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View Full Version : Another OCZ GameXstream bites the big one...when will OCZ quit using FSP Epsilons?



C'DaleRider
06-15-2007, 05:53 AM
Kyle at {H} just did another review of an OCZ GameXstream power supply....this their newest 1010W unit. Not surprisingly, it too exhibited the significant and out of spec ripple problems that plague the Epsilon line of power supplies......not to mention the 2 units Kyle had refused to put out more than 850W no matter how the demand was spread across any and all rails.

The +3.3V and +5V rails were over spec on ripple at just 50% of rated output. The+12V also went way out of ATX spec on ripple, too. Of course, OCZ fudged the ATX spec by listing the ripple on the +12V rail as being "No Greater Than 140mV"......which is unfortunately well outside ATX spec of max ripple allowed (120mV).

So, when will OCZ finally dump FSP Epsilons as their OEM source for the GameXstream power supplies? Every legitimate test of any GameXstream....{H}, JonnyGuru among others, all note out-of-spec ripple on all the rails. And if you like your components, ripple can shorten their lives significantly. Ture, not in a few months, but a year or so down the line and the out-of-spec ripple can end the life of components prematurely.



"Overall the load testing portion of the GameXStream 1010w was disappointing. It seems that the GameXStream 1010w is pushing the DC output capacity of this unit beyond its limits when tested at our more relevant operating temperature of 45c. The units fan is certainly capable of cooling the unit as the highest exhaust temperature recorded was below 50c with a 45c input. This coupled with the units good efficiency make it unlikely that the unit was overheating and was rather simply pushed too far in labeling the DC output.


"...the GameXStream 1010w was like the other members of the Epsilon line by starting off active and being almost out of specifications at only 50% load. At 75% load the ripple/noise of the unit was out of specification on the 3.3v/5v rails. This does not bode well for a system as system memory is powered off of the 3.3v. It has additionally been reported by other reviewers that at high loads the 12v rails were out of specification as well and indeed the unit even advertises the fact that it does not meet the ATX12v allowance of 120mV instead it is specified as being 140mV. Since our unit was unable to complete Test #4 we can not completely verify the 12v figures, however it should be noted that the 12v1 was around 100mV at both Test #3 and the Torture Test. Typically noise/ripple increase with load and I would expect this trend to continue with the OCZ GameXStream 1010w."


"The OCZ GameXStream 1010w entered testing with decent build quality from a well known OEM, but from a product line that has had a reputation for not being their best to date. However, our previous experience with the lower wattage Epsilon based FSP BlueStorm II was very good so we were hopeful that the GameXStream would follow in its foot steps. Unfortunately, that was not to be as the unit had a number of failings. The first and most apparent was apparent right out of the box. The unit is labeled with 2 different 12v amperage ratings which were quickly followed by the unit being specified for more ripple/noise than what is allowed by the ATX12v specification. Yes, the unit does not comply with ATX12v spec by OCZ’s own admission. We recently saw this issue in our 450w-500w Battle Royal from a couple of less-than-reputable manufacturers, so finding this issue carrying over to a much better OEM and brand is extremely disappointing. This worry was then borne out during testing when the OCZ GameXStream exhibited more ripple/noise on the 3.3v/5v rails than is allowed by the ATX12v specification. Previously other reviewers have reported out of specification ripple/noise on the 12v rails with other OCZ/FSP Epsilon based units at high loads, however we were unable to verify these ourselves because neither unit we had in for testing would complete a 100% load test. As it stands today the OCZ GameXStream 1010w is not all it should or could be. If OCZ can get together with FSP and iron out the 12v amperage and ripple/noise ratings issue, the noise/ripple performance issue, and full power loading at relevant temperatures (not 25c)"

fhpchris
06-16-2007, 09:32 PM
No one is forcing you to buy one. I had a FSP 700w for some time, and it would power my QX6700/8800GTX SLI rig, but I didn't trust it in the end for numerous reasons.

I have a 850W Silverstone now, and I am much happier. A Silverstone 560ZF powers my rig on one VGA perfectly fine, and does not kill any budget.

Do not trust a wattage rating, get a PSU that is 100% proven to do what you need it to at the cost you need and just be happy. Unless you have a crazy rig, you might get by with one of the FSP GameXtremes just fine.

OCZ knows some people need more than what the FSP unit puts out, and that is why they took over PCP&C

F@TMAN
06-17-2007, 05:14 AM
I used to have a Powerstream 520W, but that died on me and OCZ RMA'd with a 600W GameXstream to replace...do these smaller-wattage units exhibit similar phenomenon?

uOpt
06-18-2007, 01:25 PM
Hmmm - "Another OCZ GameXstream bites the big one...when will OCZ quit using FSP Epsilons?"

So which one bit the dust? Seems to work inside published parameters just fine.

Did anyone ever have a GXS die or kill equipment?

I have several and they do fine. Don't understand me wrong, I'm not happy with out of spec ripple. But dying or killing they don't.

ChaosMinionX
06-18-2007, 05:52 PM
Ive used both a 700w and a 1010w GameXstream, rock solid PSUs if you ask me.

OpTioN
06-18-2007, 05:56 PM
^Yeah my 600W OCZ GameXstream works superb for me.

[Spectre]
06-19-2007, 07:50 AM
Did anyone ever have a GXS die or kill equipment?

I have several and they do fine. Don't understand me wrong, I'm not happy with out of spec ripple. But dying or killing they don't.

Do I count ;)

CedricFP
06-19-2007, 08:35 AM
Hmm, I am running an FSP 700 Epsilon and starting to get a bit worried.

I've got my vcore set in the bios at 1.425 yet in windows probe reads 1.4 on P5K-Deluxe.

Would that be a product of a sub par PSU, or incorrect voltage allocation ala mobo, or incorrect readings?

jonnyGURU
06-19-2007, 08:42 AM
You guys are running GXS's without issue, but your loads are probably around the neighborhood of 300 to 400W DC. You won't see the ripple and noise and you won't have one blow up because you're not pushing it. But if I'm going to spend my money on a 600W, 700w or 1010W, even if I'm only using half of it's capability, there's just a piece of mind that comes with knowing that I'm using something that can handle what it says it can handle.

And time hasn't told any stories yet. That platform has only been around for a couple years. We'll see if the majority of them last their warranty period.

Bigchrome
06-20-2007, 01:44 AM
I'm on my second FSP 700W, the first one exploded when I turned off the system (barely two moths old) And it took out my X1900 and DFI LP Expert. The replacement I'm using now is slowly killing my system but my parents won't let me order again so I'm stuck.

uOpt
06-20-2007, 11:00 AM
You guys are running GXS's without issue, but your loads are probably around the neighborhood of 300 to 400W DC. You won't see the ripple and noise and you won't have one blow up because you're not pushing it. But if I'm going to spend my money on a 600W, 700w or 1010W, even if I'm only using half of it's capability, there's just a piece of mind that comes with knowing that I'm using something that can handle what it says it can handle.


I have two 700W GSX, one in a system with H8QC8, 4x Opteron 875, 8 GB RAM, 3x IDE harddrive, SCSI cage with 10K rpm drive and a ton of fans (which a PCP&C 1 KW could not power up due to rail issues).

And the other with a SLI-DR, Opteron at 3.0 GHz 24/7, 7800GTX, 7 CD/DVD drives (no typo) and assorted external harddrives all on the same PSU.

In addition, when the ripple issue came up I emailed Supermicro support with the test results (the ripple) and asked them whether that is a threat to the H8QC8. They said it's not, the power management on the board kills much more ripple than that (meaning Jonnyguru's results). It's only an issue if the power management on the board is barely obeying the ATX spec. Obviously, both the Supermicro and the DFI have better power management.

uOpt
06-20-2007, 11:01 AM
I'm on my second FSP 700W, the first one exploded when I turned off the system (barely two moths old) And it took out my X1900 and DFI LP Expert. The replacement I'm using now is slowly killing my system but my parents won't let me order again so I'm stuck.

What does "slowly killing" mean, exactly?

jonnyGURU
06-20-2007, 11:16 AM
I have two 700W GSX, one in a system with H8QC8, 4x Opteron 875, 8 GB RAM, 3x IDE harddrive, SCSI cage with 10K rpm drive and a ton of fans (which a PCP&C 1 KW could not power up due to rail issues).

And the other with a SLI-DR, Opteron at 3.0 GHz 24/7, 7800GTX, 7 CD/DVD drives (no typo) and assorted external harddrives all on the same PSU.

In addition, when the ripple issue came up I emailed Supermicro support with the test results (the ripple) and asked them whether that is a threat to the H8QC8. They said it's not, the power management on the board kills much more ripple than that (meaning Jonnyguru's results). It's only an issue if the power management on the board is barely obeying the ATX spec. Obviously, both the Supermicro and the DFI have better power management.

Supermicro, I believe. DFI? I've got to see that for myself.

Plug into a Kill-A-Watt and tell me how much power you're actually using. Neither PC has SLI? And a 7800GTX doesn't use much (I had two running SLI on my ST500EAZ) and seven opticals isn't much power consumption (typically 1.5A on each of the 5V and 12V rails.) Hard drives don't use more than 25W unless they're spinning up cold and then they use 35W.

I wouldn't have reservations using an FSP Epsilon on either of those machines. But replace that 7800GTX with a pair of 8800GTS or GTX cards and I think we'll have a whole other story.

Point is, as I've said, the PSU's are overkill. And chances are most people will not see any problems because chances are the majority of users, even here, are only using half the power they are capable of at the most. But if I'm paying cash money for a 600W, 700W or 1010W power supply.. god damn it, I want what I paid for.

EDIT: Can we move this thread into the PSU sub-forum?

[Spectre]
06-20-2007, 11:20 AM
They said it's not, the power management on the board kills much more ripple than that (meaning Jonnyguru's results). It's only an issue if the power management on the board is barely obeying the ATX spec. Obviously, both the Supermicro and the DFI have better power management.

Yeah so one company (out of how many?) can compensate for anothers spec violation in one circumstance.....but do your videocards? Harddrives? Etc do as well.


BTW do I count for having one die?

uOpt
06-20-2007, 11:36 AM
;2265318']Yeah so one company (out of how many?) can compensate for anothers spec violation in one circumstance.....but do your videocards? Harddrives? Etc do as well.


BTW do I count for having one die?

What video card? :D

Your past posts rubbed me the wrong way, Spectre, I'm not sure about your claims.

I posted the Supermicro power consumption before. I don't think I ever measured my gaming machine. It's true these boxes won't go near the 700W, but then, they still get closer than most other people's machines. I could be convinced to agree that a 800GTX SLI system isn't a good choice to put on one of these.

[Spectre]
06-20-2007, 11:47 AM
Your past posts rubbed me the wrong way, Spectre, I'm not sure about your claims.


Funny because my "claims" are documented.

CedricFP
06-21-2007, 06:18 PM
Supermicro, I believe. DFI? I've got to see that for myself.

Plug into a Kill-A-Watt and tell me how much power you're actually using. Neither PC has SLI? And a 7800GTX doesn't use much (I had two running SLI on my ST500EAZ) and seven opticals isn't much power consumption (typically 1.5A on each of the 5V and 12V rails.) Hard drives don't use more than 25W unless they're spinning up cold and then they use 35W.

I wouldn't have reservations using an FSP Epsilon on either of those machines. But replace that 7800GTX with a pair of 8800GTS or GTX cards and I think we'll have a whole other story.

Point is, as I've said, the PSU's are overkill. And chances are most people will not see any problems because chances are the majority of users, even here, are only using half the power they are capable of at the most. But if I'm paying cash money for a 600W, 700W or 1010W power supply.. god damn it, I want what I paid for.

EDIT: Can we move this thread into the PSU sub-forum?
What would be your informed opinion on a dual core/single card system like the one in my signature?

I've been pondering an upgrade to the PSU after reading this thread. I presume that I don't fully load the PSU unit anyways but one would still have to worry about these ripple fluctuation's slowly killing the components.

jonnyGURU
06-21-2007, 06:25 PM
Sort of a threadjack, but I'd say you'd be fine with a mere 500 to 600W. :)

Essentially, if it's Crossfire or SLI certified for G70 or X1900, it's good for a single G80. ;)