....

Haha, I see you ran into the same dillemma I had. I wanted button head Allen-key style screws all around in my machine, but none available in self-tapping format from my favorite industrial supply house.

[Sparky]

Hey I wouldn't complain much about the gasket, most others don't even provide one so at least you got a gasket :p:

[Anemone]

Fact is, that the TC comes off as a premium product. And the OP is a bit unhappy that "premium" doesn't mean what he thought it would. I happen to agree that the paint is kinda sad for so expensive a product but I do know that enthusiasts overlook many things on their way to the "best performance" arena.

The second thing I agree with is that Swiftech is getting it right. It's no longer optional to make things easier for the end user. You've already sold product to all the folks who were willing to make up for things that didn't fit, or didn't work, or required tapping, drilling and cutting. Now, in today's world, you are going to have to do better, to make it easier and sexier (remember that a nice electrostatic job goes a long way) than before. Swiftech knows this and they are leading the pack really. I'm not saying they are perfect, but merely that they are addressing a new market and a new need that others are missing.

So no, TC's aren't "bad", but they could use some polishing to be ready for today's and tomorrow's markets.

$.02

[teyber]

However what the OP is complaining about is trivial, when your paying... idk how much they are now, 140$?, id be complaining if they didn't wipe my arse for me and cook me some breakfast too. I mean you could almost buy 3 mcr-320's...
just my opinion

[CyberDruid]

Good Old Waterlogged...I been missing you. Not. Yes yes TC ships the rad With NO fittings...they are then remerchandised and crap poly fittings are added.

But to set the record straight I am not BLAMING TC...they are just making the rad...

In case you didn't know, there's an opening for PITA club prez...I think IanY stepped down from that high office...

I actually don't mind the paint on the Thermochill rads--it is easy to remove with a rag and some acetone--which makes painting it a lot less tedious as you can get to bare metal in no time...

[YugenM]

I actually don't mind the paint on the Thermochill rads--it is easy to remove with a rag and some acetone--which makes painting it a lot less tedious as you can get to bare metal in no time...

Personally, I love the matte black finish of my PA120.2, being one not too keen on shiny stuff.

And when it comes to that, the only shiny things I like are German waterblocks :up:

[CyberDruid]

I like to color match the Rad to the theme color for the mod at hand...my latest is metallic candy blue...you wouldn't even recognize that rad...

[virtualrain]

I personally find the Thermochill rads to be crude in their packaging as well... certainly not befitting their price point in the market. The paint is terrible, the gaskets are too small, the screws are rediculous (don't even bother), the lack of threaded mounting holes, and even the choice of G3/8 threads really causes head-aches in a water cooling world which has pretty much standardized on G1/4.

Also, what's with the 1" hole spacing between fans? It makes the rads bigger than they need to be without any advantage I can think of.

However, as Marci has said numerous times here and on their own forums, Thermochill has no aspirations to have a main-stream mass-market product offering... so they don't need to modify the product since demand already far outstrips supply. There will always be enough hard-core cooling enthusiasts to keep Thermochill where they are.

Swiftech is and will continue to grow to serve the masses and the MCR product line is an awesome value. And I highly recommend them to all my friends.

Ultimately, though, for my flagship gaming rig, I chose Thermochill for the performance and tapped my own holes, painted my own rads, and sourced my own G3/8 to G1/4 adapters. I would have preferred to not have had to do all this, but I would probably do it again if I had to.

All just my humble opinion, of course.

-Chris.

[Waterlogged]

Good Old Waterlogged...I been missing you. Not. Yes yes TC ships the rad With NO fittings...they are then remerchandised and crap poly fittings are added.

But to set the record straight I am not BLAMING TC...they are just making the rad...

In case you didn't know, there's an opening for PITA club prez...I think IanY stepped down from that high office...

I actually don't mind the paint on the Thermochill rads--it is easy to remove with a rag and some acetone--which makes painting it a lot less tedious as you can get to bare metal in no time...

I've missed you too:ROTF: Just consider me the American version of MrToad.:D I could never hope to fill IanY's shoes, that's like trying to ask Mugsy Bogues to fill in for Shaquille O'Neal.

Hmm, let's revisit your post, shall we?;)


They are the best around IMO so I am willing to overlook the several "flaws" like crap poly fittings instead of proper BSPP:rolleyes: fittings, terrible paint job and warpy shape (especially the PA160...out of 5 not one is "square" or in plane) and lack of "colorful instruction manuals:rofl:

Sounds like a little bit of blame being tossed around to me.;) All is cool between us if you want it to be.:up:

[AndyM]

Yep, Thermochill doesnt have the polish of other radiators, but when looking for the biggest surface area with the least amount of fins to get the air flowing well (no 60mph winds blowing though most computers), Thermochill is the only game in town. Add the weakness of USD, no Chinese workers working for dirt cheap, and we see the final result. Would I be happier with a nicer paint job on my Thermochills? Sure I would, but then again, I really cant see the rad as it is buried in my computer anyway, and I think design triumps over a paintjob any day.

[welshtom]

This is why you buy a Chilled PC rad grill too ;)

I ship with long self tappers and short self tappers.
covers all bases.

Tom


http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/images/large/screwsradgrill.jpg

[Apollo4g]

Hey, whats the name of those bolt screws?
The ones on the far right with the silver nuts?

[sergers]

Hey, whats the name of those bolt screws?
The ones on the far right with the silver nuts?

chilledpc lists them as: 4 x Black M4 8mm socket cap screws

[buffbiff21]

You can buy a sheet of sandpaper and some spray on glossy paint for a few dollars.

You can get 100 black round-oval head 1-1/2" (or 1-1/4") #6-32 screws for $5. Why Thermochill doesn't include these boggles me..

Yes the gasket is useless and Thermochill are expensive, but I'd prefer low noise over low cost.

I think the better rant is: do most of us even "need" the extra performance that Thermochill offers? The MCR series offers almost the same cooling (albeit with more fanpower) at less than half the price.

[MrToad]

I think the better rant is: do most of us even "need" the extra performance that Thermochill offers? The MCR series offers almost the same cooling (albeit with more fanpower) at less than half the price.

Lower restriction and better performance with less noise, that's what you pay for.

Whether you need it or not is another option TC leaves open to the customer.

Is the same with everything really. Why do people buy a £300k car when, if you abide the laws and regulations, a £1k one takes you from point A to point B exactly the same?

We call the other £299k "added value" shall we? Where "added value" means whatever you want it to mean.

[gatti-man]

the pa120.3 does suck for accessories and the gasket is a useles joke. Its a great learning tool though. I was a kit water cooler and did my first hard core build. Two things i want is a fan power supply that i can plug into the wall and an external stand ala ps2 style. Hell i would pay $50 just for the stand! As it is now my pa120.3 sits on its side balanced out by the 6 Minebea 74cfm fans and shroud lol.

[Jedda]

I think the better rant is: do most of us even "need" the extra performance that Thermochill offers? The MCR series offers almost the same cooling (albeit with more fanpower) at less than half the price.

That only applies where you live with your exchange rate.
For many other readers here the TC costs less than a MCR. Just depends on the shipping to where ever, from where ever.

[Serpentarius]

i must admit thermochill has it fair share of disappointments.

1st time using thermochill always has its challenges, but it's not really that disappointing, but still .. imo it lacks the user friendliness. not to mention if bad luck at your side, and the shipment ends up with dents.

[DarthBeavis]

Personally I think whichever radiator manufacturer steps up and provides all of the appropriate mounting hardware for their rad (30mm, ~43mm, and 5mm) to mount whatever you want to it would get a LOT of respect for caring about making water cooling easier for the consumer.

Look at Swiftech's example. Right now they are the market leader in this regard in my opinion. They provide retail clamshell packaging on their mainstream product with colourful instruction manuals, and the most idiot-proof mounting systems around.

And yet custom water cooling will never hit the mainstream because HW Labs and Thermochill will never get on board. Swiftech seems to have a little bit more figured out than the rest, but I'd still like to see a variety of labelled screws inside a radiator box. "this baggie is for a 38mm fan with a fan grill", etc.

Earth to Thermochill: 98% of your customers do NOT have a tap & die...

I have a few watercooled rigs under my belt with Thermochill rads and have not have to use a tap . . .6/32 screw works for me . . .I would not want them to include them either as different installs require different lengths anyways . . .if you cannot figure it out you probably should not be watercooling because bigger issues are surely going to come your way.

[Section8]

I think Linus has hit the nail on the head, every other manufacturer (this includes HW labs, GT series is tapped) has dumbed down their product line so even the least intelligent idiot could use their product except Thermochill. This is because most ppl in general, are dumb. Only the smart ppl know what the best rads to use are. Do we really want every idiot in the world to know about TC's? Just think how hard they'd be to come by then. ;)

*Puts on flak jacket*

LOL... my thoughts exactly.

[IanY]

Oh come on. Its a Thermochill. Nothing's like it, not even Swiftech lol At the end of the day, doesn't the product just work beautifully?

And don't flatter yourselves.. putting together a PC doesn't require the intelligence of more than a dimwit.. lol :)