8800GTS still not enough for Titan Quest on HQ?

[Soulburner]

All details on high, 1680x1050, 4xAA 4xAF still lags slightly with the 8800gts.

My scores seem ok:

3DMark03: 25k
3DMark05: 12k
3DMark06: 6.5k

The difference is quite large from my last card though, the X800XL (10k 3DMark03) managed the same performance with the following settings: details medium/low, 1680x1050, 2xAA 0xAF.

I thought the game would run without a hitch maxed out. It seems I either have to bump the AA down a notch or turn the detail level or texture quality down a notch :( All of these 3 have the most impact on performance, I just need to decide which of the 3 I can live with...any one of the three bumped down will make the game smooth.

This is with the 96.98 driver. I couldn't run the later 97.92 due to a resolution problem making the driver unusable. I shouldn't complain too much, it is an awesome looking game, but I expected a little more for my $300.

EDIT: This performance issue was resolved, see latest posts. The problem with the inconsistent framerate is with in-game settings, namely VSync being flaky and not the video card :cool:

[Omastar]

I'll say, this 320MB version is kinda seeming to be a bit of a disappointment for those who want to push detail to max/close to max even at 1280x1024. I mean this applies specifically to Oblivion for me since it's the most graphically intensive thing I play, but yes, I was expecting more I suppose.

[nicepun]

I wonder how much more performance you would get if you had Conroe rig instead.

[Omastar]

I wonder how much more performance you would get if you had Conroe rig instead.

Yeah, that single core A64 sure isn't easing the CPU bottleneck.

[Soulburner]

This card blows away the last gen though, and coming from an X800XL 256mb it was a good upgrade.


I wonder how much more performance you would get if you had Conroe rig instead.
I have thought about that too. But the performance hit comes with higher quality textures and/or AA so its easy to see where the bottleneck is.

[J-Mag]

I noticed lag when you come into areas with enemies, but it happens before they get on screen. Maybe the system buses are the culprit if they can't get textures to the card fast enough.

[Soulburner]

Its a framerate issue. Enemies do lag the screen more than a plain area. Definetely not a loading problem, I can tell when its loading.

[Omastar]

Isn't Titan Quest optimized for dual core? I mean with all the AI rendering and such, it'd seem (like Oblivion) a dual core would alleviate some of the chokepointing caused by a single core CPU and a relatively ancient 3700+, at that. :p:

[p0tter]

Opteron time!

[NickS]

I think it's time for Conroe. With some tweaking I could get 13k out of my X1900GT on my chip (e6300) in 05. Kinda sad since that tops your GTS on AMD.

No I'm not being a fanboy, I'm telling the truth.

[Soulburner]

I know I'm trying to be cheap and avoid an upgrade. I used to spend a lot on hardware...

And I don't like comparing these 3DMark scores to the Core 2's. It seems they are optimized (or rigged) for the dual core Intels. And I really doubt that is a reflection of real-world performance.

I'm sure a 3+Ghz C2D would be a good boost to performance but not enough to warrant a new motherboard, 2-4gb of DDR2, and processor to get it. I'll plan out a new system for when I do the eventual Vista upgrade.

[J-Mag]

And I don't like comparing these 3DMark scores to the Core 2's. It seems they are optimized (or rigged) for the dual core Intels. And I really doubt that is a reflection of real-world performance.

Yeah there is no reason to compare 3dmark scores when trying to understand a single app's performance differences across platforms.

[Soulburner]

The Core 2 chips are awesome, but I will have to see how well of a fight AMD puts up before I decide if I really want to go back to Intel. Tentative upgrade would be next winter, which is after the priority of paying off my car loan is finished ;)

[Omastar]

And I don't like comparing these 3DMark scores to the Core 2's. It seems they are optimized (or rigged) for the dual core Intels. And I really doubt that is a reflection of real-world performance.

Bwah? How are they 'rigged' for Core 2 Duo? C2D just happens to be the strongest CPU available right now, and its CPU scores in 3DMark, and '06 in particular, are a reflection of this. I don't think it's rigged because dual core A64's posted higher CPU scores than Netburst Pentium 4s/Ds, and now C2D is outperforming A64. Following, I'm sure Barcelona will outperform C2Q. ;)

[serialk11r]

Bwah? How are they 'rigged' for Core 2 Duo? C2D just happens to be the strongest CPU available right now, and its CPU scores in 3DMark, and '06 in particular, are a reflection of this. I don't think it's rigged because dual core A64's posted higher CPU scores than Netburst Pentium 4s/Ds, and now C2D is outperforming A64. Following, I'm sure Barcelona will outperform C2Q. ;)
Agreed even though I'm relatively new to this stuff. They didn't change 3dmark06 after conroe came out did they? So how can it be rigged?

[p0tter]

get a opteron for under 170 and sell your 3700.

[Soulburner]

It was a figure of speech...I wasn't serious. It just seems they have an uncanny advantage in certain "benchmarks".

I'm now searching for a solution to exiting to Windows/BSOD with nv4disp.dll...probable cause, heat (75-78c). That's not really PC Gaming Forum material though.

[Omastar]

I'm now searching for a solution to exiting to Windows/BSOD with nv4disp.dll...probable cause, heat (75-78c). That's not really PC Gaming Forum material though.

Same thing happened to me while playing Oblivion. You overclocking at all? When I set back to stock, I was fine.

[Soulburner]

No, but it comes clocked at 576/1700 from EVGA.

So it is, but not by me :cool:

[Omastar]

No, but it comes clocked at 576/1700 from EVGA.

So it is, but not by me :cool:

Oh, good Lord, I hope this isn't gonna turn into another eVGA fiasco like was seen with the 7900GTs with defective RAM. :( I doubt it, though, since my card's been going fine without any graphical anomalies or BSODs for the last few days. Oblivion has crashed a few times, but mainly due to my Alt-Tabbing or setting detail to max (even though I get good framerates with max settings, it still crashes when rendering a vegetation heavy environment).

Did you use CCleaner to uninstall the old drivers? Oh, and tried updating your DX9 runtime to the February (and prior updates if you haven't updated in a while) update?

[adamsleath]

My scores seem ok:

3DMark03: 25k
3DMark05: 12k
3DMark06: 6.5k


those "lower" scores are cpu bound...upgrade your cpu to an opty or c2d and watch your gts fly...i was getting 6.2k and 11.4k in 3d06/05 with 3500...and i got a 50-60% increase when i upgraded cpu...with gts oced on air...but as far as 320 version goes ..cannot speak as to that vs 640 version gts...:confused:


my gts is still cpu bound with what i have...:)

most games utilise dual cpus to some degree (some more than others)...and even if the game isnt 'optimised' you still have some cpu sharing hapenning...at least thats what ive noticed in task manager.

i was very sceptical about the dual core thing.. (b4 i got one:))...but i'm not anymore.

now i'm saving for an affordable quad core...like barcelona vs yorkfield......:woot:

[Soulburner]

Oh, good Lord, I hope this isn't gonna turn into another eVGA fiasco like was seen with the 7900GTs with defective RAM. :( I doubt it, though, since my card's been going fine without any graphical anomalies or BSODs for the last few days. Oblivion has crashed a few times, but mainly due to my Alt-Tabbing or setting detail to max (even though I get good framerates with max settings, it still crashes when rendering a vegetation heavy environment).

Did you use CCleaner to uninstall the old drivers? Oh, and tried updating your DX9 runtime to the February (and prior updates if you haven't updated in a while) update?
This is a fresh install, so no cleaner, and newest everything, except for the Nvidia drivers. The latest doesn't work for me due to a resolution problem, so I am using 96.98.

[Omastar]

This is a fresh install, so no cleaner, and newest everything, except for the Nvidia drivers. The latest doesn't work for me due to a resolution problem, so I am using 96.98.

How about the February DX9c update?

[Soulburner]

Yes, that is the one I installed.

With the symptoms of game disappearing back to desktop, sometimes BSOD with screen corruption, colored blocks, tells me its a hardware failure. Especially when the longer I wait to go back in, the longer it lasts...if I load it right back up its only a minute before it exits.

Sounds like heat to me...so much for quality testing.

[Soulburner]

Update: Cranking the fan speed did not resolve the crashing issues.

However, I did fix the performance issue. I found that with this game, if I load the game up on low detail, then switch it to high in-game, it will run smooth. However if the game is loaded already set to high it will run really bad. It's strange...and it does have the latest patch. I hope they fix this in a future patch.

Now 1680x1050, 4xAA, high texture/shadow/detail/reflection quality is possible with smooth play, and wow this game looks good! :slobber:

I'm only running 2xAF because it has a minimal effect on this game (top-down dungeon crawler questing). I can't see a difference with higher settings so the performance hit isn't worth it.

Things left to try: newer display drivers. I had an issue with the latest, so I'll cross my fingers and wait for the next release.

[Soulburner]

It looks the same either way. There is something buggy in the code. It is also inconsistent...it sometimes doesn't work.

[Omastar]

I've had a similar problem with Oblivion. If I set details to max, reload the game and load a save, it'll inevitabily freeze/crash, somewhat pointing to a driver/Oblivion patch related issue, IMO. I also reinstalled 97.92 drivers to see if that fixes anything, but I forgot a setting in NV control panel, LOD clamp or some such. I'm not at home to look at it though, at the beach right now.

[RTB]

It should be an issue with the shadows in Titan Quest. You may want to check, because the last patch I played was 1.20, but up to that point the engine was horribly inefficient in using them, especially at nighttime. There was an article somewhere some time ago explaining it all, at medium and high quality shadows the engine is allowed to draw an infinite amount of shadows, and sometimes attempts to do so.

[Soulburner]

I've had a similar problem with Oblivion. If I set details to max, reload the game and load a save, it'll inevitabily freeze/crash, somewhat pointing to a driver/Oblivion patch related issue, IMO. I also reinstalled 97.92 drivers to see if that fixes anything, but I forgot a setting in NV control panel, LOD clamp or some such. I'm not at home to look at it though, at the beach right now.
That's very interesting...could it be an Nvidia driver issue then? If it is affecting more than one game from different developers it has to be.

I am running Titan Quest 1.20 which is the latest. It is an awesome game but needs some fixing still.

On another note...Dark Messiah of Might and Magic runs like a dream on this card. 1680x1050, 4xAA/4xAF all details on high, even HDR, and its so quick indoors it needs Vsync to keep it from tearing. I haven't tested any outdoor environments yet but I expect it to at least hurt a little bit. This game looks awesome too.

[Soulburner]

I found the problem.

There seems to be an issue with VSync and the Nvidia drivers with this game. It did not do it with the ATI card. It seems cycling VSync off/on in the game gets it smooth again, but you need to do it perodically when it starts running slow again. Minimizing and maximizing the game has the same effect.

It isn't the card.

[Burnmaster]

Hey Soulburner what Patch are you using for TQ ?
I had the same Probs with low FPS I reinstallt the Game and Patch 1.20
Problem Solved. Since Yesterday Patch 1.30 is out may be this helps.
Btw I´m using a 7950gx2-sc (Evga) and an quite old D965xe running 1280x1024 full Detail without
Probs now.

[thecoldanddark]

About time.

[Soulburner]

Hey Soulburner what Patch are you using for TQ ?
I had the same Probs with low FPS I reinstallt the Game and Patch 1.20
Problem Solved. Since Yesterday Patch 1.30 is out may be this helps.
Btw I´m using a 7950gx2-sc (Evga) and an quite old D965xe running 1280x1024 full Detail without
Probs now.
Been using 1.20 since the day I installed the game a few months ago.

[Rickster_64]

Well, coming from both a dual core opteron @ 2800 and a single core 148 @ 3100 my Core 2 @ 3280 is about 30% faster even with my same ole 7800GT vid card. Not only games but when I was burning this DVD of my kids pictures I was like JESUS the thing was done encoding in like 1 minute. And yes Titan is coded for DC cpu's so even moving over to an opteron 165 and clocking it up would give you a boost. I sold my AMD stuff and it was only about 50 bucks to but my Intel rig being that I needed only ram/cpu and motherboard.

[Soulburner]

Yeah at some point in the year I may pick up some stuff cheap, as soon as people start dumping their C2D for Barcelona.

I've gotta allocate most of my funds to the car, mods, and getting the loan paid off so aside from the monitor/card upgrade the rest is on the back burner.

[Omastar]

Yeah at some point in the year I may pick up some stuff cheap, as soon as people start dumping their C2D for Barcelona.

According to some Maximum PC podcast (from Gordon Mah Ung) Barcelona is supposedly the server-end segment chip, not the desktop. So it's the Opteron equivalent, and the desktop variant should be released shortly after Barcelona's debut.

[shadow of chaos]

i wouldnt even think about a card with 320mb of video memory, its nothing compared to the 8800 gtx, or R600

[Soulburner]

I found another "optimization".

If you go into Task Manager and change Titan Quest to Below Normal Priority it actually runs better. Don't ask me why...just bad coding.

So to recap:
Toggle Vsync on/off if the game starts chugging
Run in Below Normal Priority

Dramatically improves the performance of this game on the Nvidia card. I didn't have to do any of this on the ATI :(


i wouldnt even think about a card with 320mb of video memory, its nothing compared to the 8800 gtx, or R600
My X800XL had less memory, was 2 years old and ran this game better. The 320mb is fine for me, for now. For those not wanting to spend half a grand on a card its perfect.

It blazes through just about anything else.

[XSAlliN]

What Monitor do you have? - 1680x1050 is a big resolution for most of them, so I can see the interaction between VSync and TQ FPS, if you could set the game to max FPS intended by developer you might get a smooth play but I don't think TQ has that option, with VSync On you force the game to render max FPS according to your Monitor Refresh Rate, with it off it depends on VGA and Game's options rendering max set within the game, with few jumps over.

PS.nVidia could fix this problem within the driver, including specific options for this TQ (since they have direct contact with most game developers) :)

[Soulburner]

It doesn't run faster with Vsync. It just runs choppier (tearing).

Yeah, I am waiting for the next driver release.

It runs pretty good now that I figured out the two biggest things affecting it.